joesph smith was not an innocent man when he was killed. Look it up, smith orderd the destruction of a printing press of a anti-mormon paper. smith also shot 3 men in the Carthage jail ."Smith used a small pepper-box pistol that Cyrus Wheelock had given him when Wheelock had visited the jail earlier that day. Three of the six barrels misfired, but the other three shots injured at least three of the attackers."
Look up the horrors of the "Mountain Meadows massacre"mormons killed innocent children
NARROWSBURG, NY -- Young men representing 38 troops from stakes afar abreast as Wilmington, Del., Albany County, NY, Hartford, Conn., and Long Island, NY, along with more than 100 adult priesthood leaders, .
Whether it's a pioneer handcart trek, youth conference or a service project, Mormon young men and women from around the country are staying busy this summer. Young members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints ...
Customarily, new temples are announced by the president of the Church at one of the Church's general conferences, after local government building approvals and property acquisition have been secured. Although the local government approval process for the French temple is still under way, French newspapers were already reporting Church plans to build at Le Chesnay, near Versailles, and this prompted today's announcement. . .
@digger629 Can you even give a name of 1 of these sites. You also speak as though they're the only 1's who do it. It's actually a fairly common practice. People who own things have the right to do whatever they want with them.
@digger629 "Why won't official mormon sights let me post my comments without 1st approving them?"
because Mormons have standards and like to keep things family oriented. Once you can get you and your ANTImormon cohorts to STOP with the filth, then it will happen.
You mormons are soooo blind & deaf. I quote nothing but official mormon literature, which BTW you mormons call anti-mormon. Your own literature is your own worst enemy. It exposes your group for what it really is...FALSE.
You like to use the name of Jesus Christ, but your jesus christ is no t the One described in Scripture
I am not anti-mormon. I am anti false teachers. I love all mormons I hate your false doctrines that come straight from satan..
I'm no fan of Mormon doctrine, having been steeped in it from infancy, but the Mormon people are every bit as "Christian" as folks like yourself. If you really cared about them then you would realize that they are no more lost than you are. Your kind of love is divisive and conditional. I love many Mormons personally, and accept them just as they are; I don't want to change them, I merely wish that they would accept me as I accept them; unconditionally, despite our differences.
When you tell Mormons that their doctrine comes straight from Satan it accomplishes nothing. You follow the teachings of men just as they do; you rely on human translations and preaching just as they do. You'll convert nobody using your methods; you only put up walls. They thrive on their persecution complex. Their version of reality is no more tenuous than yours, their faith in it no less true. Would you change your faith if someone told you your doctrine was of Satan?
Do you not understand or care that false beliefs about God, Jesus, salvation, etc. leads to eternal damnation? (Hell) Do I just ignore everyone who has been misled by some false teacher, guru, etc. who has claimed they have the way to eternal life (Heaven) when in fact they are in opposition to what God in His word has revealed? To keep silent about this for the sake of not offending anyone is not love but hate.
Am I become your enemy because I tell you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
@digger629 Do you believe that everyone who believes differently than you will burn in Hell? I can not believe in a God who is supposed to be all loving, yet one who tortures people eternally merely for choosing the wrong religion. As a former Mormon, I am trying to give you insight that they are not worried about your threats of Hell. To them, it is you who are misled by false doctrines. I hope you can see that you will never persuade anyone by attacking their cherished dogma.
Yes, I do believe that anyone who believes different than me will spend eternity in hell. There is only one way to have eternal life. Jesus christ is that way. Not satans brother, but God who took on humanity so He could die, by shedding His redeeming blood on a cross, not in a garden as Mormonism teaches.
I will not stop attacking Mormon doctrine...It is false & I will expose it for anyone who wants to see its errors.
Remember; The deceived do not know they are deceived.
As for you not believing in a God that sends people to hell, that is a false belief also. God does not send anyone to hell. People go there by their own free choice. God has done everything He can to keep us from going there & what He did for us doesn't cost us anything. Salvation is a free gift.
I can't believe in a God that would make anyone spend eternity with Him in Heaven when they reject Him & don't want any part of Him here on earth. Can you?
There is a fundamental disconnect when you claim that your god is both omnipotent and omnibenevolent, and then blithely assert that most of his creation is crap and thus must be tortured forever. Would you ever allow your children to be tortured, for any reason? Of course not.
You don't understand that persecution only strengthens a Mormon's testimony. If you really cared about helping them, you would try to understand them.
And your attacks will convert nobody, anywhere, ever.
And on the subject of Hell... according to you, many of the people you know, including probably members of your own family, will be sent there. Could you, in Heaven, really be happy knowing the torture they are enduring? I could not. If I was somehow transformed into a being who no longer cared about their fate, then I would no longer be me. So you see, I could never be in your version of Heaven, because I care too much about my fellow man to call such a place "Heaven."
My attacks are not against you or any Mormon. My attack is against error & lies. I have studied cults for a long time, & yes, they do thrive on persecution.
My Bible says, John 8:32>And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
Most Mormons are not interested in knowing the truth. They have a great family life, & that satisfies them.
If I don't let them know the errors of Mormonism...Who will? Not you!
They will all die & go to hell. I don't want that to happen.
I do share what I know now with them. I want to "pay it forward" and help them set themselves free, as I have found freedom due to the efforts of others. I want them to be happy, and if they are truly happy in their Mormon lives, so be it. I know from experience, though, that many of them are not really happy; they are merely putting on an act, for fear of disappointing their family and/or their god. And my point is simply this; that a frontal attack is not a persuasive tactic.
It is not my goal just to have a person leave Mormonism. I want them to come to the real God, the real Jesus, the real Word of God, the real Holy Spirit & receive the free gift of salvation.
Most Mormons are good, honest people.
Life on this earth is short. Eternity is a long time. Get my point?
I am concerned about you also. You left Mormonism for atheism. From the frying pan into the fire. I know cults make many bitter against God. Cults mess up your mind. I'm praying for you.
@digger629 Thanks, I appreciate your concern for me. I think expressions like your last one are much more effective at helping people soften their hearts so that they can try to see your perspective. I doubt that I will ever come to believe in any god, because I am compelled to believe what makes sense to me, and personal deity simply doesn't. Nevertheless, you should feel free to pray for me if it brings you comfort. I am very happy with my life outside of Mormonism / theism.
SAN PEDRO CUTUD, Philippines -- At least 24 Filipinos were nailed to crosses to re-enact Jesus Christ's suffering in a Good Friday rite rejected by Catholic church leaders but witnessed by throngs of believers and thousands of tourists.
Easter was coming up soon, and we wanted the best speaker we could possibly get. In our planning meeting, somone suggested, "Why don't we ask George Albert Smith, the president of the church?"
We all thought that was a great idea, but we wondered if it could be possible. We wrote him a letter, inviting him. To our great surprise, he said, "Yes.".
And in that moment of clarity, Black said he realized something: He was different, and that disparity now made him one of the many bad words his Mormon church and conservative military lifestyle had said. From "unholy, unnatural (and) unworthy," as the .
Lisa Olson Some of the 400 cast members in the 70th annual Arizona Easter Pageant of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints practice in March 2008 on the temporary stage north of the Mormon Temple in Mesa. 8 pm daily through Saturday. ...
You "temple worthy" Mormons who believe bamboozled you can baptize by proxy for those who haven't heard the gospel of Joseph Smith must pay your way into Mormon "heaven" with your tithe money which recipients do not even have the integrity to divulge to its temple patrons/supporters the financials thereof. So very unlike the Christian churches such really is. Mormondom is mammon at the top, Moroni blowing the trumpet "Pay before entering!" Mormon = trumpet for the cross, water for Jesus' blood!
You should have written as long as I worship The True Creator & worship in manner acceptable to Him I can obtain True Salvation. The Christian Scriptures are replete that all afflicted with mormonosis have a false gospel, a false spirit, a false Jesus & follow false prophets & apostles. You think that there will ever be enough Mormons to baptize multi-billions of people? According to your Joe foolery people can live like the devil & unrepentant enter into 1 of 3 heavens defiling heaven.. WOW!
Is that actually what you believe the Holy Spirit is speaking? You say persons have an excuse; Rom. 1:20 states they are without excuse. You ignored Ps. 19. You have said that creation reveals nothing to you of the true Creator. Is this for you because the letters of the name of Jesus are not emblazoned across the sky or because your spirit is not surrendered & susceptible to the superscendent splendor of the Son? Can you be trusted to be telling the truth? Your isogesis of the Bible fails you.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, [even] his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort [you] that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
The KJV which I read, & has not Smith's foolish JST footnotes, tells those who have ears to hear what the Spirit is saying that believers are to be boldly Berean & thereby ***judge*** all truth claims by the basis of the Bible. Neglect that & you are vulnerable to every vain & villainous thought, desire & imagination that vaunts itself against Christ, the Word of God & that which the Spirit of Scripture is saying. Other than & anyone can appoint self as prophet & promote polygamy & polyandry
(cont'd) The castration attempt might be taken as evidence that the mob felt that Joseph had committed a sexual impropriety; since the attempt is reported by [Marinda's brother who became LDS apostle] Luke Johnson, there is no good reason to doubt it. Also, they had planned the operation in advance, as they brought along a doctor to perform it.
(cont'd) The castration attempt might be taken as evidence that the mob felt that Joseph had committed a sexual impropriety; since the attempt is reported by [Marinda's brother who became LDS apostle] Luke Johnson, there is no good reason to doubt it. Also, they had planned the operation in advance, as they brought along a doctor to perform it.
LDS author Todd Compton wrote, “The motivation for this mobbing has been debated. Clark Braden…alleged…that Marinda’s brother Eli led a mob against Smith because the prophet had been too intimate with Marinda. This tradition suggests that Smith may have married Marinda at this early time, and some circumstantial factors support such a possibility.
(cont'd) During this same period, other international missionary-oriented faiths have reported accelerating growth, including the Seventh-Day Adventists, Southern Baptists, Assemblies of God, and Evangelical (5.6 percent annual growth) and Pentecostal churches (7.3 percent annual growth). For 2004, 241,239 LDS convert baptisms were reported, the lowest number of converts since 1987. MormonWiki
(cont'd) "A closer examination of growth and retention data demonstrates that LDS growth trends have been widely overstated. Annual LDS growth has progressively declined from over 5 percent in the late 1980s to less than 3 percent from 2000 to 2005. Since 1990, LDS missionaries have been challenged to double the number of baptisms, but instead the number of baptisms per missionary has halved.
Mormons and media outlets frequently appeal to their religion's growth rate as an evidence of its truthfulness. Mormon author David G. Stewart, Jr. writes on the recurring theme and the overstatements that often accompany it... In a recent General Conference, the Church of Jesus Christ was described not only as being prolific, but also as retaining and keeping active 'a higher percentage of our members' than any other major church of which the speaker was aware. "
(cont'd) The first revelations had been received in 1831, by historian Danel Bachman’s dating. Also, Joseph did tend to marry women who had stayed at his house or in whose house he had stayed” (In Sacred Loneliness, page 231).
(cont'd) The castration attempt might be taken as evidence that the mob felt that Joseph had committed a sexual impropriety; since the attempt is reported by [Marinda's brother who became LDS apostle] Luke Johnson, there is no good reason to doubt it. Also, they had planned the operation in advance, as they brought along a doctor to perform it.
Following a joint Jewish-Mormon dinner in the Hillel dining hall, Harvard students gathered to hear Mark Paredes, a Mormon who writes a column for the Jewish Journal of Greater Los Angeles on Latter Day Saints-Jewish relations. Paredes, as Yair Rosenberg '11-'12, the organizer of the event, put it, has devoted his life to "explaining Jews to Mormons, and Mormons to Jews."
And his presence immediately catalyzed a no-holds barred discussion on every issue that had previously driven a wedge between LDS Church members and Jews--leaving me far more enlightened than after any other interfaith event I've been to on Harvard's campus.
Faithful Mormons will gather to hear words of inspiration from their leaders Sunday, the second day of their church's semiannual general conference.
The two-day conference draws more than 100,000 to the four-block downtown Salt Lake City campus of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The event comes just days before the church marks its 181st anniversary on April 6.
Mormon researchers who pay close attention to LDS Church growth throughout the world see a hint of improvement in the number of converts who progress from baptism to become fully active, faithful Mormons.
That Smith was not actually castrated for girls & women he went after, including other men's wives, & his threats of slander & making false promises in the holy name of God to coerce & manipulate them & theirs is somewhat of a surprise. Ever since he began poisoning the minds & sullying the spirits of his followers toward the churches Mormons have been blatantly bearing false witness against the blessed & beloved body & bride of Christ. God ※ loves ※ anti-Christ Mormons; Jesus beckons them.
@omiolo Thanks, incendiumata omiolio, what about the following congregation?
"But we may have become complacent. Don't we send out full-time missionaries? Isn't that enough? Aren't we "the fastest growing religion"? Actually, we're not. Church growth has been falling for years, and our current rate of missionary success is the lowest it's been for decades." Daniel C. Peterson For Mormon Times in Deseret News April 7, 2011
Our hearts an altar, Christ's love the living flames
Mormondom has been COLLAPSING for YEARS. As Dan Peterson this month stated for YEARS LDS church growth has been FALLING & the LDS church's rate of missionary success is the LOWEST it's been for DECADES. WOW Omioliolio you really ARE delusional. The Truth shall set you free but you must be willing. Religion will never do for you that which only relationship in Christ can do. The LDS church cult has been for MANY YEARS hemorrhaging at its Smith-stitched seams due to the internet ! ! !
@Shulamitefire if the church is in such bad shape then why are we continually building new temples, add new stakes due to growth, building churches etc?
@solowookie Perhaps you should ask Daniel C. Peterson at BYU; he made the statement. Are you suggesting that you disbelieve his statement made in the Deseret News?
@Shulamitefire the church went from 13 million in 2007 to 14 million in 2010. we continue to build and fill those buildings I hardly believe it is the dire straights you are suggesting. when you realize how strict this religion is, and how strongly society is set against it, I would say that growth rate is phenomenal.
@solowookie Your high flying Daniel C. Peterson made the statement for Mormon Times in Deseret News; I quoted him. Doubtless, the church likes to keep up appearances as they have money to burn with their service to mammon. Do you recall that which Jesus spoke about attempting to serve two masters? What you have is corporation with its big fat ass plunked down on the seat of religion. Yours is the only one we know of in which leaders hold an annual shake down of its members for their tithe money.
@Shulamitefire you have a single quote, and because you have a single quote 'the church isn't true' anymore? growth rates fluctuated in the Book of Mormon, and even with Christs original 12 apostles until the truth was lost. we know the church will continue to grow now, which it is, and that it will never be taken off the earth again so get over it.
we have no annual shake down for money genius. nice try - other religions do make its money off its members, and they do shake them down.
@solowookie You are very amusing; you ※ wish ※ all I had was a single quote. So your numbers argument ought not give rise to the church of JS boasting & besting others. About BoM, I choose to believe B.H. Robert's Studies of the Book of Mormon et al than any number of silly, subjective, teary testiphonies, & as for your D&C, David Whitmer's An Address To All Believers In Christ et al. There are those to whom honesty is more important than loyalty & who bear the testimony of Christ. Is that you?
@Shulamitefire it doesn't matter what you have my knowledge & beliefs are based upon a personal relationship with my Savior. I have investigated a number of claims including yours. you have the right to choose, but your goal is to infringe upon my right to choose. my honesty is of great importance and feeds my loyalty. the more honest I am with myself the more it reinforces my beliefs, and the more loyal I become to my Savior. that loyalty to the church is in complete harmony with my Savior
@solowookie It is the Monson movement of Moroni that frequently & systematically bears blatant false witness against the blessed & beloved body & bride of Christ. Christians fully intend to defend the church of Christ against all cults of counterfeit & lead their captives, & whosoever will, into the liberty & splendor of Jesus Christ. As long as belief in any church is deemed as authoritative as the Lord Jesus Christ, such a person is seriously impaired in ability to discern the Spirit of Truth.
@Shulamitefire Christ never went on the attack like you have so it is a nice theory you have there, but it is not something you were taught to do by Christ, or anybody else in the Bible. we have the right to worship according to our own conscience, and we were given this right by Christ. When the apostles brought to His attention others were casting out devils in His name he instructed them to leave them along for those who were not against Him were with Him you will have to find a new excuse.
@solowookie You may heed your own words & not expect persons to believe that your double standard is righteous. It is the young, upstart religion of JS ever since its imbecilic inception who have been claiming that all other churches are false. That is the only way LDSism could gain a foothold, viz; bashing Bible belief & attempting to discredit all other churches. The Pharisees who prided themselves they were the only ones true were indeed those whom Jesus called hypocrites & whited sepulchers.
@Shulamitefire I don't expect people to 'heed' I expect them to be smart enough to find out for themselves. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints gained a foot hold because it taught / teaches people how to cultivate a relationship with God, and get answers for themselves. we aren't the ones 'bashing' we are defending. people like you bring the bashing to us. most religions teach that multiple religions cannot be true. God does not change what he teaches 'depending on the hearer'.
@solowookie That you have been massively mormonized perhaps indoctrinated from an early age I do not expect "to be smart enough to find out for themselves." It takes revelation of the Spirit of Truth, not the devilation of any self appointed prophet whose flesh & ambition is energized for gold, glory & girls. The roots of Mormonism are rotten. But it takes courage for a member to study past the sanitized, revisionist, unrealistic romanticization designed to prop the faith of the weakest member.
@Shulamitefire and that is your response simply because your mind cannot wrap its hands around the possibility that any other possil else exists. to you that is the only 'reasonable' explanation. that does not change reality that we may know something that you don't. so is it the belief in God that you have a problem with, or the fact that people can cultivate a relationship with God and get answers directly from Him?
I have studied anti Mormon literature I'm not afraid of it - nice try...
"God does not change what he teaches 'depending on the hearer'. Thanks for the afternoon entertainment. If for even a moment you back off a pace or two from having your face pressed against the wall of Mormon, you just might catch a glimpse that such is exactly that which Smith could not/did not want to know, as is the case with every cult that counterfeits Bible. Even David Whitmer came to realize that & said so expressly. Smith tickles the itching ears of the people turning them unto fables.
@Shulamitefire nice job dodging the question there. I am aware of what David 'believed' and I respect his right to choose, and believe what he wants I am not David's judge rather Christ is. you judge everyone based upon your own understanding. the problem with that action is that you a fallible, and you do not know everything (just like the rest of us). to judge everyone else on that makes your world pretty small.
@solowookie About judging others, we are to hold them accountable to the Light & Truth of Scripture or rebuke & reprove them. We have responsibility to contend for the faith cf. Jude v. 3 The Bible came long before Smith & is that Standard given of God by which He intends all other writings to be judged. Without that Standard is the sorry state of being blown about by every wind of doctrine, following the commandments of mere men, whilst having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof.
@Shulamitefire the Bible I read, the KJV, teaches things like 'judge not that ye be not judged' etc. it makes it a point that we don't judge others as typical we 'cannot remove the mote when we have a beam' in our own eye. the Savior very pointed told us not to judge others because our judgements are hypocritical. the reality is judgement is reserved for Christ, and those to whom He has given authority. only the Catholics or Mormons have any 'claim' on authority you don't seem to be either.
@solowookie Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
12 Therefore many of them believed; also of honourable women which were Greeks, and of men, not a few.
@Shulamitefire well - I study scriptures one in the morning, once and night, and then also at night with my family so I've got your scripture reading covered. this does not state how / why you think you have authority to judge others.
@MormonsLoveFamilies my family loves to study the scriptures it makes my house more peaceful. it has been 2.5 years since we missed a time reading together, and the difference is night & day.
@MormonsLoveFamilies my wife had some medical issues, and had not been able to put on a pair of shoes for over 4 years. when we started reading every day as a family she slowly got better every day. while her issues did not completely go away she improved greatly. one night we were on vacation, and sick so we skipped a night. the next morning all her old symptoms were back,but when we read the next night her health returned, and that is the last time we missed.
@MormonsLoveFamilies If an LDS father earns the celestial kingdom, his daughter is admitted to the terrestrial, his son the telestial, his wife outer darkness, will they all live happily together or will they be separated? I seek understanding why there is such emphasis by the LDS on families together forever as though this is the exclusive right of every LDS. I believe my family whose spirits are sealed to Christ in salvation shall all be joyfully together as family through endless ages. Thanks
@solowookie Jude 3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort [you] that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
@solowookie Primarily the ontology of God & the soteriolgy of man is at issue, in that order of importance, & the devilation passed off as revelation... by Smith & spiders is an affront to the Creator & Father of glory & a grave disservice to His cherished creation. Smith with impudent & profligate disregard spit in Jesus face & trampled underfoot the New Covenant that teaches a man is to have one wife. Not only did he do it himself lying about it but taught others the same. What love is that?
@Shulamitefire you state one perspective, and you are entitled to that opinion. I told you before I am not getting into a polygamy debate save it to state I have done my own research, praying, etc. and I have my own answers on what Joseph was commanded to do. it is a sensitive subject and I will not debate it.
If their God is omnipotent, He could have made a way for ALL to participate. Because of this I REJECT their trinitarian Jesus. I refuse to accept a God who is so uncaring, unloving, and unjust that He ignores the prayers and pleadings of the vast majortiy of His human creations.
This will send me to their hell, but I do this of my own free will and choice. In their hell, I will be among the billions who were never given a free will and choice.
@GaryKColeman And neither are you without excuse. Mormons are not a special case, irregardless of their supposed sense of spiritual superiority. Their biggest downfall is their pride & presumption of going beyond that which the Spirit of Scripture is saying, as though they know better, rather than enduring sound doctrine, commonly characteristic of all the cults counterfeiting Christianity.
@GaryKColeman And neither are you without excuse. Mormons are not a special case, irregardless of their supposed sense of spiritual superiority. Their biggest downfall is their pride & presumption of going beyond that which the Spirit of Scripture is saying, as though they know better, rather than enduring sound doctrine, commonly characteristic of all the cults counterfeiting Christianity.
While many in their hell are the evil and wicked of the world, many are innocent souls who tried to conduct their lives to the best of their knowledge and abilities. There are hundreds of millions who would have accepted the True Son of God had they been given the chance.
The trinitarian God created more souls to be condemned to hell than will ever be exalted to heaven.
They have absolutely nothing to offer me. I see no reason to abandon my beliefs
@GaryKColeman Mormons accuse Christians of easy believism & greasy grace yet would give unrepentant child molesters a free pass into heaven. Is that your belief in & worship of a Just Judge? If it is you are given to the wrong God & have decidedly taken sides with His archenemy.
@GaryKColeman That Jesus passionately preached eight times more about hell than heaven & suffered ineffably excruciating agony & anguish all the way to & at the cross should give you some understanding & great gratitude for the utmost sufficiency of His sacrifice in every person's stead. Do not blame the beautiful, innocent passover Lamb of God that people as free moral agents chose & do choose hell instead of Him! Be duly warned that in so doing you are crucifying the worthy Son of God afresh!
What do the trinitarians have to offer the world? Their trinitarian God created this world, provided billions of souls to occupy it, and sent a Redeemer to save those souls so they could return to Heaven. However, He made a limited effort to give those billions access to the key of redemption--the chance to know that Redeemer and ACCEPT or REJECT Him. Then He condemns those billions to hell because they didn't accept the Redeemer the majority never even heard of.
@GaryKColeman The Redeemer made a "limited effort"? That is an astounding accusation! Certainly, God gave each person free agency, & just as certainly, it is, therefore, Himself Whom you should NOT blame that persons go to hell. Jesus spoke 8 times as much about heaven as He did about hell. Rom.1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, [EVEN] his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are WITHOUT EXCUSE.
John 3:5 "...Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God."
Mark 16:16 "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
Unless Jesus made an exception somewhere, that sounds like the final word. For example, the millions who lived on the American continents until 1492, never heard of Jesus, never believed Him to be the Son of God, and were never baptized. Is it their fault?
@GaryKColeman Your usage of verse 5 is not in context of the immediate verses 4 & 6. They show luminously clear that Jesus is comparing physical birth with spiritual birth to teach that physical birth alone is not enough for a person to see the kingdom of God. Nicodemus asked Jesus if a man can enter his mother's womb a second time & be born again. Jesus' answer is that which is born of the flesh is flesh, i.e. physical birth & that which is born of the Spirit is spirit i.e. spiritual birth.
@GaryKColeman Again you are using isogesis. If baptism in water was necessary for salvation Jesus and His apostles would have directed same on every occasion baptism in Christ was mentioned. That it is a command I concur, but that a person forfeits their salvation by not being dunked in water is legalism, the letter of the law, void of the Spirit. Do tell, will you be saved because you actually kept every commandment? At Mk. 16:16 notice that the second part of the v. does not denote water.
So, baptism has nothing to do with salvation, and creation has revealed the invisible things of the Creator so all understand and none have an excuse.
That tells me that we don't need churches, preachers, missionaries, etc.. We don't even need scriptures if all we need for salvation has been revealed at creation.
When Jesus sent His disciples to preach the gospel & baptize believers, was He sending them on a fool's errand?
@GaryKColeman You did not answer whether you have kept all the commandments. You would condemn persons to no salvation in Christ because they were not baptized? Water baptism is an outward, often public expression of an inward reality & transformation having occurred, to wit, repentance & faith, of having been baptized INTO CHRIST. There is no power whatsoever in water or water baptism into the LDS church, or any other church; the Power Is Christ, baptism (Greek: immersion.) into Him. See Rom.6.
@GaryKColeman It is not a case of *** either/or ***; it is a matter of our magnificent & mighty Maker using *** both *** in His time & in His way as He deems needful & best. That He Is faithful & just there ought not to be any doubt whatsoever. When human instrumentality, the arm of flesh is inadequate, the Beautiful God is not limited. King Jesus is not up in heaven pacing back & forth worrying about imperfect churches, preachers & missionaries going in & out of the anointing of the Holy Ghost.
@GaryKColeman No, look at that particular passage in Rom. 1 again for context & note especially v. 25 which addresses your question front on: "Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen." The one who worships creation rather than/more than the Creator exchanges the truth of God for a lie. Therefore, I think it should be obvious that their Creator God's response to each one is vastly different.
Billions have believed in and worshipped a "creator," but they all had different names.
Jesus continually taught that He was the Way, the Truth, and the Life, that He was the only way to the Father, that His name was the only name by which man could be saved.
I have looked at nature for over 60 years. No where have I seen anything that testifies that Jesus Christ is the Creator. I have only seen His Name in the scriptures.
@GaryKColeman So suppose you tell me that which the Holy Spirit intends to be known through the apostle Paul having written the passage we are presently looking at & I hope when I have more time we shall address this further. Until then I will though leave you with Ps. 19 & with the idea that in the name of Jesus is more than merely a name by letter or sound but essentially expression of His nature & attributes, that is, His eternal power & Godhead revealed in creation as Creator.
From what you have presented, I conclude that as long as a person is worshipping his God as The Creator, he can be saved from hell and exalted into the Kingdom of Heaven. It doesn't matter if that God's name is Amun-Ra, Odin, or Allah; the devout have as good a chance for salvation as any others.
I also conclude that there is no need to change my beliefs. As long as I worship The Creator, I can obtain Salvation.
@GaryKColeman Oh, & of course, they must have paid their tithe money & be temple worthy which falls out that many, many more people shall not be able to be baptized into the Monson movement of Moroni..
@GaryKColeman You think that there will ever be enough Mormons to baptize the multi-billions of people? According to your Joe foolery people can live like the devil & unrepentant enter into heaven, defiling heaven.. WOW!
Emanuel Swedenborg & Joseph Smith would have had more than a litte in common.
@GaryKColeman I have addressed the Scriptures you have presented. Please, if you would, address the Rom. 1 verse concerning creation making known & shown the Creator, manifesting even His eternal power & Godhead so that people are without excuse. Pay attention to the preceding & following verse for Christ context.
@Shulamitefire "Mormondom has been COLLAPSING for YEARS. As Dan Peterson this month stated for YEARS LDS church growth has been FALLING"
There is a DIFFERENCE between collapsing and FALLING. Collapsing would be EVANGELICALS and falling from unbelievable growth would be LDS. Please do NOT put words in Dan Peterson's mouth.
But the 2010 Census found that Utah, home to the headquarters for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and to the nation's largest Mormon population, was the second-fastest-growing state in the last decade, seeing a 24 percent population spike.
@omiolo "According to the Church’s Member and Statistical Records Division, first-generation members made up 64% of total Church membership as of July 2006 Per David Stewart, 70% to 80% are inactive."Sociologist Armand Mauss estimates that 50 percent of LDS converts within the United States stop attending within a year of conversion, and 75 percent of foreign converts fail to attend after a year." MormonWiki Population & Growth
@omiolo FYI: Ballard and other speakers acknowledged that the Utah-based faith was worried about massive losses of members in this age group [18-30]— one of the reasons behind the change in ward structure — and challenged those in attendance to bring at least one other person back into the fold. Utah News in The Salt Lake Tribune April 27 2011
@Shulamitefire "the Utah-based faith was worried about massive losses of members in this age group [18-30"
yes, we will leave the 99 and go in search of the ONE lost sheep.
I fear you quote mine so that you do NOT have to deal with the impending collapse of EVANGELICALS. Google those last three words and you will see what FELLOW EVANGELICALS are predicting. Of course the collapse of EVANGELICALS means ONE thing. Time to ATTACK the Mormons more. LOL
@omiolo Thanks & please properly take note of the word "WORRIED" & the phrase "MASSIVE LOSSES" to the church of Joseph Smith. I provided the stats & sources of same showing SEVERAL denominations FAR outpacing LDSism. Even MORMON sources stated admit to widespread LDS church exaggeration of growth, even in Conference. Shall I serve up another sampling to you? You insist on fooling yourself but that is no small measure due your having giving yourself over to the spirit that is THE MORMON DELUSION.
† Christ Jesus beckons you to leave off the smythology & twistology of theology & come unto Himself, the King of veritology, & King of ALL kings, Who Is exceedingly more beautiful, more honourable, more powerful than the spirits that channelled through Joe Smith & spiders have or ever would have you believe.
Jesus loves you the way you are but loves you too much to leave you that way. You do not have to go on in this life being spun & spinning. Selah
@omiolo, my finely feathered friend, in your effort to manipulate the message of Dan Peterson for your own subversive purposes you were sure to leave off the LATTER part that reads as follows:
"Church growth has been falling for years, AND our current rate of missionary success is the lowest it's been for decades." Daniel C. Peterson For Mormon Times in Deseret News April 7, 2011 (emphasis, mine)
@omiolo It is inference that you are like "that god," which errantly according to LDS scriptures has a physical body due, at least in part, to the misappropriation of the literary device known as Hebraism, in this case, for example, as in Psalms 91:4 He shall cover thee with his FEATHERS, and under His WINGS shalt thou trust: his truth [shall be thy] shield and buckler.
@omiolo I disagree that the LDS church is the 1st, 2nd, or even 3rd or 4th fastest growing church. Look at the stats I provided & the sources from which those stats were taken. Seventh-Day Adventists, Southern Baptists, Assemblies of God, & Evangelical (5.6 percent annual growth) & Pentecostal churches (7.3 percent annual growth) have all been outpacing the LDS church. The Orthodox church with 300 million members & the oldest church community in the world (approx. 2000 y.o.) is interesting.
Temple blessings and welfare principles highlighted Sunday's topics as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints concluded its 181st annual general conference.
And LDS Church President Thomas S. Monson touched on both subjects in one of his two addresses Sunday, declaring the church's welfare program as "inspired of Almighty God" and speaking of a myriad of Mormon temples -- from those in Kirtland and Salt Lake to New Zealand, Tahiti and Brazil and the one under construction in Rome.
Plenty of the remaining apples will taste fine despite their blemishes and maybe some of the apples need some work to prepare and make them ready, but if you never choose an apple to cut out the bruise and polish it; it just stays in the barrel.
.In the church it is easy to fall into the "Women are daughters of God and wonderful just in their existence" and that they are un-flawed gems of inestimable value, and that it is all the single guys fault for not "manning up" It seems to me at this point at our ages, all the apples in the barrel are bruised and seconds, a bit warty and off. Both sides need to be more accepting of what is left in the barrel.
Don't be put off by the title. The term "social justice" evokes political connotations in modern America, but the concept itself is scriptural. The Book of Mormon, like the Bible, has strong opinions about what sorts of societies are more just or more righteous than others. (In Hebrew there is a single word, tzedek, which can be translated into English as either "justice" or "righteousness," and the same is true of the Greek word dikaiosune; the two ideas are intimately connected).
"Stimulated by whiskey and hidden behind blackened faces, a gang of more than two dozen men dragged Joseph from his bed during the night of March 24, 1832."
drugs, and disguises typically are the ANTImormon ways!!
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If you have not seen them yet, three YouTube videos to definitely not miss are:
"'Home Invasion': No on Prop 8 ad directed toward Mormon Church" by jonahtrainer
"Mrs. Betty Bowers: Less is Mormon!" by MrsBettyBowers
-and-
"Mormon Church Defends Prop 8 and Marriage(s)" by lezazacomedy
RCSVirginia 3 weeks ago
youtubeDOTcom /watch?v=v-bWz74h518
superlativeOFgood 2 months ago
@superlativeOFgood I want you to know that God loves you.
MormonsLoveFamilies 2 months ago
joesph smith was not an innocent man when he was killed. Look it up, smith orderd the destruction of a printing press of a anti-mormon paper. smith also shot 3 men in the Carthage jail ."Smith used a small pepper-box pistol that Cyrus Wheelock had given him when Wheelock had visited the jail earlier that day. Three of the six barrels misfired, but the other three shots injured at least three of the attackers."
Look up the horrors of the "Mountain Meadows massacre"mormons killed innocent children
superlativeOFgood 2 months ago 2
mormon hitting a man with a rake for doing the same thing that mormons do.
youtubeDOTcom /watch?v=v-bWz74h518
mormons are no better. No tolerance in Utah for non mormons.
superlativeOFgood 2 months ago
NARROWSBURG, NY -- Young men representing 38 troops from stakes afar abreast as Wilmington, Del., Albany County, NY, Hartford, Conn., and Long Island, NY, along with more than 100 adult priesthood leaders, .
omiolo 5 months ago
38 Mormon Scout troops attend annual encampment
omiolo 5 months ago
Whether it's a pioneer handcart trek, youth conference or a service project, Mormon young men and women from around the country are staying busy this summer. Young members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints ...
omiolo 5 months ago
If all goes as planned, the LDS Church soon will be building its first French temple -- probably outside of Paris near the famed Versailles palace.
omiolo 5 months ago
Customarily, new temples are announced by the president of the Church at one of the Church's general conferences, after local government building approvals and property acquisition have been secured. Although the local government approval process for the French temple is still under way, French newspapers were already reporting Church plans to build at Le Chesnay, near Versailles, and this prompted today's announcement. . .
omiolo 5 months ago
Mormonism is anything but truth. Why won't official mormon sights let me post my comments without 1st approving them? What do they have to fear.
I wanted to comment on all the blasphemous statements that the official LDS sight says about Jesus that they conveniently left out such as>
Jesus is the spirit brother of satan. (the devil)
Jesus was not always God but came about by an act of sex between one of God's wifes & a sexual act between Mary & God to produce His physical body.
digger629 6 months ago
@digger629 I want you to know that God loves you.
MormonsLoveFamilies 6 months ago
@MormonsLoveFamilies
I know God loves me. I know God loves you also.
But most of all I want you to know God hates false doctrine. God has exhaulted His Word above His Name. (Psa.138:2)
God's Word is Holy.
To mis-represent God's Word is a sin. Do you agree?
I'm not looking for an argument with you...Just to expose error & false teaching whereever it is found, & I find lots of it in mormonism.
I love all mormons... I love you... I hate the doctrines & teachings of mormonism.
digger629 6 months ago
@digger629 God still loves you.
MormonsLoveFamilies 6 months ago
@MormonsLoveFamilies
Are you willing to defend Mormon doctrine by answering my questions?
digger629 6 months ago
@digger629 U know how to use a cliché!
dorisfenella 6 months ago
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@dorisfenella
U know how to use a cliché!
What do you mean?
digger629 6 months ago
@digger629 "I want you to know God hate"
your god is a HATEFUL god? You must be EVANGELICAL, probably WESTBORO BAPTIST??
omiolo 5 months ago
@MormonsLoveFamilies
Will you answer my questions about mormonism?
Truth has nothing to fear from a examination.
Truth will expose the false.
Remember:> People don't hide something unless there is something to hide.
digger629 6 months ago
@digger629 Can you even give a name of 1 of these sites. You also speak as though they're the only 1's who do it. It's actually a fairly common practice. People who own things have the right to do whatever they want with them.
GlennRoxWyo 5 months ago
@digger629 "Why won't official mormon sights let me post my comments without 1st approving them?"
because Mormons have standards and like to keep things family oriented. Once you can get you and your ANTImormon cohorts to STOP with the filth, then it will happen.
omiolo 5 months ago
@omiolo
You mormons are soooo blind & deaf. I quote nothing but official mormon literature, which BTW you mormons call anti-mormon. Your own literature is your own worst enemy. It exposes your group for what it really is...FALSE.
You like to use the name of Jesus Christ, but your jesus christ is no t the One described in Scripture
I am not anti-mormon. I am anti false teachers. I love all mormons I hate your false doctrines that come straight from satan..
digger629 5 months ago
@digger629 "You mormons are soooo blind & deaf"
To EVIL And PORNOGRAPHY yes! To your POINTLESS swipes at us, we are BORED.
omiolo 5 months ago
@digger629
I'm no fan of Mormon doctrine, having been steeped in it from infancy, but the Mormon people are every bit as "Christian" as folks like yourself. If you really cared about them then you would realize that they are no more lost than you are. Your kind of love is divisive and conditional. I love many Mormons personally, and accept them just as they are; I don't want to change them, I merely wish that they would accept me as I accept them; unconditionally, despite our differences.
5avan10 5 months ago
@5avan10 Continued:
When you tell Mormons that their doctrine comes straight from Satan it accomplishes nothing. You follow the teachings of men just as they do; you rely on human translations and preaching just as they do. You'll convert nobody using your methods; you only put up walls. They thrive on their persecution complex. Their version of reality is no more tenuous than yours, their faith in it no less true. Would you change your faith if someone told you your doctrine was of Satan?
5avan10 5 months ago
@5avan10
Do you not understand or care that false beliefs about God, Jesus, salvation, etc. leads to eternal damnation? (Hell) Do I just ignore everyone who has been misled by some false teacher, guru, etc. who has claimed they have the way to eternal life (Heaven) when in fact they are in opposition to what God in His word has revealed? To keep silent about this for the sake of not offending anyone is not love but hate.
Am I become your enemy because I tell you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
digger629 5 months ago
@digger629 Do you believe that everyone who believes differently than you will burn in Hell? I can not believe in a God who is supposed to be all loving, yet one who tortures people eternally merely for choosing the wrong religion. As a former Mormon, I am trying to give you insight that they are not worried about your threats of Hell. To them, it is you who are misled by false doctrines. I hope you can see that you will never persuade anyone by attacking their cherished dogma.
5avan10 5 months ago
@5avan10
Yes, I do believe that anyone who believes different than me will spend eternity in hell. There is only one way to have eternal life. Jesus christ is that way. Not satans brother, but God who took on humanity so He could die, by shedding His redeeming blood on a cross, not in a garden as Mormonism teaches.
I will not stop attacking Mormon doctrine...It is false & I will expose it for anyone who wants to see its errors.
Remember; The deceived do not know they are deceived.
digger629 5 months ago
@5avan10
As for you not believing in a God that sends people to hell, that is a false belief also. God does not send anyone to hell. People go there by their own free choice. God has done everything He can to keep us from going there & what He did for us doesn't cost us anything. Salvation is a free gift.
I can't believe in a God that would make anyone spend eternity with Him in Heaven when they reject Him & don't want any part of Him here on earth. Can you?
digger629 5 months ago
@digger629
There is a fundamental disconnect when you claim that your god is both omnipotent and omnibenevolent, and then blithely assert that most of his creation is crap and thus must be tortured forever. Would you ever allow your children to be tortured, for any reason? Of course not.
You don't understand that persecution only strengthens a Mormon's testimony. If you really cared about helping them, you would try to understand them.
And your attacks will convert nobody, anywhere, ever.
5avan10 5 months ago
@5avan10
And on the subject of Hell... according to you, many of the people you know, including probably members of your own family, will be sent there. Could you, in Heaven, really be happy knowing the torture they are enduring? I could not. If I was somehow transformed into a being who no longer cared about their fate, then I would no longer be me. So you see, I could never be in your version of Heaven, because I care too much about my fellow man to call such a place "Heaven."
5avan10 5 months ago
@5avan10
My attacks are not against you or any Mormon. My attack is against error & lies. I have studied cults for a long time, & yes, they do thrive on persecution.
My Bible says, John 8:32>And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
Most Mormons are not interested in knowing the truth. They have a great family life, & that satisfies them.
If I don't let them know the errors of Mormonism...Who will? Not you!
They will all die & go to hell. I don't want that to happen.
digger629 5 months ago
@digger629
I do share what I know now with them. I want to "pay it forward" and help them set themselves free, as I have found freedom due to the efforts of others. I want them to be happy, and if they are truly happy in their Mormon lives, so be it. I know from experience, though, that many of them are not really happy; they are merely putting on an act, for fear of disappointing their family and/or their god. And my point is simply this; that a frontal attack is not a persuasive tactic.
5avan10 5 months ago
@5avan10
It is not my goal just to have a person leave Mormonism. I want them to come to the real God, the real Jesus, the real Word of God, the real Holy Spirit & receive the free gift of salvation.
Most Mormons are good, honest people.
Life on this earth is short. Eternity is a long time. Get my point?
I am concerned about you also. You left Mormonism for atheism. From the frying pan into the fire. I know cults make many bitter against God. Cults mess up your mind. I'm praying for you.
digger629 5 months ago
@digger629 Thanks, I appreciate your concern for me. I think expressions like your last one are much more effective at helping people soften their hearts so that they can try to see your perspective. I doubt that I will ever come to believe in any god, because I am compelled to believe what makes sense to me, and personal deity simply doesn't. Nevertheless, you should feel free to pray for me if it brings you comfort. I am very happy with my life outside of Mormonism / theism.
5avan10 5 months ago
Comment removed
digger629 6 months ago
SAN PEDRO CUTUD, Philippines -- At least 24 Filipinos were nailed to crosses to re-enact Jesus Christ's suffering in a Good Friday rite rejected by Catholic church leaders but witnessed by throngs of believers and thousands of tourists.
omiolo 10 months ago
Easter was coming up soon, and we wanted the best speaker we could possibly get. In our planning meeting, somone suggested, "Why don't we ask George Albert Smith, the president of the church?"
We all thought that was a great idea, but we wondered if it could be possible. We wrote him a letter, inviting him. To our great surprise, he said, "Yes.".
omiolo 10 months ago
@omiolo George Albert Smith. His name came up yesterday.
MormonsLoveFamilies 6 months ago
BYU Cougarettes stun competition, win national Hip Hop championship
omiolo 10 months ago
@omiolo National Champions.
MormonsLoveFamilies 10 months ago
And in that moment of clarity, Black said he realized something: He was different, and that disparity now made him one of the many bad words his Mormon church and conservative military lifestyle had said. From "unholy, unnatural (and) unworthy," as the .
omiolo 10 months ago
Lisa Olson Some of the 400 cast members in the 70th annual Arizona Easter Pageant of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints practice in March 2008 on the temporary stage north of the Mormon Temple in Mesa. 8 pm daily through Saturday. ...
omiolo 10 months ago
You "temple worthy" Mormons who believe bamboozled you can baptize by proxy for those who haven't heard the gospel of Joseph Smith must pay your way into Mormon "heaven" with your tithe money which recipients do not even have the integrity to divulge to its temple patrons/supporters the financials thereof. So very unlike the Christian churches such really is. Mormondom is mammon at the top, Moroni blowing the trumpet "Pay before entering!" Mormon = trumpet for the cross, water for Jesus' blood!
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
You should have written as long as I worship The True Creator & worship in manner acceptable to Him I can obtain True Salvation. The Christian Scriptures are replete that all afflicted with mormonosis have a false gospel, a false spirit, a false Jesus & follow false prophets & apostles. You think that there will ever be enough Mormons to baptize multi-billions of people? According to your Joe foolery people can live like the devil & unrepentant enter into 1 of 3 heavens defiling heaven.. WOW!
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
Is that actually what you believe the Holy Spirit is speaking? You say persons have an excuse; Rom. 1:20 states they are without excuse. You ignored Ps. 19. You have said that creation reveals nothing to you of the true Creator. Is this for you because the letters of the name of Jesus are not emblazoned across the sky or because your spirit is not surrendered & susceptible to the superscendent splendor of the Son? Can you be trusted to be telling the truth? Your isogesis of the Bible fails you.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
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Romans 1:20
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, [even] his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
Psalms 19
4 Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,
5 Which [is] as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, [and] rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.
6 His going forth [is] from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort [you] that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
The KJV which I read, & has not Smith's foolish JST footnotes, tells those who have ears to hear what the Spirit is saying that believers are to be boldly Berean & thereby ***judge*** all truth claims by the basis of the Bible. Neglect that & you are vulnerable to every vain & villainous thought, desire & imagination that vaunts itself against Christ, the Word of God & that which the Spirit of Scripture is saying. Other than & anyone can appoint self as prophet & promote polygamy & polyandry
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
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(cont'd) The castration attempt might be taken as evidence that the mob felt that Joseph had committed a sexual impropriety; since the attempt is reported by [Marinda's brother who became LDS apostle] Luke Johnson, there is no good reason to doubt it. Also, they had planned the operation in advance, as they brought along a doctor to perform it.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
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(cont'd) The castration attempt might be taken as evidence that the mob felt that Joseph had committed a sexual impropriety; since the attempt is reported by [Marinda's brother who became LDS apostle] Luke Johnson, there is no good reason to doubt it. Also, they had planned the operation in advance, as they brought along a doctor to perform it.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
LDS author Todd Compton wrote, “The motivation for this mobbing has been debated. Clark Braden…alleged…that Marinda’s brother Eli led a mob against Smith because the prophet had been too intimate with Marinda. This tradition suggests that Smith may have married Marinda at this early time, and some circumstantial factors support such a possibility.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
(cont'd) During this same period, other international missionary-oriented faiths have reported accelerating growth, including the Seventh-Day Adventists, Southern Baptists, Assemblies of God, and Evangelical (5.6 percent annual growth) and Pentecostal churches (7.3 percent annual growth). For 2004, 241,239 LDS convert baptisms were reported, the lowest number of converts since 1987. MormonWiki
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
(cont'd) "A closer examination of growth and retention data demonstrates that LDS growth trends have been widely overstated. Annual LDS growth has progressively declined from over 5 percent in the late 1980s to less than 3 percent from 2000 to 2005. Since 1990, LDS missionaries have been challenged to double the number of baptisms, but instead the number of baptisms per missionary has halved.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
Mormons and media outlets frequently appeal to their religion's growth rate as an evidence of its truthfulness. Mormon author David G. Stewart, Jr. writes on the recurring theme and the overstatements that often accompany it... In a recent General Conference, the Church of Jesus Christ was described not only as being prolific, but also as retaining and keeping active 'a higher percentage of our members' than any other major church of which the speaker was aware. "
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
(cont'd) The first revelations had been received in 1831, by historian Danel Bachman’s dating. Also, Joseph did tend to marry women who had stayed at his house or in whose house he had stayed” (In Sacred Loneliness, page 231).
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
(cont'd) The castration attempt might be taken as evidence that the mob felt that Joseph had committed a sexual impropriety; since the attempt is reported by [Marinda's brother who became LDS apostle] Luke Johnson, there is no good reason to doubt it. Also, they had planned the operation in advance, as they brought along a doctor to perform it.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
Following a joint Jewish-Mormon dinner in the Hillel dining hall, Harvard students gathered to hear Mark Paredes, a Mormon who writes a column for the Jewish Journal of Greater Los Angeles on Latter Day Saints-Jewish relations. Paredes, as Yair Rosenberg '11-'12, the organizer of the event, put it, has devoted his life to "explaining Jews to Mormons, and Mormons to Jews."
omiolo 10 months ago
And his presence immediately catalyzed a no-holds barred discussion on every issue that had previously driven a wedge between LDS Church members and Jews--leaving me far more enlightened than after any other interfaith event I've been to on Harvard's campus.
omiolo 10 months ago
op•ti•mism |ˈäptəˌmizəm
1 hopefulness and confidence about the future or the successful outcome of something
2 the belief that good must ultimately prevail over evil in the universe.
Restoration1830 10 months ago
Mormon church's spring conference continues
Idaho Press-Tribune
omiolo 10 months ago
Faithful Mormons will gather to hear words of inspiration from their leaders Sunday, the second day of their church's semiannual general conference.
The two-day conference draws more than 100,000 to the four-block downtown Salt Lake City campus of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The event comes just days before the church marks its 181st anniversary on April 6.
omiolo 10 months ago
Mormon researchers who pay close attention to LDS Church growth throughout the world see a hint of improvement in the number of converts who progress from baptism to become fully active, faithful Mormons.
omiolo 10 months ago
@omiolo I think this is important.
MormonsLoveFamilies 10 months ago
L. Tom Perry, with big hands and an even bigger grin, is the oldest and tallest living Mormon apostle. He also might be the least well-known.
And that, say those who know him, is no accident.
omiolo 10 months ago
@supergeek46 I have noticed that quality people use quality language. You continue to exemplify such. Congrats.
omiolo 10 months ago
That Smith was not actually castrated for girls & women he went after, including other men's wives, & his threats of slander & making false promises in the holy name of God to coerce & manipulate them & theirs is somewhat of a surprise. Ever since he began poisoning the minds & sullying the spirits of his followers toward the churches Mormons have been blatantly bearing false witness against the blessed & beloved body & bride of Christ. God ※ loves ※ anti-Christ Mormons; Jesus beckons them.
Shulamitefire 11 months ago
@Shulamitefire Stephen, you seem to like kicking against the pricks. things must be going really bad with your congregation there.
omiolo 10 months ago
@omiolo Thanks, incendiumata omiolio, what about the following congregation?
"But we may have become complacent. Don't we send out full-time missionaries? Isn't that enough? Aren't we "the fastest growing religion"? Actually, we're not. Church growth has been falling for years, and our current rate of missionary success is the lowest it's been for decades." Daniel C. Peterson For Mormon Times in Deseret News April 7, 2011
Our hearts an altar, Christ's love the living flames
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire "what about the following congregation?"
Bennett,
is the your way of AVOIDING the coming collapse of EVANGELICALS? Because we are now the second fast growing Church instead of the first? LOL
omiolo 10 months ago
@omiolo ※※※
Mormondom has been COLLAPSING for YEARS. As Dan Peterson this month stated for YEARS LDS church growth has been FALLING & the LDS church's rate of missionary success is the LOWEST it's been for DECADES. WOW Omioliolio you really ARE delusional. The Truth shall set you free but you must be willing. Religion will never do for you that which only relationship in Christ can do. The LDS church cult has been for MANY YEARS hemorrhaging at its Smith-stitched seams due to the internet ! ! !
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire if the church is in such bad shape then why are we continually building new temples, add new stakes due to growth, building churches etc?
solowookie 10 months ago
@solowookie Perhaps you should ask Daniel C. Peterson at BYU; he made the statement. Are you suggesting that you disbelieve his statement made in the Deseret News?
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire the church went from 13 million in 2007 to 14 million in 2010. we continue to build and fill those buildings I hardly believe it is the dire straights you are suggesting. when you realize how strict this religion is, and how strongly society is set against it, I would say that growth rate is phenomenal.
solowookie 10 months ago
@solowookie Your high flying Daniel C. Peterson made the statement for Mormon Times in Deseret News; I quoted him. Doubtless, the church likes to keep up appearances as they have money to burn with their service to mammon. Do you recall that which Jesus spoke about attempting to serve two masters? What you have is corporation with its big fat ass plunked down on the seat of religion. Yours is the only one we know of in which leaders hold an annual shake down of its members for their tithe money.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire you have a single quote, and because you have a single quote 'the church isn't true' anymore? growth rates fluctuated in the Book of Mormon, and even with Christs original 12 apostles until the truth was lost. we know the church will continue to grow now, which it is, and that it will never be taken off the earth again so get over it.
we have no annual shake down for money genius. nice try - other religions do make its money off its members, and they do shake them down.
solowookie 10 months ago
@solowookie Well stated.
MormonsLoveFamilies 10 months ago
@solowookie You are very amusing; you ※ wish ※ all I had was a single quote. So your numbers argument ought not give rise to the church of JS boasting & besting others. About BoM, I choose to believe B.H. Robert's Studies of the Book of Mormon et al than any number of silly, subjective, teary testiphonies, & as for your D&C, David Whitmer's An Address To All Believers In Christ et al. There are those to whom honesty is more important than loyalty & who bear the testimony of Christ. Is that you?
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire it doesn't matter what you have my knowledge & beliefs are based upon a personal relationship with my Savior. I have investigated a number of claims including yours. you have the right to choose, but your goal is to infringe upon my right to choose. my honesty is of great importance and feeds my loyalty. the more honest I am with myself the more it reinforces my beliefs, and the more loyal I become to my Savior. that loyalty to the church is in complete harmony with my Savior
solowookie 10 months ago
@solowookie It is the Monson movement of Moroni that frequently & systematically bears blatant false witness against the blessed & beloved body & bride of Christ. Christians fully intend to defend the church of Christ against all cults of counterfeit & lead their captives, & whosoever will, into the liberty & splendor of Jesus Christ. As long as belief in any church is deemed as authoritative as the Lord Jesus Christ, such a person is seriously impaired in ability to discern the Spirit of Truth.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire Christ never went on the attack like you have so it is a nice theory you have there, but it is not something you were taught to do by Christ, or anybody else in the Bible. we have the right to worship according to our own conscience, and we were given this right by Christ. When the apostles brought to His attention others were casting out devils in His name he instructed them to leave them along for those who were not against Him were with Him you will have to find a new excuse.
solowookie 10 months ago
@solowookie You may heed your own words & not expect persons to believe that your double standard is righteous. It is the young, upstart religion of JS ever since its imbecilic inception who have been claiming that all other churches are false. That is the only way LDSism could gain a foothold, viz; bashing Bible belief & attempting to discredit all other churches. The Pharisees who prided themselves they were the only ones true were indeed those whom Jesus called hypocrites & whited sepulchers.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire I don't expect people to 'heed' I expect them to be smart enough to find out for themselves. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints gained a foot hold because it taught / teaches people how to cultivate a relationship with God, and get answers for themselves. we aren't the ones 'bashing' we are defending. people like you bring the bashing to us. most religions teach that multiple religions cannot be true. God does not change what he teaches 'depending on the hearer'.
solowookie 10 months ago
@solowookie That you have been massively mormonized perhaps indoctrinated from an early age I do not expect "to be smart enough to find out for themselves." It takes revelation of the Spirit of Truth, not the devilation of any self appointed prophet whose flesh & ambition is energized for gold, glory & girls. The roots of Mormonism are rotten. But it takes courage for a member to study past the sanitized, revisionist, unrealistic romanticization designed to prop the faith of the weakest member.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire and that is your response simply because your mind cannot wrap its hands around the possibility that any other possil else exists. to you that is the only 'reasonable' explanation. that does not change reality that we may know something that you don't. so is it the belief in God that you have a problem with, or the fact that people can cultivate a relationship with God and get answers directly from Him?
I have studied anti Mormon literature I'm not afraid of it - nice try...
solowookie 10 months ago
"God does not change what he teaches 'depending on the hearer'. Thanks for the afternoon entertainment. If for even a moment you back off a pace or two from having your face pressed against the wall of Mormon, you just might catch a glimpse that such is exactly that which Smith could not/did not want to know, as is the case with every cult that counterfeits Bible. Even David Whitmer came to realize that & said so expressly. Smith tickles the itching ears of the people turning them unto fables.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire nice job dodging the question there. I am aware of what David 'believed' and I respect his right to choose, and believe what he wants I am not David's judge rather Christ is. you judge everyone based upon your own understanding. the problem with that action is that you a fallible, and you do not know everything (just like the rest of us). to judge everyone else on that makes your world pretty small.
solowookie 10 months ago
@solowookie About judging others, we are to hold them accountable to the Light & Truth of Scripture or rebuke & reprove them. We have responsibility to contend for the faith cf. Jude v. 3 The Bible came long before Smith & is that Standard given of God by which He intends all other writings to be judged. Without that Standard is the sorry state of being blown about by every wind of doctrine, following the commandments of mere men, whilst having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire the Bible I read, the KJV, teaches things like 'judge not that ye be not judged' etc. it makes it a point that we don't judge others as typical we 'cannot remove the mote when we have a beam' in our own eye. the Savior very pointed told us not to judge others because our judgements are hypocritical. the reality is judgement is reserved for Christ, and those to whom He has given authority. only the Catholics or Mormons have any 'claim' on authority you don't seem to be either.
solowookie 10 months ago
@solowookie Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
12 Therefore many of them believed; also of honourable women which were Greeks, and of men, not a few.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire well - I study scriptures one in the morning, once and night, and then also at night with my family so I've got your scripture reading covered. this does not state how / why you think you have authority to judge others.
solowookie 10 months ago
@solowookie How does your family receive it?
MormonsLoveFamilies 10 months ago
@MormonsLoveFamilies my family loves to study the scriptures it makes my house more peaceful. it has been 2.5 years since we missed a time reading together, and the difference is night & day.
solowookie 10 months ago
@solowookie That is a great witness of the power of scripture reading. Thank you.
MormonsLoveFamilies 10 months ago
@MormonsLoveFamilies my wife had some medical issues, and had not been able to put on a pair of shoes for over 4 years. when we started reading every day as a family she slowly got better every day. while her issues did not completely go away she improved greatly. one night we were on vacation, and sick so we skipped a night. the next morning all her old symptoms were back,but when we read the next night her health returned, and that is the last time we missed.
solowookie 10 months ago
@MormonsLoveFamilies If an LDS father earns the celestial kingdom, his daughter is admitted to the terrestrial, his son the telestial, his wife outer darkness, will they all live happily together or will they be separated? I seek understanding why there is such emphasis by the LDS on families together forever as though this is the exclusive right of every LDS. I believe my family whose spirits are sealed to Christ in salvation shall all be joyfully together as family through endless ages. Thanks
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
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@solowookie Jude 3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort [you] that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@solowookie Primarily the ontology of God & the soteriolgy of man is at issue, in that order of importance, & the devilation passed off as revelation... by Smith & spiders is an affront to the Creator & Father of glory & a grave disservice to His cherished creation. Smith with impudent & profligate disregard spit in Jesus face & trampled underfoot the New Covenant that teaches a man is to have one wife. Not only did he do it himself lying about it but taught others the same. What love is that?
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire you state one perspective, and you are entitled to that opinion. I told you before I am not getting into a polygamy debate save it to state I have done my own research, praying, etc. and I have my own answers on what Joseph was commanded to do. it is a sensitive subject and I will not debate it.
solowookie 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire
If their God is omnipotent, He could have made a way for ALL to participate. Because of this I REJECT their trinitarian Jesus. I refuse to accept a God who is so uncaring, unloving, and unjust that He ignores the prayers and pleadings of the vast majortiy of His human creations.
This will send me to their hell, but I do this of my own free will and choice. In their hell, I will be among the billions who were never given a free will and choice.
GaryKColeman 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman And neither are you without excuse. Mormons are not a special case, irregardless of their supposed sense of spiritual superiority. Their biggest downfall is their pride & presumption of going beyond that which the Spirit of Scripture is saying, as though they know better, rather than enduring sound doctrine, commonly characteristic of all the cults counterfeiting Christianity.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman And neither are you without excuse. Mormons are not a special case, irregardless of their supposed sense of spiritual superiority. Their biggest downfall is their pride & presumption of going beyond that which the Spirit of Scripture is saying, as though they know better, rather than enduring sound doctrine, commonly characteristic of all the cults counterfeiting Christianity.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire
While many in their hell are the evil and wicked of the world, many are innocent souls who tried to conduct their lives to the best of their knowledge and abilities. There are hundreds of millions who would have accepted the True Son of God had they been given the chance.
The trinitarian God created more souls to be condemned to hell than will ever be exalted to heaven.
They have absolutely nothing to offer me. I see no reason to abandon my beliefs
GaryKColeman 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman Mormons accuse Christians of easy believism & greasy grace yet would give unrepentant child molesters a free pass into heaven. Is that your belief in & worship of a Just Judge? If it is you are given to the wrong God & have decidedly taken sides with His archenemy.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman That Jesus passionately preached eight times more about hell than heaven & suffered ineffably excruciating agony & anguish all the way to & at the cross should give you some understanding & great gratitude for the utmost sufficiency of His sacrifice in every person's stead. Do not blame the beautiful, innocent passover Lamb of God that people as free moral agents chose & do choose hell instead of Him! Be duly warned that in so doing you are crucifying the worthy Son of God afresh!
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire
What do the trinitarians have to offer the world? Their trinitarian God created this world, provided billions of souls to occupy it, and sent a Redeemer to save those souls so they could return to Heaven. However, He made a limited effort to give those billions access to the key of redemption--the chance to know that Redeemer and ACCEPT or REJECT Him. Then He condemns those billions to hell because they didn't accept the Redeemer the majority never even heard of.
GaryKColeman 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman The Redeemer made a "limited effort"? That is an astounding accusation! Certainly, God gave each person free agency, & just as certainly, it is, therefore, Himself Whom you should NOT blame that persons go to hell. Jesus spoke 8 times as much about heaven as He did about hell. Rom.1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, [EVEN] his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are WITHOUT EXCUSE.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire
John 3:5 "...Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God."
Mark 16:16 "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
Unless Jesus made an exception somewhere, that sounds like the final word. For example, the millions who lived on the American continents until 1492, never heard of Jesus, never believed Him to be the Son of God, and were never baptized. Is it their fault?
GaryKColeman 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman Your usage of verse 5 is not in context of the immediate verses 4 & 6. They show luminously clear that Jesus is comparing physical birth with spiritual birth to teach that physical birth alone is not enough for a person to see the kingdom of God. Nicodemus asked Jesus if a man can enter his mother's womb a second time & be born again. Jesus' answer is that which is born of the flesh is flesh, i.e. physical birth & that which is born of the Spirit is spirit i.e. spiritual birth.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman Again you are using isogesis. If baptism in water was necessary for salvation Jesus and His apostles would have directed same on every occasion baptism in Christ was mentioned. That it is a command I concur, but that a person forfeits their salvation by not being dunked in water is legalism, the letter of the law, void of the Spirit. Do tell, will you be saved because you actually kept every commandment? At Mk. 16:16 notice that the second part of the v. does not denote water.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire
So, baptism has nothing to do with salvation, and creation has revealed the invisible things of the Creator so all understand and none have an excuse.
That tells me that we don't need churches, preachers, missionaries, etc.. We don't even need scriptures if all we need for salvation has been revealed at creation.
When Jesus sent His disciples to preach the gospel & baptize believers, was He sending them on a fool's errand?
GaryKColeman 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman Very insightful.
MormonsLoveFamilies 10 months ago
@MormonsLoveFamilies
Thank you, and thank you for providing this forum.
GaryKColeman 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman You did not answer whether you have kept all the commandments. You would condemn persons to no salvation in Christ because they were not baptized? Water baptism is an outward, often public expression of an inward reality & transformation having occurred, to wit, repentance & faith, of having been baptized INTO CHRIST. There is no power whatsoever in water or water baptism into the LDS church, or any other church; the Power Is Christ, baptism (Greek: immersion.) into Him. See Rom.6.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman It is not a case of *** either/or ***; it is a matter of our magnificent & mighty Maker using *** both *** in His time & in His way as He deems needful & best. That He Is faithful & just there ought not to be any doubt whatsoever. When human instrumentality, the arm of flesh is inadequate, the Beautiful God is not limited. King Jesus is not up in heaven pacing back & forth worrying about imperfect churches, preachers & missionaries going in & out of the anointing of the Holy Ghost.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire
So, the person who worships the SON will be judged the same as the one who worships the SUN?
GaryKColeman 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman No, look at that particular passage in Rom. 1 again for context & note especially v. 25 which addresses your question front on: "Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen." The one who worships creation rather than/more than the Creator exchanges the truth of God for a lie. Therefore, I think it should be obvious that their Creator God's response to each one is vastly different.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire
Billions have believed in and worshipped a "creator," but they all had different names.
Jesus continually taught that He was the Way, the Truth, and the Life, that He was the only way to the Father, that His name was the only name by which man could be saved.
I have looked at nature for over 60 years. No where have I seen anything that testifies that Jesus Christ is the Creator. I have only seen His Name in the scriptures.
GaryKColeman 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman So suppose you tell me that which the Holy Spirit intends to be known through the apostle Paul having written the passage we are presently looking at & I hope when I have more time we shall address this further. Until then I will though leave you with Ps. 19 & with the idea that in the name of Jesus is more than merely a name by letter or sound but essentially expression of His nature & attributes, that is, His eternal power & Godhead revealed in creation as Creator.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
Psalms 19
1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2 Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3 [There is] no speech nor language, [where] their voice is not heard.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire
From what you have presented, I conclude that as long as a person is worshipping his God as The Creator, he can be saved from hell and exalted into the Kingdom of Heaven. It doesn't matter if that God's name is Amun-Ra, Odin, or Allah; the devout have as good a chance for salvation as any others.
I also conclude that there is no need to change my beliefs. As long as I worship The Creator, I can obtain Salvation.
GaryKColeman 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman Oh, & of course, they must have paid their tithe money & be temple worthy which falls out that many, many more people shall not be able to be baptized into the Monson movement of Moroni..
Shulamitefire 9 months ago
@GaryKColeman You think that there will ever be enough Mormons to baptize the multi-billions of people? According to your Joe foolery people can live like the devil & unrepentant enter into heaven, defiling heaven.. WOW!
Emanuel Swedenborg & Joseph Smith would have had more than a litte in common.
Shulamitefire 9 months ago
@Shulamitefire
How can anyone come to the Father and be saved in the Kingdom of Heaven unless they accept Jesus Christ as their personal Savior and Redeemer?
GaryKColeman 10 months ago
@GaryKColeman I have addressed the Scriptures you have presented. Please, if you would, address the Rom. 1 verse concerning creation making known & shown the Creator, manifesting even His eternal power & Godhead so that people are without excuse. Pay attention to the preceding & following verse for Christ context.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire "Mormondom has been COLLAPSING for YEARS. As Dan Peterson this month stated for YEARS LDS church growth has been FALLING"
There is a DIFFERENCE between collapsing and FALLING. Collapsing would be EVANGELICALS and falling from unbelievable growth would be LDS. Please do NOT put words in Dan Peterson's mouth.
omiolo 10 months ago
But the 2010 Census found that Utah, home to the headquarters for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and to the nation's largest Mormon population, was the second-fastest-growing state in the last decade, seeing a 24 percent population spike.
omiolo 10 months ago
@omiolo "According to the Church’s Member and Statistical Records Division, first-generation members made up 64% of total Church membership as of July 2006 Per David Stewart, 70% to 80% are inactive."Sociologist Armand Mauss estimates that 50 percent of LDS converts within the United States stop attending within a year of conversion, and 75 percent of foreign converts fail to attend after a year." MormonWiki Population & Growth
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
The other three fastest-growing states -- Nevada, Arizona and Idaho -- all have substantial Mormon minorities.
omiolo 10 months ago
@omiolo FYI: Ballard and other speakers acknowledged that the Utah-based faith was worried about massive losses of members in this age group [18-30]— one of the reasons behind the change in ward structure — and challenged those in attendance to bring at least one other person back into the fold. Utah News in The Salt Lake Tribune April 27 2011
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire "the Utah-based faith was worried about massive losses of members in this age group [18-30"
yes, we will leave the 99 and go in search of the ONE lost sheep.
I fear you quote mine so that you do NOT have to deal with the impending collapse of EVANGELICALS. Google those last three words and you will see what FELLOW EVANGELICALS are predicting. Of course the collapse of EVANGELICALS means ONE thing. Time to ATTACK the Mormons more. LOL
omiolo 10 months ago
@omiolo Thanks & please properly take note of the word "WORRIED" & the phrase "MASSIVE LOSSES" to the church of Joseph Smith. I provided the stats & sources of same showing SEVERAL denominations FAR outpacing LDSism. Even MORMON sources stated admit to widespread LDS church exaggeration of growth, even in Conference. Shall I serve up another sampling to you? You insist on fooling yourself but that is no small measure due your having giving yourself over to the spirit that is THE MORMON DELUSION.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire "please properly take note of the word "WORRIED""
Let me know when we are NOT worried? We are ALWAYS trying to take care of the lost sheep.
omiolo 10 months ago
@omiolo ☆Enough of ☆your ☆Joe foolery ☆
† Christ Jesus beckons you to leave off the smythology & twistology of theology & come unto Himself, the King of veritology, & King of ALL kings, Who Is exceedingly more beautiful, more honourable, more powerful than the spirits that channelled through Joe Smith & spiders have or ever would have you believe.
Jesus loves you the way you are but loves you too much to leave you that way. You do not have to go on in this life being spun & spinning. Selah
Shulamitefire 9 months ago
@Shulamitefire Stephen STOP it.
omiolo 9 months ago
@omiolo, my finely feathered friend, in your effort to manipulate the message of Dan Peterson for your own subversive purposes you were sure to leave off the LATTER part that reads as follows:
"Church growth has been falling for years, AND our current rate of missionary success is the lowest it's been for decades." Daniel C. Peterson For Mormon Times in Deseret News April 7, 2011 (emphasis, mine)
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@Shulamitefire "my finely feathered friend"
I have feathers? is this ANOTHER one of your games?
omiolo 10 months ago
@omiolo It is inference that you are like "that god," which errantly according to LDS scriptures has a physical body due, at least in part, to the misappropriation of the literary device known as Hebraism, in this case, for example, as in Psalms 91:4 He shall cover thee with his FEATHERS, and under His WINGS shalt thou trust: his truth [shall be thy] shield and buckler.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
@omiolo I disagree that the LDS church is the 1st, 2nd, or even 3rd or 4th fastest growing church. Look at the stats I provided & the sources from which those stats were taken. Seventh-Day Adventists, Southern Baptists, Assemblies of God, & Evangelical (5.6 percent annual growth) & Pentecostal churches (7.3 percent annual growth) have all been outpacing the LDS church. The Orthodox church with 300 million members & the oldest church community in the world (approx. 2000 y.o.) is interesting.
Shulamitefire 10 months ago
Temple blessings and welfare principles highlighted Sunday's topics as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints concluded its 181st annual general conference.
omiolo 10 months ago
And LDS Church President Thomas S. Monson touched on both subjects in one of his two addresses Sunday, declaring the church's welfare program as "inspired of Almighty God" and speaking of a myriad of Mormon temples -- from those in Kirtland and Salt Lake to New Zealand, Tahiti and Brazil and the one under construction in Rome.
omiolo 10 months ago
Plenty of the remaining apples will taste fine despite their blemishes and maybe some of the apples need some work to prepare and make them ready, but if you never choose an apple to cut out the bruise and polish it; it just stays in the barrel.
omiolo 11 months ago
.In the church it is easy to fall into the "Women are daughters of God and wonderful just in their existence" and that they are un-flawed gems of inestimable value, and that it is all the single guys fault for not "manning up" It seems to me at this point at our ages, all the apples in the barrel are bruised and seconds, a bit warty and off. Both sides need to be more accepting of what is left in the barrel.
omiolo 11 months ago 2
Don't be put off by the title. The term "social justice" evokes political connotations in modern America, but the concept itself is scriptural. The Book of Mormon, like the Bible, has strong opinions about what sorts of societies are more just or more righteous than others. (In Hebrew there is a single word, tzedek, which can be translated into English as either "justice" or "righteousness," and the same is true of the Greek word dikaiosune; the two ideas are intimately connected).
omiolo 11 months ago
Could America's 6 million-strong Church of the Latter Day Saints hold the key to solving the nation's immigration impasse?
omiolo 11 months ago
@900Sunshine I want you to know that God loves you.
MormonsLoveFamilies 11 months ago
Nothing compared to Mountain Meadow massacre.....
linekerkammer 11 months ago
@linekerkammer I want you to know that God loves you.
MormonsLoveFamilies 11 months ago
@MormonsLoveFamilies Tel me abou my friend....I know that sinse I was born
linekerkammer 11 months ago
@linekerkammer God still loves you.
MormonsLoveFamilies 11 months ago
@linekerkammer Yes, MMM, the Mormon version of Hiroshima. Was Hiroshima the right thing to do?
omiolo2 11 months ago
"Stimulated by whiskey and hidden behind blackened faces, a gang of more than two dozen men dragged Joseph from his bed during the night of March 24, 1832."
drugs, and disguises typically are the ANTImormon ways!!
omiolo2 11 months ago
@omiolo2 It saddens the heart to see hate in any form.
MormonsLoveFamilies 11 months ago
I don't believe in hate or violence. I believe you can discuss things in a rational way and stay friends.
thebigcougar 11 months ago
yet this is nothing compared to the anti american thing (prop h8) that mormons did to homosexuals
mormonshatefamilies should be your moniker
idaman12345 11 months ago
@idaman12345 I want you to know that God loves you.
MormonsLoveFamilies 11 months ago
@MormonsLoveFamilies you can keep believing in god
and i can continue to live in reality
idaman12345 11 months ago
@idaman12345 Nice SPIN. You can continue to SPIN, and the rest of us with deal in an honest and straight forward way.
omiolo2 11 months ago
@omiolo2 what spin?
idaman12345 11 months ago
@idaman12345 "what spin?"
Really? We are going to play that game?
omiolo 11 months ago