Actually, let me clarify something I said in my previous post: we should KEEP Medicare and Medicaid, only it should be privatized. Social security, however, should be eliminated.
I love it. Whenever a major news corporation like Fox News doesn't tout the liberal line, they are lambasted as frauds, liars, and false journalists. Fox News isn't even conservative with the exception of Bill O Reilly, so what the fuck are you bitching about?
Also, the way to save Americans checknbooks is to eliminate the IRS, get rid of Social Security and medicare, and let us drill hwerever we want for oil, that way we don't pay 70 bucks everytime we fill up for gas.
dude, when fox LIES it gets busted. there are facts and then there are lies. theres the truth and then theres distortions. you have been led to believe that there is a conspiracy among EVERY other news org to say the exact same thing at the same time. maybe they are actually reporting facts and fox is lying about them?
you have also been convinced that you must fight for millionaires rights which is truly amazing. no gov has ever been able to get the poor to defend the rich. sheep.
and when has fox News lied before? and when did I say there was a conpiracy within the media? Some news outlets are moderate (ABC, CNBC ), some are left wing (CBS, CNN), and some are ultra left (NBC, MSNBC). I think all be told, the media has a left wing bias, but what the hell does this have to do with a conspiracy? you're making no sense
fox news runs under the doctrine "everyone else is lying and spinning so why cant we?" they believe they must balance out the lies and spin by creating more in the other direction. But there is this thing called integrity that should stop them from intentionally lying for any reason.
fox has also convinced right wing idiots that anything they dont agree with is "Liberal Bias" so you sheep have been taught not to believe anything that doesnt come from fox news.which is really creepy.
I can show you 25 videos on here where they spun the truth completely or lied completely.
ndependant polls where people who watch fox news learn less about the world than others.
people who watch fox news believe we found wmds,people who watch it believe there was a connection between 9/11 and iraq. people who watch it beleave john kerry was french and obama a muslim. right after fox reported he belonged to rev wrights church for 25 years.they cant even keep their lies straight!
"I can show you 25 videos on here where they spun the truth completely or lied completely"
show them to me. I've done some searching myself, and in every single video i saw, there were no lies whatsoever. rarely were their even distortions. Rush limbaugh said it perfectly: "left wingers have to lie to defend their position"
"people who watch fox news believe we found wmds,people who watch it believe there was a connection between 9/11 and iraq. "
again. where is the evidence for this? I have yet to run into a single person who thinks we found WMD's or that Iraq was responsible for 911, nor have I seen any polls (even on MSNBC) purporting this. you're making shit up buddy. Stick to the classic "Bush lied kids died" mantra.
"right after fox reported he belonged to rev wrights church for 25 years"
so the fact that Obama went to Wrights church some how discredits the fact that Obama might be a muslim? I don't know what religion Wright subscribes to (if any), but I know this; Wright has much more in common with Islam then Christianity.
actually obama seems to have more in line with atheism. he was exposed to islam for 4 years of his entire life. he lived in an athiest home for his childhood and i personally believe he started going to church only because his wife did and wanted to raise his kids that way.
obama has shouted out to atheists twice and has criticized religion 4 times that i know of.
If i thought that america had enough oil, i would support drilling wholeheartedly but wed still need to examine alternatives....
i agree with you that Obama is probably an atheist. but lets get back to the point: you were saying that Fox News "can't even get their lies straight," and you gave an awful example of that, which is subsequently dissected and destroyed. did you really vote for McCain? Cause you sound like a Keith Olbermann clone.
yeah. I totally swallowed every lie about obama that i heard. i actually wrote up 50 horrible things that I heard about obama to bolster my resolve. after the election I was afraid ( because fox news told me to be) so I educated myself out of the fear by learning about obama independantly. I realized that he was nothing like anyone was saying he was.
i found that all 50 were distortions or all out lies and no one cared but me that they were lied to..
I ve seen a few oberman videos which i thought were ok.not great. before the election i was watching fox news and listening to hannity and rush on the radio almost everyday. but I make it a point that if i catch somone lying ,i stop trusting them. when i got to my 50th lie i stopped trusting them.
rush and hannity basically reapeated the same catch phrases that fox news did. i would watch fox in the morning and write down the catch phrase and rush an hannity would parrot it 95% of the time.
"If i thought that america had enough oil, i would support drilling wholeheartedly"
you're obviously ignorant if you think we don't have enough oil. the department of energy and the department of interior both have concluded that there are over a trillion barrels of oil in the Arctic reserve and Great Lakes region alone. There's enough oil in America to last for centuries. We absolutely must drill for it.
"you're obviously ignorant if you think we don't have enough oil. the department of energy and the department of interior both have concluded that there are over a trillion barrels of oil in the Arctic reserve and Great Lakes region alone. There's enough oil in America to last for centuries."
I dont know if thats true. but if it is then I really would join the cause to drill for it.
its true. you can research it yourself. of course, the research you've conducted so far has been lacking, but nonetheless, the truth is out there for you to see. I don't have to make shit up like you left wing idealogues do
"Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods.If you find it is true that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then the LORD will make you a great nation..."
Deuteronomy 13:13-19 has absolutely nothing to do with invading random places and killing them if they don't convert to Christianity. You, sir, need to revamp your reading skills. Verses 13-19 have the same theme as verses 1-12: that is, if somebody within the Isrealite tribe entices his fellow isrealites to worship foreign gods, he must be put to death. I admit this is harsh, but the point is that God does not command in these verses what the Koran commands. epic fail.
"you have also been convinced that you must fight for millionaires rights "
right. I advocate eliminating the IRS, getting rid of or privitizing social security and medicare, and allowing oil companies to drill for oil that way all Americans pay lower gas prices, and I'm some how a rich fat cat millionare defending rich fat cat millionares? Typical left wing dribble on your part
........and allowing unemployed plummers tax breaks because someday he might make over 250,000 a year. i never said you were a millionaire fighting for millionaires rights to not be taxed. millionaires don't have to complain that the rich might be taxed, they found a way to convince red necks in trailer parks that its unamerican to tax the wealthy and that it is American to keep our kids in the line of fire for the next 100 years over a lie that nobody got fired over..
you're just jealous that you aren't as rich as those millionares are. why don't you stop your bitching and start making a living for yourself like Walt Disney, Bill Gates, and Chris Brady did? why the hell should the government steal money from the haves and redistribute it to the have nots? that is government endorsed theft. that is wrong.
throughout time,there have been incredibly stupid,illiterate, religiously deluded peasants that couldnt be manipulated into taking to the streets so that millionaires can get more tax breaks. the gop waves a few flags utters gods name at a few meetings and drags out a out of work plummer who thinks hes going to be a millionaire next year and you all fall in line. sticking up for the same corporations that abandoned this country because they could hire people for 1.00 a day.not for tax breaks.
there you go again with your class warfare bullshit. Stop your bitching about the money millionaires have and become a millionaire yourself. Its like Mark levin said: you left wingers hate your existence, so you have to steal from your fellow man. You are disgusting. BTW, in case you didn't notice, I support cutting and even abolishing income taxes for everybody, not just corporations.
BTW, as far as i'm concerned, its un American to put any income tax on any American. you should keep what you earn. You have no right to take my money from me just cause I may have more of it then you.
"you're just jealous that you aren't as rich as those millionares are. why don't you stop your bitching and start making a living for yourself like Walt Disney, Gates, and Brady did? "
since i am not a millionaire i stick to the issues that affect me, i dont allow myself to be the first group in any countries history for the poor and middle class to demand that the rich keep even more of their money.its an incredible example of brainwashing. im impressed actually its not easy to do.
"and middle class to demand that the rich keep even more of their money"
first of all, what exactly do you classify as "rich"? Those who make over $100,000 per year like Obama claims? Yes, I advocate the so called "rich" being allowed to keep their hard earned money, as I do with any American in any artificial income bracket. You, on the other hand, endorse government theft, which is evil in my and every other sane persons book.
drilling for oil in this country keeps us addicted and shelling out huge amounts of money to people who hate us for a few years and ignoring the problem. (I am in favor of nuclear though big time).there isnt much oil to get and only prolongs the agony. fox has convinced you that there is a left wing conspiracy by teaching you that 50 countries cheering for a president being elected (which has never happened before until now) is just morons who were brainwashed by a messiah and you buy it all.
"drilling for oil in this country keeps us addicted"
I don't care. it will lower gas prices to less then 50 cents per gallon and will release us from the bind OPEC has on us.
"and shelling out huge amounts of money to people who hate us"
now that right there is a lie that you've been taught by big daddy government and its cronnies in MSNBC. The oil companies do not hate us. the government does.
i was talking about foriegn countries that sell us the oil. the oil companies LOVE us!! they are making millions from lobbying against technologies that would save our asses. if we run ourselves into the ground buying their product what do they care?
you were taught that any fact you don't agree with is a liberal fuckin conspiracy and a lie. i dont care about obama , i voted mcain. but fox has destroyed the party by lying to its people.I fell for it to until i kept catching them lying.
"i was talking about foriegn countries that sell us the oil."
well then I agree with you there. OPEC hates us. That's why we have to drill for oil so that way we can be released from the bind they have on us and so we can also lower gas prices to 1920's levels. Let this be a lesson in prudence for you
you missed a key fact here: the oil companies are lobbying against the government forcing these "green" technologies onto the American public. If green alternatives were actually viable then the oil companies would be investing in them like crazy. but they are not viable alternatives. they are inefficient, make horribly loud noises, and are ridiculously expensive. nobody wants them
OF COURSE THE OIL COMPANIES ARE AGAINST SOMETHING WHERE THEY ARE GOING TO LOSE MONEY IF IT HAPPENS!!!! the oil company have a cash cow right now. all they had to do is pay of the car companies to eliminate electric car development. and vote for anything that keeps americans dependant on oil for a few more years.
you act like companies are a human being with a conscience and a heart. companies exist to make money and if people get hurt, fuck em.
"OF COURSE THE OIL COMPANIES ARE AGAINST SOMETHING WHERE THEY ARE GOING TO LOSE MONEY IF IT HAPPENS"
you say that like its a bad thing. I would do the exact same thing if I was the CEO of one of these oil companies. you need to stop holding onto this feudal belief that making a profit is a bad thing.
"you act like companies are a human being with a conscience and a heart."
indeed I do. human beings run those companies, you know, not unconscious robots or machines.
"companies exist to make money and if people get hurt, fuck em."
I dare you to say that to 95% of the company owners and see what their response is. these evil companies that you chide have created more wealth then the government or any other institution could dream of. Pardon me for supporting those who make my life so good.
see, this is what you anti-capitalist folk don't understand: companies will not invest in something that's not profitable (IE, something that the people don't like and don't want). so as far as I'm concerned, the oil companies are unintentionally sticking up for me and you and everybody by opposing these ridiculous government mandates for a green economy. Even Europe realizes that a green economy is bullshit, hence why they use nuclear power.
i am truly amazed that you were convinced by someone that the oil companies (who have EVERYTHING to lose) oppose the technology that if it succeeds,will ruin them, because they CARE about us and not because they stand to lose billions!!
either the people who manipulate you into believing that are brilliant genius's or you guys are complete morons willing to believe any propaganda u r fed.
fighting for the rich and actually believing the oil companies are some kind of missonaries...
"oppose the technology that if it succeeds,will ruin them, because they CARE about us and not because they stand to lose billions!!"
you missed the part where I said 'unintentionally.' Oil companies aren't thinking of people like me and you when they lobby against government enforced green alternatives. however, by opposing these government enforced alternatives, they are UNINTENTIONALLY benefiting people like me and you be helping prevent a stupid and nonsensical government policy
"fighting for the rich and actually believing the oil companies are some kind of missonarie"
oil companies are no missionaries. for all I know, some of them have beaten their wives or abused their kids. who knows. But without them (and wal Mart, Comcast, Ford, Circuit City, and all the other companies and corporations), we are still stuck in the mideval times. Karl Marx advocated the same class warfare policies you advocate. remind again how that worked out?
I am not against corporations at all!! but i am aware that corporations must make decisions every day. and those desicions are not based on what is good or bad for the american people. they are only based on money. WHICH IS FINE . but we must be aware of that. and not delude ourselves into believeing that the companies exist to help people. if the choice is peoples livlihoods and profits ,they will choose profits. thats what a good business does.
"and not delude ourselves into believeing that the companies exist to help people"
do they exist to help people? no. they exist to make a profit. but whatever their original motives, the fact is they benefit their consumers (IE, citizens like me and you). and when the government puts all these burdensome regulations on them, its me and you who suffer. I'll trust a corporation before I ever trust a congressman or senator. i'm a pragmatist like that
"these evil companies that you chide have created more wealth then the government or any other institution could dream of"
true. as a side effect of gaining profit,they have handed out money to their workers (until many found a way to save millions by paying foreign people 1.00 an hour instead and moved out of the country first chance they got) they accidentally make your life good by making billions for themselves as long as its worth it to stay here.
they aren't outsourcing cause the workers only demand 1 buck an hour. if that was the case, they would have outsourced back in the 1800's, and America wouldn't be what it is today. They are outsourcing cause of:
A. the rediculous government regulations
B. all the benefits that stupid union members demand.
"by teaching you that 50 countries cheering for a president being elected"
I don't give 2 shits what those podunk countries think. They are indeed brainless idiots or they are just plain ignorant seeing as they supported Obama. He's already the worst president in U.S history, and its only gonig to get worse from here on out. BTW, some of those countries were cheering cause they know they'll have their way with the USA now that Obama is in power.
hes 140 days in!! LMAO!! you guys wont eve give hime time to fuck up! could you possibly be any more brainwashed? bush went around telling our allies in the middle east that the usa was on a mission from god. which basically is telling them to prepare for holy war. and these are our allies!!
werent you guys the same ones that said tha obama would be sworn in on the koran and nominated bill ayers to a cabinet post? why dont you make some more bullshit predictions nostradumbass?
yeah, and in those 140 days, the unemployment rate has jumped from 7% to almost 10%, the stock market has hit rock bottom, gas prices have soared, our national security has been deeply jeopardized thanks to Obamas anti-American speeches in Europe and his pending closing of Gitmo (where EVERYONE does not want those crazies we held hostage their), and 3 trillion dollars has been needlessly wasted. Jimmy Carter is blushing right now.
you guys are supposed to figure out a way to attribute this economic crisis to obama. you need to.keep acting like we were all eating caviar and everything was perfect and we didnt have the largest budget deficit in the history of america (after clinton left us with a surplus.) before obama took the reigns. keep that lie going......
at least we have an educated non delusional person in office. not someone so stupid he went to war because rumsfeld attached bible verses to his war advisories...
"you guys are supposed to figure out a way to attribute this economic crisis to obama. "
not necessarily. Obama is responsible for making it worse then it would have been, however, the federal government writ large is responsible for getting us into the mess we are in (see the Community Reinvestment act, the tightening of Fannie Me and Freddie Mac back in the early 90's, and the FED fucking with interest rates)
"keep acting like we were all eating caviar and everything was perfect "
there is not a single conservative or libertarian on the planet who thought the economy was all fine and dandy when Obama took office. the economy was crashing in 2008, and Bush was very much responsible for facilitating it (he didn't get us into it, but he made it worse; he was a bloody socialist in his last year of office, which was truly sad)
"at least we have an educated non delusional person in office"
he's educated in the sense that he does well at regurgitating info he learned in class. he completely lacks in wisdom and prudence. he knows nothing about how economics works, or how foreign policy works, or what it means to be an American. he aid himself that he wants to spread the wealth, which is a value of Karl Marx, not, say, Abraham Lincoln or George Washington. he's a radical, and he's been an awful president
"not someone so stupid he went to war because rumsfeld attached bible verses to his war advisories"
its funny how you think I'm brainwashed when you think Bush was an 1100' crusader. If Bush really wanted to lead some Christian crusade, he would have damn well started with europe, not Iraq. Bush had Americas national security in mind, not some moral crusade. the radical muslims are the moral crusaders. the oran even says so.
"If Bush really wanted to lead some Christian crusade, he would have damn well started with europe, not Iraq."
so when muslim fundimentalists attack the usa ,we should attack england or france?
Iraq was always the target for 15 years..... the opportunity wasnt there. bush connected 9/11 with iraq and we all were hurt and scared so we went along. we found that they were all lies. yellowcake,WMDs,etc all lies and nobody got fired for it. bush is a delusional megachristian and a fool easily lead
"so when muslim fundimentalists attack the usa ,we should attack england or france?"
no no no. You said that Bush was leading some moral crusade, and I'm saying that if he was actually leading a moral crusade, he would have attacked Europe, as Europe is a far more "sinful" place then Iraq or anywhere else in the Middle East. Get it?
"Iraq was always the target for 15 years"
I don't deny that Bush had a motive to finish what his dad started.
cheney and rumsfeld knew that they would have deniability after all this went down. you can find 10 different times where they both said to american in press confirences "there is NO DOUBT that there are WMDs in iraq.we have indisputable proof!!"
we trust our government to be sure. the fact that the people who lied to the predident and vice president wenent brought to justice and fired proves that rumsfeld was lying.
moments after 9/11 there were memos telling people to connect iraq to it.
"you can find 10 different times where they both said to american in press confirences"
yeah, them and every other person in Congress and in the CIA and the British intelligence agencies. why can't you just accept that our intelligence was wrong? why the hell do you have to make shit up about Bush lying? Joe Wilson tried that, and it backfired in his face. Not even Obama is going after Bush, cause there's NOTHING to go after. there was no lying. no war crimes. nothing.
"wenent brought to justice and fired proves that rumsfeld was lying"
who was bought to 'justice,' and who was fired over supposedly lying about Iraq? Bush's lawyers? Cheney? CIA members not named Valerie Wilson? You are sounding delusional. I suggest you re-look at your history. Listening to Dick Durban and friends say Bush lied ad nauseam does not mean it actually happened.
those memos are a figment of your imagination, much like the memo 'warning' Bush of 911. stick to the anthrax conspiracy. its much more enticing and intriguing.
there is a difference between lying and being wrong about the anylisis your intelligence agencies gave you. Bush lied about nothing. The CIA and the British intelligence agencies told Bush and friends what they knew, and Bush acted off that info. He did not lie. he did not make stuff up. if Bush is a liar, then so is every democrat save 2 or 3, cause they all agreed with Bush and did independent anylisis themselves.
"If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him."
This passage of acripture proves that God was quite harsh, but it does not prove that Christians were ordered to lead a crusade against non-christians. read it again if you think thhere's a mandate to kill non-christians or non-isrealis in there.
"the radical muslims are the moral crusaders. the koran even says so."
the bible has just as many intolerant passages where god demands us to KILL (not convert) anyone who is not christian and take their wives as sex slaves,god demands we KILL all non believers,gays,childen who disobey,those who dont listen to preists......
god demands we attack the non christians and take them over if they dont accept our "terms" .the bible is just as vile as the koran. read it. ill give u the passage #s.
"the bible has just as many intolerant passages where god demands us to KILL (not convert) anyone who is not christian"
I'm a born again Christian, and the Bible says nothing of the sort. Show me the passage where God demands we kill all non Christians and take their women You can't. it doesn't exist
For God so loved the world, that he gave his one and only son. That whoever believes in him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. you may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you" Deuteronomy 20:10-14
Deuteronomy 20:10-14: This is nothing more then your classic 'war and plunder' rules which are still largely practiced today (albeit the rewards are different; back then it was cows, now its tanks and airplanes). there's no moral crusade being ordered here. this is nothing more then God laying out rules for common war. every nation since the dawn of time has practiced some form of these rules (including the USA). is it violent? yes. is it a moral cusade? no.
dont nitpick. your holy book, that is touted as the "moral foundation of the world". and that christians are trying to get children to read in every school, is filled of the most vile shit known to man . and if you think i even barely scraped the surface as to the amount of passages in that disgusting violent incestuous leather bound criminal record of gods, you are sorely mistaken. i got 1000 more
"christians are trying to get children to read in every school"
Just for the record, I'm not one of those Christians. I don't beleive public schools should be used for any religious indoctrination. I'm more libertarian then I am conservative.
" is filled of the most vile shit known to man"
alright. whatev. thats your opinion. I would contend its not based on substance, but rather irrational hatred, but trust me, you will see one day how wrong you are. Jesus loves you. (:
"Thus says the Lord: 'I will bring evil upon you out of your own house. I will take your wives [plural] while you live to see it, and will give them to your neighbor. He shall lie with your wives in broad daylight."
2 Samuel 12:11-14: here we have a punishment which God handed to King David for sleeping with Bethsheba. there's no killing of non-christians here, and there's no taking of women. David cheated on all of them. ergo, he lost his wives. You might call that opression of women. I call it extra-marital bullshit.
ok , so what you are saying is that random killing of innocents and the taking of wives as your sex slaves is perfectly ok for ones moral book to express as long as they arent of another religion? do you think that god is commanding them to kill other chistians that are reading the same bible? or do you think that god is basically talking about non christians WHENEVER he instructs his flock to slaughter and rape?
where's the random killing of innocents? we are talking about war here. there are no innocents in war, whether its 900 BC or 2000 AD.
"and the taking of wives as your sex slaves"
Again, David cheated on his wives, so therefore, they are returning the favor. 'revenge' sex is a common trait of us humans (albeit its not always right). sex slaves? Nah!
"do you think that god is commanding them to kill other chistians that are reading the same bible?"
in a word: no
"WHENEVER he instructs his flock to slaughter and rape?"
I think God is basically saying he's a supporter of total war if and when a war breaks out between Isreal and random country. I ahve no problem with this, as I ahve no problem with total war.
""When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house. But before she may live there, she must shave her head and pare her nails and lay aside her captive's garb. After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her,"
"After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her"
your lack of reading skills are again on display. there's no taking of women in that passage. Its just your typical 'boy meets girl in foreign land, boy desires girl boy tries to win girl over, girl falls in love with boy, boy and girl live happily ever after. thee end.' I'll admit this though: the shaving of her head is a stupid order.
I suppose this is more of your boy meetrs girl love story too huh?
"If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her."
The NIV version which you have quoted would make it seem like a woman is forced to marry the monster who "violated" her, but that is not the case. Look at the King James translation, which is much more articulate and complex:
"If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver"
in this passage, you have a man seducing a woman to have sex with him, and the woman obliging (it doesn't say 'he' was found, it says 'they' were found, and the man didn't 'rape' her, he 'layed' with her; the NIV gives a very poor translation of this verse). So yes, I would call that passage a boy meets girl story.
So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children. "This is what you are to do," they said. "Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin." Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan. i have a thousand passages more of different disgusting shit. i could go all day...
"So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children"
nice try. Isreal didn't start that war. they weren't leading a moral crusade, they were defending themselves. when they won, they mearly enjoyed the spoils of winning a war. the 400 virgins they took to shilo? I go back to my 'boy meets girl in foreign country' story.
Disgusting? No. I'm sorry you are so blinded and hate God so much.
for god so loved the world he delivered a flood to kill every man woman and child in the world except for 8?
He gave his one and only son so that his son can be tortured,beaten and slowly murdered as a publicity stunt.
he demanded his son die before he would CHANGE HIS MIND!! that is what a terrorist does. God makes the rules and is all powerful, yet doesnt bear the responsibility of demanding the torture of his son before making the simple decision of forgiveness?
somebody has a problem with chronological order. John 3:16 was made like 3000 years after God himself said he would never flood the world again. Indeed, God loves the world. God is love
"so that his son can be tortured,beaten"
no shit sherlock. the phrase 'beleive in him, and have eternal life' means to beleive that Jesus died on the cross for our sins, and that through him we are saved. Torture is not always a bad thing.
the phrase 'beleive in him, and have eternal life' means to beleive that Jesus died on the cross for our sins, and that through him we are saved. Torture is not always a bad thing.
torture is a bad thing when you demand your only son to go through it and then die before you make a decision you could have made before he did. if you told your son that he had to suffer and die before you would forgive your daughter for something she did,that wouldnrt make you a psychotic maniac?
Myself and born again Christians like me believe that if Jesus didn't go through that, we would have had to instead. In Romans 6:23 it says 'for the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Christ Jesus our lord.' I beleive that this gift would not even be possible without Jesus dying on the cross to clense us of our sins.
" if you told your son that he had to suffer and die before you would forgive your daughter for something she did"
you are assuming that God is a typical father and that Jesus is a typical son. That is not the case. God is perfect. Jesus is perfect. the holy spirit is perfect. Only somebody perfect like Jesus could have died for the sins of humanity like he did. And BTW, God could have chosen to punish all of is individually for our sins, but Jesus took the punishment instead to spare us
Jesus' death on the cross for humanity sins is not a sign that our father in heavan is a physcho, but rather that he loves us so much that he decided to spare us from what we would have had to go through. Like I said: God is love
the Bible says nothing of the sort. Show me the passage where God demands we kill all non Christians......"
"They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13)"
You fail again. The Isrealites whp refused to follow God were to be killed, but that was not the case with all non Christians. So I ask you again: Show me the passage where God demands we kill all non Christians. thats what the muslim faith teaches.
ok, i think i got it. The holy moral book only talks about god demanding the killing of those who refuse to follow god NOT non christians or athiests. ohhhhhh. you are right. there a huge difference!! here i was thinking it was a vile disgusting violent book but you showed me how wrong i was.
nitpicking symantic bullshit. you think it makes a difference that your god only demands the violent death of most non believers not ALL?
no. thats not what I said or what God said in the Bible. God commanded the killing of Isrealites who were non christians. this is very harsh, IMO. But thats nothnig compared to the Koran, which demands the killing of all 'infidels,' no matter which nation or tribe they are from. if the christian God is Ted Bundy, Allah is Hitler.
"bush went around telling our allies in the middle east that the usa was on a mission from god"
I recall Bush going to the middle east and saying things like "we cannot negotiate with terrorists" (and sadly, Bush didn't always abide by this mantra), but he never once declared holy war. the radical Muslims have declared holy war, not Bush or the rest of America.
"werent you guys the same ones that said tha obama would be sworn in on the koran and nominated bill ayers to a cabinet post?"
no, we were not. We made plenty of jokes about him being sword in on the Koran, but we never predicted it would happen. ditto with putting Ayers in a cabinet post. Apparently you left wingers have no sense of humor either.
that was propaganda disguised as a very lame racist joke then. designed to inform the ignorant that obama is a terrorist that can't be trusted. The idea that you guys would try to hide behind those statements that have no humor and attempt to call them jokes shows how deceitful you are or how you dont really know what a joke is.
I bet you laughed your ass off at "an american carol" which looks like it was written by karl rove and cheney themselves.
actually, i said it wasnt a joke. it was a manipulation tool to make sure that racist ignorant sheep can be informed of the impending doom of a muslim terrorist making it into the white house.
there are plenty of racial jokes that were funny against obama the "hooped up" purple presidential limo. the clip frfom "soul plane " with the plane with spinning rims as air force one cracked me up. but telling people that obama will turn into the antichrist while being sworn in in not a joke.
I read the bible cover to cover 3x times. you should try it sometime. dont just pick and choose gods word because you agree with it like you do with your news.
im surprised you dont believe that christ is too liberal to believe in.Fox news would destroy a man like jesus today. you think jesus would be hating on gays and screaming at immigrants to go home?
"jesus would be hating on gays and screaming at immigrants to go home?"
yes and yes (see Romand 1, John 2, Matthew 23). Jesus was not a nicer then though liberal that you think he is. he's an old fashioned Christian conservative. But thats not why I beleive in him. You are to blind to understand the reasons why I beleive in him.
I believe that everythnig in the Bible is true from a historical or moral standpoint. I don't pick and chose when it comes to the Bible. thats what a new aged beleiver does. And BTW, the only shows on Fox News that I watch are Redeye and a little bit of the O Reilly factor. I watch MSNBC way more then I watch Fox News. Listening to bullshit over and over makes me a stronger and more crisp debator.
"I bet you laughed your ass off at "an american carol"
actually I haven't seen the movie yet, but I'm assuming it was hilarious given the reviews that people like Mark Levin, Sean Hannity, and Glenn Beck gave it.
you will LOVE an american corol!! it's like a non-stop propaganda reel thinly disguised as humor to gently confirm everything fox and the past administration needed rednecks to believe. with a large amount of flag waving and country music to lull the toothless morons into a frenzy.
and of course they would like it. it's dialouge reads like a transcript of their shows.
i talked to alot of right wingers at the time In fact I was dating one at the time and apparently they all didnt get the joke either. everyone that i talked to were convinced that obama was getting sworn in on the koran, was best friends with bill ayers, and was a dangerous radical muslim who on inauguration day would hand out mandatory turbans to all of us or some shit. they werent jokes. they were tools to indoctrinate people too retarded to know how much they were being brainwashed.
look, Im not sure about any of this "green" stuff. but I like the idea that they are being researched and worked on .rather than what we did for the past 8 years which is let a president (whose entire family is in the FUCKING OIL BUSINESS WITH SAUDI OIL COMPANIES!!!!) not explore any options other than continuing to buy oil that coincidentally makes his family richer and richer.
but im sure that there are kickbacks and shit from green companies as well.....
"I like the idea that they are being researched and worked on"
you still don't get it: green alternatives like wind power and solar power are NOT viable alternatives! They are inefficient, make horibly loud noises, and are expensive as hell. ergo, nobody wants them. ergo, nobody in the private sector is investing in them. Even the pinkos in Europe know this, hence why they have never invested in green alternatives. you should not invest in something that doesn't work.
"not explore any options other than continuing to buy oil that coincidentally makes his family richer and richer."
actually, there were several times when Bush tried to get Congress to let companies drill for oil, and he himself lifted the executive ban on offshore oil drilling. You can blame the left wing idiots in Congress for the oil crisis in the middle east. Bush is blameless on that issue.
OF COURSE BUSH WANTED THEM TO DRILL FOR OIL!! THE LONGER WE STAY DEPENDENT ON OIL ,THE MORE MONEY HIS FAMILY AND FRIENDS MAKE.
what kind of argument is that? I tell you the bushes are oil billionaires that are in bed with mid east oil companies and you tell me to counter it that bush is pro oil?
"I tell you the bushes are oil billionaires that are in bed with mid east oil companies"
exactly. you think Bush never wanted America to stop being binded to OPEC and friends, and I was proving that that is a lie. Bush desperately wanted us to drill for oil that way we can be RELEASED of our bind to foreign oil companies. get it?
Thirty-one States have oil reserves. The top 5 are: Tex, with 4.9 billion barrels Alask, with 3.9 billion barrels Cal, with 3.4 billion barrels Wyo, with 706 million barrels New Mex, with 696 million barrels.
Also, there are crude oil in Federal Offshore fields: 3.7 billion barrels in the Gulf of Mexico and 441 million pacific.
The estimate life of reserves in the United States is about 12 years.
does that mean if we stopped buying we could last 12 years? or 12 at this rate?
"does that mean if we stopped buying we could last 12 years? or 12 at this rate?"
nice try. but all those fancy stats you gave me are oil fields which oil companies are already allowed to drill on. There are trillions of gallons of oil in lands which are off limits to oil companies. the problem is, all these enviro-nazis are preventing the companies from drilling. you can blame environmentalism for our current energy crisis
you might as well deny that we can calculate the magnitude of an earthquake, or that we are 4.3 light-years from the nearest star not named the sun, or that, or that refraction can be used to perform knee surgeries which repair ruptured ACL's. You left wingers never have been and never will be keen of science (case in point: Darwinian evolution)
"I beleive in creation, and I know evolution is false."
No, you don't. a two thousand year old book tells you to ignore millions of pieces of evidence and to deny everything our biology and medical knowledge is based upon. if you really did,u would stop using any medication or antibiotic right now.everytime that works it proves evolution was correct. it does prove that u dont care about facts or evidence and theres no reason to argue with people like u. i wish i would have asked u that 1st.
holy fucking balls. when I say that I beleive in creation and not evolution, I'm obviously saying that I don't beleive in Darwinian evolution (IE, that we all evolved from monkeys and that everything evolved from one organism). Basic evolution (IE, when a virus mutates or when humans become less hairy over hundreds of years) is undeniably true.
A christian that says things like "i'm all about facts and evidence " ALWAYS makes me laugh.
everything you believe was made up by people from the bronze age.
you know nothing of evolution except the lies that your moral leaders use to manipulate you. I'll never understand how you can trust people who lie in gods name and count on you not to check on them.
"everything you believe was made up by people from the bronze age"
thats hyperbole if I ever saw it. The frickin National Geographic documents in their history books that Moses led the Isrealites from Egypt to Isreal, that King David and King Solomon ruled Isreal, that the Isrealities were taken into captivity into babylon, and that Jesus was a great moral leader who was executed by the romans. You can ignore the devine providence behind all these stories, but they are still true events
there is no proof that there was even a man named jesus anywhere. bible gospels are stories not historical record.There occurs no contemporary Roman record that shows Pontius Pilate executing a man named Jesus. there occurs not a single contemporary writing that mentions Jesus. All documents were written well after the life of the alleged Jesus from either: unknown authors, people who had never met an earthly Jesus, or from fraudulent, mythical or allegorical writings
thats a nother lie. the Romans kept record of every single person they executed. Jesus Christ of Nazarath is in those records. To deny that a man named Jesus walked the earth is to deny that 2+2=4. You might not beleive Jesus was the son of God, and that he was just a prophet. thats fine. But it is a cold hard fact that Jesus Christ walked this earth. The author Luke is a first rate historian who documented Jesus life while he was on earth. you have your head too far up your ass
the author luke? what other writtings did he do? there is no historical proof that a "luke" existed either . just because a gosphel was attributed to a man named luke doesnt mean there is proof of he exists.
and no there is no historical evidence that a man named jesus was executed.LMAO. you are being lied to . you were taught to just accept bullshit and not ask for proof so the bullshitters have gotten more definite in their lying. they know you wont question if they sound sure.
fine. whatever. ignore what every single secular history book says and dismiss it as Christian jibberish. I don't care. your hatred for us Christians and for basic facts is appaling. I'm sure you'll ignore the proof I sent you that Luke was a real person and a real historian.
Do you honestly think that science feels threatened by a idiot blond who wears a cocktail dress at 7am?
as for hitler and stalin agreeing with darwins theory, they both put darwin down publicly. the actually believed in the scientist before darwin (Jean-Baptiste Chevalier de Lamarck) that put forth the idea that rabbits turned into chickens,and ducks into crocodiles
Hitler believed in god and even put "god with us" on most nazi officer belt buckles.
"Do you honestly think that science feels threatened by a idiot blond who wears a cocktail dress at 7am?"
Hell no. They wouldn't be threatened by God himself if he showed his face to them. You and them are so stuck up in your delusions that its impossible for you to acknolwedge the truth.
"as for hitler and stalin agreeing with darwins theory, they both put darwin down publicly."
no they didn't. they embraced Darwin and all his theories, especially the surivial of the fittest theory.
darwin didnt invent the "survival of the fittest theory." In fact darwin pushed more of a "slight change over millions of generations make large changes" theory.
scientists arent threatened by ideas that have been tested and failed every single test for the past 150 years. they tend to be partial to theories that have passed every test for 150 years.call that success bias if you like....
"darwin didnt invent the "survival of the fittest theory."
doesn't matter. he was a staunch beleiver in that theory, whether he created it or not
"scientists arent threatened by ideas that have been tested and failed every single test for the past 150 years"
what ideas are yout alknig about? I'm not defending creationism here. creationism is faith, not science. I AM, however, arguing against the crackpot cult that is darwinian evolution.
"that put forth the idea that rabbits turned into chickens,and ducks into crocodiles"
apparently Mr Lamjarck beleived in the exact same thing Darwin beleived in and what you and Dawkins and Scott and Miller believe in. You ought to know your own religion if you;re going to defend it. Read the biology books by your own priests: they each document how species suppsoedly evolved into other species.
"I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator."
Mein Kampf,
" I fell down on my knees and thanked Heaven from an overflowing heart for granting me the good fortune of being permitted to live at this time" Mein Kampf
"Once again the songs of the fatherland roared to the heavens along the endless marching columns, and for the last time the Lord's grace smiled on His ungrateful children."
"I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator."
and thats supposed to make him a beleiver in God? all tyrants like Hitelr invoke God in order to get the masses behind them. Hitler admited personally he does not beleive in God and that he is an athiest. I know you hate this fact, but it doesn't make it any less true.
that just proves that you have no idea what darwin said . or you just believe flat out lies youve been told and are too lazy to do ANY independant research. i dont need to believe or have faith, i educated myself out of it. dogs dont turn into cats ever. your leaders must teach you that because they know that you wont check. they are counting on your ignorance. its the reason i bailed on the church. its pure lies with no support besides other delusionals.
"or you just believe flat out lies youve been told and are too lazy to do ANY independant research"
no. I took 9th grade biology just like every other American who's gone to a public highschool. I'm regurgatating what i was taught in that class. I was taught that everythingh evolved from a single organism, that humans evolved from apes, and that one specie evolved into an entirely different specie. I olove how you are trying to run from this cause you know its bullshit.
no lamjarck believed in what you percieve darwinian evolution to be that rabbits turned into horses and crocs to ducks. big difference. darwin didnt believe that at all. its what creationist use to confuse the idiots who are stupid enough to just take them at their word.
"darwin didnt believe that at all. its what creationist use to confuse the idiots who are stupid enough to just take them at their word"
lets assume for the sake of argument that Darwin DIDN'T believe that one specie evolved into another type. even then, I was taught in my 9th grade bio class that one of the key elements of evolution is one specie evolving into another. Crazy christians aren't making this up to confuse the masses.
Thats not what you were taught in 9th grade unless you went to a christian school. Thats what you were told you were taught by the people you look to for moral guidance. they know better, but bringing you to god is more important to them than telling you the truth. A few hundred lies is nothing compared to saving your soul from damnation. to preach their "truth' they must lie over and over again.
if that was taught,there would be no branches on the evol tree. there are tens of thousands
"Thats not what you were taught in 9th grade unless you went to a christian school."
yes it was. And I did not go to a Christian highschool. I went to a public highschool called Milford High, which was a mostly moderate school (with some lefties and some righties).
"Hitler believed in god and even put "god with us" on most nazi officer belt buckles."
so if an athiest says 'god bless you,' does that mean he beleives in God? Nope.Hitler did not beleive in God or any god. He was a hardcore athiest. Read the book "The Rise and fall of the 3rd reich" and see for yourself
are you insane? do you honestly think an atheist building an atheist army would put a 3 world phrase with god in the title on the emblem of his representitives of his party? and all you can compare it to is saying "god bless you" after you sneeze?
read hitlers book yourself and stop just swallowing lies that your manipulaters count on you to swallow . show a little independance. hitlers book isnt anyone elses interpretation of hitler. ITS HITLERS OWN!!!
" there occurs not a single contemporary writing that mentions Jesus"
try telling that to the historians which put together Americas history books. I'm assuming those historians are crazy christians? You would ahve loved the soviet union, and Stalin and Hitler would ahve loved you.
i know most of what i know about darwinian evolution from my freshman biology class and multiple documentaries on the History Channel and Nat Geo. I've looked into evolution from a critical standpoint. I've concluded that darwinian evolution is not a matter of attacking religion, or advancing science, or anything positive and progressive. darwinian evolution is itself a religion indistinguishable in scientific credibility from scientology. it doesn't make me angry. it makes me laugh
"darwinian evolution is itself a religion indistinguishable in scientific credibility "
There is more evidence that evolution is correct than any other scientific theory ever recorded. evolution gets tested everyday and has had 150 years of scientific test and has passed every single test. the only people who dont believe in it are not allowed to believe in it because their magical bearded man in the sky theory apparently seems more credible.
"There is more evidence that evolution is correct than any other scientific theory"
no there's not. the lik sof Richard Dawkins keep on repeating this mantra and can't back it up. where's the evidence? we look liie monkeys therefore we are monkeys? you should read the science chapters in Ann Coulters book 'church of liberalism.' they completely throw evolution out of the water. Only media matters even bothered to challenge Coulters arguments, and they wrote 19 pages of lies in response
i can back up evolution and show you evidence in any natural history museum. watch the link. learn the truth and get angry at those who think you need to be stupid and incorrect to believe in god.
Id be pissed. I wouldnt allow my moral leaders to lie.
"i can back up evolution and show you evidence in any natural history museum"
that video you gave me was an utter joke, and as fopr museams, I've been to every single museam in Washington D.C, and I saw nothing that would convince me that darwinian evolution is true (I was too busy marveling at Gods awesome creatiosn in those museams to worry about what Richard Dawkins thinks of them).
You sound like some snot nosed 19 year old college boy. thinks he knows everything and doesnt think he has anything left to learn.fighting for taxes he doesnt yet pay,arguing for the rights of millionaires because his father told him to.
keep closing your eyes to evidence a repeat religious dogma and lies in its place. the rationals have all the evidence and intelligence. I think I'll stick with them. you stick with the terrified cavemen throwing rocks at the moon and praying for intelligence
",arguing for the rights of millionaires because his father told him to"
there's your class warfare bullshit again. I fight for the rights of millionares and all americans to keep their money. why should they have to give some to you just cause they earned more then you? you're a communist swine.
"the rationals have all the evidence and intelligence"
yes. Richard Dawkins and Eugenie scott are soooooooo intelligent! Their word is gold!
Thats the amazing thing about evolution. We dont have to depend of someones word (like you do). we have millions of fossils,thousands of tests passed,everything that science,biology and medicine is based on tests it every single day. They dont ask that we believe them. they ask that we look at logic reason and evidence. YOUR leaders are asking that we just believe them and a book that was heavily edited in 325 ad by council vote.
a perfect god wouldnt have to demand the torture and death of his only beloved son before he would forgive all mans sins. a perfect god wouldnt created flawed humans and then punish them for the flaws he knew would exist.
No father would would demand one of his kids suffer before he would forgive all the others. its insane and defending it is delusional.
"a perfect god wouldnt have to demand the torture and death of his only beloved son before he would forgive all mans sins."
I go back to Romans 6:23-'the wages of sin is death.' this means that unless ourselves or somebody like Jesus took the punishment for our sin, it would be impossible for God to 'forgive' us of our sins, and impossible to be with him. Forgiveness never comes without bad consequences like you left wingers want to believe.
God himself. He says in his word that nobody who is imperfect can be in his presense. we human beings, being sinful, are imperfect. therefore, we cannot be in Gods presense. we must be perfect to be in his presense. God loves us so much that he wants us to be in heaven with him, forever. he CAN change this rule. but he doesn't out of his awesome love he has for us.
there is no higher power above God forcing him to do anything. you are under the delusion that forgiveness requires that there not be punishment. It is not heartless or ruthless for God to punish us, his son, or for two human parents to punish their children. In the case of sin, the punishment is death. you can argue that this SHOULDN'T be the case, but with God, it is what it is. I, for one, do not have much of an issue with this, but then again, I've never been scared of blood and guts
1. God created us as perfect. we corrupted ourselves (see the Garden of Eden). God had nothing to do with men falling into sin
2. God did not punish us for our sins, which proves how awesome his love is.
you need to vent your hatred at the radical muslims in the middle east, or the thousands of first degree criminals like Hurricane Carter, or communist politicians like Barack Obama and Barney Frank, for those people are causing all the needless suffering, not God.
"No father would would demand one of his kids suffer before he would forgive all the others"
you still haven't grasped the fact that somebody had to pay for humanity's sin, and the only two options are us humans or a perfect being like Jesus. God is not a sado-masochist who is hell bent on destroying everything that moves. that is a trait which belongs to Satan. You would see this if you weren't so blinded by the hate you show to him. I honestly feel sorry for you.
NOBODY had to pay for human beings sins! God was GOD. He makes the rules,he decides what happens. you act like god couldnt make it so. like god had no power to change it. which is blasphemy. god needed a publicity stunt and served up his own son to make us all feel guilty. you can deny god had the power all you want. nobody has to die for anyones sins if god dint decide it had to be that way.
you were taught at an early age that reality isnt reality and what you believe is more important than what u know. you were taught to not question what u were told and to follow blindly as long as the person confirmed what u had previously been told. Now I completely understand why u believe the crap from fox news even if there is evidence. u have been taught that faith is more concrete than evidence and that makes you as dangerous ad the 9/11 hijackers because you can be easily manipulated
"you were taught at an early age that reality isnt reality"
the world is what it is. I don't try to create a utopian society like you communists do. I accept the world as it is and adapt to it, and I don't deny what my own eyes see and what my own ears here. I don't claim to have seen God, but I've put the Bible and my entire Christian beleif under the microscope before, and they've withstood the test of logic and reasoning. the athiest Lee Strobel did the same thing and became a Christian.
"you were taught to not question what u were told and to follow blindly"
As I've gotten older, I've questioned pretty much everything I know. Through this questioning, some of my bliefs and philosophies on life have changed, in ways my parents and pastor would not approve of. But my underlying, foundational Christian faith is the same now as it was when I accepted Christ into my heart back on 4/2/96. We Christians beleive questioning is a good thing, as it makes our faith that much stronger
"why u believe the crap from fox news even if there is evidence."
you still have yet to show me how Fox News has lied or even manipulated the truth. You keep on repeating dribble from MSNBC like it has some kind of meaning. its a logical fallacy to justify your point by repeatedly saying 'its true! its true! I said so, therefore, its true!' evidence really is a problem for you left wingers, isn't it? Jesus himself said: the truth will set you free.
first of all yelling "its true" is not a logical fallacy at all.i am not repeating dribble from msnbc i dont even know where to find that on my cable and i watch about an hours worth of tv a week,
there are 50 videos to the right where fox gets cought lying and manipulating the truth!! are you blind? watch them. and then talk yourself out of the lies like you do with everything else.
I think FOX sabotaged his expose!
hatfisc 2 years ago
lol what a fuckin tool.
98DevilDog79 2 years ago
nice video, dick
tylenoljohnson 2 years ago
Sound check!
nobama6 2 years ago
what hapened to the sound?
I think I know, somebody didn't want it to be heard.
So much for the 5th ammendment.
felitopingu 3 years ago
CBS is now worse about B.S. news ever I have seen... there is a video link on youtube:
watch?v=EDIAsS9VXiM
vikingscool 3 years ago
Actually, let me clarify something I said in my previous post: we should KEEP Medicare and Medicaid, only it should be privatized. Social security, however, should be eliminated.
Poole1Dan 3 years ago
I love it. Whenever a major news corporation like Fox News doesn't tout the liberal line, they are lambasted as frauds, liars, and false journalists. Fox News isn't even conservative with the exception of Bill O Reilly, so what the fuck are you bitching about?
Also, the way to save Americans checknbooks is to eliminate the IRS, get rid of Social Security and medicare, and let us drill hwerever we want for oil, that way we don't pay 70 bucks everytime we fill up for gas.
Poole1Dan 3 years ago
dude, when fox LIES it gets busted. there are facts and then there are lies. theres the truth and then theres distortions. you have been led to believe that there is a conspiracy among EVERY other news org to say the exact same thing at the same time. maybe they are actually reporting facts and fox is lying about them?
you have also been convinced that you must fight for millionaires rights which is truly amazing. no gov has ever been able to get the poor to defend the rich. sheep.
randypagan 2 years ago
and when has fox News lied before? and when did I say there was a conpiracy within the media? Some news outlets are moderate (ABC, CNBC ), some are left wing (CBS, CNN), and some are ultra left (NBC, MSNBC). I think all be told, the media has a left wing bias, but what the hell does this have to do with a conspiracy? you're making no sense
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
fox news runs under the doctrine "everyone else is lying and spinning so why cant we?" they believe they must balance out the lies and spin by creating more in the other direction. But there is this thing called integrity that should stop them from intentionally lying for any reason.
fox has also convinced right wing idiots that anything they dont agree with is "Liberal Bias" so you sheep have been taught not to believe anything that doesnt come from fox news.which is really creepy.
randypagan 2 years ago
"But there is this thing called integrity that should stop them from intentionally lying for any reason."
again, when have they lied?
"so you sheep have been taught not to believe anything that doesnt come from fox news"
I follow the truth wherever it may lead me, and thats whether I get it from Fox News or somewhere else. Fox News doesn't have a patent on the truth.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
I can show you 25 videos on here where they spun the truth completely or lied completely.
ndependant polls where people who watch fox news learn less about the world than others.
people who watch fox news believe we found wmds,people who watch it believe there was a connection between 9/11 and iraq. people who watch it beleave john kerry was french and obama a muslim. right after fox reported he belonged to rev wrights church for 25 years.they cant even keep their lies straight!
randypagan 2 years ago
"I can show you 25 videos on here where they spun the truth completely or lied completely"
show them to me. I've done some searching myself, and in every single video i saw, there were no lies whatsoever. rarely were their even distortions. Rush limbaugh said it perfectly: "left wingers have to lie to defend their position"
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"people who watch fox news believe we found wmds,people who watch it believe there was a connection between 9/11 and iraq. "
again. where is the evidence for this? I have yet to run into a single person who thinks we found WMD's or that Iraq was responsible for 911, nor have I seen any polls (even on MSNBC) purporting this. you're making shit up buddy. Stick to the classic "Bush lied kids died" mantra.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"right after fox reported he belonged to rev wrights church for 25 years"
so the fact that Obama went to Wrights church some how discredits the fact that Obama might be a muslim? I don't know what religion Wright subscribes to (if any), but I know this; Wright has much more in common with Islam then Christianity.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
actually obama seems to have more in line with atheism. he was exposed to islam for 4 years of his entire life. he lived in an athiest home for his childhood and i personally believe he started going to church only because his wife did and wanted to raise his kids that way.
obama has shouted out to atheists twice and has criticized religion 4 times that i know of.
If i thought that america had enough oil, i would support drilling wholeheartedly but wed still need to examine alternatives....
randypagan 2 years ago
i agree with you that Obama is probably an atheist. but lets get back to the point: you were saying that Fox News "can't even get their lies straight," and you gave an awful example of that, which is subsequently dissected and destroyed. did you really vote for McCain? Cause you sound like a Keith Olbermann clone.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"did you really vote for McCain"
yeah. I totally swallowed every lie about obama that i heard. i actually wrote up 50 horrible things that I heard about obama to bolster my resolve. after the election I was afraid ( because fox news told me to be) so I educated myself out of the fear by learning about obama independantly. I realized that he was nothing like anyone was saying he was.
i found that all 50 were distortions or all out lies and no one cared but me that they were lied to..
randypagan 2 years ago
I ve seen a few oberman videos which i thought were ok.not great. before the election i was watching fox news and listening to hannity and rush on the radio almost everyday. but I make it a point that if i catch somone lying ,i stop trusting them. when i got to my 50th lie i stopped trusting them.
rush and hannity basically reapeated the same catch phrases that fox news did. i would watch fox in the morning and write down the catch phrase and rush an hannity would parrot it 95% of the time.
randypagan 2 years ago
"If i thought that america had enough oil, i would support drilling wholeheartedly"
you're obviously ignorant if you think we don't have enough oil. the department of energy and the department of interior both have concluded that there are over a trillion barrels of oil in the Arctic reserve and Great Lakes region alone. There's enough oil in America to last for centuries. We absolutely must drill for it.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"you're obviously ignorant if you think we don't have enough oil. the department of energy and the department of interior both have concluded that there are over a trillion barrels of oil in the Arctic reserve and Great Lakes region alone. There's enough oil in America to last for centuries."
I dont know if thats true. but if it is then I really would join the cause to drill for it.
randypagan 2 years ago
"I dont know if thats true."
its true. you can research it yourself. of course, the research you've conducted so far has been lacking, but nonetheless, the truth is out there for you to see. I don't have to make shit up like you left wing idealogues do
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods.If you find it is true that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then the LORD will make you a great nation..."
Deuteronomy 13:13-19
randypagan 2 years ago
Deuteronomy 13:13-19 has absolutely nothing to do with invading random places and killing them if they don't convert to Christianity. You, sir, need to revamp your reading skills. Verses 13-19 have the same theme as verses 1-12: that is, if somebody within the Isrealite tribe entices his fellow isrealites to worship foreign gods, he must be put to death. I admit this is harsh, but the point is that God does not command in these verses what the Koran commands. epic fail.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"you have also been convinced that you must fight for millionaires rights "
right. I advocate eliminating the IRS, getting rid of or privitizing social security and medicare, and allowing oil companies to drill for oil that way all Americans pay lower gas prices, and I'm some how a rich fat cat millionare defending rich fat cat millionares? Typical left wing dribble on your part
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
........and allowing unemployed plummers tax breaks because someday he might make over 250,000 a year. i never said you were a millionaire fighting for millionaires rights to not be taxed. millionaires don't have to complain that the rich might be taxed, they found a way to convince red necks in trailer parks that its unamerican to tax the wealthy and that it is American to keep our kids in the line of fire for the next 100 years over a lie that nobody got fired over..
randypagan 2 years ago
you're just jealous that you aren't as rich as those millionares are. why don't you stop your bitching and start making a living for yourself like Walt Disney, Bill Gates, and Chris Brady did? why the hell should the government steal money from the haves and redistribute it to the have nots? that is government endorsed theft. that is wrong.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
throughout time,there have been incredibly stupid,illiterate, religiously deluded peasants that couldnt be manipulated into taking to the streets so that millionaires can get more tax breaks. the gop waves a few flags utters gods name at a few meetings and drags out a out of work plummer who thinks hes going to be a millionaire next year and you all fall in line. sticking up for the same corporations that abandoned this country because they could hire people for 1.00 a day.not for tax breaks.
randypagan 2 years ago
"so that millionaires can get more tax breaks"
there you go again with your class warfare bullshit. Stop your bitching about the money millionaires have and become a millionaire yourself. Its like Mark levin said: you left wingers hate your existence, so you have to steal from your fellow man. You are disgusting. BTW, in case you didn't notice, I support cutting and even abolishing income taxes for everybody, not just corporations.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
BTW, as far as i'm concerned, its un American to put any income tax on any American. you should keep what you earn. You have no right to take my money from me just cause I may have more of it then you.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"you're just jealous that you aren't as rich as those millionares are. why don't you stop your bitching and start making a living for yourself like Walt Disney, Gates, and Brady did? "
since i am not a millionaire i stick to the issues that affect me, i dont allow myself to be the first group in any countries history for the poor and middle class to demand that the rich keep even more of their money.its an incredible example of brainwashing. im impressed actually its not easy to do.
randypagan 2 years ago
"and middle class to demand that the rich keep even more of their money"
first of all, what exactly do you classify as "rich"? Those who make over $100,000 per year like Obama claims? Yes, I advocate the so called "rich" being allowed to keep their hard earned money, as I do with any American in any artificial income bracket. You, on the other hand, endorse government theft, which is evil in my and every other sane persons book.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
drilling for oil in this country keeps us addicted and shelling out huge amounts of money to people who hate us for a few years and ignoring the problem. (I am in favor of nuclear though big time).there isnt much oil to get and only prolongs the agony. fox has convinced you that there is a left wing conspiracy by teaching you that 50 countries cheering for a president being elected (which has never happened before until now) is just morons who were brainwashed by a messiah and you buy it all.
randypagan 2 years ago
"drilling for oil in this country keeps us addicted"
I don't care. it will lower gas prices to less then 50 cents per gallon and will release us from the bind OPEC has on us.
"and shelling out huge amounts of money to people who hate us"
now that right there is a lie that you've been taught by big daddy government and its cronnies in MSNBC. The oil companies do not hate us. the government does.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
i was talking about foriegn countries that sell us the oil. the oil companies LOVE us!! they are making millions from lobbying against technologies that would save our asses. if we run ourselves into the ground buying their product what do they care?
you were taught that any fact you don't agree with is a liberal fuckin conspiracy and a lie. i dont care about obama , i voted mcain. but fox has destroyed the party by lying to its people.I fell for it to until i kept catching them lying.
randypagan 2 years ago
"i was talking about foriegn countries that sell us the oil."
well then I agree with you there. OPEC hates us. That's why we have to drill for oil so that way we can be released from the bind they have on us and so we can also lower gas prices to 1920's levels. Let this be a lesson in prudence for you
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
you missed a key fact here: the oil companies are lobbying against the government forcing these "green" technologies onto the American public. If green alternatives were actually viable then the oil companies would be investing in them like crazy. but they are not viable alternatives. they are inefficient, make horribly loud noises, and are ridiculously expensive. nobody wants them
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
OF COURSE THE OIL COMPANIES ARE AGAINST SOMETHING WHERE THEY ARE GOING TO LOSE MONEY IF IT HAPPENS!!!! the oil company have a cash cow right now. all they had to do is pay of the car companies to eliminate electric car development. and vote for anything that keeps americans dependant on oil for a few more years.
you act like companies are a human being with a conscience and a heart. companies exist to make money and if people get hurt, fuck em.
randypagan 2 years ago
"OF COURSE THE OIL COMPANIES ARE AGAINST SOMETHING WHERE THEY ARE GOING TO LOSE MONEY IF IT HAPPENS"
you say that like its a bad thing. I would do the exact same thing if I was the CEO of one of these oil companies. you need to stop holding onto this feudal belief that making a profit is a bad thing.
"you act like companies are a human being with a conscience and a heart."
indeed I do. human beings run those companies, you know, not unconscious robots or machines.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"companies exist to make money and if people get hurt, fuck em."
I dare you to say that to 95% of the company owners and see what their response is. these evil companies that you chide have created more wealth then the government or any other institution could dream of. Pardon me for supporting those who make my life so good.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
see, this is what you anti-capitalist folk don't understand: companies will not invest in something that's not profitable (IE, something that the people don't like and don't want). so as far as I'm concerned, the oil companies are unintentionally sticking up for me and you and everybody by opposing these ridiculous government mandates for a green economy. Even Europe realizes that a green economy is bullshit, hence why they use nuclear power.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
i am truly amazed that you were convinced by someone that the oil companies (who have EVERYTHING to lose) oppose the technology that if it succeeds,will ruin them, because they CARE about us and not because they stand to lose billions!!
either the people who manipulate you into believing that are brilliant genius's or you guys are complete morons willing to believe any propaganda u r fed.
fighting for the rich and actually believing the oil companies are some kind of missonaries...
randypagan 2 years ago
"oppose the technology that if it succeeds,will ruin them, because they CARE about us and not because they stand to lose billions!!"
you missed the part where I said 'unintentionally.' Oil companies aren't thinking of people like me and you when they lobby against government enforced green alternatives. however, by opposing these government enforced alternatives, they are UNINTENTIONALLY benefiting people like me and you be helping prevent a stupid and nonsensical government policy
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"fighting for the rich and actually believing the oil companies are some kind of missonarie"
oil companies are no missionaries. for all I know, some of them have beaten their wives or abused their kids. who knows. But without them (and wal Mart, Comcast, Ford, Circuit City, and all the other companies and corporations), we are still stuck in the mideval times. Karl Marx advocated the same class warfare policies you advocate. remind again how that worked out?
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
I am not against corporations at all!! but i am aware that corporations must make decisions every day. and those desicions are not based on what is good or bad for the american people. they are only based on money. WHICH IS FINE . but we must be aware of that. and not delude ourselves into believeing that the companies exist to help people. if the choice is peoples livlihoods and profits ,they will choose profits. thats what a good business does.
randypagan 2 years ago
"and not delude ourselves into believeing that the companies exist to help people"
do they exist to help people? no. they exist to make a profit. but whatever their original motives, the fact is they benefit their consumers (IE, citizens like me and you). and when the government puts all these burdensome regulations on them, its me and you who suffer. I'll trust a corporation before I ever trust a congressman or senator. i'm a pragmatist like that
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"these evil companies that you chide have created more wealth then the government or any other institution could dream of"
true. as a side effect of gaining profit,they have handed out money to their workers (until many found a way to save millions by paying foreign people 1.00 an hour instead and moved out of the country first chance they got) they accidentally make your life good by making billions for themselves as long as its worth it to stay here.
randypagan 2 years ago
they aren't outsourcing cause the workers only demand 1 buck an hour. if that was the case, they would have outsourced back in the 1800's, and America wouldn't be what it is today. They are outsourcing cause of:
A. the rediculous government regulations
B. all the benefits that stupid union members demand.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"by teaching you that 50 countries cheering for a president being elected"
I don't give 2 shits what those podunk countries think. They are indeed brainless idiots or they are just plain ignorant seeing as they supported Obama. He's already the worst president in U.S history, and its only gonig to get worse from here on out. BTW, some of those countries were cheering cause they know they'll have their way with the USA now that Obama is in power.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
hes 140 days in!! LMAO!! you guys wont eve give hime time to fuck up! could you possibly be any more brainwashed? bush went around telling our allies in the middle east that the usa was on a mission from god. which basically is telling them to prepare for holy war. and these are our allies!!
werent you guys the same ones that said tha obama would be sworn in on the koran and nominated bill ayers to a cabinet post? why dont you make some more bullshit predictions nostradumbass?
randypagan 2 years ago
"you guys wont eve give hime time to fuck up! "
yeah, and in those 140 days, the unemployment rate has jumped from 7% to almost 10%, the stock market has hit rock bottom, gas prices have soared, our national security has been deeply jeopardized thanks to Obamas anti-American speeches in Europe and his pending closing of Gitmo (where EVERYONE does not want those crazies we held hostage their), and 3 trillion dollars has been needlessly wasted. Jimmy Carter is blushing right now.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
you guys are supposed to figure out a way to attribute this economic crisis to obama. you need to.keep acting like we were all eating caviar and everything was perfect and we didnt have the largest budget deficit in the history of america (after clinton left us with a surplus.) before obama took the reigns. keep that lie going......
at least we have an educated non delusional person in office. not someone so stupid he went to war because rumsfeld attached bible verses to his war advisories...
randypagan 2 years ago
"you guys are supposed to figure out a way to attribute this economic crisis to obama. "
not necessarily. Obama is responsible for making it worse then it would have been, however, the federal government writ large is responsible for getting us into the mess we are in (see the Community Reinvestment act, the tightening of Fannie Me and Freddie Mac back in the early 90's, and the FED fucking with interest rates)
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"keep acting like we were all eating caviar and everything was perfect "
there is not a single conservative or libertarian on the planet who thought the economy was all fine and dandy when Obama took office. the economy was crashing in 2008, and Bush was very much responsible for facilitating it (he didn't get us into it, but he made it worse; he was a bloody socialist in his last year of office, which was truly sad)
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"at least we have an educated non delusional person in office"
he's educated in the sense that he does well at regurgitating info he learned in class. he completely lacks in wisdom and prudence. he knows nothing about how economics works, or how foreign policy works, or what it means to be an American. he aid himself that he wants to spread the wealth, which is a value of Karl Marx, not, say, Abraham Lincoln or George Washington. he's a radical, and he's been an awful president
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"not someone so stupid he went to war because rumsfeld attached bible verses to his war advisories"
its funny how you think I'm brainwashed when you think Bush was an 1100' crusader. If Bush really wanted to lead some Christian crusade, he would have damn well started with europe, not Iraq. Bush had Americas national security in mind, not some moral crusade. the radical muslims are the moral crusaders. the oran even says so.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"If Bush really wanted to lead some Christian crusade, he would have damn well started with europe, not Iraq."
so when muslim fundimentalists attack the usa ,we should attack england or france?
Iraq was always the target for 15 years..... the opportunity wasnt there. bush connected 9/11 with iraq and we all were hurt and scared so we went along. we found that they were all lies. yellowcake,WMDs,etc all lies and nobody got fired for it. bush is a delusional megachristian and a fool easily lead
randypagan 2 years ago
"so when muslim fundimentalists attack the usa ,we should attack england or france?"
no no no. You said that Bush was leading some moral crusade, and I'm saying that if he was actually leading a moral crusade, he would have attacked Europe, as Europe is a far more "sinful" place then Iraq or anywhere else in the Middle East. Get it?
"Iraq was always the target for 15 years"
I don't deny that Bush had a motive to finish what his dad started.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
cheney and rumsfeld knew that they would have deniability after all this went down. you can find 10 different times where they both said to american in press confirences "there is NO DOUBT that there are WMDs in iraq.we have indisputable proof!!"
we trust our government to be sure. the fact that the people who lied to the predident and vice president wenent brought to justice and fired proves that rumsfeld was lying.
moments after 9/11 there were memos telling people to connect iraq to it.
randypagan 2 years ago
"you can find 10 different times where they both said to american in press confirences"
yeah, them and every other person in Congress and in the CIA and the British intelligence agencies. why can't you just accept that our intelligence was wrong? why the hell do you have to make shit up about Bush lying? Joe Wilson tried that, and it backfired in his face. Not even Obama is going after Bush, cause there's NOTHING to go after. there was no lying. no war crimes. nothing.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"wenent brought to justice and fired proves that rumsfeld was lying"
who was bought to 'justice,' and who was fired over supposedly lying about Iraq? Bush's lawyers? Cheney? CIA members not named Valerie Wilson? You are sounding delusional. I suggest you re-look at your history. Listening to Dick Durban and friends say Bush lied ad nauseam does not mean it actually happened.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
those memos are a figment of your imagination, much like the memo 'warning' Bush of 911. stick to the anthrax conspiracy. its much more enticing and intriguing.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"we found that they were all lies."
there is a difference between lying and being wrong about the anylisis your intelligence agencies gave you. Bush lied about nothing. The CIA and the British intelligence agencies told Bush and friends what they knew, and Bush acted off that info. He did not lie. he did not make stuff up. if Bush is a liar, then so is every democrat save 2 or 3, cause they all agreed with Bush and did independent anylisis themselves.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him."
randypagan 2 years ago
This passage of acripture proves that God was quite harsh, but it does not prove that Christians were ordered to lead a crusade against non-christians. read it again if you think thhere's a mandate to kill non-christians or non-isrealis in there.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"the radical muslims are the moral crusaders. the koran even says so."
the bible has just as many intolerant passages where god demands us to KILL (not convert) anyone who is not christian and take their wives as sex slaves,god demands we KILL all non believers,gays,childen who disobey,those who dont listen to preists......
god demands we attack the non christians and take them over if they dont accept our "terms" .the bible is just as vile as the koran. read it. ill give u the passage #s.
randypagan 2 years ago
"the bible has just as many intolerant passages where god demands us to KILL (not convert) anyone who is not christian"
I'm a born again Christian, and the Bible says nothing of the sort. Show me the passage where God demands we kill all non Christians and take their women You can't. it doesn't exist
For God so loved the world, that he gave his one and only son. That whoever believes in him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. you may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you" Deuteronomy 20:10-14
randypagan 2 years ago
Deuteronomy 20:10-14: This is nothing more then your classic 'war and plunder' rules which are still largely practiced today (albeit the rewards are different; back then it was cows, now its tanks and airplanes). there's no moral crusade being ordered here. this is nothing more then God laying out rules for common war. every nation since the dawn of time has practiced some form of these rules (including the USA). is it violent? yes. is it a moral cusade? no.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
dont nitpick. your holy book, that is touted as the "moral foundation of the world". and that christians are trying to get children to read in every school, is filled of the most vile shit known to man . and if you think i even barely scraped the surface as to the amount of passages in that disgusting violent incestuous leather bound criminal record of gods, you are sorely mistaken. i got 1000 more
randypagan 2 years ago
"christians are trying to get children to read in every school"
Just for the record, I'm not one of those Christians. I don't beleive public schools should be used for any religious indoctrination. I'm more libertarian then I am conservative.
" is filled of the most vile shit known to man"
alright. whatev. thats your opinion. I would contend its not based on substance, but rather irrational hatred, but trust me, you will see one day how wrong you are. Jesus loves you. (:
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"Show me the passage where God demands we kill all non Christians and take their women You can't. it doesn't exist"
2 Samuel 12:11-14
"Thus says the Lord: 'I will bring evil upon you out of your own house. I will take your wives [plural] while you live to see it, and will give them to your neighbor. He shall lie with your wives in broad daylight."
randypagan 2 years ago
2 Samuel 12:11-14: here we have a punishment which God handed to King David for sleeping with Bethsheba. there's no killing of non-christians here, and there's no taking of women. David cheated on all of them. ergo, he lost his wives. You might call that opression of women. I call it extra-marital bullshit.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
ok , so what you are saying is that random killing of innocents and the taking of wives as your sex slaves is perfectly ok for ones moral book to express as long as they arent of another religion? do you think that god is commanding them to kill other chistians that are reading the same bible? or do you think that god is basically talking about non christians WHENEVER he instructs his flock to slaughter and rape?
randypagan 2 years ago
"that random killing of innocents"
where's the random killing of innocents? we are talking about war here. there are no innocents in war, whether its 900 BC or 2000 AD.
"and the taking of wives as your sex slaves"
Again, David cheated on his wives, so therefore, they are returning the favor. 'revenge' sex is a common trait of us humans (albeit its not always right). sex slaves? Nah!
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"do you think that god is commanding them to kill other chistians that are reading the same bible?"
in a word: no
"WHENEVER he instructs his flock to slaughter and rape?"
I think God is basically saying he's a supporter of total war if and when a war breaks out between Isreal and random country. I ahve no problem with this, as I ahve no problem with total war.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
""When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house. But before she may live there, she must shave her head and pare her nails and lay aside her captive's garb. After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her,"
randypagan 2 years ago
"After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her"
your lack of reading skills are again on display. there's no taking of women in that passage. Its just your typical 'boy meets girl in foreign land, boy desires girl boy tries to win girl over, girl falls in love with boy, boy and girl live happily ever after. thee end.' I'll admit this though: the shaving of her head is a stupid order.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
I suppose this is more of your boy meetrs girl love story too huh?
"If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her."
Deuteronomy 22:28-29
I can really feel the love.
randypagan 2 years ago
Deuteronomy 22:28-29:
The NIV version which you have quoted would make it seem like a woman is forced to marry the monster who "violated" her, but that is not the case. Look at the King James translation, which is much more articulate and complex:
"If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver"
(cont)
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
(cont)
in this passage, you have a man seducing a woman to have sex with him, and the woman obliging (it doesn't say 'he' was found, it says 'they' were found, and the man didn't 'rape' her, he 'layed' with her; the NIV gives a very poor translation of this verse). So yes, I would call that passage a boy meets girl story.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children. "This is what you are to do," they said. "Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin." Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan. i have a thousand passages more of different disgusting shit. i could go all day...
randypagan 2 years ago
"So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children"
nice try. Isreal didn't start that war. they weren't leading a moral crusade, they were defending themselves. when they won, they mearly enjoyed the spoils of winning a war. the 400 virgins they took to shilo? I go back to my 'boy meets girl in foreign country' story.
Disgusting? No. I'm sorry you are so blinded and hate God so much.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
for god so loved the world he delivered a flood to kill every man woman and child in the world except for 8?
He gave his one and only son so that his son can be tortured,beaten and slowly murdered as a publicity stunt.
he demanded his son die before he would CHANGE HIS MIND!! that is what a terrorist does. God makes the rules and is all powerful, yet doesnt bear the responsibility of demanding the torture of his son before making the simple decision of forgiveness?
randypagan 2 years ago
somebody has a problem with chronological order. John 3:16 was made like 3000 years after God himself said he would never flood the world again. Indeed, God loves the world. God is love
"so that his son can be tortured,beaten"
no shit sherlock. the phrase 'beleive in him, and have eternal life' means to beleive that Jesus died on the cross for our sins, and that through him we are saved. Torture is not always a bad thing.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
the phrase 'beleive in him, and have eternal life' means to beleive that Jesus died on the cross for our sins, and that through him we are saved. Torture is not always a bad thing.
torture is a bad thing when you demand your only son to go through it and then die before you make a decision you could have made before he did. if you told your son that he had to suffer and die before you would forgive your daughter for something she did,that wouldnrt make you a psychotic maniac?
randypagan 2 years ago
"when you demand your only son to go through it"
Myself and born again Christians like me believe that if Jesus didn't go through that, we would have had to instead. In Romans 6:23 it says 'for the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Christ Jesus our lord.' I beleive that this gift would not even be possible without Jesus dying on the cross to clense us of our sins.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
" if you told your son that he had to suffer and die before you would forgive your daughter for something she did"
you are assuming that God is a typical father and that Jesus is a typical son. That is not the case. God is perfect. Jesus is perfect. the holy spirit is perfect. Only somebody perfect like Jesus could have died for the sins of humanity like he did. And BTW, God could have chosen to punish all of is individually for our sins, but Jesus took the punishment instead to spare us
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"that wouldnrt make you a psychotic maniac?"
Jesus' death on the cross for humanity sins is not a sign that our father in heavan is a physcho, but rather that he loves us so much that he decided to spare us from what we would have had to go through. Like I said: God is love
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
the Bible says nothing of the sort. Show me the passage where God demands we kill all non Christians......"
"They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13)"
randypagan 2 years ago
2 Chronicles 15:12-13:
You fail again. The Isrealites whp refused to follow God were to be killed, but that was not the case with all non Christians. So I ask you again: Show me the passage where God demands we kill all non Christians. thats what the muslim faith teaches.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
ok, i think i got it. The holy moral book only talks about god demanding the killing of those who refuse to follow god NOT non christians or athiests. ohhhhhh. you are right. there a huge difference!! here i was thinking it was a vile disgusting violent book but you showed me how wrong i was.
nitpicking symantic bullshit. you think it makes a difference that your god only demands the violent death of most non believers not ALL?
it shouldnt call for the death of ANY!!!
randypagan 2 years ago
no. thats not what I said or what God said in the Bible. God commanded the killing of Isrealites who were non christians. this is very harsh, IMO. But thats nothnig compared to the Koran, which demands the killing of all 'infidels,' no matter which nation or tribe they are from. if the christian God is Ted Bundy, Allah is Hitler.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"bush went around telling our allies in the middle east that the usa was on a mission from god"
I recall Bush going to the middle east and saying things like "we cannot negotiate with terrorists" (and sadly, Bush didn't always abide by this mantra), but he never once declared holy war. the radical Muslims have declared holy war, not Bush or the rest of America.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"werent you guys the same ones that said tha obama would be sworn in on the koran and nominated bill ayers to a cabinet post?"
no, we were not. We made plenty of jokes about him being sword in on the Koran, but we never predicted it would happen. ditto with putting Ayers in a cabinet post. Apparently you left wingers have no sense of humor either.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
that was propaganda disguised as a very lame racist joke then. designed to inform the ignorant that obama is a terrorist that can't be trusted. The idea that you guys would try to hide behind those statements that have no humor and attempt to call them jokes shows how deceitful you are or how you dont really know what a joke is.
I bet you laughed your ass off at "an american carol" which looks like it was written by karl rove and cheney themselves.
randypagan 2 years ago
"that was propaganda disguised as a very lame racist joke then."
damn, your the kind of person who does not think this joke is hilarious:
'What do black people and semen have in common?
-Only one in a million work.'
lighten the hell up. and get a sense of humor.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
'What do black people and semen have in common?
-Only one in a million work.'
that was an ok black joke. I've laughed harder at worse ones. im insanely policically incorrect, you dont know the half of it.
randypagan 2 years ago
"im insanely policically incorrect"
oh really? then why are you calling the jokes about Obama being sworn in on the Koran racist? Is it because its a joke against your boy, Obama?
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
actually, i said it wasnt a joke. it was a manipulation tool to make sure that racist ignorant sheep can be informed of the impending doom of a muslim terrorist making it into the white house.
there are plenty of racial jokes that were funny against obama the "hooped up" purple presidential limo. the clip frfom "soul plane " with the plane with spinning rims as air force one cracked me up. but telling people that obama will turn into the antichrist while being sworn in in not a joke.
randypagan 2 years ago
I read the bible cover to cover 3x times. you should try it sometime. dont just pick and choose gods word because you agree with it like you do with your news.
im surprised you dont believe that christ is too liberal to believe in.Fox news would destroy a man like jesus today. you think jesus would be hating on gays and screaming at immigrants to go home?
old testament god is the republican.
randypagan 2 years ago
"jesus would be hating on gays and screaming at immigrants to go home?"
yes and yes (see Romand 1, John 2, Matthew 23). Jesus was not a nicer then though liberal that you think he is. he's an old fashioned Christian conservative. But thats not why I beleive in him. You are to blind to understand the reasons why I beleive in him.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
I believe that everythnig in the Bible is true from a historical or moral standpoint. I don't pick and chose when it comes to the Bible. thats what a new aged beleiver does. And BTW, the only shows on Fox News that I watch are Redeye and a little bit of the O Reilly factor. I watch MSNBC way more then I watch Fox News. Listening to bullshit over and over makes me a stronger and more crisp debator.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"obama is a terrorist that can't be trusted"
i don't think obama is a terrorist, but I think he's a terrorist sympathizer, and he certainly can't be trusted.
"you are or how you dont really know what a joke is."
I got another hilarious joke for you that you probably won't laugh at:
'What did the white guy see when looking at his family tree?
-A straight line'
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"I bet you laughed your ass off at "an american carol"
actually I haven't seen the movie yet, but I'm assuming it was hilarious given the reviews that people like Mark Levin, Sean Hannity, and Glenn Beck gave it.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
you will LOVE an american corol!! it's like a non-stop propaganda reel thinly disguised as humor to gently confirm everything fox and the past administration needed rednecks to believe. with a large amount of flag waving and country music to lull the toothless morons into a frenzy.
and of course they would like it. it's dialouge reads like a transcript of their shows.
randypagan 2 years ago
i talked to alot of right wingers at the time In fact I was dating one at the time and apparently they all didnt get the joke either. everyone that i talked to were convinced that obama was getting sworn in on the koran, was best friends with bill ayers, and was a dangerous radical muslim who on inauguration day would hand out mandatory turbans to all of us or some shit. they werent jokes. they were tools to indoctrinate people too retarded to know how much they were being brainwashed.
randypagan 2 years ago
look, Im not sure about any of this "green" stuff. but I like the idea that they are being researched and worked on .rather than what we did for the past 8 years which is let a president (whose entire family is in the FUCKING OIL BUSINESS WITH SAUDI OIL COMPANIES!!!!) not explore any options other than continuing to buy oil that coincidentally makes his family richer and richer.
but im sure that there are kickbacks and shit from green companies as well.....
randypagan 2 years ago
"I like the idea that they are being researched and worked on"
you still don't get it: green alternatives like wind power and solar power are NOT viable alternatives! They are inefficient, make horibly loud noises, and are expensive as hell. ergo, nobody wants them. ergo, nobody in the private sector is investing in them. Even the pinkos in Europe know this, hence why they have never invested in green alternatives. you should not invest in something that doesn't work.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"not explore any options other than continuing to buy oil that coincidentally makes his family richer and richer."
actually, there were several times when Bush tried to get Congress to let companies drill for oil, and he himself lifted the executive ban on offshore oil drilling. You can blame the left wing idiots in Congress for the oil crisis in the middle east. Bush is blameless on that issue.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
OF COURSE BUSH WANTED THEM TO DRILL FOR OIL!! THE LONGER WE STAY DEPENDENT ON OIL ,THE MORE MONEY HIS FAMILY AND FRIENDS MAKE.
what kind of argument is that? I tell you the bushes are oil billionaires that are in bed with mid east oil companies and you tell me to counter it that bush is pro oil?
wow you really got me there!!
randypagan 2 years ago
"I tell you the bushes are oil billionaires that are in bed with mid east oil companies"
exactly. you think Bush never wanted America to stop being binded to OPEC and friends, and I was proving that that is a lie. Bush desperately wanted us to drill for oil that way we can be RELEASED of our bind to foreign oil companies. get it?
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
Thirty-one States have oil reserves. The top 5 are: Tex, with 4.9 billion barrels Alask, with 3.9 billion barrels Cal, with 3.4 billion barrels Wyo, with 706 million barrels New Mex, with 696 million barrels.
Also, there are crude oil in Federal Offshore fields: 3.7 billion barrels in the Gulf of Mexico and 441 million pacific.
The estimate life of reserves in the United States is about 12 years.
does that mean if we stopped buying we could last 12 years? or 12 at this rate?
randypagan 2 years ago
"does that mean if we stopped buying we could last 12 years? or 12 at this rate?"
nice try. but all those fancy stats you gave me are oil fields which oil companies are already allowed to drill on. There are trillions of gallons of oil in lands which are off limits to oil companies. the problem is, all these enviro-nazis are preventing the companies from drilling. you can blame environmentalism for our current energy crisis
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
ok who knows this?how do they know how much is there and wouldnt it be easy to just say that its down there to anger republicans?
when i dont know something, i research it and i admit that i dont have the data yet. dont act like i admitted i was wrong and pounce.
randypagan 2 years ago
"how do they know how much is"
you might as well deny that we can calculate the magnitude of an earthquake, or that we are 4.3 light-years from the nearest star not named the sun, or that, or that refraction can be used to perform knee surgeries which repair ruptured ACL's. You left wingers never have been and never will be keen of science (case in point: Darwinian evolution)
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
please tell me that you dont believe in evolution and believe in creation?
randypagan 2 years ago
I beleive in creation, and I know evolution is false. there. I said it. Hope you're happy.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"I beleive in creation, and I know evolution is false."
No, you don't. a two thousand year old book tells you to ignore millions of pieces of evidence and to deny everything our biology and medical knowledge is based upon. if you really did,u would stop using any medication or antibiotic right now.everytime that works it proves evolution was correct. it does prove that u dont care about facts or evidence and theres no reason to argue with people like u. i wish i would have asked u that 1st.
randypagan 2 years ago
holy fucking balls. when I say that I beleive in creation and not evolution, I'm obviously saying that I don't beleive in Darwinian evolution (IE, that we all evolved from monkeys and that everything evolved from one organism). Basic evolution (IE, when a virus mutates or when humans become less hairy over hundreds of years) is undeniably true.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"everytime that works it proves evolution was correct"
that proves that basic evolution is correct, it does nothing to prove darwinian evolution is correct
"it does prove that u dont care about facts or evidence"
on the contrary, I'm all about facts and evidence. I don't have to make shit up to justify what I beleive in like you do. I'm a straight-shooter.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
A christian that says things like "i'm all about facts and evidence " ALWAYS makes me laugh.
everything you believe was made up by people from the bronze age.
you know nothing of evolution except the lies that your moral leaders use to manipulate you. I'll never understand how you can trust people who lie in gods name and count on you not to check on them.
randypagan 2 years ago
"everything you believe was made up by people from the bronze age"
thats hyperbole if I ever saw it. The frickin National Geographic documents in their history books that Moses led the Isrealites from Egypt to Isreal, that King David and King Solomon ruled Isreal, that the Isrealities were taken into captivity into babylon, and that Jesus was a great moral leader who was executed by the romans. You can ignore the devine providence behind all these stories, but they are still true events
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
there is no proof that there was even a man named jesus anywhere. bible gospels are stories not historical record.There occurs no contemporary Roman record that shows Pontius Pilate executing a man named Jesus. there occurs not a single contemporary writing that mentions Jesus. All documents were written well after the life of the alleged Jesus from either: unknown authors, people who had never met an earthly Jesus, or from fraudulent, mythical or allegorical writings
randypagan 2 years ago
thats a nother lie. the Romans kept record of every single person they executed. Jesus Christ of Nazarath is in those records. To deny that a man named Jesus walked the earth is to deny that 2+2=4. You might not beleive Jesus was the son of God, and that he was just a prophet. thats fine. But it is a cold hard fact that Jesus Christ walked this earth. The author Luke is a first rate historian who documented Jesus life while he was on earth. you have your head too far up your ass
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
the author luke? what other writtings did he do? there is no historical proof that a "luke" existed either . just because a gosphel was attributed to a man named luke doesnt mean there is proof of he exists.
and no there is no historical evidence that a man named jesus was executed.LMAO. you are being lied to . you were taught to just accept bullshit and not ask for proof so the bullshitters have gotten more definite in their lying. they know you wont question if they sound sure.
randypagan 2 years ago
fine. whatever. ignore what every single secular history book says and dismiss it as Christian jibberish. I don't care. your hatred for us Christians and for basic facts is appaling. I'm sure you'll ignore the proof I sent you that Luke was a real person and a real historian.
go to hell
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
Do you honestly think that science feels threatened by a idiot blond who wears a cocktail dress at 7am?
as for hitler and stalin agreeing with darwins theory, they both put darwin down publicly. the actually believed in the scientist before darwin (Jean-Baptiste Chevalier de Lamarck) that put forth the idea that rabbits turned into chickens,and ducks into crocodiles
Hitler believed in god and even put "god with us" on most nazi officer belt buckles.
randypagan 2 years ago
"Do you honestly think that science feels threatened by a idiot blond who wears a cocktail dress at 7am?"
Hell no. They wouldn't be threatened by God himself if he showed his face to them. You and them are so stuck up in your delusions that its impossible for you to acknolwedge the truth.
"as for hitler and stalin agreeing with darwins theory, they both put darwin down publicly."
no they didn't. they embraced Darwin and all his theories, especially the surivial of the fittest theory.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
darwin didnt invent the "survival of the fittest theory." In fact darwin pushed more of a "slight change over millions of generations make large changes" theory.
scientists arent threatened by ideas that have been tested and failed every single test for the past 150 years. they tend to be partial to theories that have passed every test for 150 years.call that success bias if you like....
randypagan 2 years ago
"darwin didnt invent the "survival of the fittest theory."
doesn't matter. he was a staunch beleiver in that theory, whether he created it or not
"scientists arent threatened by ideas that have been tested and failed every single test for the past 150 years"
what ideas are yout alknig about? I'm not defending creationism here. creationism is faith, not science. I AM, however, arguing against the crackpot cult that is darwinian evolution.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"that put forth the idea that rabbits turned into chickens,and ducks into crocodiles"
apparently Mr Lamjarck beleived in the exact same thing Darwin beleived in and what you and Dawkins and Scott and Miller believe in. You ought to know your own religion if you;re going to defend it. Read the biology books by your own priests: they each document how species suppsoedly evolved into other species.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
Did he sneeze these out? (there are 40 i found)
"I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator."
Mein Kampf,
" I fell down on my knees and thanked Heaven from an overflowing heart for granting me the good fortune of being permitted to live at this time" Mein Kampf
"Once again the songs of the fatherland roared to the heavens along the endless marching columns, and for the last time the Lord's grace smiled on His ungrateful children."
randypagan 2 years ago
"I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator."
and thats supposed to make him a beleiver in God? all tyrants like Hitelr invoke God in order to get the masses behind them. Hitler admited personally he does not beleive in God and that he is an athiest. I know you hate this fact, but it doesn't make it any less true.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
that just proves that you have no idea what darwin said . or you just believe flat out lies youve been told and are too lazy to do ANY independant research. i dont need to believe or have faith, i educated myself out of it. dogs dont turn into cats ever. your leaders must teach you that because they know that you wont check. they are counting on your ignorance. its the reason i bailed on the church. its pure lies with no support besides other delusionals.
randypagan 2 years ago
"or you just believe flat out lies youve been told and are too lazy to do ANY independant research"
no. I took 9th grade biology just like every other American who's gone to a public highschool. I'm regurgatating what i was taught in that class. I was taught that everythingh evolved from a single organism, that humans evolved from apes, and that one specie evolved into an entirely different specie. I olove how you are trying to run from this cause you know its bullshit.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
no lamjarck believed in what you percieve darwinian evolution to be that rabbits turned into horses and crocs to ducks. big difference. darwin didnt believe that at all. its what creationist use to confuse the idiots who are stupid enough to just take them at their word.
randypagan 2 years ago
"darwin didnt believe that at all. its what creationist use to confuse the idiots who are stupid enough to just take them at their word"
lets assume for the sake of argument that Darwin DIDN'T believe that one specie evolved into another type. even then, I was taught in my 9th grade bio class that one of the key elements of evolution is one specie evolving into another. Crazy christians aren't making this up to confuse the masses.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
Thats not what you were taught in 9th grade unless you went to a christian school. Thats what you were told you were taught by the people you look to for moral guidance. they know better, but bringing you to god is more important to them than telling you the truth. A few hundred lies is nothing compared to saving your soul from damnation. to preach their "truth' they must lie over and over again.
if that was taught,there would be no branches on the evol tree. there are tens of thousands
randypagan 2 years ago
"Thats not what you were taught in 9th grade unless you went to a christian school."
yes it was. And I did not go to a Christian highschool. I went to a public highschool called Milford High, which was a mostly moderate school (with some lefties and some righties).
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"Hitler believed in god and even put "god with us" on most nazi officer belt buckles."
so if an athiest says 'god bless you,' does that mean he beleives in God? Nope.Hitler did not beleive in God or any god. He was a hardcore athiest. Read the book "The Rise and fall of the 3rd reich" and see for yourself
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
are you insane? do you honestly think an atheist building an atheist army would put a 3 world phrase with god in the title on the emblem of his representitives of his party? and all you can compare it to is saying "god bless you" after you sneeze?
read hitlers book yourself and stop just swallowing lies that your manipulaters count on you to swallow . show a little independance. hitlers book isnt anyone elses interpretation of hitler. ITS HITLERS OWN!!!
randypagan 2 years ago
" there occurs not a single contemporary writing that mentions Jesus"
try telling that to the historians which put together Americas history books. I'm assuming those historians are crazy christians? You would ahve loved the soviet union, and Stalin and Hitler would ahve loved you.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
i know most of what i know about darwinian evolution from my freshman biology class and multiple documentaries on the History Channel and Nat Geo. I've looked into evolution from a critical standpoint. I've concluded that darwinian evolution is not a matter of attacking religion, or advancing science, or anything positive and progressive. darwinian evolution is itself a religion indistinguishable in scientific credibility from scientology. it doesn't make me angry. it makes me laugh
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"darwinian evolution is itself a religion indistinguishable in scientific credibility "
There is more evidence that evolution is correct than any other scientific theory ever recorded. evolution gets tested everyday and has had 150 years of scientific test and has passed every single test. the only people who dont believe in it are not allowed to believe in it because their magical bearded man in the sky theory apparently seems more credible.
randypagan 2 years ago
"There is more evidence that evolution is correct than any other scientific theory"
no there's not. the lik sof Richard Dawkins keep on repeating this mantra and can't back it up. where's the evidence? we look liie monkeys therefore we are monkeys? you should read the science chapters in Ann Coulters book 'church of liberalism.' they completely throw evolution out of the water. Only media matters even bothered to challenge Coulters arguments, and they wrote 19 pages of lies in response
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
i can back up evolution and show you evidence in any natural history museum. watch the link. learn the truth and get angry at those who think you need to be stupid and incorrect to believe in god.
Id be pissed. I wouldnt allow my moral leaders to lie.
randypagan 2 years ago
"i can back up evolution and show you evidence in any natural history museum"
that video you gave me was an utter joke, and as fopr museams, I've been to every single museam in Washington D.C, and I saw nothing that would convince me that darwinian evolution is true (I was too busy marveling at Gods awesome creatiosn in those museams to worry about what Richard Dawkins thinks of them).
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
You sound like some snot nosed 19 year old college boy. thinks he knows everything and doesnt think he has anything left to learn.fighting for taxes he doesnt yet pay,arguing for the rights of millionaires because his father told him to.
keep closing your eyes to evidence a repeat religious dogma and lies in its place. the rationals have all the evidence and intelligence. I think I'll stick with them. you stick with the terrified cavemen throwing rocks at the moon and praying for intelligence
randypagan 2 years ago
",arguing for the rights of millionaires because his father told him to"
there's your class warfare bullshit again. I fight for the rights of millionares and all americans to keep their money. why should they have to give some to you just cause they earned more then you? you're a communist swine.
"the rationals have all the evidence and intelligence"
yes. Richard Dawkins and Eugenie scott are soooooooo intelligent! Their word is gold!
fuck them and fuck you.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
They dont have to be taken at just their "word"
Thats the amazing thing about evolution. We dont have to depend of someones word (like you do). we have millions of fossils,thousands of tests passed,everything that science,biology and medicine is based on tests it every single day. They dont ask that we believe them. they ask that we look at logic reason and evidence. YOUR leaders are asking that we just believe them and a book that was heavily edited in 325 ad by council vote.
randypagan 2 years ago
a perfect god wouldnt have to demand the torture and death of his only beloved son before he would forgive all mans sins. a perfect god wouldnt created flawed humans and then punish them for the flaws he knew would exist.
No father would would demand one of his kids suffer before he would forgive all the others. its insane and defending it is delusional.
randypagan 2 years ago
"a perfect god wouldnt have to demand the torture and death of his only beloved son before he would forgive all mans sins."
I go back to Romans 6:23-'the wages of sin is death.' this means that unless ourselves or somebody like Jesus took the punishment for our sin, it would be impossible for God to 'forgive' us of our sins, and impossible to be with him. Forgiveness never comes without bad consequences like you left wingers want to believe.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"this means that unless ourselves or somebody like Jesus took the punishment for our sin, it would be impossible for God to 'forgive' us of our sins,"
who makes that rule? who demands that? what binds god to that? what makes god so impotent that he cant change that rule?
what higher power above god forces god to demand blood and suffering to forgive? shouldnt we be praying to him. he seems to have the power.
randypagan 2 years ago
"who makes that rule?"
God himself. He says in his word that nobody who is imperfect can be in his presense. we human beings, being sinful, are imperfect. therefore, we cannot be in Gods presense. we must be perfect to be in his presense. God loves us so much that he wants us to be in heaven with him, forever. he CAN change this rule. but he doesn't out of his awesome love he has for us.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
there is no higher power above God forcing him to do anything. you are under the delusion that forgiveness requires that there not be punishment. It is not heartless or ruthless for God to punish us, his son, or for two human parents to punish their children. In the case of sin, the punishment is death. you can argue that this SHOULDN'T be the case, but with God, it is what it is. I, for one, do not have much of an issue with this, but then again, I've never been scared of blood and guts
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
1. God created us as perfect. we corrupted ourselves (see the Garden of Eden). God had nothing to do with men falling into sin
2. God did not punish us for our sins, which proves how awesome his love is.
you need to vent your hatred at the radical muslims in the middle east, or the thousands of first degree criminals like Hurricane Carter, or communist politicians like Barack Obama and Barney Frank, for those people are causing all the needless suffering, not God.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"God did not punish us for our sins, which proves how awesome his love is."
No, god decided to have his own son tortured and punsihed for them which is just a tiny bit more insane.
randypagan 2 years ago
"No father would would demand one of his kids suffer before he would forgive all the others"
you still haven't grasped the fact that somebody had to pay for humanity's sin, and the only two options are us humans or a perfect being like Jesus. God is not a sado-masochist who is hell bent on destroying everything that moves. that is a trait which belongs to Satan. You would see this if you weren't so blinded by the hate you show to him. I honestly feel sorry for you.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
NOBODY had to pay for human beings sins! God was GOD. He makes the rules,he decides what happens. you act like god couldnt make it so. like god had no power to change it. which is blasphemy. god needed a publicity stunt and served up his own son to make us all feel guilty. you can deny god had the power all you want. nobody has to die for anyones sins if god dint decide it had to be that way.
randypagan 2 years ago
you were taught at an early age that reality isnt reality and what you believe is more important than what u know. you were taught to not question what u were told and to follow blindly as long as the person confirmed what u had previously been told. Now I completely understand why u believe the crap from fox news even if there is evidence. u have been taught that faith is more concrete than evidence and that makes you as dangerous ad the 9/11 hijackers because you can be easily manipulated
randypagan 2 years ago
"you were taught at an early age that reality isnt reality"
the world is what it is. I don't try to create a utopian society like you communists do. I accept the world as it is and adapt to it, and I don't deny what my own eyes see and what my own ears here. I don't claim to have seen God, but I've put the Bible and my entire Christian beleif under the microscope before, and they've withstood the test of logic and reasoning. the athiest Lee Strobel did the same thing and became a Christian.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"you were taught to not question what u were told and to follow blindly"
As I've gotten older, I've questioned pretty much everything I know. Through this questioning, some of my bliefs and philosophies on life have changed, in ways my parents and pastor would not approve of. But my underlying, foundational Christian faith is the same now as it was when I accepted Christ into my heart back on 4/2/96. We Christians beleive questioning is a good thing, as it makes our faith that much stronger
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
"why u believe the crap from fox news even if there is evidence."
you still have yet to show me how Fox News has lied or even manipulated the truth. You keep on repeating dribble from MSNBC like it has some kind of meaning. its a logical fallacy to justify your point by repeatedly saying 'its true! its true! I said so, therefore, its true!' evidence really is a problem for you left wingers, isn't it? Jesus himself said: the truth will set you free.
Poole1Dan 2 years ago
first of all yelling "its true" is not a logical fallacy at all.i am not repeating dribble from msnbc i dont even know where to find that on my cable and i watch about an hours worth of tv a week,
there are 50 videos to the right where fox gets cought lying and manipulating the truth!! are you blind? watch them. and then talk yourself out of the lies like you do with everything else.
randypagan 2 years ago