Clean Coal? Not With Coal Ash Spills Like These.

[WKHalford]

My guess is that housing was built on at least some of these places because they didn't know what was underground. Maybe that's why some were sold at such a low price before building?

And the government doesn't like to admit when it was wrong, which could explain the secrecy. Plus they may simply be keeping it secret because they want to avoid a lawsuit.

I do know that properties like this have been built on because after years of properties changing hands, people don't know what's there.

[Rubenleesims]

China too. Appears, USA may have used coal waste as a weapon for genocide. Coal hazards were defined in 1914 public health manual before the landfills and fill dirt were used in minority public housing. Today, coal waste is secretly removed with lies, deception, and disregard for the health, safety, damages, and lives (past and present). In my video children play in coal dust secretly excavated and toxic water is released into public streets and lakes. What's the excuse? Why the secrecy?

[Rubenleesims]

OK, new coal-gas/CG may be different than old coal-gas and may produce different by-products or is it terminolgy. My concerns are: coal ash kills and government lies kill. CA landfills and fill dirt uses/locations is a Black and White issue, especiallly in the south. In Florida, ALL OLD CGP and OLD coal ash found in OLD Black neighborhoods only. Facts from studies, disease rates, death rates, and life expectancies in both races. My goal is to save lives Black or White by telling the truth.

[WKHalford]

@Rubenleesims I did some reasearch on coal gasification, and this is what I came up with as to the byproducts: "The by-products of coal gas manufacture included coke, coal tar, sulfur and ammonia; all useful products. Dyes, medicines, including sulfa drugs, saccharin and many organic compounds are therefore derived from coal gas."

Nowhere did I find ash mentione, whether it was current or old tech gasification. However, it did mention that coal tar was often disposed of by burying.

[WKHalford]

@Rubenleesims As far as housing built over old coal tar (or whatever was buried there) disposal areas, the same thing happened in England. So it's not just here. And I'm sure it wasn't always our government doing it here, as most housing is privately owned and built.

Plus, things like that were often done out of ignorance, because in the old days they just didn't understand the risks.

Also based on my research (much of which I already knew), modern gasification technologies ARE cleaner.

[Rubenleesims]

Coal-gasification produces "coal oil" not gas by burning coal in ovens. Legitimate names = "coal-gasification" or "manufactured gas" plants. So, I am not fixated on any terms.  My reference to never hear "coal ash" means: the cover up/media excludes the words "coal ash." In Pensacola they called it "mount dioxin" but in reality its "coal ash." Others use chemical names, arsenic, lead, copper, benzo(a)pyrene, PAHs, not "coal ash." "Coal ash" defines the source of chemicals. OOPs, a NO NO!!!

[WKHalford]

@Rubenleesims In coal gasification, coal is HEATED, not burned. Coal gasification as used at the Polk Power station produces pet coke, not fly ash. I KNOW THIS FOR A FACT.

Pulverized coal plants produce fly ash and slag, coal gasification produces pet coke.

Regardless of how legitimate the name MIGHT have been in the PAST, modern coal GASification produces a GAS called syngas, not liquid fuels. Syngas is burned in combustion turbines (jet engines) which turn generators to make electricity.

[Rubenleesims]

Yes, Florida did a fake recount; after disenfranchising over 100,000 minority voters in major cities impacted by coal ash in their neighborhoods. Therefore, Florida was either incompetent to hold an election or purposely carried out a plan to steal the election in order to shutdown the Environmental Justice (EJ) program established by Clinton/Gore because coal ash was found in Pensacola, gained national attention; relocated about 500 families. Get it. (coal ash=statewide) Gore out!! EJ out!!

[WKHalford]

@Rubenleesims It wasn't just minorities that were supposedly disenfranchised, it was also whites. It's not a black versus white issue.

But you missed what I said. After the vote the MEDIA got together and did a recount and verified that Bush did actually win Florida. It wasn't FLORIDA doing a "fake recount", the MEDIA verified the results with a recount.

And another thing you missed is where I clearly said that the coal gasification Polk Power Station produces NO fly ash. It produces pet coke.

[Rubenleesims]

The point of my video is that there remains thousands if not millions of Americans living either atop of coal ash landfills and where coal ash was used as fill dirt for over a century. PSR, states coal ash contributes to 4 of 5 of the leading causes of death in this country. EPA= arsenic coal ash = 1 in 50 get cancers; 200 times >smoking a pack of cigarettes a day. We should be helping those living in those environments not lying to them. Clean coal is coal-gasificification reborn.

[Rubenleesims]

Coal-gasification plants (1880/1960) extracted coal oil used in streetlights & domestic uses in major cities; 26 in Florida. Coal came in railroad cars; plants operated in segregated black neighborhoods; coal ash landfills & used as fill-dirt in projects, parks, schools, theaters, housing, in black neighborhoods. Coal ash has been found in projects; Miami, Fort Lauderdale, Pensacola, Jacksonville, Tampa, and numerous others. Florida has massive cover up; re: 2000 election (Gore v Bush)?

[WKHalford]

@Rubenleesims First off, when the media did a recount after the election, it was shown that Bush did indeed win Florida by about 600 votes. But that has NOTHING to do with this.

What I was talking about is coal-gasification for power production. And the Polk Power Station was the first.

And the coal gasification Polk Power Station does NOT produce fly ash. It produces pet coke, which is much like coal but is a little lighter in color (dark grey) and not brittle like coal. Yes, it IS cleaner.

[WKHalford]

@Rubenleesims Although it doesn't surprise me that they once used fly ash as fill dirt in neighborhoods, they don't do that anymore. In fact, fly ash is often used in concrete to replace volcanic ash that is mined, which isn't exactly clean either. In places where fly ash isn't used to make concrete, there are strict regulations concerning it's disposal in lined dams.

The dam that broke in Tennessee (Gore's home state) was an old one that didn't meet current standards.

[WKHalford]

@Rubenleesims A couple of things came to mind after I posted.

Coal GASification produces GAS. Not liquid fuels. So I'm trying to figure out how you became fixated with GASification when the process would be LIQUIDification?

Also, in order to produce ash from ANYTHING, something has to be BURNED. Burning coal produces fly ash. Neither gasification or liquidification produces ash because nothing is burned.

In the PM you sent me, you say you never hear about coal ash. Maybe that's why?

[Rubenleesims]

Form the 1880s thru the 1960 coal-gasification plants created billions of tons of this waste. The waste was used as fill dirt; disposed in off-dite dumps, landfills, and wetlands. Today, much of the public housing being demolished with HUD HOPE VI funds were built of toxic coal waste sites.

[WKHalford]

@Rubenleesims Ummm, where do you get that coal gasification existed between 1880s to the 1960s? Coal gasification power plants never existed before 1996 when Tampa Electric Company (TECO) built the first one in the world, the Polk Power Station, which is 5 miles from my house.

Yes what you mentioned happened, but stringent regulations were passed to keep those things from happening.

And the video is misleading. Ash dike breaches are VERY rare. The video makes it sound like it's a common thing.

[uturniaphobic]

I can't believe there are threads in this forum defending the TVA coal operation...they're "coal trolls".

Folks the damage is bad in this video but it does not show a fraction of the total impact to us all from coal burning. From Acid Rain to Mercury laced fish coal is the culprit or "coal-prit"

[EnviroMonster]

Filthy dirty coal.

[rwr5]

The technology for deep well injection of liquid CO2 DOES exist.

[savemaumee]

Have you asked a geologist this? CO2 Injection does not exist, coal companies are asking for money (from consumers) to RESEARCH this. Stability for extended periods of time is not scientifically sound and unrealistic

[rwr5]

First off... notice that I said that the "technology exists"

2nd... Since i wrote this, geologist HAVE injected carbon dioxide into deep wells. I will admit that it is still in what I would call a "testing phase", however it has been successful.

3rd, I don't need to ask a geologist because I am one.

[smo417]

Ok I can see you obviously don't know what the hell you are talking about. Clean Coal- No it's not and TVA does not claim it to be. Clean Coal Technology is new and not in use hardly anywhere. This is a 50 year old coal plant do you think they have the newest technology? No the facility was not over capacity, it actually has 20 -30 years of more capacity. TVA follow stricter quidline than most industry. The fact is this was a freak disaster. there is a tremendous effort to repair and clean up.

[Chaunceyiam]

TVA is working around the clock to clean this up...what else do you people want from them? Obviously TVA did not want this to happen.

[rwr5]

I think the fact that the dam broke, disproves your argument about the capacity not being reached. The holding "pond" couldn't hold what it had, much less 30 more years of waste.

[RUlegaleagle]

if it was clean there would be no need to call it "clean call"

[ninamichelle77]

Thank you for posting this.

[nyprogressive]

RDL, there is a solution - it's called conservation.  The last few months have shown that conservation is a real and practical force in energy markets. If it can bring gasoline prices down from record-highs to five year lows in just half a year, it can be brought to bear with electricity as well.

[RDLSnare]

Where do you propose we get our energy from then? No renewable non polluting resource is cheap enough or has the capabilities of powering the power grid. I'm all for renewable resources and new technology. I'm all for protecting the enviroment but where's the solution? You can't condemn and not have a solution. Show me a solution!

[CORPARANOID]

Start by talking 2 your neighbors about building your own Windmill Grid instead of buying $tuff, invest in your Local Communities future. Throw a BARBEQUE and INVITE THEM 2 MAKE The DIFFERENCE. Good Luck!

[dave777blaster]

The executive orders in the past 2 weeks.

Basically the Electric companies had all this stuff in their slurry pond and it was full to capacity. the cost of getting rid of it was prohibitive so Bush signed the executive order that allows coal energy companies to

pollute the river systems without penalty.

and a week later this

seems fishy to me I suspect they simply pulled the plug.

WAKE up go search the executive orders of the past 2 weeks .

[brotherjupiter]

How can the Clean Coal lobby ever repair the damage done to their propaganda campaign and get on with the job at hand trying to fool the American public?

[ancienthead]

Ilive 30 mi.above chattanooga,on the hiwasse river& ocoee river that feed the Tenn.Olin & dupont runoff here not to mention Bowater Paper co.'s runoff & th' fact they're removing 258,000 acs.of mostley virgin timber from th' cherokee national forrest

[CORPARANOID]

We have problems in CALif Forrests as well. Aireal shots are pocked marked w/ACRE Clear Cuts. From Sea 2 Shining SEA, our America has been $old. Missing Money, Timber, Oil &other natural resources. Corp Grabs of Public LAND Bush&Parties r $elling off. I believe it's a setup for 2012. Deep Underground Military Bases &coming Nibiru brown dwarf. We'll ALL know soon enough. How BAD these Corp's6/Gov6/Political parties6 are. The TRUTH is OUT THERE, DNA awakening. Here's hoping WE can RECOVER &CHG.

[dave777blaster]

G W bush a few days ago signed his law

all coal companies can now let the coal slur

just run off into the countryside

this is not an accident it is a new way of doing business.

CHK the laws G W Bush just unilaterally signed into law.

you will be shocked.

[Lucidmike78]

link?

[jonathanwindham]

Not to mention the process of obtaining the coal.

[reevaluate2008]

Merry Christmas!