@autoad if you actually believe Oswald pulled off this entire fiasco with his rifle shots then you are one hilarious person. I will go no further to explain myself, which will cause you to call me out as being uninformed and having no facts to back up my opinion and, well, if you don't realize what's going on in the world today then your clearly denying aspects and views of others, and you are always right no matter what.
@truesh1t So you believe LHO didn't fire the shots or fired shots that missed or had nothing to do with the shooting whatsoever. That means there must have been another gunman(s).
The following is a list of potential gunmen that have been identified by different pro-conspiracy believers. Which one(s) do you believe were involved or were there others that are not on this list? Badge Man, Hard Hat Man, Black Dog Man, Coke Bottle Man, Cowboy Hats Man, Picket Fence Man,
@truesh1t Waving At Mary Ann Moormen Man, Kicking Gordon Arnold Man, Ed Hoffman's Dark Coat Man and Striped Railroad Shirt Man, Under the Grassy Knoll Man, Triple Underpass Man, The Other Grassy Knoll Man, Sewer Sniper Man, Behind The Pergola Man, The Other Shooter From The TSBD Man, Dal-Tex Man, The Building Behind The TSBD Man, Umbrella Man, Radio Man, Jackie Man, Driver Of The Limo Man, Gun Embedded In The Limo Seat Man, Shooter In The Limo Trunk Man.
@LoneNutter1 That's quite the list of gunman, i'm just going to say this; i believe there WAS more than one gunman - with that said, i believe 2 unidentified gunman, in a matter of fate, shot Kennedy at the same exact time. One from the back (causing his forehead to explode -> exit wound) and another from behind the fence of the grassy knoll (i believe the final shot) causing him to slouch 'back, and to the left'.. I believe there's enough physical flesh/matter for both impacts to occur.
@LoneNutter1 it just so happened that this occurred in such perfect harmony that, the results of the greatest conspiracy to ever hold it's ground did in fact succeed. Oswald is you basic puppet and jack rubby was just doing an order. (and if he didn't pull through then jack would be found dead days/weeks later)
@LoneNutter1 As far as LHO, he was given an order from some "official", agent, overseas agent, WHO KNOWS, to take out the president for a reward / lump sump etc... I believe the communication was superior in this instance, (between the gunman, not LHO) in that, they took out the president before oswald had a chance to. Oswald would be screaming bloody murder that he was set up etc... but he didn't, how can you? Which makes me believe he was set up, allowing specialists to assassinate w/out error
Thanks very much for all the negative votes! Having spent a career in marketing/advertising, the "blocked" comments evoke the curiosity of people who ask themselves "I wonder what was said that was so terrible?" They click on the Show button and my comments not only get read, but people look for them! This I know because people have sent me emails telling me that this is what they do. The "blocked" comments also reveal how fragile and closed minded the pro-conspiracy people are.
This list is indicative of the foolishness of the Conspiracy Obsessed. They've destroyed their credibility by inventing nearly two dozen gunman blasting away at the president is a small area while remaining undetected while shooting and escaping unseen by hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. And all of these world-class gunman were so good at their jobs they missed JFK and they missed slow moving hulking limo as well. Whoever hired them I sure hope they got their money back.
This list is indicative of the foolishness of the Conspiracy Obsessed. They've destroyed their credibility by inventing nearly two dozen gunman blasting away at the president is a small area while remaining undetected while shooting and escaping unseen by hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. And all of these world-class gunman were so good at their jobs they missed JFK and they missed slow moving hulking limo as well. Whoever hired them I sure hope they got their money back.
The contradictions are epic among the pro-conspiracy cultists! I merely identify the location/name of all the gunman they've claimed were in Dealey plaza shooting at the president and it's been marked as "spam"??
Are these names being rejected as false or do they not like the truth delivered by an unpopular messenger?
None of them were seen by any of the hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. If they were world-class riflemen they all missed their target and they all escaped without leaving any trace of their being there firing a weapon. The Conspiracy Obsessed would have us believe all these gunmen existed despite the absence of any evidence of their existence. Yet, the people In the Plaza who saw the man holding and shooting a rifle from the TSBD at JFK are unreliable, mistaken or manipulated witnesses.
How many gunman have the Conspiracy Obsessed put in Dealey Plaza? Badge Man, Hard Hat Man, Coke Bottle Man, Cowboy Hats Man, Picket Fence Man, Waving at Maryann Mooremen Man, Black Dog Man, Sewer Sniper Man, Behind the Pergola Man, Under The Grassy Knoll Man, Dal-Tex Man, The Other Shooter in the TSBD Man, The Building Behind the TSBD Man, Gun Embedded In The Limo Seat Man, Jackie Man, Shooter In The Trunk of The Limo Man, Triple Underpass Man, Limo Driver Man. They all share something in common
You need to read 'JFK And The Unspeakable' to understand who the person who Craig saw was. Craig witnessed the CIA Oswald double who was going around Dallas setting-up Lee Oswald as a dangerous communist lone nut. Craig ended-up dead because of it like several other people. Ralph Yates had the misfortune of giving this double a ride. On the ride he spoke of how easy it would be to kill a president from a building. Yates dropped him off at the Depository. FBI killed Yates in a mental institution
JFK had made enemies with the CIA, FBI, LBJ, and was planning to put an end to the Vietnam conflict. Given that war is more profitable than drugs, porn and gambling combined, it is obvious his life was in peril. What did LBJ do once he was in office?. He added 400,000 troops to Vietnam. It is always about the money then the power. Former Secretary of the Treasury Paul O'Neil said Bush 43 was talking about invading Iraq within 10 days of taking office in 2001. WOW.
If Oswald had been picked up by anyone, why was he roaming around the streets of Dallas, shot Tippitt, and was sitting in a theater when the police tracked him down and arrested him?
considering all the mistakes curry made that day and the days that followed, i'm suprrised he didn't say "he was picked up by a lawn jockey riding a horse".
When LHO was arrested in the Texas theather he had a bus transfer in his pocket. You can find the interview with the bus driver here on youtube. LHO got on the bus a block or so away from the TSBD. The cop in this video was lying for personal gain...money from Mark Lane...Oswald did not get into a car or station wagon after he shot JFK... He got on a bus, purchased the transfer but didn't use it because traffic was backed up due to the assasssination, so he got off the bus and into the cab.
down in texas there's a saying -"go along to get along" -when the fix was in you go along with it. sometimes the truth can get you in trouble- lose your job or killed. sherriff roger craig told the truth- he got in trouble , lost his job, somebody shot at him, later he helped jim garrison investigation -they found him dead- they said he committed suicide. back in those days bennie binion could kill and get off- it was who you paid off.
@evergreenpotato fritz was in dallas quite a few years as chief of detectives- the payoffs and fixes were normal business back in those days-sherriff decker and bennie binion were tight- according to nick cascio- he told me sherriff decker had more power in texas than the govenor-he had peices of gambling joints- my reading of this -guys like binion needed the fix to operate- the sherrif can give you protection- you give him a piece of the operation- points in vegas fritz swam in that swamp.
Roger Craig no doubt saw someone getting into the Nash Rambler roughly 15 minutes after the assassination, and he no doubt believed it was Oswald. But it was not. It simply was not. Oswald walked away from Dealey Plaza, got on a bus, got off when it was stalled in traffic, and then took a cab to his rooming house. He had a transfer on him at the time of arrest that shows he was on the bus. And his fare was recorded by the cab driver.
While in police custody, LHO was brought out in the presence of the media on ten occasions. Yet, LHO claimed he was a patsy only one time and he says it in connection with having lived in the Soviet Union. He had nine other opportunities to proclaim his "patsyhood" but didn't. He had his best opportunity to state this during the "Midnight Press Conference" but didn't.
The claim of "patsy" is bogus . LHO was no patsy. But he was guilty as sin for murdering two people in one day.
@LoneNutter1 - Oh yeah, well you'll have to change your name, because the last two shots were bang-bang - almost simultaneous, as witnessed by dozens of folks, including nearly all the SS agents. And SS agent Hill, who looked at JFK's head for 10 minutes to the hospital said the back of his head was blown out. So did all the Drs. & nurses. So did Jackie. He was shot from the FRONT, get over it...YOU'RE WRONG...it was a plot, to remove JFK & put LBJ in, plain and simple.
@Tomaji69 Again, you rely on the reports of what people say they heard and saw, which in any criminal investigation is highly unreliable. That's why investigations rely on the physical, medical, forensic and ballistic evidence to help determine "what happened"? The sound of two shots fired close together is easily explained; echos. Dealey Plaza is an echo chamber that Lee Bowers testified about to the Warren Commission. You've built your argument on a bed of sand and it won't stand up.
@LoneNutter1 - I've seen these "lonenutter1" folks before...they will argue ANYTHING rather than acknowledging it holds merit. Like the BANG-BANG 100% proof there were at least TWO shooters. The Secret Service agents say that's what happened, but "LoneNutter1" says they were wrong (it must be an echo). Well, if it was an "echo", then ALL three shots would have been "bang-bang". So, just acknowledge this FACT...the last 2 shots were too close together to be one shooter. 100% proof
I notice "LoneNutter1" says "The bang-bang of the last two shots is easily explained"..that's just it..WHY "explain" it?...that's what the coverup & WC is all about, isn't it? "Explaining" away what the eyewitnesses said, saw and heard, when THEY weren't there. The Drs. ALL said the back of JFK's head was blown out. Hill & Jackie did too AND the SS said the last two shots were close together AND they said there was a "flurry of shots flying into the limo from various locations".
I have heard a recording of the police radio communications that day. The man driving the station wagon was described as being colored or a dark complected Latin male. The car with Oswald in it went west on hwy 80 and the next transmission from the dispatcher said to disregard the station wagon. Afterwards the frequency was jammed and when it was once again cleared cars were dispatched to to the Texas Theater after Tippet was killed. Odd that Oswald lost his wallet and had one when caught
@barflew - My bet is that the driver was Mac Wallace, who's fingerprints were matched to those on boxes up in the sniper's nest also (this was around 2006 or so, see Bar McClelland's book "Blood, Power and Money - How LBJ killed JFK"). He was LBJ's henchman.
Who Does Oswald see in that room? Look at his face from 2:25- 2:45, in between their look at oswalds eyes. He sots someone in the room that seems to confirm to him that he is being set up for a fall. He knew!! Who did he see in that room? Please everyone throw some names out there, because you can clearly see Oswald spotted someone in that Police station that gave him confirmation that he was set up. Lee Oswald - the man with a thousand secrets.
@kev42o97 What an incredible talent you have! The ability to look into the eyes of someone and know in an instant what they're thinking! I'm impressed!
@kev42o97 I think there's plenty to be debated about the "patsy" factor. Since you seem convinced he was, I'd like to know how you decided he was a patsy. What information are you looking at to make that conclusion?
@LoneNutter1 - I'll help out here....Oswald was an intel agent. I know you're gonna try to deny it, but he was. NOBODY could waltz back into the U.S. after what he did in Russia (and with a KGB related wife?!). You see, if you have a name like "LoneNutter1", then you're not seeking TRUTH, you're out to assassinate ANY information that Oswald was NOT a "lone nut". Obviously, you are biased with a fixed viewpoint. Bang-bang, the back of JFK's head was blown out!! Explain THAT.
@kev42o97 Well, the obvious answer would be Jack Ruby. David Atlee Phillips would be my guess, as I believe he was in the police station as well. There is a photo floating around the internet of Oswald's press conference which shows a man who is a dead ringer for Phillips in the crowd behind Oswald.
@BlackieGirl Thank you so much for being just open to the fact that this could have and clearly seems to be a conspiracy that went as planned. No different in my honest opinion to Mossad scum assassinations made on Hamas leaders, particularly one in early January of last year in Dubai with at least 20 people involved. David Attlee Philips, James Jesus Angleton, frank Sturgis, David Morales, Felix Rodriguez, and countless other CIA GOONS including the top one George H.W. Bush.
@kev42o97 No problem. Of course I'm open to the fact that this was a conspiracy. Only the most brain dead of morons would not be able to see that at this point.
When it comes to the intelligence creation that is Oswald, Angleton is key. Also, take a good look at William King Harvey.
@BlackieGirl Sorry if my statement "brain dead of morons" seemed a bit harsh. I just get tired of all the bickering and ignorance that runs rampant around this issue. I don't put you in that category at all.
@kev42o97 - Yeah, it was rogue planners....the top planner was probably Meyers, who's wife had bedded JFK. Hoover knew it was gonna happen and they counted on him to help direct the coverup. The whole "justification" they whispered to each other was the JFK was a loose cannon commie sympathizer, so there had to be a "change in the executive branch". Sounds good, OK, get it done and count me in. Bush was involved also, as he was part of the Bay of Pigs thing too and hated JFK.
The plan didn't go well. First of all, the shooters MISSED...!! Also a misfire early on (the first miss). The plan was for ONE shot each SIMULTANEOUSLY at the umbrella! OOPS! Yet another shot from the rear misses and hits Connally AND, of course, the "safety" shot from the picket fence that got him in the head. That shooter was only to fire IF necessary, thus they had to lie about how many shots & where they came from to pin it on Oswald. It was a mess, that's why we're all on to them.
@kev42o97 I disagree. Oswald was looking at all the reporters from all over the country and thinking to himself.
"Wow! I've hit the jackpot. All these people here to see me and ask me questions and I get to become famous and important. Things are working out exactly the way I wanted!"
It's clear and obvious this is what he was thinking.
@autoad - So, if Oswald was so bent on being famous, he would have simply bragged of having offed JFK all by himself. I tell you, he was an intel agent doing undercover work the whole time and was pegged as the patsy from the beginning. He was waiting in the break room to hear "They busted some guys upstairs for trying to kill the Prez". Then, he went into shock and his world came tumbling down.
@autoad Thats ridiculous, he was working for the FBI as an informant, at the same time he also worked for the CIA, George De Moreschildt was his handler, and before George was to testify before the House Select Commitee on Assassinations. So don't tell me he didn't know he was being blamed as a "Patsy" which he even said himself. Oswald did not kill JD tippet, nor did he shoot the president John Kennedy, that is a fact.
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@kev42o97 There is no evidence Oswald worked for the FBI nor is there evidence he worked for the CIA. The conspiracy obsessed tried to create a document that said LHO worked for the CIA but they bungled the document so badly it was immediately recognized as a very bad forgery. Your assessment of DeMohrenschildt (not De Moreschildt), the "patsy" defense, the non-invlovement of Oswald killing JFK and Tippit is absurd. It was never "proven" he didn't shoot them.
no one is being forced to view any of these videos ,so watch them if you want or dont watch them at all but please refrain from using vulgar language and insults.
James Files met with Oswald the day before. Files says that Oswald was sent to spend time with Files for target practise but LHO knew nothing of Files intentions. Oswald was sent by CIA Officer David Attlee Phillips who marshalled the killing.
@LoneNutter1 As LoneNutter1's therapist I can confirm categorically that LoneNuuter1 has a bored out head. There is no brain matter there whatever and never has been. His inability to spell simple words such as "desperate" is evidence of this. LoneNutter is on medication, is dyslexic and may be dangerous. DO NOT ENGAGE!!
@LoneNutter1 MR CONTRARIAN! I hope you are enjoying revelling in this role because your view is not just in the minority, but it's frankly preposterous. You are a nutter.
@shakercoola The majority is not always right. If the majority of people thought the earth was flat would the earth become flat? If the majority of people thought the earth was round would it become round? There's loads of evidence showing the movement of LHO after he left the TSBD. You can believe he was transported by aliens for all I care. Believe what you want.
verdelufe the shooting occured at 12.30 oswald was seen by officer marion baker and roy truly a maximum of 90 seconds after the shooting on the second floor where had indeed bought a coke.a mrs reid who was in the second floor office watches oswald stroll calmly away. it was about 12.40 that craig says he saw oswald get in to a rambler ,so it was some 6 to 8 minutes after oswald was seen on the second floor. so craig did not give two conflicting statments.
@fobrien1 But 8 minutes after the shooting he was seen going by bus and cab to his rooming house then to go
to the Texas theater. What the hell to jump into Mrs. Paine station wagon which would take him to Irving, the suburb in the other direction where Mrs Paine lived, away from his rooming house. Mr. Craig sounds very convincing and confusing at the same time.
Roger Craig sounds very convincing but there is a very conflicting statement from him. He saw LHO running down the grassy knoll and jump into the station wagon of Mrs. Payne. This fact happened a minute or 2 after the shooting where many witness saw LHO on the 2nd floor of the TSBD buying Coke in the lunch room and was intervewed by police officer with the manager of TSBD next to him.
I believe in conspiracy but this really bothers me. AM I MISSING SOMETHING???
@Verdelufe I think Craig ran behind the fence following Dallas Police that were in the motorcade.He spent several minutes searching the parking lot area and then made his way back accross Elm st.When he saw Oswald he couldnt get back accross the street in time to stop him.So it would have been several minutes after Oswald was found on the 2nd floor.
@ahidel - Oswald couldn't have fired two shots bang-bang...the last two shots, as told by the SS agents. They also reported "a flurry of shots came into the limo from a variety of locations". Agent Hill, all the Drs. and nurses, Jackie, the ambulance attendant, etc. ALL said the BACK of JFK's head was blown out the size of a grapefruit!! He was shot from the FRONT obviously!! It was a plot to put LBJ in place of JFK & the 24 years of Kennedy's "direction".. he was WAY ahead of his time.
this was not done by one man who woke up one day and said he was gonna shoot the president.... Owald may have been the shooter, or one of the shooters... he have have had no knowlege of the incident or no knowlege untill the last minute, but he did not do it by himdself. he was either a patsey, or he was part of a team or a hired gunman for a person or organization, bein the mob, the fbi, cia, some government org. or some oilmen in the texas area. There was ALOT of crucial overlooked evidence.
yes and you just add to the ham sandwich by making comments on here. stop making out everyone on here are idiots, dont read the comments if your not bothered a lot of us think it stinks what ever happened that day in Dallas and we want answers alot of us dont agree with each others ideas on it. but the main thing is if we keep talking it wont just go away maybe one day they(the goverment) will have to take another look at what happened.
there are few interesting things with Oswald and Tippit. Oswald make a seen in a cafe over his breakfast a police officer is also eating in the cafe he comes over to settle Oswald down, who is the officer? TIPPET. and before Oswald leaves his house a patrol car slow down outside then drives away. a neighbour said the number on the car was a had 01 or 10. officer Tippet car was 10.
hogger thats your view but he never did any deal with the mafia if any deal was done it was his dad Joe Kennedy who made it. The only thing you can say wasnt a good thing was JFK's affairs. But as for being a president he was the best.Oh and lets say he did cross the mob who gives a shit there criminals.and that piece of crap Giancana got what was coming to him.
JFK was not the best. I think we can agree that Thomas Jefferson already holds that title. FDR comes close too. JFK is nowhere near the best. He shit on everyone.
He doublecrossed the mob. They killed him and used J. Edgar Hoover to cover it up since they held leverage on him with the 'compromising' picture they had of him.
Now who better to cover it up than Hoover? Hoover is well known for having dirt on EVERYONE. If you have Hoover in your pocket, everyone will do what you want. The Chicago mob did it and Hoover was the key to the cover up.
Everyone has so many opinons on who killed JFK I have been talking with someone on the internet who thinks its Oswald on his own and from behind. I dont agree with this. As for Oswald and the mob there is meant to be a link between Oswald and Ruby having meet before. But i think Oswald was CIA but who knows.
@hogger129 - Mafia people were used so if the "lone nut" story failed, then they'd blame it on the Mafia. Oswald was an intel agent undercover doing his job and was set up all along. He had Marina take those photos of him with the rifle/pistol to show "the gang" he was ready in Dallas to put the rifle in place for the shooter. Then, he waited in the break room, soon to be a hero, or so he thought. He went into shock when he realized he was patsy. Now, he can't trust ANYBODY.
Hi basenjib123 there were witness that have said Oswald didnt shoot Tippet. But instead the WC didnt want to listen to that but instead called on a witness who changed her story like the weather. including Tippet talking to her as he died, Tippet died instantly so couldnt of spoke to her. Why kill Tippet ? he heard Oswalds discription over the radio and instead of taking him to the airport Tippet got out of the car to arrest him this could not happen as it would ruin the conspirators plans.
@basenjib123 - I think once Oswald knew he was a patsy instead of an intel hero who would get a promotion, he knew he couldn't trust ANYONE at this point. So, the tail end of his "escape from TSBD", etc. is true...he went to his room, got his pistol & had NO idea what the hell to do. When Tippit confronted him, he offed him because Oswald figured HE would be OFFED by the planners so he wouldn't talk. In fact, I think he was supposed to be offed AT the TSBD, but he slipped out.
I don't know what 62 is going on about, but Detective Craig says he say him get into the Rambler, that Paine say's was in her driveway that morning. Oswald also states that he told the other Detectives he was in the car, and he no doubt told them who was driving. None of what you see in this video made it into the W.C. report. That is conpiracy fact, not theory !
Do you know the source of your "witness murdered nonsense?
A London Times article that was RETRACTED! (Apparently the retraction didn't carry the weight of the initial story...no surprise). Why the retraction? Because it was a statistical joke as it was initially presented...let alone the fact that it was padded with "small potatoes". Any elderly person on the list having a heart attack was labeled "suspicious"...as if something frightened them so much it induced them to have a heart attack!!!
@pajasa62@pajasa62 - All that has to be shown for it to be a conspiracy is that more than one shooter and/or planner was involved. We've done that many times over. The back of JFK's head was blown out, but the WC LIED about that, ignoring the Drs. and nurses (and Clint Hill, Jackie and others) testimony. The Secret Service said the last two shots were very close together (bang-bang) AND they said that "a flurry of bullets was flying into the limo from various positions".
@pajasa62 - All that has to be shown for it to be a conspiracy is that more than one shooter and/or planner was involved. We've done that many times over. The back of JFK's head was blown out, but the WC LIED about that, ignoring the Drs. and nurses (and Clint Hill, Jackie and others) testimony. The Secret Service said the last two shots were very close together (bang-bang) AND they said that "a flurry of bullets was flying into the limo from various positions".
@Tomaji69 Let's cut to the chase and you can try to answer the following (or are you going to change the topic and run away from the questions like before?)
1. Identify the specific location of al the gunman
2. Identify the weapons used
3. Identify the caliber and type of ammo used
4. Identify the order from where the shots were fired
5. Provide the source of the evidence that supports your contention of multiple gunman.
I can answer these questions...you either can't or won't.
@LoneNutter1 - Wow, this sounds like I've heard it before. Obviously to prove conspiracy, it is only necessary to prove there was more than one shooter or planner or LIES during a coverup. Conspiracy people have done this many times over. The last two shots were BANG BANG...that ALONE is 100% proof of more than one shooter. The back of JFK's head was blown out...100% proof the head shot was from the FRONT. Your idiotic questions are irrelevant & narrow-minded, just like your name.
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@Tomaji69 And again you use earwitness testimony that is highly unreliable. Not everybody heard two shots close to each other.
If the back of JFK's head was blown out how did the particulate matter get propelled forward covering the Connally's and the two agents in the front seat? Do you have any forensic evidence that supports a shot from the front? No, you don't. Do you have any physical evidence he was shot from the front? No, you don't. Any ballistic or medical evidence? No, you don't.
@LoneNutter1 - There is no "IF"...the back of JFK's head was blown out. There is no doubt, the last two shots were BANG BANG. You can say all you want that it isn't true, but it is....YOU claiming something isn't true, doesn't PROVE it to be false. I notice you do this over and over...saying that "they" must be wrong...but THEY were there and they were Secret Service men, Police and Doctors who held JFK's head in their hands and THEY know a lot more than YOU. Two or more shooters!
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@Tomaji69 You're basing your position on selected bits of information from a variety of sources but you're failing to look at all of the evidence including the medical report from the 9 forensic experts for the HSCA. Rather, you're content to holler conspiracy and cover-up when you have no evidence of either.
@LoneNutter1 - Of course my position is based on selected information...the TRUTHFUL pieces of information that show there were TWO or more shooters/planners. You know very well the MBT is a crock, right? I suppose YOU can "prove" the MBT...? Come on, do it...because if you CAN'T, then it was more than Oswald....that's why that lie was told. But the last two shots were BANG BANG, so that ALONE proves more than one shooter. Change your name.
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@Tomaji69 So now you're resorting to name-calling and insults which adds further credibility to my position that you're case is shaky and weak. The best friend of the CT'ers, forensic pathologist Dr. Cyril Wecht, was part of the 9 person HSCA team and he said "there is no medical evidence available to support shots from the front or side". The case for multiple gunman will always fall short when there's no evidence of an additional gunman in Dealey Plaza. By my last count, you and your
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@Tomaji69 pro-conspiracy brethren have placed at least 20 gunman in the Plaza: Badge Man, Hard Hat Man, Picket Fence Man, Coke Bottle Man, Black Dog Man, Waving At Maryann Mooreman Man, Cowboys Hats Man, Under The Grassy Knoll Man, Behind The Pergola Man, Sewer Sniper Man, Triple Underpass Man, The Other Shooter In The TSBD Man, Building Behind The TSBD Man, Dal-Tex Man, Gun Embedded In the Limo Seat Man, Shooter In The Trunk Man, Jackie Man, Limo Driver Man, The Other Grassy Knoll Man.
@LoneNutter1 - You are a ranting, raving lunatic, attacking me with your bullshit. Stop it. The back of JFK's head was BLOWN OUT...that is 100% fact. The last two shots were BANG BANG...that is 100% fact...so THERE is your "evidence" of more than one shooter. Clint Hill says "The President was shot just above his right ear...and the back of his head had a hole the size of my fist". Jackie said the back of his head was missing. Get over it, they LIED to you...change your name!!
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@Tomaji69 The only person ranting and raving is you. Typing words in upper case letters may make you feel better but it doesn't make them any truer.
You've clearly lost the discussion by admitting your refusal to look at all the evidence. You've admitted you pick and choose evidence they way people pick their food at a buffet. You've based your entire argument on the most unreliable evidence and treat the scientific evidence as if it's diseased. If I were a CT'er (and I was one many years ago)
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@Tomaji69 I have a question related to the content in your posts; you like to say "that is 100% fact". In my world a fact is a fact and can't be stated as a percentage of a fact. There's no such thing as an 85% fact or 32.67% fact. A fact either is or it isn't. It's like being pregnant; either you are or you aren't. Could you enlighten us on how you're able to state facts as a percentage?
@Tomaji69 This list is indicative of the foolishness of the Conspiracy Obsessed. They've destroyed their credibility by inventing nearly two dozen gunman blasting away at the president is a small area while remaining undetected while shooting and escaping unseen by hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. And all of these world-class gunman were so good at their jobs they missed JFK and they missed slow moving hulking limo as well. Whoever hired them I sure hope they got their money back.
@Tomaji69 This list is indicative of the foolishness of the Conspiracy Obsessed. They've destroyed their credibility by inventing nearly two dozen gunman blasting away at the president is a small area while remaining undetected while shooting and escaping unseen by hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. And all of these world-class gunman were so good at their jobs they missed JFK and they missed slow moving hulking limo as well. Whoever hired them I sure hope they got their money back.
@Tomaji69 This list is indicative of the foolishness of the Conspiracy Obsessed. They've destroyed their credibility by inventing nearly two dozen gunman blasting away at the president is a small area while remaining undetected while shooting and escaping unseen by hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. And all of these world-class gunman were so good at their jobs they missed JFK and they missed slow moving hulking limo as well. Whoever hired them I sure hope they got their money back.
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@Tomaji69 I'm not asking you "prove" the case for conspiracy but to provide measurable, scientific data that can't be altered over time or influenced by fading memories or influenced by outside sources. I'm asking the you provide evidence (or the source) that can be examined by improving scientific methods and can be tested by standardized means by different people. You rely on eye and earwitness testimony that is highly unreliable in any investigation. So let's see what science has to say.
@LoneNutter1 - It is incorrect to imply or say that ALL "witness testimony is highly unreliable". It is CERTAINLY true that you or some lawyer in D.C. is LESS reliable, when they weren't even there, right? In this case, I refer to 100% reliable witness testimony...that of Jackie, Clint Hill, Kellerman, other Secret Service agents, the Doctors & nurses, etc. who had close, professional observations of the head wound, etc. These were not just people standing around in Dealy Plaza.
@LoneNutter1 - I don't have to do what you are "asking" me to do...who do you think you are? I have proven there were two or more shooters. Not so much me, but expert eyewitness testimony. That's all that has to be shown to prove CONSPIRACY....come on, say it with me...."CONSPIRACY". Why are you so hard headed?
@pajasa62 - The last two shots were BANG BANG and the back of JFK's head was blown out. Two or more shooters. You are DESPERATELY trying to discredit me...why? I know why. Because I am speaking the truth and you need to change your name and that's too much for you....you are overheating and about to explode. Get over it...you are wrong....two or more shooters.
I don't need to try to discredit you...you are doing it to yourself.
You have these worthless standards for proof.
AGAIN....cherrypicking earwitness accounts for "bang bang" when the overwhelming consensus says...You have ZERO evidence of film of this "bang bang" and ZERO physical evidence.
Maybe that's why the JFK conspiracy idea just fizzled out....a complete lack of evidence and a persuasive argument.
Although you didn't aske the question of me, I'll answer. I'm sure you know that the question CANNOT be answered. But, I'll bite: LBJ, Hoover, Ruby, an unknown number of LBJ associates in Texas. The cop that substituted the carcano for the Mauser. At least two shooters. Several members of the CIA and at least ONE in JFK's secret service detail - the one that ordered his detail off of his car. You count, how many is that?
Part 1. At least your trying, but your list of course has ZERO details of the event. I'm well aware that CTers can shift weight because after 46 years they can't even come to a logical consensus. I'll give you a general list and you can ask and specifics you want of me.
FBI, Secret Service, Dallas police, Dallas DA, Head of Dallas Bar, New Orleans media, Dallas media, national media, AT LEAST 3 teams of doctors in 3 cities, 7 direct corruburations to the 6th flr. nest, bus driver, cab driver.
@pajasa62 - OK, so how did Ozzie fire two shots bang-bang (the last two shots were almost on top of each other, like the SS agents said) AND how do you explain the BACK of JFK's head being blown out, yet the WC saying otherwise? It's an obvious plot to put LBJ in place of JFK, because JFK's "direction" was too liberal & he was for the American people instead of the 1% & the war hawks. JFK was viewed as a loose cannon "commie sympathizer" or such. He was ending the FED too!
You cherrypick "bang-bang" witnesses when the overwhelming consensus say it was NOT. Any evidence recorded on film of "bang-bang"?....NOPE....Any physical evidence of "bang-bang"?...NOPE.
You spit out garbage about Tippet and masquerade it as "the truth"....and you pretend a favorable shot for Oswald would be when a car load of SS agents are staring at him while he has a partial shot of JFK's head obscured by Connally.....weak, man....WEAK!
Handgun mail-order house, rifle mail-order house. 10 witnesses to the Tippet shooting & flight. Ruth Paine, Michael Paine, Marina Oswald, Wesley Frazier & sister, Ruby's stripper, telephone company, Western Union employee and the Warren Commission (35 members with Counsel, staff lawyers, laisons) THEN the 100's & 100's of agents that conducted 25,000 interviews and specialists that examined 3,000 pieces of evidence! Oh & before I forget one little thing...the people to RECRUIT the list!
"The cop that substituted the Carcano for the Mauser"?? Are you aware that the media was sealed in TSBD 7 minutes after the shots? That there wasn't 1 investigator there , but many?
"At least ONE in JFK's SS detail"? THAT's is one big simplification for a conspiracy theorist! To pretend agents always rode on the back bumper is flat out wrong. Eg. during his Texas visit JFK was in MULTIPLE motorcades in 2 other cities that DID NOT even use this type of limo!
"burden of proof isn't on the conspiracy theorists"
NO KIDDING!
They spit out this nonsense under the banner of "theory", but what do they offer? Fragmented ideas, weak associations, cling to premature reports and ambiguous comments, claim "simple physics" accounts for something complicated and rely on statements from paid interviews and lucrative book deals.
Sure you say they don't need proof...in ANY argument that is a sign of weakness, not strength.
pajasa: What a dumb question. You are obviously too lazy, dull-witted or ignorant to care to examine the mass of info & details refuting the simplistic WC 'finding'. You can't begin to understand how the real world works. Are you afraid to find the truth & have your fond delusions shattered? There were many motives & degrees of 'knowing' by those involved in the conspiracy & cover-up, from trained assassins & organizers to military 'orders', w/ over 49 potential witnesses & insiders murdered.
"What a dumb question. You are obviously too lazy, dull-witted or ignorant to care to examine the mass of info & details"
NICE! Who's being to lazy to defend THEIR position? Who's too lazy to bring up details? Conspiracy theorists are great at the "concept" of conspiracy...but that's about it. Their great about reasking questions, but not to brilliant when it comes to finding out the answers.
"Over 49 potential witnesses..."
Really?....are you sure it wasn't over 50?...or 51?...
Kind of silly to have someone be so unwavering in a JFK conspiracy and yet repeatedly (for 8 friggin' times) refuse to answer how a conspiracy could be organized for this event and how many people would be involved.
YEAH, it's easy to pretend there's a conspiracy when you don't actually have to sweat any details.
Ruby friend Broek Wall : "First thing out of his mouth (when he visited him in jail) was "I'm a hero".
Ruby's Rabbi Silverman: "I ask him, Jack did you have connections with people (in a conspiracy) and he denied it vehemently again and again...in his distorted mind he did the right thing in that this man killed his President and he loved his President and he was taking justice into his own hands"
A hitman doesn't "silence" someone with a single GUT SHOT ...in a police station - PERIOD!
ok you have a friend and a Rabbi. who said he did it because he felt like it was the right thing to do?
let me get my boots because the bullshit is getting high.
he is telling your "CREW" THE WARREN COMMISSION. to take me to washington for the hell of it? why did he want to take the lie detector test if he was lying?
Do you know the results of the lie detector test?...Next time don't bluff a question unless you know the answer...
He's rotting away in jail..sure, he's going to try to get a retrial...can't you think? Seriously?
FOR THE 8th TIME I ask this question (not kidding the EIGHT time. You refuse to answer it because your conspiracy goes down the tiolet when confronted with the reality and the minutia of this event.
HOW MANY PEOPLE DO YOU THINK WERE INVOLVED IN THIS CONSPIRACY?
During his questioning Lee Harvey Oswald was administered a paraffin test by W. E. Barnes of the Dallas Police Department. In this test warm paraffin, which is applied to the skin to open up its pores, collects contaminants. If the suspect had fired a gun, one potential contaminant would be the nitrates from gun powder residue.
Once the paraffin hardens, either diphenylamine or diphenylbenzidine is introduced to the paraffin cast, which will turn it blue in the presence of nitrates. Thus, the presence of blue dots on the paraffin casts is evidence that the suspect had fired a gun.
A paraffin test was applied to Oswald's hands and right cheek; his hands reacted positively, whereas his cheek did not. Since shooting a rifle should have exposed his right cheek to gunpowder, the negative reaction is often cited as evidence that he did not fire a rifle.
No LONE GUNMAN believer yet answered me a logical answer why this test failed.
Again, don't ask I question against you can answer it...when bolted the Mannlicher-Carcano doesn't emit nitrates AND this was the FIRST TIME the Dallas Police EVER ATTEMPTED such a test.
again...no logical explantion has ever been given for the Paraffin test. i have heard the "FIRST TIME" & "EVER ATTEMPTED" line before and its stinks like horse shit. HELLO! this is the DPD thats why they have training on this ,before they use it to convict anyone of any crime. Let alone the biggest Crime of the Century. dont you think the would have taken consideration, if they felt like they didnt know much about , that they would have not used the test? you dodge the question. give me Logic.
@FGTFJT Anyone claiming that the nitrate tests applied in Dallas were the "first time" those tests were done is simply unaware of the facts. However, as a tool to convict anyone, nitrate tests are basically useless. The reason being that there are far too many possible sources for nitrates to ever conclusively say that firing a weapon was the source. The tests were outdated then. They were mainly used to get a confession out of suspects who were unaware of just how useless the tests were.
also they used the Paraffin as evidence to convict LHO of the is crime. but yet you tell me it was the FIRST TIME IT WAS EVER ATTEMPTED ... Listen to what you are saying.if the test didnt pass 100% percent they should have never used it as evidence. but they used it because it was a very useful tool at the time. i have been around guns and have seen a Paraffin test done Even the same one done on LHO. Just by firing a handgun you have traces of Nitrates on your face. "LIGHT BULB !!!!"
You believe in a conspiracy. You must have thought about it...how a conspiracy to kill the President can be organized, people recruited, the massive coverup...
AGAIN I ask:
How many people do you think took part in this conspiracy to commit this act and keep the "Oswald alone / conspiracy coverup" intact?
How many FGTYFT?
3 or 4 people? Maybe 4 or 5 silent criminals? Anybody approached, but backed out? Or was it just 200+ zombies in a trance?
You have taken a so called confession by the Lone Gunman Nuts and said. ok we believe him. he is telling the truth. he had nothing to do with the JFK murder. but on the day of the Shooting no one Believed what Jack Ruby was stating to the Media, FBI, or the WC.
Mr. RUBY: All I know is maybe something can be saved. Because right now, I want to tell you this, I am used as a scapegoat, and there is no greater weapon that you can use to create some falsehood about some of the Jewish faith, especially at the terrible heinous crime such as the killing of President Kennedy.
Now maybe something can be saved. It may not be too late, whatever happens, if our President, Johnson, knew the truth from me.
But if I am eliminated, there won't be any way of knowing.
Right now, when I leave your presence now, I am the only one that can bring out the truth to our President, who believes in righteousness and justice.
But he has been told, I am certain, that I was part of a plot to assassinate the President.
Mr. RUBY: I have been used for a purpose, and there will be a certain tragic occurrence happening if you don't take my testimony and somehow vindicate me so my people don't suffer because of what I have done.
Chief Justice WARREN: But we have taken your testimony. We have it here. It will be in permanent form for the President of the United States and for the Congress of the United States, and for the courts of the United States, and for the people of the entire world.
He was looking for a retrial...rotting away in jail.
But when it comes to what his strippers, brother, RABBI, or friends and roommate say...just ignore it.
Ruby on ("Oswald's Ghost", 2008) in 1966. - "The ironic things is Had I made an ILLEGAL turn behing the buses into the parking lot on Main St. and didn't see those people as I went into Western Union, I'd never have met this fate."
Mr. RUBY: All I want is a lie detector test, and you refuse to give it to me.
Because as it stands now--and the truth serum, and any other--Pentothal--how do you pronounce it, whatever it is. And they will not give it to me, because I want to tell the truth.
And then I want to leave this world. But I don't want my people to be blamed for something that is untrue, that they claim has happened.
Chief WARREN: Mr. Ruby, I promise you that you will be able to take such a test.
now tell me after all i have dished out and more then you could chew and eat, why do you keep trying to spit it out? Jack had connections with the Govnt, Mafia and DPD connections. Common knowledge would tell you he just didnt help Dick Nixon just for that period of time and stop. hell no..he kept working for the govnt. why was he so ready to talk and leave Dallas and go to D.C? he was willing to take the truth serum and a lie detector test. now why would he do that? come on smart Guy.
You cite a friggin' document that had a zip code that DIDN'T EXIST in 1947!
That's the problem with conspiracy theorist...they dissolved into a Sci-fi community.
It went from people looking for answers... same with conspiracy programs from the 60's, 70's and 80's....all looking for answers...problem for the CTers, people found the answers to the questions and CTers were so "locked" into their position & like you in this, it just becomes a matter of saving face for them -afraid to be wrong.
So how do you counter what DID happen? The phone company verifying a call from one of Ruby's strippers 19 minutes after Oswald was scheduled to be moved. Leaves his apt. at 11:00 with his DOG! and goes to Western Union to send a moneygram time stamped at 11:17 - with the receipt on him and the ORIGINAL in the POSSESSION of Western Union - stamped 4 MINUTES BEFORE he shoots Oswald...with a friggin' GUT SHOT - hardly the method to silece someone!
you have said nothing but the same shit. i have destroyed all this BS you keeping on throwing at me. you are are going nowhere douchebag. You are telling me that he just got lucky and said "hey..i feel like killing someone today....lets kill LHO".You have to bee an idoit to believe that BS.
Please ..again to your hard evidence BS line you keep repeating. why did Jack want to leave Dallas? he was scared for his life he told this to the WC. WHY? cant wait to see your Mountain of shit about this?
Rabbi Silverman said (in "Beyond Conspiracy", 2003") "in his distorted mind he was doing the right thing..this man killed HIS President [he stresses the word] and he loved HIS President and he was taking justice into his own hands.
Why do you think the Dallas police were going to actually FEIGN taking Oswald in an armoured car? Because of people saying the SAME THING...they wanted to avenge JFK's death an kill Oswald.
let me go ahead and crush this story now. Jack Ruby own different clubs that the DPD lived in almost. you tell me at the end he finally came out and said he did because he didnt know why?
Nancy Perrin Rich worked for Ruby at the Carousal. She told the WC that Ruby had instructed her to supply free drinks to the Dallas Police Department. Rich added "I don't think there is a cop in Dallas that doesn't know Jack Ruby. He practically lived at that police station. They lived in his place."
@autoad if you actually believe Oswald pulled off this entire fiasco with his rifle shots then you are one hilarious person. I will go no further to explain myself, which will cause you to call me out as being uninformed and having no facts to back up my opinion and, well, if you don't realize what's going on in the world today then your clearly denying aspects and views of others, and you are always right no matter what.
truesh1t 3 days ago
@truesh1t So you believe LHO didn't fire the shots or fired shots that missed or had nothing to do with the shooting whatsoever. That means there must have been another gunman(s).
The following is a list of potential gunmen that have been identified by different pro-conspiracy believers. Which one(s) do you believe were involved or were there others that are not on this list? Badge Man, Hard Hat Man, Black Dog Man, Coke Bottle Man, Cowboy Hats Man, Picket Fence Man,
LoneNutter1 8 hours ago
@truesh1t Waving At Mary Ann Moormen Man, Kicking Gordon Arnold Man, Ed Hoffman's Dark Coat Man and Striped Railroad Shirt Man, Under the Grassy Knoll Man, Triple Underpass Man, The Other Grassy Knoll Man, Sewer Sniper Man, Behind The Pergola Man, The Other Shooter From The TSBD Man, Dal-Tex Man, The Building Behind The TSBD Man, Umbrella Man, Radio Man, Jackie Man, Driver Of The Limo Man, Gun Embedded In The Limo Seat Man, Shooter In The Limo Trunk Man.
LoneNutter1 8 hours ago
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LoneNutter1 8 hours ago
@truesh1t I'm curious to read your reply.
LoneNutter1 8 hours ago
@LoneNutter1 That's quite the list of gunman, i'm just going to say this; i believe there WAS more than one gunman - with that said, i believe 2 unidentified gunman, in a matter of fate, shot Kennedy at the same exact time. One from the back (causing his forehead to explode -> exit wound) and another from behind the fence of the grassy knoll (i believe the final shot) causing him to slouch 'back, and to the left'.. I believe there's enough physical flesh/matter for both impacts to occur.
truesh1t 8 hours ago
@LoneNutter1 it just so happened that this occurred in such perfect harmony that, the results of the greatest conspiracy to ever hold it's ground did in fact succeed. Oswald is you basic puppet and jack rubby was just doing an order. (and if he didn't pull through then jack would be found dead days/weeks later)
truesh1t 7 hours ago
@LoneNutter1 As far as LHO, he was given an order from some "official", agent, overseas agent, WHO KNOWS, to take out the president for a reward / lump sump etc... I believe the communication was superior in this instance, (between the gunman, not LHO) in that, they took out the president before oswald had a chance to. Oswald would be screaming bloody murder that he was set up etc... but he didn't, how can you? Which makes me believe he was set up, allowing specialists to assassinate w/out error
truesh1t 7 hours ago
Thanks very much for all the negative votes! Having spent a career in marketing/advertising, the "blocked" comments evoke the curiosity of people who ask themselves "I wonder what was said that was so terrible?" They click on the Show button and my comments not only get read, but people look for them! This I know because people have sent me emails telling me that this is what they do. The "blocked" comments also reveal how fragile and closed minded the pro-conspiracy people are.
autoad 3 days ago
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This list is indicative of the foolishness of the Conspiracy Obsessed. They've destroyed their credibility by inventing nearly two dozen gunman blasting away at the president is a small area while remaining undetected while shooting and escaping unseen by hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. And all of these world-class gunman were so good at their jobs they missed JFK and they missed slow moving hulking limo as well. Whoever hired them I sure hope they got their money back.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
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This list is indicative of the foolishness of the Conspiracy Obsessed. They've destroyed their credibility by inventing nearly two dozen gunman blasting away at the president is a small area while remaining undetected while shooting and escaping unseen by hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. And all of these world-class gunman were so good at their jobs they missed JFK and they missed slow moving hulking limo as well. Whoever hired them I sure hope they got their money back.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
The contradictions are epic among the pro-conspiracy cultists! I merely identify the location/name of all the gunman they've claimed were in Dealey plaza shooting at the president and it's been marked as "spam"??
Are these names being rejected as false or do they not like the truth delivered by an unpopular messenger?
autoad 5 days ago
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None of them were seen by any of the hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. If they were world-class riflemen they all missed their target and they all escaped without leaving any trace of their being there firing a weapon. The Conspiracy Obsessed would have us believe all these gunmen existed despite the absence of any evidence of their existence. Yet, the people In the Plaza who saw the man holding and shooting a rifle from the TSBD at JFK are unreliable, mistaken or manipulated witnesses.
LoneNutter1 5 days ago
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How many gunman have the Conspiracy Obsessed put in Dealey Plaza? Badge Man, Hard Hat Man, Coke Bottle Man, Cowboy Hats Man, Picket Fence Man, Waving at Maryann Mooremen Man, Black Dog Man, Sewer Sniper Man, Behind the Pergola Man, Under The Grassy Knoll Man, Dal-Tex Man, The Other Shooter in the TSBD Man, The Building Behind the TSBD Man, Gun Embedded In The Limo Seat Man, Jackie Man, Shooter In The Trunk of The Limo Man, Triple Underpass Man, Limo Driver Man. They all share something in common
LoneNutter1 5 days ago
i would guess some one he knew Jack Ruby
edge78a 2 months ago
You need to read 'JFK And The Unspeakable' to understand who the person who Craig saw was. Craig witnessed the CIA Oswald double who was going around Dallas setting-up Lee Oswald as a dangerous communist lone nut. Craig ended-up dead because of it like several other people. Ralph Yates had the misfortune of giving this double a ride. On the ride he spoke of how easy it would be to kill a president from a building. Yates dropped him off at the Depository. FBI killed Yates in a mental institution
Exiles800 6 months ago 2
JFK had made enemies with the CIA, FBI, LBJ, and was planning to put an end to the Vietnam conflict. Given that war is more profitable than drugs, porn and gambling combined, it is obvious his life was in peril. What did LBJ do once he was in office?. He added 400,000 troops to Vietnam. It is always about the money then the power. Former Secretary of the Treasury Paul O'Neil said Bush 43 was talking about invading Iraq within 10 days of taking office in 2001. WOW.
390bullitt1968 6 months ago
If Oswald had been picked up by anyone, why was he roaming around the streets of Dallas, shot Tippitt, and was sitting in a theater when the police tracked him down and arrested him?
johnny511000 6 months ago
considering all the mistakes curry made that day and the days that followed, i'm suprrised he didn't say "he was picked up by a lawn jockey riding a horse".
LiquorWreckedEmGood 6 months ago 2
When you're telling a lie....always blame a fictitious black man.
The media and the sheeple love a story where an unidentified black man is responsible.
How did he get over there?
"I don't know. We had heard he was picked up by a negro in a car."
"No, it's not confirmed".
...yes, blame the fictitious black man and people will stop asking questions. Oh, a black guy did it; that makes sense. I can go back to sleep, now.
Funny - G. H. W. Bush can't remember where he was that day.
SuspiciousPatriot 7 months ago 2
When LHO was arrested in the Texas theather he had a bus transfer in his pocket. You can find the interview with the bus driver here on youtube. LHO got on the bus a block or so away from the TSBD. The cop in this video was lying for personal gain...money from Mark Lane...Oswald did not get into a car or station wagon after he shot JFK... He got on a bus, purchased the transfer but didn't use it because traffic was backed up due to the assasssination, so he got off the bus and into the cab.
Com6in3d 9 months ago
down in texas there's a saying -"go along to get along" -when the fix was in you go along with it. sometimes the truth can get you in trouble- lose your job or killed. sherriff roger craig told the truth- he got in trouble , lost his job, somebody shot at him, later he helped jim garrison investigation -they found him dead- they said he committed suicide. back in those days bennie binion could kill and get off- it was who you paid off.
larrywheels 9 months ago
@larrywheels So do you think Will Fritz was in on the coverup?
evergreenpotato 8 months ago
@evergreenpotato fritz was in dallas quite a few years as chief of detectives- the payoffs and fixes were normal business back in those days-sherriff decker and bennie binion were tight- according to nick cascio- he told me sherriff decker had more power in texas than the govenor-he had peices of gambling joints- my reading of this -guys like binion needed the fix to operate- the sherrif can give you protection- you give him a piece of the operation- points in vegas fritz swam in that swamp.
larrywheels 8 months ago
Roger Craig no doubt saw someone getting into the Nash Rambler roughly 15 minutes after the assassination, and he no doubt believed it was Oswald. But it was not. It simply was not. Oswald walked away from Dealey Plaza, got on a bus, got off when it was stalled in traffic, and then took a cab to his rooming house. He had a transfer on him at the time of arrest that shows he was on the bus. And his fare was recorded by the cab driver.
JohnDavidStutts1 9 months ago
While in police custody, LHO was brought out in the presence of the media on ten occasions. Yet, LHO claimed he was a patsy only one time and he says it in connection with having lived in the Soviet Union. He had nine other opportunities to proclaim his "patsyhood" but didn't. He had his best opportunity to state this during the "Midnight Press Conference" but didn't.
The claim of "patsy" is bogus . LHO was no patsy. But he was guilty as sin for murdering two people in one day.
LoneNutter1 10 months ago
@LoneNutter1 - Oh yeah, well you'll have to change your name, because the last two shots were bang-bang - almost simultaneous, as witnessed by dozens of folks, including nearly all the SS agents. And SS agent Hill, who looked at JFK's head for 10 minutes to the hospital said the back of his head was blown out. So did all the Drs. & nurses. So did Jackie. He was shot from the FRONT, get over it...YOU'RE WRONG...it was a plot, to remove JFK & put LBJ in, plain and simple.
Tomaji69 5 days ago
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@Tomaji69 Again, you rely on the reports of what people say they heard and saw, which in any criminal investigation is highly unreliable. That's why investigations rely on the physical, medical, forensic and ballistic evidence to help determine "what happened"? The sound of two shots fired close together is easily explained; echos. Dealey Plaza is an echo chamber that Lee Bowers testified about to the Warren Commission. You've built your argument on a bed of sand and it won't stand up.
LoneNutter1 5 days ago
@LoneNutter1 - I've seen these "lonenutter1" folks before...they will argue ANYTHING rather than acknowledging it holds merit. Like the BANG-BANG 100% proof there were at least TWO shooters. The Secret Service agents say that's what happened, but "LoneNutter1" says they were wrong (it must be an echo). Well, if it was an "echo", then ALL three shots would have been "bang-bang". So, just acknowledge this FACT...the last 2 shots were too close together to be one shooter. 100% proof
Tomaji69 5 days ago
I notice "LoneNutter1" says "The bang-bang of the last two shots is easily explained"..that's just it..WHY "explain" it?...that's what the coverup & WC is all about, isn't it? "Explaining" away what the eyewitnesses said, saw and heard, when THEY weren't there. The Drs. ALL said the back of JFK's head was blown out. Hill & Jackie did too AND the SS said the last two shots were close together AND they said there was a "flurry of shots flying into the limo from various locations".
Tomaji69 5 days ago
I have heard a recording of the police radio communications that day. The man driving the station wagon was described as being colored or a dark complected Latin male. The car with Oswald in it went west on hwy 80 and the next transmission from the dispatcher said to disregard the station wagon. Afterwards the frequency was jammed and when it was once again cleared cars were dispatched to to the Texas Theater after Tippet was killed. Odd that Oswald lost his wallet and had one when caught
barflew 1 year ago
@barflew - My bet is that the driver was Mac Wallace, who's fingerprints were matched to those on boxes up in the sniper's nest also (this was around 2006 or so, see Bar McClelland's book "Blood, Power and Money - How LBJ killed JFK"). He was LBJ's henchman.
Tomaji69 5 days ago
Who Does Oswald see in that room? Look at his face from 2:25- 2:45, in between their look at oswalds eyes. He sots someone in the room that seems to confirm to him that he is being set up for a fall. He knew!! Who did he see in that room? Please everyone throw some names out there, because you can clearly see Oswald spotted someone in that Police station that gave him confirmation that he was set up. Lee Oswald - the man with a thousand secrets.
kev42o97 1 year ago 3
@kev42o97 What an incredible talent you have! The ability to look into the eyes of someone and know in an instant what they're thinking! I'm impressed!
LoneNutter1 1 year ago
@LoneNutter1 He knew he was a patsy, no debate about that so kick rocks.
kev42o97 1 year ago
@kev42o97 I think there's plenty to be debated about the "patsy" factor. Since you seem convinced he was, I'd like to know how you decided he was a patsy. What information are you looking at to make that conclusion?
LoneNutter1 1 year ago
@LoneNutter1 - I'll help out here....Oswald was an intel agent. I know you're gonna try to deny it, but he was. NOBODY could waltz back into the U.S. after what he did in Russia (and with a KGB related wife?!). You see, if you have a name like "LoneNutter1", then you're not seeking TRUTH, you're out to assassinate ANY information that Oswald was NOT a "lone nut". Obviously, you are biased with a fixed viewpoint. Bang-bang, the back of JFK's head was blown out!! Explain THAT.
Tomaji69 5 days ago
@kev42o97 Well, the obvious answer would be Jack Ruby. David Atlee Phillips would be my guess, as I believe he was in the police station as well. There is a photo floating around the internet of Oswald's press conference which shows a man who is a dead ringer for Phillips in the crowd behind Oswald.
BlackieGirl 10 months ago
@BlackieGirl Thank you so much for being just open to the fact that this could have and clearly seems to be a conspiracy that went as planned. No different in my honest opinion to Mossad scum assassinations made on Hamas leaders, particularly one in early January of last year in Dubai with at least 20 people involved. David Attlee Philips, James Jesus Angleton, frank Sturgis, David Morales, Felix Rodriguez, and countless other CIA GOONS including the top one George H.W. Bush.
kev42o97 10 months ago
@kev42o97 No problem. Of course I'm open to the fact that this was a conspiracy. Only the most brain dead of morons would not be able to see that at this point.
When it comes to the intelligence creation that is Oswald, Angleton is key. Also, take a good look at William King Harvey.
BlackieGirl 10 months ago
@BlackieGirl Sorry if my statement "brain dead of morons" seemed a bit harsh. I just get tired of all the bickering and ignorance that runs rampant around this issue. I don't put you in that category at all.
BlackieGirl 10 months ago
@BlackieGirl James Jesus Angleton, head of counter intelligence, BlackieGirl you seem to be very knowledgeable about this topic, very impressive.
kev42o97 9 months ago
@kev42o97 - Yeah, it was rogue planners....the top planner was probably Meyers, who's wife had bedded JFK. Hoover knew it was gonna happen and they counted on him to help direct the coverup. The whole "justification" they whispered to each other was the JFK was a loose cannon commie sympathizer, so there had to be a "change in the executive branch". Sounds good, OK, get it done and count me in. Bush was involved also, as he was part of the Bay of Pigs thing too and hated JFK.
Tomaji69 5 days ago
The plan didn't go well. First of all, the shooters MISSED...!! Also a misfire early on (the first miss). The plan was for ONE shot each SIMULTANEOUSLY at the umbrella! OOPS! Yet another shot from the rear misses and hits Connally AND, of course, the "safety" shot from the picket fence that got him in the head. That shooter was only to fire IF necessary, thus they had to lie about how many shots & where they came from to pin it on Oswald. It was a mess, that's why we're all on to them.
Tomaji69 5 days ago
@Tomaji69 I concur sir, you have it right.
kev42o97 4 days ago
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@kev42o97 And your reply of agreement was posted at the same time kev42o97 posted his message.
If you're going to use multiple identities or aliases to create the illusion of support, please be a little smarter than that.
autoad 4 days ago
@kev42o97 Absolutely!
misscarolinec 4 days ago
@kev42o97 I disagree. Oswald was looking at all the reporters from all over the country and thinking to himself.
"Wow! I've hit the jackpot. All these people here to see me and ask me questions and I get to become famous and important. Things are working out exactly the way I wanted!"
It's clear and obvious this is what he was thinking.
autoad 5 months ago
@autoad - So, if Oswald was so bent on being famous, he would have simply bragged of having offed JFK all by himself. I tell you, he was an intel agent doing undercover work the whole time and was pegged as the patsy from the beginning. He was waiting in the break room to hear "They busted some guys upstairs for trying to kill the Prez". Then, he went into shock and his world came tumbling down.
Tomaji69 5 days ago
@autoad Thats ridiculous, he was working for the FBI as an informant, at the same time he also worked for the CIA, George De Moreschildt was his handler, and before George was to testify before the House Select Commitee on Assassinations. So don't tell me he didn't know he was being blamed as a "Patsy" which he even said himself. Oswald did not kill JD tippet, nor did he shoot the president John Kennedy, that is a fact.
kev42o97 4 days ago
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@kev42o97 There is no evidence Oswald worked for the FBI nor is there evidence he worked for the CIA. The conspiracy obsessed tried to create a document that said LHO worked for the CIA but they bungled the document so badly it was immediately recognized as a very bad forgery. Your assessment of DeMohrenschildt (not De Moreschildt), the "patsy" defense, the non-invlovement of Oswald killing JFK and Tippit is absurd. It was never "proven" he didn't shoot them.
autoad 4 days ago
@autoad George shot himself supposedly with a shotgun in the head a day before he was to testify.
kev42o97 4 days ago
no one is being forced to view any of these videos ,so watch them if you want or dont watch them at all but please refrain from using vulgar language and insults.
fobrien1 1 year ago
James Files met with Oswald the day before. Files says that Oswald was sent to spend time with Files for target practise but LHO knew nothing of Files intentions. Oswald was sent by CIA Officer David Attlee Phillips who marshalled the killing.
shakercoola 1 year ago
@shakercoola What a load of bunk! More silly CT'er theory based on a desparate need to somehow prove something without evidence.
LoneNutter1 1 year ago
@LoneNutter1 As LoneNutter1's therapist I can confirm categorically that LoneNuuter1 has a bored out head. There is no brain matter there whatever and never has been. His inability to spell simple words such as "desperate" is evidence of this. LoneNutter is on medication, is dyslexic and may be dangerous. DO NOT ENGAGE!!
usuIkane 1 year ago
@LoneNutter1 where is the evidence for Oswald? There is none whatsoever and any you refer to is baloney.
shakercoola 1 year ago
@shakercoola You can't be serious.
LoneNutter1 1 year ago
@LoneNutter1 MR CONTRARIAN! I hope you are enjoying revelling in this role because your view is not just in the minority, but it's frankly preposterous. You are a nutter.
shakercoola 1 year ago
@shakercoola The majority is not always right. If the majority of people thought the earth was flat would the earth become flat? If the majority of people thought the earth was round would it become round? There's loads of evidence showing the movement of LHO after he left the TSBD. You can believe he was transported by aliens for all I care. Believe what you want.
LoneNutter1 1 year ago
Did they ever find the Negro?
JENDALL714 1 year ago
Ruth & Micheal Paine were cia agents.Micheal Paine was an engineer with Bell Helicopter and had security clearance.
themeaningoflife38 1 year ago
@themeaningoflife38 What a load of baloney.
LoneNutter1 1 year ago
verdelufe the shooting occured at 12.30 oswald was seen by officer marion baker and roy truly a maximum of 90 seconds after the shooting on the second floor where had indeed bought a coke.a mrs reid who was in the second floor office watches oswald stroll calmly away. it was about 12.40 that craig says he saw oswald get in to a rambler ,so it was some 6 to 8 minutes after oswald was seen on the second floor. so craig did not give two conflicting statments.
fobrien1 1 year ago
@fobrien1 But 8 minutes after the shooting he was seen going by bus and cab to his rooming house then to go
to the Texas theater. What the hell to jump into Mrs. Paine station wagon which would take him to Irving, the suburb in the other direction where Mrs Paine lived, away from his rooming house. Mr. Craig sounds very convincing and confusing at the same time.
Verdelufe 10 months ago
Roger Craig sounds very convincing but there is a very conflicting statement from him. He saw LHO running down the grassy knoll and jump into the station wagon of Mrs. Payne. This fact happened a minute or 2 after the shooting where many witness saw LHO on the 2nd floor of the TSBD buying Coke in the lunch room and was intervewed by police officer with the manager of TSBD next to him.
I believe in conspiracy but this really bothers me. AM I MISSING SOMETHING???
Please post it !!!
Verdelufe 1 year ago
@Verdelufe I think Craig ran behind the fence following Dallas Police that were in the motorcade.He spent several minutes searching the parking lot area and then made his way back accross Elm st.When he saw Oswald he couldnt get back accross the street in time to stop him.So it would have been several minutes after Oswald was found on the 2nd floor.
themeaningoflife38 1 year ago
Oswald was the lone gunman. no matter what car, bus, cab, he took to run from his crimes. end of the the story
ahidel 1 year ago
@ahidel - Oswald couldn't have fired two shots bang-bang...the last two shots, as told by the SS agents. They also reported "a flurry of shots came into the limo from a variety of locations". Agent Hill, all the Drs. and nurses, Jackie, the ambulance attendant, etc. ALL said the BACK of JFK's head was blown out the size of a grapefruit!! He was shot from the FRONT obviously!! It was a plot to put LBJ in place of JFK & the 24 years of Kennedy's "direction".. he was WAY ahead of his time.
Tomaji69 5 days ago
even back then they were blaming black people...
deshaebeasley 1 year ago 2
.52 secs, lower photo.....source of backyard (head) photo. Poor bugger was set up long before.
You shoulda heard Gary Mack when I told him this years ago.
moyadapne 1 year ago
Buell Wesley Frazier's sister picked me up, not Ruth Paine.
TheRealAlekHidell 1 year ago
this was not done by one man who woke up one day and said he was gonna shoot the president.... Owald may have been the shooter, or one of the shooters... he have have had no knowlege of the incident or no knowlege untill the last minute, but he did not do it by himdself. he was either a patsey, or he was part of a team or a hired gunman for a person or organization, bein the mob, the fbi, cia, some government org. or some oilmen in the texas area. There was ALOT of crucial overlooked evidence.
blazed24sevn 1 year ago 13
You already got answers...you just CHOOSE to not accept them.
basenjib123 1 year ago
You people would turn a ham sandwich into a conspiracy.
basenjib123 1 year ago
yes and you just add to the ham sandwich by making comments on here. stop making out everyone on here are idiots, dont read the comments if your not bothered a lot of us think it stinks what ever happened that day in Dallas and we want answers alot of us dont agree with each others ideas on it. but the main thing is if we keep talking it wont just go away maybe one day they(the goverment) will have to take another look at what happened.
RADDA77 1 year ago 2
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basenjib123 1 year ago
Bullshit! Oswald shot Tippit because he was GUILTY of MURDER!
basenjib123 1 year ago
there are few interesting things with Oswald and Tippit. Oswald make a seen in a cafe over his breakfast a police officer is also eating in the cafe he comes over to settle Oswald down, who is the officer? TIPPET. and before Oswald leaves his house a patrol car slow down outside then drives away. a neighbour said the number on the car was a had 01 or 10. officer Tippet car was 10.
RADDA77 1 year ago
Can you prove he did, cos you know people are kill't for a reason and reasons being e.g. he saw something he shouldn't have!
HateFenians 1 year ago
who cares? jfk was a piece of crap that doublecrossed the chicago mob and he got what was coming to him.
hogger129 2 years ago
hogger thats your view but he never did any deal with the mafia if any deal was done it was his dad Joe Kennedy who made it. The only thing you can say wasnt a good thing was JFK's affairs. But as for being a president he was the best.Oh and lets say he did cross the mob who gives a shit there criminals.and that piece of crap Giancana got what was coming to him.
RADDA77 1 year ago
@RADDA77 - Oswald was mob-connected through Ruby.
JFK was not the best. I think we can agree that Thomas Jefferson already holds that title. FDR comes close too. JFK is nowhere near the best. He shit on everyone.
He doublecrossed the mob. They killed him and used J. Edgar Hoover to cover it up since they held leverage on him with the 'compromising' picture they had of him.
hogger129 1 year ago
Now who better to cover it up than Hoover? Hoover is well known for having dirt on EVERYONE. If you have Hoover in your pocket, everyone will do what you want. The Chicago mob did it and Hoover was the key to the cover up.
hogger129 1 year ago
Everyone has so many opinons on who killed JFK I have been talking with someone on the internet who thinks its Oswald on his own and from behind. I dont agree with this. As for Oswald and the mob there is meant to be a link between Oswald and Ruby having meet before. But i think Oswald was CIA but who knows.
RADDA77 1 year ago
@hogger129 - Mafia people were used so if the "lone nut" story failed, then they'd blame it on the Mafia. Oswald was an intel agent undercover doing his job and was set up all along. He had Marina take those photos of him with the rifle/pistol to show "the gang" he was ready in Dallas to put the rifle in place for the shooter. Then, he waited in the break room, soon to be a hero, or so he thought. He went into shock when he realized he was patsy. Now, he can't trust ANYBODY.
Tomaji69 5 days ago
If Oswald was so innocent...why did he gun down Officer Tippet?
basenjib123 2 years ago
Hi basenjib123 there were witness that have said Oswald didnt shoot Tippet. But instead the WC didnt want to listen to that but instead called on a witness who changed her story like the weather. including Tippet talking to her as he died, Tippet died instantly so couldnt of spoke to her. Why kill Tippet ? he heard Oswalds discription over the radio and instead of taking him to the airport Tippet got out of the car to arrest him this could not happen as it would ruin the conspirators plans.
RADDA77 1 year ago
@basenjib123 - I think once Oswald knew he was a patsy instead of an intel hero who would get a promotion, he knew he couldn't trust ANYONE at this point. So, the tail end of his "escape from TSBD", etc. is true...he went to his room, got his pistol & had NO idea what the hell to do. When Tippit confronted him, he offed him because Oswald figured HE would be OFFED by the planners so he wouldn't talk. In fact, I think he was supposed to be offed AT the TSBD, but he slipped out.
Tomaji69 5 days ago 10
I don't know what 62 is going on about, but Detective Craig says he say him get into the Rambler, that Paine say's was in her driveway that morning. Oswald also states that he told the other Detectives he was in the car, and he no doubt told them who was driving. None of what you see in this video made it into the W.C. report. That is conpiracy fact, not theory !
THX1948 2 years ago
Do you know the source of your "witness murdered nonsense?
A London Times article that was RETRACTED! (Apparently the retraction didn't carry the weight of the initial story...no surprise). Why the retraction? Because it was a statistical joke as it was initially presented...let alone the fact that it was padded with "small potatoes". Any elderly person on the list having a heart attack was labeled "suspicious"...as if something frightened them so much it induced them to have a heart attack!!!
pajasa62 2 years ago
Evwr attempted on a cheek...geez you are stupid.
I don't think I have ever spoken so harshly against someone on youtube, but you are a COWARD.
I've asked you REPEATEDY to define your point of view, but you can't answer the question:
How many people did it take to pull of this conspiracy and coverup?
You CAN'T answer it after, what 5 days of asking everyday?
WHY? Becausae if you did it would make yours and all the other silly theories collapse.
pajasa62 2 years ago
a coward?
you have not given me logic just BS..just like you are good at.
you are right about Collapse. Your Bullshit is getting heavy.
you have still not told me why it failed.
the test was done for a reason.
if you are going to be a douchebag..dont be a half douche be all the way douche.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
Like the great athlete when he's suddenly outted about being on steriods...that's what the JFK conspiracy theorists feels.
Suddenly when asked to define THEIR position...the only time THEY are asked a question, what do you get?
AVOIDANCE
Just to ask the OPINION :
How many people do you feel are part of the JFK conspiracy?
The answer? - A refusal to answer.
Suddenly their little mental video game is over, suddenly this topic is no longer entertaining. Their position is UNDEFENDABLE.
pajasa62 2 years ago
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@pajasa62 @pajasa62 - All that has to be shown for it to be a conspiracy is that more than one shooter and/or planner was involved. We've done that many times over. The back of JFK's head was blown out, but the WC LIED about that, ignoring the Drs. and nurses (and Clint Hill, Jackie and others) testimony. The Secret Service said the last two shots were very close together (bang-bang) AND they said that "a flurry of bullets was flying into the limo from various positions".
Tomaji69 5 days ago
So lay it on me FGTFJT...
How many people do you think are part of this plot and massive coverup? How many did it take to organize and recruit people for conspiracy?
2 people? 3 people? Maybe 5 or 6 to create and maintain this?
I know CTers are great at asking (or more properly) RE-ASKING questions, but they don't seem too brilliant at finding out answers or accepting them.
pajasa62 2 years ago
@pajasa62 - All that has to be shown for it to be a conspiracy is that more than one shooter and/or planner was involved. We've done that many times over. The back of JFK's head was blown out, but the WC LIED about that, ignoring the Drs. and nurses (and Clint Hill, Jackie and others) testimony. The Secret Service said the last two shots were very close together (bang-bang) AND they said that "a flurry of bullets was flying into the limo from various positions".
Tomaji69 5 days ago
@Tomaji69 Let's cut to the chase and you can try to answer the following (or are you going to change the topic and run away from the questions like before?)
1. Identify the specific location of al the gunman
2. Identify the weapons used
3. Identify the caliber and type of ammo used
4. Identify the order from where the shots were fired
5. Provide the source of the evidence that supports your contention of multiple gunman.
I can answer these questions...you either can't or won't.
Which is it?
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
@LoneNutter1 - Wow, this sounds like I've heard it before. Obviously to prove conspiracy, it is only necessary to prove there was more than one shooter or planner or LIES during a coverup. Conspiracy people have done this many times over. The last two shots were BANG BANG...that ALONE is 100% proof of more than one shooter. The back of JFK's head was blown out...100% proof the head shot was from the FRONT. Your idiotic questions are irrelevant & narrow-minded, just like your name.
Tomaji69 4 days ago 2
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@Tomaji69 And again you use earwitness testimony that is highly unreliable. Not everybody heard two shots close to each other.
If the back of JFK's head was blown out how did the particulate matter get propelled forward covering the Connally's and the two agents in the front seat? Do you have any forensic evidence that supports a shot from the front? No, you don't. Do you have any physical evidence he was shot from the front? No, you don't. Any ballistic or medical evidence? No, you don't.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
@LoneNutter1 - There is no "IF"...the back of JFK's head was blown out. There is no doubt, the last two shots were BANG BANG. You can say all you want that it isn't true, but it is....YOU claiming something isn't true, doesn't PROVE it to be false. I notice you do this over and over...saying that "they" must be wrong...but THEY were there and they were Secret Service men, Police and Doctors who held JFK's head in their hands and THEY know a lot more than YOU. Two or more shooters!
Tomaji69 4 days ago
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@Tomaji69 You're basing your position on selected bits of information from a variety of sources but you're failing to look at all of the evidence including the medical report from the 9 forensic experts for the HSCA. Rather, you're content to holler conspiracy and cover-up when you have no evidence of either.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
@LoneNutter1 - Of course my position is based on selected information...the TRUTHFUL pieces of information that show there were TWO or more shooters/planners. You know very well the MBT is a crock, right? I suppose YOU can "prove" the MBT...? Come on, do it...because if you CAN'T, then it was more than Oswald....that's why that lie was told. But the last two shots were BANG BANG, so that ALONE proves more than one shooter. Change your name.
Tomaji69 4 days ago
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@Tomaji69 So now you're resorting to name-calling and insults which adds further credibility to my position that you're case is shaky and weak. The best friend of the CT'ers, forensic pathologist Dr. Cyril Wecht, was part of the 9 person HSCA team and he said "there is no medical evidence available to support shots from the front or side". The case for multiple gunman will always fall short when there's no evidence of an additional gunman in Dealey Plaza. By my last count, you and your
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
@LoneNutter1 - You are an ATTACKER and NOT a truth seeker. Period. Why is your name "LoneNutter"...??
Tomaji69 4 days ago 2
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@Tomaji69 pro-conspiracy brethren have placed at least 20 gunman in the Plaza: Badge Man, Hard Hat Man, Picket Fence Man, Coke Bottle Man, Black Dog Man, Waving At Maryann Mooreman Man, Cowboys Hats Man, Under The Grassy Knoll Man, Behind The Pergola Man, Sewer Sniper Man, Triple Underpass Man, The Other Shooter In The TSBD Man, Building Behind The TSBD Man, Dal-Tex Man, Gun Embedded In the Limo Seat Man, Shooter In The Trunk Man, Jackie Man, Limo Driver Man, The Other Grassy Knoll Man.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
@LoneNutter1 - You are a ranting, raving lunatic, attacking me with your bullshit. Stop it. The back of JFK's head was BLOWN OUT...that is 100% fact. The last two shots were BANG BANG...that is 100% fact...so THERE is your "evidence" of more than one shooter. Clint Hill says "The President was shot just above his right ear...and the back of his head had a hole the size of my fist". Jackie said the back of his head was missing. Get over it, they LIED to you...change your name!!
Tomaji69 4 days ago
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@Tomaji69 The only person ranting and raving is you. Typing words in upper case letters may make you feel better but it doesn't make them any truer.
You've clearly lost the discussion by admitting your refusal to look at all the evidence. You've admitted you pick and choose evidence they way people pick their food at a buffet. You've based your entire argument on the most unreliable evidence and treat the scientific evidence as if it's diseased. If I were a CT'er (and I was one many years ago)
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
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@Tomaji69 I'd obsess over the eye and earwitness testimony and flee the scene when the scientific evidence showed up.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
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@Tomaji69 I have a question related to the content in your posts; you like to say "that is 100% fact". In my world a fact is a fact and can't be stated as a percentage of a fact. There's no such thing as an 85% fact or 32.67% fact. A fact either is or it isn't. It's like being pregnant; either you are or you aren't. Could you enlighten us on how you're able to state facts as a percentage?
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
@Tomaji69 This list is indicative of the foolishness of the Conspiracy Obsessed. They've destroyed their credibility by inventing nearly two dozen gunman blasting away at the president is a small area while remaining undetected while shooting and escaping unseen by hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. And all of these world-class gunman were so good at their jobs they missed JFK and they missed slow moving hulking limo as well. Whoever hired them I sure hope they got their money back.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
@Tomaji69 This list is indicative of the foolishness of the Conspiracy Obsessed. They've destroyed their credibility by inventing nearly two dozen gunman blasting away at the president is a small area while remaining undetected while shooting and escaping unseen by hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. And all of these world-class gunman were so good at their jobs they missed JFK and they missed slow moving hulking limo as well. Whoever hired them I sure hope they got their money back.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
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@Tomaji69 This list is indicative of the foolishness of the Conspiracy Obsessed. They've destroyed their credibility by inventing nearly two dozen gunman blasting away at the president is a small area while remaining undetected while shooting and escaping unseen by hundreds of people in Dealey Plaza. And all of these world-class gunman were so good at their jobs they missed JFK and they missed slow moving hulking limo as well. Whoever hired them I sure hope they got their money back.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
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@Tomaji69 I'm not asking you "prove" the case for conspiracy but to provide measurable, scientific data that can't be altered over time or influenced by fading memories or influenced by outside sources. I'm asking the you provide evidence (or the source) that can be examined by improving scientific methods and can be tested by standardized means by different people. You rely on eye and earwitness testimony that is highly unreliable in any investigation. So let's see what science has to say.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
@LoneNutter1 - It is incorrect to imply or say that ALL "witness testimony is highly unreliable". It is CERTAINLY true that you or some lawyer in D.C. is LESS reliable, when they weren't even there, right? In this case, I refer to 100% reliable witness testimony...that of Jackie, Clint Hill, Kellerman, other Secret Service agents, the Doctors & nurses, etc. who had close, professional observations of the head wound, etc. These were not just people standing around in Dealy Plaza.
Tomaji69 4 days ago 2
@LoneNutter1 - I don't have to do what you are "asking" me to do...who do you think you are? I have proven there were two or more shooters. Not so much me, but expert eyewitness testimony. That's all that has to be shown to prove CONSPIRACY....come on, say it with me...."CONSPIRACY". Why are you so hard headed?
Tomaji69 4 days ago 5
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@Tomaji69 You've proven nothing.
LoneNutter1 4 days ago
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@Tomaji69
REALLY?
So what do you have after 48+ years?
Masquerading opinion as the truth?
Cherrypicking an earwitness when the OVERWHELMING consensus goes the other way?
Citing the Secret Service in one sentence, then, depending on your theory of the day, cast them as part of the plot?
You spat out this worthless garbage about Tippet being part of the plot as if this was some mental video game you're playing.
This is an historical event that happened ONE WAY, not 2 ways...not 3.
pajasa62 4 days ago
@pajasa62 - The last two shots were BANG BANG and the back of JFK's head was blown out. Two or more shooters. You are DESPERATELY trying to discredit me...why? I know why. Because I am speaking the truth and you need to change your name and that's too much for you....you are overheating and about to explode. Get over it...you are wrong....two or more shooters.
Tomaji69 4 days ago 6
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@Tomaji69
I don't need to try to discredit you...you are doing it to yourself.
You have these worthless standards for proof.
AGAIN....cherrypicking earwitness accounts for "bang bang" when the overwhelming consensus says...You have ZERO evidence of film of this "bang bang" and ZERO physical evidence.
Maybe that's why the JFK conspiracy idea just fizzled out....a complete lack of evidence and a persuasive argument.
pajasa62 4 days ago
Although you didn't aske the question of me, I'll answer. I'm sure you know that the question CANNOT be answered. But, I'll bite: LBJ, Hoover, Ruby, an unknown number of LBJ associates in Texas. The cop that substituted the carcano for the Mauser. At least two shooters. Several members of the CIA and at least ONE in JFK's secret service detail - the one that ordered his detail off of his car. You count, how many is that?
mmcsdaddy 2 years ago
Part 1. At least your trying, but your list of course has ZERO details of the event. I'm well aware that CTers can shift weight because after 46 years they can't even come to a logical consensus. I'll give you a general list and you can ask and specifics you want of me.
FBI, Secret Service, Dallas police, Dallas DA, Head of Dallas Bar, New Orleans media, Dallas media, national media, AT LEAST 3 teams of doctors in 3 cities, 7 direct corruburations to the 6th flr. nest, bus driver, cab driver.
pajasa62 2 years ago
@pajasa62 - OK, so how did Ozzie fire two shots bang-bang (the last two shots were almost on top of each other, like the SS agents said) AND how do you explain the BACK of JFK's head being blown out, yet the WC saying otherwise? It's an obvious plot to put LBJ in place of JFK, because JFK's "direction" was too liberal & he was for the American people instead of the 1% & the war hawks. JFK was viewed as a loose cannon "commie sympathizer" or such. He was ending the FED too!
Tomaji69 5 days ago 9
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@Tomaji69
EVERYTHING you said amounts to NOTHING!
You cherrypick "bang-bang" witnesses when the overwhelming consensus say it was NOT. Any evidence recorded on film of "bang-bang"?....NOPE....Any physical evidence of "bang-bang"?...NOPE.
You spit out garbage about Tippet and masquerade it as "the truth"....and you pretend a favorable shot for Oswald would be when a car load of SS agents are staring at him while he has a partial shot of JFK's head obscured by Connally.....weak, man....WEAK!
pajasa62 5 days ago
Part 2.
Handgun mail-order house, rifle mail-order house. 10 witnesses to the Tippet shooting & flight. Ruth Paine, Michael Paine, Marina Oswald, Wesley Frazier & sister, Ruby's stripper, telephone company, Western Union employee and the Warren Commission (35 members with Counsel, staff lawyers, laisons) THEN the 100's & 100's of agents that conducted 25,000 interviews and specialists that examined 3,000 pieces of evidence! Oh & before I forget one little thing...the people to RECRUIT the list!
pajasa62 2 years ago
@pajasa62 How many more parts of this bullshit are you gonna post,cocksucker?
where are parts 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 ad fucking nauseam?
LittIeVinnyCock 1 year ago 2
@LittIeVinnyCock : Are you sure it isn't "Vinny LittleCock"?
Dogheadj 1 year ago
Now adding on to your list...
"The cop that substituted the Carcano for the Mauser"?? Are you aware that the media was sealed in TSBD 7 minutes after the shots? That there wasn't 1 investigator there , but many?
"At least ONE in JFK's SS detail"? THAT's is one big simplification for a conspiracy theorist! To pretend agents always rode on the back bumper is flat out wrong. Eg. during his Texas visit JFK was in MULTIPLE motorcades in 2 other cities that DID NOT even use this type of limo!
pajasa62 2 years ago
Hey moron the burden of proof isn't on the conspiracy theorists,its on the LN side to prove oswald killed jfk beyond a reasonable doubt...you lose
TheGatorfan93 2 years ago 2
"burden of proof isn't on the conspiracy theorists"
NO KIDDING!
They spit out this nonsense under the banner of "theory", but what do they offer? Fragmented ideas, weak associations, cling to premature reports and ambiguous comments, claim "simple physics" accounts for something complicated and rely on statements from paid interviews and lucrative book deals.
Sure you say they don't need proof...in ANY argument that is a sign of weakness, not strength.
pajasa62 2 years ago
pajasa: What a dumb question. You are obviously too lazy, dull-witted or ignorant to care to examine the mass of info & details refuting the simplistic WC 'finding'. You can't begin to understand how the real world works. Are you afraid to find the truth & have your fond delusions shattered? There were many motives & degrees of 'knowing' by those involved in the conspiracy & cover-up, from trained assassins & organizers to military 'orders', w/ over 49 potential witnesses & insiders murdered.
starmanskye 2 years ago
"What a dumb question. You are obviously too lazy, dull-witted or ignorant to care to examine the mass of info & details"
NICE! Who's being to lazy to defend THEIR position? Who's too lazy to bring up details? Conspiracy theorists are great at the "concept" of conspiracy...but that's about it. Their great about reasking questions, but not to brilliant when it comes to finding out the answers.
"Over 49 potential witnesses..."
Really?....are you sure it wasn't over 50?...or 51?...
Pure BS
pajasa62 2 years ago
FGTFJT
I know your locked into your conspiracy theory (whatever the latest "cool" theory might be.) and you in a state of avoiding.
Don't you feel a bit emasculated that you refused (I counted 9 TIMES so far) to answer the question:
HOW MANY PEOPLE DO YOU THINK WERE INVOLVED IN THE JFK CONSPIRACY AND IT'S COVERUP?
I'm ASKING for you to defend your, not mine, YOUR position on this topic.
pajasa62 2 years ago
Kind of silly to have someone be so unwavering in a JFK conspiracy and yet repeatedly (for 8 friggin' times) refuse to answer how a conspiracy could be organized for this event and how many people would be involved.
YEAH, it's easy to pretend there's a conspiracy when you don't actually have to sweat any details.
pajasa62 2 years ago
Ruby friend Broek Wall : "First thing out of his mouth (when he visited him in jail) was "I'm a hero".
Ruby's Rabbi Silverman: "I ask him, Jack did you have connections with people (in a conspiracy) and he denied it vehemently again and again...in his distorted mind he did the right thing in that this man killed his President and he loved his President and he was taking justice into his own hands"
A hitman doesn't "silence" someone with a single GUT SHOT ...in a police station - PERIOD!
pajasa62 2 years ago 2
ok you have a friend and a Rabbi. who said he did it because he felt like it was the right thing to do?
let me get my boots because the bullshit is getting high.
he is telling your "CREW" THE WARREN COMMISSION. to take me to washington for the hell of it? why did he want to take the lie detector test if he was lying?
FGTFJT 2 years ago
Do you know the results of the lie detector test?...Next time don't bluff a question unless you know the answer...
He's rotting away in jail..sure, he's going to try to get a retrial...can't you think? Seriously?
FOR THE 8th TIME I ask this question (not kidding the EIGHT time. You refuse to answer it because your conspiracy goes down the tiolet when confronted with the reality and the minutia of this event.
HOW MANY PEOPLE DO YOU THINK WERE INVOLVED IN THIS CONSPIRACY?
Coward.
pajasa62 2 years ago
A paraffin test on his cheek fails.
During his questioning Lee Harvey Oswald was administered a paraffin test by W. E. Barnes of the Dallas Police Department. In this test warm paraffin, which is applied to the skin to open up its pores, collects contaminants. If the suspect had fired a gun, one potential contaminant would be the nitrates from gun powder residue.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
Once the paraffin hardens, either diphenylamine or diphenylbenzidine is introduced to the paraffin cast, which will turn it blue in the presence of nitrates. Thus, the presence of blue dots on the paraffin casts is evidence that the suspect had fired a gun.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
A paraffin test was applied to Oswald's hands and right cheek; his hands reacted positively, whereas his cheek did not. Since shooting a rifle should have exposed his right cheek to gunpowder, the negative reaction is often cited as evidence that he did not fire a rifle.
No LONE GUNMAN believer yet answered me a logical answer why this test failed.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
Again, don't ask I question against you can answer it...when bolted the Mannlicher-Carcano doesn't emit nitrates AND this was the FIRST TIME the Dallas Police EVER ATTEMPTED such a test.
More ambigous nonsense on your part.
pajasa62 2 years ago 2
again...no logical explantion has ever been given for the Paraffin test. i have heard the "FIRST TIME" & "EVER ATTEMPTED" line before and its stinks like horse shit. HELLO! this is the DPD thats why they have training on this ,before they use it to convict anyone of any crime. Let alone the biggest Crime of the Century. dont you think the would have taken consideration, if they felt like they didnt know much about , that they would have not used the test? you dodge the question. give me Logic.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
@FGTFJT Anyone claiming that the nitrate tests applied in Dallas were the "first time" those tests were done is simply unaware of the facts. However, as a tool to convict anyone, nitrate tests are basically useless. The reason being that there are far too many possible sources for nitrates to ever conclusively say that firing a weapon was the source. The tests were outdated then. They were mainly used to get a confession out of suspects who were unaware of just how useless the tests were.
JohnDavidStutts1 9 months ago
also they used the Paraffin as evidence to convict LHO of the is crime. but yet you tell me it was the FIRST TIME IT WAS EVER ATTEMPTED ... Listen to what you are saying.if the test didnt pass 100% percent they should have never used it as evidence. but they used it because it was a very useful tool at the time. i have been around guns and have seen a Paraffin test done Even the same one done on LHO. Just by firing a handgun you have traces of Nitrates on your face. "LIGHT BULB !!!!"
FGTFJT 2 years ago
Please MR. I like to stack BS high like a Mountiain. Again why did it fail ?
FGTFJT 2 years ago
For the 7th time...
You believe in a conspiracy. You must have thought about it...how a conspiracy to kill the President can be organized, people recruited, the massive coverup...
AGAIN I ask:
How many people do you think took part in this conspiracy to commit this act and keep the "Oswald alone / conspiracy coverup" intact?
How many FGTYFT?
3 or 4 people? Maybe 4 or 5 silent criminals? Anybody approached, but backed out? Or was it just 200+ zombies in a trance?
pajasa62 2 years ago
FGTFJT
For the 6th time...YOU believe in a conspiracy.
Have you even thought about it?
How many people do you think might be involved with a JFK conspiracy?
2, 3...5?
SIX TIMES I've ask you this question and NOTHING.
pajasa62 2 years ago
Everything you say amounts to nothing...just speculation trumped by what actually happend.
pajasa62 2 years ago
You have taken a so called confession by the Lone Gunman Nuts and said. ok we believe him. he is telling the truth. he had nothing to do with the JFK murder. but on the day of the Shooting no one Believed what Jack Ruby was stating to the Media, FBI, or the WC.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
You're talking in riddles.
How 'bout it.? How about defending YOUR position on conspiracy.?
You you want a conspiracy...without people....without dealing with any detail of the history of this event.
Lay it on me, I can't wait, how many conspirators?
pajasa62 2 years ago
Chief Justice WARREN: Well, I don't know what can be done, Mr. Ruby, because I don't know what you anticipate we will encounter.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
Mr. RUBY: All I know is maybe something can be saved. Because right now, I want to tell you this, I am used as a scapegoat, and there is no greater weapon that you can use to create some falsehood about some of the Jewish faith, especially at the terrible heinous crime such as the killing of President Kennedy.
Now maybe something can be saved. It may not be too late, whatever happens, if our President, Johnson, knew the truth from me.
But if I am eliminated, there won't be any way of knowing.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
Right now, when I leave your presence now, I am the only one that can bring out the truth to our President, who believes in righteousness and justice.
But he has been told, I am certain, that I was part of a plot to assassinate the President.
I know your hands are tied; you are helpless.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
Chief Justice WARREN: The President will know everything that you have said, everything that you have said.
Mr. RUBY: But I won't be around, Chief Justice. I won't be around to verify these things you are going to tell the President.
Mr. TONAHILL: Who do you think is going to eliminate you, Jack?
FGTFJT 2 years ago
Mr. RUBY: I have been used for a purpose, and there will be a certain tragic occurrence happening if you don't take my testimony and somehow vindicate me so my people don't suffer because of what I have done.
Chief Justice WARREN: But we have taken your testimony. We have it here. It will be in permanent form for the President of the United States and for the Congress of the United States, and for the courts of the United States, and for the people of the entire world.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
It is there. It will be recorded for all to see. That is the purpose of our coming here today. We feel that you are entitled to have your story told.
Mr. RUBY: You have lost me though. You have lost me, Chief Justice Warren.
Chief WARREN: Lost you in what sense?
Mr. RUBY: I won't be around for you to come and question me again.
Chief Justice WARREN: Well, it is very hard for me to believe that. I am sure that everybody would want to protect you to the very limit.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
BIDG DEAL!
He was looking for a retrial...rotting away in jail.
But when it comes to what his strippers, brother, RABBI, or friends and roommate say...just ignore it.
Ruby on ("Oswald's Ghost", 2008) in 1966. - "The ironic things is Had I made an ILLEGAL turn behing the buses into the parking lot on Main St. and didn't see those people as I went into Western Union, I'd never have met this fate."
THAT TRUMPS ANY OF YOUR CRAP!
pajasa62 2 years ago
Mr. RUBY: All I want is a lie detector test, and you refuse to give it to me.
Because as it stands now--and the truth serum, and any other--Pentothal--how do you pronounce it, whatever it is. And they will not give it to me, because I want to tell the truth.
And then I want to leave this world. But I don't want my people to be blamed for something that is untrue, that they claim has happened.
Chief WARREN: Mr. Ruby, I promise you that you will be able to take such a test.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
now tell me after all i have dished out and more then you could chew and eat, why do you keep trying to spit it out? Jack had connections with the Govnt, Mafia and DPD connections. Common knowledge would tell you he just didnt help Dick Nixon just for that period of time and stop. hell no..he kept working for the govnt. why was he so ready to talk and leave Dallas and go to D.C? he was willing to take the truth serum and a lie detector test. now why would he do that? come on smart Guy.
FGTFJT 2 years ago
You cite a friggin' document that had a zip code that DIDN'T EXIST in 1947!
That's the problem with conspiracy theorist...they dissolved into a Sci-fi community.
It went from people looking for answers... same with conspiracy programs from the 60's, 70's and 80's....all looking for answers...problem for the CTers, people found the answers to the questions and CTers were so "locked" into their position & like you in this, it just becomes a matter of saving face for them -afraid to be wrong.
pajasa62 2 years ago
So how do you counter what DID happen? The phone company verifying a call from one of Ruby's strippers 19 minutes after Oswald was scheduled to be moved. Leaves his apt. at 11:00 with his DOG! and goes to Western Union to send a moneygram time stamped at 11:17 - with the receipt on him and the ORIGINAL in the POSSESSION of Western Union - stamped 4 MINUTES BEFORE he shoots Oswald...with a friggin' GUT SHOT - hardly the method to silece someone!
pajasa62 2 years ago 2
you have said nothing but the same shit. i have destroyed all this BS you keeping on throwing at me. you are are going nowhere douchebag. You are telling me that he just got lucky and said "hey..i feel like killing someone today....lets kill LHO".You have to bee an idoit to believe that BS.
Please ..again to your hard evidence BS line you keep repeating. why did Jack want to leave Dallas? he was scared for his life he told this to the WC. WHY? cant wait to see your Mountain of shit about this?
FGTFJT 2 years ago
Rabbi Silverman said (in "Beyond Conspiracy", 2003") "in his distorted mind he was doing the right thing..this man killed HIS President [he stresses the word] and he loved HIS President and he was taking justice into his own hands.
Why do you think the Dallas police were going to actually FEIGN taking Oswald in an armoured car? Because of people saying the SAME THING...they wanted to avenge JFK's death an kill Oswald.
pajasa62 2 years ago
let me go ahead and crush this story now. Jack Ruby own different clubs that the DPD lived in almost. you tell me at the end he finally came out and said he did because he didnt know why?
Nancy Perrin Rich worked for Ruby at the Carousal. She told the WC that Ruby had instructed her to supply free drinks to the Dallas Police Department. Rich added "I don't think there is a cop in Dallas that doesn't know Jack Ruby. He practically lived at that police station. They lived in his place."
FGTFJT 2 years ago