@Geolaw1 No it doesn't, 'Rest In Peace' isn't a religious phrase, it stems from the idea of death being like an eternal sleep. So rest in peace, Chris! :)
@jgraham97mc That's simply not true he covers both quite frequently. And if things don't exist, then that makes it difficult to discuss them at length.
If god gave man free will and the right to choose, why the fuck doesn't he like it when they do? And if he doesn't like homosexuality, why did he make homosexuals?
Blair is not a Christian but an agent of international zionism. He pretends to be a Catholic to divert the blame of the Iraqui genocide from its obvious architects to christianity, and thus feed into the idea that the war (genocide?) was part of the old Christian vs Muslim divergence. I expose it all on my Tony Blair video.
The function of hydrogen working inside of us is exraordinary evidence that both we and the universe have the same Maker.
Those who want to hold on to the flesh will deny what is true in order to do so.
Just listen to Abrahams wishes and let the descendants of Isaac remain in the land of Israel. He sent every other one of his seven other sons in seven different directions.
north korea is full of people who think the "Dear leader" or whatever they call him these days,is infallible. millions of north koreans starving to death,while the cities have beautiful marble buildings,that nobody gets to use,and nobody complains. they are most certainly NOT an atheist nation,atheists would demand better treatment, Kim Jong il is their god,and he's every bit as caring as the christian god
That was really fascinating. Thanks for telling me about it. I'll have to check out his book. Have you seen 'The Root of All Evil'? From what I've seen of him, he has never expressed any doubt that there is no God. In the documentary, he states over and over that ther IS no God, and that people of faith are "delusional". He's very definite about there being no God. I wonder why he'd contradict himself like that. He IS stupid to say there's no God. That's why it's so frustrating to watch.
@craftyhan No, what he states is delusional is those who revolve their lives around the idea of there being an invisible man that will punish them after they die for doing bad things. It IS delusional to believe something that is unproven, and has zero evidence, against all the evidence to the contrary. Say they believe the bible is true. Then you must simply point out the impossibility of Noah's Ark. Say they believe Islam is fundamentally peaceful. Bullshit "Kill the nonbelievers." Is there.
@BigLundi I think you'll find that he most definitely states that religious people are delusional. Not "The people who revolve their life around religion." Religious people. And religion does have evidence; written evidence, eyewitness accounts, written thousands of years ago. (I'm speaking mostly of the New Testament here.) Written accounts are what historians deal with all the time to interpret the truth. And could you point out the passage in the Koran which says 'Kill the nonbelievers'?
@craftyhan The New Testament does NOT have historical evidence as to its validity. As to the Quran(that's how it's spelled) saying to kill the nonbelievers. It's vage enough in 2:6 "Don't bother to warn the disbelievers, Allah has blinded them. Theirs will be an awful doom." and more direct in 2:178 "Believers must retaliate, those who transgress will have a painful doom." and even MORe direct in 2:191-2 "Kill disbelievers wherever you find them."
@BigLundi The New testament is a written text regarding events thousands of years ago: it is a historical document. Heard of the Dead Sea Scrolls? Religious scripture thousands of years old have just been discovered. And there are sources which are not religious that mention Jesus, though admittedly not very many. He was only a commoner, after all. I haven't studied Islam yet, so I didn't know it was so direct. Point taken. And it's sometimes spelled Koran. I know Quaran is the proper spelling.
@craftyhan Um, no. the New Testament is not accepted by historians as a tenable historical text. And there are no sources that are irreligious that mention Jesus, and if you mention the writings of Josephus, save yourself the time, that one paragraph is a highly debateable bit of forgery. the only other accounts we have are just heresay of ,"Well there's hundres of witnesses." even though nobody can name these witnesses, or knows anything about them...
@BigLundi Is your argument that Jesus never existed at all? I find it hard to believe that a religion as big as Christianity was based on a person who didn't exist. One hell of a conspiracy. And yes, there ARE references to Jesus in history. If you're going to dismiss whatever you don't agree with as forgery, why bother arguing? I'm trying to have a coherent discussion. You're clearly only interested in saying religion is crap. If you're already decided, why watch a debate, and argue about it?
@craftyhan Conspiracy? Not really. I'm not DENYING Jesus existed, merely pointing out there's no evidence of his existence. It's very easy to simply say, "There once was a jewish man who was very enlightened." and base a religion off of that. Do you know how most myths begin? A slightly true story, like someone learning how to do a simply sleight of hand trick, blown way out of proportion with repetitive telling. And Josephus's one paragraph about Jesus IS a forgery, look it up.
@BigLundi Okay then. Historically, Jesus was a Jew, who had radical ideas for reforms to the Jewish church, which were considered heresy, so he was executed. After his death, his followers spread his teachings, and a few hundred years later, Christianity was formed. The whole thing about the ascention, the son of God, I personally don't really believe it. I can't be bothered to go get my texbook right now, but there ARE references to Jesus. Few, but they're there. I'll find some for you later.
@craftyhan No, historically, there were Jewish peoples who wanted to reform the church, as there have always been, for years and years and years. Christianity, btw, was formed because the Roman emperor decided to make it the official roman religion. It's debateable, but there's a good chance that Christianity would have just been considered another cult if the emperor didn't do such a thing. Before saying there is unreligious historical evidence of Jesus, please show it to me.
@BigLundi Of course there were Jewish people who wanted to reform Judaism, as there will always be people wanting to reform religions. Jesus was just vocal about it, and his ideas inspired many followers. Christianity was already a religion in ancient times: Constantine was just the first Christian emperor, and made it the official religion. And a cult gives glory to human leaders, rather than divine beings; it's not the same as a religion. I'll find the historical references later this week.
@craftyhan Cults give glory to human beings who claim divinity, plenty of times. Son of god is a claim of divinity. Again, there IS no evidence that any individual named Jesus wnt about with 12 disciples and poreached a specific reformity, and then was crucified and resurrected.
@BigLundi But in Christianity, Jesus IS God. They are one and the same. It's a hard concept to understand, but the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all one being. Patience, and I'll find the evidence. Who knows? Maybe my religion teacher is wrong and you're right. Pretty sure that the beginning of the argument was that religion isn't evil and fundamentalist, and that people are. I stand by that. In many third world countries, there are plenty of conflicts that have nothing to do with religion.
@craftyhan I see no difference between that and any other cult. There are people, regularly, claiming to be Jesus, or God, and there are groups of people that follow them around and believe everything they say.
"there are plenty of conflicts that have nothing to do with religon"
And there are plenty that are. You want to just ignore those? The fact is, there is no such thing as a peaceful religion. Far as Jesus goes, I quote a philosopher, "If he wasn't the son of god, his advice was bad.
@BigLundi A cult has a central, human figure to whom followers give money and power. jesus never asked for either. Oh, I'm sure there are plenty of people claiming to be a messiah, and people who follow them. Maybe they are, maybe they aren't. That's not the point. There is tons of conflict over religion, I know that. But the conflict comes from people, not from religion itself. There are millions of peaceful religious people out there, just as there are plenty of downright evil ones.
@craftyhan The religion causes the conflict, hell a lot of religions TELL people to go into conflict, and advocate it, as long as it's in the name of whatever god the religion worships. And no, there is no such thing as a peaceful religion, outside maybe Janism, that's it.
Also, a Cult is a religion that's not stately recognized as one. Scientology was a cult before the governmnet was forced to recognize it as a religion.
@BigLundi There's no point arguing with you. You are saying, "I'm right and you're wrong." I'm saying, "This is my opinion." See the difference? It's been interesting, but there's nothing more to say. There is evil all over the world which has nothing to do with religion. There are religious people all over the world who do great good for others. This indicates *to me* that it has more to do with people than relgion. Religion is not irrelevant, it's a huge factor, but it's not the whole reason.
@craftyhan I'm right because I know for a fact that a majority of the world's probelms can be traced back to religion. Most genocides in Africa, the holy war in the middle east, Ireland only just recently patched up their holy war between chrstians.
It doesn't impress me when someone says, "But religion also provides charity and whatnot." Sure, by holding the charity hostage and saying the people recieving it need to read the bible and listen to missionaries first.
@BigLundi You're not right. Most of the world's problems come from politics.Were the holy wars about religion? No. That was what they said they were about. Really, they were about gaining land, wealth and power. Name a holy war where there was nothing in it for the conqueror. Saying that relgious charities need people to convert before they help them is just ridiculous. Salvation Army. Samaratins. St Vincent de Paul. It doesn't impress me when someone says they're right and can't back it up.
@craftyhan "Were the holy wars about religion? No, that's just what they said they were about." Ok, so you're just not going to believe it. We're done.
@BigLundi Funny how that's the only part of what I said you can argue against. You're a bigot. Yes, we're done. Learn to listen to what other people say.
@craftyhan I read the rest. All you said wa sreligion was used as an excuse, and that means it wasn't about religion. Tell that to the people killed in the Inquisition, tell that to the people in the Cursades who were told that because it was a holy war, thanks to their religion they would be forgiven all their transgressions, tell that to the people who are dieing NOW in the name of their god, their religion. IT was religion, that's not arguable. Politically influenced or not, it was religion.
@craftyhan You give religion credit whern the people in it do good things, but then deny its influence when it's used for bad things. It doesn't matter that it's people using it, the vast majority of the war was as far as the general public was concerned, purely religious in nature. Sure, the conqueror might haven't even been of faith, but that means nothing. They used Religion, and without religion, it would have been FAR harder to convince good people to do these wars.
@craftyhan It's absolutely infuriating when people say, "Well look at the charity that the religious people sometimes do." and when I pont to 9.11, holy wars, inquisition, forcedconversion, execution of heretics, you go, "Oh that wasn't religion, that was the people." fucking double standard using bastard.
@craftyhan That doesn't follow that religion istelf is evil. It follows that some people are evil, particularly if they are raised in ignorance, prejudice and violence, as many of the fundamentalist Muslims in Islam are. I personally believe that evil comes from people, not religion itself. Religion is a driving force, but only if people let it. And what part of Jesus' advice was bad? Love one another, care for the poor... And he was mentioned in the Roman records kept when they ruled Judea.
@craftyhan Essentially, it's far, FAR too convenient that Josephus, who wrote his findings years after Jesus' supposed death, wrote exactly one paragraph, summing up the entirety of the Christian faith, in the middle of passages that had nothing to do with Jesus at all. It's not only convenient, but unlikely. And Josephus is the ONLY historian people can point to as having had any recorded interaction with Jesus, which is a highly debateable point in itself.
The reason these religious groups help people like AIDS victims so that they believe they can get Gods favor by doing it. In a sense that is a form of greed because most people would honestly give 2 shits about them because its not them who cares?
Could people stop attacking religion in general? Saying that it's evil and ignorant? I am NOT religious, I want to get that straight. But every religion, except maybe Satanism, is founded on one incontrivertible concept: BE A GOOD PERSON. Eliminate religion, and there will be as much war, hate and fanaticism as there was before. Lunatics will find other excuses to blow themselves up, don't you worry. Bigorty, prejudice, fundamentalism and cruelty are not in religion - they are in people.
@djdanaman How is it wrong? You're telling me that without religion, all greed, cruelty and fanaticism would be immediately eliminated from the human race? Go watch Richard Dawkins' 'The Root of All Evil', and tell me that he's not a fundamentalist to the core. He thinks that he's right and everyone else is wrong. Isn't that what every suicide bomber in history thinks?
@craftyhan You said this..."Eliminate religion, and there will be as much war, hate and fanaticism as there was before. " I said that's wrong. Because it's already been shown scientifically that the countries NOT having a religious majority are more peaceful. Japan, Switzerland, and other Atheistic countries. The US is the only exception to the rule. Highest violence? Yep, Iraq, Bosnia, etc. It's been proven. So yeah, that's wrong. Like it or not.
@djdanaman Fair enough. That's true. But do you deny that there are many peaceful religious people who accept aethiests and people of other religions wholeheartedly? And do you think that aethiests can't be fundamentalists? And do you agree that there is a lot of evil in the world without religion? In MANY CASES, I don't think the problem is religion. In countries such as Iraq, Bosnia, etc, the government dictates how its people live. How can you fight against it when you don't know better?
@djdanaman Also, if you read the Koran, there is nothing about murdering unbelievers and blowing up little children. Notjing. Those ideas come from extremists and mental nutcases.
@craftyhan The problem is Sharia Law. They take the Koran as law. You can interpret it how you like. Why do you think there are "honor killings" for rape victims? It's lunacy.
@djdanaman I would wonder though, if that is a religious custom or a cultural custom. Most people don't distinguish between the two. I don't know, and I'm only saying this because I don't know very much about Islam, but it seems more likely to me that this would be a cultural custom. After all, Islamic countries are generally third-world countries, and other non-religious undeveloped countries have just as much violence, like the Republic of Congo. But you're right. It's utter lunacy.
@MusicStudyMan Are we talking about the same Richard Dawkins that did 'The Root of All Evil'? The title is pretty self-explanatory. He is definitely 100% aethiest. Have you seen that documentary? He calls religious people delusional, and leaves NO room for argument on the subject of religion. There is no God and that is that. Is he the one you're talking about??
@craftyhan Yes - check out his 'The God Delusion" - he explains the 7 levels of atheism. He is on level 6. This is a clever move (as you would expect) because saying "there is absolutely no god" without conclusive evidence is just as insane as saying there is one without any evidence and the religious freaks would have him by the gonads. Science doesn't prove anything- it disproves things until the answer you have is most likely to be true. Check out his BBC interview - he mentions it there too.
How embarrassing is it for all the people who came out and offered the arrogant proposition that, now that he has cancer, Hitchens will reexamine his stance on faith?
Not only has his illness strengthened him, his stance nearly obliterates any extremist claims of death as door to faith.
Hitchens is a human confronting his mortality, not in the abstract, but in as real a form as is imaginable. And, he schedules his chemo treatments to allow him to continue speaking out. THAT's inspiring
@jitendrakbharai Thats because the relegion he was defending had not answers tot he questions raised. Any of the muslim debators eg Zakir Naik & Shabir Ally, could have buried Hitchens because anly Islam has answers to everything he raised. You dont have to take my word for it but find out.
@jabedin1 - Islam is merely another Jewish heresey & a silly hodge-podge of other pagan bullshit ... It has ravaged a virile, science loving society & sent it reeling back into the Stone Age ... Islam is simply religion taken to the absurd extreme ... It has answers for nothing beyond what the best sword is to behead those that see its bullshit ...
Atheism is a Religion, because you believe, you have faith there is no God without proof. When you die, it is only then you see the truth.
Go back to the definition of faith. Faith is believing in something without proof. Religion is a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith. Atheism is defined as the doctrine or belief that there is no God. Therefore Atheism is a religion.
@ThunderheadNebula - All religions are a war ... They're a war on reason, science, & freedom ... As your god of the gaps grows smaller everyday , along with your excuses to remain ignorant, the war against this oppressive delusion will indeed be won ...
The world has a lot of horrible crap and horrible people in it, but it is still a better place than it has ever been. I missed this terrific program the other night on the radio, and now I can see it here -- I love the internet.
@levonet33 N.Korea worship their leader as a demi-god. It is the "slave to Christ"-like uncritical mentality that Hitchens was attacking with this analogy.
@levonet33 You will clearly never support my position because you don't even know what I believe.
Atheism is simply a lack of belief in god. I do not believe in any supernatural dimension. I try to only accept stories as a consequence of evidence. That is the core of my belief system and if you can argue against that instead of a straw man I will be impressed .
@levonet33 What evidence have you for this statement? Jisus (sic) didn't claim he was the creator of the universe. He lived 13.7 billion years after the Big Bang and the universe is probably much older than that.
@levonet33 - No, it's not atheist ... They adhere to the 1st Commandment ... However, it's not your god that comes first , it's Kim Jung Il ... There is no light beyond him in NK ... That's a religion if there ever was one ...
@levonet33 They WORSHIP the 'dear leader' all day. The leader (Kim Jong Il) is a reincarnation of the father (who is dead but is still the 'president'). Upon his birth the birds were said to have sang in Korean! lol
Dude....if that isn't religious then Christianity is secular. lol.
"dictatorships are 100% atheist countries( in most cases communist or islamic)"
I hope you know that Islam isn't atheistic. lol. It's a religion. Pick up a book so I don't have to detail each dictatorship 4 U!
Except it's not. There are several countries moving towards Atheism. France, UK, Canada and Norway are all more Athiest than religious. Saying N Korea is a typical Athiest country (When there is a cult of personality) is an intellectual cop-out on your behalf.
@levonet33 N. Korea is not an atheist country. There is no such thing. N. Korea is just as dogmatic as the christian church. Hell there supreme leader is a dead man. They worship kim jong il everyday of their lives. They live a forced upon version of an earthly religion. You may want to educate yourself about the world more. Crack open a book besides the bible for once.
@cyklonb1989 They need to freeze him until we have the technology to transplant a brain into a computer. This man by all means can prove the evil grip that religion holds on the human race.
I love the cheap pop from Blair, might aswell have said 'Finally, the Blair-has-come-back...to Toronto' and then raised his eye-brow.
JohnyM91 2 months ago
I'm reading about poll protesters going nuts in Russia on the BBC news site, just as Hitch starts to talk about Putin and his questionable methods.
Foresight - Hitch had it.
HarrysSecret 2 months ago
Saying RIP to an atheist seems ridiculous. We loved ya Chris!
Geolaw1 2 months ago
@Geolaw1 No it doesn't, 'Rest In Peace' isn't a religious phrase, it stems from the idea of death being like an eternal sleep. So rest in peace, Chris! :)
BlueVane 2 months ago
@jgraham97mc That's simply not true he covers both quite frequently. And if things don't exist, then that makes it difficult to discuss them at length.
elfred1980 6 months ago
Hitchens....fuck he's good!!
jjoneil73 7 months ago
If god gave man free will and the right to choose, why the fuck doesn't he like it when they do? And if he doesn't like homosexuality, why did he make homosexuals?
PEANTONG 8 months ago
Blair is not a Christian but an agent of international zionism. He pretends to be a Catholic to divert the blame of the Iraqui genocide from its obvious architects to christianity, and thus feed into the idea that the war (genocide?) was part of the old Christian vs Muslim divergence. I expose it all on my Tony Blair video.
thegreatfearblog 8 months ago in playlist Hitchens Blair Debate
The function of hydrogen working inside of us is exraordinary evidence that both we and the universe have the same Maker.
Those who want to hold on to the flesh will deny what is true in order to do so.
Just listen to Abrahams wishes and let the descendants of Isaac remain in the land of Israel. He sent every other one of his seven other sons in seven different directions.
JungleJargon 8 months ago
I am not an atheist, and I really and sincerely hope that Hitchens makes it through cancer and gets well.
jjhjjff 9 months ago
@jjhjjff Me, too, but I have a feeling that we are witnessing his last days. : (
writersblock26 6 months ago
north korea is full of people who think the "Dear leader" or whatever they call him these days,is infallible. millions of north koreans starving to death,while the cities have beautiful marble buildings,that nobody gets to use,and nobody complains. they are most certainly NOT an atheist nation,atheists would demand better treatment, Kim Jong il is their god,and he's every bit as caring as the christian god
ViralMessiah 9 months ago
I pray to God that he will give Hitchen more time in this world so that Hitchen can stop me and others from praying.
eldrinirdle 9 months ago 2
@eldrinirdle - I think my head exploded with awesomeness.
TheWanderingAngel 9 months ago
Don't worry, he'll hold together (ya hear me, mate, hold together).
twosixteen 10 months ago
Tony Blair is a complete tool. But by god is he fucking sexy.
testtubekitten 10 months ago
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Alexander claimed to be a god.
thinlizzybone 10 months ago
That was really fascinating. Thanks for telling me about it. I'll have to check out his book. Have you seen 'The Root of All Evil'? From what I've seen of him, he has never expressed any doubt that there is no God. In the documentary, he states over and over that ther IS no God, and that people of faith are "delusional". He's very definite about there being no God. I wonder why he'd contradict himself like that. He IS stupid to say there's no God. That's why it's so frustrating to watch.
craftyhan 1 year ago
@craftyhan No, what he states is delusional is those who revolve their lives around the idea of there being an invisible man that will punish them after they die for doing bad things. It IS delusional to believe something that is unproven, and has zero evidence, against all the evidence to the contrary. Say they believe the bible is true. Then you must simply point out the impossibility of Noah's Ark. Say they believe Islam is fundamentally peaceful. Bullshit "Kill the nonbelievers." Is there.
BigLundi 11 months ago
@BigLundi I think you'll find that he most definitely states that religious people are delusional. Not "The people who revolve their life around religion." Religious people. And religion does have evidence; written evidence, eyewitness accounts, written thousands of years ago. (I'm speaking mostly of the New Testament here.) Written accounts are what historians deal with all the time to interpret the truth. And could you point out the passage in the Koran which says 'Kill the nonbelievers'?
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan The New Testament does NOT have historical evidence as to its validity. As to the Quran(that's how it's spelled) saying to kill the nonbelievers. It's vage enough in 2:6 "Don't bother to warn the disbelievers, Allah has blinded them. Theirs will be an awful doom." and more direct in 2:178 "Believers must retaliate, those who transgress will have a painful doom." and even MORe direct in 2:191-2 "Kill disbelievers wherever you find them."
BigLundi 11 months ago
@BigLundi The New testament is a written text regarding events thousands of years ago: it is a historical document. Heard of the Dead Sea Scrolls? Religious scripture thousands of years old have just been discovered. And there are sources which are not religious that mention Jesus, though admittedly not very many. He was only a commoner, after all. I haven't studied Islam yet, so I didn't know it was so direct. Point taken. And it's sometimes spelled Koran. I know Quaran is the proper spelling.
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan Um, no. the New Testament is not accepted by historians as a tenable historical text. And there are no sources that are irreligious that mention Jesus, and if you mention the writings of Josephus, save yourself the time, that one paragraph is a highly debateable bit of forgery. the only other accounts we have are just heresay of ,"Well there's hundres of witnesses." even though nobody can name these witnesses, or knows anything about them...
BigLundi 11 months ago
@BigLundi Is your argument that Jesus never existed at all? I find it hard to believe that a religion as big as Christianity was based on a person who didn't exist. One hell of a conspiracy. And yes, there ARE references to Jesus in history. If you're going to dismiss whatever you don't agree with as forgery, why bother arguing? I'm trying to have a coherent discussion. You're clearly only interested in saying religion is crap. If you're already decided, why watch a debate, and argue about it?
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan Conspiracy? Not really. I'm not DENYING Jesus existed, merely pointing out there's no evidence of his existence. It's very easy to simply say, "There once was a jewish man who was very enlightened." and base a religion off of that. Do you know how most myths begin? A slightly true story, like someone learning how to do a simply sleight of hand trick, blown way out of proportion with repetitive telling. And Josephus's one paragraph about Jesus IS a forgery, look it up.
BigLundi 11 months ago
@BigLundi Okay then. Historically, Jesus was a Jew, who had radical ideas for reforms to the Jewish church, which were considered heresy, so he was executed. After his death, his followers spread his teachings, and a few hundred years later, Christianity was formed. The whole thing about the ascention, the son of God, I personally don't really believe it. I can't be bothered to go get my texbook right now, but there ARE references to Jesus. Few, but they're there. I'll find some for you later.
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan No, historically, there were Jewish peoples who wanted to reform the church, as there have always been, for years and years and years. Christianity, btw, was formed because the Roman emperor decided to make it the official roman religion. It's debateable, but there's a good chance that Christianity would have just been considered another cult if the emperor didn't do such a thing. Before saying there is unreligious historical evidence of Jesus, please show it to me.
BigLundi 11 months ago
@BigLundi Of course there were Jewish people who wanted to reform Judaism, as there will always be people wanting to reform religions. Jesus was just vocal about it, and his ideas inspired many followers. Christianity was already a religion in ancient times: Constantine was just the first Christian emperor, and made it the official religion. And a cult gives glory to human leaders, rather than divine beings; it's not the same as a religion. I'll find the historical references later this week.
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan Cults give glory to human beings who claim divinity, plenty of times. Son of god is a claim of divinity. Again, there IS no evidence that any individual named Jesus wnt about with 12 disciples and poreached a specific reformity, and then was crucified and resurrected.
BigLundi 11 months ago
@BigLundi But in Christianity, Jesus IS God. They are one and the same. It's a hard concept to understand, but the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all one being. Patience, and I'll find the evidence. Who knows? Maybe my religion teacher is wrong and you're right. Pretty sure that the beginning of the argument was that religion isn't evil and fundamentalist, and that people are. I stand by that. In many third world countries, there are plenty of conflicts that have nothing to do with religion.
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan I see no difference between that and any other cult. There are people, regularly, claiming to be Jesus, or God, and there are groups of people that follow them around and believe everything they say.
"there are plenty of conflicts that have nothing to do with religon"
And there are plenty that are. You want to just ignore those? The fact is, there is no such thing as a peaceful religion. Far as Jesus goes, I quote a philosopher, "If he wasn't the son of god, his advice was bad.
BigLundi 11 months ago
@BigLundi A cult has a central, human figure to whom followers give money and power. jesus never asked for either. Oh, I'm sure there are plenty of people claiming to be a messiah, and people who follow them. Maybe they are, maybe they aren't. That's not the point. There is tons of conflict over religion, I know that. But the conflict comes from people, not from religion itself. There are millions of peaceful religious people out there, just as there are plenty of downright evil ones.
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan The religion causes the conflict, hell a lot of religions TELL people to go into conflict, and advocate it, as long as it's in the name of whatever god the religion worships. And no, there is no such thing as a peaceful religion, outside maybe Janism, that's it.
Also, a Cult is a religion that's not stately recognized as one. Scientology was a cult before the governmnet was forced to recognize it as a religion.
BigLundi 11 months ago
@BigLundi There's no point arguing with you. You are saying, "I'm right and you're wrong." I'm saying, "This is my opinion." See the difference? It's been interesting, but there's nothing more to say. There is evil all over the world which has nothing to do with religion. There are religious people all over the world who do great good for others. This indicates *to me* that it has more to do with people than relgion. Religion is not irrelevant, it's a huge factor, but it's not the whole reason.
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan I'm right because I know for a fact that a majority of the world's probelms can be traced back to religion. Most genocides in Africa, the holy war in the middle east, Ireland only just recently patched up their holy war between chrstians.
It doesn't impress me when someone says, "But religion also provides charity and whatnot." Sure, by holding the charity hostage and saying the people recieving it need to read the bible and listen to missionaries first.
BigLundi 11 months ago
@BigLundi You're not right. Most of the world's problems come from politics.Were the holy wars about religion? No. That was what they said they were about. Really, they were about gaining land, wealth and power. Name a holy war where there was nothing in it for the conqueror. Saying that relgious charities need people to convert before they help them is just ridiculous. Salvation Army. Samaratins. St Vincent de Paul. It doesn't impress me when someone says they're right and can't back it up.
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan "Were the holy wars about religion? No, that's just what they said they were about." Ok, so you're just not going to believe it. We're done.
BigLundi 11 months ago
@BigLundi Funny how that's the only part of what I said you can argue against. You're a bigot. Yes, we're done. Learn to listen to what other people say.
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan I read the rest. All you said wa sreligion was used as an excuse, and that means it wasn't about religion. Tell that to the people killed in the Inquisition, tell that to the people in the Cursades who were told that because it was a holy war, thanks to their religion they would be forgiven all their transgressions, tell that to the people who are dieing NOW in the name of their god, their religion. IT was religion, that's not arguable. Politically influenced or not, it was religion.
BigLundi 11 months ago
@craftyhan You give religion credit whern the people in it do good things, but then deny its influence when it's used for bad things. It doesn't matter that it's people using it, the vast majority of the war was as far as the general public was concerned, purely religious in nature. Sure, the conqueror might haven't even been of faith, but that means nothing. They used Religion, and without religion, it would have been FAR harder to convince good people to do these wars.
BigLundi 11 months ago
@craftyhan It's absolutely infuriating when people say, "Well look at the charity that the religious people sometimes do." and when I pont to 9.11, holy wars, inquisition, forcedconversion, execution of heretics, you go, "Oh that wasn't religion, that was the people." fucking double standard using bastard.
BigLundi 11 months ago 6
1:18 is the best starting place on this video
505alicious 1 week ago
@craftyhan That doesn't follow that religion istelf is evil. It follows that some people are evil, particularly if they are raised in ignorance, prejudice and violence, as many of the fundamentalist Muslims in Islam are. I personally believe that evil comes from people, not religion itself. Religion is a driving force, but only if people let it. And what part of Jesus' advice was bad? Love one another, care for the poor... And he was mentioned in the Roman records kept when they ruled Judea.
craftyhan 11 months ago
@craftyhan Essentially, it's far, FAR too convenient that Josephus, who wrote his findings years after Jesus' supposed death, wrote exactly one paragraph, summing up the entirety of the Christian faith, in the middle of passages that had nothing to do with Jesus at all. It's not only convenient, but unlikely. And Josephus is the ONLY historian people can point to as having had any recorded interaction with Jesus, which is a highly debateable point in itself.
BigLundi 11 months ago
Hitchens for Prime Minister! It's about time the UK seperated church from state.
blue1085 1 year ago 6
The reason these religious groups help people like AIDS victims so that they believe they can get Gods favor by doing it. In a sense that is a form of greed because most people would honestly give 2 shits about them because its not them who cares?
AvengerSaix 1 year ago
Christopher Hitchens believes in condom ?
Sonyoooo3 1 year ago
Could people stop attacking religion in general? Saying that it's evil and ignorant? I am NOT religious, I want to get that straight. But every religion, except maybe Satanism, is founded on one incontrivertible concept: BE A GOOD PERSON. Eliminate religion, and there will be as much war, hate and fanaticism as there was before. Lunatics will find other excuses to blow themselves up, don't you worry. Bigorty, prejudice, fundamentalism and cruelty are not in religion - they are in people.
craftyhan 1 year ago
@craftyhan That's just wrong. But we'll never know because people have to hold on to this garbage...
djdanaman 1 year ago
@djdanaman How is it wrong? You're telling me that without religion, all greed, cruelty and fanaticism would be immediately eliminated from the human race? Go watch Richard Dawkins' 'The Root of All Evil', and tell me that he's not a fundamentalist to the core. He thinks that he's right and everyone else is wrong. Isn't that what every suicide bomber in history thinks?
craftyhan 1 year ago
@craftyhan You said this..."Eliminate religion, and there will be as much war, hate and fanaticism as there was before. " I said that's wrong. Because it's already been shown scientifically that the countries NOT having a religious majority are more peaceful. Japan, Switzerland, and other Atheistic countries. The US is the only exception to the rule. Highest violence? Yep, Iraq, Bosnia, etc. It's been proven. So yeah, that's wrong. Like it or not.
djdanaman 1 year ago
@djdanaman Fair enough. That's true. But do you deny that there are many peaceful religious people who accept aethiests and people of other religions wholeheartedly? And do you think that aethiests can't be fundamentalists? And do you agree that there is a lot of evil in the world without religion? In MANY CASES, I don't think the problem is religion. In countries such as Iraq, Bosnia, etc, the government dictates how its people live. How can you fight against it when you don't know better?
craftyhan 1 year ago
@djdanaman Also, if you read the Koran, there is nothing about murdering unbelievers and blowing up little children. Notjing. Those ideas come from extremists and mental nutcases.
craftyhan 1 year ago
@craftyhan The problem is Sharia Law. They take the Koran as law. You can interpret it how you like. Why do you think there are "honor killings" for rape victims? It's lunacy.
djdanaman 1 year ago
@djdanaman I would wonder though, if that is a religious custom or a cultural custom. Most people don't distinguish between the two. I don't know, and I'm only saying this because I don't know very much about Islam, but it seems more likely to me that this would be a cultural custom. After all, Islamic countries are generally third-world countries, and other non-religious undeveloped countries have just as much violence, like the Republic of Congo. But you're right. It's utter lunacy.
craftyhan 1 year ago
No he doesn't - Dawkins is only 6/7ths Atheist and that last 7th makes a big difference between being reasoned, and being an extremist.
MusicStudyMan 1 year ago
@MusicStudyMan Are we talking about the same Richard Dawkins that did 'The Root of All Evil'? The title is pretty self-explanatory. He is definitely 100% aethiest. Have you seen that documentary? He calls religious people delusional, and leaves NO room for argument on the subject of religion. There is no God and that is that. Is he the one you're talking about??
craftyhan 1 year ago
@craftyhan Yes - check out his 'The God Delusion" - he explains the 7 levels of atheism. He is on level 6. This is a clever move (as you would expect) because saying "there is absolutely no god" without conclusive evidence is just as insane as saying there is one without any evidence and the religious freaks would have him by the gonads. Science doesn't prove anything- it disproves things until the answer you have is most likely to be true. Check out his BBC interview - he mentions it there too.
MusicStudyMan 1 year ago
@craftyhan search for "Richard Dawkins BBC HardTalk". Happy watching.
MusicStudyMan 1 year ago
How embarrassing is it for all the people who came out and offered the arrogant proposition that, now that he has cancer, Hitchens will reexamine his stance on faith?
Not only has his illness strengthened him, his stance nearly obliterates any extremist claims of death as door to faith.
Hitchens is a human confronting his mortality, not in the abstract, but in as real a form as is imaginable. And, he schedules his chemo treatments to allow him to continue speaking out. THAT's inspiring
Ematched 1 year ago
I love Hitchens at work!! - Particularly as that's no wanker he's up against, when it comes to a debate!!
Tobytrim 1 year ago
A breath of fresh air to listen to someone who puts moral values and sense before religion. Bravo!
MsBudd22 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Although i have always admired Tony Blair, but this time he just did not look himself.He never sounded very convincing.
jitendrakbharai 1 year ago
Although i have always admired Tony Blair, but this time he just did't look himself.He never sounded very convincing.
jitendrakbharai 1 year ago
@jitendrakbharai Thats because the relegion he was defending had not answers tot he questions raised. Any of the muslim debators eg Zakir Naik & Shabir Ally, could have buried Hitchens because anly Islam has answers to everything he raised. You dont have to take my word for it but find out.
jabedin1 1 year ago
@jabedin1 LOL
OpqHMg 1 year ago
@jabedin1 - Islam is merely another Jewish heresey & a silly hodge-podge of other pagan bullshit ... It has ravaged a virile, science loving society & sent it reeling back into the Stone Age ... Islam is simply religion taken to the absurd extreme ... It has answers for nothing beyond what the best sword is to behead those that see its bullshit ...
MaitreyaRocket 1 year ago
Atheism is a Religion, because you believe, you have faith there is no God without proof. When you die, it is only then you see the truth.
Go back to the definition of faith. Faith is believing in something without proof. Religion is a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith. Atheism is defined as the doctrine or belief that there is no God. Therefore Atheism is a religion.
.
Allen West 2012
ThunderheadNebula 1 year ago
@ThunderheadNebula -- Atheism isn't a religion ... It's a personal relationship with reality ...
MaitreyaRocket 1 year ago
@ThunderheadNebula - Am I to understand English is your second language ?
MaitreyaRocket 1 year ago
@ThunderheadNebula - Could you possibly be more ignorant ? That whole language thing truly escapes you .
MaitreyaRocket 1 year ago
@MaitreyaRocket
Islam is a war; not a religion. You really should get off YouTube and get informed.
ThunderheadNebula 1 year ago
@ThunderheadNebula - All religions are a war ... They're a war on reason, science, & freedom ... As your god of the gaps grows smaller everyday , along with your excuses to remain ignorant, the war against this oppressive delusion will indeed be won ...
MaitreyaRocket 1 year ago
Why does the audience find everything so funny?
MrKylecarlson 1 year ago
@MrKylecarlson because religion is a ridiculous laffable idea period.
StoneyMcGyver 1 year ago
@StoneyMcGyver - I dont mind that. but what i mean is that its almost rude. Let Christopher Hitchens finish a damn sentence.
MrKylecarlson 1 year ago
@MrKylecarlson Canadians man, we laugh at everything. Stupid shows are huge here
MikeEmery9 1 year ago
Made Tony blair look like a twat
willjpsmith 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Although i have always admired Tony Blair, but this time he just did not look himself.He never sounded very convincing.
jitendrakbharai 1 year ago
Thanks for posting this.
lexaling 1 year ago
The world has a lot of horrible crap and horrible people in it, but it is still a better place than it has ever been. I missed this terrific program the other night on the radio, and now I can see it here -- I love the internet.
Yep147 1 year ago
Slap that orange faced goon Hitch, slap him good and well.
MrFrontallobotomy 1 year ago
Hitchens is the man! Not only did he raise some awesome points and make some strong arguments, he did it in an entertaining and funny way. Brilliant.
apotcake13 1 year ago
i applauded :)
biohazardcel 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
He forgot to mention that N.Korea is ATHEIST country.JISUS CHRISTS IS THE CREATOR of the universe.Amen.
levonet33 1 year ago
@levonet33 N.Korea worship their leader as a demi-god. It is the "slave to Christ"-like uncritical mentality that Hitchens was attacking with this analogy.
TubeTest42 1 year ago 19
@TubeTest42 Yes,atheism is a religious cult.A belief that something came out of nothing.
levonet33 11 months ago
@levonet33 You will clearly never support my position because you don't even know what I believe.
Atheism is simply a lack of belief in god. I do not believe in any supernatural dimension. I try to only accept stories as a consequence of evidence. That is the core of my belief system and if you can argue against that instead of a straw man I will be impressed .
TubeTest42 11 months ago
@TubeTest42 Hitch definitly didn't think he would have to address people such as "levonet33"
so he didn't spell it out quite that clearly...well put TubeTest!
23codyy23 11 months ago
@levonet33 What evidence have you for this statement? Jisus (sic) didn't claim he was the creator of the universe. He lived 13.7 billion years after the Big Bang and the universe is probably much older than that.
thehumanfactorconz 1 year ago 16
@levonet33 North Korea is not an Atheist Country, idiot. They worship a god named Kim Jong Il.
JesusSojourner 1 year ago
Comment removed
atwarwithdust 1 year ago
@levonet33
A troll AND a Jesus freak. God damn.
pilottheshaker 1 year ago
@levonet33 - No, it's not atheist ... They adhere to the 1st Commandment ... However, it's not your god that comes first , it's Kim Jung Il ... There is no light beyond him in NK ... That's a religion if there ever was one ...
MaitreyaRocket 1 year ago
@levonet33 N. Korea is religious by definition. Please read up on this before you reply!
gary031183 11 months ago
@gary031183 N.Korea is typical atheist contry and dictatorships are 100% atheist countries( in most cases communist or islamic)
levonet33 11 months ago
@levonet33 They WORSHIP the 'dear leader' all day. The leader (Kim Jong Il) is a reincarnation of the father (who is dead but is still the 'president'). Upon his birth the birds were said to have sang in Korean! lol
Dude....if that isn't religious then Christianity is secular. lol.
"dictatorships are 100% atheist countries( in most cases communist or islamic)"
I hope you know that Islam isn't atheistic. lol. It's a religion. Pick up a book so I don't have to detail each dictatorship 4 U!
gary031183 11 months ago
@levonet33
Except it's not. There are several countries moving towards Atheism. France, UK, Canada and Norway are all more Athiest than religious. Saying N Korea is a typical Athiest country (When there is a cult of personality) is an intellectual cop-out on your behalf.
JerryConlon 11 months ago
@levonet33 No amount of caps lock is going to make it more true.
LittleBabyWheeler 11 months ago
@levonet33 Not technically, if you concede to the fact that they basically apotheosise their leader, pretty much making him a God in his own right.
OverFjell 9 months ago
@levonet33 N. Korea is not an atheist country. There is no such thing. N. Korea is just as dogmatic as the christian church. Hell there supreme leader is a dead man. They worship kim jong il everyday of their lives. They live a forced upon version of an earthly religion. You may want to educate yourself about the world more. Crack open a book besides the bible for once.
uniteordie1 7 months ago
please please please Hitchen don't die
cyklonb1989 1 year ago 72
@cyklonb1989 They need to freeze him until we have the technology to transplant a brain into a computer. This man by all means can prove the evil grip that religion holds on the human race.
AvengerSaix 1 year ago
@cyklonb1989 Ditto, friend, ditto!!!
thinlizzybone 10 months ago