part 2: Scientology, Brainwashing, coercive persuasion

[artemisfair]

@marcusniehaus877 I was talking about the book Nineteen-eighty-four by George Orwell.

[jerknaff]

I wonder if Tom cruise feels like a dumb ass yet. I see this happening in the U.S.A. more so then Canada, but nun the less we are being manipulated. I have come to the conclusion that ultimately people need to be accountable to themselves. Relying on the government for health care, education and other things like workers comp and unemployment insurance is almost foolish. Those are the things that they will use to bring on disaster and then implement normalization.

[artemisfair]

I was just thinking about 1984. That's got to be the scariest thing I've ever heard of. I remember reading it and getting chills.

[kurtilein3]

i think the real problem is that so few people know about it and are able to notice it when it happens. few people do have the information that is needed to protect themselves and their friends and family.

coercive persuasion is a real problem, and when you consider its importance when it comes to turning normal people into soldiers, its easy to see that it might be contributing to some of the most severe and difficult problems on our planet.

[globe255]

@kurtilein3 I dont know if you see this, but the way i see brainwashing is this:

BRAINWASHING = HYPNOSIS + INTIMIDATION + CARING. Thats the basic elements in it. You use it different from person to person and there are several ways about how to use it. But it is all very important you use all elements to have it succeed. You also need to follow up from time to time.

[crazystarwarsguy1006]

Thanks for your lucid exposition

[DobermannX2]

And what the hell is up with the headphones?

Is he listening to Van Halen's Greatest Hits while he's talking?

If so, that would explain why he can hardly speak...

[DobermannX2]

This dude looks like his brain has been "Washed" a little too much by drugs!

Wow!

[nathanwilefrazier]

By the way, Forrest Whittiker's performance in "The Last King of Scotland" is a really great example of some of these tactics. Other good movies are: Gaslight, Mommy Dearest, and Aileen Wournos - the 1992 interviews.

[kurtilein3]

i didnt watch "The Last King of Scotland", i wanted to watch it, but somehow didnt have the time to do so. i guess i really need to watch that movie.

[nathanwilefrazier]

Tactics of coercive persuasion arise naturally in the DSM-IV cluster B personality disorders. If you are familiar with the symptoms of these disorders, sometimes you can recognize it ahead of time and make them really work hard to create an attachment via "love bombing" - as you mention. I find that these people get really pissed when you walk away just as they think they've got you - heh, heh. In general, however, I find it's healthiest just to try to be a good person around good people.

[kurtilein3]

nathan: with scientology its something different, coercive persuasion is deep inside the organisational structure of the cult. it doesnt depend much on individuals, because individuals are not allowed to question the system in any way.

[hjeremy2222]

Orwell's "Animal Farm" is also very good. Same idea, but more concise.

[kurtilein3]

another book... i didnt read it yet, but heared a lot about it and watched the old movie, people say that the book really takes your mind on a ride into the abyss. Todd Strasser: ``the wave´´. small steps leading up to a totalitarian cult, and while reading you will think something like: ``okay, that makes sense, lets see what comes next... still makes sense, actually the ideas arent that bad, oh FUCK, now its too late, its a totalitarian system, how did that happen?´´

[monsterjazzlicks]

Well done mate !! Very interesting !!

[kurtilein3]

thanks a lot :)

i hope that people will use this information to immunize their children and other people against the dangers of coercive persuasion, and dont use it to start their own cult...

[obobg]

What the fuck is SCIENTOLOGY. Please explain to me? I really do not know. Is this something related to control of the world.

[kurtilein3]

obobg: scientology is a cult that is operating on a global level.

something like jehovas witnesses or mormons, just more radical more international and a bit smaller. and more destructive. you should do some research on the topic.

[onebreedofjamie]

(continued from below)

Of utmost importance is to always be aware of how much power different people or groups have over you. People can fall into very dangerous traps. Once someone realizes he's been caught, his captors have utter control and over time the tactics will break down the mind. So my ode here is this: Do not take the chance of putting yourself in hugely vulnerable situations.

[kurtilein3]

you have to rely on your own bullshit-detector, and you should always do research on the groups and beliefs you are meeting.

[onebreedofjamie]

The sad thing about coercive persuasion is that with enough time, effort, and power, an individual or group can break down the most skeptical of minds. Of course you can see this in 1984, but I know from experience. If I say the blanket is purple, and a person with complete control over me tells me it is blue. With enough pressure, repitition, punishment, etc., I'll eventually say it is blue. Very sad indeed. I would say that outside of skepticism, of utmost importance is

[vishyswa]

Excellent. Thank you kurtilein for your efforts in exposing this evil cult. The Orwell 1984 component was something I hadn't previously known about. VERY interesting!

[piercedicequeen]

So technically you could say that you were increasing our suggestibility by having us watch your two videos for 16 minutes before suggesting that we subscribe to those two people. I know that wasn't your intent and that it would take a lot longer to increase the suggestibility of people but I just thought of that when I was watching your vid :P

[kurtilein3]

pierdicequeen: if that would be the case, then im sure that more people would actually have followed ;)

[ThinkIGiveAShit]

You know the problem with Germans? They are mean and vile to non-Germans. I think if the Germans would want to be a better country, they'd stop talking shit about every other country. As if the Germans know shit about politics. Stick to engineering, science, and philosophy. Leave politics to people with brains (IE; Czechs).

[kurtilein3]

ThinkIGiveAShit: i have no idea what you are talking about. this video is about scientology and coercive persuasion.

and if you want me to stop criticizing the foreign politics of the united states, then the united states should stop behaving immoral on an international level first, if thats what you mean.

[stevenmg77]

Really interesting video. Have you seen the documentary on the Phelps family ('America's most hated family')? This is another clear case of brainwashing using the tactics you describe.

[bakrieltom]

Warum nicht auch mal auf deutsch?

Kannst dann ja englische Untertitel drunter machen (dein Akzent is echt grauenhaft :-)

[dechha1981]

Have you read 1984? If so did you read it in English or German? I'm kind of curious because there's a few refferences to language in 1984 (like, how the Proletarians have Cockney accent and teh Outer Party all have London accents, at least that's how I imaged it) I'm curious about how they handled Newspeak in the German version.

[kurtilein3]

i read it in german, but its long ago, i dont remember those details. there are different german accents, i dont think that those aspects would be too difficult to translate.

[bestckt]

You mentioned in a previous video that your country's government made the determination the the church of scientology is a cult and therefore does not exempt them from taxation. I'm wondering if you know when that determination was made and how or if it has affected the number of scientologists in Germany. I've not been able to find a reliable source to determine the numbers of scientologists in individual countries or if it is even a possible to know.

[kurtilein3]

im not really sure, i only know that scientology was never accepted as a church here in germany. scientology tried to fight against it, but always failed. im not sure, there is no good data, but to me it appears that they are not really growing in numbers here, it stays more or less the same, but the amount of money they have under their control appears to be growing.

[RobbyTheSheef]

Great video.

[auchraw]

I learned from Arnie Lerma's site that a German Dr. Anastasius Nordenholz already published a book called Scientologie in 1934 and that LRH borrowed other ideas from William Sargant's Battle for the Mind, without mentioning his sources.

[kurtilein3]

auchraw: the ideas clearly were out there, hubbard used them just like north korea and the military use them. hubbard is just the only person that turned into a more or less successful destructive cult just for fun and personal profit. he knew that he was causing a LOT of damage.

[bitchbutcher]

weiter so! ich guck deine videos sehr gerne. vor allem erklärst du es sehr verständnisvoll. und du hast eine sehr positive AUsstrahlung.

[fizzybgood]

This is really chilling stuff. I read 1984 many years ago, so I may have to read it again. I considered going into the military as an 18 year old, until I realized that I'm far too skeptical and opinionated, and would likely get kicked out. lol This type of coercion is why children should be taught critical thinking all through school. $cientology disgusts me.

[kurtilein3]

fizzybgood: well, the military uses the tactics to enable people to kill other people, but when you join the military then its clear that you will have to deal with a lot of mental pressure and that you might end up killing people. but many people dont know that scientology does it, they think its a religion that helps people. if everyone would know about it, why should anyone join? the military pays you money, and in scientology you pay.

[auchraw]

This is a very good point. Is there anything to stop another organisation (rational, non-profit, anonymous) setting up self-help groups to deal with stress, using rational techniques? It is good that a whole generation of young, mostly male, are now aware of the dangers but there are millions of vulnerable young and older, mostly female, who are not. As you know the Co$ target lonely people. Stress and loneliness are real problems.

[h2opower]

Look up Edward Bernays, that will tell volumes of what is going on around the world.

[einspahrfamily]

I wish I knew German as well as you know English!

[aZeroGodist]

Remember seeing 1984 as a kid, great film such a lasting impression,

One line I'll never forget "can you be more specific" must watch again.

Great post bty.

[kurtilein3]

read the book ;)

[lemuelbecc]

Now that i know what it is called. I see it everywhere.

[kurtilein3]

lemuelbecc: well, but at least 5% of the population is completely immune to this kind of manipulation, so there is hope. and some things just cant be corrupted, like the scientific community or wikipedia.

[PhasedPrism]

Yes, 1984 is a scary book and is a must read by everyone, in my opinion. It's a little difficult to understand your accent, but your reasoning and logic are great.

[pyromania152]

So others agree that Scientology and 1984 share a lot in common! Horray!

[TheFantasticAtheist]

When I was in school they taught me that I came before E except after C. Funny how Atheism doesnt follow that rule where Scientology does. Scientology 4 life

[thekid19921]

Hay dumb ass thats in English kurtilein3 is German so he would apply German grammar when making up a username and besides that rule doesn't apply here. Funny how dumb scientology is. ATHEISM FOR LIFE!

[incorrigiblekitty]

Heh. Rigid thinking, ie, don't allow any exceptions to the 'rules.'  Atheism: A (without) the (from theology, study of god) ism (belief, practice); theism is from theology, therefore; -ism is a suffix, thus the spelling is correct. What grade did you last attend? i think we learned about suffixes in the 3rd or 4th year of primary school, in the United States of America. Just curious, when you say the Pledge of Allegiance, do you say, 'one nation under Xenu?'

[lemuelbecc]

How about the word 'neither' then, you ignorant american?

[auchraw]

I checked out your links but did not subscribe. Why do some very young Youtubers imagine I want to watch them for hours and hours until they work out what it is they want to say? Boring, boring. I might agree with them but we will never know.

[kurtilein3]

O_o why do you keep watching my videos if you dont like them?

[auchraw]

kurtilein3: This is NOT what I wrote. I like your videos very much or I would not subscribe and keep watching them!! My comments are about your LINKS. They are correct for them. These others have a lot to learn about making videos. My comments were aimed at them, not at you. Please forgive confusion. Spamming is unfair!!

[Matt330]

Love the Scientology vids.

[niceonetom]

great vid kurt. you seem to actually care about the people that scientology hurts and not just want to fight for the sake of fighting, and proving you're right. that is admirable. i re-read 1984 recently too and found it a masterpiece in explaining how cognitive dissonance can be enforced in a closed group. i see parallels with most religions there. i'll check out your recommended links too; very community minded of you ;)

[kurtilein3]

thanks for the compliments :)

[rspawn]

1st comment!