yes, what i see in the video ist all safe and concratulations, very interesting! _but_ i think getting a neutron source from scratching the amiricium frrom smoke detectors istn so easy.. btw where can we geht Berylliumfoil?
@HFbastler1 None of the Am sources used to make the neutron source in this video were physically damaged in any way. They remain sealed sources. The neutron source was straightforward to make, but requires a lot of these sources. Availability of beryllium depends on where you live and how much you want to spend. I used foils in this source. Foil is expensive. Beryllium electrolytic flake is common and cheap, but dangerous to handle.
@ryanlak1234 Yes, in principle. Of course, the neutron source is very weak, and the only reliable way to detect this reaction would be through gamma rays emitted in the decay of short-lived grandparent U-239. That is probably possible to do with a careful experiment using an HPGe detector, but it would be barely out of the noise.
@ryanlak1234 The details of the "neutron oven" aren't really important to its function. Fundamentally all you want is to surround the source and activation sample with as much of a moderating reflector as possible. Polyethylene, wax, and water are very similar in their effectiveness. It depends mostly on what materials are easily at your disposal. The "neutron oven" is part of an old neutron detector, actually, but you could do as well with blocks of polyethylene.
@Thallium208 would this 24 hr. activation be detectable real time with a Ludlum model 3 with a NaI probe? Would this work as well with manganese metal (powder)?
@promet247 The quantity of radioactivity produced in this experiment is so low that only a shielded detector, a long count time, and the energy spectroscopy technique shown produce statistically significant Mn-56 counts relative to background. I'm afraid trying this with a bare NaI probe and a non-energy-selective counter like a Ludlum 3 would have poor results. Of course, you could always find a stronger source of neutrons...
@zoltan6561 Some atoms would be transformed to radioactive atoms, for instance N-14(n,p)C-14; but the vast majority of capture events would be on regular hydrogen nuclei in flesh to form deuterium (which is stable). Neutrons generate lots of gamma rays when they scatter and are captured, so that would be going on as well. This neutron source is exceedingly weak, but neutron exposure in general is to be avoided.
The Ludlum 12 ratemeter was obtained on eBay a number of years ago.
I appreciate the interest, but as always find the purported legal aspect amusing. I work professionally as a nuclear engineer, including RSO duties, and ain't none of this illegal in any way (where I live, in the USA). Everything I put on YouTube is unambiguously legal for me to do. (I cannot speak for people living elsewhere and so on.)
First off, where did you get the ludlum? second, where did you dig up that ancient ISOCS machine...lol. Although I know that this isn't very dangerous I will tell you that it is at some level illegal. The NRC and DOE both support regulations which you must abide by. I will say this was interesting to see but how are you calibrating your instrumentation?
Many natural isotopes will capture a neutron and become radioactive isotopes. Manganese just works very well for this because its capture cross-section is high and because of some other properties. But it is by no means unique in this regard.
wow that´s impressive 60 microcuries! I only have about 7 microcuries in my source. where did you get such a radioactive amaricium source and how much did it cost ?
@Thallium208 I would like to know if the construction of the neutron source is important in regard to the way the beryllium foil and Am241 are put together --is it better to layer the two together --or better to completely surround the Am241 with the Beryllium or the other way around? also if foil better than solid slabs of Beryllium? Thanks much
@promet247 The Am-241 sources should be in direct contact with the beryllium. Ideally, you would have a homogenous mixture of the alpha emitter in the beryllium metal, but that is not practical with sealed sources.
That IS how it was built, in a nutshell. The Am-241 sources from ANTIQUE smoke detectors (which have more activity) were lined up on pieces of beryllium metal. That's really all there is to it. However, take note of what I say the activity is in there now...it's not too small.
You can make neutrons by bombarding light elements with alpha particles from natural (or artificial) alpha emitters. I do that with americium and beryllium. But you could do it with, say, radium and boron. Or radium and the fluorine in Teflon. Efficiency isn't as good from these sources, but you can still make neutrons and detect them and possibly detect activation or other effects.
Approach these projects one step at a time: first make neutrons, then detect them, then activate something.
Heh, yes that is a piece of radioactive crockery next to the monitor! That one is especially dear to me because somebody hand-glazed a stock piece of greenware at a make-your-own-pottery joint with uranium orange. Of course it makes a Geiger counter sing.
To make radioisotopes, you really need neutrons. A few radioactive byproducts of (a,n) reactions might be detectable, e.g. Na-22 from F-19(a,n). And since the sources you might make are weak, focus on developing a good detector system.
Very educational. The arrangement with the PC is very nice. What kind of software did you use for this? Also, can you provide some specifics on the "neutron oven"? Is the plastic doped with anything?
The software is freeware, part of the open-source EPICS platform that is used at big accelerator installations. Specifically, I use Mark Rivers' "mca" application. I may be the world's smallest EPICS user. But I will not spend $2000 for Canberra's proprietary software!
The neutron oven is just a hollow cylinder of black HDPE. Its "day job" is to be the moderator for a "snoopy" neutron detector. You could get by with any HDPE, water, wax, etc.
Radiation level high, but not toxic! :)
glastheim 1 week ago
SPECTACULAR! I LOVE your videos! Educational, interesting, informative, professional, and radioactive! Keep up the AWESOME work! =D
- Kyle
KarbineKyle 6 months ago
@Thallium208 is maganese-56 safe enough to handle with your bare hands?
ryanlak1234 8 months ago
Was your neutron detector an He3 tube? I cannot find He3 anywhere any more to save my soul...
BTW, nice NIM set up...
amourdutigre 1 year ago
Hi,
yes, what i see in the video ist all safe and concratulations, very interesting! _but_ i think getting a neutron source from scratching the amiricium frrom smoke detectors istn so easy.. btw where can we geht Berylliumfoil?
HFbastler1 1 year ago
@HFbastler1 None of the Am sources used to make the neutron source in this video were physically damaged in any way. They remain sealed sources. The neutron source was straightforward to make, but requires a lot of these sources. Availability of beryllium depends on where you live and how much you want to spend. I used foils in this source. Foil is expensive. Beryllium electrolytic flake is common and cheap, but dangerous to handle.
Thallium208 1 year ago
@Thallium208 could this "neutron oven" be used to transmute uranium into plutonium?
ryanlak1234 9 months ago
@ryanlak1234 Yes, in principle. Of course, the neutron source is very weak, and the only reliable way to detect this reaction would be through gamma rays emitted in the decay of short-lived grandparent U-239. That is probably possible to do with a careful experiment using an HPGe detector, but it would be barely out of the noise.
Thallium208 9 months ago
@Thallium208 Oh by the way could you show us how to build this neutron oven please? Your description of the oven wasn't very specific.
ryanlak1234 9 months ago
@ryanlak1234 The details of the "neutron oven" aren't really important to its function. Fundamentally all you want is to surround the source and activation sample with as much of a moderating reflector as possible. Polyethylene, wax, and water are very similar in their effectiveness. It depends mostly on what materials are easily at your disposal. The "neutron oven" is part of an old neutron detector, actually, but you could do as well with blocks of polyethylene.
Thallium208 9 months ago
@Thallium208 would this 24 hr. activation be detectable real time with a Ludlum model 3 with a NaI probe? Would this work as well with manganese metal (powder)?
promet247 6 months ago
@promet247 The quantity of radioactivity produced in this experiment is so low that only a shielded detector, a long count time, and the energy spectroscopy technique shown produce statistically significant Mn-56 counts relative to background. I'm afraid trying this with a bare NaI probe and a non-energy-selective counter like a Ludlum 3 would have poor results. Of course, you could always find a stronger source of neutrons...
Thallium208 6 months ago
what would happen if you would put your hand in "neutron oven" for long time,would it transform atoms in your hand to radioactive atoms?
zoltan6561 1 year ago
@zoltan6561 Some atoms would be transformed to radioactive atoms, for instance N-14(n,p)C-14; but the vast majority of capture events would be on regular hydrogen nuclei in flesh to form deuterium (which is stable). Neutrons generate lots of gamma rays when they scatter and are captured, so that would be going on as well. This neutron source is exceedingly weak, but neutron exposure in general is to be avoided.
Thallium208 1 year ago
i was woundering how much am241 is legal in america without a liscense?
ema576 1 year ago
What is ISOCS?
The Ludlum 12 ratemeter was obtained on eBay a number of years ago.
I appreciate the interest, but as always find the purported legal aspect amusing. I work professionally as a nuclear engineer, including RSO duties, and ain't none of this illegal in any way (where I live, in the USA). Everything I put on YouTube is unambiguously legal for me to do. (I cannot speak for people living elsewhere and so on.)
Thallium208 1 year ago
First off, where did you get the ludlum? second, where did you dig up that ancient ISOCS machine...lol. Although I know that this isn't very dangerous I will tell you that it is at some level illegal. The NRC and DOE both support regulations which you must abide by. I will say this was interesting to see but how are you calibrating your instrumentation?
Iamcoldthunder 1 year ago
Great experiment!- Thanks for uploading.
Collserra 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Vous prenez peu de précautions ! vous plongez la main dans le four à neutron ! vous risquez les cancers !
ralbiruni 1 year ago
Vous prenez peu de précautions ! vous plongez la main dans le four à neutron ! vous risquez les cancers !
ralbiruni 1 year ago
can this be done with just Manganese or can this be dont with any element?
wowggscrub 2 years ago
Many natural isotopes will capture a neutron and become radioactive isotopes. Manganese just works very well for this because its capture cross-section is high and because of some other properties. But it is by no means unique in this regard.
Thallium208 2 years ago
isnt that illegal?
1994JMF 2 years ago
@1994JMF No, it is not illegal....
Thallium208 2 years ago
ZZZzzzZZZZzzz****snoring *** man I was thinking you were gonna make it glow!!!!!!!!! j/k nice vid....
rnmultimedia 2 years ago
Where did you get the beryllium foil? and about how many microcuries did your antique americium source have?
teslafredde 2 years ago
I got the Be foil off eBay. The smoke detector sources in use here have about 60 microcuries a pop.
Thallium208 2 years ago
wow that´s impressive 60 microcuries! I only have about 7 microcuries in my source. where did you get such a radioactive amaricium source and how much did it cost ?
I´m extremely interested :P
teslafredde 2 years ago
@teslafredde Industrial smoke detectors have more americium.
vmelkon 10 months ago
@Thallium208 I would like to know if the construction of the neutron source is important in regard to the way the beryllium foil and Am241 are put together --is it better to layer the two together --or better to completely surround the Am241 with the Beryllium or the other way around? also if foil better than solid slabs of Beryllium? Thanks much
promet247 2 weeks ago
@promet247 The Am-241 sources should be in direct contact with the beryllium. Ideally, you would have a homogenous mixture of the alpha emitter in the beryllium metal, but that is not practical with sealed sources.
Thallium208 1 week ago
That IS how it was built, in a nutshell. The Am-241 sources from ANTIQUE smoke detectors (which have more activity) were lined up on pieces of beryllium metal. That's really all there is to it. However, take note of what I say the activity is in there now...it's not too small.
Thallium208 2 years ago
You can make neutrons by bombarding light elements with alpha particles from natural (or artificial) alpha emitters. I do that with americium and beryllium. But you could do it with, say, radium and boron. Or radium and the fluorine in Teflon. Efficiency isn't as good from these sources, but you can still make neutrons and detect them and possibly detect activation or other effects.
Approach these projects one step at a time: first make neutrons, then detect them, then activate something.
Thallium208 2 years ago
Heh, yes that is a piece of radioactive crockery next to the monitor! That one is especially dear to me because somebody hand-glazed a stock piece of greenware at a make-your-own-pottery joint with uranium orange. Of course it makes a Geiger counter sing.
To make radioisotopes, you really need neutrons. A few radioactive byproducts of (a,n) reactions might be detectable, e.g. Na-22 from F-19(a,n). And since the sources you might make are weak, focus on developing a good detector system.
Thallium208 2 years ago
Very educational. The arrangement with the PC is very nice. What kind of software did you use for this? Also, can you provide some specifics on the "neutron oven"? Is the plastic doped with anything?
clagwell 2 years ago
The software is freeware, part of the open-source EPICS platform that is used at big accelerator installations. Specifically, I use Mark Rivers' "mca" application. I may be the world's smallest EPICS user. But I will not spend $2000 for Canberra's proprietary software!
The neutron oven is just a hollow cylinder of black HDPE. Its "day job" is to be the moderator for a "snoopy" neutron detector. You could get by with any HDPE, water, wax, etc.
Thallium208 2 years ago