we british and american people are civilized people civilized countries educated people who enjoy the fruits of democracy so we have to spread the democracy to the ather countries specialy mulim countries, this event at abugharib is just part of spreading democracy, you have to understand the reason behind this.we are lebrating iraqis from sadam
Hey Suz, what those guys did at Abu Ghraib was ILLEGAL that is why they are serving JAIL TIME. Now, why don't you whine about the radical Islamics who train children to chop the heads off of living humans beings? i guess they get a pass right..... Olberman would not now Truth if it kicked him in his ass.
Do you really want to go there with me Suz? because in the REAL world you have to have Evidence to Convict a solider or "higher up" at you put it. There is ZERO evidence that shows "higher ups" were involved and i challenge you to prove otherwise. Most of the detainees were captured on the field of battle with no uniform, do you know what that means Suz?
Understand this Suz, even under a direct order of "higher ups" a soldier no matter what rank is not to commit an illegal act PERIOD. Torture is ILLEGAL, now you can debate on what is torture and what is not, but torture is not normal military procedure this was select soldiers. Again you can't prove they were tortured for leverage, get you head out of your ass.
I must conclude you never served in the military,or you would know that those standards,along with ultimate responsibility,apply to high ranking officers,sport.
Under military law,and by virtue of honorable tradition,officers must take responsibility for the ongoing actions of those under their command.
Do you have REAL evidence that the soldiers had direct orders Yes or NO. What is it? Where did you come across this info? and no i don't think they orders from higher ups do you think putting a bag on someones head or making someone stand naked sounds like a good strategy to gain information from someone? NOO! It sounds like 18-21 year olds who are acting like idiots. You have zero common sense if you think this is some sort of High end interrogation technique that came from WAY UP TOP.
Yes of course they could act without their superiors knowing. Just like my grandfather saw in WW2 soldiers being tied to bumpers and driven down the bumpy roads then explained that this is the way they found the prisoner. Of course if your naive like you are then common sense is not really important, you just are a typical America blamer. of course you continue to avoid stating any facts. You are a true liberal.
But not in a closed facility where those prisoners were regularly seen and interrogated by MI.
I stated many facts;you just choose to ignore them and keep living in la-la land.
I am actually not a liberal and,thankfully,I am not an idiot either,which is what you clearly are if you think those soldiers carried on torture in a prison and MP and MI officers never noticed.
Even if what your saying is true that some higher rank officers knew, Even still, this does not mean if was Ok'ed by the Government or made legal by any means. By the way i don't remember seeing any facts but plenty of baseless accusations.
The testimony was under oath and the stories of the accused soldiers consistent.
Good to see you backtracking and acknowledging that these grunts could not have acted alone. My statement that the higher-ups were either not punished at all,or were sanctioned,but served no prison time stands.
Never acknowledged anything. To my knowledge if you read their statements in CONTEXT i don't know of the soldiers claiming they were ordered to torture, and if they obeyed then they should be in jail anyway, because even under a demand from a higher rank to do something illegal they are NOT to do it. also one persons word against another's word does not suffice, you must have other evidence otherwise its nothing.
The testimonies were given under oath,consistent with regard to specific acts and officers who knew,enocuraged and praised them for making the detainees malleable, and are more valid evidence than your fact-free,baseless opinion.
Nowhere did I ever claim that the soldiers involved should not have been punished. They were guilty and got what they deserved,but you still go back to letting those officers off the hook,which is outrageous. Shame on them and shame on you.
Wait, did the officers admit they did it? or do you Choose to believe these officers that did such immature terrible acts? obviously these kids who did this were not very smart or ethical, what makes you think they were not trying to get themselves off the hook and blame it on higher rank officers? this is why you need evidence other then one persons word against another's. The court can't convict an officer based on heresy, what do you not understand about that?
You clearly don't know much about Law and how to prosecute someone and bring charges on someone. Its called EVIDENCE and Hersey is not good in Court. You can sit there all day and make assertions but thats all they are, and if you decide to form an opinion on something based on what YOU THINK happened then its your own dumb fault. Personally i like sticking with the facts. Yes and people do have different definitions of torture.
@JLaw012 youre the type of guy who would've been a Tory during the american revolution. you have a sycophantic, unquestioning love and devotion to whomever is in power. you're the shit-heel of civilization. i hope you fuckin get pancreatic cancer
@alienmode. Oh ok you're a liberal. I can tell because only cheap human beings like liberals who have no respect for human life in general would wish cancer on someone,so thanks for showing everyone the hate of true liberals.
The fact that you think i have some unquestioning love for authority or people in power is absolutely hilarious, i am not a government stooge like you liberals who suck at the government cock like it's the last cock on earth so why don't go go pray to your false God obama.
@JLaw012 no I'm one of bush's cronies -- and we have tons of respect, just look at the 100,000+ Iraqis we've liberated from their corporeal prisons! I'll tell you what i hate those fuckin' liberals with their universal health care and non-warmongering... fuck they make my blood boil!
you sound like a really sensible and decent human being... very knowledgeable about cock-sucking too. If i ever turn gay, you'll be the first one I ask for advice!
@alienmode. No you're worse then Bush cronies you're a government cronie who is naive enough to think the government supplying 300 million people with universal health care is a good thing, as if the government can afford or do this effectively, what a joke they lose money delivering mail for pity's sake.
Oh and since you have your head in a hole somewhere in liberal fairy land the majority of democrats voted to go to Iraq and Afghanistan they saw the intelligence reports as well.
we british and american people are civilized people civilized countries educated people who enjoy the fruits of democracy so we have to spread the democracy to the ather countries specialy mulim countries, this event at abugharib is just part of spreading democracy, you have to understand the reason behind this.we are lebrating iraqis from sadam
richardman102 4 years ago
is raping women and children and killing them for fun being civilised to you??
fuck off u fuckin british/american....
Gangstabob716 4 years ago 2
reeeeeally
TheStupidSketchShow 4 years ago
TREASON
northmiamigirl 4 years ago
This was a disgrace,so is Gitmo,so is almost everything this administration has done to our country.
Suz45 4 years ago
Hey Suz, what those guys did at Abu Ghraib was ILLEGAL that is why they are serving JAIL TIME. Now, why don't you whine about the radical Islamics who train children to chop the heads off of living humans beings? i guess they get a pass right..... Olberman would not now Truth if it kicked him in his ass.
JLaw012 4 years ago
The higher-ups were NOT all punished,and the Gitmo detainees are suspects...not charged,not indicted,not convicted.
Hate to break it to you,sheeple,but Olbermann reports the truth,not the bs party line drivel you seem to still be buying.
Do a little information-gathering before you shoot your mouth off so you dont look quite so stupid.
Suz45 4 years ago
Do you really want to go there with me Suz? because in the REAL world you have to have Evidence to Convict a solider or "higher up" at you put it. There is ZERO evidence that shows "higher ups" were involved and i challenge you to prove otherwise. Most of the detainees were captured on the field of battle with no uniform, do you know what that means Suz?
JLaw012 4 years ago
Col. Pohl,steadfastly refused to allow testimony about the roles of MI or any senior officers at Graner's trial.
10 soldiers got prison time,whereas
Karpinski got demoted for "negligence" and Pappas was fined 8K and relieved.
And what about Wood and Sanchez?
You think these grunts operated in a vacuum?
Field of battle? Some were there for car jacking,theft,prostitution,or were just innocent relatives tortured for leverage.
Get your facts straight or piss off,fool.
Suz45 4 years ago
Understand this Suz, even under a direct order of "higher ups" a soldier no matter what rank is not to commit an illegal act PERIOD. Torture is ILLEGAL, now you can debate on what is torture and what is not, but torture is not normal military procedure this was select soldiers. Again you can't prove they were tortured for leverage, get you head out of your ass.
JLaw012 4 years ago
I must conclude you never served in the military,or you would know that those standards,along with ultimate responsibility,apply to high ranking officers,sport.
Under military law,and by virtue of honorable tradition,officers must take responsibility for the ongoing actions of those under their command.
Smarten up and get YOUR head out of Bush's ass.
Suz45 4 years ago
Do you have REAL evidence that the soldiers had direct orders Yes or NO. What is it? Where did you come across this info? and no i don't think they orders from higher ups do you think putting a bag on someones head or making someone stand naked sounds like a good strategy to gain information from someone? NOO! It sounds like 18-21 year olds who are acting like idiots. You have zero common sense if you think this is some sort of High end interrogation technique that came from WAY UP TOP.
JLaw012 4 years ago
Their testimony is available.
Taguba's report is available.
Do you think 10+ soldiers,in a closed facility,regularly interacting with MI, could act on their own,without their superiors' knowing?
How did they explain the injuries and the deaths?
You think all of those officers were just blind and stupid? Moronic bullshit.
Enlist and find out just how much you can hide under those circumstances.
You are the idiot. Do some research before you shoot your mouth off,kid.
Suz45 4 years ago
Yes of course they could act without their superiors knowing. Just like my grandfather saw in WW2 soldiers being tied to bumpers and driven down the bumpy roads then explained that this is the way they found the prisoner. Of course if your naive like you are then common sense is not really important, you just are a typical America blamer. of course you continue to avoid stating any facts. You are a true liberal.
JLaw012 4 years ago
Out in the open? Sure.
But not in a closed facility where those prisoners were regularly seen and interrogated by MI.
I stated many facts;you just choose to ignore them and keep living in la-la land.
I am actually not a liberal and,thankfully,I am not an idiot either,which is what you clearly are if you think those soldiers carried on torture in a prison and MP and MI officers never noticed.
Stop drooling and get a grip on your sanity,kid.
ginerlynn 4 years ago
Even if what your saying is true that some higher rank officers knew, Even still, this does not mean if was Ok'ed by the Government or made legal by any means. By the way i don't remember seeing any facts but plenty of baseless accusations.
JLaw012 4 years ago
The testimony was under oath and the stories of the accused soldiers consistent.
Good to see you backtracking and acknowledging that these grunts could not have acted alone. My statement that the higher-ups were either not punished at all,or were sanctioned,but served no prison time stands.
I never said it was "legal"...that is the point.
Suz45 4 years ago
Never acknowledged anything. To my knowledge if you read their statements in CONTEXT i don't know of the soldiers claiming they were ordered to torture, and if they obeyed then they should be in jail anyway, because even under a demand from a higher rank to do something illegal they are NOT to do it. also one persons word against another's word does not suffice, you must have other evidence otherwise its nothing.
JLaw012 4 years ago
The testimonies were given under oath,consistent with regard to specific acts and officers who knew,enocuraged and praised them for making the detainees malleable, and are more valid evidence than your fact-free,baseless opinion.
Nowhere did I ever claim that the soldiers involved should not have been punished. They were guilty and got what they deserved,but you still go back to letting those officers off the hook,which is outrageous. Shame on them and shame on you.
Suz45 4 years ago
Wait, did the officers admit they did it? or do you Choose to believe these officers that did such immature terrible acts? obviously these kids who did this were not very smart or ethical, what makes you think they were not trying to get themselves off the hook and blame it on higher rank officers? this is why you need evidence other then one persons word against another's. The court can't convict an officer based on heresy, what do you not understand about that?
JLaw012 4 years ago
Torture in a closed prison,victims interrogated regularly by MI,and none of their superiors knew about it.
Or,they DID know,but the gov.didn't so the grunts are to blame.
Nobody above ordered/sanctioned it,but even if they did,they didn't admit it,so maybe all of those soldiers lied and its still solely their fault.
Or,maybe they were never tortured at all,since what is the definition of torture?
Idiotic,specious bullshit.
You clearly dont know much about the military.
Suz45 4 years ago
You clearly don't know much about Law and how to prosecute someone and bring charges on someone. Its called EVIDENCE and Hersey is not good in Court. You can sit there all day and make assertions but thats all they are, and if you decide to form an opinion on something based on what YOU THINK happened then its your own dumb fault. Personally i like sticking with the facts. Yes and people do have different definitions of torture.
JLaw012 4 years ago
@JLaw012 youre the type of guy who would've been a Tory during the american revolution. you have a sycophantic, unquestioning love and devotion to whomever is in power. you're the shit-heel of civilization. i hope you fuckin get pancreatic cancer
alienmode 1 year ago
@alienmode. Oh ok you're a liberal. I can tell because only cheap human beings like liberals who have no respect for human life in general would wish cancer on someone,so thanks for showing everyone the hate of true liberals.
The fact that you think i have some unquestioning love for authority or people in power is absolutely hilarious, i am not a government stooge like you liberals who suck at the government cock like it's the last cock on earth so why don't go go pray to your false God obama.
JLaw012 1 year ago
@JLaw012 no I'm one of bush's cronies -- and we have tons of respect, just look at the 100,000+ Iraqis we've liberated from their corporeal prisons! I'll tell you what i hate those fuckin' liberals with their universal health care and non-warmongering... fuck they make my blood boil!
you sound like a really sensible and decent human being... very knowledgeable about cock-sucking too. If i ever turn gay, you'll be the first one I ask for advice!
alienmode 1 year ago
@alienmode. No you're worse then Bush cronies you're a government cronie who is naive enough to think the government supplying 300 million people with universal health care is a good thing, as if the government can afford or do this effectively, what a joke they lose money delivering mail for pity's sake.
Oh and since you have your head in a hole somewhere in liberal fairy land the majority of democrats voted to go to Iraq and Afghanistan they saw the intelligence reports as well.
JLaw012 1 year ago
Sorry,my sister-in-law was logged in,but the comment stands.
Suz45 4 years ago
By the way,thanks for acknowledging that those soldiers had orders from "higher up".
Suz45 4 years ago