@stormchaser420 Hey! Don't use that kind of language towards Le Mans drivers. They are there for a good reason and that is to tackle the great Le Mans 24 hours that has right hand turns in it. Their racing helps develop fuel efficient, reliable cars while some forms of racing doesn't. (I'm looking at you *nascrap) *nascrap doesn't deserve a capital letter
Dang! I got to say, I don't think the factory Toyota, BMW, Nissan, and Audi drivers had to suffer such a bouncy front end! Especially at Tertre Rouge! Great engine though! Sounds beefy!
@supercooled just remember CART days, much better than what Ford produced from the same time Mercedes started the silver arrows in 1997. They had some flaws in 1997 but no wonder why they won 1998 and 1999 F1 together with the CART cars powered by Mercedes like Penske, Kool, Green only Zanardi and Honda could fight with them. Ford had it´s advantage on ovals but with the fast paced learning by mercedes in the late 90s they overcome this matter quickly. Can´t name a Series where they struggled :D
Ford didn't produce jack shit. Both in F1 and CART their engines were designed and manafacturerd by Cosworth in England, which at the time actually was owned by Vickers and not by Ford themselves.
Ford funded Cosworth and put their name on the cover, that's all.
Speaking of which. Mercedes didn't design the F1 engines either. It was Ilmor in England. The same as the Cosworth thing. Later Mercedes bought and re-named it but their engines are still built in Brixworth, England.
Yeah, especially since they didn't design a single bolt in that engine. The engine is designed in Brixworth, England by what used to be Ilmor Engineering and now re-named Mercedes HighPerformance Engines Ltd.
They are NOT made in Stuttgart, Germany.
And how competitive are they when their factory team didn't win a single race in 2010, and Red Bull, powered by Renault won both titles?
However, Mercedes do make some of the best roadcar engines, especially their diesels.
It just passes by every car... porsches, on straight! only the toyota gt made him little problems, but im sure if the video would be complete, it would pass it too
As others have pointed out this isn't a CLK-GTR, it's a CLR-GT1. The CLK is a street car that was built for the sole purpose of making this race car legal.
No, the CLK-GTR street car was required to homologate the CLK-GTR GT1 car that raced FIA-GT, ALMS and Le Mans until 1998 - The CLR was a thoroughbred racing car build for winning Le Mans in 1999 - there's no road going version of it at all as it wasn't required by the ACO, because they invented a new LMP-GTP class for closed cockpit prototypes which replaced GT1 where 25 street cars had to be build
this is the 1999 le mans version of the clk gtr called the CLR. mercedes entered 3 cars no 4 5 and 6. no 4 flipped at the end of the mulsanne straight in practice and again in warm up and so did not take part. mercedes tried to solve the aerodynamic problem by adding extra wings to the front of the cars but it didnt work, this car (no 5) flipped in the race on the straight before arnage. the 6 car was then withdrawn. i dunno if this is true but i heard mercedes destroyed all the clrs after?!
I think they did too; however, the CLR is a completely different car from the CLK-GTR and the CLK-LM. The CLK-GTR ran in 97, CLK-LM in 98, and the CLR in 99.
The CLK wasn't banned, the team pulled the cars after all three went airborn, the shape of the car made it act like a wing when it has a low amount of downforce on the front-wing. So the team thought it was too dangerous for the drivers to continue...!
that, and the rear overhang was so large that the rear wing had enough leverage to lift the front of the car when it had the combination of losing front downforce and going over a crest.
everyone gives CLK GTR a bad rap for the airborne episodes. But they are still some of the most devastatingly quick cars ever made for a race track, especially in their class. Didn't they outlaw them for the circuit?
This is a nice video, but if you really want to see flying cars (not in the airborne sense, like some of the Mercedes, but in the speed sense) check out the videos from the video "Onboard 956," a film with Derek Bell and the Rothmans Porsche. Some of the video has clips here on YouTube.
956 is quite slow on braking and corner. too weightful 900 kg too less aero force under 1960 kg on 300km/h speed and there is old tecnics of handling system. modern sport cars are better than old 1982 year 25 olds 956 at least lap times show the true
Of course newer cars have better technology, but the lap times are on a different track configuration than they were in the 80's. Quicker in the turns? Yes. Faster in Mulsanne? No. Who are you kidding? Do to current regs, the current Le Mans cars are not nearly as fast and cannot reach the same speeds (which were deemed to dangerous). Do you know how fast the 956's were clocked at Mulsanne? 248mph!! You couldn't do that in a car like this...
...especially with the current chicanes in Mulsanne. The 956 was a marvel of speed and (along with the 962 (of the 956/962 family of cars) achieved a feat only rivaled to some degree by the Audi R8. And the CLR is a great example of aerodynamics - but not from all angles! It's flat bottom left it vulnerable to the nose lifting (and in turn the car flying) when air was forced under there (such as when it was behind the Toyota - the infamous "flying car" incident.
Also it is a CLR, the Toyota GT-one at the end of the video has the LM 99' livery (Esso Ultraflo) where in 1998 they had the red/white flame style the F1 cars use today. Mercedes did'nt bring any CLK-GTR's to Le Mans that year.
No the car is a CLR. And the circuit is not called "Le Mans". I think its Circuit De La Sarthe or wateva its called, except Gran Turismo 4s looks NOTHING like it. Thats why I asked
This is a Mercedes CLK LM (a modified CLK GTR) and the track is called Circuit de la Sarthe, but the race event is the 24 Hours of Le Mans. Two of these cars flipped at Le Mans that year. It was later discovered that GT1 cars had aerodynamic stability issues when trailing behind the "dirty" air of a car ahead. This same phenomenon caused a Porsche 911 GT1 to crash at Petit Le Mans at Road Atlanta in 1998.
No, its the CLR. Not convinced? i've uploaded the 1998 and 1999 Le Mans races. I think the only car that had aerodynamics issues was the Mercedes CLR. GT1 cars aren't the problem since the CLR is classified as a LM GTP due to rule changes for 1999. Also, the BMW LMR V12 (it being an open top) flipped in the ALMS. the CLK LM raced in Le Mans 1998. i think that clears it up.
Allow me to clarify myself. What I meant by LM is not that the car is necessarily modified, but that slight tweaks may be made (if necessary) so that it complies with the rules set forth by Automobile Club de l'Ouest in regards to fuel capacity, wing size and type, etc.
...And if GT1 cars didn't have aerodynamic stability issues, then how do you explain the flip of the Porsche 911 GT1 at Road Atlanta in '98 or the fact that they were being phased out by 1999 and gone by 2000?
GT1s were phased due to rising cost. The end was brought about by the collapse of FIA GT1 class thanks to Mercedes and poor governing by the FIA. To a lesser extent, newer cars such as the Toyota GT-One were so radical in their designs that they more resembled racing prototypes than road cars.
The 911 GT1 crashed since it was cresting a rise and was trailing behind another car. Not to mention it being flat bottomed also would've been a factor. The same can be said about the BMW LMR flip at Petit Le Mans in 2000, trailing behind a car and moving out of its slipstream etc.
If you search YouTube for Bill Auberlen, you can find a vid of both flips. You'll see that the circumstances for both crashes are similar.
So you can't really say GT1s had aerodynamic issues, since it can also happen to an open top prototype. If anything it is down the the fact that these cars are both light and flat bottomed.
the Mercedes CLR is classifield as LMGTP and therefore is a prototype, not GT1. That aerodynamic issues were caused by the car having too much front overhang, and the engineers only tested the car on oval tracks where there were no bumps.
Lastly, I'm confused at where your coming from with the CLK LM. The LM had a V8 as opposed to the CLK GTR's V12. Are you saying the CLR is a CLM LM with revised bodywork and aerodynamics?
btw i had to break it up b/c Youtube wouldn't allow anything over 500 characters.
Thanks for the information. I previously thought that the LM designation on a prototype meant it was the Le Mans spec version. I had no idea that there was an eight cyclinder version of this car.
However, I disagree with you on two points. First, I consider a flat-bottomed car that can get airborne due to "dirty" air getting under the nose a car that has an aerodynamic issue.
Group C cars, for instance, were quite costly. Since the research required to meet the stringent restrictions on fuel capacity (and consequently mileage) was time consuming and incredibly expensive, only manufacturers with huge budgets were able to achieve noteable success, namely Porsche, Jaguar, and Peugeot (although it can be argued that Peugeot's wins were due to a lack of competition).
yeah they were costly, and unfortunately that is why they are no longer around today. The Peugeots aren't Group C cars for that matter, they were running under the new FIA rules designed to reduce cost and overtake the Group C category. The new rules were all engines be naturally aspirated 3.5L (pretty much F1 engines), no fuel limits for races and were lighter than Group C cars. Most teams just decided to go to F1 shortly afterwards, and the World Sportscar Championship was finished.
i'm glad to see others remember group c. i was raised on the imsa series but my dad always showed me group c stuff. we used to group c cars compete against imsa cars at the 24 hours of daytona and the 12 hours of sebring. the clk gtr is one of the best bad ass cars you can drive down the street. i wish they would come back with that car and the F50, 333sp, jag xjr 14. i could go on all night they all rock. prototypes RULE.
Same situation here. BTW F50? Never made into fully raced GT1 - only a few were built - unless of course your referring to its F1-based powerplant, which was used in the F333 Sports Prototype (333 SP).
i wish they would bring them back. i remember seeing the jag xjr 14 with the double rear wing at watkins glen as a kid. that thing was fucking insane. davy jones drove it incredibly fast. dose that car still hold the recored there today. i know when he drove it there in 92-93 he had the fastes lap without the boot section. please let me know on that fact.
i've also said the collapse of the FIA GT1 class in the FIA GT Championship was another major factor. For the 1998 season, Mercedes didn't have the mandatory number (25) of homologated road cars built, but in spite of this the FIA still let them compete. they went on to dominate the season, winning all races.
Around the end of 1998, Porsche decided to withdraw from the series, citing that costs in motorsport was too expensive. i guess an example could be the fact that the 911 GT1-98 was the first all carbon fibre Porsche. I also think a number of private teams withdrew as well after Porsche. Then the only team left were Mercedes and with no other enties, the GT1 class for 1999 was scrapped before it even began.
Then you also think open top prototypes have aerodynamics issues too because of the BMW flip?
i think its harsh to say an entire class of cars have aerodynamic problems because of a flip by one car. the 911 GT1 ran all of Le Mans and the FIA GT season without similar incidents, and another 911 GT1 also finished the Petit Le Mans race, albeit down the order.
i think the problem isn't GT1 cars, closed top cars in general tend to generate more lift as opposed to an open top.
Circuit de la Sarthe, to be exact. The race is the 24 Hours of Le Mans, but the village (and track name "Circuit de") is La Sarthe. Don't forget it - its the most important auto race in the world. Indy 500 the biggest spectacle in racing? I don't think so!! This is the stuff.
as a matter of fact it was this car that flipped, if you watch the video where mark webber flips it you can just make out the number 5 on it, unless they have more than one car with number 5 on it!
Mercedes actually flipped two cars that year. Both during qualifying, never made it to the race. When Mercedes gets it right, they get it right, but when they get it wrong, damn, they get it wrong.
yh i found out after i had posted that that there were two mecedes benz but i also found that it wasnt webber that flipped, ur couldnt be more ryt about mercedes gettin it ryt or wrong cus christ this is one fast lap!
It's clearly a CLR. The CLK-GTR, which was designed with the FIA Sports Car title in mind, had a higher nose than the CLR. Compare photos with the shot of the car at the beginnig of this video. You'll notice a difference.
why is this car not in gt5 D8
clarktista1 3 months ago
most beautiful car in Le mans
hm3066 8 months ago
Delecious
scottgoldstein10 9 months ago
Yannick Dalmas, 4 times Le Mans winner great driver himself
Quadrant14 1 year ago
Wow it owns the other LM cars! Too bad it flipped ;/
olevixx 1 year ago
@olevixx This car dominated LM
nawzy202 1 year ago
no talkie......
JohnnyGasTank 1 year ago
@ 1.55 Mark Webber flipped on the warmup and @ 2.23 Peter Dumbreck flipped in the race.
Marcus666Sund 1 year ago
lol, I would like to hear how Dalmas reacted when Dumbreck flipped, my thoughts:
- Oh my god, Oh my GOD, Thats totaly bullshit! He landed on Grass, WHEN I FLIPPED I LANDED ON the Concret, THATS a FUCKING DIFFERENCE...
LOL
Marcus666Sund 1 year ago
Good lord he doesn't even slow down in the corners.
smasila 1 year ago
if he could just stop fucking talkinjg that would be great
stormchaser420 1 year ago 2
@stormchaser420 Hey! Don't use that kind of language towards Le Mans drivers. They are there for a good reason and that is to tackle the great Le Mans 24 hours that has right hand turns in it. Their racing helps develop fuel efficient, reliable cars while some forms of racing doesn't. (I'm looking at you *nascrap) *nascrap doesn't deserve a capital letter
leylandcarsloverslea 1 year ago
Dang! I got to say, I don't think the factory Toyota, BMW, Nissan, and Audi drivers had to suffer such a bouncy front end! Especially at Tertre Rouge! Great engine though! Sounds beefy!
leylandcarsloverslea 1 year ago
Comment removed
leylandcarsloverslea 1 year ago
hey its the toyota GT-1 at 3:12! wow this is classic!!
NewarkGothIndustrial 2 years ago
@NewarkGothIndustrial
Yep. Merc had a good chance at winning that race. Too bad their aero kung-fu was weak.
OOQRA 2 years ago
@OOQRA aero kung fu, ha ha !
Mercedes sure knows how to build engines; just look at how competitive they are in Formula 1.
supercooled 1 year ago
@supercooled just remember CART days, much better than what Ford produced from the same time Mercedes started the silver arrows in 1997. They had some flaws in 1997 but no wonder why they won 1998 and 1999 F1 together with the CART cars powered by Mercedes like Penske, Kool, Green only Zanardi and Honda could fight with them. Ford had it´s advantage on ovals but with the fast paced learning by mercedes in the late 90s they overcome this matter quickly. Can´t name a Series where they struggled :D
M1GHTYM4VS 1 year ago
@M1GHTYM4VS
Ford didn't produce jack shit. Both in F1 and CART their engines were designed and manafacturerd by Cosworth in England, which at the time actually was owned by Vickers and not by Ford themselves.
Ford funded Cosworth and put their name on the cover, that's all.
Speaking of which. Mercedes didn't design the F1 engines either. It was Ilmor in England. The same as the Cosworth thing. Later Mercedes bought and re-named it but their engines are still built in Brixworth, England.
McLarenMercedes 10 months ago
@supercooled
Yeah, especially since they didn't design a single bolt in that engine. The engine is designed in Brixworth, England by what used to be Ilmor Engineering and now re-named Mercedes HighPerformance Engines Ltd.
They are NOT made in Stuttgart, Germany.
And how competitive are they when their factory team didn't win a single race in 2010, and Red Bull, powered by Renault won both titles?
However, Mercedes do make some of the best roadcar engines, especially their diesels.
McLarenMercedes 10 months ago
That is awesome vision... This lap is right up there with Jurgen Barth's 1977 hot lap in the Porsche 936.. Thank you for sharing with us.
parkaoz 2 years ago 3
Wow, those LM cars make the GT cars look soo slow.
rudeydudey05 2 years ago
of cause it is one of the prototypes similar to the the 908
f16692 2 years ago
damn it was going toe to toe with a gt one at the end. impresive!
aieljose 2 years ago
He makes it look so easy Merc my all time fav car brand we need to get back on top of Le Man
RRdaKing23 2 years ago 2
the front is damn flat compared to CLK-GTR
hamtairo 2 years ago 17
yes you'r right
jaafarsnsn 2 years ago
It's LMP and not a GT.
YawnGod 2 years ago
To make it more complicated, but more accurate, it's LMGTP.
Bloemplantstuifmeel 2 years ago
that mercedes you can get on pgr4, and this course is fun to drive on GRID
fatman10666 2 years ago
It just passes by every car... porsches, on straight! only the toyota gt made him little problems, but im sure if the video would be complete, it would pass it too
OldtimerMercedesBenz 2 years ago
v12
danelio 2 years ago
wow it got right on that toyota gt ones ass right at the end
HitMan1263 3 years ago 4
This not a CLK GTR, but a CLR LM.
Very beautiful this car ;)
ViniciusLimaRS 3 years ago 21
on aurait pû se passer des commentaires...
Kazer0001 3 years ago
wai xD
mercedesfener 2 years ago
Papipt this car is a CLR LM-GTP class, is not a CLK-GTR or a GT1
misterv1978 3 years ago
clk gtr is many favourite car :):)
in hockenheim he drives 330kmh (in hockneheim with not a long straight)
in lemans ????ohhhhohhhhhhh :):)
ICEMANZIDANE 3 years ago
2 questions:
1.- is it faster than a dauer? and
2.- is that buzz at low rev a turbo or it's just the straight cut gears?
qwertysc666 3 years ago
1 have no idea :)
2 it has no turbo ofc.
AndrewKonin 3 years ago
As others have pointed out this isn't a CLK-GTR, it's a CLR-GT1. The CLK is a street car that was built for the sole purpose of making this race car legal.
kabob983 3 years ago
No, the CLK-GTR street car was required to homologate the CLK-GTR GT1 car that raced FIA-GT, ALMS and Le Mans until 1998 - The CLR was a thoroughbred racing car build for winning Le Mans in 1999 - there's no road going version of it at all as it wasn't required by the ACO, because they invented a new LMP-GTP class for closed cockpit prototypes which replaced GT1 where 25 street cars had to be build
tommy9927 2 years ago
it looks forza 2 :P
grassmower83 3 years ago
very cool to see the Toyota GT-One and the dodge viper too
peersuk 3 years ago
mate that dose not sound like a v12 its sounds like a bloody v8 wtf mate
rihefoiuhefoiuh 3 years ago
Lol very funny how he takes over the BMW at Mulsanne's straight =p that car would later win the 24 hours..
blspjnl 3 years ago
CLR-GT1.
FERRARI664 3 years ago
good driver
Playboo62 3 years ago
I just bought one on midnight club 3 dub edition and it is FAST!
SLRMC93 3 years ago
lol the GT One is like a greyhound bus on the track compared to the rest of the cars.
Triple88a 3 years ago
Haha, yeah, it's not like it was being held up by a slower Dodge Viper or anything...
EsbenT 3 years ago
for more details on the crashes: Mulsanne's Corner is an awesome website on aerodynamics and they have a full investigation.
heelandtoe33 3 years ago
God, just watch how unstable the front end is under speed :/
zytekfan 3 years ago
very true. rather worrying....
heelandtoe33 3 years ago
that's a CLR
flanke14 3 years ago 2
great, i lost the video i had of this.. i was lucky enough to be out there that year, the CLR sounded fantastic!
sunglassesron53 4 years ago
this is the 1999 le mans version of the clk gtr called the CLR. mercedes entered 3 cars no 4 5 and 6. no 4 flipped at the end of the mulsanne straight in practice and again in warm up and so did not take part. mercedes tried to solve the aerodynamic problem by adding extra wings to the front of the cars but it didnt work, this car (no 5) flipped in the race on the straight before arnage. the 6 car was then withdrawn. i dunno if this is true but i heard mercedes destroyed all the clrs after?!
shazmeister2005 4 years ago 2
I think they did too; however, the CLR is a completely different car from the CLK-GTR and the CLK-LM. The CLK-GTR ran in 97, CLK-LM in 98, and the CLR in 99.
heelandtoe33 4 years ago
just when the race was getting good!
moviemanacct 4 years ago
This isn't the CLK GTR! 1999 was Mercedes CLR.
Speedworx 4 years ago 4
I want this baby or at least I want to drive this car for a day on the Nürburgring track.
M1710 4 years ago
God that thing is quick! Awesome!
ktayor1 4 years ago
that's a clr,wake up !
angelosvelo 4 years ago
The CLK wasn't banned, the team pulled the cars after all three went airborn, the shape of the car made it act like a wing when it has a low amount of downforce on the front-wing. So the team thought it was too dangerous for the drivers to continue...!
A least, that's what i heard...
skynet0912 4 years ago
that, and the rear overhang was so large that the rear wing had enough leverage to lift the front of the car when it had the combination of losing front downforce and going over a crest.
heelandtoe33 4 years ago 2
Also, the general shape of the car was like a wing.
zytekfan 3 years ago
Yeah they tanked the Mclaren F1. Mclaren was still a more successful car though.
jaymz123456789 4 years ago
everyone gives CLK GTR a bad rap for the airborne episodes. But they are still some of the most devastatingly quick cars ever made for a race track, especially in their class. Didn't they outlaw them for the circuit?
dac111982 4 years ago
Looks like he's playing GT5 on the PS3 :P
CoolColJ 4 years ago
haha yeh although gt5 is more realistic!
willperchard 4 years ago
Really brutal engine sounds.
Shame it turned to aircraft...
Jyllenberg 4 years ago
conozko el circuito por el GT4 jajaj
la sarthe
jero517 4 years ago
animal!!
eulluisgtr34 4 years ago
That's a CLR not a CLK-GTR
StreeTRacR008 4 years ago
Interesting traffic at the end of the lap :-)
RalphColmar 4 years ago
Just like downtown Rome.
getplaning 4 years ago
woo le mans is better then formula one
syedjaafar 4 years ago
This is a nice video, but if you really want to see flying cars (not in the airborne sense, like some of the Mercedes, but in the speed sense) check out the videos from the video "Onboard 956," a film with Derek Bell and the Rothmans Porsche. Some of the video has clips here on YouTube.
the5thdominion 4 years ago
956 is quite slow on braking and corner. too weightful 900 kg too less aero force under 1960 kg on 300km/h speed and there is old tecnics of handling system. modern sport cars are better than old 1982 year 25 olds 956 at least lap times show the true
mrjfin 4 years ago
Of course newer cars have better technology, but the lap times are on a different track configuration than they were in the 80's. Quicker in the turns? Yes. Faster in Mulsanne? No. Who are you kidding? Do to current regs, the current Le Mans cars are not nearly as fast and cannot reach the same speeds (which were deemed to dangerous). Do you know how fast the 956's were clocked at Mulsanne? 248mph!! You couldn't do that in a car like this...
the5thdominion 4 years ago
so true older cars were way faster cauz they didnt have all the restrictions of today even with f1s
spartan1893 4 years ago
...especially with the current chicanes in Mulsanne. The 956 was a marvel of speed and (along with the 962 (of the 956/962 family of cars) achieved a feat only rivaled to some degree by the Audi R8. And the CLR is a great example of aerodynamics - but not from all angles! It's flat bottom left it vulnerable to the nose lifting (and in turn the car flying) when air was forced under there (such as when it was behind the Toyota - the infamous "flying car" incident.
the5thdominion 4 years ago
What's that whistling noise everytime the car accelerates? A supercharger?
Shenryu888 4 years ago
a turbocharger. Two, to be exact.
the5thdominion 4 years ago
No, the CLR was powered by a N/A 6 litre V8, to be exact, not a twin turbo.
As with most GT car onboards, I would think the whirring sound is actually the transmission.
Fuzzypanda011 4 years ago
Also it is a CLR, the Toyota GT-one at the end of the video has the LM 99' livery (Esso Ultraflo) where in 1998 they had the red/white flame style the F1 cars use today. Mercedes did'nt bring any CLK-GTR's to Le Mans that year.
Fuzzypanda011 4 years ago
You are right about the CLR. I was thinking of the CLK GTR. My mistake! :P
the5thdominion 4 years ago
BTW: 6 litres? Its more like 5.72.
the5thdominion 4 years ago
Papipt,Awesome vid, but its the "CLR", not the "GTR".
Spyker88 4 years ago
That's how I drive in the C5 R, in GT 4 with my wheel, lol ;). 3:40 is what I can do ;)
CobraMarty 4 years ago
Just so you know I ripped this video in 2004 from Eurosport coverage. Nice to see it's made it's way onto t'tube!
f0rmula1fr3ak 4 years ago
wow he drives almost as good as me ... !
uAIsvec 4 years ago
this is a CLR ! clk gtr is different !
rcteamfr 4 years ago
No the car is a CLR. And the circuit is not called "Le Mans". I think its Circuit De La Sarthe or wateva its called, except Gran Turismo 4s looks NOTHING like it. Thats why I asked
richboy900 4 years ago
This is a Mercedes CLK LM (a modified CLK GTR) and the track is called Circuit de la Sarthe, but the race event is the 24 Hours of Le Mans. Two of these cars flipped at Le Mans that year. It was later discovered that GT1 cars had aerodynamic stability issues when trailing behind the "dirty" air of a car ahead. This same phenomenon caused a Porsche 911 GT1 to crash at Petit Le Mans at Road Atlanta in 1998.
the5thdominion 4 years ago
No, its the CLR. Not convinced? i've uploaded the 1998 and 1999 Le Mans races. I think the only car that had aerodynamics issues was the Mercedes CLR. GT1 cars aren't the problem since the CLR is classified as a LM GTP due to rule changes for 1999. Also, the BMW LMR V12 (it being an open top) flipped in the ALMS. the CLK LM raced in Le Mans 1998. i think that clears it up.
Porsche911GT1 4 years ago
Allow me to clarify myself. What I meant by LM is not that the car is necessarily modified, but that slight tweaks may be made (if necessary) so that it complies with the rules set forth by Automobile Club de l'Ouest in regards to fuel capacity, wing size and type, etc.
...And if GT1 cars didn't have aerodynamic stability issues, then how do you explain the flip of the Porsche 911 GT1 at Road Atlanta in '98 or the fact that they were being phased out by 1999 and gone by 2000?
the5thdominion 4 years ago
GT1s were phased due to rising cost. The end was brought about by the collapse of FIA GT1 class thanks to Mercedes and poor governing by the FIA. To a lesser extent, newer cars such as the Toyota GT-One were so radical in their designs that they more resembled racing prototypes than road cars.
Porsche911GT1 4 years ago
The 911 GT1 crashed since it was cresting a rise and was trailing behind another car. Not to mention it being flat bottomed also would've been a factor. The same can be said about the BMW LMR flip at Petit Le Mans in 2000, trailing behind a car and moving out of its slipstream etc.
If you search YouTube for Bill Auberlen, you can find a vid of both flips. You'll see that the circumstances for both crashes are similar.
Porsche911GT1 4 years ago
So you can't really say GT1s had aerodynamic issues, since it can also happen to an open top prototype. If anything it is down the the fact that these cars are both light and flat bottomed.
the Mercedes CLR is classifield as LMGTP and therefore is a prototype, not GT1. That aerodynamic issues were caused by the car having too much front overhang, and the engineers only tested the car on oval tracks where there were no bumps.
Porsche911GT1 4 years ago
Lastly, I'm confused at where your coming from with the CLK LM. The LM had a V8 as opposed to the CLK GTR's V12. Are you saying the CLR is a CLM LM with revised bodywork and aerodynamics?
btw i had to break it up b/c Youtube wouldn't allow anything over 500 characters.
Porsche911GT1 4 years ago
it's a clk gtr with the lm package, and other upgrades (including motor). the poster should of said clr...
thedriver 4 years ago
i meant CLK LM not CLM LM, that was a typo.
Porsche911GT1 4 years ago
Thanks for the information. I previously thought that the LM designation on a prototype meant it was the Le Mans spec version. I had no idea that there was an eight cyclinder version of this car.
the5thdominion 4 years ago
However, I disagree with you on two points. First, I consider a flat-bottomed car that can get airborne due to "dirty" air getting under the nose a car that has an aerodynamic issue.
the5thdominion 4 years ago
Second, while GT1 was expensive, this couldn't have been the only factor in its demise, as Le Mans has never been "cheap."
the5thdominion 4 years ago
Group C cars, for instance, were quite costly. Since the research required to meet the stringent restrictions on fuel capacity (and consequently mileage) was time consuming and incredibly expensive, only manufacturers with huge budgets were able to achieve noteable success, namely Porsche, Jaguar, and Peugeot (although it can be argued that Peugeot's wins were due to a lack of competition).
the5thdominion 4 years ago
yeah they were costly, and unfortunately that is why they are no longer around today. The Peugeots aren't Group C cars for that matter, they were running under the new FIA rules designed to reduce cost and overtake the Group C category. The new rules were all engines be naturally aspirated 3.5L (pretty much F1 engines), no fuel limits for races and were lighter than Group C cars. Most teams just decided to go to F1 shortly afterwards, and the World Sportscar Championship was finished.
Porsche911GT1 4 years ago
i'm glad to see others remember group c. i was raised on the imsa series but my dad always showed me group c stuff. we used to group c cars compete against imsa cars at the 24 hours of daytona and the 12 hours of sebring. the clk gtr is one of the best bad ass cars you can drive down the street. i wish they would come back with that car and the F50, 333sp, jag xjr 14. i could go on all night they all rock. prototypes RULE.
honfx2004 4 years ago
Same situation here. BTW F50? Never made into fully raced GT1 - only a few were built - unless of course your referring to its F1-based powerplant, which was used in the F333 Sports Prototype (333 SP).
the5thdominion 4 years ago
i wish they would bring them back. i remember seeing the jag xjr 14 with the double rear wing at watkins glen as a kid. that thing was fucking insane. davy jones drove it incredibly fast. dose that car still hold the recored there today. i know when he drove it there in 92-93 he had the fastes lap without the boot section. please let me know on that fact.
honfx2004 4 years ago
i've also said the collapse of the FIA GT1 class in the FIA GT Championship was another major factor. For the 1998 season, Mercedes didn't have the mandatory number (25) of homologated road cars built, but in spite of this the FIA still let them compete. they went on to dominate the season, winning all races.
Porsche911GT1 4 years ago
Around the end of 1998, Porsche decided to withdraw from the series, citing that costs in motorsport was too expensive. i guess an example could be the fact that the 911 GT1-98 was the first all carbon fibre Porsche. I also think a number of private teams withdrew as well after Porsche. Then the only team left were Mercedes and with no other enties, the GT1 class for 1999 was scrapped before it even began.
Porsche911GT1 4 years ago
Then you also think open top prototypes have aerodynamics issues too because of the BMW flip?
i think its harsh to say an entire class of cars have aerodynamic problems because of a flip by one car. the 911 GT1 ran all of Le Mans and the FIA GT season without similar incidents, and another 911 GT1 also finished the Petit Le Mans race, albeit down the order.
i think the problem isn't GT1 cars, closed top cars in general tend to generate more lift as opposed to an open top.
Porsche911GT1 4 years ago
its CLK GTR !!!
MustangGTA390 4 years ago
soz can anyone what circuit is that? thanks v much
richboy900 4 years ago
euhm...Le Mans maybe?..
JamoZ46 4 years ago
Circuit de la Sarthe, to be exact. The race is the 24 Hours of Le Mans, but the village (and track name "Circuit de") is La Sarthe. Don't forget it - its the most important auto race in the world. Indy 500 the biggest spectacle in racing? I don't think so!! This is the stuff.
the5thdominion 4 years ago
CLK GTR is the most beautiful Mercedes ever made!
GJN2 4 years ago
I prefer the CLR over the CLK-GTR (even though the CLR flipped), but they both look beautiful. The CLR better looking imo
richboy900 4 years ago
2 flipped not one
laughsatposers 5 years ago
as a matter of fact it was this car that flipped, if you watch the video where mark webber flips it you can just make out the number 5 on it, unless they have more than one car with number 5 on it!
thesupahfly 5 years ago
Mercedes actually flipped two cars that year. Both during qualifying, never made it to the race. When Mercedes gets it right, they get it right, but when they get it wrong, damn, they get it wrong.
orbassasin 5 years ago
yh i found out after i had posted that that there were two mecedes benz but i also found that it wasnt webber that flipped, ur couldnt be more ryt about mercedes gettin it ryt or wrong cus christ this is one fast lap!
thesupahfly 5 years ago
You'd get used to it! Let's face it, you'd have to!
Heidfeld86 5 years ago
This is the Mercedes CLR not CLK-GTR...
yellowflash02 5 years ago
No...hes right its the CLK-GTR
cardude911 4 years ago
No... you're an idiot, it's the CLR
mbrammsteinmb 4 years ago
It's clearly a CLR. The CLK-GTR, which was designed with the FIA Sports Car title in mind, had a higher nose than the CLR. Compare photos with the shot of the car at the beginnig of this video. You'll notice a difference.
the5thdominion 4 years ago
but you have a birds perspective so it looks different did you notice that?
mercedesbenzrules 4 years ago