I believe that is Mark Dever of Capitol Hill Baptist Church in Washington D.C. preaching at the end of the song, not John Piper. Shai Linne was studying under Mark Dever to become an elder over a year ago or so.
Wow! Soo powerful! Thanks to performers and first and foremost to Jesus for what He did for us! Thank You Lord, how can we ever repay You even remotely for what You've done for us! I guess we should multiply like God commanded us by the leading and power of the Holy Spirit,we are soo blessed! Amen!Amen!
So many people are so fixated on "prove to me this & that" already have harden hearts and can't wait to shut down any notion that there is a God (Jesus in particular). First of all, God is not going to do it YOUR way. And secondly if you humbled yourself and prayed and asked for prayer of understanding of who the Lord is, it would be given to you. There are so many living testimonies walking around who have relationships with the Lord through Christ.
A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Any time an atheist claims that there is absolutely no God, they are claiming absolute and full knowledge of the universe (omniscience). If they are not claiming absolute knowledge, then they are going off of faith, but in fact, since they could never EVER know for sure that universal negative, then they are requiring much more faith than a person who claims there is a God (because finding out if there is a God may not require absolute knowledge).
i like ur comments but ur wasting ur time with ricksparks, only God can change Him. you already told Him the truth so its up to him to accept or reject Jesus.
If there were no religious zealots who DEMAND that others identify themselves as believers or otherwise, the terms "atheist" and "agnostic" wouldn't need to exist. -- Rick Sparks
You have demanded, over and over again, that a "god" is real, and you have done so consistently in order to attempt to convince me to BELEIVE.
You are EXACTLY the kind of person who made people develo the words "atheist" and "agnostic." You're a zealous fool who can't stand the fact that people have used their intelligence to realize the beliefs you spout are a waste of time.
I wonder; Would you be the type to ostracize and/or kill non-believers?
"attempt to believe" and DEMAND are entirely two different things now arent they? Funny, Ive used, in part, my inteliigence and reasoning to figure out that something can not, has not, will not, come from nothing....depsite secularists attempts to try over and over again, something can not come from nothing.
Call me some more names and give me some more loaded questions.
"It is very likely that the energy which resulted in the development of everything we are and/or perceive came about with absolutely no sentient involvement."
Translated, means, something came from nothing....after all, you have no explanation of this energy's existence.
No evidence for the energy, then no energy. =) Welcome to contradiction central. Population:You
Regardless of whether or not the Bible is true, which it is but for argument's sake let's leave that to speculation, you must admit that a Maker must exist. To say there is no God means that you have a big chain of events- the Big Bang Theory- which in the end contradicts the basic fundamental laws of science, the law of conservation of matter, and the law of conservation of energy.
@ricksparks A fool always harden his heart and believes in lies. Those lies are created by the devil, It was him that wanted to take God's place for this reason he wants u not to acknowledge that God is real. Simple thing that can explain that u were designed cautiously and awesomely by a God is well explained by ur body. There is a girl and boy made with different purpose for each other. If I were u I'd think twice to say something big is behind that creation real. Something far beautiful....
To sustain the belief that there is no God, atheism has to demonstrate infinite knowledge, which is tantamount to saying, "I have infinite knowledge that there is no being in existence with infinite knowledge" --Ravi Zacharias
To claim that the only way to be atheist is to have infinite knowledge is like claiming the only way to know which whores are diseased is to have unprotected sex with all of them. -- Rick Sparks
You claim there "is no God", hence, you must know everything, you must have infinite knowledge of all things to make a definitive statement such as that.
I'm going to try this one more time, maybe it will stick with you:
The "god" of the "bible" is fictional. No other being which humans would call a "god" has been proven to be real. NO evidence; NO god.
Are you sure you're an educated adult? I find it hard to believe that a person with such limited understanding of language would actually hold a college degree.
And yet you have offered no proof to make your claim viable. Your three defenses to your claim dont even attempt to discredit Gods existence, at best you attempted to attack the bible's truthfulness...and even with those arguments have been shattered as: different nomenclatures (ancient v. modern man made), contextually inaccurate representation of scripture and a pitiful attempt to discredit the bibles description of Davids Kingdom, which your ilk said was non exisistant a few years ago.
You go ahead an believe in the very fictitious "bible." Just don't expect those who can think to follow in your footsteps.
Also, if you have children, don't you DARE muddy their minds with religious nonsense. Let them reach an age where they can think critically for themselves instead of forcing them to belief nonsense before they're old enough to read the "bible" and understand it.
Still waiting for you to name ONE atheist who said David didn't exist. Can't help but notice you're stalling.
How very "DEMANDING" of you, didnt you just write, without a single example from the thread, that it was Christains who were demanding things from you?
There are atheists websites still proclaiming David didnt exist,,,,use a search engine...let me know if you need a tutorial.
i got my evidence, every sunday i go to church i see people, including myself, filled wit the holy ghost and speaking in other tongues( other languages) with the spirit giving the utterance, how can one explain that? it's Jesus man
You first have to be humble and teachable to be affected by the presentation of the gospel to you. You can't go at someone talking about "prove Jesus is true. Write nonsense & i'll chalk you up as another fool". God will NOT do it YOUR way, for real.
1 Corinthians 14:19-Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.
1 Corinthians 14:4-He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.
....That's how I would explain it...or rather, The Apostle Paul would explain it.
I'm a Christian as well and I LOVE GOD with every fiber of my being, but I don't speak in tongues.
And here I thought you read the bible. Are you referring to the entire chapters of 21 and 22? Or did you mean 21:22?
Heres how to keep in context, theres a prerequisite...in faith ('believing', depending on version), meaning when someone without faith in God or in the sincerity of the prayer, asks for anything, certainly the prayer wont be answered...why??? Its a test of God. Thou shall not tempt the Lord thy God.
James 4:2,3 says, "You do not have because you do not ask, you ask and do not receive because you ask wrongly to spend it on your passions."
Here is one like Matt 21:22:
Therefore, I tell you, whatever you ask in prayer, believe that you have received it and it will be yours. Mark 11:24
Now, lets put that one in context with an everyday example just for you. If I call a meeting with you, your mother and your girlfriend and I walk in the room and ask, "is everyone here"?
You would answer "Yes, everyone is here"...certainly not everyone is here...after all, where is Hugo Chavez? Or anyone else outside your defeinition of "everyone"?
Obviously James has qualified the term "whatever" in my cross referenced verse, and the condition of the heart and sincerity of a prayer, qualifies the word "all" in your example.
Once again, your presupposition and predisposition wont allow for that to take place.
However, you set forth the original premise that "God isnt real".
All youve seem to do is detract from your premise. Youve tried to justify your position, and I just clearly explained away your defense as a typical noncontextual interpretation of scipture.
By all means, please try to defend your premise again, rather than detract....the onus is yours.
I've addressed this with you. YOU are the one claiming a "god" exists. The burden of proof rests squarely with you.
By all means, write more repetitive nonsense designed to fool people into believing in your fairy-tale deity. Just don't expect anyone intelligent to agree with you.
Detraction from your premise again. I have addressed your questions. I gave you as an example to evidence of a creator (God), creation itself. Nothing has ever popped into existence. Behind art, was an artist, behind a building, a builder., behind creation a CREATOR...one more question you detracted from was "how did creation come into existence"? Got answers?
Your presupposition will not allow for you to be convinced. The evidence lies in your repeated ad hominem and bitterness.
"Just don't expect anyone intelligent to agree with you. "
For you to make a claim that no one with intelligence can beleive in a creator is demonstrably false. IF you dont believe it takes intelligence to get the degree I have, then go get one yourself.
It amazes me to find an intelligent person who fights against something which he does not at all believe exists. --Mohandas Gandhi
Have you proven that we go or do not go somewhere when we die?
Have you proven anything by the means of how the universe was created?
You cannot prove anything yet jump our case for believing in our Lord which requires Faith. Our Lord says we are saved by Faith in him. Go on having Faith in other things. You can no more prove yoru positiont than we can ours. Our Jesus was a real man and the Bible is real. No one can prove he never came and did what he did.
The "god" of the 'bible" is described as calling bats BIRDS... twice!
Shouldn't an omniscient "god" know bats are NOT birds? Better still, shouldn't an omniscient "god" have known better than to leave the teaching of its existence to semi-barbaric goat herders who did not know bats are not birds?
You claim "Jesus" is real and that a "god" is real. PROVE IT.
Until you do, I and others who are intelligent are under NO obligation to believe.
Wow.,...heres a synopsis of yhour proof, apparently you never read my total thrashing of them:
birds/bats: your comparing an ancient classification system to a modern, man made biological system of nomencalture...its only proves two different systems, nothing more.
Matt 22:21: reflects your inbalilty to keep scripture in context.
Davids Kingdom: you, as an atheist claim its small..yet atheists only a decade ago insisted it didnt even exist.
The "god" of the "bible" lists fowl (original Hebrew word "owph" meaning flighted birds, with feathers) that people should not eat. The list is in both Deuteronomy and Leviticus. Bats are included in both lists.
Don't you think a supposedly omniscient "god" should know better? Or, shouldn't a supposedly omniscient "god" have known it would be unwise to allow "his" story to be told by people who didn't know better?
Name one atheist who, a decade ago, claimed David wasn't real. I dare you.
Well sir if you dont indent to have a respecful conversation with me i will no mince words with you. its a shame i would have liked to have a rival. However no matter the insults you contiue to spit at mt brothers in christ i will pray for you. good day sir
The universe exists. It is not infinitely old. If it were it would have run out of energy long ago. Therefore, it had a beginning. The universe did not bring itself into existence. Since it was brought into existence by something else, I assert that God is the one who created the universe.
Prove there is a "god" and I'll believe in it. Make a bunch of assertions founded on the argument from ignorance and I will continue to write you off as just another fool for the oldest con game in the world.
NO evidence; NO god. It's that simple. To claim otherwise is to be a sucker or a liar.
What brought the universe into existence? It would have to be greater than the universe and be a sufficient cause to it. The Bible promotes this sufficient cause as God. What does atheism offer instead of God? If nothing, then atheism is not able to account for our own existence.
It's is not the job of "atheism" to provide an explanation of why we exist. Atheism is simply a state of rejecting the belief that some kind of "god" exists, especially when one considers that every "god" put forth by idiots like you are little more than projections of the humans who wrote scripture in order to attempt to control other humans.
Whatever science proves regarding the nature of the universe will be far grander than the idiotic "creation" story of the "bible." I guarantee it.
Laughable....your faith in the creation of the universe is very strong.
Atheism is an intellectual position. What reasons do you have for holding that position? Your reasons are based upon lack of evidence So, is there any reason/evidence for you holding your position that you defend?
Do you REALLY think that your asinine assumptions will impress anyone?
I've provided plenty of examples as to why i (and those who are intellectual) find the "god" of the "bible" to be a work of fiction. The fact that you continue to ask for more examples proves you are completely out of gas.
I've challenged you to provide the following more times than I can remember. This will be the last time.
The fact that the universe exists is not proof that a "god" is real... ESPECIALLY the megalomaniacal, sexist, genocidal, slave driving deity of the "bible."
Why do you wish to be a slave and/or drive others to be slaves? Is it money, power, or fame you crave?
You are a waste of time. I will no longer respond to your idiocy in this forum. My best wishes that you learn to be more than a force for evil in this world.
"All the strictly historical evidence we have is in favor of [the empty tomb], and those scholars who reject it ought to recognize that they do so on some other ground than that of scientific history."-William Wand, Oxford University, 1972)
The Existence of Valleys in the Seas - "The valleys of the sea were exposed and the foundations of the earth laid bare at the rebuke of the LORD, at the blast of breath from his nostrils," (2 Samuel 22:16).
ufbret: I've already addressed this. The things the "bible" is right about is no more impressive than the fact that the movie "Forrest Gump" makes references to the recent U.S. past.
How old were you when you were first told to believe in a "god," and why do you not realize you're a brainwashed fool?
iii.If you say that atheism is supported by the lack of evidence for God, then it is only your opinion that there is no evidence. You cannot know all evidence for or against God, therefore you cannot say there is no evidence for God.
You keep capitalizing the word "god." However, you have NOT proven one exists.
Do so. I dare you.
---
Fair warning: I know you can't. You are evil for attempting to convince people a deity exists without providing one shred of proof. Anyone who follows your "advice" is stupider than you.
If you say that atheism is simply lack of belief in a god, then my dog is an atheist the same as the tree outside and the road out front, since they also lack faith. Therefore, your definition is insufficient.
ii.I can no more prove to you that God is real than you can prove that the universe is all that exists. Your demand of proof precludes acknowledgement of many types of evidence because your presuppositions don't allow it.
That's not an insult, it's a statement of fact. You hide behind a "bible" which is nonsense, you hide behind belief in a "god" which you STILL have not defined (which "god" is it, EXACTLY, that you believe in? I grow tired of asking...), and you hide behind verse which makes observations even the most vacant goat herder from the third century could have made.
I reposted it....of course you really arent too interested in reading...sorry for that.
Here is is again, just for you.
To say "there is no proof for God's existence" is illogical because an atheist cannot know all things by which he could state that there is no proof. You can only say you have not yet seen a convincing proof.....after all, there may be one he hasn't yet seen.
The fact that you claim a "god" may exists without clearly identifying it as the 'god" of the "bible" proves you are engaging in deception.
You are pretending that a "god" which ISN'T necessarily defined by the "bible" you are supporting may exists, in an attempt to convince me (and others) to believe in the very SPECIFIC "god" of the "bible."
I claim God does exist, not may existI really cant catch you up on theology. and why I gave the names of God that I did...Im still hoping you go study logic on your own.....maybe you'll be able to do something other than call people names.
The Hydrologic Cycle - ""He draws up the drops of water, which distill as rain to the streams; the clouds pour down their moisture and abundant showers fall on mankind," (Job 36:27-28); "The wind blows to the south and turns to the north; round and round it goes, ever returning on its course. All streams flow into the sea, yet the sea is never full. To the place the streams come from, there they return again," (Ecclesiastes 1:6-7).Pretty good for a time when men simply looked to Tefnut for rain
I realize you rely upon the ignorance of the people you are attempting to convince.
I encourage EVERYONE to study weather cycles and determine for themselves whether or not STOREHOUSES are part of the process which results in rain or snow.
To say "there is no proof for God's existence" is illogical because an atheist cannot know all things by which he could state that there is no proof. You can only say you have not yet seen a convincing proof.....after all, there may be one he hasn't yet seen.
I can no more prove to you that God is real than you can prove that the universe is all that exists. Your demand of proof precludes acknowledgement of many types of evidence because your presuppositions don't allow it....and you are full of illogical presuppositions
If you say that atheism needs no evidence or reason, then you are holding a position that has no evidence or rational basis? If so, then isn't that simply faith?
I understand the need of religious adherents to pretend atheism is the same as faith. However, think clearly: 'Calling atheism a religion is like calling bald a hair color." -- (original quote by a person whose name currently escapes me)
Sad for you, I'm not the one who marked your comment as "spam."
Clearly, long before I encountered you, you've been identified as a useless waste of time. Ever wonder to yourself why that is?
I know you havent studied logic ....or fallacies like presuppositions, but:
I can no more prove to you that God is real than I can prove to you that I love my family. If you are convinced I don't love my family, no matter what I say or do will be dismissed by you as invalid. It is your presuppositions that are the problem, not whether or not God exists.
Of course, if you have no clue of what logic is, this means nothing, IM sure
There's nothing an idiot like you could explain to me.
The "bible" is fiction, originally invented by ancient Canaanites in order to control the minds of other humans. Prove otherwise, or admit the fact that you're a tool for the oldest con in the world.
The Existence of Water Paths (Ocean Currents) in the Seas - "O LORD, our Lord, how majestic is your name in all the earth!... When I consider your heavens, the work of your fingers, the moon and the stars, which you have set in place,... You made him [man] ruler over the works of your hands; you put everything under his feet... the birds of the air, and the fish of the sea, all that swim the paths of the seas," (Psalm 8:1,3,6,8).
The Round Shape of the Earth - "He sits enthroned above the circle of the earth, and its people are like grasshoppers. He stretches out the heavens like a canopy, and spreads them out like a tent to live in," (Isaiah 40:22"
Wow, not bad for a time when everyone thought the earth was flat
Haaaaa....I debunked your four corners days ago....we still use the term today.,....to describe the earth or a specific gepgraphy in its entirety.....yeah, your a bible mental giant.
It fascinates me that you think you're right. ANYONE can reference the verses I've provided and see the writers of the "bible" thought, quite clearly, that Earth was a flat expanse.
Really...and yet anyone, with a clue, can look at the scripture I put in and see that the earth was suspended in nothing and round....but you of course
You must be aware that it is modern science that has a different classification system than ancient times. To the ancients, creatures such as a bat were considered birds since they categorized all flying animals as birds. If that is the category that they used, then they were correct. It is not an error. It is a difference of categorization procedures....wow.,
Wow....good stretch....just an fyi, from BIO, if you can remember your high school BIO class....modern classifications are just that MODERN and man made.
Tool.....good one....Ive answered A, and I will repost my repsonse to B AGAIN, since you didnt catch it the first time:
I can no more prove to you that God is real than you can prove that the universe is all that exists. Your demand of proof precludes acknowledgement of many types of evidence because your presuppositions don't allow it.
What part of "DONT allow for it' is confusing to you?
Not to you, your illogical stance...SEE presuppositions AGAIN...wont allow for it.
If you say that atheism is supported by the lack of evidence for God, then it is only your opinion that there is no evidence. You cannot know all evidence for or against God, therefore you cannot say there is no evidence for God.
You clearly do not have a logical cell in your brain.
My condolences.
Prove there is a "god" and I'll believe in it. Keep referring to "god" as if one has proven itself real and I'll continue to identify you as a fucking idiot.
An inscription bearing he name of Pontius Pilate. A stone slab was uncovered in the Roman theater at Caesarea with the Latin words "Pointius Pilatus" and "Tiverius" in 1961.
David captured the Jebusite city Kathleen Kenyon between 1961-1967 found the Jebusite walls. Captain Charles Warren found the water shaft through which Joab climbed to gain entrance to the city (2 Samuel 5:6-8).
And to think, as recent;ly as 2002 atheists were claiming there was no evidence of Davids kingdom at all.(ref. Daniel Lazare). How much more will be discovered in the future I wonder.?
Sir Flinders Petrie in 1912 confirmed great granaries and Joseph's Palace.
Only a few months ago, archeologists discovered ancient Egyptian coins bearing the name and image of the biblical Joseph, from Cairo's Al Ahram newspaper. The period in which Joseph was regarded to have lived in Egypt matches the minting of the coins in the cache, researchers said.
Irrelevant. Since a majority of the "bible" was written centuries after the supposed time of the stories, any amount of such information could have been easily included within it.
ufbret: "Joseph" has never been proven to have been a real person. You're ignorant or a liar if you claim otherwise.
Still waiting for you to prove a "god" exists.
Can't help but notice all you've done is attempt to prove the parts of the "bible" which ANY semi-intelligent goat herder living about two-thousand years ago might have expressed are true.
Asked and answered over and over....so name calling, a whole list of fallacies, more name calling, presuppositions,more name calling...repeat...repeat...thats it? Your right, I should have contacted Hawkings...the conversation wouldnt be so elementary
Its funny, you are educated enough to to correct ufbret on the spelling of someones last name, but yet uneducated to the point of using "stupider" as a adjective..... "Stupider" is not a word, The correct usage is MORE stupid.....
Still, ufbret has NOT proved a "god" exists in spite of the fact that everything he's written thus far is a pathetic attempt to claim one does. For that, he is much more stupid than I.
Authenticity of the bible: Luke is a historian of the first rank; not merely are his statements of fact trustworthy ... this author should be placed along with the very greatest of historians. Lukes history is unsurpassed in respect of its trustworthiness.
"Luke" has never been proven to have been a real person. In fact, most of the "gospels" were written WITHOUT a name attached, and only later were they added by the folks responsible for distribution in order to attempt to give the stories credence.
I guess you know more than William Ramsay....of ocurse, his writing are his evidence, but hey,. if you want to contend with Ramsay, go ahead. Famous historian A.N. Sherwin-White declares:
In all, Luke names thirty-two countries, fifty-four cities, and nine islands without error. 8
For Acts the confirmation of historicity is overwhelming. . . . Any attempt to reject its basic historicity must now appear absurd.
I believe that is Mark Dever of Capitol Hill Baptist Church in Washington D.C. preaching at the end of the song, not John Piper. Shai Linne was studying under Mark Dever to become an elder over a year ago or so.
Thanks for posting this video.
Soli Deo Gloria
DRYSIDECOUG 8 months ago
@DRYSIDECOUG It's actually C.J. Mahaney of Sovereign Grace Ministries! Great message in any case.
dkcaldwell99 8 months ago
What does CJ starting at 5:10?
ldod6613 10 months ago
tell shai i was there, anyone viewing this misses the point if "you dont see yo face in the crowd"
chrislittman 10 months ago
@cakebatterhomez that's john piper preachin'.
cbreeze137 11 months ago
BANANAS!!!
kopesthetic 11 months ago
who's the random people in the video
devon8trillionaire 1 year ago
@devon8trillionaire dwg u cant be serious lol
SuperMCSLAYER 1 year ago
what album or mixtape is this off of
boogeyman7891 1 year ago
"the Atonement"-dats da albums name'
lonestarsk8a 11 months ago
wow they show lecrae on the pics.
evizcarra1 1 year ago
WOW @ 2:16 Is this Shai Linne? WOOOOOOOOOOOOOW...!
he just POWNED it.... WOW!!
sailentshadow 1 year ago
I'm in this video somewhere
TracyIAmDuat 1 year ago
@TracyIAmDuat Just got what you meant, so true, so true..
MusicRodent 11 months ago
1The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good. Psalm 14:1
KeeKiddProd1 1 year ago
amen
dpk0943 1 year ago
Wow! Soo powerful! Thanks to performers and first and foremost to Jesus for what He did for us! Thank You Lord, how can we ever repay You even remotely for what You've done for us! I guess we should multiply like God commanded us by the leading and power of the Holy Spirit,we are soo blessed! Amen!Amen!
smoothsailing07 1 year ago
So many people are so fixated on "prove to me this & that" already have harden hearts and can't wait to shut down any notion that there is a God (Jesus in particular). First of all, God is not going to do it YOUR way. And secondly if you humbled yourself and prayed and asked for prayer of understanding of who the Lord is, it would be given to you. There are so many living testimonies walking around who have relationships with the Lord through Christ.
slowwinda 1 year ago
ricksparks
I challenge you to tell me about those who claim that The Bible is true!
Read about prophecies, scientific proof, Historical Evidence, The Bible and archeaology!
And most important of all READ THE BIBLE!
Theres a video here on youtube called Proving the Bible Through Archaeology
Ezekiel 36:26
A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Flozzee 1 year ago 2
Any time an atheist claims that there is absolutely no God, they are claiming absolute and full knowledge of the universe (omniscience). If they are not claiming absolute knowledge, then they are going off of faith, but in fact, since they could never EVER know for sure that universal negative, then they are requiring much more faith than a person who claims there is a God (because finding out if there is a God may not require absolute knowledge).
ufbret 2 years ago 45
i like ur comments but ur wasting ur time with ricksparks, only God can change Him. you already told Him the truth so its up to him to accept or reject Jesus.
cj3007 2 years ago
ufbret wants everyone to believe in the "god" he believes in.
And yet, he has provided NO proof that such a being exists.
He is worse than a used-car salesman. At least when they are done lying, you have something to drive off the lot.
NO evidence; NO god. It's that simple.
ricksparks 1 year ago
@ufbret DAMN DUDE I HAVEN'T HEARD WORDS LIKE THAT IN A WHILE......GOOD STUFF
giltax14 1 year ago
@ufbret wow. thats deep. Are you quoting some one? Because, you might want to think about publishing that.
sayYAYtooday 10 months ago
If there were no God, there would be no atheists. --G.K. Chesterton
ufbret 2 years ago 2
If there were no religious zealots who DEMAND that others identify themselves as believers or otherwise, the terms "atheist" and "agnostic" wouldn't need to exist. -- Rick Sparks
ricksparks 2 years ago
Really? ....youve been writing on this video for months and yet, no one has DEMANDED you to identify yourself as a believer.
ufbret 2 years ago
Wrong.
You have demanded, over and over again, that a "god" is real, and you have done so consistently in order to attempt to convince me to BELEIVE.
You are EXACTLY the kind of person who made people develo the words "atheist" and "agnostic." You're a zealous fool who can't stand the fact that people have used their intelligence to realize the beliefs you spout are a waste of time.
I wonder; Would you be the type to ostracize and/or kill non-believers?
ricksparks 2 years ago
"attempt to believe" and DEMAND are entirely two different things now arent they? Funny, Ive used, in part, my inteliigence and reasoning to figure out that something can not, has not, will not, come from nothing....depsite secularists attempts to try over and over again, something can not come from nothing.
Call me some more names and give me some more loaded questions.
ufbret 2 years ago
ufbret
Name one secular person who is reputable who claims something can come from nothing. I dare you.
ricksparks 2 years ago
"It is very likely that the energy which resulted in the development of everything we are and/or perceive came about with absolutely no sentient involvement."
Translated, means, something came from nothing....after all, you have no explanation of this energy's existence.
ufbret 2 years ago
How stupid are you?
The energy definitely came from somewhere. We DON'T KNOW where! NO ONE on Earth knows!
Your "bible" claims to know, but it just attributes everything to a being which has never been proven real.
Are you lacking reading comprehension skills or are you being purposefully obtuse?
ricksparks 2 years ago
"We dont know" the origin of the universe, but we proclaim without hesistance that there was no creator....how illogical.
ufbret 2 years ago 2
@ricksparks
No evidence for the energy, then no energy. =) Welcome to contradiction central. Population:You
Regardless of whether or not the Bible is true, which it is but for argument's sake let's leave that to speculation, you must admit that a Maker must exist. To say there is no God means that you have a big chain of events- the Big Bang Theory- which in the end contradicts the basic fundamental laws of science, the law of conservation of matter, and the law of conservation of energy.
dominicano0226 1 year ago 2
@ricksparks A fool always harden his heart and believes in lies. Those lies are created by the devil, It was him that wanted to take God's place for this reason he wants u not to acknowledge that God is real. Simple thing that can explain that u were designed cautiously and awesomely by a God is well explained by ur body. There is a girl and boy made with different purpose for each other. If I were u I'd think twice to say something big is behind that creation real. Something far beautiful....
MultiDennis1991 1 year ago
To sustain the belief that there is no God, atheism has to demonstrate infinite knowledge, which is tantamount to saying, "I have infinite knowledge that there is no being in existence with infinite knowledge" --Ravi Zacharias
ufbret 2 years ago
To claim that the only way to be atheist is to have infinite knowledge is like claiming the only way to know which whores are diseased is to have unprotected sex with all of them. -- Rick Sparks
ricksparks 2 years ago
You claim there "is no God", hence, you must know everything, you must have infinite knowledge of all things to make a definitive statement such as that.
ufbret 2 years ago
I'm going to try this one more time, maybe it will stick with you:
The "god" of the "bible" is fictional. No other being which humans would call a "god" has been proven to be real. NO evidence; NO god.
Are you sure you're an educated adult? I find it hard to believe that a person with such limited understanding of language would actually hold a college degree.
ricksparks 2 years ago
And yet you have offered no proof to make your claim viable. Your three defenses to your claim dont even attempt to discredit Gods existence, at best you attempted to attack the bible's truthfulness...and even with those arguments have been shattered as: different nomenclatures (ancient v. modern man made), contextually inaccurate representation of scripture and a pitiful attempt to discredit the bibles description of Davids Kingdom, which your ilk said was non exisistant a few years ago.
ufbret 2 years ago
You go ahead an believe in the very fictitious "bible." Just don't expect those who can think to follow in your footsteps.
Also, if you have children, don't you DARE muddy their minds with religious nonsense. Let them reach an age where they can think critically for themselves instead of forcing them to belief nonsense before they're old enough to read the "bible" and understand it.
Still waiting for you to name ONE atheist who said David didn't exist. Can't help but notice you're stalling.
ricksparks 2 years ago
"don't you DARE"
How very "DEMANDING" of you, didnt you just write, without a single example from the thread, that it was Christains who were demanding things from you?
There are atheists websites still proclaiming David didnt exist,,,,use a search engine...let me know if you need a tutorial.
ufbret 2 years ago
i got my evidence, every sunday i go to church i see people, including myself, filled wit the holy ghost and speaking in other tongues( other languages) with the spirit giving the utterance, how can one explain that? it's Jesus man
gathuarox7 2 years ago 3
Prove "Jesus" is real and I'll believe in such a being. Write nonsense and I'll chalk you up as just another fool for the oldest con in the world.
ricksparks 1 year ago
what nonsense am i writing, and by the way look it up there is plenty of proof that Jesus is real
gathuarox7 1 year ago 20
You first have to be humble and teachable to be affected by the presentation of the gospel to you. You can't go at someone talking about "prove Jesus is true. Write nonsense & i'll chalk you up as another fool". God will NOT do it YOUR way, for real.
slowwinda 1 year ago
Wisdom searches out a matter.
smoothsailing07 1 year ago
@gathuarox7
1 Corinthians 14:19-Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.
1 Corinthians 14:4-He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.
....That's how I would explain it...or rather, The Apostle Paul would explain it.
I'm a Christian as well and I LOVE GOD with every fiber of my being, but I don't speak in tongues.
jcolemansleeps 1 year ago
Hey ufbret we should not be arguing with such people, but rather praying that they see the light.
umboo890 2 years ago
@umboo890
According to the "bible," ALL prayers of believers will be GRANTED.
Pray for all the parents who died in Haiti's recent earthquake to come back to life so their orphans don't have to deal with such a horrendous loss.
Be sure to let me know how that works out.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Out of context....as usual.
ufbret 2 years ago
Tell me exactly how you figure this is being taken out of context. I dare you.
Matthew 21, 22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive
ALL things!!!
Sucker.
ricksparks 2 years ago
And here I thought you read the bible. Are you referring to the entire chapters of 21 and 22? Or did you mean 21:22?
Heres how to keep in context, theres a prerequisite...in faith ('believing', depending on version), meaning when someone without faith in God or in the sincerity of the prayer, asks for anything, certainly the prayer wont be answered...why??? Its a test of God. Thou shall not tempt the Lord thy God.
More on context with other versus follows:
ufbret 2 years ago
James 4:2,3 says, "You do not have because you do not ask, you ask and do not receive because you ask wrongly to spend it on your passions."
Here is one like Matt 21:22:
Therefore, I tell you, whatever you ask in prayer, believe that you have received it and it will be yours. Mark 11:24
Now, lets put that one in context with an everyday example just for you. If I call a meeting with you, your mother and your girlfriend and I walk in the room and ask, "is everyone here"?
ufbret 2 years ago
You would answer "Yes, everyone is here"...certainly not everyone is here...after all, where is Hugo Chavez? Or anyone else outside your defeinition of "everyone"?
Obviously James has qualified the term "whatever" in my cross referenced verse, and the condition of the heart and sincerity of a prayer, qualifies the word "all" in your example.
ufbret 2 years ago
@ufbret
Have you proven the "god" you believe in is real?
If no, consider your attempt to make sense of the very nonsensical "bible" a complete waste of time.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Once again, your presupposition and predisposition wont allow for that to take place.
However, you set forth the original premise that "God isnt real".
All youve seem to do is detract from your premise. Youve tried to justify your position, and I just clearly explained away your defense as a typical noncontextual interpretation of scipture.
By all means, please try to defend your premise again, rather than detract....the onus is yours.
ufbret 2 years ago
@ufbret
I've addressed this with you. YOU are the one claiming a "god" exists. The burden of proof rests squarely with you.
By all means, write more repetitive nonsense designed to fool people into believing in your fairy-tale deity. Just don't expect anyone intelligent to agree with you.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Detraction from your premise again. I have addressed your questions. I gave you as an example to evidence of a creator (God), creation itself. Nothing has ever popped into existence. Behind art, was an artist, behind a building, a builder., behind creation a CREATOR...one more question you detracted from was "how did creation come into existence"? Got answers?
Your presupposition will not allow for you to be convinced. The evidence lies in your repeated ad hominem and bitterness.
ufbret 2 years ago
"Just don't expect anyone intelligent to agree with you. "
For you to make a claim that no one with intelligence can beleive in a creator is demonstrably false. IF you dont believe it takes intelligence to get the degree I have, then go get one yourself.
It amazes me to find an intelligent person who fights against something which he does not at all believe exists. --Mohandas Gandhi
ufbret 2 years ago
have you proven God isn't real
Have you proven that we go or do not go somewhere when we die?
Have you proven anything by the means of how the universe was created?
You cannot prove anything yet jump our case for believing in our Lord which requires Faith. Our Lord says we are saved by Faith in him. Go on having Faith in other things. You can no more prove yoru positiont than we can ours. Our Jesus was a real man and the Bible is real. No one can prove he never came and did what he did.
Noahedwinbeach2 2 years ago
I have, in many ways. Here's one:
The "god" of the 'bible" is described as calling bats BIRDS... twice!
Shouldn't an omniscient "god" know bats are NOT birds? Better still, shouldn't an omniscient "god" have known better than to leave the teaching of its existence to semi-barbaric goat herders who did not know bats are not birds?
You claim "Jesus" is real and that a "god" is real. PROVE IT.
Until you do, I and others who are intelligent are under NO obligation to believe.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Wow.,...heres a synopsis of yhour proof, apparently you never read my total thrashing of them:
birds/bats: your comparing an ancient classification system to a modern, man made biological system of nomencalture...its only proves two different systems, nothing more.
Matt 22:21: reflects your inbalilty to keep scripture in context.
Davids Kingdom: you, as an atheist claim its small..yet atheists only a decade ago insisted it didnt even exist.
Anything else?
ufbret 2 years ago
The "god" of the "bible" lists fowl (original Hebrew word "owph" meaning flighted birds, with feathers) that people should not eat. The list is in both Deuteronomy and Leviticus. Bats are included in both lists.
Don't you think a supposedly omniscient "god" should know better? Or, shouldn't a supposedly omniscient "god" have known it would be unwise to allow "his" story to be told by people who didn't know better?
Name one atheist who, a decade ago, claimed David wasn't real. I dare you.
ricksparks 2 years ago
What part of two different classification systems did you not understand? One from the ancients and another from modern biology?
Further, you offer this as a defense to your statement that "there is no God"...seriously?
ufbret 2 years ago
Well sir if you dont indent to have a respecful conversation with me i will no mince words with you. its a shame i would have liked to have a rival. However no matter the insults you contiue to spit at mt brothers in christ i will pray for you. good day sir
umboo890 2 years ago
How old were you when you were first told to believe in a "god" and why do you not realize you were lied to?
ricksparks 2 years ago
The universe exists. It is not infinitely old. If it were it would have run out of energy long ago. Therefore, it had a beginning. The universe did not bring itself into existence. Since it was brought into existence by something else, I assert that God is the one who created the universe.
ufbret 2 years ago
@ufbret
(yawn)
Prove there is a "god" and I'll believe in it. Make a bunch of assertions founded on the argument from ignorance and I will continue to write you off as just another fool for the oldest con game in the world.
NO evidence; NO god. It's that simple. To claim otherwise is to be a sucker or a liar.
ricksparks 2 years ago
At least your consistent in your ad hominem attacks.
ufbret 2 years ago
If you were a sucker, there would be no offense in calling you as such. A "sucker" is just a person who wasn't hip to the con man's game.
Only a liar would be offended by being identified as one.
Pretend that's an ad hominem all you like, but the fact remains that you are pretending to be offended in a way which a fool would not.
Are you a professional or a self-appointed proselytizer?
ricksparks 2 years ago
What brought the universe into existence? It would have to be greater than the universe and be a sufficient cause to it. The Bible promotes this sufficient cause as God. What does atheism offer instead of God? If nothing, then atheism is not able to account for our own existence.
ufbret 2 years ago
It's is not the job of "atheism" to provide an explanation of why we exist. Atheism is simply a state of rejecting the belief that some kind of "god" exists, especially when one considers that every "god" put forth by idiots like you are little more than projections of the humans who wrote scripture in order to attempt to control other humans.
Whatever science proves regarding the nature of the universe will be far grander than the idiotic "creation" story of the "bible." I guarantee it.
ricksparks 2 years ago
You cannot logically state that there is no God because you cannot know all things so as to determine that there is no God.
ufbret 2 years ago
You know nothing about logic. You believe a woman made from a rib snacked on some magical fruit while hanging out with a talking snake.
ricksparks 2 years ago
The formal study of logic,,,,yes, been there done that, in college, how about you?
ufbret 2 years ago
... and with that, you prove your real intent.
You're not out to prove a "god" exists. You're not out to debate this topic with truth.
You're only out to attempt to discredit your opponent (me).
FACT: The "bible" is fiction written by humans attempting to control other humans.
You are beyond a liar at this point. You are evil.
Is it power, money, or fame you crave? Or a combination?
ricksparks 2 years ago
Presupposition, straw men, red herrings....again and again....
ufbret 2 years ago
No logic, no proof, no ability to process rational thought...
That's you..
AGAIN and AGAIN.
When are you going to realize that FAITH is not PROOF?
ricksparks 2 years ago
Laughable....your faith in the creation of the universe is very strong.
Atheism is an intellectual position. What reasons do you have for holding that position? Your reasons are based upon lack of evidence So, is there any reason/evidence for you holding your position that you defend?
ufbret 2 years ago
Do you REALLY think that your asinine assumptions will impress anyone?
I've provided plenty of examples as to why i (and those who are intellectual) find the "god" of the "bible" to be a work of fiction. The fact that you continue to ask for more examples proves you are completely out of gas.
I've challenged you to provide the following more times than I can remember. This will be the last time.
PROVE there is a "god" and I will believe it.
Whatcha got?
(....as if I don't already know....)
ricksparks 2 years ago
Asked an answered again and again and again....I spend some volunteer time as a GAL...love that phrase asked and answered.
In order for you to truly know there is no God, you have to have all knowledge in all the universe...are you actually making that claim?
ufbret 2 years ago
No one intelligent thinks your comment makes sense.
ricksparks 2 years ago
And yet you assume the unvierse came into creation, how exactly??
ufbret 2 years ago
I assume the universe came into creation?
Are you drunk, stupid, or both?
ricksparks 2 years ago
Please reread,....I am asking for your explanation as to how the unverse began...hence, the "How exactly" followed by a question mark.
ufbret 2 years ago
Please answer my question...
Are you drunk, stupid, or both?
The fact that the universe exists is not proof that a "god" is real... ESPECIALLY the megalomaniacal, sexist, genocidal, slave driving deity of the "bible."
Why do you wish to be a slave and/or drive others to be slaves? Is it money, power, or fame you crave?
ricksparks 2 years ago
Please stop asking pressupositions....it clearly shows a lack of debating skill and exposing you as nothing more than a bitter angry person.
But, go ahead, like Pavlovs dogs...
Call me some more names.
ufbret 2 years ago
I have challenged you to prove a "god" exists.
You have failed.
You are a waste of time. I will no longer respond to your idiocy in this forum. My best wishes that you learn to be more than a force for evil in this world.
ricksparks 2 years ago
"All the strictly historical evidence we have is in favor of [the empty tomb], and those scholars who reject it ought to recognize that they do so on some other ground than that of scientific history."-William Wand, Oxford University, 1972)
ufbret 2 years ago
Wand!
You're a joke.
You might as well quote C.S. Lewis.
idiot.
ricksparks 2 years ago
The Existence of Valleys in the Seas - "The valleys of the sea were exposed and the foundations of the earth laid bare at the rebuke of the LORD, at the blast of breath from his nostrils," (2 Samuel 22:16).
ufbret 2 years ago
@ufbret
Keep in mind, the movie "Forrest Gump" refers to real world events. Shall we assume Bubba was a real person?
Of course not.
You're an evil person, engaged in trying to baffle people who follow ARGUMENTS FROM IGNORANCE.
Please stop being evil.
ricksparks 2 years ago
How does that relate to with valleys in the seas being written in the bible?
Terrific analogy.
ufbret 2 years ago
ufbret: I've already addressed this. The things the "bible" is right about is no more impressive than the fact that the movie "Forrest Gump" makes references to the recent U.S. past.
How old were you when you were first told to believe in a "god," and why do you not realize you're a brainwashed fool?
ricksparks 2 years ago
iii.If you say that atheism is supported by the lack of evidence for God, then it is only your opinion that there is no evidence. You cannot know all evidence for or against God, therefore you cannot say there is no evidence for God.
ufbret 2 years ago
You keep capitalizing the word "god." However, you have NOT proven one exists.
Do so. I dare you.
---
Fair warning: I know you can't. You are evil for attempting to convince people a deity exists without providing one shred of proof. Anyone who follows your "advice" is stupider than you.
ricksparks 2 years ago
If you say that atheism is simply lack of belief in a god, then my dog is an atheist the same as the tree outside and the road out front, since they also lack faith. Therefore, your definition is insufficient.
ufbret 2 years ago
You are atheist regarding RA.
You are atheist regarding KRISHNA.
You are atheist regarding ZEUS.
My definition is appropriate. You're an idiot for attempting to claim otherwise.
ricksparks 2 years ago
ii.I can no more prove to you that God is real than you can prove that the universe is all that exists. Your demand of proof precludes acknowledgement of many types of evidence because your presuppositions don't allow it.
ufbret 2 years ago
What did you delete, coward?
ricksparks 2 years ago
put it back in....too many typos....is that all you really have,,,name calling???
ufbret 2 years ago
You're a coward.
That's not an insult, it's a statement of fact. You hide behind a "bible" which is nonsense, you hide behind belief in a "god" which you STILL have not defined (which "god" is it, EXACTLY, that you believe in? I grow tired of asking...), and you hide behind verse which makes observations even the most vacant goat herder from the third century could have made.
You're a joke.
That's not a name. It's a fact.
NO evidence; NO god. It's that simple.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Red herring
ufbret 2 years ago
Your cliches are boring.
What did you delete, coward?
ricksparks 2 years ago
Read much?...I already wrote saying I "Put it back in"....not too surprising though
ufbret 2 years ago
The comment is still marked as DELETED.
Put it back, or consider yourself proved as a complete waste of time.
ricksparks 2 years ago
I reposted it....of course you really arent too interested in reading...sorry for that.
Here is is again, just for you.
To say "there is no proof for God's existence" is illogical because an atheist cannot know all things by which he could state that there is no proof. You can only say you have not yet seen a convincing proof.....after all, there may be one he hasn't yet seen.
ufbret 2 years ago
The fact that you claim a "god" may exists without clearly identifying it as the 'god" of the "bible" proves you are engaging in deception.
You are pretending that a "god" which ISN'T necessarily defined by the "bible" you are supporting may exists, in an attempt to convince me (and others) to believe in the very SPECIFIC "god" of the "bible."
Why are you an asshole? Money, power, or fame?
ricksparks 2 years ago
I claim God does exist, not may existI really cant catch you up on theology. and why I gave the names of God that I did...Im still hoping you go study logic on your own.....maybe you'll be able to do something other than call people names.
ufbret 2 years ago
WHICH "god?" You have, for many days, failed to address that very relevant question.
You are a waste of human skin.
ricksparks 2 years ago
I only gave a listing of HIs names.....apparently that didnt sink in to well
ufbret 2 years ago
Which version do you adhere to?
Answer clearly or consider yourself identified as a useless bag of guts.
ricksparks 2 years ago
The Hydrologic Cycle - ""He draws up the drops of water, which distill as rain to the streams; the clouds pour down their moisture and abundant showers fall on mankind," (Job 36:27-28); "The wind blows to the south and turns to the north; round and round it goes, ever returning on its course. All streams flow into the sea, yet the sea is never full. To the place the streams come from, there they return again," (Ecclesiastes 1:6-7).Pretty good for a time when men simply looked to Tefnut for rain
ufbret 2 years ago
@ufbret
Except, of course, the fact that the "bible" claims there are STOREHOUSES for snow.
In case anyone doesn't know, weather cycles do not rely upon STOREHOUSES.
Please stop being evil.
ricksparks 2 years ago
What terrific imagery that brings....of course nothing you just wrote debunks the hyrologic cycle laid out in the verses above. Try again.
ufbret 2 years ago
I realize you rely upon the ignorance of the people you are attempting to convince.
I encourage EVERYONE to study weather cycles and determine for themselves whether or not STOREHOUSES are part of the process which results in rain or snow.
ricksparks 2 years ago
To say "there is no proof for God's existence" is illogical because an atheist cannot know all things by which he could state that there is no proof. You can only say you have not yet seen a convincing proof.....after all, there may be one he hasn't yet seen.
ufbret 2 years ago
MAY be?
That's not proof. That's conjecture.
You're getting boring.
ricksparks 2 years ago
I can no more prove to you that God is real than you can prove that the universe is all that exists. Your demand of proof precludes acknowledgement of many types of evidence because your presuppositions don't allow it....and you are full of illogical presuppositions
ufbret 2 years ago
(yawn)
No evidence, no god. It's that simple.
You are a fool.
ricksparks 2 years ago
If you say that atheism needs no evidence or reason, then you are holding a position that has no evidence or rational basis? If so, then isn't that simply faith?
ufbret 2 years ago
I wrote no such thing.
I understand the need of religious adherents to pretend atheism is the same as faith. However, think clearly: 'Calling atheism a religion is like calling bald a hair color." -- (original quote by a person whose name currently escapes me)
Sad for you, I'm not the one who marked your comment as "spam."
Clearly, long before I encountered you, you've been identified as a useless waste of time. Ever wonder to yourself why that is?
ricksparks 2 years ago
It takes way more faith too believe what you believe about the existance of the universe,, than me believeing in a creator of the universe.
ii.If you say that atheism needs no evidence or reason, then you are holding a position that has no evidence or rational basis...thats faith
ufbret 2 years ago
I know you havent studied logic ....or fallacies like presuppositions, but:
I can no more prove to you that God is real than I can prove to you that I love my family. If you are convinced I don't love my family, no matter what I say or do will be dismissed by you as invalid. It is your presuppositions that are the problem, not whether or not God exists.
Of course, if you have no clue of what logic is, this means nothing, IM sure
ufbret 2 years ago
It seems you are writing as if the fact that you write it will make it true.
You're an idiot. You were either brainwashed as a child, or you were suckered as an insecure juvenile/adult.
What is the reason you need to not only believe in a "god," but what is driving you to attempt to convince ME that the "god" you believe in exists?
ricksparks 2 years ago
Presupposition again...? Really?
ufbret 2 years ago
I have asked you MANY times to identify which "god" you are referring to.
You have thus far not answered.
It's clear you have something to hide.
Consider yourself identified as a person with suspicious intentions.
Idiot.
ricksparks 2 years ago
El Shaddai
El Elyon
El Olam
Yahweh
Adonai
ufbret 2 years ago
Don't be confused, fellow humans. This person "ufbret" is NOT stupid. He is engaged in a very real effort to keep your minds muddled.
I wonder: what does he gain by doing so?
ricksparks 2 years ago
Wow...youve call me stupid and stupider over and over again...is this yet one more example of an ever adjusting position youve taken?
ufbret 2 years ago
PS....more appeal to sympathy....learned that one in my first logic class
ufbret 2 years ago
(yawn)
How old were you when you were first told to believe in a "god," and why do you not realize you're a brainwashed idiot?
ricksparks 2 years ago
Presupposition again....seriously...is that it? Thats your game?
ufbret 2 years ago
Im taking your silence to mean,,,,yes, I have advance my argument once again....now call me some names.
ufbret 2 years ago
Read out of context much?,,,the "May be" refers to a proof YOU HAVENT SEEN...let me know if you need further explaination
ufbret 2 years ago
There's nothing an idiot like you could explain to me.
The "bible" is fiction, originally invented by ancient Canaanites in order to control the minds of other humans. Prove otherwise, or admit the fact that you're a tool for the oldest con in the world.
ricksparks 2 years ago
The Existence of Water Paths (Ocean Currents) in the Seas - "O LORD, our Lord, how majestic is your name in all the earth!... When I consider your heavens, the work of your fingers, the moon and the stars, which you have set in place,... You made him [man] ruler over the works of your hands; you put everything under his feet... the birds of the air, and the fish of the sea, all that swim the paths of the seas," (Psalm 8:1,3,6,8).
ufbret 2 years ago
Bible authenticity..
The Round Shape of the Earth - "He sits enthroned above the circle of the earth, and its people are like grasshoppers. He stretches out the heavens like a canopy, and spreads them out like a tent to live in," (Isaiah 40:22"
Wow, not bad for a time when everyone thought the earth was flat
ufbret 2 years ago
Many people who lived during the time that part of the "bible" was written believed Earth was a flat CIRCLE.
So there's that.
ricksparks 2 years ago
I think I asked you for the scripture reference to a flat circle....and this is your reply? Seriously?
ufbret 2 years ago
You asked for no such thing.
However, don't expect I can't provide it. I'd wager I've studied the "bible" more than you.
---
Isaiah 11:12 - Jeremiah 16:19 - Daniel 4:11 - Matthew 4:8 - Job 38:4
ricksparks 2 years ago
Haaaaa....I debunked your four corners days ago....we still use the term today.,....to describe the earth or a specific gepgraphy in its entirety.....yeah, your a bible mental giant.
ufbret 2 years ago
It fascinates me that you think you're right. ANYONE can reference the verses I've provided and see the writers of the "bible" thought, quite clearly, that Earth was a flat expanse.
You're a joke. A useless, impotent, joke.
NO evidence; NO god. It's that simple.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Really...and yet anyone, with a clue, can look at the scripture I put in and see that the earth was suspended in nothing and round....but you of course
ufbret 2 years ago
(yawn)
The "god" of the "bible" claims bats are BIRDS. With feathers. In both Deuteronomy and Leviticus.
Do you think bats are birds?
ricksparks 2 years ago
You must be aware that it is modern science that has a different classification system than ancient times. To the ancients, creatures such as a bat were considered birds since they categorized all flying animals as birds. If that is the category that they used, then they were correct. It is not an error. It is a difference of categorization procedures....wow.,
ufbret 2 years ago
Sorry, but that particular part of the "bible" (both parts, actually) are attributed as DIRECT QUOTES from the character known as "god."
I know bats are not birds.
The "god" of the "bible" does not.
What does that tell you?
ricksparks 2 years ago
Wow....good stretch....just an fyi, from BIO, if you can remember your high school BIO class....modern classifications are just that MODERN and man made.
ufbret 2 years ago
Have you answered the following?
A) What do you mean when you refer to "god?"
B) What is your proof that a "god" exists?
Idiot.
I almost feel sorry for you. You don't even realize what a useful fool you've been.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Tool.....good one....Ive answered A, and I will repost my repsonse to B AGAIN, since you didnt catch it the first time:
I can no more prove to you that God is real than you can prove that the universe is all that exists. Your demand of proof precludes acknowledgement of many types of evidence because your presuppositions don't allow it.
What part of "DONT allow for it' is confusing to you?
ufbret 2 years ago
You admit you can't prove a "god" exists.
We're done.
NO evidence; NO god. It's that simple.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Not to you, your illogical stance...SEE presuppositions AGAIN...wont allow for it.
If you say that atheism is supported by the lack of evidence for God, then it is only your opinion that there is no evidence. You cannot know all evidence for or against God, therefore you cannot say there is no evidence for God.
ufbret 2 years ago
You clearly do not have a logical cell in your brain.
My condolences.
Prove there is a "god" and I'll believe in it. Keep referring to "god" as if one has proven itself real and I'll continue to identify you as a fucking idiot.
ricksparks 2 years ago
The authenticity of the bible:
Was Pontius real?
An inscription bearing he name of Pontius Pilate. A stone slab was uncovered in the Roman theater at Caesarea with the Latin words "Pointius Pilatus" and "Tiverius" in 1961.
ufbret 2 years ago
@ufbret
Irrelevant. Does not prove a "god" exists.
Please stop being evil.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Authenticity of the bible:
David captured the Jebusite city Kathleen Kenyon between 1961-1967 found the Jebusite walls. Captain Charles Warren found the water shaft through which Joab climbed to gain entrance to the city (2 Samuel 5:6-8).
ufbret 2 years ago
@ufbret
The "kingdom" of David has been proven by archaeologists to be little more than a cow town. Ref. William Dever, Israel Finkelstein.
Please stop being evil.
ricksparks 2 years ago
And to think, as recent;ly as 2002 atheists were claiming there was no evidence of Davids kingdom at all.(ref. Daniel Lazare). How much more will be discovered in the future I wonder.?
ufbret 2 years ago
I take your lack of rebuttal to be an agreement that the "kingdom" of David was nothing compared to what the "bible" aggrandized it to be.
Take note, those who are following this conversation. What ufbret leaves out is what he hopes you won't notice.
ricksparks 2 years ago
The authenticity of the bible:
Sir Flinders Petrie in 1912 confirmed great granaries and Joseph's Palace.
Only a few months ago, archeologists discovered ancient Egyptian coins bearing the name and image of the biblical Joseph, from Cairo's Al Ahram newspaper. The period in which Joseph was regarded to have lived in Egypt matches the minting of the coins in the cache, researchers said.
ufbret 2 years ago
@ufbret
Irrelevant. Since a majority of the "bible" was written centuries after the supposed time of the stories, any amount of such information could have been easily included within it.
Please stop being evil.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Its give validity to the story of Joseph, found in the bible.....I thought you said the bible was fiction?
ufbret 2 years ago
ufbret: "Joseph" has never been proven to have been a real person. You're ignorant or a liar if you claim otherwise.
Still waiting for you to prove a "god" exists.
Can't help but notice all you've done is attempt to prove the parts of the "bible" which ANY semi-intelligent goat herder living about two-thousand years ago might have expressed are true.
NO evidence; NO god. It's that simple.
ricksparks 2 years ago
"Joseph didnt exist"....Hence he is on coins with his description, likeliness and images of cows on the otherside
ufbret 2 years ago
Prove he was real. Please. I challenge you to do so.
---
FYI.. I know you can't. You are an ass, trying to convince people that fiction is representative of reality.
You are worse than a fool. You are clearly a very focused liar.
Why weren't you taught to be honest?
ricksparks 2 years ago
Uhhhh maybe the coins with his face, dates and starving cows would give you a clue.
ufbret 2 years ago
You didn't answer my challenge. Consider yourself identified as a liar and/or idiot.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Asked and answered over and over....so name calling, a whole list of fallacies, more name calling, presuppositions,more name calling...repeat...repeat...thats it? Your right, I should have contacted Hawkings...the conversation wouldnt be so elementary
ufbret 2 years ago
You're so brainless that you can't even spell his last name right. It's HAWKING.
You're a moron. Anyone who believes what you claim is even stupider than you.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Its funny, you are educated enough to to correct ufbret on the spelling of someones last name, but yet uneducated to the point of using "stupider" as a adjective..... "Stupider" is not a word, The correct usage is MORE stupid.....
ludachris1999 2 years ago
Yes, you've caught my sense of humor.
Still, ufbret has NOT proved a "god" exists in spite of the fact that everything he's written thus far is a pathetic attempt to claim one does. For that, he is much more stupid than I.
ricksparks 2 years ago
Authenticity of the bible: Luke is a historian of the first rank; not merely are his statements of fact trustworthy ... this author should be placed along with the very greatest of historians. Lukes history is unsurpassed in respect of its trustworthiness.
Sir William Ramsay
Nobel Prize Winner
Organic and Inorganic genius
ufbret 2 years ago
@ufbret
"Luke" has never been proven to have been a real person. In fact, most of the "gospels" were written WITHOUT a name attached, and only later were they added by the folks responsible for distribution in order to attempt to give the stories credence.
Please stop being evil.
ricksparks 2 years ago
I guess you know more than William Ramsay....of ocurse, his writing are his evidence, but hey,. if you want to contend with Ramsay, go ahead. Famous historian A.N. Sherwin-White declares:
In all, Luke names thirty-two countries, fifty-four cities, and nine islands without error. 8
For Acts the confirmation of historicity is overwhelming. . . . Any attempt to reject its basic historicity must now appear absurd.
ufbret 2 years ago