Steal This Film 2 - Part 5

[conexy2k7]

wtf is that vague blur

[UchihaRuthl3ss]

Pure and simple, "piracy" is the free sharing of intellectual property. Life is short, if you give a fuck about money someone else is making you're a faggot. Long live Piracy.

[rageohol]

i liked this..but really..this is all just justifications for stealing...pirating is stealing..when next you are screwed out of something..you wont have an ethical leg to stand on...and before you judge me?..i wont have one either...

[kyleshike]

no dude, it's sharing... what about not having a leg?

[rageohol]

i mean to say i pirate as well,i wasnt trying to judge anyone who does this,i live in japan-and i cant see normal tv-sidereel. com and piratebay is the only way i can stay up to date.

also..yeah..it pisses me off that if i only want one song well..it takes 3 cents to make a cd-and the weasels charge me 20 bux-so thats theft too.

so..just saying-Im stealing..i admit it-but so should everyone else-basically-if the people who make the music dont want you to get it that way-then its stealing.

[shadycallum]

filesharing = idea sharing = good thing

im all for taking down capitalist mass media

BUT

we need to pay small artists or they will starve and their ideas with them. mass media and censorship will thrive...torrents or no torrents :(

new artists cant make money from gigs if they are small bands,most venues are "pay to play" and new small bands actually LOSE money by playing gigs!

How can we nurture new bands/artists etc while still making corporate mass produced macdonals music/film free?

[stylemasterrr]

art existed before industry.

we are getting back to the fundamentals.

an artist will get supported by other means besides selling the actual data (music/film)

as musician for example will have to sell tickets to his/her performances.

the cinema experience is still worth $8 to many and that will never change.

then there is always advertising, product placement in indie films may be the future.

knowing that a "free" movie will be DL'd by millions, an advertiser might want to contribute. idk.

[Mp3Drug]

@stylemasterrr Lol I agree with most but the advertisers might be a problem. Why would someone want to advertise a movie trailer to pirates? why would an advertisers want to advertise washing up liquid etc, even a car advert wouldn't work on a digital copy, as it would be outofdate in a sort amount of time, and you can't re-giveout a movie file for everyone to share as people will be downloading the original copy with the old car advert in it... any ideas?

[Tuber77]

I think theres two assumptions people make about file sharing especially from the "Stealing" crowd. One is that people who download anything where going to buy it to begin with and two that everybody who downloads isnt going go out and buy it later. alot of them do go out and buy. I think that people what to reward people for the good work. If it is good work and if they can afford it. Some just cant. I think the idea that you deserve money even if its bad went out with the advent of the net

[bazza0173]

we need a whole new system for "profits" what is a profit? a cash insentive? that's that deeper meaning in this film.. that as a race, we shouldn't be consumed by cash! and ultimately we need a better system of payment for goods, one that includes everyone, and doesn't favour some with ALL the rewards and others with NONE..

[nyran125]

to be honest they spend TOOooo much fckin money on, advertising, video clips,Mass marketing just to get broader profits..

Some video clips have been reaching staggering prices, all to reach a wider audience to make BIGGER profit, It has gone too far with marketing anyway.Maybe pirating is making artists have to come back to reality,You have to enjoy PERFORMING to make your money.Not just marketing and mass advertising like a mcDonalds restuarant.I dont think snoop dogg is losing sleep or CARS!

[towerofthunder]

Also, consider the fact that musicians make only about 50 cents per $20 album sold, that's about 2.5% of the profit. Traditionally record companies and music stores were just the middlemen who got artists music "out there." In modern times, the internet has rendered these industries practically useless.  Even if a very small percentage of people actively donated to these artists, artists would still get the same amount of money.

[bazza0173]

I totally agree that the artist should profit, and I understand completely that the artist isn't the main profit from his/her art at the moment, However, i'm also not blinded by the sheer amount of money that goes into designing CD covers, making videos, hiring costumes, directors, producers, paying for slots on MTV type programs, Printing up T-shirts, Making Dolls, Actual cost of producing the Cd's themselves, with or without a vinyl additional sale, all these things add costs..

[bazza0173]

this is really interesting.. but i wonder what these dj's/rappers/writers are doing for money in order to be able to provide them with the machines they use to be able to pirate? are they scrubbing floors!?

[dudewhatthehellman]

any source of money, just not intellectual property

[bazza0173]

missed my point. my point is. if you are creating music/art etc how are you going to make money from it to enable you to further create!..

[L337AB1X]

How expensive do you think those machines are? because its not much more than most home appliances

[towerofthunder]

Interesting question, the basic idea behind this movie is that thoughts are free and that thus they should remain free, and be given freely. The question that you raised, how then should artists support themselves, is an important question and one that should be addressed.

[towerofthunder]

Musicians currently make money through a variety of sources: sales of records, merchandise and concert tickets, and royalties from commercial airplay. Freeing music will certainly not be detrimental to the sales of merchandise (T-shirts, etc.) and concert tickets, nor will it affect compulsory or performance royalties. If anything, it will improve sales. This isn't just theory, bands such as the Nine Inch Nails, Oasis, Radiohead, and The Grateful Dead all embrace the free music philosophy.

[bazza0173]

The bands you've sited prospered under a system of monetary reward for their intellual property. They are also big names with prior marketing/advertising and mythology attracting sales.. mythology that came from Record Cover design - (example pink floyd) Music video's (micheal jackson - thriller) and merchandise sales.. (example - britney spears dolls) who would fund those outlets and why if there were no further sales to be gained? and what large venue would host a relatively unknown artist?

[towerofthunder]

Obviously they prospered from monetary rewards from their intellectual property, making songs takes work. They should be compensated for that work, but hoarding computer files that can be easily duplicated is unethical. Once I buy something I should do with it as I like.

[towerofthunder]

There are other ways to be compensated for that work, other than hoarding of computer files, (as you [bazza0173] stated), such as charging for live performances, advertising ("Mmmm, coca-cola is 'insert band name here's favorite soda"), merchandise sales. And why wouldn't you fund these outlets? Just because I downloaded a song from a band wouldn't mean i wouldn't buy a t-shirt from them, drink their brand of soda, or go to their concert. Maybe I don't understand your point?

[bazza0173]

My point is.. my band.. (fictional) doesn't want to be associated with teeth rotting fizzy drinks, or the next local politician running for office.. and i'm having trouble getting time off work (i work in a factory, 11 hr shifts) to play live gigs, small venues, and merchadise other than t-shirts who pays for them? the band? from what money!?

[MistsofRuin]

Look bro, you don't understand the way business works do you? I'm the owner of a small software start-up, I designed my product to make it irrelevent to steal, because to the general public, it is free.

It's called advertising, if you allow a segment of your product to be released for free, you will attract more people, and if you are intelligent enough, you find another system to drive profits.

In the case of bands, that's free music online, and you get paid for your show.

[towerofthunder]

Secondly if a large venue won't host a relatively unknown artist what CD sales would that artist be losing? He has everything to gain by letting people download his music, his concert sales will probably increase, and he's getting free publicity. Unless he totally sucks, which means he should probably go find another job anyway.

[bazza0173]

well without CD sales, how does the artist continue to work? or become known.. cept by a small select few on the internet.. ? voluntary donation!?

[towerofthunder]

if only a select few know you on the internet who's going to buy your CDs?

[bazza0173]

exactly my point!!

[towerofthunder]

actually i doubt it's your point. the point i'm trying to make is, if you're relatively unknown. you aren't famous enough to make music your full time career, you don't play live gigs enough to sell very many cds, and no one knows who you are. aren't you going to profit more from letting people download your music than trying to sell CDs (which no one is going to buy)?

[Shatonmedeek]

i download all the music i want from bittorrents, and when i go see the live shows of the bands i really like, thats when they get compensated........

[Dmiendnl]

Uhm, take youtube for instance. There are lots of fresh artists here that give people a chance to listen to one or two of their songs followed by a link to their site in which you can buy their cds. And I've gotta be honest! I've bought many cds this way, and its a good way to spread your artwork. And most importantly of all... Everyone can do it! And they work without any help from a record company what so ever.. The artists should get the money right in their pockets and not their distributors

[woody21c]

Won't work, that's the whole point of this film... as soon as someone has purchased that media, they can then distribute it freely.

[Dmiendnl]

If a guy told me: "Hey, listen to this song. But you have to pay 15 dollar to open it up though." Then I would not have listened to it at all. Why risk it? But if he just sent it to me for free, I would definatley accept it and give it a listen. And if you're an artist and no one listen to your music, what the hell is the point in the first place?

[AtomicN]

we live in a world where people do things for that money.

[andremp03]

I'm so glad I watched this

[kirbykia]

Proud world not a profitable!

[dudewhatthehellman]

yEAH!! information to all, i mean, big guys can survive and still be rich with the sharing of intellectual property, SHARE EVERYONE!

[bazza0173]

THis film never said big guys can survive.. it said we need a new way of working. but never said how!?

[Harvey2face123]

That's because no one knows a why, or has gotten an idea of new way across.

And I like it the way it is, everything in the world is so centralized, so controlled you can't but help feeling limited, the internet is wide open though, for now anyways. We need to use this state of the internet now while it lasts, before it's taken over by some bureaucracy, we need to hold onto it for as long as possible.