Birmingham Uni Boy Racer River erosion continues...1

[SHADOWDAEMON666]

Faced with the prospect of having your car stolen from you by the police I'd of done the same, If I smash the car then that's unlucky but at least the police can't auction it off.

[mikeandsouth]

You need to get a hobby, stamp collecting maybe? or train spotting?

[joebigpumpkin]

Ok so you claim that it is not a safety boat but a coaching boat and is not needed.. Join any uni rowing club and see how many beginner boats are allowed out without safety cover (give you a clue genius 0). If you really do take offence and truly want to make birmingham stop using this launch, donate 2-3 grand to get them a wakeless one untill then pipe down and get a fucking life x

[fatman434434]

I am sure you will find a river by law that allows him going at the speeds his going for coaching purposes and safety reasons, secondly rivers erode that is what they do that is why you have bends in a river, that is why you have a river in the first place, to act like it is the end of the world is frankly idiotic, while they have brought a new one it is not usually a lack of funds to buy a wake less launch but a lack of space even then they aren't that effective as they tend to be huge

[bezzano5]

It's not illegal what he is doing

A launch accompanying a rowing boat doesn't have to stick to the speed limit as it has to supervise the boat for safety reasons as well as coaching them.

Although the motor boat does create erosion there are so many other causes that trying to attack one person due to the wash created by the launch he is using is both harsh and a waste of time.

[sabrinaworcester1]

@bezzano5

First sentence wrong

Second sentence wrong

third sentence wrong

I will reply why when i have more time

[bezzano5]

What are you planning to write to me? An essay?

Speak to GB rowing (formerly the ARA) about Birmingham Uni if you are really anoyed. They would have a lot larger impact than the Environmental Agency.

A rowing boat's speed depends on a large number of factors, but they generally go well in excess of water speed limits. A launch has to go with them therefore what I am saying is right.

Why put a crew's safety at risk to reduce erosion when so many other things affect it already?It would be crazy

[sabrinaworcester1]

@bezzano5

I will consider your comment re ARA in future if needed though that doesnt say much about the so called Guardians of the river the EA and BW.

A launch does not have to go with them, the rowing club wants it to go with them.

What sort of people destroy the very river they rely on for their rowing as well as affect other rowers and river users and cause criminal damage to other peoples property?

[BotActionAndy]

@sabrinaworcester1 who cares if it is eroding the sides it happens naturally anyway and no one cares

[sabrinaworcester1]

@bezzano5

He is causing damage to other peoples property- unlawful

Please provide proof of sentence 2. The boats are coaching boats NOT safety boats.

It is not harsh as he refused to slow down and lied that he had permission.

it was not a waste of time as eventually the video got him stopped

[switchback63]

A lot of fuss about nothing in my opinion. Same launches are used accross the world in hundreds of rivers and lakes without complaint. If they are following crews they are hardly speeding. Its people like this which contribute to the ever decreasing participation in sport accross the country- if you haven't noticed obesity is going to be a huge drain on the nations resources over the next 20 years, all sport should be encouraged. If nothing else its a safety issue not allowing a launch to follow

[artjomf4]

I'm actually bored enough to watch all of your videos about this and I have come to the conclusion that your 'activist' mission is a waste of time and nothing will be changed for quite a few years coming unless you or the boat club somehow manages to raise enough money in the annual funds to afford a launch as their priority will be to try and survive for the forseeable future and provide better equipment for the athletes (athletes don't use an engine or race in launches). cont.

[artjomf4]

I'm actually bored enough to watch all of your videos about this and I have come to the conclusion that your 'activist' mission is a waste of time and nothing will be changed for quite a few years coming unless you or the boat club somehow manages to raise enough money in the annual funds to afford a launch as their priority will be to try and survive for the forseeable future and provide better equipment for the athletes (athletes don't use an engine).

cont.

[cathburgerqueen]

@sabrinaworcester1 Is that boat still in use?

[sabrinaworcester1]

@cathburgerqueen Finally in about February 2010 they have adapted a boat which has much better wash, however it is the worst of all the low wash boats on the river! But it depends how it is driven and the boy racer appears to have moved on, so it appears acceptable most of the time. I complained to the University itself and despite taking about 8 months they viewed the footage and despite the fact that it was unclear, agreed to get a low wash boat. So success with this one after some years

[AJC79]

My apologies, I did mean BW, rather than EA (although EA play part of the decision making process I believe! I know that coaching launches are issued with speed exemptions, because as a club secretary one of my duties was to apply for a new one each year! I'm pretty sure as well that the club would rather not cause damage to the bank. However generally speaking Uni clubs' finances are VERY limited, and buying a new launch could be something they cannot afford at present.

[cathburgerqueen]

@AJC79 It's a university for crying out loud. If they can't research and build their own low wash launch for less than £1,000 they need their exemption reviewing. It's ignorant to the rowers using a boat with a wash like that never mind to other river users.

[AJC79]

@cathburgerqueen

I agree that they could build a low wash launch for less than 1k. However 1k would, in all likelyhood represent most of, if not all or more than the clubs entire annual budget!

As I have pointed out already, for the club to be using this lauch they will have been issued with an exemption by BW from the speed limit. I've already pointed out that as they manage the waterway they are well aware of what wash can and does do. The Uni are breaking no rules, hence not ignorant.

[WalneyCol]

@AJC79 Of course it's ignorant. BW not objecting doesn't make something right. For al we know they may be ignorant too.

[AJC79]

@WalneyCol

I'm sorry, but the organisation charged with the responsibilty of maintaining the waterways being ignorant? Please?!? Also they are not only not objecting, but also SANCTIONING the use of launches!

I started posting on this thread having explained that I could see and understand the point being made. I've tried to make clear the bakground to the situation, but it is becoming clear that others are not prepared to make the same leaps. I'd say it's not the boat club being ignorant.

[WalneyCol]

@AJC79 Yes, BW appears to be granting unjustifiable flexibility. Responsible bodies acting disgracefully isn't totally unheard of you know. On Walney where I live Natural England - santioned by our town council - have recently errected a barrier which barrs disabled access to our local nature reserve in clear defiance of the disability discrimination act 2005. Just admit it - not all so-called responsible boddies behave as they should - especially when you get into "old boys network" situations.

[AJC79]

@WalneyCol. You make a fair point regarding responsible bodies being able to act unfairly. However the point I was trying to make was that the University boat club is not the one at fault necesarily. They are acting within the rules! Also, I'm afraid that you are tarring all rowers with a rather antiquated brush. Rowing is no longer the preserve of private school boys, and as such is not privy to the 'old boys' network of which you speak! It;s Brum Uni, not Oxbridge at the end of the day!

[WalneyCol]

@AJC79 Point taken about it being brum rather than oxbridge. But just because he CAN get away with using such an unsitable craft deos that automatically mean he SHOULD? Whatever happened to social concience? I'd be too embarrassed to use that craft for that purpose on that river. The guy ought to have an ASBO slapped on him.

[sabrinaworcester1]

@WalneyCol Absolutely agree. He appears now to have moved on as I havent seen him for months. Hope it is permanent, the new driver appears better in a new boat the Univ have bought due to these vids and he keeps more to the middle rather than the shallower edges with sloping bottom which both exacerbate the wash.

[cathburgerqueen]

@AJC79 You don't have to break any rules in order to be an ignoramus. The ignorant slob in the boat could probably cut his wash by half just by going on a diet.

[AJC79]

@cathburgerqueen

I think basing making personal comments about someone based upon physical appearance is rather uncalled for don't you think? I do not know the person involved, nor yourself, but feel that describing the guy as a 'slob' is out of order. If you are reduced to name calling and ridicule based on those points, I'd say that you held a rather narrow-minded view point on life!

[WalneyCol]

@AJC79 "SLOB" is based on behavior as much as mere appearances. The man in the video was demonstrating a highly selfish attitude towards all other river users (even his own rowers) and by doing what he did he demonstrates to those very same rowers that selfish and inconsiderate attitudes are ok - and in my opinion that makes him an ignorant inconsiderate slob.

[cathburgerqueen]

@WalneyCol Thank you walneycol you put it much better than me. I would have just called him an inconsiderate arse hole and pushed him in the river.

[sabrinaworcester1]

@cathburgerqueen I wouldnt condone that! One rower did threaten to erode my face. Still after several years of eroding they now are mostly acceptable - just the Kings School with 2 of theirs, and gin palace cruisers with 200 hp which are less frequent but higher wash and now the local trip boat with a new driver has stated causing a wash! British Waterways dont care. Conflict of interest between revenue collection and environment!

[artjomf4]

@cathburgerqueen In response to the 17second video of the launch going at full pace, you'll find that at higher speeds there is less wet surface on the launch, hence less water gets disturbed and less wash is created. That's why you can get high speed boats with barely any wash as they're practically above the surface)

[sabrinaworcester1]

@AJC79 I am not aware that they have been given an exemption and if they were then I would have thought the coach would have told me about it rather than lying about the WWUF. It would also go against BW own advice on this page for this area of the river. urls cannot be posted in these messages I believe but i might get away with this waterscape com/canals-and-rivers/river-se­vern/boating.

[sabrinaworcester1]

@sabrinaworcester1

Just put the dot before the com and use world wide web before it

[sabrinaworcester1]

@AJC79

Hi . Whilst I have heard rumours that BW did this, I have not had this confirmed before. Is this on the Severn? and on a part of the river that banks could be damaged? Does it have any restrictions on the exemption? My initial response not knowing more facts would be that BW are acting ultra vires, beyond their powers. They do not own the river and they should not give permission to anyone, who by that act of permission is causing damage to others property.

[AJC79]

@sabrinaworcester1

I cannot comment on the Severn I'm afraid, as it is an area with which i am unfamiliar. Nor am I certain exactly what limitations are placed on the use of the boats. My club was given the proviso that the coaching launch had to be accompanying a boat which was being coached in order to travel above the speed limit.

On your other point, I believe that rivers are classified as 'common land' meaning that no-one owns it, but everyone can use it in line with the rules set down.

[sabrinaworcester1]

@AJC79 Thanks for that clarification. The scenario is different for almost every river, as they have different classifications and local acts. Riparian law though means that whoever owns the land adjoining the river owns the soil to the centre of the river, with rights to fish, moor and extract water. The navigation of the river is dependent on whether it has gained this through long time use or order of the crown except in tidal waters which all have a right.

[sabrinaworcester1]

@AJC79 All people have to abide by the common law of no harm or loss to anyone and the undermining of the riverbank up to 3 foot in places, (which then slumps in the river in a flood) by launches causing breaking wash is clearly causing damage to property. BW have some rights over the water eg licence pleasure boats who use the middle channel. If BW had issued these exemptions, (which I thought maybe had to be classified as safety launches?) then they would be liable to paying part of the costs.

[sabrinaworcester1]

@AJC79 I obviously asked them to slow down for years before I put the video up. He lied that they had permission from Worcestershire water users forum. They replied that they had not given a permission they could not give. I am surprised that a low wash launch would cost only £1000, then that is only £20 each for a club of 50 rowers to save all the problems to the wildlife, riverbanks and other river users. The rowing boats themselves are at a guess way more expensive?

[AJC79]

@sabrinaworcester1

A low wash launch is not prohibitivly expensive for most clubs to buy, but student clubs are, I'm afraid, another matter entirely! Rowing is indeed an expensive sport (as you rightly say the shells do cost considerably more than 1k!), but what you are asking the students to do is pay for something that most of them will only be able to use for a year or two. In most clubs this would be reasonable, but why should already cash-strapped individuals pay extra for somethign they

[AJC79]

@sabrinaworcester1 @sabrinaworcester1

won't see the benefit of themselves? (I am of course speakig from the point of view of the rowers, not my own POV!)

It will be the University that will provide the funding to buy the launch and boats. If you were to approach the club and speak to the coach about offering your help to cajole the uni to release extra funds to pay for a low wash launch, I honestly cannot see them refusing!

[sabrinaworcester1]

@Dj1nsan1ty. So you are saying that because the rowing club do not want to raise funds then the owners of the banks, including the council then have to to repair the bank? Far more expensive and rowing coach has externalised cost onto someone else , as well as the biodiversity loss, and polluter pays is a far more moral solution and pollution/damage prevention far better still. They bought the wrong boat when they started, should the river and other people suffer for that?

[sabrinaworcester1]

@Dj1nsan1ty . As for the old chestnut that stong rainfall causes more damage, what proof do you provide? None. Heavy rainfall only can cause damage if the riverbank is at greater than the natural angle of repose of the bank or if the bank is not held together by roots of trees and water margin plants. What causes erosion of all these - boats causing a breaking wash

[sabrinaworcester1]

@Dj1nsan1ty. 7 videos whose subjects are Birmingham University and Kings school - not everyone who uses the river, also it is against their non low wash launches, when they could easily use low wash launches. If someone unnecessarily and continuously damaged a wall of yours would that be yobbish behaviour? Why is not when rowing coaches do it to the riverbank? Is not the vendetta by the rowing clubs against all the owners of the riverbanks, including the public?

[AJC79]

Hi Sabrinaworcester1

I, like a previous poster, am a rower. I can see your point with this one though, however I do take issue with your claim that this activity is illegal. I would point out that the boat club are not in contrvention of any rules here as long as their craft is registered with the environment agency. They issue exemption permits to a limited number of craft, allowing them to ignore the speed limit. The environment agency is well aware of the damage that speeding craft cause

[sabrinaworcester1]

@AJC79.

Hi AJC79. I think you must be talking about a different river or possibly a tidal zone. This rivers navigation authority is BW. The rules are 6mph upriver, 8 down or not causing a breaking wash whichever is slower. This i admit causes a problem for rowing coaches who i believe in an 8 can get up to 16 knots? It is difficult to see how the EA could give exemption to rowing coaches causing damage to private or council property ie riverbanks which is being damaged

[fastfallin]

oh no there is at least a 5inch wave END OF THE WORLD END OF THE WORLD!!!! WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO WHAT?

[sabrinaworcester1]

@fastfallin 5 inches undermining the bank 3 foot back during the summer means that at least 3 foot of the bank slumps into the river approximately 5 yeards high.

[fastfallin]

@sabrinaworcester1 I'm no expert dut how do u think the river got there ok i'll give you a clue god didn't create them

now please go get a hobby there are loads of internet games you could start with or maybe a nice country walk or drive I prefer the later.

[sabrinaworcester1]

@fastfallin

1 minute ago

@fastfallin You appear to forget this is no longer a natural river which used to be tidal to Worcester. It has been "locked" and is subject to mans effects via use of fossil fuels. Do you think this might increase the erosion just a tad at what is known as summer levels, which has an effect on the bank above it?. Thanks for your contribution

[myjugsarehuge]

He is an idiot, the phrase toys for boys springs to mind, perhaps he drives a mini?

Seriously this is terrible, you should email this video to the Dean of Birmingham University, or whoever is in charge and demand a reply.

[sabrinaworcester1]

Hi jugs. Yes he does appear to have a few issues. The whole Birmingham University mentality appears to be "we can do what we want and sod everyone else", despite the fact that they are illegally doing this yobbish behaviour, and destroying the environment, causing bank erosion, making flooding worse, causing damage to boats, putting peoples safety at risk etc.

I have written to various authroities again, to ask that this Sea Strike boat be replaced by a low wash boat so far with no action.cont

[sabrinaworcester1]

cont. If they do not take action, then is is plenty more footage to go up and we will continue to witness their actions. Maybe it will be a god idea to put up the various emails so others can send them the video as well. cont