Michelle Kwan - 1997 Worlds SP - Dream of Desdemona

[lowdaisy1]

This is a beautiful short program. Lori Nichol is a genius, Michelle really is beautiful in this routine.

[stephe1987]

The scores here seem fair. I don't see what all the fuss is about?

[allenglandlawns]

Tara skated out of this world but her marks were shafted...leaving room only for the Kwan, but even then she bungles up an already simplified program. Safe, simple, and a graceful stumble and the judges still handed her 5.9s. So much work from their end to give her this title.

[idolfan9495]

Her mistake here cost her the championship, because she was first in the long program. I think her presentation marks were a little--would have to see the other skaters to say for sure.

[lucylikeslollies]

wow i wish i could do those change of edge spirals like her.

[kwansansog]

She shouldn't even have BEEN at worlds with that splatfest at nationals.This is just the beginning of the givens to Kwan. Those scores are ridiculously inflated just as they were at nats and it is in your face favortism.

[JNagarya]

@kwansansog Then stop irritating yourself by watching a skater you obvioulsy hate personally even though you don't know her. Not-so-by-the-way: hate is immoral; which puts you in a position to not be talking about morality and ethics.

[mlc2005]

@kwansansog: "the beginning of the givens for Kwan." Name ONE World title that Kwan won (of her five) that she should not have won? Judges (90% from Europe btw) know good skating when they see it, and they scored her accordingly. At Worlds in 1996, 2000, 2001 and 2003 (4 of her 5) she had to skate literally flawless programs to win her titles. Your comments show a clear bias, I'm sorry. If Kwan was really "gifted" titles, she surely would have won the Olympics in 1998, without a doubt.

[dtdurr]

I really like this. I like how th jumps are spaced as well. These days jumps seem to be the first 3 elements,

[markbob120]

What do you call the fastener on the front of a man's jeans? A DICK BUTTON!

[mlc2005]

Let's face it, even with a mistake, she's still the best skater! Everything she does it first class, and she just draws you in so much.

[1203456789]

i like michelle but i cant believe dick button said her layback had a very nice position, dick button that always criticized slutskaya's layback position called this a very nice one?!

[cortez411]

This year was a nightmare for most skaters at the world championship. Michelle finishes 4th after short, Slutskaya falls down hard, Nicole Bobek's coach dies, Lu Chen a former world champion finishes 23rd.

[michellequeen1980]

all the season she was skating this program cleanly and she did one serious mistake at worlds- she had really bad luck. Undoubtedly she was able to win the world title

[rfillangi]

This is the performance that cost her the 1998 olympics. She won the long program here and woud have won the title if not for this mistake. If that happens she goes into the Olympics as the two time defending world champion and that gives her a hudge advantage.

[allenglandlawns]

lol look at the 90s fluff. brings me back to the good old days. Can't believe things have changed so much since. This a great program and I think it should have been in the top 3 for sure.

[superstarbebe]

This was an absolutely gorgeous program...can't believe I had never paid attention to it before (probably because this was the year she lost her titles). This could definitely have been a short she could have used at the Olympics and received amazing marks for. One of the best artistically that I have seen from her. Figure skating just isn't the same without the Kween.

[Dylvente]

She had such command over the interpretation of the music. Peggy said it well, that Michelle makes every move important. She puts emphasis in all the right places. It was a very good choice of music for her. Just about as good artistically as her Rachmaninov short, although I still prefer the latter.

[beckerbombs]

I just want to make it clear I agree this is overall the best short other than her mistake. However it is ridiculous to suggest she was undermined by the judges here. The scores made it clear they gave her the highest base mark of anyone both on the technical and presentation side. Her presentations scores were much higher than anyone else even with a flow disrupting mistake which SHOULD lower the 2nd mark a bit. The only thing wrong was Tara winning the short over Vanessa who was much better.

[bardtoob]

So strange. Michelle was nervous. About 20 seconds into the program (2:15), long before her jump combination, she is wobbling on the change of edge during the spiral, which is so uncharacteristic.

[mlc2005]

5.7 is a joke for artistic mark. This is one of the greatest shorts of hers, in my opinion. I really did feel she was undermarked. One thing I never understood: The short has 8 elements, and if there is a failure of anyone, they take off points. Well, so many of the women had mediocre spirals, not great footwork, etc... I would think that a beautiful program like this could beat a program where all jumps were landed, based on the other elements alone.

[robertamstern]

I could not agree more with your comment. There have often been moments with beautiful skaters like Kwan and Cohen when the rest of there elements should make up for the mistake. Unfortunately the old judging system wasn't created for this: a 3 tenth deduction is going to damage the mark. I think it's one of the few positive things about the new system, that we could see a program like this, with a fairly major error and it might garner 2nd or 3rd place marks.

[beckerbombs]

LOL her artistic marks were the highest of the event even with a flow disrupting mistake. In fact she was still the only skater 5.7 to 5.9 range for artistry, averaging out to a 5.8 with a flow disrupting mistake is plenty generous. If anything her elements marks were too high. 5.4 to 5.6 for a .3 deduction which would have meant 5.7 to 5.9, much higher than anyone else, despite only a solo triple toe and a tiny double axel, and a layback nowhere near as good as Slutskaya or Gusmeroli.

[uncchristine99]

It's too unfortunate on the 3lutz because this program is superior to Lipiniski's in every way.

[GosfordAbercrombie]

the lowest she should've gotten for technical is a 5.6!!! 5.4s are ludicrous!!!

[BestFiction00]

Technically speaking, Michelle needed to do a jump combo as part of the short program requirement. She turned out on her lutz and then did her double-toe, which basically made her combo into a sequence. She didn't fulfill the combo requirement.

Also, depending on her SP draw, there might have been other competitors after her, so judges give lower scores to earlier skaters to make room. It's silly but the new COP gets rid of that.

[beckerbombs]

The deduction was .3. To say the lowest she should have gotten is a 5.6 is to say no judge should have given her lower than 5.9 for technical if she were clean. Considering she had only a solo triple toe when nearly everyone else was doing a flip or loop, her double axel was tiny and weak, and her layback was mediocre, her elements scores which were marked as the highest without her mistake were in fact too high if anything.

[rodia77]

That's what I love about watching Michele. even when she makes mistake the program is still exquisite. Unlike most skaters, her jumps are not the "program" they're part of the the program.

[deepn2night]

This program is amazing, it is so well choreographed and mature, it is so hard to belive she was so young and still capable of producing such a program. It's wonderful.

[mlc2005]

This is my favorite short program from her... It is so unique and intricate... and really intense... Plus, kwan skates the hell out of it.

[tellito1]

michelle kwan the best!

[uwoeric]

It's too bad that in the old 6.0, quality wasn't really rewarded since the marking was so subjective. I think if this program was marked under the COP, she would have defended her title here.

[rickram1961]

My wish is for figure skating to return like this.  My emphasis on artistry instead of all of the technical moves.

[Scott89119]

Opening with the spiral was beautiful.

[54spiritedwill54]

Beautiful!

[gayskatingfan]

I agree. What is so frusterating is legends of the sport like Fleming and Button, who should be knowledgable on that sort of thing gush on Sasha's spirals just because she can get her leg up so high, and point out none of these other factors.

[gayskatingfan]

Yeah people gush about the spirals of Cohen but I have never seen Cohen do such a complex change of edge and hold it with such control. In fact I saw her try and do it once and she wobbled back to the original edge on a shallow edge, too hard for her.

[muffycat26]

I think I might have had her 3rd in the short even with her mistake. This was one of the best women short programs ever other then the mistake. So much meaning to each move in the choreography, so much detail, such strong elements other then the mistake, such incredible expression and drama brought for a short program. Butyrskayas short I did not like at all. She had some very good shorts from 98-2000 but this was not one of them. So many sloppy and shaky elements, annoying program.

[fong03]

I often found some of her programs to be overrated as far as artistry was concerned. (Her long program in '97 for example.)

This program, however, IS exquisite. It might be one of my favorite SPs ever. This program really showcased Michelle's great qualities, while also being choreographically strong and elegant at the same time.

[sk8ingdreamer]

I agree with Dick Button. This program is exquisite. I felt the audience's pain 11 years ago when she faultered on that jump combination. I wonder if Michelle is the creator of the inside-edge-to-outside-edge spiral. Now that it's a program requirement, not many people perform it well. I don't like when skaters are holding their blade or boot for this change-of-edge spiral.

[tinymavy]

i really love this program. very underrated.

[taw1001]

Despite the fall out on the lutz, this was a very beautiful program and I love the music.

[skatefan9495]

Wow, it seems like she was really undermarked on this one. What was the mandatory deduction under 6.0 for something like this. If not for that stumble out of the lutz, she would have 6 world titles.

[raichmaneuvers]

mandatory deduction was .3. She was certainly not undermarked.  Without the deduction her technical marks range from 5.7 to 5.9, much higher then the next highest despite some of the easiest jumps in the competition.

[skatefan9495]

I disagree. 5 of 9 judges gave her 5.7 without the deduction for required elements. That seems like a double penalty since everything else was fine. But the real undermarking was on presentation. Three

5.7s? It's clear that the judges were taking off presentation points for the step-out in addition to required elements points for the same mistake.

[huetboy27]

She was overscored for this program not underscored. Someone like Gusmeroli skated a program with all excellent elements and only scores 5.5 to 5.7 on required elements, while Kwan with a .3 deduction and easier jumps gets 5.4 to 5.6.  That is too high. As for the 2nd mark her stumble broke the flow of the program and the 5.9s were inappropriate also.

[JNagarya]

@huetboy27 Who is Gusmeroli?



[SOLE2SOUL]

@JNagarya Vanessa Gusmeroli was the national champion of France at that time.

[bean778899]

IMO, this is the best program of her career. Artistically committed throughout the entire program with brilliant choreography that is chock-full of great transitions. For me, 96-98 was her artistic peak, though I did enjoy her play with intensity in her 'The Red Violin' and 'Carmen' programs.

[frostdiamond1]

Yes, Michelle's LP was nice and the choreography fit the music perfectly. (The foot-work section that started at 6:45 and the ending were particularly brilliant!) Had she not skated to the same kind of program the year before I would have liked it very much, though Tara's better. As it was, though, I felt Tara's was not only inherently better but much fresher.

[frostdiamond1]

Also, Michelle doubled her second 3L and had trouble on the second landing of her 3T/3T combination. (She nearly doubled footed it, pulling her foot around just in time.) Therefore, she not only landed less difficult triples, but had one less than Tara! Considering this it seems a no brainer that she would be second in the LP.

[frostdiamond1]

Did you really prefer her 1997 LP? As much as I loved it, I thought the '98 one even better! Her artistry had developed to an even higher level than before (as had Michelle's, keeping them on an equal level there still) and the music was wonderful (though much different from Sense and Sensibility) and the choreography interpreted it beautifully! Still, I can see your point. They're both such great LPs it's hard to choose!

[sk8ingdreamer]

I would think all athletes would love the attention, and Tara Lipinski wasn't immune from that. I recently saw on youtube a 2003 fluff piece on Tara, and it seemed like she was begging for attention. But I don't recall the media ever criticizing her turing professional or even mentioning her serious hip injury. Did anyone know about that after Nagano?

But in Michelle's defense, there really is no such thing as a strong field of skaters. Every competition just happens to have one clear winner.

[sk8ingdreamer]

Someone brought that up on another youtube video, and for a while I suspected ithinkformyself was Tara Lipinski. I mean, you hear nothing about her to this day except on youtube, and it's been years since she last skated for television, and her acting career has been in trouble.

Once you're on TV, that's all people will remember you for. And it must be impossible to find work after competitive skating other than touring on ice. Michelle was smart to have competed for as long as she had.

[tinymavy]

kinda reminds me of kimmie this year. Maybe kimmie can come back as strong as michelle did!

[eblocrock]

It's really too bad about the combination. The choreography/theme of this program is pretty incredible and it would have been interesting to see it developed as a long program as well.

[Saphead]

Just phenomenal, even with the lutz problem. She's set the bar so high, for herself and for others. This is complete skating.

[ohioweatherguy]

Without a doubt her best short program and quite possibly the best ladies short program ever. The choreographic detail of this progra is astounding. Choreographer, Lori Nichol, certainly was at her best during this period.

[PeekAtYou24]

Beautiful!

[mk146hw]

Like the drama of this program alot.

[suraaldy]

except for the lutz i agree.

[Lilia96]

Sooo exquisite.. her best short, IMO.