Mig 23 Flogger

[ThaFunkster100]

Shit song.

[zerocker45]

This planes downed lots of south african Mirages in the Angolan War....

[Blacknemisis]

Man if Russians would upgrade the engines give it flyby wire systems maybe some modren avironics and put some R77 and R73 on it this would be a great sale to 3rd world countries.

[leonelp51]

u couldnt see this airplane at its max being used by Siryan pilots, and guess what ... they downed F-16... what could a russian pilot do with one of those MIG-23MLD .... mmmm

[longlivestalin1]

another soviet beauty

[xraidedlok]

cut the fag music and les hear some jets

[RaptorGP]

На мой взгляд, красавцем его не назовёшь. 21-й посимпатичнее был.

[rampking1]

The "Hell fighter"???.... perhaps........

to it's own pilots!

To be honest, I am shocked that the American FAA allows a privately owned east coast MiG-23 to be flown.

Only a matter of time before someone gets killed.

[AhdelEssam]

and its funny all they state is simple phrase judging the russian fighters. typical american way lol.

[rampking1]

I guess you missed reading the part where it said HALF of the MiG-23's in the IAF were lost from accidents,

not combat.

Out of 75 aircaft, less than a dozen were still operational at the end.

Regarding the American way...

I read interviews from USAF pilots of the then

4477th Test and Evaluation Squadron,and these TEST pilots prefered not to fly it...but did continnue to fly later model MiG 21 and

MiG-29's.

These pilots came one step away from calling the MiG-23 a deathtrap.

[AhdelEssam]

why it happend in india not in russia?

and by the way i wont take america's evaluations as integrity excuse me lol, i saw enough childish reports from americans, even when in recent simulations against indian Su-30mki they usually cycle around the point and will show the points where they have advantage over the many points where they get outperformed. so i wont believe any reports from america over russian aircrafts without a thirdparty "eg india"

[rampking1]

You might be correct about MiG-23 and it's history in the Red Air Force.

We don't know.

But you have to ask yourself, why the Russians retired the MiG-23 so soon after the retirement of the MiG-21.

The MiG-23 was the MiG-21's supposed replacement fighter!

FYI: I have been talking to you for a while.

I can downgrade American weapons as well.

I'm in the midst of a running battle with others regarding the American M-4 Sherman tank, a deathtrap against any German Panzer after 1943.

C/ya

[AhdelEssam]

mig-23 is a fighter with very limited roles to be able to fullfill, its a 3rd generation aircraft, unlike su-24 that can fullfill its roles same for su-25 that will continue that in the future also. no american 3rd generation fighter is in service today. fighters are hard to update if not with near timeless frame that can fullfill future requirements, still mig-23 is effictive but russians had the mig-29 so soon after the mig-23 production started.

[nedeljko031]

@rampking1 it wasnt mig21 replacement....mig29 was mig 21 replacement....

[rampking1]

@nedeljko031

I know there were numerous upgraded models of the MiG-21, but that still is a huge gap in years between the MiG-21 and the introduction of the MiG-29.

[nedeljko031]

@rampking1 well not so much Mig 29 was in full production in 1983 and Mig 21 was sent to reserve in 1989 :)....

[JohnyKage]

If the Mig 23 is such a hazard to its own pilot what do you have to say about the F 104 wich changed its name from Starfighter to Widowmaker or the AV 8 Harrier.

[rampking1]

Easy one,no winning combat history.

Lets not get into the export model excuses again please.

F-104,yes it was nicknamed widowmaker with the Luftwaffe when they tried to convert a pure interceptor into a fighter bomber. It was as idiotic as putting bombs on a MiG-21.

The first Harriers from the British did have many crashes,but by the time of the Falkland Island war it owned the skies from short decked helecopter carriers for a base.

Still the only successful verticle fighter as of now.

[rampking1]

@JohnyKage The F-104 became a dangerous when the German's decided to make it into fighter-bomber.

Like strapping bombs onto the wings of the MiG-21....not a good idea. Yes, the early Harriers from GB were dangerous but it sure save the Brits bacon down in the Falkland Islands War ( and I was supporting Argentina)

How many conflicts has the MiG-23 dominated the skies?

[PICLex]

@JohnyKage

yeah no shit. Im glad the FAA allows people to fly a MiG. Flying is inherently dangerous, and as pilots we get ourselves into tight situations from time to time, its the only way we can truly learn. So we take our lives into our own hands, as long as were not taking anyone else with us, it's no one else's business.

[simeon5541]

@JohnyKage

I am sorry if you two are Americans,

but I do not belive that this plane is so bad,

Americans have always 5 or more planes on 1 hostile plane !

[kakadz89]

Nice video about beautifull machines. :)

[rampking1]

They suckered a lot of countries didn't they?

As I mentioned to the Russian fan, what is the point of getting a good deal from the Soviets if you are getting a castrated fighter aircraft? I guess it looks good on paper?

Of course the Warsaw Pact countries didn't have not much choice.

Now that the "excellent MiG-23's" are largely retired, I guess we will never really be able to settle this will we?

Like the old fish story, you should have seen the one that got away? thanks for your reply

[foman17]

provocator?

[rampking1]

nope...

I judge aircraft by actual service and COMBAT record....

not by aircraft stats and airshow demos

.

 Everytime I talk about Soviet/Russian aircraft weak combat records I always have some Russian telling me how the export models were not good and the good ones back in the Motherland were world beaters.

Look, the F-105 Thud was a Mach 2 fighter with 26,000lb of thrust but was still eaten alive by MiG-17's in Vietnam.

I see both sides of the coin.

Can you do the same in Russia?

[demonsvoice22689]

i know exactly what your talkin bout thiers alot of ruskies haten on uncle sam

[rampking1]

Thank you...

I am really looking for diolog here with all views.

I not looking to show anyone that the USA is #1 or shit like that.

But when people here start making comments about their countries fighters "ruling the skies" and especially "KICKING ASS" ...

I WANT them to back the statement up with actual combat records...

Btw, the two aircraft that I respect the most are the Korean War MiG-15 and the over-achieving MiG-17's in Vietnam.

[AhdelEssam]

so sadat from the begining wanted only a victory to negotiate with which is stupid cause simply "what is taken by force cant be returned except by force". thats a rule with no exceptions. historically proven.

[AhdelEssam]

its too bad also cause the same presedent during the 6 of october war is the one who delivered mig-23s for US for evaluation.

[rampking1]

I work with aircraft for an airline but I am not a pilot

However I do listen to what my pilots tell me and respect it while at work.

The USAF test and aggressor pilots like flying the MiG-29 and MiG 21 and also the

Mi-24 Hind helicopter over the Nevada test range....but there is virtually no interest in flying MiG-23.

I may be mistaken about a lot of things, but I will continue to respect their opinions regarding the MiG 23.

Dismiss this if you want.

Thanks for the replies,

C/yu

[AhdelEssam]

/wiki/MiG-23#Performance_tests­

[rampking1]

Wikipedia as a info source? Okay, I will follow your lead.

try /wiki/Tonapah_Range_Airport

If you go there you will find:

MiG-23, "unstable and difficult to fly"

Here is supporting view of my point from the "Hindu Times" of India regarding their recently retired MiG-23 fleet:

"half of the IAF's 75 MiG-23 fleet was destroyed in non-combat flying accidents"

In their words: "a dubious safety record"

Google MiG-23 and you will find this article as the first one listed.

[AhdelEssam]

in russia the issues with india never existed so i wont count it anything. and u sent a wiki stating "unstable and difficult to fly" and doesnt state how they performed against US fighters . while i sent a wiki stating their performance.

i want to know the results.

[rampking1]

Oh no, I see the "export excuse" coming back again. :-(

Btw, India is the ONE country that gets the real stuff from Russia.

They let the Russians know they will go elseware if needed to get the best aircraft, it why they also have the Mirage 2000.

I followed your lead on wikipedia, Wiki is not the last and final word on any subject.

I get too many books and military aviation mags to resort to a general knowledge publication.

Go beyond statistics,.. read battle reports and pilot interviews.

[AhdelEssam]

who said export excuse? iam talking abt maintainance. why this only happns with india?.

and iam not ready to search u for other stuff abt mig-23 evaluations in west. just research and let me know the results. peace :)

[rampking1]

Export excuse, I have had conversations with several commentators on YouYube that always give me the old, "The Soviet Union/ Russia had the good models, the export model MiG 23's are inferior". They like this excuse regarding the combat record of the MiG-29.

Maintainance is a variable which is to be considered, until recently Peru had a hell of a problem with parts for it's MiG-29's.

India got whatever it needed from Russia, but I do admit though that I don't know about their mechanics.

[rampking1]

Btw, the opinion of the western countries regarding the MiG-23...we were impressed by the aircraft for many years.

Then came dismal combat reports back from between Israel and Syria.

At first discounted because of "pilot inexperience and downgraded avionics fit"

But after the dissolution of the Soviet Union we obtained many MiG's for evaluation from former Russian Republics.

Acceleration and speed is all the MiG-23 had.

I admit I do not have the magazine article anymore...wish I had it.

[AhdelEssam]

mhmm syreans didnt perform good also with mig-21 for example check the el mansoura airbattle. it was mainly mig-21s. MIG 23 didnt see action with egypt.

[rampking1]

Although the actual losses from the Mansoura air battle are subject to debate, the IAF did NOT achieve it objective to knock out the Egyptian Air Force and it's bases.

(*End of the line for the A-4 Skyhawk). Regarding the MiG-23, the articlles I have read in the past were about Syrian MiG-23 losses over Lebanon and especially the Bekka valley.

Although two different generation aircraft, the MiG-21 and MiG-23 were retired at about the same time in India and Russia.

Peace also to you.

[AhdelEssam]

yes actually the egyptian estimates of israelie losses are more than that the wiki mentiones the israelie estimates.

and yes seryans always sucked in A-A combat. they always have advanced aircrafts compared to egypt but they never been making good use of it, and let me admit that even egypt's potential is far beyond their performance in the previous war. since our pro-western governments. but still we had supermacy over israel. though they outnumbered us in aircraft u know.

[AhdelEssam]

and mig-23 existed when the best of the west in israel were F-4s and mirages. though it didnt see action in yumkippur maybe cause it was too new for pilots. but it existed in very limited numbers. even since nasser's days.

[AhdelEssam]

and by the way india uses western avionics too much not that they use the best from russia. best russian exports variants were in the cold war era mostly and in wars like yumkipur. research more on that

[AhdelEssam]

iam in, so when was the american fighters or any western fighter better than russian? only in cases where its decades more modern? and poor trained pilots, or in an agression, now look at every single war including 82 war and 73 war and u'll find that russian aircrafts had the upper hands still with poor supplies and far less numbers than israel in these cases, and in vietnam russian aircrafts had the upper hand also. conclusion is simple, west rarely faught even an average equipped enemy.

[rampking1]

You are stating that Israel had more and better aircraft than Eygpt, Syria, Jordan, etc, ?

Look, I don't really like Israel that much..

they are not really allies of the U.S.

(Research the USS Liberty incident and you'll see once again I back my statement up with facts)

Your "average equipped" statement is so far off that discussion is impossible.

American aircraft are not always #1, Japan with it's ZERO and Germany with it's Focke Wulf 190 were #1 during 1941-42.

stop the excuses please.

[AhdelEssam]

yes israel had more and they still have more right now but in dogfights in 73 they lost, and jordan really didnt faught that war it was egypt and syria, and i know abt liberity incident and believe me israel strapped america's back more than that, and average equipped i refere here to countries like iraq and vietnam and even thoes america threatened like iran, america never faught a country like india for example, and of course american aircraft "NEVER" been #1, why u thought i believe this lol.

[rampking1]

The A-4 Skyhawks of the IAF lost big but to the new at the time Soviet -made surface to air hand-held "Strella" missile.

However it was the IAF using American and French made aircraft that slowed the advance of the Egyptian Army across the Sinai.

If Egyptian fighters won the dogfights in 1973, then why is Israel still around?

Israel almost LOST the war in 73 but for it's control of the skies.

Btw, are you aware that Israel counter-attacked in 73 and crossed the Suez Canal?

[AhdelEssam]

first israel is not in sinai anymore, secondly egyptian army only slowed progress after sadat of egypt "a pro-western" agreed on sease fire and "expectedly" israel didnt sease fire, and throuh the war egypt had the aircontrol, and not cause only of the sams, the dog fights losses of israel are record numbers "the longest dog fights in history in that war" .

[AhdelEssam]

A-4s lost in dogfights and midium altitude SAMs mainly. then to strellas. and the advance of egypt wasnt slowed it was that our pro-western "sadat" wanted to gain america as an allie "yes its dumb" that he even stated to the soviets that he want only 10 meters on the west bank to negotiate with. and egypt stopped advancement after the cease fire treaty that was broken several times by israel, and the counter attack wasnt able to capture any city on the canal and could have been taken by mi-8s :)

[AhdelEssam]

and israel yes crossed the canal "less than a batalion" and it had no aircover and could have been taken out by "mi-8s" easily just cause sadat sticked to the sease fire, israelies know well that the purpose of this was a media victory, sadat was not smart i believe, but he didnt want to piss america off, heis the one shifted egypt government to a prowestern one, and research "el mansoura air battle". sadat made a mistake he told russians before "help me gain just 10 meters on western bank"

[AhdelEssam]

i know abt the liberty incident :) and iam sorry i didnt reply before i didnt notice ur replies on my comments list. :)

and yes jordanian king was a traitor

[NorceCodine]

MiG-23 was a very versatile plane; also mechanically very complex. The wings must be adjusted manually by the pilot, which means that a good pilot can push the envelope of flight parameters, a poor pilot can make a mistake easily. It was meant for pilots with a lot of experience. It had a sophisticated auto-pilot that once in the mid-80s flew an abandoned Mig-23 (pilot ejected by false alarm) from Poland to Belgium, through German airspace. It landed the plane, but unfortunately into a house.

[rampking1]

NorceCodine....thanks for pointing out one of the main weaknesses of the MiG-23. Sounds like too much aircraft for a third world pilot to fly...

I wonder how many piled in?

[Poseidon500]

OH NO! LOL

[bobyluppo]

sexy plane

[mudpitboarder]

who`s playing this song? (Saw a 27 in there)

[JohnyKage]

Mig 27 is also known as Mig 23 J.

The song is "Wish i had an angel by Nightwish

[VadimRuskyAmerican]

wrong... its drowningpool! Dont know the song and the real singer is dead but theres another one but hes is not as good as the old one ;(.

[JohnyKage]

I had to change the song from nightwish with these because youtube made a copyright claim.

[VadimRuskyAmerican]

Ahhh... i was pissed of when i come to find out that one of my fucking songs i actually bought with my own dam money was cut out of my video by this Copyright crap. Silly how you have to use another song by some one else that made money off of. and the previous song is some how special!

[gr0xarg]

q flogger

[macius125]

B mnie się podoba !! super muzyczka pozdrawiam!

[TM09TKC]

thx for this video

remember me when was young ..:)

i pilot this plane

[OpelGTC]

At Giarmata Timisoara?

Congratulations!Flogger was a good plane.

[racinglad]

What was it like to fly?

[rampking1]

racinglad, check online to see what USAF agressor pilots said about the "export" MiG-23 that they played with over the the Nellis Test Range in Nevada. They have a clear answer to your question.

[Poseidon500]

They called it unweildy, and it could out-acclerate U.S. planes like Ferrari's outrunning Fords. ; )

It's true.

[rampking1]

The F-105 Thunderchief had a lot of power too...but still could be shot down by a trans-sonic MiG-17 during the Vietnam War. Its all about combination of assets. I recall the pilots being a little stronger with their comments about this export**

( **a footnote for our Russian fans) MiG-23

that go beyond "unweildy"

Bottom line: they didn't want to fly it.

I believe that ends the discussion ?

I'm dreaming,

I'm sure I'll hear from the Russians again.

[Poseidon500]

That's because F-105's were carrying heavy bombs and sorely underestimated the mig-17 effectiveness. They did not fly fast while on an attack mission.

The mig-23 is actually an excellent plane to counter what it was designed to counter. Bombers, F4's, Mirage 3's, Mirage f1's ect ect. IT can hold it's own against any third generation aircraft.

[rampking1]

Okay, look at it this way. The USAF Thundebird's used the F-105 for a short time...and they kept it short for a reason and it had nothing to do with carrying bombs. Speed was the only defence for the F-105. Doesn't seem awkward to be fooling with manual wing-sweep when your in a dogfight?

I do like your comparison to an F-4 though....both aircraft, good acceleration and lots of power. I also agree that the Soviets loved to build aircraft specificly to shoot down bombers (eg. Su15 & MiG-25)

[Poseidon500]

They dont. Usually the plane flies with it's wings in the "medium" position" . I forget what the actual degrees are.

They only sweep them full back for supersonic interception missions, and only have them swept forward for takeoff and landing.

The export versions were pieces of crap. The Soviets were famous for this. They kep the good stuff for themselves. For example... MIg-23mld. An excellent fighter.

[ADiamandi]

not really, R.S.R( communist Romania) got all of the Mig family, export of course, except MiG25 and they were quite reliable aircraft, and the MiG21's still are. The failiure rate is the same if not better than the american counterparts, you do not see many fatigue related crashes (F15 like), most are pilot error.

[Poseidon500]

How could communist Russia get "exports" when they build the planes?

I am either cinfused, or you messed up. : )

The export MLD versions lacked aerodynamic refinements.

[moahoah]

Cool! What was it like flying it? Can the wings sweep back and forward automatically or did you have to do it manually?

[gio31brasil]

thank you for the video,I love it!

[brtshstel]

I love that gunsight!

[krbosak]

On a few occasions we saw Red Star Mig 27 here.

[Wolfie1112]

My english it,s very poor,but I try. :)

Very nice begining of this picture specialy low alitude ride of polish Mig 23 in Redzikowo.Miusic also is good.Nighwish :)

Thank You very much!Nice pice of work!

[Wolfie1112]

Miło mi że filmik zaczyna się naszymi Redzikowskimi Migami :)

Wielkie dzięki !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[JohnyKage]

Can you wirte your comment in english

[Santaclausemikey]

The MiG-23 MLD is comparable to the F-16.

[Dogmeatmgc]

piece of crap jet lol.

[indiochorotega]

Viva el Mig,viva Rusia y la memoria de Artem Mikoyan y Mikhail Gurevich (Long live Russia).

[strauser]

who is the author of this song?

[JohnyKage]

Its Nightwish = wish i had an angel

[strauser]

thx

[gio31brasil]

nightwish

[Tod2cz]

last flight in 2000

[Tod2cz]

Czech Republic retired in 1998

[karaiby1]

Polish Mig still falying but in USA as a privet jet

[JohnyKage]

Cool and how expensive is a ride on the mig ???

[sovietjet]

Czech Republic retired them in the mid-90s, Poland in 99, Romania in 2001, Bulgaria in late 2002-early 2003.

[JohnyKage]

It was flown until 2001,now they are out off service.

[zmatt]

cool video this mig 23 was quite unstable is it still being flown in romania?