Blackbox - 05 - Blaming the Pilot - Part 1 of 5

[Ankur07d]

'human beings can't be upgraded or redesigned...'

hmm.............

[Odin197188]

A "cover sheet", not "cooler sheet" damn spellcheck!

[Odin197188]

Why is this one poor guys body the only one not given the respect of not being shown on camera, just thrown the ground like so much rubbish, without even the dignity of cooler sheet?  Why does respect for the dead and the politeness of not showing the dead on a documentary that might be watched by families, not apply in this ONE instance?? You might think I'm being ridiculous, but honestly ask yourself, why is it ok in only one instance?

[MSSpenceProductions]

scary!!



[fs10inator]

0:06 I just heard 'Saudia 163' - that well refers to a tragic flight in 1980, where a TriStar was burnt, killing all onboard.

[MightySouthpaw]

When Channel 4 didn`t do wall to wall property shows and reality shows...

..thanks for uploading.

[hairyfatslobpig]

Absolute bullshit, he was a tough ass who earned his respect. Ya 2 punks pissed him off but a heart attack in flight..no way. He wanted to teach these punks a lesson, not normal behavior for a responsible aged individual but definitely a possibility for a short tempered old guy fighting with young punks. His intellect didnt stop his emotions earlier so obviously could control it later..The heart disease would of caught up to him but never in flight. 90% of heart attacks occur when some is on job

[awlcvl]

Thanks for posting; there will be another programme about this accident and that of another Trident (G-AWZT) over Yugoslavia in 1976. I believe it will be broadcast in February 2011.

[faffaflunkie]

Delightfully creepy.

[glynamus]

need to recheck the mechanics. they have sent many planes to their doom

[cs925]

One more question for all (incl bjones4)

On the network TLC channel - back in the mid to late 90's - they had a show called "Mayday" & it covered disasters like BB and AIC - it was narrated by Wil Lyman most known for PBS's Frontline -

Does anyone else besides me remember that show?

And if so, has anyone found it on-line?

Thanks in advance for your time!

[MsYumo]

@cs925 Perhaps you are thinking of Air Crash Investigation? AKA Mayday in some countries? There are plenty of them on YouTube

[cs925]

@MsYumo Hi MsYumo - thanks 4 responding. In fac I did find the show on YT only 5 days ago. The U.S. version - narrated by Wil Lyman, the guy who narrates most if nearly all the FRONTLINE shows on PBS - is called; "Survival In The Sky".

Slight differences in the show besides narration is/are the sequence of one or two scenes...in short editing. Only noticed cause parents r retired Post Production people. Sad thing is Media Consolidation forcing News div' 2 turn profit; docs like these; gone.

[MsYumo]

@cs925 Survival in the Sky? Interesting, and you are correct with the editing and sequence. If you find any other good stuff please send it along!

[cs925]

Hey bjones4 - Didn't PBS (in America) re-name one of the Black Box episodes that you posted - "Black Box - Crash Detectives" as one of their own?

Let me explain: back in 90's I caught a PBS doc about "crash detectives"/NTSB - it was narrated by Wil Lyman who does most of the Frontline shows. I remember just the topic & Greg Feith's shirt. Ever since I was looking for that episode then I saw your other BB posting and flashback-same show-diff narrator.

[bg11215]

About the first plane crash described, the narrator says "a testament to a pilot's mistake". What actually happened was that a maintenance worker washing the plane had covered either the pitot tube or static port with tape to protect ot while washing the plane, then forgot to remove it, which is why the plane crashed. True, maybe the pilot should have inspoected the plane more thoroughly before departing, but to say it's the pilot's mistake isn't really accurate.

[cs925]

@bg11215 Good point, but what about the mention of the Pilot (on the CVR?) noticing (or was it copilot?) the A.S.I. guage malfunction - giving false readings - during take off roll? I mean before the Point of No Return when u can abort a take off - don't know what it's called, anyway the narrator mentioned this in the same context as the criticisms described. Haven't watched this 1 since last sunday so I appologize if I remember this wrong.

[maxkinn]

Planes are safer now , but human beings cannot be upgraded or redesigned...!!!

[DCr556]

the beeping sound gives me creepies , old planes have the most weardes things

[iiiset]

"the modern pilot resembles a bank manager." ha! yes. sad, but that's what makes for the safe life.

[BoyScout1960]

And people think that Capt. Jacob Veldhuyzen van Zanten of KLM of "Tenerife Airport Disaster" fame was a jerk...

[stpetersburg]

he was

[DCr556]

@BoyScout1960 hell yeah he was ; i don't thing that he will change when he retires.

[BIGGREENLEAF1]

This series of shows was originally shown in the USA in 1996 under the title "Survival In The Sky" , it's nice to see the show again even if under a different title/name some 13 years later. I tried looking the show up on youtube under the original name but nothing came up. How ironic the show I had been looking for has been here the whole time and on the channel to one of my subscriptions...lol Small World.....

[thedayitriedtodie]

mmm,nice intro. non bias and all...

i'm just happy this "pilot-monster" isn't my dad, or so.....

what a disrespectful intro.

[keeprighton2007]

Have a look at any tv programme or report about the Birginair crash and it is pilot error all the way... hard for this programme to dress it up as something else...

[2crazyuk]

I totally agree with you SH96 and Delta

[SH96films]

"Planes are safer now, but human beings cannot be upgraded or redisigned"

It's true. Maybe this is the cause of most air crashes...

[DeltaEagle7700]

Yep. Humans can't be upgraded. But improved training can prevent accidents.

[CVKent317]

That's correct

[intrepidZANY]

It is possible in this day & age to have all communication & navigation via GPS n satellites. Even the Flight data and cockpit voice recordings can be made remotely on the ground via satellite links this will save the trouble of locating blackboxes after crashes & experts on the ground can analyse that date in real time and help the crew when it needs it most before crashing but after the problems have starrted.

[celticlofts]

A lot of upgrades are available for aircraft but just like everything else it's a matter of cost. Many airlines work on a very thight budget and for many this kind of upgrading would be cost prohibative.

[CVKent317]

You'd have to set up a system to monitor huge amounts of information. I find it hard to believe that such a system wouldn't be expanded in use and adapted to spy on american cell-phone calls and such as it is.

After all with the NSA's warrantless wiretapping in mind, this would be very bad.

[jennycorea]

Hi, what is the name of the 195x movie, one featuring captain and the BOAC aircraft?

[cvanbeurden]

my grand father died in the BA. plane crash,it's interresting as a menber of the family to have more details about the accident.

[fightingtemeraire]

There is a new Airbus being planned. The crew has been further reduced to one pilot, a dog and a computer. The computer is there to fly the plane and the dog will bite the pilot if he tries to touch anything.

[bob7399162]

THis may be a crazy thought, but is there some kind of cream that you could take with you on a plane that could act as a fire retardant if you have a crash fire? i.e. you put the cream onm IF you're about to crash and it would offer some level of protection. And honeslty, in theory, why not bring helmets aboard?

[fightingtemeraire]

Parachutes and ejector seats for all on board would possibly rule out any fatalities from any crash, but the cost and incurred weight are prohibitive.

[kcy29581]

Not just costs, but practicality. For every passenger to be strapped into an ejector seat would mean a huge increase in the weight of the craft and therefore a massive reduction in the number of passengers that could be carried per flight. In turn, this would drive up costs dramatically and make commercial flight virtually impossible.

[superemposed]

ejector seats often cause spinal injuries too

[Corvid]

Burning is the least of your worries... a massive number of deaths are from smoke inhalation or sheer trauma to the body... if you've ever been involved in a car accident or had a bad fall you know just how fragile the human body can be.

Even the protective clothing worn by todays fire-fighters will only protect them for a matter of seconds in a fireball or flashover. If burning alive is that much of an issue to an individual, not flying would be the answer!

[bob7399162]

great screen name

[Corvid]

Cheers mate! :P

[avidalocan]

I had a really bad mountainbike accident over a jump last year, but I could walk after a few days. The main reason was concentration on my fall and a period of several months working out in the gym. If you have heavier more toned muscles around you, it is literally like hard padded cushioning. There's nothing better for protection. That is why painful accidents happen so often - the peoples' muscles are too weak to absorb the impact.

[Corvid]

I can well believe that! Also the reason that people who are very fit are able to recover in weeks from sporting injuries that would take an average person months to recover from. As you say, rehabilitation is worlds better than doing absolutely nothing.

[avidalocan]

I actually meant to say that the previous seven months of working out at the gym was what caused me to be up and walking (actually hiking in mountains in Tasmania) within days. I know it sounds like I did 7 months work after the accident but at the start I said I was walking after a few days almost as normal.

[SkavenUK]

The g-force effects alone would kill you if you crashed, nevermind a fire.

[cleared31]

There is no problem so complex that it cannot simply be blamed on the pilot.

— Dr Earl Weiner

[bigpizza112]

it was not a a 320! it was a b757

[BaybeeDoll84]

I can only imagine what the pilot's widow must have gone through knowing that his/her spouse is responsible for the death of all those ppl. Since the pilot was at fault does the family still get the life insurance? Not trying to be mean.

[madaboutrc]

Yes they do still get insurance

[LH287]

even if it's the pilot's fault, it is still an accident. If he had commited suicide by crashing, that would have been a different story.

[zulquarnainanwar]

how do you fix a pilot?

answer- get them some sexy hostesses on board

[alsuwaidi87]

boring

[Snare0wnz]

FLIES UNDER WATER!!!! HAHA

[Clausfarre]

"Curve, a device that flies under water.."

Now THAT is ironic! (no disrespect)

[Vanadeo]

LOL i was thinking the same

[ROMEwolfboy357]

ye lol, a flying device underwater xD

[zeerak1plane]

cool

[thedinnerplate]

Loved this show when I was younger, but feel guilty for loving these kinds of shows because of how many people died in these crashes!!

[Nabalathu]

I know, I often feel the same way.. But at the same time I know it's quite human to be interested in these things. Plus: if no one was, we wouldn't have numerous investigators and such who help prevent accidents (and crimes etc.) from happening.

[sbmrunning]

@thedinnerplate nah, you no need to feel guilty, you should feel honored to know that you are interested in understanding the past, and allows you to understand the men and women of the industry to try and combat air incidents of negative results.

[casperblackcat1975]

@thedinnerplate These kind of programs are very interesting you see these crashes & the wreckage looks nothing like a plan or everything has been burnt & yet these black boxes actually survive impacts & fires.

[aviationwingnut]

@thedinnerplate I don't think you ought to feel guilty for being interested. I too feel for the lives lost but, it's the science behind finding out WHY it all happened that interests me. I've applied to the FAA and NTSB and if they hire me for accident investigation type work, I'm sure I'll have some bad dreams but, it's got to be done. Putting the puzzle together is what I'm drawn to.

[cs925]

@aviationwingnut * I really hope you get the job and I wish you the best luck humanly possible - seriously - no sarcasim or anything. I really mean it.

People like you are a key component to the science of ACI. G.Feith talks about that a little in another episode...anyway I'm pullin 4 ya! Good luck!

[aviationwingnut]

@cs925 Thank you, I appreciate those wishes. I hope so too. Just this past afternoon, sent off three Inquiries of Availability I received from the FAA in the past week. Sent them UPS next day. So, I should hear something soon. Greg Feith did a job I want to do. One case that nearly drove the man to the nuthouse was Flight 427. There's a very good book out that I read on that USAir flight that nosedived into the woods in PA. I'd like a job like that. Grisly but, trying to put together a puzzle.

[juantrippe82]

@thedinnerplate You weren't the only one, I loved this show too but in North America it was called 'Survival in the sky'.

[foxbat68]

bjonjes4 - Many thanks for uploading this rare series. It truly deserves to be repeated, and is superbly produced. Sombre but truly informative, with haunting music too.

[varlogwarn]

thaaankks