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Obama just admitted that private companies such as FedEx and UPS work fine. In fact, they are profitable and have delivery systems that are efficient.
But in the same breath, Obama revealed that the Postal Service has problems!
If the U.S. government can't oversee the Postal Service, which delivers just packages, how can it properly handle the medical care of more than 300 million Americans? You know the answer. I know the answer. The American people know the answer.
Have you heard of the Veterans Administration? Have you ever heard of Medicare? People who get Medicare are mostly very happy with it. And Veterans get free care at VA Hospitals. Just two examples of government-run healthcare that works fine, perhaps better than the death panels (a.k.a. risk assessors) that you are likely subjected to by your private health insurer-- a company that looks out for its proft first, second, and third, and looks out for your health care last, if at all!
Look i agree things need to get better with our healthcare but we are going broke thanks to Bush and Obama i just don't get the extreme left and how they think we are going to pay for a government run healthcare option.
The government needs to take away support to terrorist countries that will use the money that we give them to plan terrorist attacks and buy the weapons that they will need to fight against us. Our government needs to take care of their own people first and then if it is in the power of their hand they can help another country. Money is foolishly wasted that could be used to help our poor citizens and children that are dying because they cannot afford to pay for their health care. (Psalm 82:3)
What we need is a hybrid system between free markets and socialism with the basic system being socialist. As long as gov employees are paid based on performance it would work. Everyone would get positive or negative rewards or even be out on the street. Get rid of the bloated insurance industry controlling healtcare! An economic system should not be rewarding someone with $100M bonuses for causing the rest of us to pay $4. gas by trading oil contracts!
The health-reform debate on Capitol Hill is skipping over the key issue: "Universal insurance" means less care for people who have coverage now -- especially the elderly.
How wonderful that these protesters bravely try to get the point across that the American people's best interests are not being represented in these meetings.
If passed, not only could the $1.5 TRILLION federal government takeover of healthcare be the last straw to bankrupt our country, but it would also: End private health insurance by herding hardworking Americans into a government-sanctioned health insurance boondoggle;
Dramatically raise taxes by counting health benefits as income, or by forcing businesses and uninsured workers to pay for officially sanctioned insurance.
Do you how much money the United States still gives to terrorist countries? This money could be used to help our own. Why would we continue to give money to other countries that use the money to pay for abortions for their own citizens and yet not provide health care for our our citizens? The government even gives tax breaks to businesses that provide jobs to other countries and takes away jobs from Americans. This is disgusting. It needs to stop and the money could be used to help our poor.
I'm not an Obama fan, his liberal agenda or a fan of his health care plan, it needs some major editing. I just know that something should be done to help poor children and their parents. I do believe that all foreign aid to terrorist countries should stop and the money used to help those in the US that really need help. Other areas could be cut as well and the that money put to good use for Americans.
Are you calling the insurance executives the experts? If you are, we have first-hand experience of their expertise on doing whatever they can to get out of paying for necessary care while we pay high premiums that go higher every time we turn around. There main concern is not that a person gets the best of care but that they get the best profit. Remember, they are a business.
@pluto4847 We have boycotted them and plan to continue to do so even if we have to pay a fine. :) True, the customer is always right, at least the customer should have a choice in the matter.
Well, let's start with the 2 Billion that went to oil drilling in Brazil. And another 6.5 Billion to ACORN...and hundreds of Billions that went to pork projects in the so called "stimulus" bill. Was it 1 Billion for Harry's bullet train from LV to LA? And how many Billion, I forget, annually goes to Hamas and Hezbollah...those are terrorists groups.
There is no money for the poor because DC fat cats appropriated Trillions in deficit spending and borrowed a few Trill from China.
And this still hasn't stopped them from giving to other countries and neglecting their own. They borrow money so they can give it to other countries. Doesn't make sense to me at all.
Right on, johnnorviaisas. Our nation was founded by sound principles. Now, and for the last 79 years, progressives (statists) like Wilson, FDR, LBJ and Carter passed massive spending/entitlement programs that have overstepped constitutional parameters. Those parameters called for LIMITED government. This "health care reform" if enacted would be the final nail in the coffin. Fleecing America must stop NOW!
This "reform" is not about HEALTH or CARE. Honest people will admit this fact.
Heres a rundown of money that the people who are blocking real reform in health care have received from the health care industry: Specter ($4,02m) Baucus ($2,8m) McConnell ($2.7m) When you take a look at Big Insurance, the non-presidential candidates who got biggest legalized bribes were the 7 senators tasked with the job of killing single-payer: Nelson ($1.1m) Baucus ($1.1m) Lieberman ($1.03m) Specter ($1.03m) Schumer ( $0.98m) McConnell ($0.93m) Grassley ($0.88m)
You'll change your tune sure enough, the day your health insurer cheats you out of cover you've, for years no doubt, been paying for. You're 40 and, from a health perspective, you're heading full steam into the danger zone. Never forget the health insurers are in it to make a profit. As for your 'great leaders', they've all got 'Cadillac care' courtesy of US taxpayers. These pigs will be the first to turn their backs and call you a loser when you get sick and go broke.
Your right Silberdachs, we received big time run around from our insurance company. They want to receive their premium payments but they sure don't want to pay and will find anyway they can to get out of it. No tear in my eye for them.
What fools! Single Payer socialist puppets. Advocating a lousy system of "healthcare". For what, overpriced bandaids? Ushering more of the typical fraud, waste & abuse...and favoritism by one already bloated central gov't. Healthcare is not a right, it is a responsibility of each individual. The original purpose of the fed is to defend the states from enemies foreign and domestic...now the enemy to our liberty controls the highest offices in gov't, the white house and Congress.
The poor you will always have among you and they should not be neglected health care because they can't responsibly afford it! Not every individual can afford it. Take away the aid to terrorist foreign countries and tax breaks to those to take American jobs overseas and our taxes can RIGHTLY be used to help the poor and NOT NEGLECT them because they are poor. What a sick in the mind society we live in to think that poor children or their parents should die of disease because they are poor.
Qedem, Our "sick in the mind society" is the best there is and ever will be.
Fairness? No society is fair, especially dictatorships like communist or sociaiist. To plunder from one to give to another is sick and immoral and in some nations that's a crime. By contrast, charity is moral, forced charity is theft. Entitlements are not a birthright. This reality does not equate to a "sickness".
Here's what is "sick":
"from each according to his ability to each according to his need"
Our Government can stop giving our tax money to terrorist countries and use the money to help our own needy people. If they did that, nothing would have to come out of your pocket book that isn't already coming out. Big Businesses get their tax breaks and guess who is forced to pay for their FINE dining and FINE hotels, the tax payer. So our taxes feed the rich. He that oppresseth the poor to increase his riches, and he that giveth to the rich, shall surely come to want (Proverbs 22:16).
Mr.President keep your promises to the people who voted you into office for Universal health Care and ending the WAR at least keep ONE of those Promises or Loose My VOTE in the Next Election period..........
he will leave grinning from ear to ear, and sell a new Book....He's set for Life, sad but true, them's the fact of life. Obamas Deceptions worked , he took the Change we can believe in and all the folding cash too, not just from us, but from my children and there children as well.
I happen to be a proponent of a single payer universal health care programI see no reason why the United States of America, the wealthiest country in the history of the world, spending 14 percent of its Gross National Product on health care cannot provide basic health insurance to everybody. And thats what Jim is talking about when he says everybody in, nobody out. A single payer health care plan, a universal health care plan. And thats what Id like to see.
Dude stop being a typical scared republican.... I don't want the government in my business any more than you do ... but with health care the current system is sucking the life out of our economy .... the single payer system will work ... it's a no brainer and it's desperately needed
Again ... I've been to Canada.... MANY MANY times... I live right on the border.... Vancouver is a second home for me..... They LOVE THERE system over there.... WTF ... dont believe the hype... no system is perfect but Canadians are scared shitless of our system ... there number one concern coming to the USA is " what if I get sick " what does that tell you .....
That's highly exaggerated ... I think you need to check the stat of how many Americans go to Canada for treatment..... a buddy of mine went to Vancouver to have surgery to cure his sleep apnea .... paid out of his pocket because he has no insurance ... a quarter of the price he was quoted in the USA..... with about 50 million Americans with no health insurance ....MORE Americans are going to Canada than you realize....
And what about the 10 to 13 million that don't want Health Insurance and what about the 10 million illegal people in this country i take it you would want them insured also?
Your 50 million number is so inflated by the left i'm sure it's more like 20 million still alot thats why i do agree with making health care more afordable and more user friendly.
But please no radical single payer it is such a failed system.
You do realize were in a recession and people are losing there jobs left and right in this country .. so both of us can only guess the true number of uninsured at this point ... I"m sure it's MUCH higher over the last year ..... and we both agree costs need to be lowered.... we need to make this a relationship between patients and doctors.... insurance companies are the middle man .... we can eliminate the middle man .... that would lower costs ....
Come you need to understand that insurance companies are going nowhere it's a pipedream the insurance lobby is the 3rd largest in the country they won't go away face the facts.
They need to work with congress to lower cost and give people with health conditions that are out of work to get afordable plans.
47 million Aug 2007, US Government censuses so add almost 4 million more for those who have lost there jobs...... most were a family of 4....so 51 million is the current low ball and there are some numbers out that claim 60 million US Citizens don't have any form of Healthcare. ask 100 people and count the ratio, then do the math for over 330 million...about 18 out of 100.
N/A , we already have a Single Payer System, your just not old enough to Qualify....Medicare and Medicaid are single payer systems already being ran by the Government because the "for Profit System" Healthcare Limiting Private Corporations don't want to cover your ass when you really need it...As fare as Taxes, who do you think is picking up the tab on the uninsured right now? We are, the property Tax payers are being charged to pay the Bills at your Local County Hospitals and Health clinics.
And it will get alot worse if you socialists get you're way.
Socialism does not work never has never will.
The free market is the only way i hope you wake up from you're fantasy world some day i did i was at once a Democrat a moderate one that never fit in with the socialist democrats that are trying to destroy America.
Ron Paul is one of the only few that make sense in DC anymore.
socialism has never worked? what a joke... the resounding success of neocapitalism free markets can be seen the world over: financial collapse and not to mention the poverty and misery it has caused the 3rd world.
Yes communism doesn't work but that is NOT the same as socialism which has successful examples in places like Sweden and is looking promising in Latin America. To tar communism and socialism with the same brush smacks of cold war hysteria...
Do you think there is a chance that the insurance industry could be lying to us so they can keep the money rolling in? If youre making billions wouldnt you lie and cheat to keep it?
I agree with you, communism doesn't work. We are not for socialilzed medicine; we are for socialized insurance.
Socialized police, socialized fire department, socialized military; I'm glad we have this little bit of communism. I hope police come if I am perpetrated by a criminal. I hope fire dept comes if my house catches fire.
it is now 50 million and 20,000 will DIE this yr and One Million More WHO Have Health Care because they dont KNOW their health Care TOPS OUT ..said the World health Org.
Single pay health care will make things worse by reducing competition increasing red tape and exacerbating inefficiencies.We need to make health care more afordable not take it over the cliff.
reducing competition ?? this is not a product ... this is health care.... I agree with that philosophy when it comes to selling products... BUT I dont agree with it when it comes to health care.... when your sick your sick dude... you need help... it should not be about profit .... competition has done NOTHING to reduce costs over the years.... it's increased costs because hospitals charge whatever the #$%^@# they want .... insurance companies deny care to save money ... this is a mess dude
I agree the system needs to be cleaned up but you will never got rid of the insurance companies they are far to huge and they provide alot of good paying jobs.
They say in Pa alone we would lose at least half a million jobs that sucks.
I think a single payer system is far to extreme for America sorry.
Plus i think most moderate people either R or D don't want it i just think it is a very bad idea.
More government scars the hell out of most common people.
Single payer will not make those jobs go away. Medicare is administered by people. People with experience are the most likely to get those jobs. Jobs aren't going to just disappear into thin air because the payment system changes to run by the people rather than run by special interest getting rich off sick people! Put some thought into your rhetoric, sheesh!
The problems you've listed are what we have in excess with the private system right now, not with Medicare at all! Medicare seems to run fine without those problems...that is, except when Republicans give it away to private interests, such as they did with part D. I bet you will claim your medicare when you are 67!
johnnoirvausas, I have worked in hospitals for 20 years and we are drowning in red tape and inefficiencies. We have hundreds of people on the payroll whose only job is to try to bill the insurance companies successfully so we can get reimbursed for the services we have already given. It's madness.
Expand Medicare to all United States citizens! Medicare for years has no questions asked approved life saving procedures where private insurance companies have denied (just like they tried to deny Katrina victims...& lost). Medicare saves lives, private insurance companies to date have had the power to end lives
The majority of American's won't want a single payer plan if they understand it's rationed garbage insurance that will kill you because you will have to wait for the governmet to tell you when you can get surgery.
Take an open minded look at health care in Canada and ask a Canadian how much there taxes are you will find out that single payer is not worth it!
Thats BS .... the government wont decide.... DOCTORS WILL.... why is that so hard for you to figure out.... you GO to a doctor and you get treatment... PERIOD ... the payment is from the government like medicare NOT DECIDED by the government.....
If the government runs it people will wish for the days of insurance companies the government will f it up like they do most everything else then our taxes will sky rocket like in the UK.
No thanks i'm for less government not having another huge branch of government.
Obama is wasting money like Bush did we own the auto companies now we will run a health care system come on wake up.
NO .... SINGLE PAYER system .... YOU choose your doctor.... not the government .... YOU choose your hospital NOT the government ... YOU and your doctor decide your treatment NOT the government .... I suppose you would rather have some person in a booth in India decide if your treatment will be covered or not ? some person in a cubical deciding how to save the company $ because your not a profit to them if your treatment is carried out... common man ... wake up ... before you see first hand...
Funkyflights, you are wasting your time trying to explain health care to Johnnorvaisas. Canada's health care system is not failing it is working just fine. The Republicans have brain washed some of the people so much that they can't even give an ear to the truth of the facts. People, PLEASE seek your our facts on a subject before you make the wrong decision and oppose Obama's fight for health care for the nation.
Corporations determine public policy. Profiteers decide who will get elected & then - surprise! - legislators are in the corporate pocket. This week Baucus voted against limits on credit card interest and ordered the arrest of 11 doctors & health care reformers representing 60%+ majority opinion he refuses to acknowledge. Baucus, as a corporate-dependent legislator likes power more than fairness. They say: "Let the middle class pay the health care piper. Ive got mine for free from taxpayers!
I had BCBS for 17 yrs @$7500 I used it one time and was told they willnever cover feamle cancer in me again I was ON MY OWN ! I am on my own since 1997 Human services is for illegal's and women / children ONLY !
This video clearly shows that the Democratic Party doesn't care what the majority of Americans think and that when you disturb insurance companies' spotlight, you get arrested. To Hell with the Democrats, to Hell with the Republicans! To win the change we want, we need to be independent and critical of both corporate parties.
10 yrs ago I worked in the Hepatology Dept. @ U Hospital in Denver. People on medicare or medicaid were automatically approved for transpants...people with "private" insurance"- it was a toss up whether they were approved or not (even though they needed transplants to live). We watched people die because of douchbag insurance companies. Kudos to these doctors
Wait...arrested?!!!! WHAT THE FUCK FOR??? TALKING?! YOU CAN'T ARREST SOMEONE FOR TALKING!!! I understand having them escorted out- but arrested?! What were the charges??? WHAT THE FUCK?!
Wait...arrested?!!!! WHAT THE FUCK FOR??? TALKING?! YOU CAN'T ARREST SOMEONE FOR TALKING!!! I understand having them escorted out- but arrested?! WHAT THE FUCK?!
Wait...arrested?!!!! WHAT THE FUCK FOR??? TALKING?! YOU CAN'T ARREST SOMEONE FOR TALKING!!! I understand having them escorted out- but arrested?! WHAT THE FUCK?!
As i said before, stop regurgitating studies you are copy and pasting from phnp. Come up with some of your own thoughts and ideas and quit trying to make it seem like you are some guru on the issue.
I could copy and paste studies and atricles and throw out fancy titles until I turn blue in the face. I am not wasting any more of my time with you. When you start thinking for yourself let me know.
Excuse me but just because I happen to agree with PNHP does not mean I don't get info other places. I have not copy pasted ONE thing from their site. I provided you with many sources besides them as well. You are just having a hard time dealing with the facts and because you have yourself in a corner are resorting to this old tactic of name calling and diversion. Look, I got back to you and answered every question and comment of yours. Now you want to quit because you have no response.
Once again, Gratzer is not my man. People like you really do make me sick to my stomach. If you hate the way things are done in the United States so much-leave! If you feel the governemnt can do things better go to somewhere like Canada or the UK.
I work full time, pay my taxes, pay my insurance premiums and am completely satisfied with the healthcare I receive.
Really? I make you sick because I see a REAL problem? You don't agree tha our healthcare system is failing? Wow. Trying to fix a problem makes you sick? If your roof is leaking and your wife wants to fix it, do you tell her she makes you sick and that she should move? Your thinking is absurd. People like you make the entire country sick because they can't get healthcare.
Give me a break. I conceded the fact that the current system is broken and in need of serious reform in one of my first posts. What makes me sick to my stomach is that you are so narrow minded and full of yourself that you have shut out any options other than SP.
NO. I am very open minded and I have thought through and studied all the options. I read everything and have followed this issue for YEARS. I didn't come around to SP overnight. I just can't find one that is viable except for SP. And when I get into debates like this one, with know it alls like you, you make the argument for SP even stronger. I have explained why your suggestions don't work and backed it up with solid arguments and research. the same can't be said for you, obviously.
YOu provide me a list of how private insurance companies add value to our healthcare system. Name one thing they do to contribute to healthcare. Name one. I am listening.
Nobel prize winning economist Kenneth Arrow published an article, Uncertainty and the Welfare Economics of Medical Care, The American Economic Review, Vol 53, No. 5, December 1963, and a more recent book by Professor Thomas Rice, The Economics of Health Reconsidered, both show the absurdity of applying market models to health care. Does he make you sick, too? Do the over 65% of Americans who want change and who support a national healthcare plan make you sick? Give me a break.
Fucking Prick, Glad you can afford it what about your mom. what about all the moms who can't. What about the young adults just starting out without the family to provide it for them. The ones working three jobs to pay for college trying to make it but can't afford health care. a good hard working, tax paying young adult? how about the children falling the through the cracks once they reach 18. Why we are suppose to be the greatest nation on earth have such cracks.
go to michaelrachlis . com and download his book, "Prescription for Excellence." He draws on examples from Canada, U.S. England, Denmark, etc. where timely access and quality have been achieved by a combination of various approaches that did not require additional personnel or costs, just smarter use of them. If one wants example of just shortening wait times, go to his publications, scroll down to article, "Public Solutions to Waiting Lists."
The next thing your going to tell me is that Kennedy was assasinated by the mob, we never landed on the moon, the Pentagon was really hit by a Tomahawk missle ect......
You don't have a seat at the health reform table because anyone with half a brain knows it would be a terrible solution to the problem. Have you ever thought about that possiblity?
Funny, too, that your guy Gratzer's hero is Milton Friedman. Friedman described Austrian Economist FA Hayek - considered one of the founding giants of free-market economics - as his inspiration. FYI: Hayek was a supporter of National Health Care! He recognized that there exist public goods, goods & services, that markets do not apply to, that trying to fit into a market model only result in market failure & reduced societal welfare. Do your homework and read Hayeks "The Road to Serfdom."
Single-payer, by using economies of scale, simplified administration makes including everyone the only viable way to get cost-effective quality care. By emphases on preventive medicine, better maintenance of chronic conditions, we save on more expensive care which is often too late, and attain a healthier and more productive citizenry. It is cheaper to go to your family doctor a few extra times and nip something in the bud than wait.
According to the Kaiser Family Foundation, "the cost of private health insurance administrative expenses per enrollee has been rising at an increasing rate, from $85 in 1986 to $421 in 2003. The most rapid growth occurred in the 4-year period from 1987 to 1990, when these administrative costs rose 125%. For the six-year period from 1998 to 2003, administrative costs per enrollee nearly doubled (+95%)."
to make more clear below, a single Payer system (SP) can effectively negotiate for lower drug costs, medical equipment, etc. We can't do any of this now. Our system is too fragmented to manage.
Negotiate lower costs, right, kind of like how Medicare currently negotiates lower costs. As you know, Medicare has the ability to set it's payment rates by law, no negotation required. Don't insinuate that a SP would negotiate on costs. They would dictate costs.
Yes, SP would have the power to do so, in the same way the SP system does in Canada. That is why drug prices in Canada are lower than they are here even with insurance benefits. Medicare Part D was pushed by the drug companies here to prevent Medicare from negotiating lower prices. And seniors lost.
And before you start with the R&D claim, read this paper: "Rx R&D Myths: The Case Against the Drug Industry's R&D 'Scare Card' (citizen . org / documents / ACFDC . pdf - just remove the spaces). Every independent study that's ever looked at the sources of medical innovation has concluded that research funded by the public sector--not the private sector--is chiefly responsible for a majority of the medically significant advances that have led to new treatments of disease.
Having access to good medical care will also increase productivity and reduce risks from infectious diseases left untreated. In addition, a single-payer system with one database will help uncover which medical interventions work and which don't, currently estimated that over 30% of all medical treatments either just worthless or actually harm us.
First of all I never said the Massachusetts Connector was a single payer system. I know exactly what it is and you described in correctly. I was using it as an example to show the problems that arise when you have a large, previously uninsured population become insured in a short amount of time.
Having access to good medical care will not increase under this scenario. That is what I was pointing out regarding the problems Massachusetts is having.
ACCESS and COST are the two cirital problems that are occuring with the large influx of newly insured to the system.
A single payer system would face the same problems. If you insure 47 million people overnight the first thing they are going to do is seek health care. We do not have the worforce to treat the current population of insured individuals. How are these people going to be accomadated by an already overextended system? How do you propose we finance this initiative?
Again, when you remove the insurance middlemen and save all the dollars currently wasted on outlandish CEO salaries, adminstrative costs, advertising, etc. you save 350 BILLION which can be redirected to cover the uninsured. Tax payers already pay over 60% of all the health care costs in this country. Insurance middlemen suck out over 1/3 of the current dollars and we are not able to negotiate w/o SP. Without raising taxes (or very little) we can do it.
Where do you get this 350 Billion figure? Was this study done by the GAO or CBO? I'll agree with you on salaries and advertising although I find it hard to squeeze that much savings from the two. Regarding adminitrative costs I will point directly back to my fraud numbers. Private Insurance companies, because they operate on a for profit basis, have an incentive to use resources to combat fradulent activities.
Have you ever considered that low administrative costs might some how coorelate to Medicare and Medicaid wasting 60 billion a year?
You still have not addressed the Access issue. Which is the root of the problem. How do you plan on accomdating the uninsured once they become covered?
Are we going to magically train tens of thousands of health care workers overnight? They will end up in the ER because they wont be able to access a Dr. Which is the same place they went when uninsured
And keep in mind that those people who currently clog ER rooms seeking basic, primary care, would be able to access early and preventative care which prevents the need for more expensive care for untreated disease. Other countries provide care for ALL citizens. Are you saying the U.S. can't do it? Sure, we can't do it overnight but we better get started NOW if we are to succeed.
Again, you just don't get it. The REASON the MA plan failed was because IT IS NOT SINGLE PAYER. They didn't address THE PROBLEM, which is the hundreds of PRIVATE insurance companies. YOu can't control costs and feed the beast at the same time. Single payer SAVES money and COVERS EVERYONE.
If you now admit that the MA plan is not single payer, then why are you bringing it up on this thread if not to confuse? How is it an example of single payer? It's not and that is why it didnt' work and WHY the activists are protesting. The MA plan is a joke. we know that. So, obviously you must agree that single payer is the way to go.
Would you support opening up the FEHBP to our current uninsured population? Let's allow all of them to sign up and receive the same benefits Federal Employees currently have access to. They would not be excluded based on pre-existing conditions and would enjoy the same plan premiums. What do you think about this option?
I support SINGLE PAYER - IMPROVED MEDICARE FOR ALL. that means EVERYONE IN, NO BODY OUT. Covered from birth to death. Not tied to employment so people can be free to move between jobs without fear. You didn't answer my question. do you think that the U.S. is not capable of covering all of its citizens like they do for 1/2 the cost in other countries? Are we too stupid to stop the insurance industry from ripping us off and controlling our healthcare?
You have not addressed the main problems I have suggested regarding a SP system.
WORKFORCE/ACCESS--we do not have the man power or infrastructure to accommodate 47 million uninsured, period. Secondly, doctors are declining to see new Medicare/Medicaid patients everyday. Why? Because government set reimbursement often does not cover the costs of doing business. What makes you think these doctors will suddenly have a change of heart and decide to start seeing patients?
I made the suggestions of opening the FEHBP to all of the currently uninsured. The uninsured would be able to buy into the program and receive the exact same benefits regardless of health or employment status. You say no to covering everyone because it is done in a private for profit market? Where is the sense in that if your goal is to have accessible healthcare for all?
FINANCE- Medicare's own board of trustees has said flat out the program will be broke by 2019. This is coming from the government officials who oversee the program. We simply do not have enough workers paying into the system to support the amount of beneficiaries who received care.
Please reference a reputable study, such as one done by the GAO or CBO who score savings and costs for the government, that shows you will save 350 billion dollars in your previously mentioned cost savers.
The US could save enough on administrative costs more than $350 billion annually with a single-payer system to cover all of the uninsured. SOURCE: Woolhandler, et al Costs of Health Administration in the U.S. and Canada, New England Journal of Medicine 349(8) Sept. 21, 2003 and Proposal of the Physicians Working Group for Single-Payer National Health Insurance, Journal of the American Medical Association 290(6): Aug 30, 2003
Just posted GAO/CBO studies &others but, whether the savings would be $350 billion or less or more is only part of the puzzle. The fragmentation caused by our system, the wasted time that doctors spend negotiating with umpteen plans, that a family doctor instead of having a working relationship with a handful of specialist must refer patients to different specialists based on which ones included in the patients health plans network, all this wastes time and reducing the coordination of care.
I think we need to agree to disagree at this point. I don't need to listen you regurgitate information you lifted off pnhp. I could just as easily go to a website like freemarkertcure and copy and paste rebuttals to all of your arguments.
Your living in a fantasy land to think that we can take a system that is in place on such a massive scale and throw it out the window and replace it with SP. I can't even begin to fathom the Bureaucracy that would be tasked just implement SP.
if you get your info from David Gratzer's site, I see why you are so misinformed! Gratzer is a senior fellow for the Manhattan Institute, the one that worked on behalf of tobacco companies to put out false & misleading "studies" on tobacco. Manhattan Institute gets its funding from known financiers of neo-conservatism - big money men, corps and big business including the insurance industry, big pharma & Wall Street. Yeah, those free market guys who recently robbed tax payers of billions.
I didn't get any of my information from his site. I only mentioned it to make the point that anyone can go to any number of websites and see arguements and rebuttals for both sides.
Can we please end this and stop wasting both of out time?
"Broke" is a loaded word. The projected costs show a shortfall. Based on current projections the amount going into the Medicare fund will not meet the projected outlays, initially by a few percentage points. This is the same misuse of labels with Social Security, claiming it is facing bankruptcy. I need to continue this reply in 2 more comments.
I'll just use some ballpark numbers to illustrate. Medicare does pay less than private insurance companies, both to hospitals and doctors. Let's use 25% as the amount of waste going to our fragmented for-profit system, e.g. additional staff for billing, negotiating, etc. in hospitals and insurance companies bureaucracies and profits. If Medicare pays 10% less, then it is still subsidizing the waste by 15%.
In a single-payer system, the savings will allow paying less while still doctors and hospitals will do all right. Years ago there was an article comparing solo family practitioners in U.S. and Canada. American doctors gross incomes were double that of their Canadian counterparts. However, American doctor's net income was only 30% higher. Major difference was American doctor had to pay collection agencies for non-paid, staff for billing and arguing with insurance companies, etc.
If we abolish Medicare because it is going "broke," most senior citizens will not be able to afford private coverage. They will end up clogging our already overburdened emergency rooms, burdening families with care for sick parents who might have enjoyed additional healthy years, etc. In the end it will cost us more.
Where is your sense in providing people the option to buy PRIVATE insurance that is unaffordable and whose incentive is to deny care for profit? Insurance is NOT healthcare. and how do you save money if you don't remove the biggest waste? You keep forgetting that private insurance wastes over 1/3 of our healthcare dollars. the adminitrative costs for private insurance between 25% and 50% as compared to 2-3% for traditional Medicare.
Private insurance through the FEHBP seems to be quite affordable to the 10's of thousands of individuals who are currently insured by it and are satisfied with their coverage.
You are familiar with CBO and GAO correct? They are the standard when it comes to predicting realized savings. I'm patiently waiting.
50% for administrative costs in the private sector, get real.
How exactly is printing a government insurance card for 47 million people providing them health care?
Administrative cost are the difference between what an insurance company collects from enrollees in premiums and what it pays for their health service claims. It includes claims processing, underwriting, marketing, utilization review, building up reserves, general management, SALARIES and PROFIT PAID TO SHARE HOLDERS. And yes, often shown as a % of the premium, ranges from 5% to 50% or more.
There have been dozens of analyses carried out by various well-known groups like Lewin who have all arrived at the same conclusion. Earlier studies of administrative costs and savings can be gleaned from: CBO - H.R. 1200, American Health Security Act of 1993, 12- 16-1993
GAO/HRD-91-90 - Canadian Health Insurance: Lessons for the United States, June 1991
Steffie Woolhandler et al, Costs of Health Care Administration in the United States and Canada, New England Journal of Medicine, 2003, Volume 349, pages 768-775
The Lewin Group, The Healthcare for All Californians Act: Cost and Economic Impact Analysis, January 19, 2005.
Re: Private insurance through the FEHBP: There would still be wasted administrative costs and difficulty in a fragmented system to improve healthcare. Rather than simplifying things and costs, it makes it more costly. We would need an additional bureaucracy to decide how much to subsidize those with lower income or unemployed. And currently most, except the high end plans, LIMIT choice of physicians.
To maintain our private fragmented for-profit system one has to come up with a rationale to justify their existence, besides creating huge incomes for some. There is no credible evidence private insurance companies add anything to the quality of the health care we receive. Even if we could regulate private companies to keep costs down, to stop cherry picking, they would still create a fragmented system where doctors and hospitals had to deal with the multiple companies, etc.
We have more than enough medical personnel to cover those who are un and underinsured with adequate time for visits and additional visits. Nurses working for insurance companies will go back to actually caring for patients. Doctors will spend less time fighting and negotiating with umpteen insurance companies. But we still need to get smart on how we use health care. We need team approaches, more use of Nurse Practitioners and Physician Assistants, Electronic Databases, etc.
Doctors want single payer because they want to negotiate fair prices and save the hassles of hiring an entire staff to do battle for every dime. When you remove the insurance companies and fund Medicare, we have the money. when all patients are covered under the same plan, doctors are not going to turn away patients. You don't even make sense. PLEASE check out the FAQ section of pnhp . org before you comment back. THESE ARE DOCTORS begging for single payer.
What about every other doctor in the United States who doesn't support a single payer system? Are these doctors some how less intelligent? There are plenty of doctors who strongly oppose SP, let me guess...they are in bed with the insurance companies. This argument holds now water.
Please address the workforce issues you seem to dodge every time i've mentioned it
Regarding the workforce. HR 676 and other single-payer bills allow funds for re-training workers in the health insurance industry. As already mentioned, nurses would actually do nursing. We need teachers, etc. There are lots of jobs that are needed that actually will contribute to the overall welfare of our society rather than just paperwork that makes getting health care more fragmented and difficult.
you removed your comment explaining that you meant Medicare Advantage, not the MA state plan. Well, I guess you figured out on your own that Medicare Advantage is not traditional medicare but PRIVATE INSURANCE companies. And they are the ones responsible for the all the recent FRAUD. We need to get rid of these crooks. Single Payer is the way to go.
With single-payer the administrative costs will go to actual health care. Doctors will spend more time in patient care than fighting with insurance companies. Monies will be saved by more preventive medicine and public health as well as better treatment of chronic conditions rather than paying for expensive treatments for conditions that could have been avoided.
Pathetic. No wonder these folks weren't invited to be part of it, they are not advocates for "health care reform" but advocates for their particular and limited form of health care reform. Have they convinced me of the merit of their cause? Quite the opposite, they seem to be a very narrow minded group who thinks everyone should only see it their way.
What do you do when you have tried every normal way to be heard and included and they simply ignore you? Why don't you watch the videos and hear the remarks from these people - many of them respected doctors before you judge.
And FYI: It is not unreasonable to expect, as PNHP . org (doctors) and the CA Nurses did, to be a serious part of the discussion on health care reform. These groups rep the views of the majority of Americans & that they have been excluded is a travesty.
If anyone doesn't understand that the US is not a democracy but a corpratocracy - a country run by the corporations that don't give a damn for the American people but only for profits - then they don't know what American has become.
It doesn't matter which party is in power. They will vote the way the corporations tell them. It is time for public financing of elections and an end to lobbying. It is time for Americans to stand up and scream "We're mad as hell & we won't take it any more."
You can't end lobbying. Its about the only way to reach oppoliticians living in ivory towers.
Nor will public finiancing of elections make one iota of difference.
What would really cut the ground from under the current system is for the end to the party system and an end to campaign contributions by anyone other than individuals and only then below a certain amount. Only problem is to get these measures through you will need a gun.
Bravo! Obama USED TO SUPPORT SINGLE PAYER UNTIL HE CAME TO WASHINGTON and presumably, met the Insurance and Pharmaceutical Lobbies who "make a killing" off the current Healthcare for Profit scam.
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bigdogphoto 1 year ago
BRAVO!!!! These activists are doing what we ALL should be doing - DEMANDING WHAT IS DUE TO US NOW!!!!
alanbounville 1 year ago
Just look up baucus drunk on youtube and see his true colors. He is a drunkin liar.
scotmanable 2 years ago
Max Baucus is a fool, how the hell did he get into office?? He will tear Montana apart !!
hakunamakarla 2 years ago 2
yeah well i was just waiting for the good doc to throw a shoe, lol!
Isawanangel1X 2 years ago
Don't taze me bro....
We should have Baucus arrested for be a traitor.
There was no need to cuff those courageous citizens.
cri8tor 2 years ago 3
Baucus is a soulless political whore bought and paid for by big insurance and healthcare corporations. TERMS LIMITS NOW
TheAerialbomb 2 years ago 3
thank god for youtube which allows stuff like this to be broadcast to a worldwide audience. you won't see this often on the news or print.
ddean1987 2 years ago 2
Baucus is total scum and has been in the pockets of the insurance companies during his whole term. I wish he'd switch parties!
beatnikjd 2 years ago
they are so proud for demanding they people are not heard. this is not a meeting but a speech.
Sheeple102 2 years ago
Obama just admitted that private companies such as FedEx and UPS work fine. In fact, they are profitable and have delivery systems that are efficient.
But in the same breath, Obama revealed that the Postal Service has problems!
If the U.S. government can't oversee the Postal Service, which delivers just packages, how can it properly handle the medical care of more than 300 million Americans? You know the answer. I know the answer. The American people know the answer.
It can't.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Have you heard of the Veterans Administration? Have you ever heard of Medicare? People who get Medicare are mostly very happy with it. And Veterans get free care at VA Hospitals. Just two examples of government-run healthcare that works fine, perhaps better than the death panels (a.k.a. risk assessors) that you are likely subjected to by your private health insurer-- a company that looks out for its proft first, second, and third, and looks out for your health care last, if at all!
himanv 2 years ago
Look i agree things need to get better with our healthcare but we are going broke thanks to Bush and Obama i just don't get the extreme left and how they think we are going to pay for a government run healthcare option.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
The government needs to take away support to terrorist countries that will use the money that we give them to plan terrorist attacks and buy the weapons that they will need to fight against us. Our government needs to take care of their own people first and then if it is in the power of their hand they can help another country. Money is foolishly wasted that could be used to help our poor citizens and children that are dying because they cannot afford to pay for their health care. (Psalm 82:3)
Qedem1611 2 years ago
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WWWoDMOCRATSoORG 2 years ago
What we need is a hybrid system between free markets and socialism with the basic system being socialist. As long as gov employees are paid based on performance it would work. Everyone would get positive or negative rewards or even be out on the street. Get rid of the bloated insurance industry controlling healtcare! An economic system should not be rewarding someone with $100M bonuses for causing the rest of us to pay $4. gas by trading oil contracts!
discountbrains 2 years ago
The health-reform debate on Capitol Hill is skipping over the key issue: "Universal insurance" means less care for people who have coverage now -- especially the elderly.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Bastards! How Dare You Disrupt Those Millionaires!
clapzilla 2 years ago 3
The people are demanding bread and a circus...
Shoelessx2z 2 years ago
How wonderful that these protesters bravely try to get the point across that the American people's best interests are not being represented in these meetings.
sophiemarie49 2 years ago 12
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Wow those people look stupid getting cuffed all for garbage single payer health care thank god Max has a clue about health care.
The radical socialists single payer people should never get a seat at the table we are a great capitalist country not a radical one like Cuba.
HELL NO TO A PUBLIC OPTION!
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Well they helped us get medicare part D and that is working great thanks to private insurance companies running it!
I love you're thinking we are 60th you're so blinded by MORONS like Mike Moore it makes me sick!
Medicare is going broke thanks to it being government run part D is working thanks to private insurance companies running it.
And thats a real fact not you liberal make up 60th crap!
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Please stop with you're liberal socialist dribble you people make me sick!
We need to make it better but not take it over the cliff with you're FAILED single payer crap insurance!
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
yo I'm gonna vote Republican just to get bring the death of this country to a reality once and for all who's with me?
Joe402 2 years ago
they get taken away to the gas chamber...
sexydorkmo 2 years ago
If passed, not only could the $1.5 TRILLION federal government takeover of healthcare be the last straw to bankrupt our country, but it would also: End private health insurance by herding hardworking Americans into a government-sanctioned health insurance boondoggle;
Dramatically raise taxes by counting health benefits as income, or by forcing businesses and uninsured workers to pay for officially sanctioned insurance.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Do you how much money the United States still gives to terrorist countries? This money could be used to help our own. Why would we continue to give money to other countries that use the money to pay for abortions for their own citizens and yet not provide health care for our our citizens? The government even gives tax breaks to businesses that provide jobs to other countries and takes away jobs from Americans. This is disgusting. It needs to stop and the money could be used to help our poor.
Qedem1611 2 years ago
Wow you are right in some ways but a government run health care system will destroy us.
Obama has done so much harm to us already we the majority can't take it.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
I'm not an Obama fan, his liberal agenda or a fan of his health care plan, it needs some major editing. I just know that something should be done to help poor children and their parents. I do believe that all foreign aid to terrorist countries should stop and the money used to help those in the US that really need help. Other areas could be cut as well and the that money put to good use for Americans.
Qedem1611 2 years ago
I agree with you but i don't want to end up like Canada or the UK with a rationed garbage health care system in America.
The government already runs medicare and medicaid and it is going broke because it is very poorly run.
Let the experts run health care not the government that's all i'm saying.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Are you calling the insurance executives the experts? If you are, we have first-hand experience of their expertise on doing whatever they can to get out of paying for necessary care while we pay high premiums that go higher every time we turn around. There main concern is not that a person gets the best of care but that they get the best profit. Remember, they are a business.
Qedem1611 2 years ago 2
@Qedem1611
Well if we boycott the Insurance companies, all of us, they should be begging us to reconsider.
I mean whatever happened to the Customer is always right?
Isn't the cystomer the boss?
pluto4847 1 year ago
@pluto4847 We have boycotted them and plan to continue to do so even if we have to pay a fine. :) True, the customer is always right, at least the customer should have a choice in the matter.
Qedem1611 1 year ago
Well, let's start with the 2 Billion that went to oil drilling in Brazil. And another 6.5 Billion to ACORN...and hundreds of Billions that went to pork projects in the so called "stimulus" bill. Was it 1 Billion for Harry's bullet train from LV to LA? And how many Billion, I forget, annually goes to Hamas and Hezbollah...those are terrorists groups.
There is no money for the poor because DC fat cats appropriated Trillions in deficit spending and borrowed a few Trill from China.
VideoSeattle 2 years ago
And this still hasn't stopped them from giving to other countries and neglecting their own. They borrow money so they can give it to other countries. Doesn't make sense to me at all.
Qedem1611 2 years ago 2
Right on, johnnorviaisas. Our nation was founded by sound principles. Now, and for the last 79 years, progressives (statists) like Wilson, FDR, LBJ and Carter passed massive spending/entitlement programs that have overstepped constitutional parameters. Those parameters called for LIMITED government. This "health care reform" if enacted would be the final nail in the coffin. Fleecing America must stop NOW!
This "reform" is not about HEALTH or CARE. Honest people will admit this fact.
VideoSeattle 2 years ago
I know that for America there will always be a bright dawn ahead.
Ronald Reagan
If only Ronald Reagan knew we would have a socialist running America he would have never said that.
These are very dark days for America!
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Silberdachs 2 years ago 2
Thank god we have these great leaders hell no to single payer!
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
You'll change your tune sure enough, the day your health insurer cheats you out of cover you've, for years no doubt, been paying for. You're 40 and, from a health perspective, you're heading full steam into the danger zone. Never forget the health insurers are in it to make a profit. As for your 'great leaders', they've all got 'Cadillac care' courtesy of US taxpayers. These pigs will be the first to turn their backs and call you a loser when you get sick and go broke.
Sayonara, you fool.
Silberdachs 2 years ago
Your right Silberdachs, we received big time run around from our insurance company. They want to receive their premium payments but they sure don't want to pay and will find anyway they can to get out of it. No tear in my eye for them.
Qedem1611 2 years ago
What fools! Single Payer socialist puppets. Advocating a lousy system of "healthcare". For what, overpriced bandaids? Ushering more of the typical fraud, waste & abuse...and favoritism by one already bloated central gov't. Healthcare is not a right, it is a responsibility of each individual. The original purpose of the fed is to defend the states from enemies foreign and domestic...now the enemy to our liberty controls the highest offices in gov't, the white house and Congress.
VideoSeattle 2 years ago
The poor you will always have among you and they should not be neglected health care because they can't responsibly afford it! Not every individual can afford it. Take away the aid to terrorist foreign countries and tax breaks to those to take American jobs overseas and our taxes can RIGHTLY be used to help the poor and NOT NEGLECT them because they are poor. What a sick in the mind society we live in to think that poor children or their parents should die of disease because they are poor.
Qedem1611 2 years ago
Qedem, Our "sick in the mind society" is the best there is and ever will be.
Fairness? No society is fair, especially dictatorships like communist or sociaiist. To plunder from one to give to another is sick and immoral and in some nations that's a crime. By contrast, charity is moral, forced charity is theft. Entitlements are not a birthright. This reality does not equate to a "sickness".
Here's what is "sick":
"from each according to his ability to each according to his need"
VideoSeattle 2 years ago
"Entitlements are not a birthright."
the bill of rights are entitlements, right? we shouldn't be GIVEN free speech or press by the government, right?
ddean1987 2 years ago
Our Government can stop giving our tax money to terrorist countries and use the money to help our own needy people. If they did that, nothing would have to come out of your pocket book that isn't already coming out. Big Businesses get their tax breaks and guess who is forced to pay for their FINE dining and FINE hotels, the tax payer. So our taxes feed the rich. He that oppresseth the poor to increase his riches, and he that giveth to the rich, shall surely come to want (Proverbs 22:16).
Qedem1611 2 years ago
fuck this country holy shit
Joe402 2 years ago
I think we may need to give Max a bigger bribe than the insurance companies for him to do whats right.
70road 2 years ago 2
is this video for real shitty deal
Buttakrispy 2 years ago
Obama sucks and all presidents suck. But Obama will be the worse.
rikkrude 2 years ago
Mr.President keep your promises to the people who voted you into office for Universal health Care and ending the WAR at least keep ONE of those Promises or Loose My VOTE in the Next Election period..........
nohealthcare62 2 years ago
he will leave grinning from ear to ear, and sell a new Book....He's set for Life, sad but true, them's the fact of life. Obamas Deceptions worked , he took the Change we can believe in and all the folding cash too, not just from us, but from my children and there children as well.
ubuibiok 2 years ago
I happen to be a proponent of a single payer universal health care programI see no reason why the United States of America, the wealthiest country in the history of the world, spending 14 percent of its Gross National Product on health care cannot provide basic health insurance to everybody. And thats what Jim is talking about when he says everybody in, nobody out. A single payer health care plan, a universal health care plan. And thats what Id like to see.
nohealthcare62 2 years ago
Because first we have to take back the White House, we have to take back the Senate, and we have to take back the House. - Barack Obama, 2003
nohealthcare62 2 years ago
Single-payer health care would be just what's best,
even if they placed Flowers under arrest,
like the civil rights Wallace could not suppress.
'cause Kucinich will stand tall right in our Congress.
RamuelMRaagas 2 years ago 2
Health care reform could cost the government up to $1.2 trillion over 10 years.
Thats scary shit more government= more taxes no thank you.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Move to Russia you socialists we don't need more government.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Dude stop being a typical scared republican.... I don't want the government in my business any more than you do ... but with health care the current system is sucking the life out of our economy .... the single payer system will work ... it's a no brainer and it's desperately needed
funkyflights 2 years ago
You're clueless just like the other socialists wanting a single payer syatem.
We need to make health care better and more afordable not tax us working people more for a failed single payer system.
Single payer only works in small countries it won't work in a large country.
It sure does not work in Canada and the UK and it's starting to fall apart in France.
I am so sick of you people that think government can do better they can't get a grip!
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Again ... I've been to Canada.... MANY MANY times... I live right on the border.... Vancouver is a second home for me..... They LOVE THERE system over there.... WTF ... dont believe the hype... no system is perfect but Canadians are scared shitless of our system ... there number one concern coming to the USA is " what if I get sick " what does that tell you .....
funkyflights 2 years ago
Then why do they come in droves to American hospitals when they need anything major done?
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
That's highly exaggerated ... I think you need to check the stat of how many Americans go to Canada for treatment..... a buddy of mine went to Vancouver to have surgery to cure his sleep apnea .... paid out of his pocket because he has no insurance ... a quarter of the price he was quoted in the USA..... with about 50 million Americans with no health insurance ....MORE Americans are going to Canada than you realize....
funkyflights 2 years ago 2
And what about the 10 to 13 million that don't want Health Insurance and what about the 10 million illegal people in this country i take it you would want them insured also?
Your 50 million number is so inflated by the left i'm sure it's more like 20 million still alot thats why i do agree with making health care more afordable and more user friendly.
But please no radical single payer it is such a failed system.
Thanks
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
You do realize were in a recession and people are losing there jobs left and right in this country .. so both of us can only guess the true number of uninsured at this point ... I"m sure it's MUCH higher over the last year ..... and we both agree costs need to be lowered.... we need to make this a relationship between patients and doctors.... insurance companies are the middle man .... we can eliminate the middle man .... that would lower costs ....
funkyflights 2 years ago
Come you need to understand that insurance companies are going nowhere it's a pipedream the insurance lobby is the 3rd largest in the country they won't go away face the facts.
They need to work with congress to lower cost and give people with health conditions that are out of work to get afordable plans.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
47 million Aug 2007, US Government censuses so add almost 4 million more for those who have lost there jobs...... most were a family of 4....so 51 million is the current low ball and there are some numbers out that claim 60 million US Citizens don't have any form of Healthcare. ask 100 people and count the ratio, then do the math for over 330 million...about 18 out of 100.
ubuibiok 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
And a failed single payer system won't work in America get over it!
Health care needs to be more afordable and we need more options not a single payer system run by the government give me a break.
More government = more taxes and a huge mess.
The free market is the only way!
Ron Paul was right and still is right free markets are the only way!
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
N/A , we already have a Single Payer System, your just not old enough to Qualify....Medicare and Medicaid are single payer systems already being ran by the Government because the "for Profit System" Healthcare Limiting Private Corporations don't want to cover your ass when you really need it...As fare as Taxes, who do you think is picking up the tab on the uninsured right now? We are, the property Tax payers are being charged to pay the Bills at your Local County Hospitals and Health clinics.
ubuibiok 2 years ago
And it will get alot worse if you socialists get you're way.
Socialism does not work never has never will.
The free market is the only way i hope you wake up from you're fantasy world some day i did i was at once a Democrat a moderate one that never fit in with the socialist democrats that are trying to destroy America.
Ron Paul is one of the only few that make sense in DC anymore.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
socialism has never worked? what a joke... the resounding success of neocapitalism free markets can be seen the world over: financial collapse and not to mention the poverty and misery it has caused the 3rd world.
Yes communism doesn't work but that is NOT the same as socialism which has successful examples in places like Sweden and is looking promising in Latin America. To tar communism and socialism with the same brush smacks of cold war hysteria...
dave927th 2 years ago 4
Do you think there is a chance that the insurance industry could be lying to us so they can keep the money rolling in? If youre making billions wouldnt you lie and cheat to keep it?
FluxCapacitor2008 2 years ago 4
I agree with you, communism doesn't work. We are not for socialilzed medicine; we are for socialized insurance.
Socialized police, socialized fire department, socialized military; I'm glad we have this little bit of communism. I hope police come if I am perpetrated by a criminal. I hope fire dept comes if my house catches fire.
healthmusic 2 years ago 4
it is now 50 million and 20,000 will DIE this yr and One Million More WHO Have Health Care because they dont KNOW their health Care TOPS OUT ..said the World health Org.
nohealthcare62 2 years ago
Single pay health care will make things worse by reducing competition increasing red tape and exacerbating inefficiencies.We need to make health care more afordable not take it over the cliff.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
reducing competition ?? this is not a product ... this is health care.... I agree with that philosophy when it comes to selling products... BUT I dont agree with it when it comes to health care.... when your sick your sick dude... you need help... it should not be about profit .... competition has done NOTHING to reduce costs over the years.... it's increased costs because hospitals charge whatever the #$%^@# they want .... insurance companies deny care to save money ... this is a mess dude
funkyflights 2 years ago
I agree the system needs to be cleaned up but you will never got rid of the insurance companies they are far to huge and they provide alot of good paying jobs.
They say in Pa alone we would lose at least half a million jobs that sucks.
I think a single payer system is far to extreme for America sorry.
Plus i think most moderate people either R or D don't want it i just think it is a very bad idea.
More government scars the hell out of most common people.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Single payer will not make those jobs go away. Medicare is administered by people. People with experience are the most likely to get those jobs. Jobs aren't going to just disappear into thin air because the payment system changes to run by the people rather than run by special interest getting rich off sick people! Put some thought into your rhetoric, sheesh!
0XXD 2 years ago 3
Right on OXXD. Single-payer will save our economy. It will restore America's production to be able to compete in world market.
healthmusic 2 years ago 7
The problems you've listed are what we have in excess with the private system right now, not with Medicare at all! Medicare seems to run fine without those problems...that is, except when Republicans give it away to private interests, such as they did with part D. I bet you will claim your medicare when you are 67!
0XXD 2 years ago
johnnoirvausas, I have worked in hospitals for 20 years and we are drowning in red tape and inefficiencies. We have hundreds of people on the payroll whose only job is to try to bill the insurance companies successfully so we can get reimbursed for the services we have already given. It's madness.
fliegeroh 2 years ago
And it will be far worse if the government runs our health system.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Expand Medicare to all United States citizens! Medicare for years has no questions asked approved life saving procedures where private insurance companies have denied (just like they tried to deny Katrina victims...& lost). Medicare saves lives, private insurance companies to date have had the power to end lives
Susieshepherd 2 years ago 2
Free healthcare.. not single payer..
dunngar 2 years ago
The majority of American's won't want a single payer plan if they understand it's rationed garbage insurance that will kill you because you will have to wait for the governmet to tell you when you can get surgery.
Take an open minded look at health care in Canada and ask a Canadian how much there taxes are you will find out that single payer is not worth it!
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Thats BS .... the government wont decide.... DOCTORS WILL.... why is that so hard for you to figure out.... you GO to a doctor and you get treatment... PERIOD ... the payment is from the government like medicare NOT DECIDED by the government.....
funkyflights 2 years ago
And the government will run health care then?
If the government runs it people will wish for the days of insurance companies the government will f it up like they do most everything else then our taxes will sky rocket like in the UK.
No thanks i'm for less government not having another huge branch of government.
Obama is wasting money like Bush did we own the auto companies now we will run a health care system come on wake up.
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
NO .... SINGLE PAYER system .... YOU choose your doctor.... not the government .... YOU choose your hospital NOT the government ... YOU and your doctor decide your treatment NOT the government .... I suppose you would rather have some person in a booth in India decide if your treatment will be covered or not ? some person in a cubical deciding how to save the company $ because your not a profit to them if your treatment is carried out... common man ... wake up ... before you see first hand...
funkyflights 2 years ago
I have seen first hand in Canada single payer is bad news and we are going broke thanks to Bush and Obams spending sprees you need to wake up!
Less government is the only way!
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Funkyflights, you are wasting your time trying to explain health care to Johnnorvaisas. Canada's health care system is not failing it is working just fine. The Republicans have brain washed some of the people so much that they can't even give an ear to the truth of the facts. People, PLEASE seek your our facts on a subject before you make the wrong decision and oppose Obama's fight for health care for the nation.
gransul67 2 years ago
Rationed health care no thanks!
johnnorvaisas 2 years ago
Corporations determine public policy. Profiteers decide who will get elected & then - surprise! - legislators are in the corporate pocket. This week Baucus voted against limits on credit card interest and ordered the arrest of 11 doctors & health care reformers representing 60%+ majority opinion he refuses to acknowledge. Baucus, as a corporate-dependent legislator likes power more than fairness. They say: "Let the middle class pay the health care piper. Ive got mine for free from taxpayers!
SupportWeThePeopleKB 2 years ago 3
I had BCBS for 17 yrs @$7500 I used it one time and was told they willnever cover feamle cancer in me again I was ON MY OWN ! I am on my own since 1997 Human services is for illegal's and women / children ONLY !
nohealthcare62 2 years ago
This video clearly shows that the Democratic Party doesn't care what the majority of Americans think and that when you disturb insurance companies' spotlight, you get arrested. To Hell with the Democrats, to Hell with the Republicans! To win the change we want, we need to be independent and critical of both corporate parties.
themodpoet 2 years ago 6
comment below is for DaRock02412, anyway message me for link to petition to support single pay healthcare hr676 and pass it on
sincerityproductions 2 years ago 2
well that guys hammer sure works. like were fuking kids...just hit the hammer and we freaze..
muiere2 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Get the word out. . .this is legit, and I was able to leave a message.
Record a Single Payer message for Baucus or the White House at night:
Call 1-800-578-4171 & press 0 for the White House or 1 for Baucus - during day direct connects to their offices.
You record it at night and they will put the message in their Queue and forward it during office hours to their offices.
SunLogic1973 2 years ago
National Health NOw! Obama promised.
chinacat22 2 years ago 2
Obama promised to escalate the war in Afghanistan and he is doing that. He bombed and killed 150 civilians this week.
He promised to expand insurance and make the insurance companies richer, he is doing that.
Obama opposed single payer not for profit health care like these doctors want.
Dennis Kucinich , Ralph Nader, Cynthia McKinney they all supported it.
You voted for the wrong person if you voted for Obama.
Obama is for war fare not health care!
Protest!
nowellian 2 years ago
freedom of Speech??????
BeantownJim 2 years ago
10 yrs ago I worked in the Hepatology Dept. @ U Hospital in Denver. People on medicare or medicaid were automatically approved for transpants...people with "private" insurance"- it was a toss up whether they were approved or not (even though they needed transplants to live). We watched people die because of douchbag insurance companies. Kudos to these doctors
Susieshepherd 2 years ago
Wait...arrested?!!!! WHAT THE FUCK FOR??? TALKING?! YOU CAN'T ARREST SOMEONE FOR TALKING!!! I understand having them escorted out- but arrested?! What were the charges??? WHAT THE FUCK?!
Susieshepherd 2 years ago
Wait...arrested?!!!! WHAT THE FUCK FOR??? TALKING?! YOU CAN'T ARREST SOMEONE FOR TALKING!!! I understand having them escorted out- but arrested?! WHAT THE FUCK?!
Susieshepherd 2 years ago
Wait...arrested?!!!! WHAT THE FUCK FOR??? TALKING?! YOU CAN'T ARREST SOMEONE FOR TALKING!!! I understand having them escorted out- but arrested?! WHAT THE FUCK?!
Susieshepherd 2 years ago
I really appreciate these doctors and activists standing up for those of us who couldn't afford to be in D.C.
My current cancer treatments have me broke. It is past time to Expand Medicare to include everyone, which is what Single Payer would do.
It is time for real healthcare reform. It is time for the Single Payer solution.
mgunch 2 years ago 2
As i said before, stop regurgitating studies you are copy and pasting from phnp. Come up with some of your own thoughts and ideas and quit trying to make it seem like you are some guru on the issue.
I could copy and paste studies and atricles and throw out fancy titles until I turn blue in the face. I am not wasting any more of my time with you. When you start thinking for yourself let me know.
DaRock02412 2 years ago
Excuse me but just because I happen to agree with PNHP does not mean I don't get info other places. I have not copy pasted ONE thing from their site. I provided you with many sources besides them as well. You are just having a hard time dealing with the facts and because you have yourself in a corner are resorting to this old tactic of name calling and diversion. Look, I got back to you and answered every question and comment of yours. Now you want to quit because you have no response.
729zoom 2 years ago
Once again, Gratzer is not my man. People like you really do make me sick to my stomach. If you hate the way things are done in the United States so much-leave! If you feel the governemnt can do things better go to somewhere like Canada or the UK.
I work full time, pay my taxes, pay my insurance premiums and am completely satisfied with the healthcare I receive.
DaRock02412 2 years ago
Really? I make you sick because I see a REAL problem? You don't agree tha our healthcare system is failing? Wow. Trying to fix a problem makes you sick? If your roof is leaking and your wife wants to fix it, do you tell her she makes you sick and that she should move? Your thinking is absurd. People like you make the entire country sick because they can't get healthcare.
729zoom 2 years ago
Give me a break. I conceded the fact that the current system is broken and in need of serious reform in one of my first posts. What makes me sick to my stomach is that you are so narrow minded and full of yourself that you have shut out any options other than SP.
DaRock02412 2 years ago
NO. I am very open minded and I have thought through and studied all the options. I read everything and have followed this issue for YEARS. I didn't come around to SP overnight. I just can't find one that is viable except for SP. And when I get into debates like this one, with know it alls like you, you make the argument for SP even stronger. I have explained why your suggestions don't work and backed it up with solid arguments and research. the same can't be said for you, obviously.
729zoom 2 years ago
YOu provide me a list of how private insurance companies add value to our healthcare system. Name one thing they do to contribute to healthcare. Name one. I am listening.
729zoom 2 years ago
Nobel prize winning economist Kenneth Arrow published an article, Uncertainty and the Welfare Economics of Medical Care, The American Economic Review, Vol 53, No. 5, December 1963, and a more recent book by Professor Thomas Rice, The Economics of Health Reconsidered, both show the absurdity of applying market models to health care. Does he make you sick, too? Do the over 65% of Americans who want change and who support a national healthcare plan make you sick? Give me a break.
729zoom 2 years ago
Fucking Prick, Glad you can afford it what about your mom. what about all the moms who can't. What about the young adults just starting out without the family to provide it for them. The ones working three jobs to pay for college trying to make it but can't afford health care. a good hard working, tax paying young adult? how about the children falling the through the cracks once they reach 18. Why we are suppose to be the greatest nation on earth have such cracks.
sincerityproductions 2 years ago 2
go to michaelrachlis . com and download his book, "Prescription for Excellence." He draws on examples from Canada, U.S. England, Denmark, etc. where timely access and quality have been achieved by a combination of various approaches that did not require additional personnel or costs, just smarter use of them. If one wants example of just shortening wait times, go to his publications, scroll down to article, "Public Solutions to Waiting Lists."
729zoom 2 years ago
The next thing your going to tell me is that Kennedy was assasinated by the mob, we never landed on the moon, the Pentagon was really hit by a Tomahawk missle ect......
You don't have a seat at the health reform table because anyone with half a brain knows it would be a terrible solution to the problem. Have you ever thought about that possiblity?
DaRock02412 2 years ago
Funny, too, that your guy Gratzer's hero is Milton Friedman. Friedman described Austrian Economist FA Hayek - considered one of the founding giants of free-market economics - as his inspiration. FYI: Hayek was a supporter of National Health Care! He recognized that there exist public goods, goods & services, that markets do not apply to, that trying to fit into a market model only result in market failure & reduced societal welfare. Do your homework and read Hayeks "The Road to Serfdom."
729zoom 2 years ago
Single-payer, by using economies of scale, simplified administration makes including everyone the only viable way to get cost-effective quality care. By emphases on preventive medicine, better maintenance of chronic conditions, we save on more expensive care which is often too late, and attain a healthier and more productive citizenry. It is cheaper to go to your family doctor a few extra times and nip something in the bud than wait.
729zoom 2 years ago
Bravi! Thank you for standing up for single payer
Mopsibus 2 years ago
According to the Kaiser Family Foundation, "the cost of private health insurance administrative expenses per enrollee has been rising at an increasing rate, from $85 in 1986 to $421 in 2003. The most rapid growth occurred in the 4-year period from 1987 to 1990, when these administrative costs rose 125%. For the six-year period from 1998 to 2003, administrative costs per enrollee nearly doubled (+95%)."
1mayven 2 years ago
to make more clear below, a single Payer system (SP) can effectively negotiate for lower drug costs, medical equipment, etc. We can't do any of this now. Our system is too fragmented to manage.
729zoom 2 years ago
Negotiate lower costs, right, kind of like how Medicare currently negotiates lower costs. As you know, Medicare has the ability to set it's payment rates by law, no negotation required. Don't insinuate that a SP would negotiate on costs. They would dictate costs.
DaRock02412 2 years ago
Yes, SP would have the power to do so, in the same way the SP system does in Canada. That is why drug prices in Canada are lower than they are here even with insurance benefits. Medicare Part D was pushed by the drug companies here to prevent Medicare from negotiating lower prices. And seniors lost.
729zoom 2 years ago
And before you start with the R&D claim, read this paper: "Rx R&D Myths: The Case Against the Drug Industry's R&D 'Scare Card' (citizen . org / documents / ACFDC . pdf - just remove the spaces). Every independent study that's ever looked at the sources of medical innovation has concluded that research funded by the public sector--not the private sector--is chiefly responsible for a majority of the medically significant advances that have led to new treatments of disease.
729zoom 2 years ago
Having access to good medical care will also increase productivity and reduce risks from infectious diseases left untreated. In addition, a single-payer system with one database will help uncover which medical interventions work and which don't, currently estimated that over 30% of all medical treatments either just worthless or actually harm us.
729zoom 2 years ago
First of all I never said the Massachusetts Connector was a single payer system. I know exactly what it is and you described in correctly. I was using it as an example to show the problems that arise when you have a large, previously uninsured population become insured in a short amount of time.
Having access to good medical care will not increase under this scenario. That is what I was pointing out regarding the problems Massachusetts is having.
DaRock02412 2 years ago
ACCESS and COST are the two cirital problems that are occuring with the large influx of newly insured to the system.
A single payer system would face the same problems. If you insure 47 million people overnight the first thing they are going to do is seek health care. We do not have the worforce to treat the current population of insured individuals. How are these people going to be accomadated by an already overextended system? How do you propose we finance this initiative?
DaRock02412 2 years ago
Again, when you remove the insurance middlemen and save all the dollars currently wasted on outlandish CEO salaries, adminstrative costs, advertising, etc. you save 350 BILLION which can be redirected to cover the uninsured. Tax payers already pay over 60% of all the health care costs in this country. Insurance middlemen suck out over 1/3 of the current dollars and we are not able to negotiate w/o SP. Without raising taxes (or very little) we can do it.
729zoom 2 years ago
Where do you get this 350 Billion figure? Was this study done by the GAO or CBO? I'll agree with you on salaries and advertising although I find it hard to squeeze that much savings from the two. Regarding adminitrative costs I will point directly back to my fraud numbers. Private Insurance companies, because they operate on a for profit basis, have an incentive to use resources to combat fradulent activities.
DaRock02412 2 years ago
Have you ever considered that low administrative costs might some how coorelate to Medicare and Medicaid wasting 60 billion a year?
You still have not addressed the Access issue. Which is the root of the problem. How do you plan on accomdating the uninsured once they become covered?
Are we going to magically train tens of thousands of health care workers overnight? They will end up in the ER because they wont be able to access a Dr. Which is the same place they went when uninsured
DaRock02412 2 years ago
And keep in mind that those people who currently clog ER rooms seeking basic, primary care, would be able to access early and preventative care which prevents the need for more expensive care for untreated disease. Other countries provide care for ALL citizens. Are you saying the U.S. can't do it? Sure, we can't do it overnight but we better get started NOW if we are to succeed.
729zoom 2 years ago
Comment removed
BillOhashi 2 years ago
Again, you just don't get it. The REASON the MA plan failed was because IT IS NOT SINGLE PAYER. They didn't address THE PROBLEM, which is the hundreds of PRIVATE insurance companies. YOu can't control costs and feed the beast at the same time. Single payer SAVES money and COVERS EVERYONE.
729zoom 2 years ago
If you now admit that the MA plan is not single payer, then why are you bringing it up on this thread if not to confuse? How is it an example of single payer? It's not and that is why it didnt' work and WHY the activists are protesting. The MA plan is a joke. we know that. So, obviously you must agree that single payer is the way to go.
729zoom 2 years ago
Comment removed
DaRock02412 2 years ago
Would you support opening up the FEHBP to our current uninsured population? Let's allow all of them to sign up and receive the same benefits Federal Employees currently have access to. They would not be excluded based on pre-existing conditions and would enjoy the same plan premiums. What do you think about this option?
DaRock02412 2 years ago
I support SINGLE PAYER - IMPROVED MEDICARE FOR ALL. that means EVERYONE IN, NO BODY OUT. Covered from birth to death. Not tied to employment so people can be free to move between jobs without fear. You didn't answer my question. do you think that the U.S. is not capable of covering all of its citizens like they do for 1/2 the cost in other countries? Are we too stupid to stop the insurance industry from ripping us off and controlling our healthcare?
729zoom 2 years ago
You have not addressed the main problems I have suggested regarding a SP system.
WORKFORCE/ACCESS--we do not have the man power or infrastructure to accommodate 47 million uninsured, period. Secondly, doctors are declining to see new Medicare/Medicaid patients everyday. Why? Because government set reimbursement often does not cover the costs of doing business. What makes you think these doctors will suddenly have a change of heart and decide to start seeing patients?
DaRock02412 2 years ago
FEHBP FOR ALL
I made the suggestions of opening the FEHBP to all of the currently uninsured. The uninsured would be able to buy into the program and receive the exact same benefits regardless of health or employment status. You say no to covering everyone because it is done in a private for profit market? Where is the sense in that if your goal is to have accessible healthcare for all?
DaRock02412 2 years ago
FINANCE- Medicare's own board of trustees has said flat out the program will be broke by 2019. This is coming from the government officials who oversee the program. We simply do not have enough workers paying into the system to support the amount of beneficiaries who received care.
Please reference a reputable study, such as one done by the GAO or CBO who score savings and costs for the government, that shows you will save 350 billion dollars in your previously mentioned cost savers.
DaRock02412 2 years ago
The US could save enough on administrative costs more than $350 billion annually with a single-payer system to cover all of the uninsured. SOURCE: Woolhandler, et al Costs of Health Administration in the U.S. and Canada, New England Journal of Medicine 349(8) Sept. 21, 2003 and Proposal of the Physicians Working Group for Single-Payer National Health Insurance, Journal of the American Medical Association 290(6): Aug 30, 2003
More later.
729zoom 2 years ago
Just posted GAO/CBO studies &others but, whether the savings would be $350 billion or less or more is only part of the puzzle. The fragmentation caused by our system, the wasted time that doctors spend negotiating with umpteen plans, that a family doctor instead of having a working relationship with a handful of specialist must refer patients to different specialists based on which ones included in the patients health plans network, all this wastes time and reducing the coordination of care.
729zoom 2 years ago
I think we need to agree to disagree at this point. I don't need to listen you regurgitate information you lifted off pnhp. I could just as easily go to a website like freemarkertcure and copy and paste rebuttals to all of your arguments.
Your living in a fantasy land to think that we can take a system that is in place on such a massive scale and throw it out the window and replace it with SP. I can't even begin to fathom the Bureaucracy that would be tasked just implement SP.
DaRock02412 2 years ago
if you get your info from David Gratzer's site, I see why you are so misinformed! Gratzer is a senior fellow for the Manhattan Institute, the one that worked on behalf of tobacco companies to put out false & misleading "studies" on tobacco. Manhattan Institute gets its funding from known financiers of neo-conservatism - big money men, corps and big business including the insurance industry, big pharma & Wall Street. Yeah, those free market guys who recently robbed tax payers of billions.
729zoom 2 years ago
I didn't get any of my information from his site. I only mentioned it to make the point that anyone can go to any number of websites and see arguements and rebuttals for both sides.
Can we please end this and stop wasting both of out time?
DaRock02412 2 years ago
"Broke" is a loaded word. The projected costs show a shortfall. Based on current projections the amount going into the Medicare fund will not meet the projected outlays, initially by a few percentage points. This is the same misuse of labels with Social Security, claiming it is facing bankruptcy. I need to continue this reply in 2 more comments.
729zoom 2 years ago
I'll just use some ballpark numbers to illustrate. Medicare does pay less than private insurance companies, both to hospitals and doctors. Let's use 25% as the amount of waste going to our fragmented for-profit system, e.g. additional staff for billing, negotiating, etc. in hospitals and insurance companies bureaucracies and profits. If Medicare pays 10% less, then it is still subsidizing the waste by 15%.
729zoom 2 years ago
In a single-payer system, the savings will allow paying less while still doctors and hospitals will do all right. Years ago there was an article comparing solo family practitioners in U.S. and Canada. American doctors gross incomes were double that of their Canadian counterparts. However, American doctor's net income was only 30% higher. Major difference was American doctor had to pay collection agencies for non-paid, staff for billing and arguing with insurance companies, etc.
729zoom 2 years ago
If we abolish Medicare because it is going "broke," most senior citizens will not be able to afford private coverage. They will end up clogging our already overburdened emergency rooms, burdening families with care for sick parents who might have enjoyed additional healthy years, etc. In the end it will cost us more.
729zoom 2 years ago
Where is your sense in providing people the option to buy PRIVATE insurance that is unaffordable and whose incentive is to deny care for profit? Insurance is NOT healthcare. and how do you save money if you don't remove the biggest waste? You keep forgetting that private insurance wastes over 1/3 of our healthcare dollars. the adminitrative costs for private insurance between 25% and 50% as compared to 2-3% for traditional Medicare.
729zoom 2 years ago
Private insurance through the FEHBP seems to be quite affordable to the 10's of thousands of individuals who are currently insured by it and are satisfied with their coverage.
You are familiar with CBO and GAO correct? They are the standard when it comes to predicting realized savings. I'm patiently waiting.
50% for administrative costs in the private sector, get real.
How exactly is printing a government insurance card for 47 million people providing them health care?
DaRock02412 2 years ago
Administrative cost are the difference between what an insurance company collects from enrollees in premiums and what it pays for their health service claims. It includes claims processing, underwriting, marketing, utilization review, building up reserves, general management, SALARIES and PROFIT PAID TO SHARE HOLDERS. And yes, often shown as a % of the premium, ranges from 5% to 50% or more.
1mayven 2 years ago
There have been dozens of analyses carried out by various well-known groups like Lewin who have all arrived at the same conclusion. Earlier studies of administrative costs and savings can be gleaned from: CBO - H.R. 1200, American Health Security Act of 1993, 12- 16-1993
GAO/HRD-91-90 - Canadian Health Insurance: Lessons for the United States, June 1991
729zoom 2 years ago
Steffie Woolhandler et al, Costs of Health Care Administration in the United States and Canada, New England Journal of Medicine, 2003, Volume 349, pages 768-775
The Lewin Group, The Healthcare for All Californians Act: Cost and Economic Impact Analysis, January 19, 2005.
729zoom 2 years ago
Re: Private insurance through the FEHBP: There would still be wasted administrative costs and difficulty in a fragmented system to improve healthcare. Rather than simplifying things and costs, it makes it more costly. We would need an additional bureaucracy to decide how much to subsidize those with lower income or unemployed. And currently most, except the high end plans, LIMIT choice of physicians.
729zoom 2 years ago
To maintain our private fragmented for-profit system one has to come up with a rationale to justify their existence, besides creating huge incomes for some. There is no credible evidence private insurance companies add anything to the quality of the health care we receive. Even if we could regulate private companies to keep costs down, to stop cherry picking, they would still create a fragmented system where doctors and hospitals had to deal with the multiple companies, etc.
729zoom 2 years ago
We have more than enough medical personnel to cover those who are un and underinsured with adequate time for visits and additional visits. Nurses working for insurance companies will go back to actually caring for patients. Doctors will spend less time fighting and negotiating with umpteen insurance companies. But we still need to get smart on how we use health care. We need team approaches, more use of Nurse Practitioners and Physician Assistants, Electronic Databases, etc.
729zoom 2 years ago
Doctors want single payer because they want to negotiate fair prices and save the hassles of hiring an entire staff to do battle for every dime. When you remove the insurance companies and fund Medicare, we have the money. when all patients are covered under the same plan, doctors are not going to turn away patients. You don't even make sense. PLEASE check out the FAQ section of pnhp . org before you comment back. THESE ARE DOCTORS begging for single payer.
729zoom 2 years ago
What about every other doctor in the United States who doesn't support a single payer system? Are these doctors some how less intelligent? There are plenty of doctors who strongly oppose SP, let me guess...they are in bed with the insurance companies. This argument holds now water.
Please address the workforce issues you seem to dodge every time i've mentioned it
DaRock02412 2 years ago
Regarding the workforce. HR 676 and other single-payer bills allow funds for re-training workers in the health insurance industry. As already mentioned, nurses would actually do nursing. We need teachers, etc. There are lots of jobs that are needed that actually will contribute to the overall welfare of our society rather than just paperwork that makes getting health care more fragmented and difficult.
729zoom 2 years ago
you removed your comment explaining that you meant Medicare Advantage, not the MA state plan. Well, I guess you figured out on your own that Medicare Advantage is not traditional medicare but PRIVATE INSURANCE companies. And they are the ones responsible for the all the recent FRAUD. We need to get rid of these crooks. Single Payer is the way to go.
729zoom 2 years ago
With single-payer the administrative costs will go to actual health care. Doctors will spend more time in patient care than fighting with insurance companies. Monies will be saved by more preventive medicine and public health as well as better treatment of chronic conditions rather than paying for expensive treatments for conditions that could have been avoided.
729zoom 2 years ago
Pathetic. No wonder these folks weren't invited to be part of it, they are not advocates for "health care reform" but advocates for their particular and limited form of health care reform. Have they convinced me of the merit of their cause? Quite the opposite, they seem to be a very narrow minded group who thinks everyone should only see it their way.
SteveKopekne 2 years ago
What do you do when you have tried every normal way to be heard and included and they simply ignore you? Why don't you watch the videos and hear the remarks from these people - many of them respected doctors before you judge.
And FYI: It is not unreasonable to expect, as PNHP . org (doctors) and the CA Nurses did, to be a serious part of the discussion on health care reform. These groups rep the views of the majority of Americans & that they have been excluded is a travesty.
729zoom 2 years ago
Fascist pigs!
cottrell003 2 years ago
If anyone doesn't understand that the US is not a democracy but a corpratocracy - a country run by the corporations that don't give a damn for the American people but only for profits - then they don't know what American has become.
It doesn't matter which party is in power. They will vote the way the corporations tell them. It is time for public financing of elections and an end to lobbying. It is time for Americans to stand up and scream "We're mad as hell & we won't take it any more."
Janba32 2 years ago
I couldn't agree more. Public financing of elections is needed and we need to petition for it because the politicians will never vote for it.
729zoom 2 years ago
You can't end lobbying. Its about the only way to reach oppoliticians living in ivory towers.
Nor will public finiancing of elections make one iota of difference.
What would really cut the ground from under the current system is for the end to the party system and an end to campaign contributions by anyone other than individuals and only then below a certain amount. Only problem is to get these measures through you will need a gun.
Telcontar1962 2 years ago
Max Baucus....AND EVERY OTHER REPRESENTATIVE that sells out to the Health Insurance Mafia needs to be primaried and kicked out of office.
The whores have sold their souls to the Health Insurance Mafia for campaign "contributions". LEGALIZED BRIBERY!!!
Single payer could cover every American for LESS than we're spending now to leave over 40 million uncovered.
Single payer would be cheaper and far more medically effective.
The status quo KILLS Americans for profit. That's legalized MURDER!!!
nilent 2 years ago 2
Bravo! Obama USED TO SUPPORT SINGLE PAYER UNTIL HE CAME TO WASHINGTON and presumably, met the Insurance and Pharmaceutical Lobbies who "make a killing" off the current Healthcare for Profit scam.
madebutante 2 years ago