Christmas in Capetown

[MrAtishraja]

He sure likes saying nigger a lot.

[wallofboingo]

@MrAtishraja he says it twice in this song and both times it has an impact and is within the character of the piece. Taint nothin' to complain' 'bout!

[MrAtishraja]

@wallofboingo 'Character of the piece' is a great excuse for saying nigger a lot.

[wallofboingo]

@MrAtishraja Hmm, guess thats why my friends call me "quite a character".... *rim shot*

[MrAtishraja]

@wallofboingo so you like saying nigger too

[wallofboingo]

@MrAtishraja I don't 'like' saying it and have never uttered it with genuine hate, but I dont wanna restrict a particular word from my vocabulary when it could work in certain instances just because some people might freak out about it. I dont wanna let culture dictate what I'm allowed to say or do. Your own heart and mind should dictate your language.

[MrAtishraja]

@wallofboingo Say that to a black guy in Harlem and see how culture 'dictates' your ass.

[wallofboingo]

@MrAtishraja Hey man, he might actually like this song for the same reason a lot of other people do.

[MrAtishraja]

@wallofboingo yeah if he likes being called nigger.

[X0TangoX0]

@frankthetank383 What? If you don't like it, leave. The greatest American Songwriter/composer of the last quarter of the 20th century and into this one.I like his songs about murder too. Even learned one. I'm sorry. Just re-read. You like him too.

[moehio]

Brilliant.

[Tokopol]

Absolutely brilliant, Mr. Newman. As always.

[izzaboutime]

while it might 15/'20 yrs old.............. same story.......... bunch a goldiggers having a afternoon.......... bet 1/2 of thenm could dind there car after the social............but it doesn 't matter, they'll just move on and fuck the \next guy

[inomawthanu]

just a brilliant song is what i say.A composer of music,within

the song, motiv , development, intelligence

[MobiusBandwidth]

the most daring songwriter of the last century. brilliant and often misunderstood. Stephen King writes about murder and no one thinks he's a murderer. Randy writes about racism and people assume he's racist. he's anti-racist.

[frankthetank383]

why are people looking up this video and a good few other Randy Newman videos then complaining or misinterpreting the meaning of the song its Randy Newman if you were a fan of his you would understand his writing style its not racist its telling a story of how a certain type of person thinks depending on the song, he's not Elton John singing little pointless love songs he's trying to get a message across.

[chiefillinichuck]

amen

[askmeaboutmypresidnt]

this isn't satire. It's another view of the changes in South Africa, from the point of view of someone about to lose his whole life as the culture of the last 150 years is about to get wiped out. Don't forget the "necklacing" (tire filled with gasoline and set on fire) done by Mandala's followers against opponents.

[022877]

being from new york..it's nice to hear a Mr. Newman at his best and watching someone light a cig at 1:14.

[xaquery]

At about  2:59, someone farts. Listen for yourselves.

[doctorw2]

that wasnt a fart that was randy newmans chair moving across the floor.

[Hoboscouts]

fag

[Hoboscouts]

fag

[TonyMoans]

@xaquery Oh it's Randy alright.

[kerezteny]

Although I wouldn't say this is his point of view, Randy Newman doesn't do 'satire' songs per se. That seems a bit too PC for his taste. He simply tells a story from the other side. 'Rednecks,' he said, is from the point of a southern everyman, and he said if he were a Georgian and saw Maddox being insulted like that, he would have been pissed too.

His satire songs are stuff like the Great Nations of Europe and Political Science 101.

I love this song.

[022877]

I like randy because he tells it like it is. You don't get the sense that he's a racist.

[doctorw2]

this song like short people is easily misunderstood, hes talking about social changes in south africa using satire.

[cantonadenmark]

Have you read the lyrics?..justifying apartheid???..quiet the opposite...I suggest you look the lyric up on the net...

[sptfgpn]

Thanks. I've done as you suggested. I'm no clearer. The song appears to be a rather hostile towards black South Africans.

[lcorinth]

In poetry and in music, the speaker in the poem, or the song, often does not reflect the attitude of the poet or songwriter. The poet uses a character to make a point.

Same goes for Newman's songs "Rednecks" or "Short People." Two songs that make a lot of people uncomfortable because of their confrontational - but satiric - lyrics.

If you think Randy Newman (and his sizeable audience) hates black South Africans - or midgets - then you don't get it.

[sptfgpn]

No. You're right. I don't.

[sptfgpn]

I'm a bit baffled by the lyrics. He seems to be justifying apartheid.

[RapaTerntSanga]

"niggers dirty niggers.."

O_O

[estreet58]

i love artists who tell stories like this harry chapin, bruce springsteen and jethro tull

[Bapuji42]

I'd like to congratulate JacobTrue and bapyou for totally dominating this forum with asinine bickering about your opinions. Here's my opinion: I don't care what either one of you thinks. I love Randy Newman, both musically and lyrically. And he's got a nice ass, too.

[Restrooms1]

You are both pompous assholes. Shut the fuck up! Enjoy neither of you would probably come to this video unless you enjoyed Ranady's music so why not enjoy? Basically I think you are all missing the point. ! BG

[wonkeaux]

great song. he is not racist, don't confuse the author with the character. this is an anti racism song. if you don't get that, oh well. :\

[TheBlackPage1]

Saying his songs are 'boring' is SUBJECTIVE. Bapyou's statement on his songwriting is OBJECTIVE. Therefore the latter is clearly the winning argument because it is backed up by valid evidence.

[eduardoyoung21]

"And I don't actually go onto certain videos to starting arguements. I just clicked a link."

JacobTrue, 4 months ago

[Hoboscouts]

the only reason i like randy is hes not afraid to say anything. Of course this was in the 70's and 80's but still not many did say what they wanted to back then either.

[TheBlackPage1]

Music is important to me, well written music should be stood up for by myself and others who feel the same way.

[TheBlackPage1]

If there is one thing I hate to see on YouTube, its arrogant opinion..seriously, get over yourselves guys. Or get educated about what you are judging.

[Hoboscouts]

Randy Newman= THE BEST

[BornAgain2989]

doesnt anybody realize he's singing in the third person? everybody thinks songs should be about personal feelings, get a grip!

[tsungvarsky]

What would Rev Al and Jesse think about this?

[squattyroo]

even tho this is about SoAfrica, Newman is one of the few white performers & composers who deal honestly with race. it makes some folk uneasy, huh?

[filthyfil024]

Jacob you have to take into account that this was made back in 1983. Things were different then. People spoke differently. Don't assume that someone is racist just on the soul case of using one word.

[JacobTrue]

i never once said he was racist. i don't think he's racist at all. all i'm saying is he looks like he's loving the fact he can get away with saying 'nigger' because its a sad story.

PS. he's still terrible.

[tuttlemsm]

Except for all those Grammies and Oscars....

[JacobTrue]

who were given to him by people who are also terrible. So many times talent has gone unrecognised and the talentless benefit.

[tuttlemsm]

Is someone making coffee? Because something smells bitter....

[JacobTrue]

firstly, nice comeback. secondly, since when is coffee bitter?

[LanysNevelesser]

If you think Randy Newman is a "maintream talentless hack," I'd be curious to hear who you think IS an unappreciated genius of our time.

[JacobTrue]

When did I call him a "maintream talentless hack"? Britney Spears is mainstream. Justin timberlake is mainstream. Not randy newman. Stop putting words in my mouth.

[LanysNevelesser]

Let me rephrase, then. Randy Newman is "still terrible," with and award "given to him by people who are also terrible."

How's that?

[JacobTrue]

Okay, fair enough. It's an opinion, but honestly, he really isn't that great. Lots of people have created better, more critically acclaimed music, yet have never received one award. Awards don't always equate to greatness.

[BornAgain2989]

I agree that awards don't always equate to greatness, however i must say that you should stop watching videos of artists that you don't like. It spoils it for people like me who actually enjoy watching videos of artists that they like. Also, you don't know the first thing about this style of writing. He does not enjoy using the aforementioned 'N' word he uses it to make a point. How else do you suggest you get that point across? "Racism is bad?"

[JacobTrue]

Look, I have nothing against other races. I'm not racist. I'm just saying that he sounds like he's really enjoying the fact that hes's getting away with saying 'nigger'.

And I don't actually go onto certain videos to starting arguements. I just clicked a link.

By the way, say NIGGER. No ones going to arrest you.

[BornAgain2989]

Fair enough, you make a good argument and you sound like a smart guy so i respect your opinion. but I don't like saying or even typing 'nigger' because i know it offends pretty much everyone who sees/hears it.

[JacobTrue]

Thanks for the compliment. But honestly, it offends me more when people act like they shouldn't say it, especially on youtube.

[TheBlackPage1]

Evidently you are not well informed about Newman. He has received very little in the way of awards, next to 30 or so nominations he has only received one Oscar and a few Grammys I believe. His film scores are very powerful on both emotional and technique level. His 'pop' writing third-person narrative is truly unique for its day also. He remained widely unpopular in his career, he deserves any award that comes his way.

[TheBlackPage1]

Self righteous ignorance will get you nowhere in life JacobTrue. You should rethink your values or at least form a valid opinion and state it in a less condescending manner.

[JacobTrue]

I should rethink my values because I don't like Randy Newman? Please.

As for the awards, I was simply going by what 'tuttlemsm' said a few comments up. The truth is, I know very little about Newman, a fact I freely admit. It's just my opinion.

[JacobTrue]

In fact, a lot of my replies on this comment thread have been defending free speech, addressing 'misquotes', and arguing about the supposed 'bitterness' of coffee. In actuality, I have talked very little about Newman. So don't call me fucking 'self-religious' and 'ignorant' when most of the time I'm trying to decipher what you bastards are saying.

[TheBlackPage1]

You should rethink your values based on the evidence of the 'nigger' subject. If you dont know a lot about Newman, dont post a comment - that is ignorance. Your probably one of many millions who found out about him via that dreadful 'Family Guy' series. If you want to defend free speech go and post a comment on a video that is in someway related to it, not just a half assed attempt at stalking controversy.

[TheBlackPage1]

it makes no difference whether you claim its 'just an opinion' Its insulting. It shows you in an incredibly ignorant light and i'm sure your not like that in real life, so why behave as such on a comment board?

[JacobTrue]

Fuck you! Firstly, Family Guy is the best cartoon ever, and Will Sasso kicks ass too. Secondly, I don't like newman because of musical taste. THAT'S NOT IGNORANCE. And since we've shared about 4 exchanges on youtube, you don't no FUCK ALL about me. So don't make baseless assumptions about me and say I 'stalk controversy'.

Thirdly, a word is not a crime.

NIGGER.

I'm not racist, but I have the right to SPEAK.

[TheBlackPage1]

Your opinions are subjective, it doesnt reign as fact. The reason I call you ignorant is because you make sweeping generalizations based on very little evidence, such as these comments you have posted. Yes you have the right to speak. Try calling someone a Nigger after sunset in Hackney, London. You'd be dead within seconds.

[JacobTrue]

Ooooh! Shit! I'd better not go down to hackney! Where the law is respected and your rights are upheld!

And for the last time, THAT COMMENT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE INSULTING! I don't like Newman as a musician! If I met him, we might get along, but I would tell him straight up that I think very little of his music. Everyting else is irrelevant. I don't claim to know everything about him! Jesus Christ!

[TheBlackPage1]

Ironic that you would treat Newman fans with no respect and then get all touchy when someone comes along to not only, disprove your opinion but give a much more valid statement! Your opinions are based on subjectivity, mine make a valid statement.I judged you on the evidence given by your comments, which can hardly be perceived as a 'baseless assumption'

[TheBlackPage1]

No law is respected in hackney, thats the point! they'd kill you regardless of law or rights. You are patronising and condescending where it isnt appropriate. Thankfully I neednt stoop as low to insult anybody with such launguage. I must learn to tip toe around you in the future incase you do something drastic! I'd much prefer to use my extensive vocabulary and verbally decimate you!

[JacobTrue]

Verbally decimate me?! Are you fucking dense? I use those words because they put a point across. That does not make me verbally inept. You say I'm arrogant, yet you talk about you're 'extensive vocabulary' and how you make 'valid statements' and how I'm 'subjective'. You say I'm ignorant, when I have never made fun of fans. All I'm saying is that I don't like him musically. THATS IT. Yet you just make more assumptions about how wrong I am, without giving any evidence.

[JacobTrue]

as for hackney, I was being sarcastic. I wouldn't say nigger there because I wouldn't get fair deal. Thats just common sense. And don't say I'm patronising and condescending where it isnt appropriate, cos you've already implied that I'm angry and stupid and that you are SO articulate. You really don't seem to understand what I'm saying.

[TheBlackPage1]

I'd rather come up with a series of words that sound pleasing to the ear rather than resort to a vulgar personal attack. 'Are you fucking dense?' no thats evidence enough to suggest you are condescending and patronising. Clearly you are not 'verbally inept'.. however, one of your comments suggested as much. I'll make a judgement on you based on what you've contributed to the discussion, I had plenty of evidence.

[TheBlackPage1]

And as for the verbal decimation, its a phrase I love to use..especially whilst listening to Wagner's 'Ride of the Valkyries'! I love the english language and I'm unashamed that I'm articulate, if that makes me arrogant so be it. Your opinions ARE subjective as they are based on no factual evidence (musically or otherwise) its just not your taste, big deal! post a comment about it and act surprised and offended when people disprove your statements.

[JacobTrue]

I'm articulate too, (by the way, I also love Ride of the Valkyries), but don't call me arrogant when you admit you are too.

However, you have once again repeated yourself in saying I am subjective, that my claims are not backed up by fact, and that you have disproved me, without giving any reasons why.

If you do reply, please include something that adds weight to your arguement.

[TheBlackPage1]

Ok. You dont like Newmans music because it is not your taste. You said he is 'terrible'. To me, thats a subjective statement. I disproved that by stating the fact that he does write music well (although I agree its not everybodys thing) and deserves recognition (awards etc). I dont resent you for the fact you dont like his music as I am not that petty. I can be vulgar but I dont intend to come across arrogant. I guess I got a little carried away by calling you arrogant, I apologize.

[TheBlackPage1]

Ah, I have more insight to your musical taste.. Thumbs of for listening to Wagner!

[JacobTrue]

Well if saying I think Newman is terrible is subjective, I guess I am subjective. But then saying that you think he does write well is then also subjective.

[TheBlackPage1]

I've studied his work from a musicalogical point of view, my opinions are more valid as they are based on the evidence i've accumulated. I've taken the time to sit down at the piano and learn his music, you on the other hand have done diddly shit lol. Ultimately, I dont care. I dont like seeing Newman's fans back down from an argument on his music, I felt I needed to step up.

[JacobTrue]

Firstly, don't argue with me for four days and then say you don't care.

Secondly, if you are looking at it from a musicalogical point of view, then you can't use it against an opinion of taste. I realise that Newman is a highly skilled pianist, but I don't like him musically.

[JacobTrue]

Thats all I'm saying. I wasn't attacking fans of Newman at all.

[TheBlackPage1]

I dont care what other peoples views are of him. I DO care about how he is perceived musically.

[JacobTrue]

And how do you think that is?

[TheBlackPage1]

I think because he has a bad voice people target that and the fact that he is a good composer and pianist gets shoved to the side.

[JacobTrue]

YEAH! Its called parody. Its only for fun.

[TheBlackPage1]

To be completely honest with you, I view parody as the lowest form of comedy.

[JacobTrue]

I disagree wholeheartedly. Parody can be fucking hilarious, and NO ONE is exempt from parody.

[TheBlackPage1]

Sure, it can be funny but its not hard to do, you dont require any special skills. Theres a lot of gifted comedians who dont do parody because its beneath them. Some parody I like, but I find it low in comedic value.

[TheBlackPage1]

Having said that, there is a few exceptions to when its done properly and executed well.

[JacobTrue]

Who cares whether it is easy! Just because parody comes easily it doesn't mean its any less funny.

Its like power chords on guitar. Power chords are really easy to play, and they produce great sound, yet so many people dismiss them because they are easy to do. People should see them for what they are. They sound good, so it shouldn't matter whether its hard to do it.

[TheBlackPage1]

Well, fair enough but personally I dont believe in simplicity in the art world. Stripes must be earned.

[JacobTrue]

Then lets agree to disagree.

[TheBlackPage1]

Lol, yes lets do. Best Wishes ;)

[JacobTrue]

and you.

[bapyou]

Jacob: You completely miss the point of Newman's song. In many many of Newman's songs, he is adopts a PERSONA. The persona he adopts for this song - written when the apartheid government of South Africa was crumbling - is that of a white South African who is seeing his race's hegemony slip through their collective fingers. So: The character - from whose perspective this song is being sung - is the one who is really enjoying the use of the N word.

[JacobTrue]

I NEVER SAID HE WAS RACIST. READ WHAT I WROTE BEFORE YOU REPLY. Also, siy NIGGER. There is no youtube police that are going to arrest you if you type NIGGER.

[bapyou]

Jacob, I didn't write that you said Newman was a racist. You wrote that Randy seemed to be enjoying the use of the word nigger. I did read your comment. Did you read mine?

[bapyou]

Jacob: Awards don't always equate with greatness, but no one in the songwriting game even comes close to Randy Newman's biting satirical wit. He will never be appreciated as he should because America is full of dimwits. Who else has writen or is capable of writing a song with the historical sweep and vision of 'Sail Away'? Or the historical emotion of 'Louisiana 1927'? Or the humor/satirical eye of 'It's Money that I Love' and 'My Life is Good'? Answer: No one.

[JacobTrue]

And as for your rant about his songwriting, I'm sorry to say that your arguement comes to naught because it is simply an opinion. I know that I have written my opinions on Randy Newman, but I have siad time and time again that my view on Newman is just one of an entire spectrum. Personally I think you are seriously overselling him. Newman's songs are BORING. Again, my opinion.

[bapyou]

Well, Jacob, my claim was not that Newman is America's most EXCITING songwriter (whatever an exciting songwriter is), I wrote that "no one in the songwriting game even comes close to Randy Newman's biting satirical wit". This is a statement about satirical wit as much as it is about Randy Newman. So whose songwriting comes close for satirical wit? Please give me a name.

[bapyou]

Jacob: No. I'm not overselling Newman. He has his place in the American popular music scene. His niche is what it is; nothing more, nothing less. You think he's boring. It's because (in all likelihood) you're a person who requires a high amount of stimulus in order not to be bored. A common American trait. Personally, I'm never bored. Not all, but much of Newman's best work is too intelligent for most. For this reason he'll probably never connect to the masses.

[JacobTrue]

Firstly, I'm English, not American. Secondly, you know nothing about me, so don't say that you think I must need lot of stimulus to be entertained. Again, you are using an opinion to argue. You say that RN is to intelligent for most. MAYBE HE IS JUST SHIT AND NOBODY LIKES HIS MUSIC. Ever thought of that? See, thats an opinion to.

[bapyou]

Well, you're English. And you're 19 yrs old. That explains a whole lot. Newman is (frequently) very very very American in what he writes about. And yes, I don't know you and made an assumption in my last comment. But you didn't address the important part of my last comments to you. I guess you're not knowledgeable about music enough. Music is not about who can beat up who. That's boxing.

[JacobTrue]

It has nothing to do with a knowledge of music! Its about whether it SOUNDS GOOD! Its my opinion, (which I have said time and time again), and I have a right to express it. I'm not arguing against opinion! I just expressed mine and I got roped into all the shit.

And what do you mean by me being english and 19 years old 'explains a whole lot'?

[bapyou]

JacobTrue:

"what do you mean by me being english and 19 years old 'explains a whole lot'?"

Here is what I mean, Jacob:

Randy Newman's songs are American with a capital 'A'. They r-e-s-o-n-a-t-e with AMERICANS. The references within most of his best songs are AMERICAN. Now, granted, from the song posted here, you may not come to that conclusion; but this would only be true if 'Christmas in Capetown' were the only song you have ever known of Newman. Newman speaks to the soul of America.

[JacobTrue]

so you're saying, and correct me if I'm wrong, that I can't appreciate the SOUND of RN because I'm not american?

Because thats what my original comment was about. Its not about content, or messages, or political satire, its about SOUND.

and RN SOUNDS shit, IN MY OPINION.

[bapyou]

OK, if you dislike his sound, fine. I looked up your original comment. It isn't about sound at all. ghere it is:

"Wow. I thought that Will Sasso was exaggerating when he was doing those impressions. They're actually spot on.

He loves the fact that he can say 'nigger' just because it's a story of black hardship. This is SHIT. Randy Newman is WANK."

IOW, you first learned of Newman through an impressionist. And then you criticize him for using 'nigger'. You don't understand the context.

[bapyou]

cont: Many (most?) of Newman's songs are written in the third person, and, in this song, he is singing from the perspective of a white South African decrying the loss of white hegemony. Why wouldn't someone within that mileau/in that position use such a word? You must address the content of THE SONG in the historical CONTEXT during which in was written. The song and its context are inseparable.

And, if this song is all you know of RN, you speak from an uninformed, reactionary POV.

[JacobTrue]

And I don't rely only on sound, but its the main factor. I like a band called DragonForce. Their lyrics are infinately cheesy, but they are the best speed metal band I have ever heard.

(btw my comment below that I replied to 'marnavot' with was also intended for you as well)

[Marnavot]

I rely both on sound and on lyrics. It depends in what I'm listening to. There are some bands that I like that have mediocre lyrics, but good sound. In Randy's case, the lyrics come first, but I love his sound as well (there I disagree with you).

If you want to try getting to know Newman's work better, I suggest you begin with these songs: Political Science, Rednecks, God's Song, My Life is Good, Lonely at the Top.

Try it. If you're still not convinced... your loss. Goodbye (-:

[Marnavot]

And BTW, I also liked Will Sasso's impression of RN, it's funny (even though RN is one of my favorite musicians).

[bapyou]

Jacob:

"I like a band called DragonForce...the best speed metal band I have ever heard."

Speed metal. (rolls eyes) Not exactly a musical genre. More like an athletic workout. Newman has used very metal sounding guitars in the production of some of his songs, btw. Check out 'It's Money that I Love'.

Speed metal. (rolls eyes) (rolls eyes again) (walks away shaking head, rolling eyes)

[JacobTrue]

Not a musical genre?! Are you fucking serious?! Do you even understand the basic tenets of an appriciation of music?

Again, you are arguing musical preference, which is stupid, pointless, and the pricipal of it is tantamount to racism or homophobia. YOU ARGUING OVER THINGS THAT NO ONE CAN HELP.

I don't just listen speed metal. I listen to pop, punk, ska, funk, alternative, emo, all sorts.

[JacobTrue]

And guess what? I would rather have an athletic workout than sit in a small room listening to someone give his 2 cents about world issues in the form of gloomy strained vocals and boring piano, you condescendind bastard.

[bapyou]

And guess what? An athletic workout might be healthier for you than listening to "gloomy strained vocals and boring piano". Hope you're on the right side of things. Your world is a bright one, isn't it? Kill all those sick morose twits who feel pain of the world! Kill 'em all!

[bapyou]

Look, you little twerp, lucky for you this argument is taking place across the internet and a continent and an ocean away. Elsewise you'd have had your teeth busted clean by now. Condescending bastard? Look who the fuck is talking! Your entire demeanor brims with condescention.

[JacobTrue]

All I was saying was that enjoying music shouldn't be judged on primarily on lyrical content! Music is supposed to sound good!

When I tried to explain this with an example concerning my musical taste, you act as if I am some sort of 'little twerp' who does not understand music. I respect you tastes, and you should respect mine. BUT YOU DON'T. You replied with a comment which was basically

'My music is better than your music, because I listen to music that says things about stuff'

[JacobTrue]

You WERE being condescending, and you WERE being close-minded, not only about music, but also about me in general.

You act like I have not knowledge of music because I am younger than you. A BASELESS ASSUMPTION.

Fuck you and fuck your teeth-busting skills.

[bapyou]

And fuck you as well, you public school tosser.

[bapyou]

Well, Newman's music is quite interesting and it can rock hard at times. Unlike speed metal, his music - aside from its lyrics - is quite dynamic, and highly varied. Not all of his songs sound like "gloomy strained vocals and boring piano". You don't have to like Newman, but I thnk you haven't listened to all of his music, as some of us on this post have. Speed metal? Same thing:

Over and over: Fuzz guitar, fast drums; fuzz guitars, fast drums. Talk about BORING! It's for kids.

[JacobTrue]

First of all, Public school? What the fuck?Are you REALLY bringing class into this?

Second, if you actually listened to speed metal regularly, which I do, you might be able to tell the elements of the so-called 'over and over' genre apart, which I can quite easily.

However, it is still a question of musical taste, which obviously differs from me to you. And yet, you are continuing to argue against it, which makes no sense.

[bapyou]

You can't separate music and sound in a song. It's an entire package. There is nothing interesting - sonicaly - about speed metal. Sorry. And why not bring class into it? You little prick. If you had any sense of the way things are in the world - and why they are they way they are - you might appreciate Newman's art. Or, perhaps, you like being a little public school snot. Fuck off, you little prick. Again: You're lucky this exchange is taking place across continents and oceans.

[JacobTrue]

Correction:

"There is nothing interesting - sonicaly - about speed metal."

TO YOU.

To other people with other musical tastes, speed metal is very interesting. Again, you are arguing musical taste, which is stupid and pointless.

[bapyou]

Then why do you keep emailing me? You like what you like, you little public school prick, and I like what I like. There isn't anything about art that goes beyond your head. Is that it? In a word, this is a philosophy known as solipsism. It's OK. Solipsism is rampant in western culture. Be one of the crowd.

And - for the fifty-ninth time - you have listened to how much of Newman's music?

[JacobTrue]

Hardly any! I freely admit that! I don't need to hear any of his other songs to make judgements on this one!

And I keep emailing you to remind you, for the 60th time, that You like what you like, and I like what I like!

And by the way, this arguement is taking place across and ocean and BETWEEN continents.

[bapyou]

Get...

...a life.

....some taste.

[JacobTrue]

get...

...a gun

...shoot yourself in the fucking head.

[bapyou]

No thanks.

Maybe you should also find yourself a girlfriend. Or a guy, if that's your thing.

You've wasted far too much energy on this post.

Cheers, public schoolboy.

[JacobTrue]

Thats it? Thats all you've got to say? We finally get to the root of the problem, (you either ignoring or not understanding that musical taste is pointless to debate), and you tell me I need to GET LAID?

How profound...

And for what its worth, I don't feel I've wasted time here. All I did was type. You are the middle aged self-professed 'scientist and college instructor'. Out of the two of us, you are the one who has wasted time.

Cheers, pompous self-righteous shit.

[bapyou]

And you're a pompous self-righteous shit as well. What makes you any better than someone else?

And not just "get laid". Get something else in your life besides posting comments to YouTube. You know: Friends, family, people. The internet, frequently, IS a waste of time. I'm home with a bad cold. What's your excuse?

Cheers, public school schoolboy.

(Guess I nailed that one!)

[JacobTrue]

"What makes you any better than someone else?"

This from someone who thinks its okay to bring social class into the arguement? You are a fucking moron and a hypocrite.

And by the way, my excuse is posting my opinion on youtube (something that this comments thread is specifically for), and then getting replied to by someone who thinks they have an unparalleled appriciation of music due to:

- Age

- Social Class

- An interest in non-mainstream music

You are an awful human being.

[bapyou]

No. I'm not awful at all. Thank you.

And you're an upper-class twit. Thank you.

" "What makes you any better than someone else?" This from someone who thinks its okay to bring social class into the arguement?"

Well, frequently you upper class types have this superior attitude. Class is an inescapable fact. Recognizing this isn't hypocritical at all. It is what it is. It is hypocritical of you to attempt to claim otherwise.

[bapyou]

You sound like a conservative Republican here in the states, crying woe. You can't change the facts of class.

And age has nothing to do with anything. The real issue is you posting sweeping comments about an artist about whose work - admittedly - you know little.

Please stay in England, and make comments on Cold Play videos. OK?

[JacobTrue]

Me upper-class? I'm working class if anything. Where are you getting this information? Republican? I am a definate liberal if you want to talk politics.

And as I've said, YES I know little about RN. Thats why I only talk about this song you idiot.

And just for the record, I fucking hate coldplay. I hate them with every fibre of my being.

[bapyou]

Give it a rest.

[JacobTrue]

what do you mean, 'Give it a rest'?

[bapyou]

Here's what I mean: Give it a rest.

[JacobTrue]

I understand what the fucking words mean (again you are being conscending).

What do you mean with respect to my previous comments?

[bapyou]

"musical taste is pointless to debate"

Then why are you?

[bapyou]

I understand music far more than you realize. Much of what you young folks refer to as music, is nothing more than your own little cult bands with which you exclude the world. Art steps up to the plate (American phrase there), and addresses the world. It's not about some little group of the select initiated.

[Marnavot]

Hey, JacobTrue, I totally agree- you have a right for your own opinion. So, dear fellow Randy Newman fans, try convincing him instead of attacking him!

JacobTrue, it's too bad you're relying only on sound, and not on lyrics and content, because you're missing out on some great songwriters. Many people say that Dylan also sounds crap, but he's one of the greatest songwriters ever lived, and so is Newman (in my opinion). Both are NOT singers, but are great songwriters.

[JacobTrue]

"This is SHIT. Randy Newman is WANK"

Yes, I added comment about Will Sasso's impression of RN but the sound comment is there.

Also, I have said time and time again, I never said RN was racist, just that he looked like he enjoyed his privelage to say nigger because it is a tale about racism, which he obviously does not agree with.

[JacobTrue]

sorry, that comment was supposed to go to 'bapyou'.

[bapyou]

Jacob: What exactly in Newman's demeanor makes you say that "he looks like he enjoyed saying the word nigger"? Is it a look that comes across his eyes when he sings the word? Some sort of body movement? Just what the hell are you sensing that no one else on this post seems to be picking up on? BTW, this isn't the only song in which he has sung the word nigger. Probably the first such song in which he used it is 'Rednecks'. There is a video of him singing that song posted here on YouTube.

[Marnavot]

An opinion to what?! (-;

(should be: an opinion, too.)

[JacobTrue]

read the thread and find out.

[bapyou]

Read Greil Marcus's essay on Newman in one of the greatest books ever written about popular music in America: Mystery Train. You'll get a better perspective on Newman's art.

[geeflat]

Thanks for the tip. I'll get that.

[bapyou]

It's an old(er) book (early 70s), but worth your time to read. Read also the chapter on Sly Stone. You will see the history of gansta rap decades before gangsta rap came to be. The story of Stagger Lee, according to Marcus, is a folk tale that's been floating around Black America for generations; the story of the biggest, baddest mutha on the block. It's a stance that Sly Stone faced down in his life and artistry. It's a stance that gansta rap, consciously or unconsciously, embodies.

[bapyou]

Mystery Train is a powerful book. Full of resonance.

[JacobTrue]

Wow. I thought that Will Sasso was exaggerating when he was doing those impressions. They're actually spot on.

He loves the fact that he can say 'nigger' just because it's a story of black hardship. This is SHIT. Randy Newman is WANK.

[JazzySaxE]

he said nigga? wtf?

[Ge0ffB]

The man is fantastic! No-one else writes songs like these, except for Richard Thompson

[blackheartlewis]

does anybody have the bbc documentry made about randy, it was shown about 3 years ago.if you do please upload as mine got taped over and ive never forgiven myself.

[pkeltz]

Finally some REAL Randy Newman videos.