I think formula 1 today is very very very very easy to drive,but forumla 1 20 years ago was very hard to drive...=The drivers with the best car winning the championship not the best driver..
@MeBest777 Agreed - a very pale shadow of its golden days - those too young to remember have no idea what they missed - those old enough to remember cant bear to watch what its become. And i thionk its gonna get worse- Bernie now openly admitting that the traditional circuits will be dropped in favour of new era stuff in emerging markets - look forward in 1- years to more circuits like Turkey, Bahrain, Dubai, China, Valencia. And goodbye to Spa, Suzuka, maybe even Monza No thanks Bernie!
@mallamoozoo i agree its a utter tragedy to drop historic tracks but come on f1=dead? no way we just had the most exciting season in all of f1 history (according to the majority) this is what ill be talking about when im older fantasizing the past like you are (no offense, happens a lot) but the major problem i see is how f1 is trying to find its place in a changing global environment from ancient fossil fuels to new sources of power but no matter what happens 1 thing is true it must be done!!
@laxstevo1 "2010 was the best season ever according to the majority" ???? LMAO! YOU CANNOT BE SERIOUS!
No - only according to the majority of people who weren't watching F1 before 2000 - but anyone who was around from 85 to 95 knows that the sport is a pale imitation of its former glory.
2010: small engine small tyre small wing cars on small tracks and small drivers (Webber, Button):
1980's: 3.5 lt atmo + 1.6 lt turbo monsters on balls-out circuits like Osterreichring with GIANTS Senna+Prost.
@mallamoozoo Four drivers with a chance to win at the last race? Five in the running with two races left? Did you pay attention to the season at all? I won't deny the greatness of Senna and Prost but comparing a retired driver to one that is near the beginning of his career doesn't really make much of a point. I expect Vettel, Hamilton, and probably Alonso will each win at least one more championship. Have FIVE world champions ever sat on the grid together before? I hope 2011 is as good as 2010.
@Richardsmusic Not sure what ur point is? Are you saying that 10 D-grade drivers vying for the Title is better than the 2 greatest of all time (Senna and Prost) slugging it out in the same car? I certainly couldn't agree less - to prove my point i will extend your point to a conclusion extreme enough to make it apparent to you:-Go to any gokart race and there are 40 drivers who could win - but it isnt the same level of interest - why? - because the drivers aren't as highly recognized. Capiche?
@laxstevo1 let me correct myself maybe i meant closest one in recent memory and i believe it was the new york times that said that it was the best in 60 years maybe thats why i said that which may not be a reliable source for and f1 opinion since they prob dont know much about f1 since they were calling the drivers mr. webber and mr schumacher but either way i couldnt keep myself awake through a grand prix unless there was a moment anyone else beside a front runner was winning
@laxstevo1 New York times? That would be New York USA - U.S.A. - which deosn't even have an F1 race some years because they have so little interest in it - the USA doesn't know F1 from its ass - that opinion is irrelevant (and its a general journalism piece anyway - not specialist motorsport)
With experience you start to realize that every 5 years the best season of that 5 years gets called "the best season of all time".
F1 is lame now - lame cars, lame circuits. It cant possibly beat the 80's
@laxstevo1 but what needs to get done is a prob one of the hardest transitions this sport will ever face to keep itself "relevant" to industry so money will still poor into f1 from them but this wil mean eventually a new source of energy to power the cars(which i will completely agree will be a tragedy but it will happen and if we dont start acting now we might lose the sport due to "wastefulness" and "irrelevance" to the modern world kinda get the gist of what im saying?
@laxstevo1 Yes I agree - they need to run on bio-fuel OR go electric. Electric would be good except that they make little noise which would kill the spectacle - so i cant imagine that ever being adopted. (Perhaps they could adopt electric cars and allow a 20 kilogram weight allowance to carry a hi-output sound system and play CD's of the 1990 V12 Ferrari and V10 Honda - man they were SWEEEEET!)
@mallamoozoo i agree its a utter tragedy to drop historic tracks but come on f1=dead? no way we just had the most exciting season in all of f1 history (according to the majority) this is what ill be talking about when im older fantasizing the past like you are (no offense, happens a lot) but the major problem i see is how f1 is trying to find its place in a changing global environment from ancient fossil fuels to new sources of power but no matter what happens 1 thing is true it must be done
Senna the best of the best, the myth, someone who will never reach your shadow. If I had a time machine back and hampering him from participating in the race imola, that the myth still alive. He was not human, not a human being could not do what he fezia races, he should be an alien to do what I did. SENNA FOREVER!
@gthilly1 Thats why i actually watch archives (and now YouTube) more than current F1- I half heartedly watch the races now- I don't care about F1 now- the sport peaked in this era and was so much better in every way than it is now- there is nothing of interest now- it's all been done before and in a much better way- in the golden era of mid 80s to mid 90s. There is nothing left to keep my interest.
People say; "You can't live in the past"
I say; "I can, I do and I will...because it was BETTER!"
@chouzouris However, F1 back in the 80s were alot more fragile. AIRBORNE=LIKELY DEATH. DO you want that happen when everyone is talking about safety?? I know any racing in itself involves high risks, just saying that the FIA were forced to make sure driver's safety is the first priority somehow. What I agree with you though is that F1 back in those days were alot better looking, true speed machines.
@coinjoin Most drivers would perhaps not have crashed (though they might have) but what was amazing about Senna was that when he was spectacular like this - it wasn't a mistake as it usually is when things get speccy- it was Senna being blindingly fast!- Eg here at 8:21- when most drivers get power oversteer- they lose time- Senna uses it here to SAVE time- ie go faster. There's a big difference - the first is easy to do- its a wide band- the latter requires absolute genius - its a razor's edge!
All F1 drivers are exceptional drivers (take out Montoya)in those days it was really more like the pilot that made the difference and it was more difficult to ride on the limit with cars at 1200pk and no electronic aids continious correcting the car
nowa days F1 has to much electronic aids...same in motogp
and senna had something more then all other F1 drivers we've seen today...he had a connection with the feeling of a car like no other pilot has its unexplainable
@eraserke Agreed - Senna's talent - car control and pure speed - were totally and utterly inexplicable - the most staggering talent the whole world of sport has ever seen. (I know Rossi is good in his sport - but I feel its more of the Schumacher variety - the best of his time but not unquestionably the greatest ever as Senna is in F1 and certainly not as mysteriously talented. Senna was superhuman - really from another dimension.
When Senna saw that Prost did a good lap, he left the boxes, and, in the end of qualifying, hit our best lap, and 0.694 scnds gap to Prost. Senna doesn´t need tos gou out track, but he try, and hit our time, SIMPLY THE BEST SENNA....
We are all Senna loyalist here and when you say something like that that makes me wonder if your as sharpe as you need to be talking about this. he is like Senna but he doesn't qualify as well. Well that doens't make him anything like Senna now does it? Its like saying he is like Alain Prost but he likes to eat his brakes up. Hamilton is a product of Mclaren. The closet comparision to Ayrton Senna is Jim Clark...
No one reminds of of Senna and I have followed F1 for 30 plus years. Senna doesn't act like a litle bitch when a team gives him info about the car that he doesn't like. Senna does what he wants. He doens't need his daddy to come from Brazil to tell him what to do, he'll run your ass off the road and let you know who is boss if you get in his way...he doesn't back into a championship by comming in 5th in the title run.
Everyone who has seen Senna racing knows that he would own Schumacher... But people tend to forget as the time goes by... Senna was the best driver; he was the fastest and the most skilled
you are right bro he was kicking evrybodys asses even when there were competion alan, mansel ect. now schumacher give me a break. schumacher was breathing SENNAS exhaust when he was alive THE RAINMAN IS GONE BUT HE HE WILL LIVE IN OUER HEARTS AND MINDS FOREVER R.I.P bro.
@dea1able The more tursn you have and the more movement you have, Senna would inch further and further away....No one can ever explain how he got 1.5 second ahead of Prost in qualifying..i wasn't as if he skipped a chicane. I start to blieve some of this stuff he is talking about. Its beyond what he could do at times..so at times his higher power guilds him.
yeah i dont like f1 cars nowdays (just like the drivers). These were real cars and real drivers. The other ive noticed is how fast the f1 cars look going around that circuit than the v8 supercars. Adelaide is a dangerous track.
Indeed mate - the F1 cars blow the V8 supercars out of the water - back in the Grand Prix days - the v8s were just a support class for the big boys of F1 and they were around HALF A MINUTE PER LAP slower!!!!!! That means the F1's would lap them within just 3 laps - or about 25 times over the race distance - yessiree - F1 is a completely different universe.
I once drove the AGS driven here by Dalmas at 3:30 - and believe me - F1 cars are absolute rocketships - I mean I love driving fast but that wasa mindblowing experience - i realized even the worst F1 drivers are supermen.
@vodafonemclarenf1fan I agree with you. Those cars and pilots (especially Senna, Prost and Mansell) were great. But I thonk this F1 season is very good, and that Hamilton is the new Senna (I know anybody would be as good as Senna for me but Hamilton remainds me Senna, except that he doesn´t qualify like the brazilian).
realistically - he will struggle to even be mediocre, let alone match the greatest of all time - lets face it - he doesnt have the experience and is only there due to his name.
Current F1 could keep cars and tracks from 80's and 90's, and just spend the money on some saftey and some more speed... why the fuck spend billions on traction control so that anyone could drive a f1 car.
Why even spend billions making the cars 2 seconds a lap faster - cap the budget at $25 million a year per team instead of $500 million and no-one will notice that they are doing 1.24's instead of 1.21's
F1 administration is more incompetent than any recalcitrant Government - they only exist through dictatorship - they are too incompetent to survive in a competitive model. Ecclestone and Mosely are fascists!
more important than TC is the chassis developments since 1990 - the cars now handle so well and are so much easier to drive - the driver workload is a mere 25% of what it used to be - today's drivers have no idea how much more difficult it was 20 years ago - they would struggle to get within 5 seconds of senna in a 1990 car.
Yeah - the cars from this era are my all time favourite - they look perfect - low flat wide and with 18 inch rear, and 15 inch front tyres!
THATS how F1 cars should look. And that's just when stopped - the body language is even more beautiful - without high tech engineering these cars moved around and forced the driver to really work hard to keep it under control.
The commpetitors are soo good (prost, piquet, berger, alesi, mansell...), that was the great time of F1, and gives us a bigg reason to say that Ayrton was the biggest driver in F1!!!!
and well if the obvious didn't happen in 1994, the 1994 season could have been a real interesting one with Senna, Hill and Schumacher all fighting for the championship
senna would have continued to pulverize Hill as he did in Brazil (lapping him) and therefore comfortably beaten Schumacher who only beat Hill by 1 point and even that by ramming hill out in Adelaide.
Nah - best season ever was probably 89 (even though senna didnt officially win he was crushingly dominant - just bad luck with multiple mechanical failures).
Also Prost at his peak was better than Schui at his peak - so i think we saw the greatest seasons ever in 88,89.
And BTW this clips Shows us what a F1 car is Supposed to look like low wide fat slick tires. And the sound of the engines the sound of the Ferrari and the Mclaren just gives me goosebumps.
Exactly! The FIA messed it up completely. They made the teams focus on the aerodynamics and thus heavily investing in wind tunnels. They should have restricted the aerodynamics and leave more mechanical freedom. They instead created crappy looking cars with all the same technology inside! They also banned tech that could have been used in cars like infenitely variable transmissions (Willams tested it already 20 years ago!). I hope they allow the KERS again!
But often Prost (or anyone else) didn't get it down to even with a second- Senna was often on pole by a second or more. The greatest was Monaco 88 - 1.4 seconds over Prost in the same car - Prost said his car was great and it was a good lap - he had no explanation - of course at that stage Senna was known as the fastest but not yet appreciated by how much. After Senna's career ended Prost acknowledged that he was simply in another world in qualifying - untouchable.)
Yeah - as he often was - that was par for the course for The Mighty One - while the others were separated by tenths - The SpeedMeister of all-time was a clear second or more off in another league - a world of his own where the others literally couldn't even believe much less match.
Murray Walker and James Hunt did all the commentary in this era. The guy at the very start is Ken Sutcliffe - a generic sports journalist in Australia who doesn't understand much about motorsport.
But he once said; "In all my years covering sport, I've never seen the impact that Ayrton Senna's death has had Worldwide!"
yeah but there's always so much traffic and many median strips interrupt the flow - its not like you can take racing lines - except the infield section - even there its dodgy as so many people are walking around and they look at you and call the cops if you so much as squeal a tyre - see my other video where i drove round there - people were pissed off with me at just 100kph (where F1's did 270kph).
Or the main straight where F1's hit 320kph the speed limit is just 60kph.
and I came to the conclusion that the reaso is quite profound - its because he wanted to be.
Yes every driver wants to be, but Senna wante it more - his passion was of another order altogether -driving was really his religion - and he was the most fanatical driver there ever was - it took him to places that most people can't even imagine much less match - in effect it meant he was in a trance where time slowed down. MAGIC!
I wanted to ask your opinion but you pretty much gave me an answer...It was about you saying somewhere that if Schumi had played fair he might have been able to reach Prost...my question was why you did not mention Senna,if Schumi played fair could he be another Senna and also if in your opinion any current driver's skill reminds you of Senna and in which way...Anyone who wants is welcome to reply too of course,but Malla I really would like your opinion on this;)))
@arhavlisj Sorry for 10 month wait on reply - I just saw ur question!
My opinion is that in some ways aschumi was better than Prost and in other ways Prost was better - who would win most depends on circumstances (eg wet races Schui was better, but Prost was better at preserving tyres whilst maintaining good speed.)
But Senna was better than both of them in almost every way.
As for the current era of drivers - my opinion is that technology has now partially ruined the sport - the artistry of really high-performance driving such as we saw 20 years ago has been lost, "dumbed down"- the cars are now so good. Most people think of it as "paddle shift is 10 times easier than manual shift" but I am talking more about the art of car control - engineers have now optimized parameters of control, response, stability etc so that its now MUCH easier than it was 20 years ago.
@mallamoozoo thanks mate better late than never....and it was great hearing from you again....check out TOP Gear tribute to Ayrton when you have time....says it all....
I also Think he had a natural hability for driving in such a High skill. Plus how much he wanted to be always in the top. Awesome video thank you for posting
if senna had raced for 15 years he would have had more than 100 pole positions of course ,very great to have so many pole positions with great opponents.
I think Schui was better than Hill and Villeneuve (to be fair) but he was certainly exaggerated way beyond his real quality by the circumstances he found himself in - Mansell and prost retired, Senna killed and ferrari ramping up their program to never-before-seen levels (and handing it all to him exclusively with team orders bullshit). Yes- altogether too convenient- i consider he deserved 2 Titles- i dont even acknowledge anything he did at Ferrari.
What I'm about to say is probably immoral but, Senna's death is the most fitting death he can have ever have. Like everyone who retires from a job they love, Senna would have died of boredom after his would-be career. Senna, the samurai of driving.
Yes i know what you mean - I have thought the same thing. He himself said once he thought he would never find anything ever again to compare with racing. He was born for nothing else but racing - the most pure racing driver of all time - a racing machine with the heart of a samurai. So in that sense it was a fitting end - he actually died leading a Formula 1 Grand Prix - sort of poetic.
But i wish he had of hung around - he was a great man with a lot more to give.
You are right but mate he was 34!And I can't stop thinking how much more he could have contributed to the sport if he was still alive,even from outside the cockpit that is....
I am sad I miss him deeply he could have achieved so much more...Along with him died his inexplicable ability behind the wheel....That's what the sport lost.....A huge huge loss to say the least...
But at least he didn't suffer didn't live to be unable to drive...That would be worse than dying for him.....
Yes - he said that too - just months before he died in january 94 - he said if he ever had a bad crash he'd rather be killed instantly than handicapped because he couldnt face life handicapped.
But yes an immeasurable loss to F1, sport in general and the wider world - god knows what that formidable commitment and intellect would have achieved when applied to other issues - maybe even becoming Brazilian president. Truly the biggest waste of talent that ever happened - it's STILL gutting!
Well I am a fan of most English drivers and proud for their great achievements and I have high hopes for Hamilton well not Button;-) but still I can't just deny the plain fact that Senna was much better than them all
Yep - about 100 years ahead. Even 15 years later there is not an athlete on the planet that operates anywhere near his level of commitment and talent. His speed was so far ahead of the rest - it was like a 100 metre runner running 9.0 second 100 metre runs. He was another level again ahead of the others what Usain Bolt is foot racing.
From what I understand you are a racing driver right?
Then why don't you take the time to explain to all fools out there how it feels and what it takes to race and especially a F1 car in the 80's and 90's.
People like you know better and if you stand up for Senna then maybe it's like better than 10 of us who are just spectators.
Senna is noy only the fastest but also the more all around complete driver there ever was.
Ive done my best mate - Ive posted more comments on this subject on You Tube than anyone else. But some people will always think the Earth is flat despite mountains of evidence.
You are 100% right - Senna was not only the fastest but also the most complete package of all time. Quote from Encyclopedia of F1;
'Senna was the greatest driver ever to grace a circuit - perhaps the ultimate sportsman - the one who came closer to perfection in his activity than any other."
zentralwerkstatt, a checkbook alone in racing will only take you so far, you still have to have the talent, which Senna clearly did and it was frequently shown just like in this video. Senna worked his ass off more than any other driver even though he was a natural at racing. Some eople seem to think his talent just magically appeared because he had money or some other dum reason. He just wanted it more than anyone else, so he did what was necessary to win and that's exactly what he did.
Besides - the Senna family weren't FILTHY rich - take a look at the house - its not exactly a Beverly Hills mansion - its just an upper-middle class home. Senna would have spent less than $100,ooo in getting to F1 (eg. 10,ooo pounds for F.Ford 2000) - yes thats more than most kids can find but it hardly compares to the millions kids spend getting there today. Today's racing kids are more like Hollywood brats than dedicated sportsmen.
Yep - racing was actually literally Senna's real religion! It's how he identified himself, filtered reality, perceived life and consciousness - everything a religion is. Senna was 100 years ahead of any other sportsman on Earth.
I'm convinced that was the basis for his incomprehensible speed - when he drove he was in a psychologically altered state - a trance - where he perceived time in finer detail than everyone else - he effectively warped his spacetime with mind power. He was VERY special.
Zentra man Iast time we talked I told you how unbelievably morinic it is ti assume that Schumacher''developed'' a car!Hello???he went to Ferrari one of the best teams and Brawn?ever heard o him?
There has never been a driver more opportunist than Schumi and he was offered among other things a contract that IN NO WAY COULD HIS TEAMMATE CHALLENGE!
And complete driver???yes he was great but under pressure?are u sure?
And what about his competition?Villeneuve ?Coulthard?Seriously?
What Schumi makes the greatest is that he is the most complete driver of F1 ever. Senna was undoubtedly tremendous! But the difference is that Schumi had to work all his carreer and EARN his racing-material. Senna just got his driving material under the christmas tree, because his parents were millionairs. This behaviour is seen in later days, Senna seeked the best cars, Schumi developed winning teams from crap!! This bravery to take such challenges costed Schumi numbers of championships!!!
Yes Senna was a rich kid and never worked normal jobs - but almost none of the f1 drivers ever had real jobs (Mansell and Hill are the only two i know of in the past 20 years.) Schumi never had a real job either - he raced karts as a kid and teenager and went into cars with money from his Dad's friend.
So don't try to turn his background into a rags to riches story - he had more privilege in life than most people.
So what if Senna was rich?This is as moronic as saying Senna became a legend after his death!
He had help to begin with he was lucky but he won his mane on his own merit and that;s that!
What if a great surgeon or lawyer came from rich families who could provide for them an adequate education,would anyone trust them any less or underrate them cause of their families?????
As for your delusion that Schui actively sought for rubbish teams to 'develop'- absolute BULLSHIT-he started his career at benetton (ignore 1 corner in a jordan). Then in 16 years he only changed teams ONCE! And he only chose ferrari knowing damn well of their plan to steal all Benetton's key technical staff - so actually its the complete opposite of what you think- he went to ferrari not to develop them but knowing the tech developments would soon give him the best car AND team orders. Got it?
So following the same ridiculous logic - you have to conclude that Senna went to mcLaren after they got smashed by Williams in 87 - and promptly turned them into a supercar that won 15 of 16 races.
Clearly bullshit too - obviously the tech guys made the car aweseome - and its exactly the same with Schui going to Ferrari.
Grow up and start to understand things more realistically instead of in a simplistic fantasy way.
senna only sought one car which was when he moved to Williams and that's because of his tremendous desire to win. Every driver wants the best car, not just the children of millionaires. And it wasn't even the best car when he got it, and he still put it on pole in the first race of '94.
Ok this is like the most crappy comment ever about Schumacher and I need to share it.
Zentralwerkstatt thinks that before Schumacher all drivers were a bunch of egotistical noobs that knew nothing but cause accidents...Then came Schumacher the great altruist humanist Braveheart to teach us all about F1...OH MY GOD ......I mean you posted this elsewhere but I just needed some of my friends from around the world to see this...
I mean this is like worse than Barnevelddarts videos.lololololol
Yeah I know that guy too..he posts rubbish....fangio clark gilles stewart Prost Senna all useless ha?????oh well are you sure this is not Barveldarts again????:))))))))
I agree completely mallamoozoo! It seems like the most gifted drivers were taken away from us so prematurely and suddenly. Schumi's 7 titles don't seem like much after you watch one of Senna's qualy laps!
Thats going a bit too far - Schui yeah but Senna and Prost were HUGE - but yeah Gilles was in that league - its a tragedy that Gilles was killed so early - just 68 GP under his belt (Look at Senna, Prost and Schu after 68 GP and they hadnt great stats either) - Gilles was lightning fast - perhaps Senna-esque for pure speed - can you just imagine qualifying sessions with Gilles Villeneuve and Ayrton Senna as team-mates in the same car - oh my god that would have been mindblowing.
Gilles and Senna racing 2gether was always l the ultimate dream race for me.
That is why I believe that it is soooo stupid to compare Senna to Schumacher(Senna being so superior a driver in so many ways),we should rather wish Gilles had not died so soon so we could see him race with Ayrton and Alain.
Still maintain though Senna was by far the driver with the greatest skill an practically every situation on the track!
Yes - Gilles is possibly the only driver whose raw talent can be compared with Senna's (maybe Clark too but i wasnt around then). But Senna took it all to a not just a new level but into the stratosphere with his religious-style of commitment - the likes of which has no equal in sport. Senna was the most talented drive ever AND the most committed - the combination of which made him literally beyond belief. He was damn nearly perfect.
Isn't it almost too hard to believe that Senna, Villeneuve and Clark were probably the 3 most talented drivers of all time and all died young - at the wheel?
Apparently all nice guys too. There is no justice in this life!
I was too young to see Gilles,but having heard of him,and loving F1 so much,I did my own search in 1984(when I first started watching f1 and realized how brilliant a driver he was...Clark also,I feel those 3 shared what I call a perfect driving ability...They could drive beyond the level other drivers could ever reach...
You know Senna said in one of his early(1986)interviews that the best driver ever would be Villeneuve if only one could add self control to him...
Actually - it was Gilles death that alerted me to the sport of F1. I was 10 and we got home from holidays and Dad had brought a copy of Auto Action I think the paper was called and he opened it up and read the front page and threw the paper down in disgust! I said 'What's wrong Dad?" and he said "I hate it when one of the good guys goes down the tubes". That made me think this sport must be something special - if guys were prepared to risk death for it. I then learned just how great Gilles was.
I then became interested in F1 and watched the rise of Prost then Senna. I was watching the 94 GP at Imola with Dad when Senna went off and this time I discovered the horrible feeling of losing a hero. I have a friend whose sport is boxing and I explained to him that seeing Senna - the greatest of all time - die live on TV was like a boxing fan see Mohammed Ali be killed in the ring in his prime - and thus he understood what it meant to Senna fans- just horrible.
Wish younger fans did a little more search though,I mean now with the Internet and y tube it is so easy to see and learn about these huge drivers.
Instead I am just appalled reading how Schumacher is the greatest why?Because he has 7 titles,so what?
Senna told Stewart in an interview that his sole aim was to win every race not the championships or stats,just to be better and faster in every race...this is the essence of racing IMO...
Exactly my friend - you understand the true essence of a racing driver. Villeneuve also said (I think to Enzo Ferrari but I am not sure) he aimed to win every race - not to collect points to win a World Championship.
Senna's whole reason for existence was to push his limits - thats why even if he was already on pole he'd go out for another lap - just to see how far he could go.
Schui's stats leave me cold - due mainly to circumstances he was just plain lucky to be in.
This mentality of Schu's fans though has turned F1 to what it is now!
I mean Hamilton comparing himself to Senna on his first years?Being as arrogant as can be claiming that he is is the best?Sure he can think it but in no way he should say these things in the open...
Anyhow I must admit that I would never have expected so many Senna haters out there,is it just ignorance or the inability to accept there was one driver so much above the rest and still not replaced in F1?I just dont understand.
Hamilton is a knob - in his first year saying "I feel i am achieving the same things Prost and Senna did" WHAT? GET A GRIP SON - winning in the best car, even in rookie year, does not equal what Prost and Senna achieved.
This 09 season is exactly what Hamilton needed to drop the cockiness (lets hope so).
I feel the golden years of F1 are gone - the sport has changed and it is now "plastic" where it once was real. The cars are too easy to drive now - overgrown go-karts. I like my 20th century!
I'd forgotten that - thanks for reminding me - yes indeed Senna did say that - and that's what Senna was - the raw talent and speed of Gilles Villeneuve allied with ultra commitment and discipline. Perfection!
Senna was great! I saw him qualify in McLaren at Hungaroring in 1992 (and Hakkinen in Lotus!), still remember his handwave after the qualification. "Better things to come", he seemed to say.
It's so refreshing to actually read a proper discussion on here for once, written by knowledgeable fans who can actually compose an eloquent sentence.
So much so, I'm finally commenting on my first video. Unfortunately, I'm off back into work now, but I'll be back to add my thoughts...
Senna though; genius. It's a shame well never, ever, have anyone like him again. One of my favourite videos on here is his Qualifying lap at Spa in 1991. Tells you everything you ever needed to know about Senna.
I am sure you saw the 1990 Belain GP.....Senna made 3 perfects starts that day, the first one,,,,the second one and finally after the second red flag,,,,he freaking made another perfect start without breaking the clutch...come on if the na sayers can't respect that,,,they just refuse to accept his greatness.
Yeah I remember that - wondering whether their clutches would take a 3rd start. I think James hunt mentioned that it was high risk as they arent designed for 3 starts. Senna was awesome at Spa in the rain that day.
But here is the thing I always said about that 89 Race. Prost had done everyting to the best of his ability and gotten every break possible...the good start and the early lead. And if this is a race that the 2 best driver was driving at their best then I see one thing, ultimately, the best driver Senna had made up all the gap and as of that time, with 8 laps to go at that point, Prost had nothing left to conter Senna....So one last move at the chicane was his only choice..Senna was comming hard
Prost actually jumped the start- not illegal then as it is now so it wasn't cheating - but it wasn't that he got ahead of Senna by better driving. Nonetheless he pulled a small gap, but the fact that it closed down later in the race indicates strongly that Prost set his car up for full tanks- Senna for light tanks- and as you imply, the situation evened out with 8 laps to go- so you could say that was a measure of Senna's overall superiority- 8 laps of 53 (15%).
What can I say, it was a titanic battle with both men ready. Yes there were minor mistakes here and there but nothing that either couldn't overcome,,,Senna's biggest mistake. A very slight wheel spin at the start that cause him to lift off....that allow the whole thing to happen. How often does Senna make a not so perfect start,,,and how often does Prost make a great start? I would say that It is more rare for Senna to make a mistake at the start. If not for that,,Senna would have been gone
I think formula 1 today is very very very very easy to drive,but forumla 1 20 years ago was very hard to drive...=The drivers with the best car winning the championship not the best driver..
shwedishv8power 11 months ago 2
absolute amazing!! AYRTON WE LOVE YOU WE FORGOT YOU NEVER!!!
shwedishv8power 1 year ago
f1 is totally boring and dead now a days.
MeBest777 1 year ago
@MeBest777 Agreed - a very pale shadow of its golden days - those too young to remember have no idea what they missed - those old enough to remember cant bear to watch what its become. And i thionk its gonna get worse- Bernie now openly admitting that the traditional circuits will be dropped in favour of new era stuff in emerging markets - look forward in 1- years to more circuits like Turkey, Bahrain, Dubai, China, Valencia. And goodbye to Spa, Suzuka, maybe even Monza No thanks Bernie!
mallamoozoo 1 year ago 4
@mallamoozoo
agree 100% with you. One day I will looks all the races from 1982 - 1999 :)
MeBest777 1 year ago
@mallamoozoo i agree its a utter tragedy to drop historic tracks but come on f1=dead? no way we just had the most exciting season in all of f1 history (according to the majority) this is what ill be talking about when im older fantasizing the past like you are (no offense, happens a lot) but the major problem i see is how f1 is trying to find its place in a changing global environment from ancient fossil fuels to new sources of power but no matter what happens 1 thing is true it must be done!!
laxstevo1 11 months ago
@laxstevo1 "2010 was the best season ever according to the majority" ???? LMAO! YOU CANNOT BE SERIOUS!
No - only according to the majority of people who weren't watching F1 before 2000 - but anyone who was around from 85 to 95 knows that the sport is a pale imitation of its former glory.
2010: small engine small tyre small wing cars on small tracks and small drivers (Webber, Button):
1980's: 3.5 lt atmo + 1.6 lt turbo monsters on balls-out circuits like Osterreichring with GIANTS Senna+Prost.
mallamoozoo 11 months ago 12
@mallamoozoo Four drivers with a chance to win at the last race? Five in the running with two races left? Did you pay attention to the season at all? I won't deny the greatness of Senna and Prost but comparing a retired driver to one that is near the beginning of his career doesn't really make much of a point. I expect Vettel, Hamilton, and probably Alonso will each win at least one more championship. Have FIVE world champions ever sat on the grid together before? I hope 2011 is as good as 2010.
Richardsmusic 11 months ago
@Richardsmusic Not sure what ur point is? Are you saying that 10 D-grade drivers vying for the Title is better than the 2 greatest of all time (Senna and Prost) slugging it out in the same car? I certainly couldn't agree less - to prove my point i will extend your point to a conclusion extreme enough to make it apparent to you:-Go to any gokart race and there are 40 drivers who could win - but it isnt the same level of interest - why? - because the drivers aren't as highly recognized. Capiche?
mallamoozoo 11 months ago 2
@Richardsmusic And yes - in fact SIX World Champs have competed simultaneously before.
1984/85: Senna, Prost, Mansell, Piquet, Lauda, Rosberg
mallamoozoo 11 months ago 3
@laxstevo1 let me correct myself maybe i meant closest one in recent memory and i believe it was the new york times that said that it was the best in 60 years maybe thats why i said that which may not be a reliable source for and f1 opinion since they prob dont know much about f1 since they were calling the drivers mr. webber and mr schumacher but either way i couldnt keep myself awake through a grand prix unless there was a moment anyone else beside a front runner was winning
laxstevo1 11 months ago
@laxstevo1 New York times? That would be New York USA - U.S.A. - which deosn't even have an F1 race some years because they have so little interest in it - the USA doesn't know F1 from its ass - that opinion is irrelevant (and its a general journalism piece anyway - not specialist motorsport)
With experience you start to realize that every 5 years the best season of that 5 years gets called "the best season of all time".
F1 is lame now - lame cars, lame circuits. It cant possibly beat the 80's
mallamoozoo 11 months ago 10
@laxstevo1 but what needs to get done is a prob one of the hardest transitions this sport will ever face to keep itself "relevant" to industry so money will still poor into f1 from them but this wil mean eventually a new source of energy to power the cars(which i will completely agree will be a tragedy but it will happen and if we dont start acting now we might lose the sport due to "wastefulness" and "irrelevance" to the modern world kinda get the gist of what im saying?
laxstevo1 11 months ago
@laxstevo1 Yes I agree - they need to run on bio-fuel OR go electric. Electric would be good except that they make little noise which would kill the spectacle - so i cant imagine that ever being adopted. (Perhaps they could adopt electric cars and allow a 20 kilogram weight allowance to carry a hi-output sound system and play CD's of the 1990 V12 Ferrari and V10 Honda - man they were SWEEEEET!)
LOL
mallamoozoo 11 months ago 5
@mallamoozoo i agree its a utter tragedy to drop historic tracks but come on f1=dead? no way we just had the most exciting season in all of f1 history (according to the majority) this is what ill be talking about when im older fantasizing the past like you are (no offense, happens a lot) but the major problem i see is how f1 is trying to find its place in a changing global environment from ancient fossil fuels to new sources of power but no matter what happens 1 thing is true it must be done
laxstevo1 11 months ago
Remake the beast that Senna rode. Let Hamilton, Schummacher and everyone else try to drive it. I want to see how they tame it.
tmeu 1 year ago
3 brazilians drivers in the top 8. afraid to never see that again...
andrelhpdf 1 year ago
Senna in the McLaren. That was a hero for me when I watched F1 on tv as a little kid. Today when I know more about him he is an even greater hero.
I just hope that the 2013 turbo cars will be raw beasts that drivers will love to race. Hopefully we can enter a new golden era of turbo F1.
McLarenMercedes 1 year ago
Senna the best of the best, the myth, someone who will never reach your shadow. If I had a time machine back and hampering him from participating in the race imola, that the myth still alive. He was not human, not a human being could not do what he fezia races, he should be an alien to do what I did. SENNA FOREVER!
gvnsport 1 year ago 2
Anyone know were i could go to watch full F1 races, in this era?
NO4Q2 1 year ago
this is the best era in racing wish it was still like this
gthilly1 1 year ago 8
@gthilly1 Thats why i actually watch archives (and now YouTube) more than current F1- I half heartedly watch the races now- I don't care about F1 now- the sport peaked in this era and was so much better in every way than it is now- there is nothing of interest now- it's all been done before and in a much better way- in the golden era of mid 80s to mid 90s. There is nothing left to keep my interest.
People say; "You can't live in the past"
I say; "I can, I do and I will...because it was BETTER!"
mallamoozoo 1 year ago 14
@mallamoozoo couldnt agree more with wot you said i feel the same way
gthilly1 1 year ago
@mallamoozoo
I totally agree with you man... Plus I wanted to say how beautiful those F1 cars were compared to today's hi-tech monsters ...
chouzouris 1 year ago 2
@chouzouris However, F1 back in the 80s were alot more fragile. AIRBORNE=LIKELY DEATH. DO you want that happen when everyone is talking about safety?? I know any racing in itself involves high risks, just saying that the FIA were forced to make sure driver's safety is the first priority somehow. What I agree with you though is that F1 back in those days were alot better looking, true speed machines.
ultrakelv 1 year ago
@mallamoozoo totally agree. want me to live in the present? Then surpass the past! slackers
BeckTropical 1 year ago
Schumi is the king, Senna is god!!!!
UndertakerFan1990 1 year ago
The 90s were the last time, when we had brilliant drivers in the F1(include Schumi, he wasn't a cheater). But now, F1 is soooooo boring!
UndertakerFan1990 1 year ago
Just look at the way he kept the car under control @8:21 amazing...most good drivers would of crashed.
coinjoin 1 year ago 2
@coinjoin Most drivers would perhaps not have crashed (though they might have) but what was amazing about Senna was that when he was spectacular like this - it wasn't a mistake as it usually is when things get speccy- it was Senna being blindingly fast!- Eg here at 8:21- when most drivers get power oversteer- they lose time- Senna uses it here to SAVE time- ie go faster. There's a big difference - the first is easy to do- its a wide band- the latter requires absolute genius - its a razor's edge!
mallamoozoo 1 year ago 2
@coinjoin
Jeeeeeeesussss!!!!
chouzouris 1 year ago
senna was the "Rossi" of F1...
All F1 drivers are exceptional drivers (take out Montoya)in those days it was really more like the pilot that made the difference and it was more difficult to ride on the limit with cars at 1200pk and no electronic aids continious correcting the car
nowa days F1 has to much electronic aids...same in motogp
and senna had something more then all other F1 drivers we've seen today...he had a connection with the feeling of a car like no other pilot has its unexplainable
eraserke 1 year ago
@eraserke Agreed - Senna's talent - car control and pure speed - were totally and utterly inexplicable - the most staggering talent the whole world of sport has ever seen. (I know Rossi is good in his sport - but I feel its more of the Schumacher variety - the best of his time but not unquestionably the greatest ever as Senna is in F1 and certainly not as mysteriously talented. Senna was superhuman - really from another dimension.
mallamoozoo 1 year ago 2
@eraserke i have that same connection feeling of a car too, senna is the greatest. RIP
joeaccord23 1 year ago
f1 died with senna..
littlewing62 1 year ago 7
LOOK AT HIS TIIIIIIMEEE.. MY GOD 1.4 seconds faster than the Patrese. What a Driver he was. We all miss you Senna.
hadabenz 1 year ago 3
A whole day faster in racing
ZClipze 1 year ago
Ayrton Senna was a god.
roflex2 1 year ago 2
@roflex2 wrong. is a god
mrmaranello44 1 year ago
Brutal ese Ayrton en ese gran McLaren
iagoil 1 year ago
When Senna saw that Prost did a good lap, he left the boxes, and, in the end of qualifying, hit our best lap, and 0.694 scnds gap to Prost. Senna doesn´t need tos gou out track, but he try, and hit our time, SIMPLY THE BEST SENNA....
nmarracho 1 year ago
Sunday Mornings havent been the same since those days......
casasbojorges 1 year ago 2
We are all Senna loyalist here and when you say something like that that makes me wonder if your as sharpe as you need to be talking about this. he is like Senna but he doesn't qualify as well. Well that doens't make him anything like Senna now does it? Its like saying he is like Alain Prost but he likes to eat his brakes up. Hamilton is a product of Mclaren. The closet comparision to Ayrton Senna is Jim Clark...
dalebshelton 1 year ago
No one reminds of of Senna and I have followed F1 for 30 plus years. Senna doesn't act like a litle bitch when a team gives him info about the car that he doesn't like. Senna does what he wants. He doens't need his daddy to come from Brazil to tell him what to do, he'll run your ass off the road and let you know who is boss if you get in his way...he doesn't back into a championship by comming in 5th in the title run.
dalebshelton 1 year ago
jackie stewart? hes stilll wearing the same farmer's hat still now!! lol!!
iamaheartwrecker 1 year ago
Everyone who has seen Senna racing knows that he would own Schumacher... But people tend to forget as the time goes by... Senna was the best driver; he was the fastest and the most skilled
hurnus 1 year ago 12
you are right bro he was kicking evrybodys asses even when there were competion alan, mansel ect. now schumacher give me a break. schumacher was breathing SENNAS exhaust when he was alive THE RAINMAN IS GONE BUT HE HE WILL LIVE IN OUER HEARTS AND MINDS FOREVER R.I.P bro.
fernysho 1 year ago
These was the days when the driver made the difference instead of the car, Thats why Senna was so much faster than the rest.
dea1able 1 year ago
@dea1able The more tursn you have and the more movement you have, Senna would inch further and further away....No one can ever explain how he got 1.5 second ahead of Prost in qualifying..i wasn't as if he skipped a chicane. I start to blieve some of this stuff he is talking about. Its beyond what he could do at times..so at times his higher power guilds him.
dalebshelton 1 year ago
yeah i dont like f1 cars nowdays (just like the drivers). These were real cars and real drivers. The other ive noticed is how fast the f1 cars look going around that circuit than the v8 supercars. Adelaide is a dangerous track.
vodafonemclarenf1fan 1 year ago 5
Indeed mate - the F1 cars blow the V8 supercars out of the water - back in the Grand Prix days - the v8s were just a support class for the big boys of F1 and they were around HALF A MINUTE PER LAP slower!!!!!! That means the F1's would lap them within just 3 laps - or about 25 times over the race distance - yessiree - F1 is a completely different universe.
mallamoozoo 1 year ago
I once drove the AGS driven here by Dalmas at 3:30 - and believe me - F1 cars are absolute rocketships - I mean I love driving fast but that wasa mindblowing experience - i realized even the worst F1 drivers are supermen.
mallamoozoo 1 year ago 4
@vodafonemclarenf1fan I agree with you. Those cars and pilots (especially Senna, Prost and Mansell) were great. But I thonk this F1 season is very good, and that Hamilton is the new Senna (I know anybody would be as good as Senna for me but Hamilton remainds me Senna, except that he doesn´t qualify like the brazilian).
drc911 1 year ago
@drc911
Hamilton doesn't remind me of Senna at all - i see no comparison.
Senna was a far better driver and a far better person.
mallamoozoo 1 year ago 178
Hahahaa that Lola team was a fucking disaster.
But seriously, THIS is what F1 should really be about. Real cars and real men driving them. Not the bullshit thats going on today.
tpaladino 1 year ago 3
realistically - he will struggle to even be mediocre, let alone match the greatest of all time - lets face it - he doesnt have the experience and is only there due to his name.
mallamoozoo 1 year ago
Current F1 could keep cars and tracks from 80's and 90's, and just spend the money on some saftey and some more speed... why the fuck spend billions on traction control so that anyone could drive a f1 car.
launger 1 year ago
Why even spend billions making the cars 2 seconds a lap faster - cap the budget at $25 million a year per team instead of $500 million and no-one will notice that they are doing 1.24's instead of 1.21's
F1 administration is more incompetent than any recalcitrant Government - they only exist through dictatorship - they are too incompetent to survive in a competitive model. Ecclestone and Mosely are fascists!
mallamoozoo 1 year ago
@launger
i agree with you, look por examples the simplicity of the steeringwheel of the 90's. Today looks like the must start a Space Shuttle
VinGee33 1 year ago
@launger dont mean to me technical, but they havnt used t/c in f1 for a few years now.
mbaynham 1 year ago
more important than TC is the chassis developments since 1990 - the cars now handle so well and are so much easier to drive - the driver workload is a mere 25% of what it used to be - today's drivers have no idea how much more difficult it was 20 years ago - they would struggle to get within 5 seconds of senna in a 1990 car.
mallamoozoo 1 year ago
1"15.719 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
1983blair 2 years ago
Ferrari and McLaren were really beautiful in 1990.
paulomor 2 years ago
Yeah - the cars from this era are my all time favourite - they look perfect - low flat wide and with 18 inch rear, and 15 inch front tyres!
THATS how F1 cars should look. And that's just when stopped - the body language is even more beautiful - without high tech engineering these cars moved around and forced the driver to really work hard to keep it under control.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
wow senna was flying
raphalink7 2 years ago
The commpetitors are soo good (prost, piquet, berger, alesi, mansell...), that was the great time of F1, and gives us a bigg reason to say that Ayrton was the biggest driver in F1!!!!
TheSenna01051994 2 years ago 100
and well if the obvious didn't happen in 1994, the 1994 season could have been a real interesting one with Senna, Hill and Schumacher all fighting for the championship
that would have been the best season ever
Eagz 2 years ago
senna would have continued to pulverize Hill as he did in Brazil (lapping him) and therefore comfortably beaten Schumacher who only beat Hill by 1 point and even that by ramming hill out in Adelaide.
Nah - best season ever was probably 89 (even though senna didnt officially win he was crushingly dominant - just bad luck with multiple mechanical failures).
Also Prost at his peak was better than Schui at his peak - so i think we saw the greatest seasons ever in 88,89.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Who was the man with the checkered flag? Brunserade?
manuel164 2 years ago
Flag Man was Glenn Dix.
(He also did the flag at my National Karting Championships back in these days)
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
And BTW this clips Shows us what a F1 car is Supposed to look like low wide fat slick tires. And the sound of the engines the sound of the Ferrari and the Mclaren just gives me goosebumps.
falmark187 2 years ago 2
Exactly! The FIA messed it up completely. They made the teams focus on the aerodynamics and thus heavily investing in wind tunnels. They should have restricted the aerodynamics and leave more mechanical freedom. They instead created crappy looking cars with all the same technology inside! They also banned tech that could have been used in cars like infenitely variable transmissions (Willams tested it already 20 years ago!). I hope they allow the KERS again!
22j77 2 years ago
@22j77 The FIA messes everything up completely - more incompetent than even the US government.
mallamoozoo 1 year ago
4:30 1.4 sec ahead of the rest that about says it all. Prost cut it down to 0,7 but still in qualifying he was i league of his own
falmark187 2 years ago
0.7 is still absolutely HUGE.
But often Prost (or anyone else) didn't get it down to even with a second- Senna was often on pole by a second or more. The greatest was Monaco 88 - 1.4 seconds over Prost in the same car - Prost said his car was great and it was a good lap - he had no explanation - of course at that stage Senna was known as the fastest but not yet appreciated by how much. After Senna's career ended Prost acknowledged that he was simply in another world in qualifying - untouchable.)
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
yeah- anyone know where you can see footage of that qualifying in monaco 88? Would love to see a vid of it like this one..
thiscocks 2 years ago
Ive never seen more than 2 seconds worth of that session - but surely it exists somewhere.
Hard to believe how patchy the coverage used to be - not so long ago really.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
agreed. Not the coverage like we get today! Look forward to 2010 where qualifying will be more like this- no race fuel crap!
thiscocks 2 years ago
Comment removed
falmark187 2 years ago
Yeah - as he often was - that was par for the course for The Mighty One - while the others were separated by tenths - The SpeedMeister of all-time was a clear second or more off in another league - a world of his own where the others literally couldn't even believe much less match.
Senna was a genius of the most extreme order.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
what are the names of the announcers?
Context91 2 years ago
Murray Walker and James Hunt did all the commentary in this era. The guy at the very start is Ken Sutcliffe - a generic sports journalist in Australia who doesn't understand much about motorsport.
But he once said; "In all my years covering sport, I've never seen the impact that Ayrton Senna's death has had Worldwide!"
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
I drive on this track everyday.
jimmy3284 2 years ago
yeah but there's always so much traffic and many median strips interrupt the flow - its not like you can take racing lines - except the infield section - even there its dodgy as so many people are walking around and they look at you and call the cops if you so much as squeal a tyre - see my other video where i drove round there - people were pissed off with me at just 100kph (where F1's did 270kph).
Or the main straight where F1's hit 320kph the speed limit is just 60kph.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
The title... the truth.
osiriusy2k 2 years ago 3
how come this guy was so fast? every modern F1 drivers are slow, it's boring to watch now
NationOfMasturbation 2 years ago
How was Senna so fast?
Its a question I spent years trying to answer -
and I came to the conclusion that the reaso is quite profound - its because he wanted to be.
Yes every driver wants to be, but Senna wante it more - his passion was of another order altogether -driving was really his religion - and he was the most fanatical driver there ever was - it took him to places that most people can't even imagine much less match - in effect it meant he was in a trance where time slowed down. MAGIC!
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
I wanted to ask your opinion but you pretty much gave me an answer...It was about you saying somewhere that if Schumi had played fair he might have been able to reach Prost...my question was why you did not mention Senna,if Schumi played fair could he be another Senna and also if in your opinion any current driver's skill reminds you of Senna and in which way...Anyone who wants is welcome to reply too of course,but Malla I really would like your opinion on this;)))
arhavlisj 2 years ago
@arhavlisj Sorry for 10 month wait on reply - I just saw ur question!
My opinion is that in some ways aschumi was better than Prost and in other ways Prost was better - who would win most depends on circumstances (eg wet races Schui was better, but Prost was better at preserving tyres whilst maintaining good speed.)
But Senna was better than both of them in almost every way.
mallamoozoo 1 year ago
As for the current era of drivers - my opinion is that technology has now partially ruined the sport - the artistry of really high-performance driving such as we saw 20 years ago has been lost, "dumbed down"- the cars are now so good. Most people think of it as "paddle shift is 10 times easier than manual shift" but I am talking more about the art of car control - engineers have now optimized parameters of control, response, stability etc so that its now MUCH easier than it was 20 years ago.
mallamoozoo 1 year ago
@mallamoozoo thanks mate better late than never....and it was great hearing from you again....check out TOP Gear tribute to Ayrton when you have time....says it all....
arhavlisj 1 year ago
your answer makes me happy, this is why i F1 was senna :)
NationOfMasturbation 2 years ago 3
Awesome video, thanks for sharing! Another good Adelaide lap from him is his pole lap there in 85.
F1Driver 2 years ago 3
I also Think he had a natural hability for driving in such a High skill. Plus how much he wanted to be always in the top. Awesome video thank you for posting
pichicho88888 2 years ago
8:20
OMG
dj7oya 2 years ago 3
Beautiful aint it?!
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
pretty much...
i play SNES f1 grand prix just to hear the engine of those times... :P
dj7oya 2 years ago
if senna had raced for 15 years he would have had more than 100 pole positions of course ,very great to have so many pole positions with great opponents.
cc198719871987 2 years ago 11
If Senna had raced for 15 years Schumacher would be another J Villeneuve,a Hill....
Senna would have gone to Ferrari to retire and He would probably have become their advisor or something.....
How convenient the whole thing was for the German....But who cares?
Even dead he never managed to surpass him....
Being eternally compared to Senna boy that's like the worst thing ever;)))
arhavlisj 2 years ago 6
I think Schui was better than Hill and Villeneuve (to be fair) but he was certainly exaggerated way beyond his real quality by the circumstances he found himself in - Mansell and prost retired, Senna killed and ferrari ramping up their program to never-before-seen levels (and handing it all to him exclusively with team orders bullshit). Yes- altogether too convenient- i consider he deserved 2 Titles- i dont even acknowledge anything he did at Ferrari.
Not even a pea next to the Senna mountain.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
arhavlisj
Totally agree!
jileao 2 years ago 2
Senna and Schumacher...apples and oranges...
68 poles in 250 races 91 wins with illegal traction control and the super car?Mallamoozoo you are soooo right just a pea compared to Senna dude....
Schumacher was a cheater Mallamoozoo
I do not appreciate cheaters in any kind of sport
@arhalisj:at least Hill and J VILL were not cheaters......
stoookton1234 2 years ago 3
For sure man, for sure.
jileao 2 years ago 3
maybe he would even reach a magic 25 fastest laps
KBCKC 2 years ago 2
What I'm about to say is probably immoral but, Senna's death is the most fitting death he can have ever have. Like everyone who retires from a job they love, Senna would have died of boredom after his would-be career. Senna, the samurai of driving.
Smegma007 2 years ago 2
Yes i know what you mean - I have thought the same thing. He himself said once he thought he would never find anything ever again to compare with racing. He was born for nothing else but racing - the most pure racing driver of all time - a racing machine with the heart of a samurai. So in that sense it was a fitting end - he actually died leading a Formula 1 Grand Prix - sort of poetic.
But i wish he had of hung around - he was a great man with a lot more to give.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
You are right but mate he was 34!And I can't stop thinking how much more he could have contributed to the sport if he was still alive,even from outside the cockpit that is....
I am sad I miss him deeply he could have achieved so much more...Along with him died his inexplicable ability behind the wheel....That's what the sport lost.....A huge huge loss to say the least...
But at least he didn't suffer didn't live to be unable to drive...That would be worse than dying for him.....
arhavlisj 2 years ago
Yes - he said that too - just months before he died in january 94 - he said if he ever had a bad crash he'd rather be killed instantly than handicapped because he couldnt face life handicapped.
But yes an immeasurable loss to F1, sport in general and the wider world - god knows what that formidable commitment and intellect would have achieved when applied to other issues - maybe even becoming Brazilian president. Truly the biggest waste of talent that ever happened - it's STILL gutting!
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Well I am a fan of most English drivers and proud for their great achievements and I have high hopes for Hamilton well not Button;-) but still I can't just deny the plain fact that Senna was much better than them all
stoookton1234 2 years ago 3
For some people who crave for statistics Schumacher raced almost 100 more races in his brilliant cheating career so shut up.
Take the actual ratio like poles/wins and then see who's the best.
LOSERS
stoookton1234 2 years ago 3
senna was ahead of his time..
kyeraa2007 2 years ago
Yep - about 100 years ahead. Even 15 years later there is not an athlete on the planet that operates anywhere near his level of commitment and talent. His speed was so far ahead of the rest - it was like a 100 metre runner running 9.0 second 100 metre runs. He was another level again ahead of the others what Usain Bolt is foot racing.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
From what I understand you are a racing driver right?
Then why don't you take the time to explain to all fools out there how it feels and what it takes to race and especially a F1 car in the 80's and 90's.
People like you know better and if you stand up for Senna then maybe it's like better than 10 of us who are just spectators.
Senna is noy only the fastest but also the more all around complete driver there ever was.
stoookton1234 2 years ago
Ive done my best mate - Ive posted more comments on this subject on You Tube than anyone else. But some people will always think the Earth is flat despite mountains of evidence.
You are 100% right - Senna was not only the fastest but also the most complete package of all time. Quote from Encyclopedia of F1;
'Senna was the greatest driver ever to grace a circuit - perhaps the ultimate sportsman - the one who came closer to perfection in his activity than any other."
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Wow!!! Good F1 times - not the boring nowadays...
The cars were so raw and the drivers, greatest - much better than today. Thanks for this video.
jileao 2 years ago
zentralwerkstatt, a checkbook alone in racing will only take you so far, you still have to have the talent, which Senna clearly did and it was frequently shown just like in this video. Senna worked his ass off more than any other driver even though he was a natural at racing. Some eople seem to think his talent just magically appeared because he had money or some other dum reason. He just wanted it more than anyone else, so he did what was necessary to win and that's exactly what he did.
Drewc6r 2 years ago 2
Besides - the Senna family weren't FILTHY rich - take a look at the house - its not exactly a Beverly Hills mansion - its just an upper-middle class home. Senna would have spent less than $100,ooo in getting to F1 (eg. 10,ooo pounds for F.Ford 2000) - yes thats more than most kids can find but it hardly compares to the millions kids spend getting there today. Today's racing kids are more like Hollywood brats than dedicated sportsmen.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Quotes;
"Senna was THE MOST DEDICATED person to ANYTHING i have EVER seen."; Murray Walker
"Senna's commitment takes some believing"; Nigel Roebuck.
"He needed to do this in a way that even other F1 drivers don't"; Damon Hill
"Senna needs racing like the rest of us need air" Journalist
"Senna thinks about racing every waking second of the day and probably dreams about it as well"; James Hunt
"Talent boundless and commitment unmatched"; Journo
So FUCK OFF claiming Senna wasn't committed!
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Whoever said Senna wasn't commited?
is it the nursery 3-12 age group striking again?
They also go by with the name;Schumacher fan club!
BTW Senna lived and breathed F1 you fools!
stoookton1234 2 years ago 2
Yep - racing was actually literally Senna's real religion! It's how he identified himself, filtered reality, perceived life and consciousness - everything a religion is. Senna was 100 years ahead of any other sportsman on Earth.
I'm convinced that was the basis for his incomprehensible speed - when he drove he was in a psychologically altered state - a trance - where he perceived time in finer detail than everyone else - he effectively warped his spacetime with mind power. He was VERY special.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Or will you come back with the story about Prost being no better than Massa or Rubens again?
Really you will not convince anyone with these arguments!
Stick to Murray's interview it's the best you have.
Sorry but this is NOT about Senna and Schumacher,cause Schui is not even second after Senna-he wishes,he is 5th at best in an all time list.
arhavlisj 2 years ago 2
Yes arhavlisj - i think its clear to all rational thinkers what the truth is - we have won this debate completely - its been a walkover!
At the end of it all - i just feel so honoured to have seen THE SENNA drive!
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Zentra man Iast time we talked I told you how unbelievably morinic it is ti assume that Schumacher''developed'' a car!Hello???he went to Ferrari one of the best teams and Brawn?ever heard o him?
There has never been a driver more opportunist than Schumi and he was offered among other things a contract that IN NO WAY COULD HIS TEAMMATE CHALLENGE!
And complete driver???yes he was great but under pressure?are u sure?
And what about his competition?Villeneuve ?Coulthard?Seriously?
arhavlisj 2 years ago 2
What Schumi makes the greatest is that he is the most complete driver of F1 ever. Senna was undoubtedly tremendous! But the difference is that Schumi had to work all his carreer and EARN his racing-material. Senna just got his driving material under the christmas tree, because his parents were millionairs. This behaviour is seen in later days, Senna seeked the best cars, Schumi developed winning teams from crap!! This bravery to take such challenges costed Schumi numbers of championships!!!
zentralwerkstatt 2 years ago
Complete rubbish!
Yes Senna was a rich kid and never worked normal jobs - but almost none of the f1 drivers ever had real jobs (Mansell and Hill are the only two i know of in the past 20 years.) Schumi never had a real job either - he raced karts as a kid and teenager and went into cars with money from his Dad's friend.
So don't try to turn his background into a rags to riches story - he had more privilege in life than most people.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
So what if Senna was rich?This is as moronic as saying Senna became a legend after his death!
He had help to begin with he was lucky but he won his mane on his own merit and that;s that!
What if a great surgeon or lawyer came from rich families who could provide for them an adequate education,would anyone trust them any less or underrate them cause of their families?????
Seriously???
arhavlisj 2 years ago
rich in Brasil´s 80´s terms means the same to any european mid-class today
KingTabor 2 years ago 2
As for your delusion that Schui actively sought for rubbish teams to 'develop'- absolute BULLSHIT-he started his career at benetton (ignore 1 corner in a jordan). Then in 16 years he only changed teams ONCE! And he only chose ferrari knowing damn well of their plan to steal all Benetton's key technical staff - so actually its the complete opposite of what you think- he went to ferrari not to develop them but knowing the tech developments would soon give him the best car AND team orders. Got it?
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
So following the same ridiculous logic - you have to conclude that Senna went to mcLaren after they got smashed by Williams in 87 - and promptly turned them into a supercar that won 15 of 16 races.
Clearly bullshit too - obviously the tech guys made the car aweseome - and its exactly the same with Schui going to Ferrari.
Grow up and start to understand things more realistically instead of in a simplistic fantasy way.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
senna only sought one car which was when he moved to Williams and that's because of his tremendous desire to win. Every driver wants the best car, not just the children of millionaires. And it wasn't even the best car when he got it, and he still put it on pole in the first race of '94.
creatyve 2 years ago
So what if he was a rich kid what difference does it make to the legend he became by 1993?
What will you use next ?that his looks got him to become the best ever?
Maybe so cause he was very popular with the ladies give it some thought will you?
I feel sorry for you and all of you passing judgement on things and people you absolutely have no idea on!
Senna is huge the best live with that!
stoookton1234 2 years ago 2
Schumy and his 1994 Benetton full of tricks. What a great driver huh?
KingTabor 2 years ago 3
Ok this is like the most crappy comment ever about Schumacher and I need to share it.
Zentralwerkstatt thinks that before Schumacher all drivers were a bunch of egotistical noobs that knew nothing but cause accidents...Then came Schumacher the great altruist humanist Braveheart to teach us all about F1...OH MY GOD ......I mean you posted this elsewhere but I just needed some of my friends from around the world to see this...
I mean this is like worse than Barnevelddarts videos.lololololol
stoookton1234 2 years ago 7
Yeah I know that guy too..he posts rubbish....fangio clark gilles stewart Prost Senna all useless ha?????oh well are you sure this is not Barveldarts again????:))))))))
arhavlisj 2 years ago 4
Almost certainly its Barnveldarts - same crazy words (and we know he has about 10 aliases)
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
I agree completely mallamoozoo! It seems like the most gifted drivers were taken away from us so prematurely and suddenly. Schumi's 7 titles don't seem like much after you watch one of Senna's qualy laps!
Drewc6r 2 years ago
HAHA - awesoeme comment - "Schumi's 7 titles don't seem like much after you watch one of Senna's qualy laps!"
So succinct and so true.
If you don't mind i will borrow that and use it myself. Thanks.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
had GILLES lived he would had made prost , senna , schumacher cry like little girls , the 80'would have been totaly different
Dropspine 2 years ago
Thats going a bit too far - Schui yeah but Senna and Prost were HUGE - but yeah Gilles was in that league - its a tragedy that Gilles was killed so early - just 68 GP under his belt (Look at Senna, Prost and Schu after 68 GP and they hadnt great stats either) - Gilles was lightning fast - perhaps Senna-esque for pure speed - can you just imagine qualifying sessions with Gilles Villeneuve and Ayrton Senna as team-mates in the same car - oh my god that would have been mindblowing.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Gilles and Senna racing 2gether was always l the ultimate dream race for me.
That is why I believe that it is soooo stupid to compare Senna to Schumacher(Senna being so superior a driver in so many ways),we should rather wish Gilles had not died so soon so we could see him race with Ayrton and Alain.
Still maintain though Senna was by far the driver with the greatest skill an practically every situation on the track!
arhavlisj 2 years ago 2
Yes - Gilles is possibly the only driver whose raw talent can be compared with Senna's (maybe Clark too but i wasnt around then). But Senna took it all to a not just a new level but into the stratosphere with his religious-style of commitment - the likes of which has no equal in sport. Senna was the most talented drive ever AND the most committed - the combination of which made him literally beyond belief. He was damn nearly perfect.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Isn't it almost too hard to believe that Senna, Villeneuve and Clark were probably the 3 most talented drivers of all time and all died young - at the wheel?
Apparently all nice guys too. There is no justice in this life!
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Exactly how I would put it.
I was too young to see Gilles,but having heard of him,and loving F1 so much,I did my own search in 1984(when I first started watching f1 and realized how brilliant a driver he was...Clark also,I feel those 3 shared what I call a perfect driving ability...They could drive beyond the level other drivers could ever reach...
You know Senna said in one of his early(1986)interviews that the best driver ever would be Villeneuve if only one could add self control to him...
arhavlisj 2 years ago 2
Actually - it was Gilles death that alerted me to the sport of F1. I was 10 and we got home from holidays and Dad had brought a copy of Auto Action I think the paper was called and he opened it up and read the front page and threw the paper down in disgust! I said 'What's wrong Dad?" and he said "I hate it when one of the good guys goes down the tubes". That made me think this sport must be something special - if guys were prepared to risk death for it. I then learned just how great Gilles was.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
I then became interested in F1 and watched the rise of Prost then Senna. I was watching the 94 GP at Imola with Dad when Senna went off and this time I discovered the horrible feeling of losing a hero. I have a friend whose sport is boxing and I explained to him that seeing Senna - the greatest of all time - die live on TV was like a boxing fan see Mohammed Ali be killed in the ring in his prime - and thus he understood what it meant to Senna fans- just horrible.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Wish younger fans did a little more search though,I mean now with the Internet and y tube it is so easy to see and learn about these huge drivers.
Instead I am just appalled reading how Schumacher is the greatest why?Because he has 7 titles,so what?
Senna told Stewart in an interview that his sole aim was to win every race not the championships or stats,just to be better and faster in every race...this is the essence of racing IMO...
arhavlisj 2 years ago 2
Exactly my friend - you understand the true essence of a racing driver. Villeneuve also said (I think to Enzo Ferrari but I am not sure) he aimed to win every race - not to collect points to win a World Championship.
Senna's whole reason for existence was to push his limits - thats why even if he was already on pole he'd go out for another lap - just to see how far he could go.
Schui's stats leave me cold - due mainly to circumstances he was just plain lucky to be in.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
This mentality of Schu's fans though has turned F1 to what it is now!
I mean Hamilton comparing himself to Senna on his first years?Being as arrogant as can be claiming that he is is the best?Sure he can think it but in no way he should say these things in the open...
Anyhow I must admit that I would never have expected so many Senna haters out there,is it just ignorance or the inability to accept there was one driver so much above the rest and still not replaced in F1?I just dont understand.
arhavlisj 2 years ago 2
Hamilton is a knob - in his first year saying "I feel i am achieving the same things Prost and Senna did" WHAT? GET A GRIP SON - winning in the best car, even in rookie year, does not equal what Prost and Senna achieved.
This 09 season is exactly what Hamilton needed to drop the cockiness (lets hope so).
I feel the golden years of F1 are gone - the sport has changed and it is now "plastic" where it once was real. The cars are too easy to drive now - overgrown go-karts. I like my 20th century!
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
They are sure gone,I realized when I actually found myself wishing for Schu to return to F1...
just to make it interesting again..Can u believe that?
As for Hamilton,at least Alain must have had a good laugh hearing this...
But still in every survey Senna will be first,or second to the likes of Clark,or Fangio but always above Schu,at least in all experts' lists.
arhavlisj 2 years ago 2
I'd forgotten that - thanks for reminding me - yes indeed Senna did say that - and that's what Senna was - the raw talent and speed of Gilles Villeneuve allied with ultra commitment and discipline. Perfection!
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
Good times. Prost & Senna on the track, Walker & Hunt behind the mic.
Audioquest56 2 years ago 2
Senna was great! I saw him qualify in McLaren at Hungaroring in 1992 (and Hakkinen in Lotus!), still remember his handwave after the qualification. "Better things to come", he seemed to say.
kokkodiili 2 years ago
Also prost was the monaco master and yet senna outquaified him by almost 2 seconds!!!!
in todays environment senna would have been on pl and prost in 20th place.
Just think 2 seconds in a relatively short circuit thats like 0.3 evry corner!
specialsenna 2 years ago
great stuff from Senna as usual,and look at that top 8 drivers at the end of the video,what a list !!!
seatleontsi1 2 years ago
Yes indeed - and at the same time - take note of the relative margins between them all - Senna light years ahead.
(This was business as usual in qualifying by THE FASTEST DRIVER OF ALL TIME!)
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
The fastest driver ever.
proof?
65 poles in 161 races with the best car only 2 0% of his career and team orders 0% of his career.
And above all that - regularly pole by 1 full second - even 1.5 seconds, not tenths - SECONDS over his World Champ team-mates.
What the fuck else do you need to see?
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
great video, but the sound is a bit bad
nenejbs 2 years ago
Yeah - 20 year old master tape.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
The one and only!R.I.P GREAT MAN
arhavlisj 2 years ago
SENNA FOREVER
burns985 2 years ago 4
This is the right title for this video.
Thanks for puting facts like this.
SENNA forever.
burns985 2 years ago 4
It's so refreshing to actually read a proper discussion on here for once, written by knowledgeable fans who can actually compose an eloquent sentence.
So much so, I'm finally commenting on my first video. Unfortunately, I'm off back into work now, but I'll be back to add my thoughts...
Senna though; genius. It's a shame well never, ever, have anyone like him again. One of my favourite videos on here is his Qualifying lap at Spa in 1991. Tells you everything you ever needed to know about Senna.
jonnycarbon 2 years ago 5
I've watched that video many a time, brilliant throttle control and poise.
xXIbanezJamesXx 2 years ago
I am sure you saw the 1990 Belain GP.....Senna made 3 perfects starts that day, the first one,,,,the second one and finally after the second red flag,,,,he freaking made another perfect start without breaking the clutch...come on if the na sayers can't respect that,,,they just refuse to accept his greatness.
dalebshelton 2 years ago
Yeah I remember that - wondering whether their clutches would take a 3rd start. I think James hunt mentioned that it was high risk as they arent designed for 3 starts. Senna was awesome at Spa in the rain that day.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
But here is the thing I always said about that 89 Race. Prost had done everyting to the best of his ability and gotten every break possible...the good start and the early lead. And if this is a race that the 2 best driver was driving at their best then I see one thing, ultimately, the best driver Senna had made up all the gap and as of that time, with 8 laps to go at that point, Prost had nothing left to conter Senna....So one last move at the chicane was his only choice..Senna was comming hard
dalebshelton 2 years ago
Prost actually jumped the start- not illegal then as it is now so it wasn't cheating - but it wasn't that he got ahead of Senna by better driving. Nonetheless he pulled a small gap, but the fact that it closed down later in the race indicates strongly that Prost set his car up for full tanks- Senna for light tanks- and as you imply, the situation evened out with 8 laps to go- so you could say that was a measure of Senna's overall superiority- 8 laps of 53 (15%).
Nonetheless, Prost was fast here.
mallamoozoo 2 years ago
What can I say, it was a titanic battle with both men ready. Yes there were minor mistakes here and there but nothing that either couldn't overcome,,,Senna's biggest mistake. A very slight wheel spin at the start that cause him to lift off....that allow the whole thing to happen. How often does Senna make a not so perfect start,,,and how often does Prost make a great start? I would say that It is more rare for Senna to make a mistake at the start. If not for that,,Senna would have been gone
dalebshelton 2 years ago