Suzuka F1 Grand Prix 1989 - part 1

[MrRockzoul]

Such a dull way to do a television report ... who is this commentator ? Nowadays the italian national broadcast commentator (Gianfranco Mazzoni) is even too vehement instead

[fonzarellio]

Yes, Senna's start was bad. Yes, Prost jumped the start. Yes, Prost deliberately closed the door when Senna was 2/3 of a car lenght next to him at Casino Triangle. Yes, Senna did won the race and was disqualified for a pathetic reason by a french FIA-president who was best friends with Alain. Yes, Senna took Prost out the year after at Suzuka. Yes, Prost drove like a pragmatist, Senna with passion (thank you Richard Williams). Yes, both are fantastic.

Yes, I miss those days.

Merry xmass!

[casho1968]

one min prost is leading, 5 mins in senna is leading, but we dont see the pass... whats the point, you missed the the only bit worth seeing & we have to guess or remember how senna did it... idiots! DOH missed both passes so far, what a waste of time this has been

[casho1968]

one min prost is leading, 5 mins in senna is leading, but we dont see the pass... whats the point, you missed the the only bit worth seeing & we have to guess or remember how senna did it... idiots!

[blackknife1]

why do you people get offended by other people's OPINIONS?!?! WGAF!! They were BOTH great drivers!!

[312t4]

Also, it looks like people have problems with Prost and waste time in stupid matters, trying to ignore the fact that Senna himself, before to die, was use to call Prost to speak with him about his problems with the car and his feelings. Senna and Prost were going to be friend and the friday of Imola94, from the car, Senna spoke with Prost for the french Tv and said: I miss you. I invite you all to stop wasting time against a great driver, get a life, and simply enjoy race as they are.

[vibeackermann]

@312t4 you cant talk about either driver without mentioning either of there names, prost was senna motivation in 94 he really looked sad because he felt he had no rival

[312t4]

Beside, I guess a lot of user here weren't born the day of that race. I invite people to have a look at Senna's camera car video, in which it's clear that Senna had a very poor start, spinning the wheels in first and second gear. Senna never say anything about Prost start, but the next year he asked to change the pole position on the grid in order to avoid the same bad start. The video is called "Ayrton Senna (exclusive) ONBOARD FOOTAGE from MP4/5 - start,Suzuka 89".

[312t4]

Hi guys, I am really tired of reading people writing about Prost jumping the start. If at that time something like that was normal and nobody ever complained, why you are complaining 22 years later? Can you get a life? Did you ever asked yourself why nobody ever complained about that start?

Unless you'll speak to me -properly- about that start, I will delete new comments like "oh my god Prost jumped the start!" that add nothing to the matter.

[vibeackermann]

@312t4 Prost did jump the start thats evident second of all pole position at the time was on the wrong side of the grid, off the racing line and thirdly, the head of the F.I.A at the time was jean marie balleste and he was french and favoured prost, senna won this fairly the way he was treated was disgusting, however he got his revenge in 90 so in the end it all worked out prost delibratley turned into senna that it also evident two fantastic drivers in two fantastic cars ! ahh the good times !

[HotShogun]

Prost jumped the start!

[quatrupeto]

Chi ha quelle corse registrate??

Sono davvero interessato ad una conversione analogico-digitale...

e masterizzazione su DVD...

Dove posso trovarli??

[dsjnkfdksjn]

chi erano i commentatori?mi ricordo di quando passo a mediaset la f1 e deadamic nn si poteva sentire

[dogboyzz]

prost fastest than senna...then why all the people say senna is the best?? because he died on the track? because he said cool phrases?

[alexey790713]

@dogboyzz have u EVER watched Senna race?

[swistral1]

Great debate by all those involved! Opinions are like an asshole, everyone has one, lol!

[AleXcr86]

Lol, Prost jumped the start by a mile!

[312t4]

As I already wrote,

IN 1989 THE STARTING GRID DIDN'T CHANGE.

Can you please stop writing untrue things?

Because Senna in this race did a bad start, THE YEAR AFETR, in 1990, he asked to swap position for pole in order to have the best side of the track.

So it was in 1990 that Balestre refused to do something for Ayrton. That's why Senna said that he was going to be first after the first corner or going to push out off the track Prost. And he did it.

The pole position changed side in 1991.

[dalebshelton]

@312t4 Prost Jump the start in 1989. And wasn't penalised....did you mention that too or are you too blind to see that?

[saci30]

@dalebshelton

Perfect !! Senna killed Prost mentally.... the only way to Prost win something was doing politics with Ballestre and the press....

[312t4]

@dalebshelton

You can have a good look at the Senna's cameracar and see how bad was his start and how much he left the wheels spin in first and second gear. Listen to the engine sound and watch the steering wheel. Prost jumped the start? Yes, but mostly Senna did a very poor start.

[vibeackermann]

@312t4 agreed, sennas car sounded like a fucking train !

[saci30]

@

Bad start ? Prost clearly burn the grid... ridiculous... Prost crashed in Senna and not satisfied ... went to Ballestre... crying... please .... give me the WTC.....

Shame on you Ballestre...

[saci30]

In the Prost´s car there was also Ballestre ... Unfortunately after see that it was impossible to beat Senna in the track .. Prost began to make a dirty play ... in the press and also with FIA ... Prost didn´t need it .. But Senna killed him mentallly ...

[ttaruss]

prost started before green light.Any way Senna lost the championship not here but with the many retired and the mistake in silverstone...But Senna alway the best driver prost the right mix man and driver

[NationOfMasturbation]

senna; fastest, prost;smartest :)

[lucianoestivill]

Prost 1.4sec faster than Ayrton on cold tyres just in 1st lap. 2.2sec ahead of Ayrton by 2nd lap..... Two laps later (4th lap), 3.421sec ahead of Ayrton...... Almost 9sec ahead of Ayrton after pitstops........ Even when being a fan of Senna at the time, UTMOST RESPECT to this magical driver called The Professor..... Was Ayrton faster than Alain? Almost sure..... But the way Prost planned tactically this race, and his determination to win the race is just a matter of a fact, NO DOUBT. TALENT!!!!

[Conquerer13]

@lucianoestivill Yes, his start was good, although he jumped the green light to make the pass at the beginning, but Senna still caught him at the end of the race and even made the move to pass before Prost crashed into Senna. Too bad since it would have made the next race very interesting, although it still is a great piece of F1 history between these two.

[dalebshelton]

@Conquerer13 I have talked of the same thing for years. He jumped the start...secondly for all the advantage Prost had to start the race. Senna evened him up and then started cahtching him..Prost knew that in Traffic.....Senna would get him. So he did what he knew he had to do. Senna made up 20 meters on him in like 100 yards. he set him up.

[lucianoestivill]

@Conquerer13 I agree on the jump start, but Senna moved his car a bit early as well, by 150/1000. Small, but it did existed. Prost jumping is clear, but Prost placed his car a bit far from the starting grid line, so He moved earlier but at the time He reached starting grid line, it was almost about turning on green. Prost didn't sliced Senna that day due to a jumping but because He pushed very hard, an average of 35/100sec faster than Ayrton from start to pit stop. Prost was very fast that day.

[Conquerer13]

Senna's car doesn't move at all until the light turns green, so I don't know what you're looking at. Even Berger moves before him, almost what Prost did but he realizes and eases off, but Prost just keeps going. I have a lot of respect for Alain Prost but that day he jumped the start, took out his own teammate, got out of the car and became world champion. Yet Senna drove within the rules, didn't give up, passed the new leader and won the race but was DSQ'd. It's not a race to praise Prost for.

[lucianoestivill]

@Conquerer13 As a Senna fan myself: this was Prost's race, not Senna. He even shut the door on him when Senna had his front wheels behind Prost's front wheels. And the DSQ was legal, He was pushed in a place where there was no danger: Senna's car should have been taken out of the chicane escape as it was done with Prost's car. So I don't agree mate, but We could keep respect and politeness. Quotes like "...so I don't know what you're looking at..." could be avoided... Best Regards.

[Conquerer13]

@lucianoestivill I wasn't showing disrespect at all. I simply do not see any movement whatsoever by Senna's car. It is completely still until the green light. The car was pushed cause it was at the end of the chicane after high speeds, and drivers later agreed in the 1990 prerace meeting that it would be unsafe to turn around and take the chicane instead of cutting it, especially a stalled car. And Prost shut the door too late and caused the crash. There was no more room for Senna to go.

[lucianoestivill]

@Conquerer13 By the way mate, I should ask myself why Senna, if He was that fast that day, couldn't do not even a single attempt on Prost but the one on the chicane on lap 47. It seems Prost controlled Senna from start to lap 47. He even control Ayrton when Senna performed his optimistic attempt on the chicane: did He expected Prost would lay a red carpet to let him go? I don't think so. Senna had to try it, just that, He had no choice, but it is not serious thinking Prost would let him go.

[Conquerer13]

@lucianoestivill I'm not arguing who was faster. Prost had a better first stint and Senna had a better 2nd stint after the pit stop. Senna gained on him lap by lap and went for it on lap 46 because that was the closest he was to him at that point.. He went for it, Prost saw him and cornered well before the apex purely to block Senna, but he blocked too late and left no chance for him to avoid the collision. It was a bad intentioned maneuver regardless of how fast he was that day.

[lucianoestivill]

@Conquerer13 OK, no problem about disrespect, you didn't I guess, maybe I misunderstood you a bit: I apologize mate!

I agree in almost everything with you but no the chicane episode: Senna used to do the same, shut doors (Senna on Prost UK 89 in Copse curve, or against a DSQ Mansell in Estoril 89 which made him have a typical 50/50% to blame incident) or even push a challenger against a wall (Estoril 88.....). This time, in my view, there was no reason why Prost should let him go....

[lefgeo]

@lucianoestivill the difference is that senna use to fight and closing the door when he was defending his position BUT if you see in that race prost didn't close the door because senna was already next to prost and prost just hit him!

as for mansell incident if you don't know mansell was blackflagged 3 laps before the incident,he ignore it and you can see clearly that senna had his line and mansell put his outside front wheel in senna's inside back wheel.estoril 88 you missed the 1st lap i think

[lucianoestivill]

@lefgeo For sure I know all those facts, but again, the following:

1-Mansell was DSQ but why Senna risked that much fighting with a DSQ driver? OK, Ayrton didn't know Mansell had been DSQ but it is the same: He tought He was figthing for 2nd place with Mansell, so if Mansell had not been DSQ, the result would have been the same: a crash and boom!.

2-I didn't miss Estoril 88 1st lap. Otherwise, I would have missed Prost overtaking which also happened in 1st lap, as Prost tough starting...

[lefgeo]

@lucianoestivill first of all senna didin't know mansell dsq.my personal opinion is that mansell wanted to hit senna's car!i mean imagine that you are mansell and you dsq why the hell you have to keep going 3 laps until an accident happens?more than once mansell said "i'll help prost to take the WDR!anyway we are in wrong direction,i mean what's the point?prost was better than senna?i can accept reasons for someone telling this(french,no f1 fan,hate,jealous)Even for f1 drivers there is no dought

[lucianoestivill]

@lefgeo Again: I don't understand the point. I'm a Senna fan. Did I say Prost was better than Senna, or Senna better than Prost? No, I didn't. That argument is nonsense, who can be better is not important for me at all. I don't care. I was discussing Suzuka 89, and my point of view is that I don't see, honestly, why Prost should have let Senna overtake him. Ayrton usually went for 1st place or try to defend his position in the tough way. He got his own medicine this time... As simple as that.

[lefgeo]

@lucianoestivill in that race prost didn't defend his position in a tough way!he saw senna coming let him come next to him and finally hit him!just see the video very carefully because actually the incident didn't happend in the turn.prost turn his wheel just a little before the turn to hit senna's car! Now or you have a different opinion or you think that prost had the right to hit senna's car. In the end why not?(LOL) he had balestre by his side.These 2 made senna a weapon in 1990.

[lucianoestivill]

@Conquerer13 I also think Prost would have won the title that day even if He had done a bad star: He set up his car to be fast on full tanks, while Senna did it to have a better performance with a ligther car. Prost would have attacked in his 1st stint (with a faster car) and would have gone for it at all cost. In that case, Senna would have had no option but to open the door. Otherwise, closing the door would've been a gift to Prost: He would have crashed into him and Prost Champion.....

[ssssroryssss2]

I don't mean to intrude on this video but I've uploaded the BBC version of this race

/watch?v=UIyQ4u7U7t8

[lucasefata]

Prost burned to release, only blind can not see.

[dalebshelton]

agreed

[Ferrariman60]

I think you've got me all wrong. I do know all about the dominance of the McLaren-Honda partnership through the 80's and 90's, I was referring to how similar F1 engines sound nowadays, using one of the best engines (Ferrari) and one of the worst in recent years (Honda) to illustrate my point. BTW, I too love the sound of that McLaren MP4/6!

[Ferrariman60]

Wow, you can actually hear the difference in the sounds with the different engines. Not like today, a Ferrari sounds just like a Honda.

[innojuve1985]

no you are completely wrong man!

dont look at ayrton start cause it was too late... prost started correctly when the red light turned off. he was more experience than senna in pressure at this time. but senna is more talented than any driver in the history no doubt. thats a fact

[LouieGee]

C'mon, it's pretty obvious that Alain jumped the start. I don't need slow motion to see that, but you should try. Alain starts moving before the green light appears.

[312t4]

Until the middle of 90's there were no way to misure jump start like this or others. There is no point in questioning about that. It's silly. Have a look at the "monza 1978" video and watch Gilles and Mario Andretti.. No one saw the jump start?

From now on I will delete stupid or insulting message.

312t4

[schopfheim91]

Yeah, he was not absolutely stationary, he moved slightly forward, but it is too difficult to see whether he jumped the start or not.

[CesareF1]

Well, I have the 2 DVD videos "The official tribute to Senna".

Before to post my comment, I watched again "Racing is in my blood" film (Disc 2), watching frame-to-frame (1/32 speed) Suzuka's 1989 start, and I swear you than is evident than Prost jumped the start.

[safcfan89]

Irrelevant. Too many Senna fans choose to go with the conspiracy theories rather than just thinking that he wasn't perfect.

[mattcrash69]

i miss the days when the cars sounded different

[NathanF11989]

Senna v Prost was Formula 1 at its best.

[absolutemorons]

senna - greatest driver ever

[jezroller3]

yeah we're lucky that so many videos are in English, it must be hard for everyone else

[Loris636]

shut up!

9 of 10 are in english

[schopfheim91]

Bad that it is in Italian

[cojones2000]

:(

che dire per il francese bastardo che dire..

grazie mille per i video. mai vista prima :)