No, going to the moon and not taking photos of stars is not like making a doco on NY firefighters and ignoring a massive terrorist attack, it is stupid to even liken the too events.
The moon landings were time critical events, where there were limited opportunities to get things done like collect moon rocks etc, taking photos of things we can already take photos of from earth is utterly pointless given the context of the mission.
LMFAO!!! So time critical they had time to whack around a few golf balls and chuck around a hammer. But fuck taking pictures of what should have been an awesome sight overhead. But of course the only things overhead were some puppeteers and maybe a roof.
Six supposed landings on the moon & no time for a picture of the lunar sky?
but i believe the moon missions were real. only that no photograph is possible from the moon since films can't be taken beyond van allen belts, or through it. it maybe that the videos and photos from the moon missions were badly exposed or were even destroyed during the flight. new videos and photos were staged to account for the taxpayer money and to garner public and senate support.
The only 100% sure way to find out about the Moon Landing is to go see the multitude of objects that were allegedly left on the moon, with remote controlled cameras mounted on space shuttles, and all this done by someone with no conflict of interest or desire to see something else than the truth...
And of course, this should be done by someone not linked to NASA in any way, and keep every possible aspect of it 100% transparent to everyone on Earth...
Ok, the all-time silliest moon hoax analogy is uttered here @ 7:00 - "what they were, and were not there to do is irrelevant(?), it would be like going to Manhattan to do a documentary about the FDNY and ignoring a big plane hitting a bldg (i.e. the WTC on 9/11) to continue your documentary"
The analogy to J.W.s analogy would be if they went to the moon to do a documentary and ignored the Command Module crashing nearby to continue their documentary.
The point is that Amstrong asked in an interview after the first Apollo mission if he saw any stars? He didn't see any stars he said and was swiftly backed up by his colleage saying "I can't remeber seeing any stars" ?????? duh!
This hoax claim is wrong from the start. Apollo astronauts DID take pictures of stars, including pictures of the Earth with stars in the background The Apollo 16 crew used an ultraviolet camera system to take photos of stars that would be impossible on Earth due to the atmosphere blocking UV light. Analysis of these photos proves that they were taken on the moon, because the constellation alignment matches what would have been visible from the vantage point of the moon's surface at the time.
The UV photos are discussed in Part 2. Hubble and Gemini took UV photos from earth orbit, without any effect from the geo-corona. Further, propagandists hype that the star positions on the moon are the same as those taken from earth orbit.
Pictures of stars are easy to get without going to the moon, so it's logical that Apollo pictures would focus on the moon itself. Star positions were well known, so NASA could easily have faked stars in all of their moon pictures. Therefore, it defies logic that they would create difficult forgeries of UV star pictures, but not fake stars in the other pictures. The Apollo16 photos could have been taken on the moon, so these pictures don't provide any evidence of the moon landings being faked.
If the cameras were set to take star images, i.e. wider apature & slower shutter speed, they would then need to set the cameara upon a tripod or similar to keep it steady.
Great post Jarrah; Also 9/11 footage is also questionable. A documentary titled: September Clues highlights the mistakes in the media footage of what they said happened on 9/11. (This reminds me of your work in regards to Apollo)
The biggest moving force during the Apollo Program was von Braun, for obvious reasons.. As for Dr. Van Allen, he NEVER refuted his original claims about the extreme radiation dangers of the belts and he was also dead set AGAINST manned space flight until the day he died.
SD02:"As for Dr. Van Allen, he NEVER refuted his original claims about the extreme radiation dangers of the belts."
--Riiight...
"The recent Fox TV show, which I saw, is an ingenious and entertaining assemblage of nonsense. The claim that radiation exposure during the Apollo missions would have been fatal to the astronauts is only one example of such nonsense."
WS:" "The recent Fox TV show, which I saw, is an ingenious and entertaining assemblage of nonsense. The claim that radiation exposure during the Apollo missions would have been fatal to the astronauts is only one example of such nonsense."
-- Dr. James Van Allen"
Which only proves what lies some of the top team players have to promote for "national security" purposes.
SD02:"and he was also dead set AGAINST manned space flight until the day he died.
--Irrelevant to this argument, certainly not because of the radiation dangers as you and other CTers suggest, but because of costs between manned vs. unmanned spaceflight.
Fortunately, space is very big, so there's room for a proper balance between the two with unmanned serving as the pathfinders for the eventual permanent human presence that will follow (and if not U.S., other nations taking advantage will).
WS: "--Irrelevant to this argument, certainly not because of the radiation dangers as you and other CTers suggest, but because of costs between manned vs. unmanned spaceflight."
NASA's lies and your excuses don't work anymore, now that the truth about the extreme dangers of space radiation is known.
The more people like spaceport avoid the truth about the deadly nature of space radiation, the more they show their ignorance, and the more obvious it is to not pay attention to them. Of course you'll always have your patriotic numbskulls that go around waving their flags and believing God is going to deliver them from the evil of the world. That how they won't have to get off their asses, educate themselves, and throw the bums out of Congress, and take back their country!!!
WS: "Besides, all you CTs and Moon Hoaxers are so wrapped up on the wrong individuals -- von Braun and Van Allen -- you've unwittingly provided the proof the moon landings did occur as history recorded it by ignoring the real moving force and key individuals behind the success of Apollo."
Bravo!.. Spoken like a true NASA shill.. Say a lot, while saying nothing .. Which indivuduals would that "moving force" be exactly?
WS:"-- If you don't know, I'm certainly not going to help you. Figure it out on your own, Bub, they're hiding in plain sight."
Funny you should use that expression, as "hiding in plain sight" is one of the most successful tactics used by those who have committed monumental crimes.
In fact, it's very similar to; "The bigger the lie, the more people will believe it".
You compare seeing stars from the moon with seeing a plane hit the WTC. You then make the suggestion the the astronauts shouldn't have photographed themselves and the lunar activities but focused on photographing the stars in the same way that the documentart makers focused on the events of 911. You are clearly not as smart as you like to think you are...
Gee, what a strange thing for NASA's top Nazi rocket scientist to do in the middle of a 30 billion dollar space race to the Moon!
Go looking for Moon rocks in the freezing cold Antarctic, when all he had to do was to go grab them in Hawaii, the home of basalt and breccia "Moon" rocks!
SD02:"Gee, what a strange thing for NASA's top Nazi rocket scientist to do in the middle of a 30 billion dollar space race to the Moon!"
--Dr. von Braun also went scuba diving in the middle of his Apollo program. Are you going to suggest he was looking for Atlantis as well?
Military & Civil Service get 30 days leave. I'm sure hundreds of thousands took it in the middle of Vietnam as well as Apollo. Why should von Braun be any different -- or were you expecting him to work 24/7/365?
WS:"--Dr. von Braun also went scuba diving in the middle of his Apollo program. Are you going to suggest he was looking for Atlantis as well?"
If he thought Atlantis might have something he could pass off as coming from the Moon, I have no doubt he would have donned scuba gear, instead of snow shoes , and chosen his "vacation" spot there.
WS: "Military & Civil Service get 30 days leave. I'm sure hundreds of thousands took it in the middle of Vietnam as well as Apollo. Why should von Braun be any different -- or were you expecting him to work 24/7/365?"
Right in the middle of conducting a 30 billion American tax payer dollar space race against the "evil" Russians, I would think he would at least not trot off for two months to Antarctica or Atlantis!.. Especially when trying to meet JFK's "end of the decade" race to the Moon!
SD02:"Right in the middle of conducting a 30 billion American tax payer dollar space race against the "evil" Russians, I would think he would at least not trot off for two months to Antarctica..."
--Once again, your fact checking and research is proved wrong. Shall I publicly embarrass you with pgs 354-358 of Erik Bergaust's biography of Wernher von Braun that specifically covers the 1967 Antarctica expedition (also covered in Popular Science, Vol. 190, No. 5, May 1967, pgs. 114-116 & 200)?
"--Once again, your fact checking and research is proved wrong. Shall I publicly embarrass you with pgs 354-358 of Erik Bergaust's biography of Wernher von Braun that specifically covers the 1967 Antarctica expedition .. "
I won't be embarrassed by what is written in his book. People can write anything they choose to. It doesn't necessarily mean it's true, especially if they have a particular agenda or are pals with NASA.
Go ahead and post the info. I'm curious to see what has to say.
SD02:"People can write anything they choose to. It doesn't necessarily mean it's true, especially if they have a particular agenda or are pals with NASA."
--Interesting, since this is the very same author who wrote a blistering report against NASA and North American Aviation, builders of the CM-012 (Apollo 1) spacecraft and the subsequent fire and death of the crew in his book entitled "Murder on Pad 34."
Doesn't sound like someone who endeared himself to NASA.
SD02:"People can write anything they choose to. It doesn't necessarily mean it's true, especially if they have a particular agenda"
--Funny, you perfectly described self-proclaimed "author" Bill Kaysing and cabinetmaker cum self-taught "engineer", self-published "author" and gashole Ralph Rene -- both of whom were/are grey-haired kooks/village idiots soundly debunked by others of reasonable intelligence elsewhere years ago.
Are these the type of people you want to be associated with?
WS: "--Funny, you perfectly described self-proclaimed "author" Bill Kaysing and cabinetmaker cum self-taught "engineer", self-published "author" and gashole Ralph Rene -- both of whom were/are grey-haired kooks/village idiots soundly debunked by others of reasonable intelligence elsewhere years ago."
I also perfectly described the losers who write bogus biographies about the Apollo astronots, including their alleged Moon trip fantasies.
SD02:"Go ahead and post the info. I'm curious to see what has to say."
--Too much to retype here, well beyond YouTube's 500 character limit and off-topic to this subject about not seeing/photographing stars on the moon.
Go to your local Library (or Amazon. com) and look up "Wernher von Braun: The authoritative and definitive biographical profile of the father of modern space flight" by Erik Bergaust
You're a "big businessman"; you can afford to shell out $10.74 for an out of print copy.
Ws: "You're a "big businessman"; you can afford to shell out $10.74 for an out of print copy."
Only $10.47 for an out of print copy? .. That really is a bargain!
How about send me the relative quote about von Braun's Moon rock collecting expedition to my PM box? .. That is if you are capable of retyping text exceding 500 characters.
I recently typed thousands of characters to an Apollo defender's PM box, to show him the error of his ways about Apollo 11 not being tracked to the Moon.
SD02:"How about send me the relative quote about von Braun's Moon rock collecting expedition to my PM box? .. That is if you are capable of retyping text exceding 500 characters."
--If you're capable of sitting long enough to read through four pages of transcribed text, they're in your PM.
Nowhere is there any proof von Braun went to Antarctica for anything other than research for Apollo.
The rock "claims" are nothing more than the debunked rantings of Bill Kaysing and Ralph Rene.
WS: "The rock "claims" are nothing more than the debunked rantings of Bill Kaysing and Ralph Rene."
The rock "claims" are on respected sites, similar to Wikipedia.. We've already been through this before where I proved you wrong and provided evidence that von Braun took a geological team to the Antarctic to search for "lunar meteroites", and NOT to "train the Apollo astronots".
"Go looking for Moon rocks in the freezing cold Antarctic, when all he had to do was to go grab them in Hawaii, the home of basalt and breccia "Moon" rocks!"
I never got something with the whole theory that Von Braun went to Antarctica to find moon rocks.
1 - Antarctica wouldn't be the first place I'd go for rocks
2 - 30 moon rocks have been found on earth, yet somehow Von Braun managed to find a much larger collection than that
"We only know that NOW. You think in 1960 they thought "I need rocks, I know lets go to that place covered in snow and ice!" "
von Braun's trip took place in 1967, two years before Apollo 11 allegedly went to the Moon .. So yes, the rocks would have been very much needed.
"They brought some back from Mars and used that to compare."
Using UNMANNED missions .. Thanks for proving my point .. How many unmanned missions did NASA launch to the Moon ( that we know about ) before Apollo 11?
"von Braun's trip took place in 1967, two years before Apollo 11 allegedly went to the Moon .. So yes, the rocks would have been very much needed."
I don't think you get my point. Let's say you needed 150lbs of rocks. Would you plan an expedition to a place covered in ice and snow, or as you said before, just go to Hawaii?
"How many unmanned missions did NASA launch to the Moon ( that we know about ) before Apollo 11?"
That brought back rocks? None, the Russians did it first.
"I don't think you get my point. Let's say you needed 150lbs of rocks. Would you plan an expedition to a place covered in ice and snow, or as you said before, just go to Hawaii?"
No, I got your point.. but I wasn't very clear about mine .. Being a Nazi, there were more reasons for von Braun's team to explore the Antarctic, besides gathering Moon rocks for the Apollo Program.
Look up Nazi secret saucer technology and their expeditions to the Antarctic.
"Look up Nazi secret saucer technology and their expeditions to the Antarctic."
I'm not even going there.
"None that we know about, anyway."
We would know about any remotely controlled missions to the moon. Someone would have picked up the signal and thought "THE RUSSIANS ARE INVOLVED IN A SECRET MISSION ON THE MOON!"
Of course you're not .. Why bring even more attention to the fact that von Braun was a Nazi who was most likely involved in Nazi secret weapons development and top secret space flight technology.
straydog02:"Look up Nazi secret saucer technology and their expeditions to the Antarctic."
zakabog:"I'm not even going there"
straydog02" Of course you're not .. Why bring even more attention to the fact that von Braun was a Nazi who was most likely involved in Nazi secret weapons development and top secret space flight technology.
--OK, I'll bite.
The question has been often asked whether Wernher von Braun was a member of the Nazi Party -- or a Nazi at heart; Two big differences.
The question has been often asked whether Wernher von Braun was a member of the Nazi Party -- or a Nazi at heart; Two big differences."
I don't see any difference at all .. A Nazi is a Nazi, whether they don a uniform or not.. von Braun worked for the Nazi party as one of their top scientists who developed rockets that could deliver weapons of mass destruction .. That makes him a Nazi war criminal.
SD02:"I don't see any difference at all .. A Nazi is a Nazi, whether they don a uniform or not...That makes him a Nazi war criminal."
--Good thing you're not a juror in any courtroom. You're forgetting the Nazis were originally a political party, not unlike Democrats or Republicans today.
Stay on-topic with the subject ("Dude where's my Stars?") by moving the von Braun discussion over to these appropriate, multi-part YouTube sites:
WS:"--Good thing you're not a juror in any courtroom. You're forgetting the Nazis were originally a political party, not unlike Democrats or Republicans today."
The Republican fascists in power today are no different from Nazis.. So what's your point?
SD02:"The Republican fascists in power today are no different from Nazis.. So what's your point?"
--Just as there are some good Republicans & Democrats, there were "good Nazis" too.
Oskar Schindler is but one example. Franz Stigler is another.
And more than a million ballots cast by industry professionals from 108 countries unveiled at the 2003 Paris Air Show ranked von Braun above all other space figures ("Top 100 Stars of Aerospace") and #2 overall behind the Wright Brothers.
WS:"--Just as there are some good Republicans & Democrats, there were "good Nazis" too."
There is no such thing as a "good Nazi".. and lately there aren't too many good republicans left either .. The 'Grand Old Party' has become a neo con agenda that has destroyed American democracy, the US economy and has broken the US military .. Too bad the Democratic congress didn't have the guts to impeach the fascist bastards who have done nothing but damage this Nation in every way possible.
WS:" Stay on-topic with the subject ("Dude where's my Stars?") by moving the von Braun discussion over to these appropriate, multi-part YouTube sites:"
Thanks, but I will discuss what I want, where I want .. I don't think Jarrah minds a bit.
WS.. Thanks very much for the pages from Erik Bergaust's book about von Braun's trip to the Antarctic. I kept waiting for him to mention their search for lunar meteorites, but all he said about finding rocks was from the excerpt I posted here. He claims that they discovered rocks among the glaciers, though he doesn't go into much detail about them, except von Braun's remark about it being "THE IDEAL SETTING TO ATTEMPT DETECTION OF TRACES OF LIFE ON OTHER PLANETS".
Less than 100 miles from McMurdo and the Royal Society Range are Antarctica's "dry valleys," formerly covered by glaciers. Due to reduced snowfall in recent centuries, the glaciers have receded and exposed virgin expanses of rock and pebble-strewn earth. Life, in the form of organisms, carried by the wind and bird droppings, is just finding foothold. "Here," von Braun wrote, "is an ideal setting to attempt detection of traces of life on other planets."
SD02:""Here," von Braun wrote, "is an ideal setting to attempt detection of traces of life on other planets."
--Except, by "other planets" von Braun is referring to Mars, not the moon.
Besides, all you CTs and Moon Hoaxers are so wrapped up on the wrong individuals -- von Braun and Van Allen -- you've unwittingly provided the proof the moon landings did occur as history recorded it by ignoring the real moving force and key individuals behind the success of Apollo.
WS:"--Except, by "other planets" von Braun is referring to Mars, not the moon."
How do you know that? .. Mars wasn't even mentioned in that text.. and Moon meteorites were found in the Antarctic much earlier than Mars meteorites were.
SD02:"How do you know that? .. Mars wasn't even mentioned in that text.. and Moon meteorites were found in the Antarctic much earlier than Mars meteorites were."
--Read von Braun's earlier published works, like 1953's "Das Marsprojekt" and other titles.
They're called "books." You can find them in a place called a "Library."
WS:" --Read von Braun's earlier published works, like 1953's "Das Marsprojekt" and other titles."
A few years ago scientist went absolutely ballistic when a rock from Mars was discovered in the Antarctic .. but you want me to read some work of fiction about men traveling to Mars by the master of fiction himself, Wehner von Braun? .. That is too funny.
Stray! Funny how these apollogists want us to read works by ardent NAZI's responsible for ripping off American taxpayers, as well as war crimes against humanity. Makes you wonder what kind of people guys like wspaceport find admirable!! It's sick brother!
SD02:"I kept waiting for him to mention their search for lunar meteorites, but all he said about finding rocks was from the excerpt I posted here. He claims that they discovered rocks among the glaciers, though he doesn't go into much detail about them..."
--Perhaps because you're reading too much into the events and creating your own conspiracy theories to fit your misguided beliefs.
The reason there isn't any details is because there was nothing there in the first place.
"We would know about any remotely controlled missions to the moon. Someone would have picked up the signal and thought "THE RUSSIANS ARE INVOLVED IN A SECRET MISSION ON THE MOON!" "
Are you kidding me? .. Not even Jodrell Bank would have picked up any signal from the Moon without prior knowledge of the misson and pointing data (tracking coordinates).
As for the rest of the "Moon rocks", which have never been studied, but only viewed under glass in NASA museums, they could have come from Hawaii, where they are quite common and also quite plentiful.
"As the race to the moon wore on, scientists pushed to add a scientific mission to the Apollo program. The astronauts didn't know much about geology, so they had training in New Mexico, Hawaii, and California, places geologists thought would be most like the moon."
No mention of them training in Antarctica with von Braun.
"You're too afraid, claiming you have a "business" to run."
I do have a busines to run and don't have the time to race off to Houston to look at fake Moon rocks under glass at NASA facilities.
"Squaw talk like brave on keyboard; afraid to face Big Chief."
Who's the big chief? .. I offered NASA brass Jim Oberg $10,000 on the Education Forum, to produce the proof that he had offered Ralph Rene' the same amount, but that lying coward didn't even have the guts to reply to my post.
SD02:"I do have a busines to run and don't have the time to race off to Houston to look at fake Moon rocks under glass at NASA"
--Once again, you've forfeited your right to have an opinion. Sorry, but that's the way it works in society.
You don't have time to check out real science but seem to have time to post here. You don't have time to read real earth science and biology or learn real history but have time for crackpot works on "faked moon landings."
--Nope. Mainstream USA comprised of normal, working, middle-class Americans.
SD02:All I can say to that crap is thank God you're not in control of the world, because you sound like a Nazi pig."
Well, thanks for trying, but I'm not a Socialist. I claim no political party and will decide on the merits of the issue, not whether its a Democrat or Republican idea.
You, however, come across as an anarchist bordering on Asperger's Syndrome.
You don't have time to check out real science but seem to have time to post here. You don't have time to read real earth science and biology or learn real history but have time for crackpot works on "faked moon landings." "
Once again you have proven that you know nothing about me.
SD02:"I offered...Jim Oberg $10,000...but that lying coward didn't even have the guts to reply."
--Because you're not worth the effort.
If you think I'm disrespecting you, you're right. I have no respect for people who are uninformed, get angry when someone contradicts them, but are too lazy to get informed, and too cowardly to face failure, criticism, and the possibility they might have to change their minds. You're not a good person. Nobody who is lazy and cowardly can be called "good."
No, it was because Jim Oberg was caught in his lie.. and if I'm really "not worth the effort", then why do you spend so much of your valuable time arguing with me on YouTube? .. I would think that a man of your "importance" would have better things to do with his very valuable time than waste it here with somone who's "not worth the effort".
SD02:"and if I'm really "not worth the effort", then why do you spend so much of your valuable time arguing with me on YouTube?"
--Because I enjoy having a good laugh at your expense at the end of my busy day. Seeing your outrageous postings and claims helps me unwind and sleep like a baby, knowing that the meek shall inherit the Earth while the rest of us (our future generations) will be going to the stars.
WS:"--Because I enjoy having a good laugh at your expense at the end of my busy day. Seeing your outrageous postings and claims helps me unwind and sleep like a baby, knowing that the meek shall inherit the Earth while the rest of us (our future generations) will be going to the stars."
I doubt you're laughing at my comments, which refute your nonsense here.. and the meek may inherit the Earth one day but no one will ever travel to the stars until the proper radiation shielding is invented.
WS: "If you think I'm disrespecting you, you're right. I have no respect for people who are uninformed, get angry when someone contradicts them, but are too lazy to get informed, and too cowardly to face failure, criticism, and the possibility they might have to change their minds. You're not a good person. Nobody who is lazy and cowardly can be called "good." "
1. You just described yourself.
2. You know nothing about me, excpet that didn't fall for the Apollo scam.
SD02"The same common basalt and breccia rocks can be found right here on Earth, in Hawaii and Antarctica .. No proof there."
--(Part 1) Except for one small detail: the complete absence of water-bearing minerals, and the total absence of alteration in the lunar rock.
Water is ubiquitous on earth - it's present in magma, rocks deep in the crust are changed by hot fluids, and rocks near the surface are altered by surface water. They're completely devoid in the lunar rocks and soil samples.
WS:"--(Part 1) Except for one small detail: the complete absence of water-bearing minerals, and the total absence of alteration in the lunar rock."
Would those be the Russian samples, collected by unmanned missions, or NASA's tiny fragments, which are farmed out to unsuspecting scientists, who are only allowed to study the little contaminated slivers that NASA sends out in envelopes?
Google; 'Moon Rocks: NASA's Dirty Little Secrets.'
--(Part 2) Olivine in particular is easily altered. In the lunar rocks, the olivine is fractured, but the fractures are absolutely clean. You simply do not see unaltered olivine in earth rocks.
This could not have been faked. These rocks have grains easily visible to the unaided eye, which means they cooled slowly. To have made these materials synthetically would have required keeping the rocks at 1100 C for years, cooling them slowly at thousands of pounds per square inch pressure.
WS:"This could not have been faked. These rocks have grains easily visible to the unaided eye, which means they cooled slowly. To have made these materials synthetically would have required keeping the rocks at 1100 C for years, cooling them slowly at thousands of pounds per square inch pressure."
Russia collected Moon rocks using three unmanned missions.. NASA could have gotten their's the same way..These could very well be the rocks that have been studied.
--(Part 3) It would have taken years to create the apparatus, years more to get the hang of making the materials, and then years more to create the final result.
Starting from Sputnik I in 1957, there would not have been enough time to do it by 1969.
And, you'd have to synthesize several different types of rock in hundred-pound lots. And, the results would have to be convincing. Tthe faked specimens would have to stand up to any kind of scrutiny that researchers might give them.
WS: "Starting from Sputnik I in 1957, there would not have been enough time to do it by 1969."
What does Sputnik have to do with Moon rocks?
von Braun collected Moon rocks in the Antarctic in 1967 .. The Apollo astronots "trained" in Hawaii in 1967 ... Moon rocks are made of besalt and breccia and so are the rocks from Hawaii.
Seems pretty obvious to me where most of the "Moon rocks" came from.
WS: "And, you'd have to synthesize several different types of rock in hundred-pound lots. And, the results would have to be convincing. Tthe faked specimens would have to stand up to any kind of scrutiny that researchers might give them."
But if the scientists are only allowed to study small slivers of rocks and sand, then how do we know if the unstudied larger rocks really came from the Moon?
Have any of the rocks ever contained any radioactive material?
SD02:"then how do we know if the unstudied larger rocks really came from the Moon?"
--The larger rocks have been studied and are continually being studied to this very day.
That's why I keep telling you to get off your duff, SUBMIT A SCIENTIFIC PROPOSAL and/or HIRE AN INDEPENDENT RESEARCHER that YOU would trust, LET YOUR ASSISTANT MANAGER HANDLE YOUR BUSINESS for a couple of days and GO DOWN TO HOUSTON and STUDY them to your heart's content.
WS:"--The larger rocks have been studied and are continually being studied to this very day."
That's not what I've read .. and even if a few of the larger rocks have been studied, Russia and America have pooled their rocks together.. Which means they could have been obtained using unmanned missions.
Have any of these alleged Moon rocks ever contained any signs of radiation?
SD02:"...these alleged Moon rocks... contained any signs of radiation?
"I could go on at great and boring length about QAPF diagrams, intergrown feldspars, oxygen-depleted micas and the like. But I won't.
If they had fallen as meteorites, the atmosphere would have oxidized them in a most obvious way. These rocks are genuine, and have spent the last 5 billion years or so in an oxygen-poor, radiation-bombarded environment (fusion trails...ask me later)."
WS: "If they had fallen as meteorites, the atmosphere would have oxidized them in a most obvious way. These rocks are genuine, and have spent the last 5 billion years or so in an oxygen-poor, radiation-bombarded environment (fusion trails...ask me later)."
--Callum MacAlister, Geologist "
Do you mean the genuine Russian rocks, or the Apollo Antarctica radiation dosed specials? .. LOL
--(Part 4) Whoever came up with the faked specimens would have to have devised a story of lunar evolution to fit the samples. The story would have to have checked out in every detail, for example rare-earth element abundances and evidence of meteor impact.
Why create absolutely water-free rocks? Nobody was expecting that - it would have been much easier to fake rocks with water in them (for one thing, you could use terrestrial rocks) and nobody would have been suspicious.
--(Part 5) You'd have to put in exactly the right amounts of radioactive elements and daughter products to get the rocks to date radiometrically at 4 billion years old - older than any rocks found here on Earth.
Additionally, you'd also have to anticipate the development of new dating methods which were not in use in 1969 and then make sure those elements are present in the correct abundance. It's not like adding carrots to a stew, either.
WS:"Additionally, you'd also have to anticipate the development of new dating methods which were not in use in 1969 and then make sure those elements are present in the correct abundance. It's not like adding carrots to a stew, either."
If the dating methods were not in use in 1969, then how did they date the Russian and American Moon rocks?
--(Part 6) To mimic the results of potassium-argon dating, you'd have to add inert argon gas and trap it just in the potassium-bearing minerals, and in exact proportion to the amount of potassium.
Then the story would have to stand up to scrutiny for decades -- even in the face of new research methods which were not in existence in 1969. For example, when lunar meteorites were discovered in Antarctica in the 1970s (after Apollo), they had to match the Apollo and Russian samples (they did).
WS: "Then the story would have to stand up to scrutiny for decades -- even in the face of new research methods which were not in existence in 1969. For example, when lunar meteorites were discovered in Antarctica in the 1970s (after Apollo), they had to match the Apollo and Russian samples (they did)."
First of all, you have this all backwards. The lunar meteorites were not discovered in the 70's. They were discovered and picked up by von Braun's geological team in 1967 (BEFORE Apollo).
SD02:"First of all, you have this all backwards. The lunar meteorites were not discovered in the 70's. They were discovered and picked up by von Braun's geological team in 1967 (BEFORE Apollo)."
It's a FACT that von Braun took a geological team to the Antarctic to search for Moon rocks.. He didn't go there to "train astronauts" and he didn't go there, in the middle of the Apollo Program, for a summer getaway vacation either.. He went there for one purpose only.. To collect lunar meteorites for Project Apollo.
--(Part 7) If you really believe NASA had the technical ability to pull all this off by "faking it", then actually going to the Moon in 1968-1972 was a piece of cake in comparison.
WS:"--(Part 7) If you really believe NASA had the technical ability to pull all this off by "faking it", then actually going to the Moon in 1968-1972 was a piece of cake in comparison."
zzzzzzz .. Now where have I heard that one before?
I bet you wouldn't be able to find your own ass, if NASA didn't show you where to look.
WS: "--No, but I've got a pretty good idea of where to find yours if I want to kick it, according to your police record."
Now, you're just gonna have to make up your mind here, Mr. W. Spaceport.. Am I the married man Duane, who's the manager of Applebee's, or the 18 year old Duane, who uses drugs and beats up his girlfriend?
SD02:"Now, you're just gonna have to make up your mind here... Am I the married man Duane, who's the manager of Applebee's, or the 18 year old Duane, who uses drugs and beats up his girlfriend?"
-- What difference does it make? Both characters' middle name is "Loser".
WS:" -- What difference does it make? Both characters' middle name is "Loser"."
I would have to agree with you about the Duane who does drugs and beats up his girlfriend, but the Duane who's manager of that resturant is probably a fine upstanding fellow.. Even if he doesn't have your very "important" job of acting like a complete idiot on YouTube, by insulting and ridiculing people you disagree with, and don't even know anything about, "Grand Loser".. Er, I mean "Grand Lunar". LOL
WS:"--Except they're all 501(c)3 nonprofit educational organizations, and I pay out of my own pocket for the priveledge of being associated with them."
It doesn't matter if they make a profit or not, they are still space organizations who all go along with the official version of Apollo and all follow the accepted status quo.
SD02:"It doesn't matter if they make a profit or not, they are still space organizations who all go along with the official version of Apollo and all follow the accepted status quo."
WS:"Well, of course they do -- because it did happen."
Well, millions of people, including some astronomers, scientists and physicists, believe otherwise.
Space organizations wouldn't dare question the validity of Apollo..If they did, they would loose all of their funding and then be shut down by the government.
SD02"Well, millions of people, including some astronomers, scientists and physicists, believe otherwise.
--Prove it by providing all their names and credentials -- not just the two that you alledge.
SD02:"Space organizations wouldn't dare question the validity of Apollo..If they did, they would loose all of their funding and then be shut down by the government."
--What part of non-profit 501c3 / 501c4educational space organizations (privately supported) don't you understand?
SD02:"Oh, then they're all closed minded, duped fools because of choice, not funding."
Wrong again, as always.
They're regular folks from cross-section of world society: Educators, students, professionals, doctors, stay-at-home soccer Moms, scientists and politicians, burger-flippers and lawyers -- just about anyone who believes in the visionary goals of opening the space frontier for the rest of society's advancement.
"They're regular folks from cross-section of world society: Educators, students, professionals, doctors, stay-at-home soccer Moms, scientists and politicians, burger-flippers and lawyers -- just about anyone who believes in the visionary goals of opening the space frontier for the rest of society's advancement."
Some things are definately worth repeating, don't you think WS?
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
SD02:"Some things are definately worth repeating, don't you think WS?
--You should know:
SD02:During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a field trip to Antarctica, organized for him and several other members of top NASA management...The goal of the field trip was to determine whether the experience gained by US scientific and technological community during the exploration of Antarctic wastelands would be useful for the manned exploration of space.."
Intrigued by exploration in space and on Earth, Dr. Von Braun participated in an expedition to Antarctica. This photo was made on or about January 7, 1967."
history . msfc . nasa . gov/vonbraun/photo/late-60s . html
"Remarkably well preserved in the ice of Antarctica scientists have found remnants of lunar rocks blasted off the Moon by meteoric impacts. Numerous expeditions have explored the continent looking for rock samples from the Moon, Mars and comets.
In 1967, two years before the Apollo mission, such a group visited Antarctica, including the ex-Nazi rocket scientist Wernher von Braun, by then working for NASA. Why a rocket scientist would be sent to look for rocks is a good question."
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material." ( I bet! LOL )
Author: Timothy Ministries
Publication Name: Wernher von Braun
Publish Date: Feb 12, 2008
base . google . com/base/a/1205030/D11396046382544199805
base . google . com/base/a/1205030/D11396046382544199805 "
--Sorry, No. This is nothing more than a line-by-line regurgitation (plagerism?) from Wikipedia, Internet Movie Database and numerous sources elsewhere repeating the same stuff.
You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. Come back when you're worthy.
"You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. Come back when you're worthy."
Using the typical PSYCHOLOGICAL PROJECTION will do you no good either, NASA SHILL.
I SUPPLIED THE PROOF FROM A SELF SERVING NASA SITE THAT VON BRAUN WENT TO THE ANTARCTIC TO COLLECT MOON ROCKS AND YOU HAVEN'T SUPPLIED ANY PROOF THAT HE WENT THERE TO TRAIN ASTRONAUTS.
IN MY BOOK, THAT MAKES YOU THE ONE "WEIGHED, MEASURED, AND FOUND WANTING"!
SD02:"I SUPPLIED THE PROOF FROM A SELF SERVING NASA SITE THAT VON BRAUN WENT TO THE ANTARCTIC TO COLLECT MOON ROCKS"
--Nope. You tried, but failed:
SD02:""Intrigued by exploration in space and on Earth, Dr. Von Braun participated in an expedition to Antarctica. This photo was made on or about January 7, 1967."
history . msfc . nasa . gov/vonbraun/photo/late-60s . html"
Name-calling and extensive use of capitalizion doesn't make your claims "proof" either.
Oh, great...yet another Conspiracy Theorist who starts off with the infamous (and yet to be proven to actually exist) "Una Ronald" and her magical Coke bottle.
Sorry, the claims of another Conspiracy Theorist on another Pseudoscience/Moon Hoax site is not valid proof.
NASA site that's peer reviewed by the Nat'l Academy of Sciences, Nat'l Science Foundation, American Academy for the Advancement of Science and the international scientific community.
vs.
Hoax Believer site created by scam/con artists and hustlers that's backed by other Conspiracy Theorists repeating the same claims despite being debunked ad nauseum by international science community.
Well, of course you are, seeing as you work for them! LOL
And in backing their sites, you have just admitted to agreeing with this...
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
Author: Timothy Ministries
Publication Name: WvBraun
Publish Date: Feb 12, 2008
base . google . com/base/a/1205030/D11396046382544199805
SD02:"Well, of course you are, seeing as you work for them! LOL"
--Really!?! I'm shocked, SHOCKED by that new, stunning disclosure. I must inform the IRS immediately that I'm actually on NASA's payroll.
And to think for the past five years my W-2s were all wrong and paychecks have been mistakenly direct-deposited into my checking and savings accounts by the Defense Finance & Accounting Service in Cleveland, OH
WS:"--Really!?! I'm shocked, SHOCKED by that new, stunning disclosure. I must inform the IRS immediately that I'm actually on NASA's payroll."
Retired Air Force/Defense Dept. is close enough .. Plus, you belonging to various space agencies and organizations, pretty much sums up your particular agenda here.
SD02""Remarkably well preserved in the ice of Antarctica scientists have found remnants of lunar rocks blasted off the Moon by meteoric impacts...
In 1967, two years before the Apollo mission, such a group visited Antarctica, including the ex-Nazi rocket scientist Wernher von Braun, by then working for NASA. Why a rocket scientist would be sent to look for rocks is a good question."
--Two separate events, 5-12 years apart (1967, 1972 or 1979. Sorry, implied claims, but still no proof.
WS:"--Two separate events, 5-12 years apart (1967, 1972 or 1979. Sorry, implied claims, but still no proof."
There's no need for this type of silly game.
I supplied the evidence yuo asked for, that von Braun went to the Antarctic to collect Moon rocks in 1967, and you haven't supplied anything but ridicule of the CT's and the typical NASA disinformation.
SD02:"There's no need for this type of silly game. I supplied the evidence yuo asked for, that von Braun went to the Antarctic to collect Moon rocks in 1967"
--No, you didn't. You supplied two paragraphs in conflict with each other, a WvB photo from a MSFC site, a CT site stating the same arguments and a Timothy Ministries site that copied from Wikipedia and other sources.
Besides, I never said WvB didn't go, only the reason why he went. Try again, and stay on topic to JW's subject line.
"Besides, I never said WvB didn't go, only the reason why he went. Try again, and stay on topic to JW's subject line."
Your claim was that WvB went to the Antarctic to train the Apollo astronauts. But you couldn't find any proof for that claim. I claimed that he went there to collect Moon rocks and then provided that proof.
The web sites are not in disagreement. It's just that most of them leave out the REAL REASON for his geological expedition to the Antarctic. TO GATHER LUNAR METEORITES!
SD02:"But you couldn't find any proof for that claim. I claimed that he went there to collect Moon rocks and then provided that proof."
--I told you; ya gotta wait 'til I go south to pull Erik Bergaust's von Braun Bio (He also wrote 'Murder on Pad 34')
SD02:"The web sites are not in disagreement. It's just that most of them leave out the REAL REASON for his geological expedition to the Antarctic. TO GATHER LUNAR METEORITES!"
--Again, you haven't produced any proof to back your claim.
WS:--Again, you haven't produced any proof to back your claim."
This IS the proof...
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
Where is your proof that von Braun's geological expedition was really to find a place to "train the Apollo astronauts"?
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
--Riight, using Wikipedia as your primary source once again.
And we all know how accurate and well-researched that site is, don't we?
SD02:"But the info about von Braun collecting Moon rocks in the Antarctic in 1967 didn't even come from Wikipedia."
--Then why did you source it as such four days ago? Do I have to go back and copy your entire message to remind you, since it's officially recorded in these posts, or are you all of a sudden going to deny doing such a thing and blame it on a conspiracy to discredit you?
WS:"--Then why did you source it as such four days ago?"
I didn't.
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
Author: Timothy Ministries
Publication Name: WvBraun
Publish Date: Feb 12, 2008
base . google . com/base/a/1205030/D11396046382544199805
"Do I have to go back and copy your entire message to remind you, since it's officially recorded in these posts, or are you all of a sudden going to deny doing such a thing and blame it on a conspiracy to discredit you?"
Since when is Timothy Ministries a Wikipedia site?
Maybe you should pay closer attention to what's posted here, instead of making a fool out of yourself every time I prove you wrong.
I also mentioned in original, earlier post that Timothy Ministries borrowed from other sources besides Wikipedia. Funny how you conveniently overlook that fact.
"Norwegian-born Erik Bergaust has had a bent for missiles since the age of twelve when he blew up his parents' apartment in an Oslo suburb with black powder rocket propellant. After serving in the Norwegian underground during World War II. Bergaust in 1946 became aviation editor of an Oslo newspaper."
THE APOLLO SPACE PROGRAM IS A HOAX OF ASTRONOMICAL PROPORTIONS!!! HEHE
tenthousandyearsgoon 3 weeks ago
The first Jarrah video I ever saw!! I thought he was Bart Sibrel and I was like, "Wow. Sibrel sounds different here." HAHHAHHAA
yesiamawizardjonny 5 months ago
No, going to the moon and not taking photos of stars is not like making a doco on NY firefighters and ignoring a massive terrorist attack, it is stupid to even liken the too events.
The moon landings were time critical events, where there were limited opportunities to get things done like collect moon rocks etc, taking photos of things we can already take photos of from earth is utterly pointless given the context of the mission.
rbowden123 1 year ago
@rbowden123 there were NO moon landings
2nasafakedit 1 year ago
@rbowden123
"The moon landings were time critical events"
LMFAO!!! So time critical they had time to whack around a few golf balls and chuck around a hammer. But fuck taking pictures of what should have been an awesome sight overhead. But of course the only things overhead were some puppeteers and maybe a roof.
Six supposed landings on the moon & no time for a picture of the lunar sky?
watch?v=xyjppxh2-C0
Neil Armstrong's reaction says it all.
jelinto 1 year ago
@jelinto
that nails the coffin!
but i believe the moon missions were real. only that no photograph is possible from the moon since films can't be taken beyond van allen belts, or through it. it maybe that the videos and photos from the moon missions were badly exposed or were even destroyed during the flight. new videos and photos were staged to account for the taxpayer money and to garner public and senate support.
zambi007i 9 months ago
we are at the start, millionaire's paying to go to space, soon we will know the truth,in a vew years
SpectralForm 2 years ago
The only 100% sure way to find out about the Moon Landing is to go see the multitude of objects that were allegedly left on the moon, with remote controlled cameras mounted on space shuttles, and all this done by someone with no conflict of interest or desire to see something else than the truth...
And of course, this should be done by someone not linked to NASA in any way, and keep every possible aspect of it 100% transparent to everyone on Earth...
That should do the job...
Simboiss 2 years ago
Hmmm... which is it, NASA?
antwrp.gsfc.nasa*gov/apod/ap070621.html
nasascam 2 years ago
Ok, the all-time silliest moon hoax analogy is uttered here @ 7:00 - "what they were, and were not there to do is irrelevant(?), it would be like going to Manhattan to do a documentary about the FDNY and ignoring a big plane hitting a bldg (i.e. the WTC on 9/11) to continue your documentary"
The analogy to J.W.s analogy would be if they went to the moon to do a documentary and ignored the Command Module crashing nearby to continue their documentary.
Boy, were hyping them stars aint we?
TinaFeyForVP2008 2 years ago
One problem Tina. The WTC would have been hit 9 times and still ignored.
nasascam 2 years ago
The point is that Amstrong asked in an interview after the first Apollo mission if he saw any stars? He didn't see any stars he said and was swiftly backed up by his colleage saying "I can't remeber seeing any stars" ?????? duh!
YouriCarma 2 years ago
This hoax claim is wrong from the start. Apollo astronauts DID take pictures of stars, including pictures of the Earth with stars in the background The Apollo 16 crew used an ultraviolet camera system to take photos of stars that would be impossible on Earth due to the atmosphere blocking UV light. Analysis of these photos proves that they were taken on the moon, because the constellation alignment matches what would have been visible from the vantage point of the moon's surface at the time.
jamesbooty 2 years ago
The UV photos are discussed in Part 2. Hubble and Gemini took UV photos from earth orbit, without any effect from the geo-corona. Further, propagandists hype that the star positions on the moon are the same as those taken from earth orbit.
WhiteJarrah 2 years ago
Pictures of stars are easy to get without going to the moon, so it's logical that Apollo pictures would focus on the moon itself. Star positions were well known, so NASA could easily have faked stars in all of their moon pictures. Therefore, it defies logic that they would create difficult forgeries of UV star pictures, but not fake stars in the other pictures. The Apollo16 photos could have been taken on the moon, so these pictures don't provide any evidence of the moon landings being faked.
jamesbooty 2 years ago
@WhiteJarrah
Are you really bill kacing grand-son ?
meelusine 7 months ago in playlist The MoonFaker Series
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@WhiteJarrah THE APOLLO SPACE PROGRAM IS A HOAX OF ASTRONOMICAL PROPORTIONS!!!
tenthousandyearsgoon 3 weeks ago
If the cameras were set to take star images, i.e. wider apature & slower shutter speed, they would then need to set the cameara upon a tripod or similar to keep it steady.
davewatcher 2 years ago
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That's right, they had tripods...
Simboiss 2 years ago
Great post Jarrah; Also 9/11 footage is also questionable. A documentary titled: September Clues highlights the mistakes in the media footage of what they said happened on 9/11. (This reminds me of your work in regards to Apollo)
foxxx2001 3 years ago
The biggest moving force during the Apollo Program was von Braun, for obvious reasons.. As for Dr. Van Allen, he NEVER refuted his original claims about the extreme radiation dangers of the belts and he was also dead set AGAINST manned space flight until the day he died.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"The biggest moving force during the Apollo Program was von Braun, for obvious reasons."
--von Braun and his Huntsville team certainly had a key role in Apollo's success, but there were others just as equally important.
wspaceport 3 years ago
SD02:"As for Dr. Van Allen, he NEVER refuted his original claims about the extreme radiation dangers of the belts."
--Riiight...
"The recent Fox TV show, which I saw, is an ingenious and entertaining assemblage of nonsense. The claim that radiation exposure during the Apollo missions would have been fatal to the astronauts is only one example of such nonsense."
-- Dr. James Van Allen
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:" "The recent Fox TV show, which I saw, is an ingenious and entertaining assemblage of nonsense. The claim that radiation exposure during the Apollo missions would have been fatal to the astronauts is only one example of such nonsense."
-- Dr. James Van Allen"
Which only proves what lies some of the top team players have to promote for "national security" purposes.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"and he was also dead set AGAINST manned space flight until the day he died.
--Irrelevant to this argument, certainly not because of the radiation dangers as you and other CTers suggest, but because of costs between manned vs. unmanned spaceflight.
Fortunately, space is very big, so there's room for a proper balance between the two with unmanned serving as the pathfinders for the eventual permanent human presence that will follow (and if not U.S., other nations taking advantage will).
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "--Irrelevant to this argument, certainly not because of the radiation dangers as you and other CTers suggest, but because of costs between manned vs. unmanned spaceflight."
NASA's lies and your excuses don't work anymore, now that the truth about the extreme dangers of space radiation is known.
Lunarcy: NASA's Radiation Problem 4.5
watch?v=dFiIR7hA1rM
straydog02 3 years ago
The more people like spaceport avoid the truth about the deadly nature of space radiation, the more they show their ignorance, and the more obvious it is to not pay attention to them. Of course you'll always have your patriotic numbskulls that go around waving their flags and believing God is going to deliver them from the evil of the world. That how they won't have to get off their asses, educate themselves, and throw the bums out of Congress, and take back their country!!!
un4g1v3n1 3 years ago
WS: "Besides, all you CTs and Moon Hoaxers are so wrapped up on the wrong individuals -- von Braun and Van Allen -- you've unwittingly provided the proof the moon landings did occur as history recorded it by ignoring the real moving force and key individuals behind the success of Apollo."
Bravo!.. Spoken like a true NASA shill.. Say a lot, while saying nothing .. Which indivuduals would that "moving force" be exactly?
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Which indivuduals would that "moving force" be exactly?"
-- If you don't know, I'm certainly not going to help you. Figure it out on your own, Bub, they're hiding in plain sight.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"-- If you don't know, I'm certainly not going to help you. Figure it out on your own, Bub, they're hiding in plain sight."
Funny you should use that expression, as "hiding in plain sight" is one of the most successful tactics used by those who have committed monumental crimes.
In fact, it's very similar to; "The bigger the lie, the more people will believe it".
straydog02 3 years ago
yeah i believe hitler said that...... which lmao makes perfect sense with the moon landing
BlutoDaBoss21 3 years ago
You compare seeing stars from the moon with seeing a plane hit the WTC. You then make the suggestion the the astronauts shouldn't have photographed themselves and the lunar activities but focused on photographing the stars in the same way that the documentart makers focused on the events of 911. You are clearly not as smart as you like to think you are...
stagga76 3 years ago
*documentary
stagga76 3 years ago
Hey wspaceport google this: FUCK YOU!!! Take your nazi DOD and shove it up your pedo ass!
FORCETHETRUTH 3 years ago
The eloquence of your insult is underwhelming.
However, your ignorance knows no boundries by having to resort to tasteless language in a public forum.
The nicest thing I can say about you is that you're unbearable, and what you seem to lack in intelligence, you make up in stupidity.
wspaceport 3 years ago
Gee, what a strange thing for NASA's top Nazi rocket scientist to do in the middle of a 30 billion dollar space race to the Moon!
Go looking for Moon rocks in the freezing cold Antarctic, when all he had to do was to go grab them in Hawaii, the home of basalt and breccia "Moon" rocks!
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Gee, what a strange thing for NASA's top Nazi rocket scientist to do in the middle of a 30 billion dollar space race to the Moon!"
--Dr. von Braun also went scuba diving in the middle of his Apollo program. Are you going to suggest he was looking for Atlantis as well?
Military & Civil Service get 30 days leave. I'm sure hundreds of thousands took it in the middle of Vietnam as well as Apollo. Why should von Braun be any different -- or were you expecting him to work 24/7/365?
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Dr. von Braun also went scuba diving in the middle of his Apollo program. Are you going to suggest he was looking for Atlantis as well?"
If he thought Atlantis might have something he could pass off as coming from the Moon, I have no doubt he would have donned scuba gear, instead of snow shoes , and chosen his "vacation" spot there.
straydog02 3 years ago
WS: "Military & Civil Service get 30 days leave. I'm sure hundreds of thousands took it in the middle of Vietnam as well as Apollo. Why should von Braun be any different -- or were you expecting him to work 24/7/365?"
Right in the middle of conducting a 30 billion American tax payer dollar space race against the "evil" Russians, I would think he would at least not trot off for two months to Antarctica or Atlantis!.. Especially when trying to meet JFK's "end of the decade" race to the Moon!
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Right in the middle of conducting a 30 billion American tax payer dollar space race against the "evil" Russians, I would think he would at least not trot off for two months to Antarctica..."
--Once again, your fact checking and research is proved wrong. Shall I publicly embarrass you with pgs 354-358 of Erik Bergaust's biography of Wernher von Braun that specifically covers the 1967 Antarctica expedition (also covered in Popular Science, Vol. 190, No. 5, May 1967, pgs. 114-116 & 200)?
wspaceport 3 years ago
"--Once again, your fact checking and research is proved wrong. Shall I publicly embarrass you with pgs 354-358 of Erik Bergaust's biography of Wernher von Braun that specifically covers the 1967 Antarctica expedition .. "
I won't be embarrassed by what is written in his book. People can write anything they choose to. It doesn't necessarily mean it's true, especially if they have a particular agenda or are pals with NASA.
Go ahead and post the info. I'm curious to see what has to say.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"People can write anything they choose to. It doesn't necessarily mean it's true, especially if they have a particular agenda or are pals with NASA."
--Interesting, since this is the very same author who wrote a blistering report against NASA and North American Aviation, builders of the CM-012 (Apollo 1) spacecraft and the subsequent fire and death of the crew in his book entitled "Murder on Pad 34."
Doesn't sound like someone who endeared himself to NASA.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"..Doesn't sound like someone who endeared himself to NASA."
No, it sure doesn't.. Which makes me wonder why you're posting this information here, MRdefensedept?
Hey, you're not a double agent are you?
LOL
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"People can write anything they choose to. It doesn't necessarily mean it's true, especially if they have a particular agenda"
--Funny, you perfectly described self-proclaimed "author" Bill Kaysing and cabinetmaker cum self-taught "engineer", self-published "author" and gashole Ralph Rene -- both of whom were/are grey-haired kooks/village idiots soundly debunked by others of reasonable intelligence elsewhere years ago.
Are these the type of people you want to be associated with?
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "--Funny, you perfectly described self-proclaimed "author" Bill Kaysing and cabinetmaker cum self-taught "engineer", self-published "author" and gashole Ralph Rene -- both of whom were/are grey-haired kooks/village idiots soundly debunked by others of reasonable intelligence elsewhere years ago."
I also perfectly described the losers who write bogus biographies about the Apollo astronots, including their alleged Moon trip fantasies.
straydog02 3 years ago
WS: "Are these the type of people you want to be associated with?"
Better to be associated with truth seekers and conspiracy researchers, than those who lie for NASA.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Go ahead and post the info. I'm curious to see what has to say."
--Too much to retype here, well beyond YouTube's 500 character limit and off-topic to this subject about not seeing/photographing stars on the moon.
Go to your local Library (or Amazon. com) and look up "Wernher von Braun: The authoritative and definitive biographical profile of the father of modern space flight" by Erik Bergaust
You're a "big businessman"; you can afford to shell out $10.74 for an out of print copy.
wspaceport 3 years ago
Ws: "You're a "big businessman"; you can afford to shell out $10.74 for an out of print copy."
Only $10.47 for an out of print copy? .. That really is a bargain!
How about send me the relative quote about von Braun's Moon rock collecting expedition to my PM box? .. That is if you are capable of retyping text exceding 500 characters.
I recently typed thousands of characters to an Apollo defender's PM box, to show him the error of his ways about Apollo 11 not being tracked to the Moon.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"How about send me the relative quote about von Braun's Moon rock collecting expedition to my PM box? .. That is if you are capable of retyping text exceding 500 characters."
--If you're capable of sitting long enough to read through four pages of transcribed text, they're in your PM.
Nowhere is there any proof von Braun went to Antarctica for anything other than research for Apollo.
The rock "claims" are nothing more than the debunked rantings of Bill Kaysing and Ralph Rene.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "Nowhere is there any proof von Braun went to Antarctica for anything other than research for Apollo."
That's an outright LIE.. I have already posted the evidence here that proved he went to the Antarctic to search for "lunar metorites", in 1967.
straydog02 3 years ago
WS: "The rock "claims" are nothing more than the debunked rantings of Bill Kaysing and Ralph Rene."
The rock "claims" are on respected sites, similar to Wikipedia.. We've already been through this before where I proved you wrong and provided evidence that von Braun took a geological team to the Antarctic to search for "lunar meteroites", and NOT to "train the Apollo astronots".
straydog02 3 years ago
WS: "--If you're capable of sitting long enough to read through four pages of transcribed text, they're in your PM."
I am .. and thank you for sending the pages.. I will read them tonight and let you know what I think.
straydog02 3 years ago
"Go looking for Moon rocks in the freezing cold Antarctic, when all he had to do was to go grab them in Hawaii, the home of basalt and breccia "Moon" rocks!"
I never got something with the whole theory that Von Braun went to Antarctica to find moon rocks.
1 - Antarctica wouldn't be the first place I'd go for rocks
2 - 30 moon rocks have been found on earth, yet somehow Von Braun managed to find a much larger collection than that
3 - How did he know what was a moon rock?
zakabog 3 years ago
"1 - Antarctica wouldn't be the first place I'd go for rocks."
Why not? ..It is still one of the best places to find lunar meterorites.
" 2- 30 moon rocks have been found on earth, yet somehow Von Braun managed to find a much larger collection than that."
Only 30 Moon rocks have been found according to whom? .. NASA? .. LOL
"3-How did he know what was a moon rock?"
How did anyone know what was a Mar's rock?
straydog02 3 years ago
"Why not? ..It is still one of the best places to find lunar meterorites."
We only know that NOW. You think in 1960 they thought "I need rocks, I know lets go to that place covered in snow and ice!"
"Only 30 Moon rocks have been found according to whom? .. NASA? .. LOL "
According to geologists around the world that studied tons of meteorites.
"How did anyone know what was a Mar's rock?"
They brought some back from Mars and used that to compare.
zakabog 3 years ago
"We only know that NOW. You think in 1960 they thought "I need rocks, I know lets go to that place covered in snow and ice!" "
von Braun's trip took place in 1967, two years before Apollo 11 allegedly went to the Moon .. So yes, the rocks would have been very much needed.
"They brought some back from Mars and used that to compare."
Using UNMANNED missions .. Thanks for proving my point .. How many unmanned missions did NASA launch to the Moon ( that we know about ) before Apollo 11?
straydog02 3 years ago
"von Braun's trip took place in 1967, two years before Apollo 11 allegedly went to the Moon .. So yes, the rocks would have been very much needed."
I don't think you get my point. Let's say you needed 150lbs of rocks. Would you plan an expedition to a place covered in ice and snow, or as you said before, just go to Hawaii?
"How many unmanned missions did NASA launch to the Moon ( that we know about ) before Apollo 11?"
That brought back rocks? None, the Russians did it first.
zakabog 3 years ago
"I don't think you get my point. Let's say you needed 150lbs of rocks. Would you plan an expedition to a place covered in ice and snow, or as you said before, just go to Hawaii?"
No, I got your point.. but I wasn't very clear about mine .. Being a Nazi, there were more reasons for von Braun's team to explore the Antarctic, besides gathering Moon rocks for the Apollo Program.
Look up Nazi secret saucer technology and their expeditions to the Antarctic.
straydog02 3 years ago
"Look up Nazi secret saucer technology and their expeditions to the Antarctic."
I'm not even going there.
"None that we know about, anyway."
We would know about any remotely controlled missions to the moon. Someone would have picked up the signal and thought "THE RUSSIANS ARE INVOLVED IN A SECRET MISSION ON THE MOON!"
zakabog 3 years ago
"I'm not even going there"
Of course you're not .. Why bring even more attention to the fact that von Braun was a Nazi who was most likely involved in Nazi secret weapons development and top secret space flight technology.
straydog02 3 years ago
straydog02:"Look up Nazi secret saucer technology and their expeditions to the Antarctic."
zakabog:"I'm not even going there"
straydog02" Of course you're not .. Why bring even more attention to the fact that von Braun was a Nazi who was most likely involved in Nazi secret weapons development and top secret space flight technology.
--OK, I'll bite.
The question has been often asked whether Wernher von Braun was a member of the Nazi Party -- or a Nazi at heart; Two big differences.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--OK, I'll bite.
The question has been often asked whether Wernher von Braun was a member of the Nazi Party -- or a Nazi at heart; Two big differences."
I don't see any difference at all .. A Nazi is a Nazi, whether they don a uniform or not.. von Braun worked for the Nazi party as one of their top scientists who developed rockets that could deliver weapons of mass destruction .. That makes him a Nazi war criminal.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"I don't see any difference at all .. A Nazi is a Nazi, whether they don a uniform or not...That makes him a Nazi war criminal."
--Good thing you're not a juror in any courtroom. You're forgetting the Nazis were originally a political party, not unlike Democrats or Republicans today.
Stay on-topic with the subject ("Dude where's my Stars?") by moving the von Braun discussion over to these appropriate, multi-part YouTube sites:
watch?v=OqmlDqiHYWU
watch?v=6_9_KFIZpMs
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Good thing you're not a juror in any courtroom. You're forgetting the Nazis were originally a political party, not unlike Democrats or Republicans today."
The Republican fascists in power today are no different from Nazis.. So what's your point?
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"The Republican fascists in power today are no different from Nazis.. So what's your point?"
--Just as there are some good Republicans & Democrats, there were "good Nazis" too.
Oskar Schindler is but one example. Franz Stigler is another.
And more than a million ballots cast by industry professionals from 108 countries unveiled at the 2003 Paris Air Show ranked von Braun above all other space figures ("Top 100 Stars of Aerospace") and #2 overall behind the Wright Brothers.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Just as there are some good Republicans & Democrats, there were "good Nazis" too."
There is no such thing as a "good Nazi".. and lately there aren't too many good republicans left either .. The 'Grand Old Party' has become a neo con agenda that has destroyed American democracy, the US economy and has broken the US military .. Too bad the Democratic congress didn't have the guts to impeach the fascist bastards who have done nothing but damage this Nation in every way possible.
straydog02 3 years ago
WS:" Stay on-topic with the subject ("Dude where's my Stars?") by moving the von Braun discussion over to these appropriate, multi-part YouTube sites:"
Thanks, but I will discuss what I want, where I want .. I don't think Jarrah minds a bit.
straydog02 3 years ago
WS.. Thanks very much for the pages from Erik Bergaust's book about von Braun's trip to the Antarctic. I kept waiting for him to mention their search for lunar meteorites, but all he said about finding rocks was from the excerpt I posted here. He claims that they discovered rocks among the glaciers, though he doesn't go into much detail about them, except von Braun's remark about it being "THE IDEAL SETTING TO ATTEMPT DETECTION OF TRACES OF LIFE ON OTHER PLANETS".
Moon rocks anybody?
straydog02 3 years ago
Excerpt from the book about vB's trip.
Less than 100 miles from McMurdo and the Royal Society Range are Antarctica's "dry valleys," formerly covered by glaciers. Due to reduced snowfall in recent centuries, the glaciers have receded and exposed virgin expanses of rock and pebble-strewn earth. Life, in the form of organisms, carried by the wind and bird droppings, is just finding foothold. "Here," von Braun wrote, "is an ideal setting to attempt detection of traces of life on other planets."
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:""Here," von Braun wrote, "is an ideal setting to attempt detection of traces of life on other planets."
--Except, by "other planets" von Braun is referring to Mars, not the moon.
Besides, all you CTs and Moon Hoaxers are so wrapped up on the wrong individuals -- von Braun and Van Allen -- you've unwittingly provided the proof the moon landings did occur as history recorded it by ignoring the real moving force and key individuals behind the success of Apollo.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Except, by "other planets" von Braun is referring to Mars, not the moon."
How do you know that? .. Mars wasn't even mentioned in that text.. and Moon meteorites were found in the Antarctic much earlier than Mars meteorites were.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"How do you know that? .. Mars wasn't even mentioned in that text.. and Moon meteorites were found in the Antarctic much earlier than Mars meteorites were."
--Read von Braun's earlier published works, like 1953's "Das Marsprojekt" and other titles.
They're called "books." You can find them in a place called a "Library."
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:" --Read von Braun's earlier published works, like 1953's "Das Marsprojekt" and other titles."
A few years ago scientist went absolutely ballistic when a rock from Mars was discovered in the Antarctic .. but you want me to read some work of fiction about men traveling to Mars by the master of fiction himself, Wehner von Braun? .. That is too funny.
straydog02 3 years ago
Stray! Funny how these apollogists want us to read works by ardent NAZI's responsible for ripping off American taxpayers, as well as war crimes against humanity. Makes you wonder what kind of people guys like wspaceport find admirable!! It's sick brother!
un4g1v3n1 3 years ago
SD02:"I kept waiting for him to mention their search for lunar meteorites, but all he said about finding rocks was from the excerpt I posted here. He claims that they discovered rocks among the glaciers, though he doesn't go into much detail about them..."
--Perhaps because you're reading too much into the events and creating your own conspiracy theories to fit your misguided beliefs.
The reason there isn't any details is because there was nothing there in the first place.
wspaceport 3 years ago
"We would know about any remotely controlled missions to the moon. Someone would have picked up the signal and thought "THE RUSSIANS ARE INVOLVED IN A SECRET MISSION ON THE MOON!" "
Are you kidding me? .. Not even Jodrell Bank would have picked up any signal from the Moon without prior knowledge of the misson and pointing data (tracking coordinates).
straydog02 3 years ago
"That brought back rocks? None, the Russians did it first."
None that we know about, anyway.
straydog02 3 years ago
As for the rest of the "Moon rocks", which have never been studied, but only viewed under glass in NASA museums, they could have come from Hawaii, where they are quite common and also quite plentiful.
straydog02 3 years ago
Look what else you lied about WS.
"As the race to the moon wore on, scientists pushed to add a scientific mission to the Apollo program. The astronauts didn't know much about geology, so they had training in New Mexico, Hawaii, and California, places geologists thought would be most like the moon."
No mention of them training in Antarctica with von Braun.
straydog02 3 years ago
"You're too afraid, claiming you have a "business" to run."
I do have a busines to run and don't have the time to race off to Houston to look at fake Moon rocks under glass at NASA facilities.
"Squaw talk like brave on keyboard; afraid to face Big Chief."
Who's the big chief? .. I offered NASA brass Jim Oberg $10,000 on the Education Forum, to produce the proof that he had offered Ralph Rene' the same amount, but that lying coward didn't even have the guts to reply to my post.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"I do have a busines to run and don't have the time to race off to Houston to look at fake Moon rocks under glass at NASA"
--Once again, you've forfeited your right to have an opinion. Sorry, but that's the way it works in society.
You don't have time to check out real science but seem to have time to post here. You don't have time to read real earth science and biology or learn real history but have time for crackpot works on "faked moon landings."
I have no respect for you.
wspaceport 3 years ago
Ws:"--Once again, you've forfeited your right to have an opinion. Sorry, but that's the way it works in society."
Who's society ? .. The Defense Dept?
All I can say to that crap is thank God you're not in control of the world, because you sound like a Nazi pig.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Who's society ? .. The Defense Dept?"
--Nope. Mainstream USA comprised of normal, working, middle-class Americans.
SD02:All I can say to that crap is thank God you're not in control of the world, because you sound like a Nazi pig."
Well, thanks for trying, but I'm not a Socialist. I claim no political party and will decide on the merits of the issue, not whether its a Democrat or Republican idea.
You, however, come across as an anarchist bordering on Asperger's Syndrome.
wspaceport 3 years ago
You don't have time to check out real science but seem to have time to post here. You don't have time to read real earth science and biology or learn real history but have time for crackpot works on "faked moon landings." "
Once again you have proven that you know nothing about me.
"I have no respect for you."
Then that makes us even.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"I offered...Jim Oberg $10,000...but that lying coward didn't even have the guts to reply."
--Because you're not worth the effort.
If you think I'm disrespecting you, you're right. I have no respect for people who are uninformed, get angry when someone contradicts them, but are too lazy to get informed, and too cowardly to face failure, criticism, and the possibility they might have to change their minds. You're not a good person. Nobody who is lazy and cowardly can be called "good."
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Because you're not worth the effort."
No, it was because Jim Oberg was caught in his lie.. and if I'm really "not worth the effort", then why do you spend so much of your valuable time arguing with me on YouTube? .. I would think that a man of your "importance" would have better things to do with his very valuable time than waste it here with somone who's "not worth the effort".
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"and if I'm really "not worth the effort", then why do you spend so much of your valuable time arguing with me on YouTube?"
--Because I enjoy having a good laugh at your expense at the end of my busy day. Seeing your outrageous postings and claims helps me unwind and sleep like a baby, knowing that the meek shall inherit the Earth while the rest of us (our future generations) will be going to the stars.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Because I enjoy having a good laugh at your expense at the end of my busy day. Seeing your outrageous postings and claims helps me unwind and sleep like a baby, knowing that the meek shall inherit the Earth while the rest of us (our future generations) will be going to the stars."
I doubt you're laughing at my comments, which refute your nonsense here.. and the meek may inherit the Earth one day but no one will ever travel to the stars until the proper radiation shielding is invented.
straydog02 3 years ago
WS: "If you think I'm disrespecting you, you're right. I have no respect for people who are uninformed, get angry when someone contradicts them, but are too lazy to get informed, and too cowardly to face failure, criticism, and the possibility they might have to change their minds. You're not a good person. Nobody who is lazy and cowardly can be called "good." "
1. You just described yourself.
2. You know nothing about me, excpet that didn't fall for the Apollo scam.
Get over it.
straydog02 3 years ago
We went...
We landed...
We came back...
The proof is in the rocks and documented evidence...
Our main enemy and rival superpower at the time (CCCP) acknowledged it...
Get over it.
wspaceport 3 years ago
"We went...
We landed...
We came back...
The proof is in the rocks and documented evidence..."
We came..We saw ..We conqured.. (You are soooo origonal) LOL
The same common basalt and breccia rocks can be found right here on Earth, in Hawaii and Antarctica .. No proof there.
Get over it.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02"The same common basalt and breccia rocks can be found right here on Earth, in Hawaii and Antarctica .. No proof there."
--(Part 1) Except for one small detail: the complete absence of water-bearing minerals, and the total absence of alteration in the lunar rock.
Water is ubiquitous on earth - it's present in magma, rocks deep in the crust are changed by hot fluids, and rocks near the surface are altered by surface water. They're completely devoid in the lunar rocks and soil samples.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--(Part 1) Except for one small detail: the complete absence of water-bearing minerals, and the total absence of alteration in the lunar rock."
Would those be the Russian samples, collected by unmanned missions, or NASA's tiny fragments, which are farmed out to unsuspecting scientists, who are only allowed to study the little contaminated slivers that NASA sends out in envelopes?
Google; 'Moon Rocks: NASA's Dirty Little Secrets.'
straydog02 3 years ago
--(Part 2) Olivine in particular is easily altered. In the lunar rocks, the olivine is fractured, but the fractures are absolutely clean. You simply do not see unaltered olivine in earth rocks.
This could not have been faked. These rocks have grains easily visible to the unaided eye, which means they cooled slowly. To have made these materials synthetically would have required keeping the rocks at 1100 C for years, cooling them slowly at thousands of pounds per square inch pressure.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"This could not have been faked. These rocks have grains easily visible to the unaided eye, which means they cooled slowly. To have made these materials synthetically would have required keeping the rocks at 1100 C for years, cooling them slowly at thousands of pounds per square inch pressure."
Russia collected Moon rocks using three unmanned missions.. NASA could have gotten their's the same way..These could very well be the rocks that have been studied.
straydog02 3 years ago
--(Part 3) It would have taken years to create the apparatus, years more to get the hang of making the materials, and then years more to create the final result.
Starting from Sputnik I in 1957, there would not have been enough time to do it by 1969.
And, you'd have to synthesize several different types of rock in hundred-pound lots. And, the results would have to be convincing. Tthe faked specimens would have to stand up to any kind of scrutiny that researchers might give them.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "Starting from Sputnik I in 1957, there would not have been enough time to do it by 1969."
What does Sputnik have to do with Moon rocks?
von Braun collected Moon rocks in the Antarctic in 1967 .. The Apollo astronots "trained" in Hawaii in 1967 ... Moon rocks are made of besalt and breccia and so are the rocks from Hawaii.
Seems pretty obvious to me where most of the "Moon rocks" came from.
straydog02 3 years ago
WS: "And, you'd have to synthesize several different types of rock in hundred-pound lots. And, the results would have to be convincing. Tthe faked specimens would have to stand up to any kind of scrutiny that researchers might give them."
But if the scientists are only allowed to study small slivers of rocks and sand, then how do we know if the unstudied larger rocks really came from the Moon?
Have any of the rocks ever contained any radioactive material?
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"then how do we know if the unstudied larger rocks really came from the Moon?"
--The larger rocks have been studied and are continually being studied to this very day.
That's why I keep telling you to get off your duff, SUBMIT A SCIENTIFIC PROPOSAL and/or HIRE AN INDEPENDENT RESEARCHER that YOU would trust, LET YOUR ASSISTANT MANAGER HANDLE YOUR BUSINESS for a couple of days and GO DOWN TO HOUSTON and STUDY them to your heart's content.
What part of that don't you understand?
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--The larger rocks have been studied and are continually being studied to this very day."
That's not what I've read .. and even if a few of the larger rocks have been studied, Russia and America have pooled their rocks together.. Which means they could have been obtained using unmanned missions.
Have any of these alleged Moon rocks ever contained any signs of radiation?
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"...these alleged Moon rocks... contained any signs of radiation?
"I could go on at great and boring length about QAPF diagrams, intergrown feldspars, oxygen-depleted micas and the like. But I won't.
If they had fallen as meteorites, the atmosphere would have oxidized them in a most obvious way. These rocks are genuine, and have spent the last 5 billion years or so in an oxygen-poor, radiation-bombarded environment (fusion trails...ask me later)."
--Callum MacAlister, Geologist
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "I could go on at great and boring length about QAPF diagrams, intergrown feldspars, oxygen-depleted micas and the like. But I won't."
Was that a yes or a no to the question about the rocks containing any radiation?
straydog02 3 years ago
WS: "If they had fallen as meteorites, the atmosphere would have oxidized them in a most obvious way. These rocks are genuine, and have spent the last 5 billion years or so in an oxygen-poor, radiation-bombarded environment (fusion trails...ask me later)."
--Callum MacAlister, Geologist "
Do you mean the genuine Russian rocks, or the Apollo Antarctica radiation dosed specials? .. LOL
straydog02 3 years ago
--(Part 4) Whoever came up with the faked specimens would have to have devised a story of lunar evolution to fit the samples. The story would have to have checked out in every detail, for example rare-earth element abundances and evidence of meteor impact.
Why create absolutely water-free rocks? Nobody was expecting that - it would have been much easier to fake rocks with water in them (for one thing, you could use terrestrial rocks) and nobody would have been suspicious.
wspaceport 3 years ago
--(Part 5) You'd have to put in exactly the right amounts of radioactive elements and daughter products to get the rocks to date radiometrically at 4 billion years old - older than any rocks found here on Earth.
Additionally, you'd also have to anticipate the development of new dating methods which were not in use in 1969 and then make sure those elements are present in the correct abundance. It's not like adding carrots to a stew, either.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"Additionally, you'd also have to anticipate the development of new dating methods which were not in use in 1969 and then make sure those elements are present in the correct abundance. It's not like adding carrots to a stew, either."
If the dating methods were not in use in 1969, then how did they date the Russian and American Moon rocks?
straydog02 3 years ago
--(Part 6) To mimic the results of potassium-argon dating, you'd have to add inert argon gas and trap it just in the potassium-bearing minerals, and in exact proportion to the amount of potassium.
Then the story would have to stand up to scrutiny for decades -- even in the face of new research methods which were not in existence in 1969. For example, when lunar meteorites were discovered in Antarctica in the 1970s (after Apollo), they had to match the Apollo and Russian samples (they did).
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "Then the story would have to stand up to scrutiny for decades -- even in the face of new research methods which were not in existence in 1969. For example, when lunar meteorites were discovered in Antarctica in the 1970s (after Apollo), they had to match the Apollo and Russian samples (they did)."
First of all, you have this all backwards. The lunar meteorites were not discovered in the 70's. They were discovered and picked up by von Braun's geological team in 1967 (BEFORE Apollo).
straydog02 3 years ago
Second of all, of course they matched the Apollo samples, because the Apollo samples came from Antarctia.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"First of all, you have this all backwards. The lunar meteorites were not discovered in the 70's. They were discovered and picked up by von Braun's geological team in 1967 (BEFORE Apollo)."
--That's YOUR claim, citing incorrect facts.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--That's YOUR claim, citing incorrect facts."
It's not my claim and it's not incorrect.
It's a FACT that von Braun took a geological team to the Antarctic to search for Moon rocks.. He didn't go there to "train astronauts" and he didn't go there, in the middle of the Apollo Program, for a summer getaway vacation either.. He went there for one purpose only.. To collect lunar meteorites for Project Apollo.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"It's not my claim and it's not incorrect."
--Go pour yourself a Tequila from your restaurant, have some chips and salsa, and read the following:
msnbc. msn. com/ id/ 5551432
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "--Go pour yourself a Tequila from your restaurant, have some chips and salsa, and read the following:"
Somebody from the Defense Department has been googling my name.
straydog02 3 years ago
--(Part 7) If you really believe NASA had the technical ability to pull all this off by "faking it", then actually going to the Moon in 1968-1972 was a piece of cake in comparison.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--(Part 7) If you really believe NASA had the technical ability to pull all this off by "faking it", then actually going to the Moon in 1968-1972 was a piece of cake in comparison."
zzzzzzz .. Now where have I heard that one before?
I bet you wouldn't be able to find your own ass, if NASA didn't show you where to look.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"I bet you wouldn't be able to find your own ass, if NASA didn't show you where to look."
--No, but I've got a pretty good idea of where to find yours if I want to kick it, according to your police record.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "--No, but I've got a pretty good idea of where to find yours if I want to kick it, according to your police record."
Now, you're just gonna have to make up your mind here, Mr. W. Spaceport.. Am I the married man Duane, who's the manager of Applebee's, or the 18 year old Duane, who uses drugs and beats up his girlfriend?
Inquiring minds, using google, want to know!
LOL
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Now, you're just gonna have to make up your mind here... Am I the married man Duane, who's the manager of Applebee's, or the 18 year old Duane, who uses drugs and beats up his girlfriend?"
-- What difference does it make? Both characters' middle name is "Loser".
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:" -- What difference does it make? Both characters' middle name is "Loser"."
I would have to agree with you about the Duane who does drugs and beats up his girlfriend, but the Duane who's manager of that resturant is probably a fine upstanding fellow.. Even if he doesn't have your very "important" job of acting like a complete idiot on YouTube, by insulting and ridiculing people you disagree with, and don't even know anything about, "Grand Loser".. Er, I mean "Grand Lunar". LOL
straydog02 3 years ago
I am returning this otherwise nicely typed paragraph to you because someone has printed gibberish all over it and put your name at the top.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "I am returning this otherwise nicely typed paragraph to you because someone has printed gibberish all over it and put your name at the top."
What are you talking about?
straydog02 3 years ago
WS: "I am returning this otherwise nicely typed paragraph to you because someone has printed gibberish all over it and put your name at the top."
This comment was addressed to me .. So can you please explain what you meant by that statement?
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"This comment was addressed to me .. So can you please explain what you meant by that statement?"
--If you can't figure it out for yourself, then I'm not surprised (and I can't help you).
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--If you can't figure it out for yourself, then I'm not surprised (and I can't help you)."
You post meaningless gibberish here and then you expect me to figure it out?
You really are a silly game player.
straydog02 3 years ago
WS:"--Except they're all 501(c)3 nonprofit educational organizations, and I pay out of my own pocket for the priveledge of being associated with them."
It doesn't matter if they make a profit or not, they are still space organizations who all go along with the official version of Apollo and all follow the accepted status quo.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"It doesn't matter if they make a profit or not, they are still space organizations who all go along with the official version of Apollo and all follow the accepted status quo."
Well, of course they do -- because it did happen.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"Well, of course they do -- because it did happen."
Well, millions of people, including some astronomers, scientists and physicists, believe otherwise.
Space organizations wouldn't dare question the validity of Apollo..If they did, they would loose all of their funding and then be shut down by the government.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02"Well, millions of people, including some astronomers, scientists and physicists, believe otherwise.
--Prove it by providing all their names and credentials -- not just the two that you alledge.
SD02:"Space organizations wouldn't dare question the validity of Apollo..If they did, they would loose all of their funding and then be shut down by the government."
--What part of non-profit 501c3 / 501c4educational space organizations (privately supported) don't you understand?
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:" --Prove it by providing all their names and credentials -- not just the two that you alledge."
Google Wikipedia ... LOL
"--What part of non-profit 501c3 / 501c4educational space organizations (privately supported) don't you understand?"
Oh, then they're all closed minded, duped fools because of choice, not funding.. Thanks for clearing that up.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Oh, then they're all closed minded, duped fools because of choice, not funding."
Wrong again, as always.
They're regular folks from cross-section of world society: Educators, students, professionals, doctors, stay-at-home soccer Moms, scientists and politicians, burger-flippers and lawyers -- just about anyone who believes in the visionary goals of opening the space frontier for the rest of society's advancement.
wspaceport 3 years ago
"They're regular folks from cross-section of world society: Educators, students, professionals, doctors, stay-at-home soccer Moms, scientists and politicians, burger-flippers and lawyers -- just about anyone who believes in the visionary goals of opening the space frontier for the rest of society's advancement."
Like I said before .. Duped fools.
straydog02 3 years ago
Some things are definately worth repeating, don't you think WS?
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
LOL
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Some things are definately worth repeating, don't you think WS?
--You should know:
SD02:During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a field trip to Antarctica, organized for him and several other members of top NASA management...The goal of the field trip was to determine whether the experience gained by US scientific and technological community during the exploration of Antarctic wastelands would be useful for the manned exploration of space.."
wspaceport 3 years ago
"Exploring Antarctica (1967)
Intrigued by exploration in space and on Earth, Dr. Von Braun participated in an expedition to Antarctica. This photo was made on or about January 7, 1967."
history . msfc . nasa . gov/vonbraun/photo/late-60s . html
straydog02 3 years ago
"Remarkably well preserved in the ice of Antarctica scientists have found remnants of lunar rocks blasted off the Moon by meteoric impacts. Numerous expeditions have explored the continent looking for rock samples from the Moon, Mars and comets.
In 1967, two years before the Apollo mission, such a group visited Antarctica, including the ex-Nazi rocket scientist Wernher von Braun, by then working for NASA. Why a rocket scientist would be sent to look for rocks is a good question."
straydog02 3 years ago
jimmccluskey . com/apollo . html
straydog02 3 years ago
Ws:--"Then produce your "proof."
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material." ( I bet! LOL )
Author: Timothy Ministries
Publication Name: Wernher von Braun
Publish Date: Feb 12, 2008
base . google . com/base/a/1205030/D11396046382544199805
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Author: Timothy Ministries
Publication Name: Wernher von Braun
Publish Date: Feb 12, 2008
base . google . com/base/a/1205030/D11396046382544199805 "
--Sorry, No. This is nothing more than a line-by-line regurgitation (plagerism?) from Wikipedia, Internet Movie Database and numerous sources elsewhere repeating the same stuff.
You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. Come back when you're worthy.
wspaceport 3 years ago
"You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. Come back when you're worthy."
Using the typical PSYCHOLOGICAL PROJECTION will do you no good either, NASA SHILL.
I SUPPLIED THE PROOF FROM A SELF SERVING NASA SITE THAT VON BRAUN WENT TO THE ANTARCTIC TO COLLECT MOON ROCKS AND YOU HAVEN'T SUPPLIED ANY PROOF THAT HE WENT THERE TO TRAIN ASTRONAUTS.
IN MY BOOK, THAT MAKES YOU THE ONE "WEIGHED, MEASURED, AND FOUND WANTING"!
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"I SUPPLIED THE PROOF FROM A SELF SERVING NASA SITE THAT VON BRAUN WENT TO THE ANTARCTIC TO COLLECT MOON ROCKS"
--Nope. You tried, but failed:
SD02:""Intrigued by exploration in space and on Earth, Dr. Von Braun participated in an expedition to Antarctica. This photo was made on or about January 7, 1967."
history . msfc . nasa . gov/vonbraun/photo/late-60s . html"
Name-calling and extensive use of capitalizion doesn't make your claims "proof" either.
wspaceport 3 years ago
SD02:"jimmccluskey . com/apollo . html"
Oh, great...yet another Conspiracy Theorist who starts off with the infamous (and yet to be proven to actually exist) "Una Ronald" and her magical Coke bottle.
Sorry, the claims of another Conspiracy Theorist on another Pseudoscience/Moon Hoax site is not valid proof.
wspaceport 3 years ago
"Sorry, the claims of another Conspiracy Theorist on another Pseudoscience/Moon Hoax site is not valid proof."
But NASA sites ARE proof, right shill?
LMAO!
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"But NASA sites ARE proof, right shill?"
--Hmm, let's see:
NASA site that's peer reviewed by the Nat'l Academy of Sciences, Nat'l Science Foundation, American Academy for the Advancement of Science and the international scientific community.
vs.
Hoax Believer site created by scam/con artists and hustlers that's backed by other Conspiracy Theorists repeating the same claims despite being debunked ad nauseum by international science community.
I'm going to back the NASA site.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "I'm going to back the NASA site."
Well, of course you are, seeing as you work for them! LOL
And in backing their sites, you have just admitted to agreeing with this...
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
straydog02 3 years ago
--Since when is Timothy Ministries a NASA site?
straydog02 (3 days ago)
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
Author: Timothy Ministries
Publication Name: WvBraun
Publish Date: Feb 12, 2008
base . google . com/base/a/1205030/D11396046382544199805
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "I'm going to back the NASA site."
SD02:"Well, of course you are, seeing as you work for them! LOL"
--Really!?! I'm shocked, SHOCKED by that new, stunning disclosure. I must inform the IRS immediately that I'm actually on NASA's payroll.
And to think for the past five years my W-2s were all wrong and paychecks have been mistakenly direct-deposited into my checking and savings accounts by the Defense Finance & Accounting Service in Cleveland, OH
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Really!?! I'm shocked, SHOCKED by that new, stunning disclosure. I must inform the IRS immediately that I'm actually on NASA's payroll."
Retired Air Force/Defense Dept. is close enough .. Plus, you belonging to various space agencies and organizations, pretty much sums up your particular agenda here.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Retired Air Force/Defense Dept. is close enough."
--Nope, not even close enough (once again); I still have another 10-15 yrs to go before I think of retirement.
SD02"Plus, you belonging to various space agencies and organizations, pretty much sums up your particular agenda here."
--Except they're all 501(c)3 nonprofit educational organizations, and I pay out of my own pocket for the priveledge of being associated with them.
You lose, once again.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Nope, not even close enough (once again); I still have another 10-15 yrs to go before I think of retirement."
Well, then you have even more reason to defend military/government conspiracires, cover-ups and lies.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02""Remarkably well preserved in the ice of Antarctica scientists have found remnants of lunar rocks blasted off the Moon by meteoric impacts...
In 1967, two years before the Apollo mission, such a group visited Antarctica, including the ex-Nazi rocket scientist Wernher von Braun, by then working for NASA. Why a rocket scientist would be sent to look for rocks is a good question."
--Two separate events, 5-12 years apart (1967, 1972 or 1979. Sorry, implied claims, but still no proof.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Two separate events, 5-12 years apart (1967, 1972 or 1979. Sorry, implied claims, but still no proof."
There's no need for this type of silly game.
I supplied the evidence yuo asked for, that von Braun went to the Antarctic to collect Moon rocks in 1967, and you haven't supplied anything but ridicule of the CT's and the typical NASA disinformation.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"There's no need for this type of silly game. I supplied the evidence yuo asked for, that von Braun went to the Antarctic to collect Moon rocks in 1967"
--No, you didn't. You supplied two paragraphs in conflict with each other, a WvB photo from a MSFC site, a CT site stating the same arguments and a Timothy Ministries site that copied from Wikipedia and other sources.
Besides, I never said WvB didn't go, only the reason why he went. Try again, and stay on topic to JW's subject line.
wspaceport 3 years ago
"Besides, I never said WvB didn't go, only the reason why he went. Try again, and stay on topic to JW's subject line."
Your claim was that WvB went to the Antarctic to train the Apollo astronauts. But you couldn't find any proof for that claim. I claimed that he went there to collect Moon rocks and then provided that proof.
The web sites are not in disagreement. It's just that most of them leave out the REAL REASON for his geological expedition to the Antarctic. TO GATHER LUNAR METEORITES!
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"But you couldn't find any proof for that claim. I claimed that he went there to collect Moon rocks and then provided that proof."
--I told you; ya gotta wait 'til I go south to pull Erik Bergaust's von Braun Bio (He also wrote 'Murder on Pad 34')
SD02:"The web sites are not in disagreement. It's just that most of them leave out the REAL REASON for his geological expedition to the Antarctic. TO GATHER LUNAR METEORITES!"
--Again, you haven't produced any proof to back your claim.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:--Again, you haven't produced any proof to back your claim."
This IS the proof...
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
Where is your proof that von Braun's geological expedition was really to find a place to "train the Apollo astronauts"?
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"This IS the proof...
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
--Riight, using Wikipedia as your primary source once again.
And we all know how accurate and well-researched that site is, don't we?
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Riight, using Wikipedia as your primary source once again.
And we all know how accurate and well-researched that site is, don't we? "
It's one of the main sources used by Apollo apologists and NASA shills .. So why wouldn't it be good enough for the CTs?
But the info about von Braun collecting Moon rocks in the Antarctic in 1967 didn't even come from Wikipedia.
So you lose again.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"But the info about von Braun collecting Moon rocks in the Antarctic in 1967 didn't even come from Wikipedia."
--Then why did you source it as such four days ago? Do I have to go back and copy your entire message to remind you, since it's officially recorded in these posts, or are you all of a sudden going to deny doing such a thing and blame it on a conspiracy to discredit you?
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:"--Then why did you source it as such four days ago?"
I didn't.
"During the local summer of 1966/67, von Braun participated in a U.S. government expedition to Antarctica. The expedition was one of the first to systematically search the ice surface for meteorites believed to originate from the moon, for later use as a reference material."
Author: Timothy Ministries
Publication Name: WvBraun
Publish Date: Feb 12, 2008
base . google . com/base/a/1205030/D11396046382544199805
straydog02 3 years ago
"Do I have to go back and copy your entire message to remind you, since it's officially recorded in these posts, or are you all of a sudden going to deny doing such a thing and blame it on a conspiracy to discredit you?"
Since when is Timothy Ministries a Wikipedia site?
Maybe you should pay closer attention to what's posted here, instead of making a fool out of yourself every time I prove you wrong.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"Since when is Timothy Ministries a Wikipedia site?
Maybe you should pay closer attention to what's posted here, instead of making a fool out of yourself every time I prove you wrong."
--Maybe you should do a side-by-side comparison of the two sites; it's obvious one copied from the other.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS: "--Maybe you should do a side-by-side comparison of the two sites; it's obvious one copied from the other."
Nice try, but the Wikipedia site never mentioned that von Braun went to the Antarctic to collect Moon rocks, only Timmy had the guts to mention that.
Sorry, but you lose again.
Would you like to agree to disagree now, and let all of this go, or do you prefer getting your ass kicked every day?
straydog02 3 years ago
Not by a long shot.
I also mentioned in original, earlier post that Timothy Ministries borrowed from other sources besides Wikipedia. Funny how you conveniently overlook that fact.
wspaceport 3 years ago
WS:" I also mentioned in original, earlier post that Timothy Ministries borrowed from other sources besides Wikipedia."
Timothy Ministries is not the Wikipedia site .. Which means you're a liar.
straydog02 3 years ago
WS:"--Maybe you should do a side-by-side comparison of the two sites; it's obvious one copied from the other."
Are you completely brain dead? .. The two articles didn't say the same thing at all.
Timothy Ministries mentioned the fact that von Braun went to the Antarctic to collect Moon rocks and Wikipedia never mentioned that fact at all!
So I'm afraid you got caught making a fool of yourself .. again.
If you're really this senile maybe you should consider early retirement.
straydog02 3 years ago
WS:"--I told you; ya gotta wait 'til I go south to pull Erik Bergaust's von Braun Bio (He also wrote 'Murder on Pad 34')"
So is Erik a NASA shill too, or does he admit that von Braun collected lunar meteorites in the Antarctic in 1967?
And does his book 'Murder on Pad 34', claim that the deaths of the A1 crew was just an accident, or does he admit that it was deliberate sabatoge?
Answer those two questions and I will know whether his book is the truth or just more NASA disinformation.
straydog02 3 years ago
SD02:"So is Erik a NASA shill too"
"Norwegian-born Erik Bergaust has had a bent for missiles since the age of twelve when he blew up his parents' apartment in an Oslo suburb with black powder rocket propellant. After serving in the Norwegian underground during World War II. Bergaust in 1946 became aviation editor of an Oslo newspaper."
-- TIME magazine, Feb. 23, 1956
wspaceport 3 years ago