Who is "You're Judge"? I assume you mean "Your judge". Judge John E. Jones was a George W. Bush appointment, not someone the plaintiffs would rush to hear their arguments. His opinion in the case shows how weak the defense case was. ID is not science. Get over it. Go back to your think tanks and come up with another magical explanation for everything.
For everyone trying to find Behe being accused of perjury, you won't find it. Behe was simply embarrassed on his lack of knowledge of peer-reviewed evidence showing the evolution of the bacterial flagellum.
However, there was a man in Dover who claimed he didn't know who paid for the free copies of Panda and People that the Dover school received when in fact he knew.
i actually have to give Judge Jones credit. Given that in doing this he may have actually damaged himself politically, and ended up having to face death threats and the like he stood up for truth and I am quite proud that we have people like that on the bench in this country.
Although the argument from irreducible complexity is essentially a rehash of the famously flawed watchmaker argument advanced by William Paley at the start of the 19th century, Behe's book has attracted a great deal of attention from creationists and non-creationists alike. The articles collected here address the claims made by Behe in his book.
After the trial, there were calls for the defendants accused of not presenting their case honestly to be put on trial for committing perjury. "Witnesses either testified inconsistently, or lied outright under oath several times. Judge Jones wrote. "The inescapable truth is that Bonsell, Buckingham and Behe lied at their January 3, 2005 depositions. … Defendants have attempted in vain to distance themselves from their own statements, which culminated in repetitious, untruthful testimony."
@VanGoghsEar1890 Wow what a fool ! Hey genius, do a google on "The inescapable truth is that Bonsell, and show me where Behe's name is mentioned.
It's just one lie after another with you. Not only do you lie about the judge warning Behe at the trial but now you even lie as to what the judge wrote !!!!! What a twit.
@edwite777 I think the troll is in self-denial. He's had three people show him he's wrong and yet he still clings to his lie. This thread is effectively dead. Anyone coming into the thread will see that VanGoghEar1890 is a fool at best. The trial transcript is on-line for anyone to read and the wikipedia quote is there for anyone to google.
@VanGoghsEar1890 I have finished reading Michael Behe's entire testimony from the on-line trial transcript. And I can't find anything that even comes close to what you claim occurred.
It is apparent to me that you haven't read it at all. The judge didn't have a single negative thing to say to Behe throughout his testimony. And you're quote of what the judge wrote is also wrong. Behe's name is not mentioned at all with Bonsell and Buckingham. Your sources whatever they are, are incorrect.
@tapemahn Just for the record, this is from Wikipedia.
Judge Jones wrote. "The inescapable truth is that both [Alan] Bonsell and [William] Buckingham lied at their January 3, 2005 depositions." You'll find no mention of Michael Behe there at all. Unlike the tale this troll would have you beleive.
And the very fact that he had to stick Behe's name into the quote speaks volumes as to the nature of this troll.
@tapemahn I don't think he has any sources. He makes things up as he goes along. His insertion of Behe's name into Jones' qoute is rather telling don't you think.
In fact, I'll give you two biblical trolls an easy start. Let's talk the Bible since you probably assume I was raised in a cave by Atheists. Question #1. Name at least two passages that prove God created a flat earth. Good luck...
Do I see a little sour grapes on the part of pseudo-science proponents. You freaks do realize if you ever get your way you're going to have to produce peer reviewed works supporting creationism. If science does not yet know then it must be God isn't science. Michael Behe's disastrous and perjured testimony about irreducible complexity was laughable and highly dishonest. If that's the best you've got you're in big trouble. Besides, what is your goal? To make bigger morons of our schoolchildren?
@jsloan777 What a self-inflated lunatic you are. Your testimony on judgement day? I suggest you take a break from your cult and commit yourself to a psychiatric institution.
@VanGoghsEar1890 Personal attack, first resort of the ignorant last resort of the desperate. I'd be more impressed if you could actual make an attempt to rebut with arguments. But of course you have none to offer. What a surprise.
@jsloan777 If you're looking for a debate with these trolls, lots of luck. most of these kids probably just barely made it through high school. Critical thinking wasn't part of the curriculum.
@jsloan777 Troll eh? I've only read two books on the trial and own the PBS documentary. When all someone can comment is the trial was a joke what do you want me to reply to such intellectual insights? I've put something up now that will show that I was right the first time. Do you want to add something a bit more cerebral or just continue to call me( someone who knows a 1,000 times what you know about the trial, creationism, and evolution) or are you satisfied with the argument that I'm a troll?
@edwite777 Let me guess. It was a joke because your delusions and Michael Behe's outright lies didn't win over the truth. You're a hopeless cult member who has no desire to learn the truth. You're the joke.
@edwite777 Obviously you don't know a single fact about that trial. When the judge threatens you with perjury, you've committed some lies. Behe said there were no peer reviewed essays or books disputing his laughable hypotheses of irreducible complexity. After the plaintiffs' attorney finished stacking the books disputing his claim on the witness stand, you could no longer see his red face. I'd be careful about who you accuse of not knowing what they're talking about. You sir, are a twit.
@VanGoghsEar1890 The PBS propaganda piece was an allefged re-enactment idiot. It wasn't live coverage. And if you actually read the transcript you'd know the dialogue in the re-enactment was nothing like what happened. And I challenge you to show me where the judge threatened Behe from the transcript.. Come on genius put up or shut up .
@edwite777 Oh God, the old PBS is propaganda line. I can only imagine what bullshit you consider news. Put up or shut up? Wow, I'll bet you're a real tough guy. Look tough guy, the fact is a conservative, christian, Bush appointed judge called the creationist case complete inanity. LMAO. You lose!!!!!
@VanGoghsEar1890 Just what i thought, you can't provide proof for your bullshit claim that the judge threatened Behe with perjury.
Anyone following this thread and actually goes and checks the trial transcript will realize what a lying troll you are. Case closed. The only one who loses is liars like you.
@edwite777 Listen you dumb liar. A troll is someone who visits other's channels with threats, vulgarities and endless inanity. It's not someone who disagrees with your bullshit. You just can't take it like that fat ass, oxycontin freak who echoes your exact words. Look at the number of times you've commented on this video compared to me. If your definition of a troll is correct, you're the king.
Sidesteping the issue isn't going to help you . You said the judge threatened Behe with pergury at the trial. You can't show us that , what a surprise. Ed was right you are a troll, and a lying one too.
@jsloan777 It's rather telling when a person has to engage in such intellectual dishonesty in order to support his world view. How cowardly to impune someone's integrity (Behe) who is not here to defend himself by lying about him.
And then when shown his fallacy not to at least admit he made a mistake. He loses all credibility and his cause takes a hit because observers can easily assume that he typically represents the cause when in all likelihood he represents the baser elements of the cause.
@edwite777 The idiot can't even show you the judge threatening Behe. What a surprise. A troll and a lying one to boot. And I have to laugh at him bragging about owning the PBS propaganda piece. Bet he also owns Inherit The wind and thinks that's authoritative too. LOL
Conservative Christian judge ? What a laugh ! This moron hasn't a clue what he's talking about.
@jsloan777 Well I warned you. I caught him in a lie, he doesn't even know the difference between giving an opinion and a judge threatening Behe with perjury, which the judge did not do.
Jones claimed that Behe, when asked about articles purporting to explain the evolution of the immune system, responded that the articles were “not ‘good enough.’” Behe actually said the exact opposite: “it’s not that they aren’t good enough. It’s simply that they are addressed to a different subject.”
@edwite777 Yeah well, you were right. The fact that he lied about the judge threatening Behe with perjury is enough to discredit anything else he has to say and the only ones that will be patting him on the back will be his fellow trolls..
See how fast he tried to switch the topic from the trial transcript to the judge's opinion. He knows he was caught in a lie. I'll ignore him from here on in. Let him troll away to his heart's content :) And thanks a lot for your support :)
@jsloan777 Well that's what trolls do, they lie and ignore the facts. Anyone following this thread will see his charge of the judge allegedly threatening Behe with perjury, and if they're honest and go read the actual transcript, they'll find out what a liar this troll is. That's the great thing about trial transcripts, they are no-spin zones. Let this troll keep watching his PBS propaganda piece and fool himself into thinking he knows something. Let him live the lie.. Keep up the fight !
@edwite777 One more thing, in regard to the claim that Judge Jones is a conservative christian. From his commencement speech at Dickinson College:
“The founders believed that true religion was not something handed down by a church or contained in a Bible, but was to be found through free, rational inquiry"
The irony here is that the Dickinson College Seal contains the motto "Religion and learning, the bulwark of liberty" with a picture of a telescope and an open bible. Some conservative !
@jsloan777 Well that's a prime example of how the left-wing media works. They know nobody wants to hear about liberals opinions so they try to promote someone as being conservative and gullible people like this troll swallow it hook and sinker.. Left-wing politicians are nowadays trying to promote themselves as being conservatives to get elected too. Judge Jones is an activist judge. Your typical run-of-the-mill liberal.
@jsloan777 His credibility here is shot. He got caught in a lie. I doubt you'll see him in this thread again, except maybe to toss some more choice pejoratives our way..
@edwite777 You want to bet my little liar? Now all of a sudden you've read the transcript? Ha-ha. You freaks never fail when it comes to lying. I guess it comes with believing in the words of superstitious, lying, ancient, middle eastern yokels. Bugger off tough guy. You're really boring me.
@jsloan777 LMAO. You wimps are hilarious. I'd love to meet you in person and see how brave you are. LOL!!! The troll? Look at all the comments you have up here. I think you doing a little projecting.
@jsloan777 Perhaps you' like to explain your expertise. I don't think you read anything on the trial. Put your money where your mouth is. He WAS threatened with perjury for testifying that his hypotheses was original and when Jones found out over forty books had been written disproving his claim, he was threatened with PERJURY. Why do you pathological liars just admit you're not the least bit familiar with the case other than a few YT videos?LMFAO. Now, one quote and you're an expert on Jones.
@VanGoghsEar1890 Still lying !!!Unbeleivable, all you have to do is show me the page from the transcript where the judge does that. If you could, you would have done it by now. But you haven't instead you just continue trolling. What a surprise.
@jsloan777 Did I call it or what ? LOL. Not only can he not meet my challenge, he compounds his lie by sticking Behe's name into Judge Jones quote !!!! How pathetic. This idiot apparently doesn't realize that people can read this thread and go check these things out very easily.
@edwite777 please explain to me how it is you came to reply to one of my PMs that formed part of a conversation I've been having with jsloan777? If you are in fact the same person, then talking to yourself in the comments seems very misleading and unchristian of you, not to mention a little whacky! Or maybe you just share a computer? Either way, it all seems a little desperate I have to say.
@edwite777 What part about it was a joke? Both sides had their time in court. The judge was even the appointment of a conservative (Bush). The ID advocates were simply embarrassed for a couple of reasons. First, they showed the lack of scientific merit that ID has. Secondly, they were exposed as liars. One man was almost charged with perjury.
Who is "You're Judge"? I assume you mean "Your judge". Judge John E. Jones was a George W. Bush appointment, not someone the plaintiffs would rush to hear their arguments. His opinion in the case shows how weak the defense case was. ID is not science. Get over it. Go back to your think tanks and come up with another magical explanation for everything.
SailingMonsoon 6 months ago 4
@SailingMonsoon ...Amen.
BeneathTheLogicLB 1 month ago
As the ignorant lemming that you are, that's all you have to offer is empty rhetoric,
You're Judge lied in his opinion and morons like oyu just ignore it.
jsloan777 10 months ago
For everyone trying to find Behe being accused of perjury, you won't find it. Behe was simply embarrassed on his lack of knowledge of peer-reviewed evidence showing the evolution of the bacterial flagellum.
However, there was a man in Dover who claimed he didn't know who paid for the free copies of Panda and People that the Dover school received when in fact he knew.
logsdonj 1 year ago
The ACLU did a good job of writing Judge Jone's decision, don't you think?
MorganMarvinson 1 year ago
What does "forment" mean? You might get the message across better if the music did not drown what you are trying to say.
paulg53 1 year ago
i actually have to give Judge Jones credit. Given that in doing this he may have actually damaged himself politically, and ended up having to face death threats and the like he stood up for truth and I am quite proud that we have people like that on the bench in this country.
Darkstar1484 1 year ago 14
Although the argument from irreducible complexity is essentially a rehash of the famously flawed watchmaker argument advanced by William Paley at the start of the 19th century, Behe's book has attracted a great deal of attention from creationists and non-creationists alike. The articles collected here address the claims made by Behe in his book.
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
After the trial, there were calls for the defendants accused of not presenting their case honestly to be put on trial for committing perjury. "Witnesses either testified inconsistently, or lied outright under oath several times. Judge Jones wrote. "The inescapable truth is that Bonsell, Buckingham and Behe lied at their January 3, 2005 depositions. … Defendants have attempted in vain to distance themselves from their own statements, which culminated in repetitious, untruthful testimony."
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
@VanGoghsEar1890 Wow what a fool ! Hey genius, do a google on "The inescapable truth is that Bonsell, and show me where Behe's name is mentioned.
It's just one lie after another with you. Not only do you lie about the judge warning Behe at the trial but now you even lie as to what the judge wrote !!!!! What a twit.
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 I think the troll is in self-denial. He's had three people show him he's wrong and yet he still clings to his lie. This thread is effectively dead. Anyone coming into the thread will see that VanGoghEar1890 is a fool at best. The trial transcript is on-line for anyone to read and the wikipedia quote is there for anyone to google.
jsloan777 1 year ago
@VanGoghsEar1890 I have finished reading Michael Behe's entire testimony from the on-line trial transcript. And I can't find anything that even comes close to what you claim occurred.
It is apparent to me that you haven't read it at all. The judge didn't have a single negative thing to say to Behe throughout his testimony. And you're quote of what the judge wrote is also wrong. Behe's name is not mentioned at all with Bonsell and Buckingham. Your sources whatever they are, are incorrect.
tapemahn 1 year ago
@tapemahn Just for the record, this is from Wikipedia.
Judge Jones wrote. "The inescapable truth is that both [Alan] Bonsell and [William] Buckingham lied at their January 3, 2005 depositions." You'll find no mention of Michael Behe there at all. Unlike the tale this troll would have you beleive.
And the very fact that he had to stick Behe's name into the quote speaks volumes as to the nature of this troll.
edwite777 1 year ago
@tapemahn I don't think he has any sources. He makes things up as he goes along. His insertion of Behe's name into Jones' qoute is rather telling don't you think.
jsloan777 1 year ago
In fact, I'll give you two biblical trolls an easy start. Let's talk the Bible since you probably assume I was raised in a cave by Atheists. Question #1. Name at least two passages that prove God created a flat earth. Good luck...
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
Do I see a little sour grapes on the part of pseudo-science proponents. You freaks do realize if you ever get your way you're going to have to produce peer reviewed works supporting creationism. If science does not yet know then it must be God isn't science. Michael Behe's disastrous and perjured testimony about irreducible complexity was laughable and highly dishonest. If that's the best you've got you're in big trouble. Besides, what is your goal? To make bigger morons of our schoolchildren?
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
The trial was a joke and so is this commentary.
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 I bet
MatterofLuck 1 year ago
@MatterofLuck
Check out my commentary on judgement day
jsloan777 1 year ago
@jsloan777 Haha ;D
MatterofLuck 1 year ago
@jsloan777 What a self-inflated lunatic you are. Your testimony on judgement day? I suggest you take a break from your cult and commit yourself to a psychiatric institution.
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
@VanGoghsEar1890 Personal attack, first resort of the ignorant last resort of the desperate. I'd be more impressed if you could actual make an attempt to rebut with arguments. But of course you have none to offer. What a surprise.
jsloan777 1 year ago
@jsloan777 If you're looking for a debate with these trolls, lots of luck. most of these kids probably just barely made it through high school. Critical thinking wasn't part of the curriculum.
edwite777 1 year ago
@jsloan777 Troll eh? I've only read two books on the trial and own the PBS documentary. When all someone can comment is the trial was a joke what do you want me to reply to such intellectual insights? I've put something up now that will show that I was right the first time. Do you want to add something a bit more cerebral or just continue to call me( someone who knows a 1,000 times what you know about the trial, creationism, and evolution) or are you satisfied with the argument that I'm a troll?
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
@edwite777 Let me guess. It was a joke because your delusions and Michael Behe's outright lies didn't win over the truth. You're a hopeless cult member who has no desire to learn the truth. You're the joke.
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
@VanGoghsEar1890 What lies were those ? Name one. You wouldn't know truth if it fell on you.
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 Obviously you don't know a single fact about that trial. When the judge threatens you with perjury, you've committed some lies. Behe said there were no peer reviewed essays or books disputing his laughable hypotheses of irreducible complexity. After the plaintiffs' attorney finished stacking the books disputing his claim on the witness stand, you could no longer see his red face. I'd be careful about who you accuse of not knowing what they're talking about. You sir, are a twit.
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
@VanGoghsEar1890 The PBS propaganda piece was an allefged re-enactment idiot. It wasn't live coverage. And if you actually read the transcript you'd know the dialogue in the re-enactment was nothing like what happened. And I challenge you to show me where the judge threatened Behe from the transcript.. Come on genius put up or shut up .
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 Oh God, the old PBS is propaganda line. I can only imagine what bullshit you consider news. Put up or shut up? Wow, I'll bet you're a real tough guy. Look tough guy, the fact is a conservative, christian, Bush appointed judge called the creationist case complete inanity. LMAO. You lose!!!!!
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
@VanGoghsEar1890 Just what i thought, you can't provide proof for your bullshit claim that the judge threatened Behe with perjury.
Anyone following this thread and actually goes and checks the trial transcript will realize what a lying troll you are. Case closed. The only one who loses is liars like you.
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 Listen you dumb liar. A troll is someone who visits other's channels with threats, vulgarities and endless inanity. It's not someone who disagrees with your bullshit. You just can't take it like that fat ass, oxycontin freak who echoes your exact words. Look at the number of times you've commented on this video compared to me. If your definition of a troll is correct, you're the king.
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
@VanGoghsEar1890 Wow, what an idiot. Hey, genius, all you have to do is cite the day and session where the judge threatens Behe.
You can't do that can you sport ?? LOL
You do know how to read a transcript don't you ? I know some of the words are longer than four letters, but give it a shot anyway LOL.
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 Pardon me chief, he called it unbelievable inanity. Is that better? LOL!!!!
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
Sidesteping the issue isn't going to help you . You said the judge threatened Behe with pergury at the trial. You can't show us that , what a surprise. Ed was right you are a troll, and a lying one too.
jsloan777 1 year ago
@jsloan777 It's rather telling when a person has to engage in such intellectual dishonesty in order to support his world view. How cowardly to impune someone's integrity (Behe) who is not here to defend himself by lying about him.
And then when shown his fallacy not to at least admit he made a mistake. He loses all credibility and his cause takes a hit because observers can easily assume that he typically represents the cause when in all likelihood he represents the baser elements of the cause.
tapemahn 1 year ago
@VanGoghsEar1890 That wasn't in the transcript either idiot.
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 The idiot can't even show you the judge threatening Behe. What a surprise. A troll and a lying one to boot. And I have to laugh at him bragging about owning the PBS propaganda piece. Bet he also owns Inherit The wind and thinks that's authoritative too. LOL
Conservative Christian judge ? What a laugh ! This moron hasn't a clue what he's talking about.
jsloan777 1 year ago
@jsloan777 Well I warned you. I caught him in a lie, he doesn't even know the difference between giving an opinion and a judge threatening Behe with perjury, which the judge did not do.
Jones claimed that Behe, when asked about articles purporting to explain the evolution of the immune system, responded that the articles were “not ‘good enough.’” Behe actually said the exact opposite: “it’s not that they aren’t good enough. It’s simply that they are addressed to a different subject.”
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 Yeah well, you were right. The fact that he lied about the judge threatening Behe with perjury is enough to discredit anything else he has to say and the only ones that will be patting him on the back will be his fellow trolls..
See how fast he tried to switch the topic from the trial transcript to the judge's opinion. He knows he was caught in a lie. I'll ignore him from here on in. Let him troll away to his heart's content :) And thanks a lot for your support :)
jsloan777 1 year ago
@jsloan777 Well that's what trolls do, they lie and ignore the facts. Anyone following this thread will see his charge of the judge allegedly threatening Behe with perjury, and if they're honest and go read the actual transcript, they'll find out what a liar this troll is. That's the great thing about trial transcripts, they are no-spin zones. Let this troll keep watching his PBS propaganda piece and fool himself into thinking he knows something. Let him live the lie.. Keep up the fight !
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 One more thing, in regard to the claim that Judge Jones is a conservative christian. From his commencement speech at Dickinson College:
“The founders believed that true religion was not something handed down by a church or contained in a Bible, but was to be found through free, rational inquiry"
The irony here is that the Dickinson College Seal contains the motto "Religion and learning, the bulwark of liberty" with a picture of a telescope and an open bible. Some conservative !
jsloan777 1 year ago
@jsloan777 Well that's a prime example of how the left-wing media works. They know nobody wants to hear about liberals opinions so they try to promote someone as being conservative and gullible people like this troll swallow it hook and sinker.. Left-wing politicians are nowadays trying to promote themselves as being conservatives to get elected too. Judge Jones is an activist judge. Your typical run-of-the-mill liberal.
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 Hmmmm, haven't heard from the troll in a couple days. Wonder where he went? Hey Trolly, where are you ?
jsloan777 1 year ago
@jsloan777 His credibility here is shot. He got caught in a lie. I doubt you'll see him in this thread again, except maybe to toss some more choice pejoratives our way..
He's probably off trolling in some other thread.
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 You want to bet my little liar? Now all of a sudden you've read the transcript? Ha-ha. You freaks never fail when it comes to lying. I guess it comes with believing in the words of superstitious, lying, ancient, middle eastern yokels. Bugger off tough guy. You're really boring me.
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
@jsloan777 LMAO. You wimps are hilarious. I'd love to meet you in person and see how brave you are. LOL!!! The troll? Look at all the comments you have up here. I think you doing a little projecting.
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
@jsloan777 Perhaps you' like to explain your expertise. I don't think you read anything on the trial. Put your money where your mouth is. He WAS threatened with perjury for testifying that his hypotheses was original and when Jones found out over forty books had been written disproving his claim, he was threatened with PERJURY. Why do you pathological liars just admit you're not the least bit familiar with the case other than a few YT videos?LMFAO. Now, one quote and you're an expert on Jones.
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
@VanGoghsEar1890 Still lying !!!Unbeleivable, all you have to do is show me the page from the transcript where the judge does that. If you could, you would have done it by now. But you haven't instead you just continue trolling. What a surprise.
But that's what pathological liars like you do .
jsloan777 1 year ago
@jsloan777 Did I call it or what ? LOL. Not only can he not meet my challenge, he compounds his lie by sticking Behe's name into Judge Jones quote !!!! How pathetic. This idiot apparently doesn't realize that people can read this thread and go check these things out very easily.
edwite777 1 year ago
@edwite777 please explain to me how it is you came to reply to one of my PMs that formed part of a conversation I've been having with jsloan777? If you are in fact the same person, then talking to yourself in the comments seems very misleading and unchristian of you, not to mention a little whacky! Or maybe you just share a computer? Either way, it all seems a little desperate I have to say.
dj2baduk 1 year ago
@edwite777 What part about it was a joke? Both sides had their time in court. The judge was even the appointment of a conservative (Bush). The ID advocates were simply embarrassed for a couple of reasons. First, they showed the lack of scientific merit that ID has. Secondly, they were exposed as liars. One man was almost charged with perjury.
logsdonj 1 year ago 2
@edwite777 That's it! Deny the evidence and reject reality... AGAIN! That's all the we expect from backward cave dwellers like you!
SteDeRaver 10 months ago
Amen. :P
demaskas 2 years ago 4