The AK does handle neglect better however the AR has better accuracy and far far better ergonomics. Plus it has far greater after market support. You can make an AR into anything from a .22 long rifle plinker to a precision rifle in 6.8 to a .458 socom brush gun. I like both guns but the AR is my choice when things go bad.
only problem i have with this test is he used quality brass ammo in the AR and russian mil surp steel cased ammo in the Ak. A more fair comparison would be quality brass ammo for both.
@Solingen1000 he used the ammo each rifle was design to use. the AR was not designed to be used with russian steel cased ammo and the russian military do not produce brass ammo for their AKs. I think it is a fair, real world comparison.
Love the video! could you possibly do a video simulating falling into a mud hole then firing? I've read a lot about ak's shrugging such stuff off, but it would be great to see this put to the test. Thanks!
Great video, really kind of set the situation straight for me. I own both rifles and I have been contemplating selling my Ak because I have more accesories, ammo, etc for my M4. But the reliability and shear power of the 7.62x39 cartridge has steered me away from selling it.
You mentioned that you have not cleaned your AK-47 in 10 years. Have you been shooting corrosive ammunition through it? If so, how is the gas system holding up? Thank you.
@VENAT0RIS Why would anyone choose corrosive ammo when there are plenty of cheap non-corrosive ammo options out there? I shot corrosive ammo in an ak (less than a thousand rounds) and left it for probably less than a year and the gas tube was all rusted. But that doesn't determine the reliability of the Ak itself, there are way more factors involved in that case.
@IdeaCalledFreedom A year? Heck, let it sit for 2 weeks without cleaning after shooting corrosive ammo and you'll see the same rust. Maintenance is critical with corrosive ammo. The good thing is that all you need is a little water and some cleaning solvent like CLP to take care of the gun. I shoot corrosive ammo because it's a fraction of the cost of commercial ammo, and it has the devastating 7N6 bullet that's not available in commercial loads.
for recreation shooting and u have to admit when u go to the range u want to be seen with an "bling" rifle.. but for "preppers" aka survivalist I MUST have the AK its about philosophy of use (humm where I got that from? )
So your video's are really great, and you even have a microphone attached to your body...all of this is awesome...BUT the music (as cool as it sounds) is way too loud in comparison to the rest of the audio levels.
Keep up the great work. You have a really nice channel and perspective!
@tzychess Yeah, I have been told that an in my newer videos I bring the audio down on the intro music. Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching.
@WildWestBudgie The AR15 has a flash suppressor while the AK74 has a highly effective muzzle brake (no flash suppression). The Russians value quick follow-up shots more than flash suppression it would seem.
Just askin, not to troll or anything, wouldn't it have been a better comparison if they used the same type of ammunition? just wondering, cause the 5.56 and the 5.45x39 do have different properties and might affect accuracy.
You present yourself and your information excellently! It is a pleasure watching your videos, and I'm glad to see successful veterans. Now when it comes to maintenance, what is the availability and quality of replacement ak parts? Is there a specific part that is likely or known to fail on the ak?
@Airsoftpsyco1423 Thank you. I have an AK that's about 20 years old now and for 10 of those years I've not cleaned it or oiled it. It has had zero malfunctions including zero parts breaking. I've fired countless cases of ammo through it in those years. If I were to buy spare parts, it would be springs. The AK parts are so big and robust that something actually breaking is a rarity in my experience.
@Sturmgewehre I had a question about that AK. Even though you do not need to clean it, isn't it a duty to keep it clean no matter what and to maintain it like the Rifleman's Creed states? I mean, I think that creed applies to all gun owners. Not just Marines.
@TheRagingFoxhound If you can maintain your weapon, yes - you should. The reason I choose an AK is because should the world stop working I might not have the ability to do proper maintenance regularly. If you're in extended combat conditions, taking your rifle apart as a single man (not part of a team) leaves you exposed. I prefer to have a rifle that maintenance is optional vs. it being required. In a SHTF situation I won't have a company of Marines backing me up.
@Sturmgewehre But aren't you completely capable to maintain your weapon right now? I mean, you said you did not clean it once in 10 years. I understand what you are saying about its reliability and leaving yourself exposed. But lets say the SHTF tomorrow. You would be much better off and prepared if it were immaculately clean. You would not have to worry about that past 10 years of use and dirt. I am not trying to lecture you or anything. Sorry if I am coming across in that manner.
@TheRagingFoxhound I have one of my 9 AK rifles that I haven't cleaned in 10 years as an ongoing experiment. I wouldn't do that to my "go to" rifle, that would be a bad idea. My momma didn't raise no dummies.
Why would I want either one in a survival situation? I say screw em both. 22's would be the best survival guns in a SHTF situation. Unless if you plan on shooting targets out to 800 meters, in which case you still wouldn't use either of those rifles because you would want a 308 or 7.62x54r, or some other similar cartridge.
@Nationofhonor .22's are certainly useful, especially for putting food on the table. However, I've never owned a .22 firearm that was as reliable as a good centerfire rifle. I also won't leave the security of myself or family to a cartridge that can't even penetrate a car door. Gunfights rarely occur under ideal circumstances and often times the BG isn't standing in the open, they tend to take cover. It's better to have too much power than too little at the moment if truth.
I often wonder how much of the inaccuracy of the AK is the result of the ammo rather than the gun. I'm sure the AK design and loose tolerances reduce accuracy potential, but has anyone ever done an examination of the components in Russian ammo? Do those bullets weight 123 grains, or do they average 123 grains? Are the powder charges uniform or do they vary by a couple of grains from round to round? We have seen the diference in quality of AK's but what about the ammo?
@curtm97982 Valid point. If you watch my Krebs Custom SOCOM video I recently uploaded, there's a .308 AK using match ammo easily capable of 1-MOA accuracy using the factory barrel.
good video. of accuracy will vary with different ammo/rifle combinations, but you've used the issue ammo for both. M193 is more accurate than M855 due to wobble from armor piercing component of M855. I would have like to have seen this with optics on each, as sight alignment can contribute to accuracy errors. Also 3 or 4 comparsion groups to show results are repeatable. thanks for all the good videos though.
Simulate having a hand or arm injury that limits you to firing the rifle and reloading it using only one arm+and one hand. eject empty mag, replace with loaded mag then recharge the chamber and fire a few rounds. Now which rifle looks good?
Simulate having a hand or arm injury that limits you to firing the rifle and reloading it using only one arm+and one hand. eject empty mag, replace with loaded mag then recharge the chamber and fire a few rounds. Now which rifle looks good?
Simulate having a hand or arm injury that limits you to firing the rifle and reloading it using only one arm+and one hand. eject empty mag, replace with loaded mag then recharge the chamber and fire a few rounds. Now which rifle looks good?
"I could use a mud hole to clean the AK" That is priceless. Very good review of both rifle's accuracy and reliability. I like the honesty that you used to present these facts. That is very rare in this discussion. Good job.
Optics are better than Irons. & that is Not debatable, not anymore with the quality optics that are out there now. & the options for mounting optics on an AK rifle are shit. So is having a huge muzzle blast. Most bad shit goes down at night. The AK with standard muzzle breaks & no illuminated sighting system is a pretty shitty set up for shooting at night.
I retired from the Army with my Expert Marksman badge with the M-16A4 and the M4, I do however prefer my AK-47 for defense. I do have a carbine AR if I need pinpoint accuracy, but in my experience in life, pin point is not always necessary. The AK is not as accurate as the AR, but it is not a "scatter gun." I stand in the middle, why have one and not the other? Why not have the best of both worlds? Never enough guns and such.
Generally critiques of the AK/AR stop at accuracy & reliability but short-shrift the ergonomics & weight qualities. If you had to walk & carry 1 for 10 miles which 1 would you want? If you had to use 1 for a hidden ambush which one's ergonomics require less movement and produce less noise? My most likely SHTF scenario is a hurricane so in actuality long term maintenance supplies aren't that important. In reality I haven't had to fire a gun yet due to sheltering in place or evacuating a storm.
This is my fourth video of yours I've watched. I do appreciate your videos, and I think they're pretty informative given the limitations of video. Rock on, brother.
But, as I'm sure you'd like feedback, and not just love, I will say you should probably close your video comments with "this is my experience, I do recommend you give (XYZ) a shot on your own to make your own decision."
@PowerSpartanl99 - Not really... both guns can shoot on 400m with no problem on human sized target. Anyone who claims how AR/M4 is "so much more accurate" ...do you really think how 3-5cm on persons center will even matter? Not at all. AK-74 is just as good on accuracy on combat distance as M4's... but AK is 100% more reliable in stress situations.
@Sturmgewehre That's a silly technicality. The United States hasn't made a formal declaration of war since June 5, 1942. I believe it's fair to say the United States has been at war since. Common law precedent and reasonable definitions certainly indicate that even if Congress doesn't. In the context of lawsuit to "save" whales from SONAR, a federal judge said this in 2009: "...But it also has an interest in national defence. We are currently engaged in war, in two countries."
@Sturmgewehre .. The Corporation known has the UNITED STATES (U.S.) never makes a declaration of WAR, they use forced U.S. Volunteers to control Nations/Regimes, force the purchase of Oil with fiat Dollars, and to control of Drugs.
@Sturmgewehre You can call it whatever you want, but calling it a war or conflict doesnt tell you anything about what really happen in Vietnam, War is just and euphemism for mass murder of innocent civilianns(all wars are mass murder of the innocent).
"War is the continuation of politics by other means" Von Clausewitz, and vice versa.
@ps90tacguy Nutnfancy didn't do anything! I pulled that clip because YouTube was giving me fits over the royalty free music I was using on top of the clip. I was so busy editing new videos that I didn't have time to go dig up the release form to send to them, it was easier to just delete the video. Nutnfancy and I get along great, he's been quite friendly to me.
@ps90tacguy No apology necessary. Such misunderstandings happen. I know that when I pulled the video the natural assumption would be that Nutnfancy had something to do with it. I know he commented on his channel about not wanting to be tapped by other YT'bers but he said absolutely nothing about my short clip and honestly, probably never seen it before I yanked it. Thanks for watching.
AK's are favored by Commie loving hippies. It's a fugly gun, I'll put up my .223, 6.8mm and 7.62mm against any rifle that looks like a boiler pipe cappuccino machine.
Sturmgewhre, we both know from the Corps hat a sloppy fitted M16 can way outshoot any commie POS past 500 yds. 1 shot, 1 kill, magazine hot.
@dg1234ify - Let me explain something to you idiot... I used AKS-74 on Army service for years. Both AK and M4 can strike target of human size on 400m pretty easy. Also, let me explain you how chances to encounter fight passed 400m is extremely rare thing. But just so you understand, AK-74 can hit target on 600m or more for good shooter. Same with M4. One thing you seem to not understand is how everyone who use AK's is not the desert farmers who don't have any training. Stupid redneck.
@dg1234ify - Also... one thing, AK-74 round is far more deadly than M4 round. 5.56 have issues even tumbling in target... they found that problem in Iraq recently. 5.45 Soviet round however is named "poison bullet" from Mujahideen. So learn something, please. Because you are simply complete moron.
@bittemeinrammstein Wow, you are an angry, angry Russian. You're absolutely right, though. I'm a qualified marksman with the M16, but I still prefer my AKs as my own personal weapons. I have two, a Romanian piece of crap and an Arsenal SGL21-94, which is an Izhmash-produced, Legion-tuned, authentic Russian AK-103. The difference in quality is incredible, and I have no problems punching 6.5 cm groups with it at 100 m. [continued]
@bittemeinrammstein I think a major reason why so many Americans think AKs are so inaccurate is because our enemies typically use those cheap, crappy East European and Chinese clones, and it's what we typically encounter and recover in battle. Also, the most popular AK on the US civilian market is a Romanian rebuild called a WASR-10, and, while it's reliable, it's a pile of shit. Before I enlisted, I used mine to shoot boars in the swamp so I didn't get my good guns muddy.
@EricsTechTalk Yeah, I think you are right about the thing on manufacturing location: one of my mates who recently came home from A-stan told me that they had found a stash of romanian-made AKs (a dozen or so), two east-german and a pair of hungarian made ones. He said that the romanian ones were all gone to sh1t, they had lost all kind of accuracy (they test-fired them for some reason).[continued]
@EricsTechTalk Later on, when they were more closely inspected it was found that their barrels were so used down that the rounds were wobbling in the chamber. And the production date was (apparently) 1986. You would say that in 20+ years it is normal to be used down so much, but then how come the east-german and hungarian ones weren't in such a bad shape?
@0501856849 Indeed. For the most part, Romanian steel is shit. Have you seen that slomo video of the AK barrels wobbling and flexing? New production Russian AKs are made with special, flexible steel (I think it might be an alloy) that is designed to bend like crazy and return to its original shape. They can be bent into a U shape without permanently damaging the internal geometry of the barrel. REALLY good metal. If you want an AK, accept no less than original Russian goodness.
@EricsTechTalk Here in hungary, we use the hungarian made ones. Pretty neat too :) Although they tend to have their rear sight hinge loosen up over longer periods of time (10-20 years, depending on frequency and intesity of use.). It isn't a big deal, the master at arms usually can fix it 5 minutes, but police trainees can't even aim their AMDs right because their sights are so loose that every time they fire, they just jump all over the place. But otherwise those are goodguns too
@0501856849 I don't mind AMDs; they're pretty cool. They're like bulldogs: ugly as sin, but they have character. Hungarian ammo is where it's at, though. I run it through my Russian AK and it tends to form better groupings. It's fairly-priced here in the states, and it's so much better than that dirty, steel-cased Russian crap.
@EricsTechTalk Do you mean that the hungarian ammo you use states-side isn't steel-cased? That would be odd. For what I know M43 and M67 manufactured in ex eastern-bloc are both steel-cased. I heard about brass-cased 7,62x39 manufactured in the US, but that's pretty much it.
Yeah, AMDs are cool, but they are out of production unfortunately. They were too pricy compared to the AK-63. Despite it being phased out I saw some guys using the AMD muzzlebreak.
@EricsTechTalk Two years ago when I got my hands on one in A-stan I found it very handy with its short barrel. We tried it (them - we were in an ANP training facility) with my squad in the local "killhouse", and we found them much better suited for CQ than our full-length AKMs.
@EricsTechTalk - Well, Chinese copies was actually almost the same quality as Soviet build one. One major reason is because sand farmers simply fires wildly. I dont think I ever even saw one single footage from middle east fighters who actually aim his weapon. xaxa.
I shot WASR-10 when I was at USA also. They are very raw gun. Not very good line of the gas system. But reliable gun anyway. I shot 5-10cm group with him on 60m. So not so bad gun for cheap one.
@bittemeinrammstein Oh yeah, like I said, the WASR isn't a BAD gun, just not a great one. They are purely utilitarian. Also, I agree that the Chinese clones are quite good for what they are, Izhmash uses MUCH better steel and chrome (as I mentioned in my comment below to 0501856849), and it certainly shows in the consistent accuracy and service life of the weapon. Some of the flexibility claims may be stretching the truth a bit, but it's noticeably better material quality.
We left with 72 men in our platoon and came back with 19, Believe it or not, you know what killed most of us? Our own rifle. Practically every one of our dead was found with his M16 torn down next to him where he had been trying to fix it.
3. By contrast, soldiers armed with rapid fire weapons were much more likely to have fired their weapons in battle. These conclusions suggested that infantry should be equipped with a fully automatic rifle of some sort in order to increase the actual firepower of regular soldiers.
2. They also found that the chance of being hit in combat was essentially random; accurate "aiming" made little difference because the targets no longer sat still. The number one predictor of casualties was the total number of bullets fired. Other studies of behavior in battle revealed that many U.S. infantrymen (as many as 2/3) never actually fired their rifles in combat.
1. In 1948, the Army organized the civilian Operations Research Office. Operations Research Office. Over 3 million battlefield reports from World War I and World War II were analyzed and over the next few years they released a series of reports on their findings. The conclusion was that most combat takes place at short range. In a highly mobile war, combat teams ran into each other largely by surprise; and the team with the higher firepower tended to win.
2. Our military purchases M4s from colt for $1799, Izhmash sells brand new AK-100 series rifles for $160 USD, You cant tell me its 7x more accurate. AK's are perfect for combat accuracy. War is not static, fire and maneuver is what wins the fight. Better ergos, accuracy, modularity, range and recoil manageability, lethality, and battery of operations means nothing if your weapon malfunctions 15 yards from the enemy.
1. High ARs with match grade barrels don't last very long, AK 74s have less recoil than the AR does, the AR produces 5.3 Joules of recoil. AK in 5.45 only produces 3.9 joules of energy all. AK bolt has roughly 5oz more of moving mass.There are multiple manufactures that develop heavier bolt carriers for the AR to help reduce recoil, and give it longer dwell time.. In this case heavier is better. Look at the formula to calculate kinetic energy...
I see your point about accuracy but I would think you would just have a better chance at getting ammo and parts for an AR system over an AK. I guess I'm not exactly agreeing with your logistics argument. I think availability creates a logistics chain of it's own. Your accuracy test was very informative.
I gave this debate a lot of thought when buying my most recent AR. So I decided to go with a LMT MRP CQB 16. Slapped a Leatherwood CMR on it and couldn't be more happy with the results thus far.
@jfaerr not really, you would have to get mud in the chamber, and since the AR fires from a closed bolt thats almost a non-issue, especially when you have the dust cover closed
@HunterKiller308 or is it? The comparison with the M16 give a lower muzzle energy, whilst a comparison with the M4 give higher energy because of the difference in barrel lenght. So half-wrong.
@HunterKiller308 Which is exactly what I was saying. The M16 has a longer barrel, hence higher muzzle energy, while the M4 has a shorter one so lower muzzle energy.
And did you ever hear abotu ambushes? There's your full torso. The group made at 400 metres is 16 centimetres (around six inches) with an AKM, believe it or not.
@0501856849 LMFAO, are you retarded or somthing? you can expect a 4" group with an AK74 at 100 meters,did you even watch the video? so how the hell are you going to get a 6" group with an AKM at 400 meters? hell the 7.62x39 has 26" inched of drop at 300 meters alone.
stop spreading your ignorant bullshit. i doubt you have ever fired an AK in your life, and if you did your nothing but another dirt shooter
@0501856849 and as for "ambushes" you wouldnt do it at that kind of range, it would just turn into taking pot shots...you should have enough time to take a more precise and lethal shot, such as head or left chest....none of that random center mass shit
@HunterKiller308 I am being ignorant? Do you even know how to use the rear sights oon an AKM? 26" of drop means that at any targeted point the bullets will impact 26" lower? If yes then you should adjust the sights and let one fly afterwards. You are right, if I do an ambush I will use a heavier calibre, I was just demonstrating where you could see a full torso in a "combat situation". Also I see you are a real M16 fan, it's okay, just don't try to be superior to everyone else.
@0501856849 LOL, who the hell walks around with a 400 yard zero on their AK47? you would be shooting way to high at closer ranges. do you have any idea how hard it would be to sight in a rifle during combat?
1.5 MOA means a rifle that groups within 3" at 200 yards and 6" at 400 yards. thats a 10 shot group average.
AKs are 3-4 MOA rifles at best. your full of shit kid. post a video of someone making a 6" group at 400 yards with an AK, i would LOVE to see that
@HunterKiller308 Do you know ANYTHING about the AKs sight system? You know it has a tangent sight that can be ranged from 100 to 1000m (although it is completely pointless to adjust it anywhere over 500), for elevation. Ranging the tangent sight is not very hard: you press the button on the left side and you push it into position then release the button. You are full of shit, you don't even seem to know the rifle you are criticizing. And it is metres, not yards, Mr Know-It-All.
@0501856849 LMFAO, first of all the AK sight system is very crude, like over sized pistol sight really, the open sight picture shit at low light and night shooting as well they are extremely crude when put next to AR peep sights that are adjustable for windage and elevation.
kid fucking around with your rifles zero in combat...i doubt you could eyeball any kind of distance anyway. you think you can just slide your rear sight to the 400M mark and your point of aim will be the same? LOL
@HunterKiller308 no use in swearing. You probably never understood the whole point of practising on a firing range: targets of the same height (175cm if I am not mistaken - the average body height in the world) are disposed at a given distance and after a point of time you eye starts recognising the approximate distance of a man-sized target. continued in next comment
@HunterKiller308 Then when you are qualifying targets pop up at different distances and you have to engage them accordingly to what the officer in charge says. If it is "slow shooting" (I don't know the english term) you have to range the rifle's rear sights and engage the target with it. If it is "fast shooting" you have to engage targets with approximate elevation with your sights zeroed to 100m. Oh and it's not "your" but "you're".
@HunterKiller308 Now come upto any soldier who really trained with an AKM and tell him that 6" is impossible at 400m. He will laugh in your face (just as I do). Even my father, who was trained as a conscrit in the early '70s with an AMD was able to put his 3-round bursts in the same 17 cm circle at 300m. That's pretty much enough for anything if you ask me... FYI, I am not retarded, this is why I am trying to reason with you (or maybe that means I actually AM retarded).
@0501856849 I've seen Russian soldiers in 1993 hit targets with AK-74 from 400 meters consistently. They are accurate if you know how to use it. Thats without optics or red-dots by the way with standard iron sights that were quickly set to the appropriate range setting.
@Spetsnazovets I believe that. I see my guys hit targets with their AKM's iron sights at 200-300-400 metres every month :) I know that it is only as accurate as the shooter :)
@HunterKiller308 And who is going to try to engage at this range? At this range the unit sniper will begin taking out targets. Also at 400 meters STATIONARY target sure can hit with both AK and M-16. But thats assuming the targets are not shooting back at you. Also cover available in field is scarce. If in city/forest ranges are short as and both are equal in that scenario, most common today.
@Spetsnazovets "And who is going to try to engage at this range" anone who can see the threat with a weapon than can reach out. when a unit of men have rifles like M16's you dont need to rely on a DM or "unit sniper", to take out threats at 400M, especially if they have ACOGs
those targets are only STATIONARY when using cover or laying prone..in both instances the target is much much smaller than a typical head and sholders man sized target, that why not just range, but accuracy is key
At last I see the video where the person that makes the presentation actually UNDERSTANDS the whole IDEA of WHY the AK was designed the way it was. Its ACCURATE ENOUGH for average battle range.
Russian training favours SHORT BURST fire. They didn't bother chasing 1MOA as they knew soldier will be firing on the move and won't have 6-10 seconds for an accurate shot especially when the heart is pounding, people screaming, explosions and gunfire roaring and bullets are flying.
@Spetsnazovets actually the Soviet soldiers who the Ak was made for liked to attack in mass waves, charging enmass and spraying from the hip, crude suppress and manuver stuff.
the AR was designed for motivated marksman that date all the way back to picking off individual british officers in the Revolutionary war. soldiers who pride themselves on marksmanship
you wont be saying your 4 moa Ak is "accurate enough" when you come accross a threat using hard cover and only exposing his head
@Spetsnazovets "I'd love to see the moron who'd be dumb enough to try to stick the head up while the suppressive fire is continually conducted over the head"
You aint always got it like that
"Thats ww2 tactics that were rejected later and replaced "
True, but im talking about the tactic being used at the time of the AK-47s design, its fit and funtion was to serve in that role, its more of a machinegun, a bullet hose than a rifle in its function.
@HunterKiller308 As far as "liked to charge spraying from the hip" - Thats ww2 tactics that were rejected later and replaced with much more sophisticated ones
Semper fi. I'm a vet of Iraq and the last few years I have found that my fav. Rifle is the mini 14 tactical. The new minis are just as accurate as basic ar or m16 and it has the combat proven operating system of the grand and m14. Iv got about 1000 yds though mine now and have not had one malfuction. Semper fi
@jnpiel i am not a fan of the Mini 14/30s they are ranch rifles, not combat firearms. yes they are designed on the venerable M1A but it is completely sized down. thus critical components are more fragile and far less robust. just like what happened with the ARs, the original design was for the 308, it was a far more robust, as such more reliable before they sized it down to the AR15
mind if i ask your MOS? im enlisting 0300 infantry option
@HunterKiller308 Hey glad to hear you are enlisting. Let me start off by saying if you dont like the mini thats cool not every body is into the same stuff but let me say this from my personal test The mini wont jam iv done practal test with mine for fun and its never jamed. as far as my mos I am a combat enginer the short version is when I was in iraq I cleard obstacals for the grunts with explosive and hunted out mines and ied. we did not dis arm like eod we just blew them.
@HunterKiller308 there's a pretty good article about the m4/ar-15 on Defense Industry Daily. Google " The USA's M4 Carbine Controversy " btw, I was in the army, I hated the m4.
@cj89311 yeah, the direct impingment AR15 was designed for a rifle length gas system,if i was going to use a carbine AR i would want a short stroke gas system. not to mention the 5.56 was designed around a 20" barrel and it greatly increases its fragmenation threshold. thats why im glad the Marines still use full length M16s, im enlisting as 0300 infantry option, going for 0311
@HunterKiller308 Not really much better for optics. All you have to do on the M1A is remove the stripper clip guide and put a smith enterprise mount in its place. It's just as good as an AR10 then for optics. As far as recoil, mangement, I had both. I didn't think there was a lot of difference.
@esh325 every Ar10 NEEDs a hydrolic recoil buffer, it just replaced the standard buffer on any AR and the differance it makes is night and day. you wont want to shoot any 308 without one again. it makes a .308 AR10 have less recoil than a god damn AK47. you have obviously never had the pleause of getting your hands on one.
ok prehaps the Ar10 isnt a "better" optics mount, but its less of a hastle.
Thanks for a great video. I appreciate your articulate, unbiased and practical opinion. I would also add that because of another video of yours I ended up buying a Saiga and converting it to an AK74.
Now shoot at 50 yards shooting off hand with no bench. Accuracy is nice for everyone to talk about but in war one does not necessarily shoot from a bench.
@Allante715 That doesn't demonstrate the accuracy of the rifle, that demonstrates the accuracy of that individual, and thus is mostly irrelevant when comparing the accuracy capabilities of two rifles since all individuals do things differently. I know men who can shoot the AK better than the AR, and men that can shoot the AR better than the AK. The bench removes the human factor to a degree and shows the mechanical accuracy capabilities of the rifle itself.
I was in no way attempting to discredit your analysis. The difference in inherent accuracy between the AK and AR would be virtually indistinguishable when shot offhand.
Excellent vid, Sturmgewehre. About a year ago, I put the two side by side in an effort to determine a "one-gun" SHTF weapon, and came to the exact same conclusions. Love the M4/M16 series, but the direct impingement gas system is kinda like crapping where you eat in my view, and tiny groups don't mean much on the street. AK is perfect for assault in all conditions. Well done vid all around (especially that Jeep).
@defibaughjd7 "tiny groups don't mean much on the street" it depends how long that street is, those tiny groups mean you rifle will hold its point of aim at longer distances.
"the direct impingement gas system is kinda like crapping where you eat" by it blowing gasses directly into the bolt then yeah i guess. but its reliability issue are way over blown. just keep it lubed and use good mags. they dont need to be spotless, far from it
@HunterKiller308 I'm well aware of what tiny groups mean, and I stand by my statement. I can hit a man-sized target at 300 yards with my current setup. Chances are good that in the situation we're discussing, either that level of accuracy will be sufficient, or I won't be revealing my position. I'm not trying to discredit the choices of others or their systems, I've just had the occasional malfunction with the M4/M16 and it turned me off of them - for this application, that is.
@defibaughjd7 when you fire you are usually static, either using cover, only exposing your head, or laying prone, making yourself a smaller target.
a standard M16A4 gets 1.5 - 2 MOA
1.5 MOA is still a 5" group at 300 meters, thats headshot material. the further your enemy is the more time you may have in increasing your odds of lining up your sight on a small target like that. no one is going to stand straight up,exposing their entire torso for you.
@defibaughjd7 LOL.you throw in some off hand lingo and you think your hot shit when you aint shit at all. "Your paper MOA figures mean pretty much dinkydoo in combat" tell that to a sniper, a DM, all those Marines who were taking so many headshots there as an interantional investigation into execution allegations when it was proven all the shots were taken at well over 200 meters. when you think your safe peeking out a window 400 meters away your DEAD wrong
@HunterKiller308 Respect your betters, cockbreath. You've got no idea where I've been. And the unit to which you refer was under investigation because they had recently been issued ACOGs on their A4s. I suppose you'll probably argue that optics are for pussies, since you've got piles of combat experience laying around.
@defibaughjd7 good optics are a fucking game changer and the AR is tailor made for optics. this day in age iron sights are more for backup than anything
@HunterKiller308 and if you did anything more than play video games and talk out of your ass, you'd realize that you just made my point for me. Third world pig farmers can't always take time to scrub and lube and clean their precious ARs, so they go with the cheap and reliable AK. No one was talking to you, but you had to pop right in and give us all your precious biased opinion on your favorite weapon.
@defibaughjd7 " Third world pig farmers can't always take time to scrub and lube and clean their precious ARs"...ignorant.
it takes less than five minutes to swab out an AR, including the bolt group. it takes 2 seconds to lube an AR, just squirt a little in the bolt. ARs will run very dirty if you keep it well lubed, and thats a non issue. no soldier is going to trash and not clean his weapon, russian soldiers clean their Aks all the time, just because you could dosent mean you should
@defibaughjd7 an AR thats kept lubed will run dirty just fine. if the AR was as unreliable as you claim do you really think the most powerful military force in the world would use it? i think not. get your facts straight. Russian soldiers clean and lube their AKs just like all other nations armys with their various firearms. no soldier is going to trash and not clean his weapon. go move to some third world shit hole every pig farmer will have your favorite crude bullet hose
As always, good information. I have both AR15 and AK47 and I can say that both rifles are superb! However, in a shtf scenario, my choice will be the AK..
I like video's like this, no vulgarity, your word's are in the proper context, no strong opinions, just sticking to the facts. I WISH I could be like this.
Finally a review that doesn't try to compare apples to oranges. These two apples are nice but it just goes to show that the AR is just a little more precise. Now all we need is some orange two orange comparison. Like the .300 Blackout(7.62x35) to the 7.62x39
The AK does handle neglect better however the AR has better accuracy and far far better ergonomics. Plus it has far greater after market support. You can make an AR into anything from a .22 long rifle plinker to a precision rifle in 6.8 to a .458 socom brush gun. I like both guns but the AR is my choice when things go bad.
Alaskapopo 8 hours ago
only problem i have with this test is he used quality brass ammo in the AR and russian mil surp steel cased ammo in the Ak. A more fair comparison would be quality brass ammo for both.
Solingen1000 4 days ago
@Solingen1000 You know where I can find high quality brass cased 5.45x39?
Sturmgewehre 4 days ago
@Sturmgewehre Aghh I was thinkin 7.62x39..Idk why I was thinkin that. :P..Still wish there was brass 5.45 tho..
Solingen1000 4 days ago
@Solingen1000 :) Yeah, I know what you mean. That's why I used military surplus for both, to keep the playing field level.
Sturmgewehre 4 days ago
@Sturmgewehre I agree with your video but what do think of piston ar and do you think it makes them more reliable. just curious
05camarodude69 2 days ago
@Solingen1000 he used the ammo each rifle was design to use. the AR was not designed to be used with russian steel cased ammo and the russian military do not produce brass ammo for their AKs. I think it is a fair, real world comparison.
shtfgear 2 days ago
Love the video! could you possibly do a video simulating falling into a mud hole then firing? I've read a lot about ak's shrugging such stuff off, but it would be great to see this put to the test. Thanks!
banshee511 6 days ago
nice shooting with those irons
Noobpatty 6 days ago
Great video, really kind of set the situation straight for me. I own both rifles and I have been contemplating selling my Ak because I have more accesories, ammo, etc for my M4. But the reliability and shear power of the 7.62x39 cartridge has steered me away from selling it.
IdeaCalledFreedom 1 week ago
You mentioned that you have not cleaned your AK-47 in 10 years. Have you been shooting corrosive ammunition through it? If so, how is the gas system holding up? Thank you.
VENAT0RIS 1 week ago
@VENAT0RIS One of my 9 AK's hasn't been cleaned in 10 years. No, I haven't shot corrosive ammo out of it, it would pit pretty severely if I had.
Sturmgewehre 1 week ago
@VENAT0RIS Why would anyone choose corrosive ammo when there are plenty of cheap non-corrosive ammo options out there? I shot corrosive ammo in an ak (less than a thousand rounds) and left it for probably less than a year and the gas tube was all rusted. But that doesn't determine the reliability of the Ak itself, there are way more factors involved in that case.
IdeaCalledFreedom 1 week ago
@IdeaCalledFreedom A year? Heck, let it sit for 2 weeks without cleaning after shooting corrosive ammo and you'll see the same rust. Maintenance is critical with corrosive ammo. The good thing is that all you need is a little water and some cleaning solvent like CLP to take care of the gun. I shoot corrosive ammo because it's a fraction of the cost of commercial ammo, and it has the devastating 7N6 bullet that's not available in commercial loads.
Sturmgewehre 6 days ago
@IdeaCalledFreedom cuz its cheaper and brass cased usualy
Solingen1000 4 days ago
for recreation shooting and u have to admit when u go to the range u want to be seen with an "bling" rifle.. but for "preppers" aka survivalist I MUST have the AK its about philosophy of use (humm where I got that from? )
BenSpartanburg 1 week ago
I got a "BUT"...
So your video's are really great, and you even have a microphone attached to your body...all of this is awesome...BUT the music (as cool as it sounds) is way too loud in comparison to the rest of the audio levels.
Keep up the great work. You have a really nice channel and perspective!
tzychess 1 week ago
@tzychess Yeah, I have been told that an in my newer videos I bring the audio down on the intro music. Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching.
Sturmgewehre 1 week ago
I noticed that the AK-74 had some muzzle flash, but the M4 did not. Any explanation for that? I'm not trolling, I'm just wondering.
WildWestBudgie 1 week ago
@WildWestBudgie The AR15 has a flash suppressor while the AK74 has a highly effective muzzle brake (no flash suppression). The Russians value quick follow-up shots more than flash suppression it would seem.
Sturmgewehre 1 week ago
Just askin, not to troll or anything, wouldn't it have been a better comparison if they used the same type of ammunition? just wondering, cause the 5.56 and the 5.45x39 do have different properties and might affect accuracy.
Tha1DJPLex 1 week ago
try out the g36 if you can get a hold of one
inut13 1 week ago
You present yourself and your information excellently! It is a pleasure watching your videos, and I'm glad to see successful veterans. Now when it comes to maintenance, what is the availability and quality of replacement ak parts? Is there a specific part that is likely or known to fail on the ak?
Airsoftpsyco1423 1 week ago
@Airsoftpsyco1423 Thank you. I have an AK that's about 20 years old now and for 10 of those years I've not cleaned it or oiled it. It has had zero malfunctions including zero parts breaking. I've fired countless cases of ammo through it in those years. If I were to buy spare parts, it would be springs. The AK parts are so big and robust that something actually breaking is a rarity in my experience.
Sturmgewehre 1 week ago
@Sturmgewehre I had a question about that AK. Even though you do not need to clean it, isn't it a duty to keep it clean no matter what and to maintain it like the Rifleman's Creed states? I mean, I think that creed applies to all gun owners. Not just Marines.
TheRagingFoxhound 1 week ago
@TheRagingFoxhound If you can maintain your weapon, yes - you should. The reason I choose an AK is because should the world stop working I might not have the ability to do proper maintenance regularly. If you're in extended combat conditions, taking your rifle apart as a single man (not part of a team) leaves you exposed. I prefer to have a rifle that maintenance is optional vs. it being required. In a SHTF situation I won't have a company of Marines backing me up.
Sturmgewehre 1 week ago
@Sturmgewehre But aren't you completely capable to maintain your weapon right now? I mean, you said you did not clean it once in 10 years. I understand what you are saying about its reliability and leaving yourself exposed. But lets say the SHTF tomorrow. You would be much better off and prepared if it were immaculately clean. You would not have to worry about that past 10 years of use and dirt. I am not trying to lecture you or anything. Sorry if I am coming across in that manner.
TheRagingFoxhound 1 week ago
@TheRagingFoxhound I have one of my 9 AK rifles that I haven't cleaned in 10 years as an ongoing experiment. I wouldn't do that to my "go to" rifle, that would be a bad idea. My momma didn't raise no dummies.
Sturmgewehre 1 week ago
@Sturmgewehre I see. Haha nice.
TheRagingFoxhound 1 week ago
Why would I want either one in a survival situation? I say screw em both. 22's would be the best survival guns in a SHTF situation. Unless if you plan on shooting targets out to 800 meters, in which case you still wouldn't use either of those rifles because you would want a 308 or 7.62x54r, or some other similar cartridge.
Just my two cents
Nationofhonor 1 week ago
@Nationofhonor .22's are certainly useful, especially for putting food on the table. However, I've never owned a .22 firearm that was as reliable as a good centerfire rifle. I also won't leave the security of myself or family to a cartridge that can't even penetrate a car door. Gunfights rarely occur under ideal circumstances and often times the BG isn't standing in the open, they tend to take cover. It's better to have too much power than too little at the moment if truth.
Sturmgewehre 1 week ago
I often wonder how much of the inaccuracy of the AK is the result of the ammo rather than the gun. I'm sure the AK design and loose tolerances reduce accuracy potential, but has anyone ever done an examination of the components in Russian ammo? Do those bullets weight 123 grains, or do they average 123 grains? Are the powder charges uniform or do they vary by a couple of grains from round to round? We have seen the diference in quality of AK's but what about the ammo?
curtm97982 1 week ago
@curtm97982 Valid point. If you watch my Krebs Custom SOCOM video I recently uploaded, there's a .308 AK using match ammo easily capable of 1-MOA accuracy using the factory barrel.
Sturmgewehre 1 week ago
@Sturmgewehre What do you think of the Arsenal ak? I am looking at purchasing my first rifle and I can't decide between an ar or ak.
GTILOUD 1 week ago
AR: prom queen
AK: biker chick
Kalashnikov all they way!
iedhunter44 1 week ago
good video. of accuracy will vary with different ammo/rifle combinations, but you've used the issue ammo for both. M193 is more accurate than M855 due to wobble from armor piercing component of M855. I would have like to have seen this with optics on each, as sight alignment can contribute to accuracy errors. Also 3 or 4 comparsion groups to show results are repeatable. thanks for all the good videos though.
no1worldgovt 2 weeks ago
An AR from BCM went 26000 rounds before cleaning. I love the AK and AR! Great video
bironmiller4330 3 weeks ago
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Simulate having a hand or arm injury that limits you to firing the rifle and reloading it using only one arm+and one hand. eject empty mag, replace with loaded mag then recharge the chamber and fire a few rounds. Now which rifle looks good?
oeyesea 3 weeks ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Simulate having a hand or arm injury that limits you to firing the rifle and reloading it using only one arm+and one hand. eject empty mag, replace with loaded mag then recharge the chamber and fire a few rounds. Now which rifle looks good?
oeyesea 3 weeks ago
Simulate having a hand or arm injury that limits you to firing the rifle and reloading it using only one arm+and one hand. eject empty mag, replace with loaded mag then recharge the chamber and fire a few rounds. Now which rifle looks good?
oeyesea 3 weeks ago
@oeyesea
Why would that matter if I'm taking my rifle to the range? Just wondering.
acidburn134 1 week ago
"I could use a mud hole to clean the AK" That is priceless. Very good review of both rifle's accuracy and reliability. I like the honesty that you used to present these facts. That is very rare in this discussion. Good job.
TheAnomalos 3 weeks ago
Optics are better than Irons. & that is Not debatable, not anymore with the quality optics that are out there now. & the options for mounting optics on an AK rifle are shit. So is having a huge muzzle blast. Most bad shit goes down at night. The AK with standard muzzle breaks & no illuminated sighting system is a pretty shitty set up for shooting at night.
Friedstuffsable 1 month ago
I retired from the Army with my Expert Marksman badge with the M-16A4 and the M4, I do however prefer my AK-47 for defense. I do have a carbine AR if I need pinpoint accuracy, but in my experience in life, pin point is not always necessary. The AK is not as accurate as the AR, but it is not a "scatter gun." I stand in the middle, why have one and not the other? Why not have the best of both worlds? Never enough guns and such.
scottcain20051 1 month ago 6
@scottcain20051 That is the wisest thing I have heard today.
0501856849 1 month ago
Generally critiques of the AK/AR stop at accuracy & reliability but short-shrift the ergonomics & weight qualities. If you had to walk & carry 1 for 10 miles which 1 would you want? If you had to use 1 for a hidden ambush which one's ergonomics require less movement and produce less noise? My most likely SHTF scenario is a hurricane so in actuality long term maintenance supplies aren't that important. In reality I haven't had to fire a gun yet due to sheltering in place or evacuating a storm.
oeyesea 1 month ago
Only Americans think the M4 is cool. Everyone else thinks it's the ugliest rifle ever made.
Filewalkr 1 month ago
everyone has there favorite for one reason or another me if it came down to life and death i would want a colt m4 over an ak anything
jamesconn210 1 month ago in playlist More videos from Sturmgewehre
This is my fourth video of yours I've watched. I do appreciate your videos, and I think they're pretty informative given the limitations of video. Rock on, brother.
But, as I'm sure you'd like feedback, and not just love, I will say you should probably close your video comments with "this is my experience, I do recommend you give (XYZ) a shot on your own to make your own decision."
bltdonahue 1 month ago
Ar=far more accurate
Ak=most reliable gun you will find
PowerSpartanl99 1 month ago
@PowerSpartanl99 - Not really... both guns can shoot on 400m with no problem on human sized target. Anyone who claims how AR/M4 is "so much more accurate" ...do you really think how 3-5cm on persons center will even matter? Not at all. AK-74 is just as good on accuracy on combat distance as M4's... but AK is 100% more reliable in stress situations.
bittemeinrammstein 1 month ago
Ugh, it's the Vietnam War, Not conflict...
Romeosierra616 1 month ago
@Romeosierra616 On what date did the US make a formal declaration of war on North Vietnam?
Sturmgewehre 1 month ago 27
@Sturmgewehre That's a silly technicality. The United States hasn't made a formal declaration of war since June 5, 1942. I believe it's fair to say the United States has been at war since. Common law precedent and reasonable definitions certainly indicate that even if Congress doesn't. In the context of lawsuit to "save" whales from SONAR, a federal judge said this in 2009: "...But it also has an interest in national defence. We are currently engaged in war, in two countries."
bloomsdaymoocow 4 weeks ago in playlist More videos from Sturmgewehre
@Sturmgewehre .. The Corporation known has the UNITED STATES (U.S.) never makes a declaration of WAR, they use forced U.S. Volunteers to control Nations/Regimes, force the purchase of Oil with fiat Dollars, and to control of Drugs.
MrSchpankme 3 weeks ago
@Sturmgewehre You can call it whatever you want, but calling it a war or conflict doesnt tell you anything about what really happen in Vietnam, War is just and euphemism for mass murder of innocent civilianns(all wars are mass murder of the innocent).
"War is the continuation of politics by other means" Von Clausewitz, and vice versa.
megatherium100 2 weeks ago
Comment removed
ps90tacguy 1 month ago
@ps90tacguy Nutnfancy didn't do anything! I pulled that clip because YouTube was giving me fits over the royalty free music I was using on top of the clip. I was so busy editing new videos that I didn't have time to go dig up the release form to send to them, it was easier to just delete the video. Nutnfancy and I get along great, he's been quite friendly to me.
Sturmgewehre 1 month ago
@Sturmgewehre then i redraw my comment and extend a apology to my comment on nutnfancy and too you sir
ps90tacguy 1 month ago
@ps90tacguy No apology necessary. Such misunderstandings happen. I know that when I pulled the video the natural assumption would be that Nutnfancy had something to do with it. I know he commented on his channel about not wanting to be tapped by other YT'bers but he said absolutely nothing about my short clip and honestly, probably never seen it before I yanked it. Thanks for watching.
Sturmgewehre 1 month ago
@antiigravity usmc purchases the m16 a2 for less then 500 usd. I've seen it with my own eyes
djtlfox 1 month ago
What kind of AK-74 are you using in this video? I haven't been able to find one that I like much in terms of appearance, but yours looks great.
cvict6 1 month ago in playlist More videos from Sturmgewehre
AK's are favored by Commie loving hippies. It's a fugly gun, I'll put up my .223, 6.8mm and 7.62mm against any rifle that looks like a boiler pipe cappuccino machine.
Sturmgewhre, we both know from the Corps hat a sloppy fitted M16 can way outshoot any commie POS past 500 yds. 1 shot, 1 kill, magazine hot.
dg1234ify 1 month ago in playlist More videos from Sturmgewehre
@dg1234ify - Let me explain something to you idiot... I used AKS-74 on Army service for years. Both AK and M4 can strike target of human size on 400m pretty easy. Also, let me explain you how chances to encounter fight passed 400m is extremely rare thing. But just so you understand, AK-74 can hit target on 600m or more for good shooter. Same with M4. One thing you seem to not understand is how everyone who use AK's is not the desert farmers who don't have any training. Stupid redneck.
bittemeinrammstein 1 month ago
@dg1234ify - Also... one thing, AK-74 round is far more deadly than M4 round. 5.56 have issues even tumbling in target... they found that problem in Iraq recently. 5.45 Soviet round however is named "poison bullet" from Mujahideen. So learn something, please. Because you are simply complete moron.
bittemeinrammstein 1 month ago
@bittemeinrammstein Wow, you are an angry, angry Russian. You're absolutely right, though. I'm a qualified marksman with the M16, but I still prefer my AKs as my own personal weapons. I have two, a Romanian piece of crap and an Arsenal SGL21-94, which is an Izhmash-produced, Legion-tuned, authentic Russian AK-103. The difference in quality is incredible, and I have no problems punching 6.5 cm groups with it at 100 m. [continued]
EricsTechTalk 1 month ago
@bittemeinrammstein I think a major reason why so many Americans think AKs are so inaccurate is because our enemies typically use those cheap, crappy East European and Chinese clones, and it's what we typically encounter and recover in battle. Also, the most popular AK on the US civilian market is a Romanian rebuild called a WASR-10, and, while it's reliable, it's a pile of shit. Before I enlisted, I used mine to shoot boars in the swamp so I didn't get my good guns muddy.
EricsTechTalk 1 month ago
@EricsTechTalk Yeah, I think you are right about the thing on manufacturing location: one of my mates who recently came home from A-stan told me that they had found a stash of romanian-made AKs (a dozen or so), two east-german and a pair of hungarian made ones. He said that the romanian ones were all gone to sh1t, they had lost all kind of accuracy (they test-fired them for some reason).[continued]
0501856849 1 month ago
@EricsTechTalk Later on, when they were more closely inspected it was found that their barrels were so used down that the rounds were wobbling in the chamber. And the production date was (apparently) 1986. You would say that in 20+ years it is normal to be used down so much, but then how come the east-german and hungarian ones weren't in such a bad shape?
0501856849 1 month ago
@0501856849 Indeed. For the most part, Romanian steel is shit. Have you seen that slomo video of the AK barrels wobbling and flexing? New production Russian AKs are made with special, flexible steel (I think it might be an alloy) that is designed to bend like crazy and return to its original shape. They can be bent into a U shape without permanently damaging the internal geometry of the barrel. REALLY good metal. If you want an AK, accept no less than original Russian goodness.
EricsTechTalk 1 month ago
@0501856849 Oh, and the German and Bulgarian ones are great, too.
EricsTechTalk 1 month ago
@EricsTechTalk Here in hungary, we use the hungarian made ones. Pretty neat too :) Although they tend to have their rear sight hinge loosen up over longer periods of time (10-20 years, depending on frequency and intesity of use.). It isn't a big deal, the master at arms usually can fix it 5 minutes, but police trainees can't even aim their AMDs right because their sights are so loose that every time they fire, they just jump all over the place. But otherwise those are goodguns too
0501856849 1 month ago
@0501856849 I don't mind AMDs; they're pretty cool. They're like bulldogs: ugly as sin, but they have character. Hungarian ammo is where it's at, though. I run it through my Russian AK and it tends to form better groupings. It's fairly-priced here in the states, and it's so much better than that dirty, steel-cased Russian crap.
EricsTechTalk 1 month ago
@EricsTechTalk Do you mean that the hungarian ammo you use states-side isn't steel-cased? That would be odd. For what I know M43 and M67 manufactured in ex eastern-bloc are both steel-cased. I heard about brass-cased 7,62x39 manufactured in the US, but that's pretty much it.
Yeah, AMDs are cool, but they are out of production unfortunately. They were too pricy compared to the AK-63. Despite it being phased out I saw some guys using the AMD muzzlebreak.
0501856849 1 month ago
@EricsTechTalk Two years ago when I got my hands on one in A-stan I found it very handy with its short barrel. We tried it (them - we were in an ANP training facility) with my squad in the local "killhouse", and we found them much better suited for CQ than our full-length AKMs.
0501856849 1 month ago
@EricsTechTalk - Well, Chinese copies was actually almost the same quality as Soviet build one. One major reason is because sand farmers simply fires wildly. I dont think I ever even saw one single footage from middle east fighters who actually aim his weapon. xaxa.
I shot WASR-10 when I was at USA also. They are very raw gun. Not very good line of the gas system. But reliable gun anyway. I shot 5-10cm group with him on 60m. So not so bad gun for cheap one.
bittemeinrammstein 1 month ago
@bittemeinrammstein Oh yeah, like I said, the WASR isn't a BAD gun, just not a great one. They are purely utilitarian. Also, I agree that the Chinese clones are quite good for what they are, Izhmash uses MUCH better steel and chrome (as I mentioned in my comment below to 0501856849), and it certainly shows in the consistent accuracy and service life of the weapon. Some of the flexibility claims may be stretching the truth a bit, but it's noticeably better material quality.
EricsTechTalk 1 month ago
7:47
Best Argument for AK out there.
r4yD4r 1 month ago in playlist More videos from Sturmgewehre
This has been flagged as spam show
We left with 72 men in our platoon and came back with 19, Believe it or not, you know what killed most of us? Our own rifle. Practically every one of our dead was found with his M16 torn down next to him where he had been trying to fix it.
- Marine Corps Rifleman, Vietnam.
antiigravity 1 month ago
3. By contrast, soldiers armed with rapid fire weapons were much more likely to have fired their weapons in battle. These conclusions suggested that infantry should be equipped with a fully automatic rifle of some sort in order to increase the actual firepower of regular soldiers.
antiigravity 1 month ago
2. They also found that the chance of being hit in combat was essentially random; accurate "aiming" made little difference because the targets no longer sat still. The number one predictor of casualties was the total number of bullets fired. Other studies of behavior in battle revealed that many U.S. infantrymen (as many as 2/3) never actually fired their rifles in combat.
antiigravity 1 month ago
Project SALVO
1. In 1948, the Army organized the civilian Operations Research Office. Operations Research Office. Over 3 million battlefield reports from World War I and World War II were analyzed and over the next few years they released a series of reports on their findings. The conclusion was that most combat takes place at short range. In a highly mobile war, combat teams ran into each other largely by surprise; and the team with the higher firepower tended to win.
antiigravity 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
2. Our military purchases M4s from colt for $1799, Izhmash sells brand new AK-100 series rifles for $160 USD, You cant tell me its 7x more accurate. AK's are perfect for combat accuracy. War is not static, fire and maneuver is what wins the fight. Better ergos, accuracy, modularity, range and recoil manageability, lethality, and battery of operations means nothing if your weapon malfunctions 15 yards from the enemy.
antiigravity 1 month ago
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Precision:
1. High ARs with match grade barrels don't last very long, AK 74s have less recoil than the AR does, the AR produces 5.3 Joules of recoil. AK in 5.45 only produces 3.9 joules of energy all. AK bolt has roughly 5oz more of moving mass.There are multiple manufactures that develop heavier bolt carriers for the AR to help reduce recoil, and give it longer dwell time.. In this case heavier is better. Look at the formula to calculate kinetic energy...
antiigravity 1 month ago
I see your point about accuracy but I would think you would just have a better chance at getting ammo and parts for an AR system over an AK. I guess I'm not exactly agreeing with your logistics argument. I think availability creates a logistics chain of it's own. Your accuracy test was very informative.
Corsair8X 1 month ago
I gave this debate a lot of thought when buying my most recent AR. So I decided to go with a LMT MRP CQB 16. Slapped a Leatherwood CMR on it and couldn't be more happy with the results thus far.
shaokem 1 month ago
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shaokem 1 month ago
AR is more refined, but is more sensitive to dirt.
plumberjoe80 1 month ago
I love reading the comments on this video. You guys are a bunch of babies! They are a couple of the best combat arms ever. AK is utter reliability,
plumberjoe80 1 month ago
"If I fall in a mud hole I have to be mindful that the M4 may stop working. With the AK, I can use a mud hole to clean it."
LOL! Post of the year, haha.
jfaerr 1 month ago
@jfaerr not really, you would have to get mud in the chamber, and since the AR fires from a closed bolt thats almost a non-issue, especially when you have the dust cover closed
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
Also you should not forget that the AK-74 delivers slightly bigger muzzle energy, which compensates for the smaller accuracy.
0501856849 1 month ago
@0501856849 wrong
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
@HunterKiller308 or is it? The comparison with the M16 give a lower muzzle energy, whilst a comparison with the M4 give higher energy because of the difference in barrel lenght. So half-wrong.
0501856849 1 month ago
@0501856849 No, longer barrels give you higher muzzle energy.......
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
@HunterKiller308 Which is exactly what I was saying. The M16 has a longer barrel, hence higher muzzle energy, while the M4 has a shorter one so lower muzzle energy.
And did you ever hear abotu ambushes? There's your full torso. The group made at 400 metres is 16 centimetres (around six inches) with an AKM, believe it or not.
0501856849 1 month ago
@0501856849 LMFAO, are you retarded or somthing? you can expect a 4" group with an AK74 at 100 meters,did you even watch the video? so how the hell are you going to get a 6" group with an AKM at 400 meters? hell the 7.62x39 has 26" inched of drop at 300 meters alone.
stop spreading your ignorant bullshit. i doubt you have ever fired an AK in your life, and if you did your nothing but another dirt shooter
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
@0501856849 and as for "ambushes" you wouldnt do it at that kind of range, it would just turn into taking pot shots...you should have enough time to take a more precise and lethal shot, such as head or left chest....none of that random center mass shit
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
@HunterKiller308 I am being ignorant? Do you even know how to use the rear sights oon an AKM? 26" of drop means that at any targeted point the bullets will impact 26" lower? If yes then you should adjust the sights and let one fly afterwards. You are right, if I do an ambush I will use a heavier calibre, I was just demonstrating where you could see a full torso in a "combat situation". Also I see you are a real M16 fan, it's okay, just don't try to be superior to everyone else.
0501856849 1 month ago 2
@0501856849 LOL, who the hell walks around with a 400 yard zero on their AK47? you would be shooting way to high at closer ranges. do you have any idea how hard it would be to sight in a rifle during combat?
1.5 MOA means a rifle that groups within 3" at 200 yards and 6" at 400 yards. thats a 10 shot group average.
AKs are 3-4 MOA rifles at best. your full of shit kid. post a video of someone making a 6" group at 400 yards with an AK, i would LOVE to see that
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
@HunterKiller308 Do you know ANYTHING about the AKs sight system? You know it has a tangent sight that can be ranged from 100 to 1000m (although it is completely pointless to adjust it anywhere over 500), for elevation. Ranging the tangent sight is not very hard: you press the button on the left side and you push it into position then release the button. You are full of shit, you don't even seem to know the rifle you are criticizing. And it is metres, not yards, Mr Know-It-All.
0501856849 1 month ago
@0501856849 LMFAO, first of all the AK sight system is very crude, like over sized pistol sight really, the open sight picture shit at low light and night shooting as well they are extremely crude when put next to AR peep sights that are adjustable for windage and elevation.
kid fucking around with your rifles zero in combat...i doubt you could eyeball any kind of distance anyway. you think you can just slide your rear sight to the 400M mark and your point of aim will be the same? LOL
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
@0501856849 TYOUR SAYING THAT THE AK47 IS A 1.5 MOA RIFLE
YOUR FULL OF SHIT CHILD
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
@HunterKiller308 no use in swearing. You probably never understood the whole point of practising on a firing range: targets of the same height (175cm if I am not mistaken - the average body height in the world) are disposed at a given distance and after a point of time you eye starts recognising the approximate distance of a man-sized target. continued in next comment
0501856849 1 month ago
@HunterKiller308 Then when you are qualifying targets pop up at different distances and you have to engage them accordingly to what the officer in charge says. If it is "slow shooting" (I don't know the english term) you have to range the rifle's rear sights and engage the target with it. If it is "fast shooting" you have to engage targets with approximate elevation with your sights zeroed to 100m. Oh and it's not "your" but "you're".
0501856849 1 month ago
@HunterKiller308 oh and it is not the AK-47, but the AK-63F, the Hugarian-made version of the AKM.
0501856849 1 month ago
@0501856849 Totally agree.
antiigravity 1 month ago
@antiigravity you would shit4brains
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
@HunterKiller308 Now come upto any soldier who really trained with an AKM and tell him that 6" is impossible at 400m. He will laugh in your face (just as I do). Even my father, who was trained as a conscrit in the early '70s with an AMD was able to put his 3-round bursts in the same 17 cm circle at 300m. That's pretty much enough for anything if you ask me... FYI, I am not retarded, this is why I am trying to reason with you (or maybe that means I actually AM retarded).
0501856849 1 month ago 14
@0501856849 I've seen Russian soldiers in 1993 hit targets with AK-74 from 400 meters consistently. They are accurate if you know how to use it. Thats without optics or red-dots by the way with standard iron sights that were quickly set to the appropriate range setting.
Spetsnazovets 1 month ago
@Spetsnazovets I believe that. I see my guys hit targets with their AKM's iron sights at 200-300-400 metres every month :) I know that it is only as accurate as the shooter :)
0501856849 1 month ago
@0501856849 yeah you can hit at that range, but you need a big torso target...something rarely seen in combat when cover is involved
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
@Spetsnazovets yeah a full sized torso targets, AK74 at 400 meters is about a 14" group.
you rarely see someones whole torso in combat as everyone fights from cover.
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
@HunterKiller308 And who is going to try to engage at this range? At this range the unit sniper will begin taking out targets. Also at 400 meters STATIONARY target sure can hit with both AK and M-16. But thats assuming the targets are not shooting back at you. Also cover available in field is scarce. If in city/forest ranges are short as and both are equal in that scenario, most common today.
Spetsnazovets 1 month ago
@Spetsnazovets "And who is going to try to engage at this range" anone who can see the threat with a weapon than can reach out. when a unit of men have rifles like M16's you dont need to rely on a DM or "unit sniper", to take out threats at 400M, especially if they have ACOGs
those targets are only STATIONARY when using cover or laying prone..in both instances the target is much much smaller than a typical head and sholders man sized target, that why not just range, but accuracy is key
HunterKiller308 1 month ago
Fall into a mudhole with an AK? No problem, "I can clean an AK in a mudhole." lol
rogermcgee1 2 months ago
At last I see the video where the person that makes the presentation actually UNDERSTANDS the whole IDEA of WHY the AK was designed the way it was. Its ACCURATE ENOUGH for average battle range.
Russian training favours SHORT BURST fire. They didn't bother chasing 1MOA as they knew soldier will be firing on the move and won't have 6-10 seconds for an accurate shot especially when the heart is pounding, people screaming, explosions and gunfire roaring and bullets are flying.
Spetsnazovets 2 months ago
@Spetsnazovets actually the Soviet soldiers who the Ak was made for liked to attack in mass waves, charging enmass and spraying from the hip, crude suppress and manuver stuff.
the AR was designed for motivated marksman that date all the way back to picking off individual british officers in the Revolutionary war. soldiers who pride themselves on marksmanship
you wont be saying your 4 moa Ak is "accurate enough" when you come accross a threat using hard cover and only exposing his head
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
@HunterKiller308 Then you are massively unaware of Soviet doctrine and training.
I'd love to see the moron who'd be dumb enough to try to stick the head up while the suppressive fire is continually conducted over the head.
Spetsnazovets 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Spetsnazovets "I'd love to see the moron who'd be dumb enough to try to stick the head up while the suppressive fire is continually conducted over the head"
You aint always got it like that
"Thats ww2 tactics that were rejected later and replaced "
True, but im talking about the tactic being used at the time of the AK-47s design, its fit and funtion was to serve in that role, its more of a machinegun, a bullet hose than a rifle in its function.
.
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
@Spetsnazovets xexe, so true.
antiigravity 1 month ago
@HunterKiller308 As far as "liked to charge spraying from the hip" - Thats ww2 tactics that were rejected later and replaced with much more sophisticated ones
Spetsnazovets 2 months ago
"I can use a mud hole to clean it" new AK catch phase. Great vid
08ltr450racer 2 months ago
Great video
leicamaster 2 months ago
Semper fi. I'm a vet of Iraq and the last few years I have found that my fav. Rifle is the mini 14 tactical. The new minis are just as accurate as basic ar or m16 and it has the combat proven operating system of the grand and m14. Iv got about 1000 yds though mine now and have not had one malfuction. Semper fi
jnpiel 2 months ago
@jnpiel i am not a fan of the Mini 14/30s they are ranch rifles, not combat firearms. yes they are designed on the venerable M1A but it is completely sized down. thus critical components are more fragile and far less robust. just like what happened with the ARs, the original design was for the 308, it was a far more robust, as such more reliable before they sized it down to the AR15
mind if i ask your MOS? im enlisting 0300 infantry option
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
@HunterKiller308 Hey glad to hear you are enlisting. Let me start off by saying if you dont like the mini thats cool not every body is into the same stuff but let me say this from my personal test The mini wont jam iv done practal test with mine for fun and its never jamed. as far as my mos I am a combat enginer the short version is when I was in iraq I cleard obstacals for the grunts with explosive and hunted out mines and ied. we did not dis arm like eod we just blew them.
jnpiel 2 months ago
@jnpiel cond where they was so bascly we where there to blow up what ever got in the way or slowed down the advance good luck and semper fi
jnpiel 2 months ago
@HunterKiller308 there's a pretty good article about the m4/ar-15 on Defense Industry Daily. Google " The USA's M4 Carbine Controversy " btw, I was in the army, I hated the m4.
cj89311 2 months ago
@cj89311 yeah, the direct impingment AR15 was designed for a rifle length gas system,if i was going to use a carbine AR i would want a short stroke gas system. not to mention the 5.56 was designed around a 20" barrel and it greatly increases its fragmenation threshold. thats why im glad the Marines still use full length M16s, im enlisting as 0300 infantry option, going for 0311
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
"i can use the mud hole to clean it" Haha....Awesome!
LibertyorDeath777 2 months ago
How about an M-1a/M-14?? 7.62x51mm/.308win? I like range and knock down power personally. The M-1a is pretty reliable too
Eggomania86 2 months ago
@Eggomania86 the M1A is pure beast, but im partial to the AR10, its a better host for optics as well as advanced recoil managment
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
@HunterKiller308 Not really much better for optics. All you have to do on the M1A is remove the stripper clip guide and put a smith enterprise mount in its place. It's just as good as an AR10 then for optics. As far as recoil, mangement, I had both. I didn't think there was a lot of difference.
esh325 2 months ago in playlist Favorite videos
@esh325 every Ar10 NEEDs a hydrolic recoil buffer, it just replaced the standard buffer on any AR and the differance it makes is night and day. you wont want to shoot any 308 without one again. it makes a .308 AR10 have less recoil than a god damn AK47. you have obviously never had the pleause of getting your hands on one.
ok prehaps the Ar10 isnt a "better" optics mount, but its less of a hastle.
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
you shot corrosive without cleaning your ak47?
nunvikingsofthesea 2 months ago
Thanks for a great video. I appreciate your articulate, unbiased and practical opinion. I would also add that because of another video of yours I ended up buying a Saiga and converting it to an AK74.
Keep the videos coming.
beerbrewer737 2 months ago in playlist Firearms Reviews
i really enjoyed this vid and commend you for the unbiased review. keep up the good work.
swiznat1 2 months ago in playlist More videos from Sturmgewehre
Now shoot at 50 yards shooting off hand with no bench. Accuracy is nice for everyone to talk about but in war one does not necessarily shoot from a bench.
Allante715 2 months ago
@Allante715 That doesn't demonstrate the accuracy of the rifle, that demonstrates the accuracy of that individual, and thus is mostly irrelevant when comparing the accuracy capabilities of two rifles since all individuals do things differently. I know men who can shoot the AK better than the AR, and men that can shoot the AR better than the AK. The bench removes the human factor to a degree and shows the mechanical accuracy capabilities of the rifle itself.
Sturmgewehre 2 months ago 32
@Sturmgewehre
I was in no way attempting to discredit your analysis. The difference in inherent accuracy between the AK and AR would be virtually indistinguishable when shot offhand.
Allante715 2 months ago
@Allante715 maybe out to 100 yards or so, any further and your going to start noticing a differance
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
thanks for this
sleighte 2 months ago
Thumbs up just for saying "shiznit" :)
cfusionpm 2 months ago
Excellent vid, Sturmgewehre. About a year ago, I put the two side by side in an effort to determine a "one-gun" SHTF weapon, and came to the exact same conclusions. Love the M4/M16 series, but the direct impingement gas system is kinda like crapping where you eat in my view, and tiny groups don't mean much on the street. AK is perfect for assault in all conditions. Well done vid all around (especially that Jeep).
defibaughjd7 2 months ago
@defibaughjd7 "tiny groups don't mean much on the street" it depends how long that street is, those tiny groups mean you rifle will hold its point of aim at longer distances.
"the direct impingement gas system is kinda like crapping where you eat" by it blowing gasses directly into the bolt then yeah i guess. but its reliability issue are way over blown. just keep it lubed and use good mags. they dont need to be spotless, far from it
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
@HunterKiller308 I'm well aware of what tiny groups mean, and I stand by my statement. I can hit a man-sized target at 300 yards with my current setup. Chances are good that in the situation we're discussing, either that level of accuracy will be sufficient, or I won't be revealing my position. I'm not trying to discredit the choices of others or their systems, I've just had the occasional malfunction with the M4/M16 and it turned me off of them - for this application, that is.
defibaughjd7 2 months ago
@defibaughjd7 when you fire you are usually static, either using cover, only exposing your head, or laying prone, making yourself a smaller target.
a standard M16A4 gets 1.5 - 2 MOA
1.5 MOA is still a 5" group at 300 meters, thats headshot material. the further your enemy is the more time you may have in increasing your odds of lining up your sight on a small target like that. no one is going to stand straight up,exposing their entire torso for you.
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
Comment removed
defibaughjd7 2 months ago
@defibaughjd7 LOL.you throw in some off hand lingo and you think your hot shit when you aint shit at all. "Your paper MOA figures mean pretty much dinkydoo in combat" tell that to a sniper, a DM, all those Marines who were taking so many headshots there as an interantional investigation into execution allegations when it was proven all the shots were taken at well over 200 meters. when you think your safe peeking out a window 400 meters away your DEAD wrong
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
@HunterKiller308 Respect your betters, cockbreath. You've got no idea where I've been. And the unit to which you refer was under investigation because they had recently been issued ACOGs on their A4s. I suppose you'll probably argue that optics are for pussies, since you've got piles of combat experience laying around.
defibaughjd7 2 months ago
@defibaughjd7 good optics are a fucking game changer and the AR is tailor made for optics. this day in age iron sights are more for backup than anything
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
@HunterKiller308 and if you did anything more than play video games and talk out of your ass, you'd realize that you just made my point for me. Third world pig farmers can't always take time to scrub and lube and clean their precious ARs, so they go with the cheap and reliable AK. No one was talking to you, but you had to pop right in and give us all your precious biased opinion on your favorite weapon.
defibaughjd7 2 months ago
@defibaughjd7 " Third world pig farmers can't always take time to scrub and lube and clean their precious ARs"...ignorant.
it takes less than five minutes to swab out an AR, including the bolt group. it takes 2 seconds to lube an AR, just squirt a little in the bolt. ARs will run very dirty if you keep it well lubed, and thats a non issue. no soldier is going to trash and not clean his weapon, russian soldiers clean their Aks all the time, just because you could dosent mean you should
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
@defibaughjd7 an AR thats kept lubed will run dirty just fine. if the AR was as unreliable as you claim do you really think the most powerful military force in the world would use it? i think not. get your facts straight. Russian soldiers clean and lube their AKs just like all other nations armys with their various firearms. no soldier is going to trash and not clean his weapon. go move to some third world shit hole every pig farmer will have your favorite crude bullet hose
HunterKiller308 2 months ago
The sight radius is proportional to the barrel lenght, both on the AR and the AK.
alexandre92ca 2 months ago
As always, good information. I have both AR15 and AK47 and I can say that both rifles are superb! However, in a shtf scenario, my choice will be the AK..
hvn4bid 2 months ago
DUDE your awesome, I have a igh respect for technique of speaking,, can I upload a portion of thois viideo on my channel, like 6:35 to 8:00 or so???
Doyouknowhowmuchusuc 2 months ago
I like video's like this, no vulgarity, your word's are in the proper context, no strong opinions, just sticking to the facts. I WISH I could be like this.
Doyouknowhowmuchusuc 2 months ago
This is a great vid thanks for the comprehensive test, but as we all can see the debate will still rage on.
chris6464h 2 months ago
What's the most rounds you've shot out of an ar without a malfunction?
zhartford2 2 months ago
I think I'll open ANOTHER channel AR-GEWEHRE... :))) hehe...
antiigravity 2 months ago
Finally a review that doesn't try to compare apples to oranges. These two apples are nice but it just goes to show that the AR is just a little more precise. Now all we need is some orange two orange comparison. Like the .300 Blackout(7.62x35) to the 7.62x39
okiegunman 2 months ago
@okiegunman AR is just a ALOT more precise at longer ranges