Gaddafi is dead and the Libyan people are free - and freedom is always worth the price. Now he is getting his photo taken with the families of his victims only he is in hell and his body is propped up for photos... how very fitting.
A Question to be made by al jazeeraTV Report now??? A Question in Saudi Arabi support with the Americans, France, England, Italy. LOL Stupid Arabs. They selling there people. What you expect they were slave traders before. Follow a strong Muslim. Not Arabs
qaddafi likes to give grandiose speeches in which he talks of defiance. saddam, miloshevich, mubarak, ceausescu, tojo, mussolini, they too gave grandiose speeches & spoke of defiance.
@MrPloverwi Educate yourself brother i know for a fact your making up half of this shit because it doesn't fit the timeline nor have i said anything about US involvement in China because there wasn't any. You accuse me of being politically "motivated" ( you spelled it wrong its not "motovated") i don't have any political motivation. I know you brother your not here to convince me your here to convince yourself. I will leave you with your own illusions do not expect a response.
@MrPloverwi You continue to make Historical Mistakes and Grammatical errors in your posts. This leads me to conclude you either have a limited understanding of English or you are sightly uneducated.
My Family lives in the Philippines and i visit every so often. My aunt married a Chinese man who's brother was shot at in the Tienanmen Protests. Do not tell me Tienanmen changed nothing or was some CIA hoax because that is false and an insult to the people who stood up for the greater good.
@MrPloverwi The communist party kept its policies on restricting private ownership from the 40's to the 90's. However Mao's Great Leap Forward introduced even more extremes revoking private ownership almost completely and it caused Famine and Economic decay throughout China this is why his policies where abolished. Tienanmen Square was the people calling out for change and free Entrepreneurial policies, now Bourgeois allowed to exist in china once more.
@MrPloverwi Correction you should reread my previous post. If you knew your history properly Tienanmen Square happened in '89 that would make it 21-22 years ago from this day. read this Quote carefully this time
"Tienanmen Square happened 15 years after Mao's reforms where abolished by Chairman Hua Guofeng." that happened in the 70's. Mao has nothing to do with the economic success Post-Tienanmen Square.
PS: Your definitions are politically motivated, mine are based on historical facts.
@MrPloverwi Im sorry but i just read one of your posts and i could not help myself because you are just so wrong. Tienanmen Square happened 15 years after Mao's reforms where abolished by Chairman Hua Guofeng. So where the hell do you get this idea its as if you don't know even know Chinese history. Educate yourself my god man! anyhow just adding to my previous post im done with this conversation.
PS: you don't need to post 11 responses and try to keep them coherent just a little advice for you
@MrPloverwi You are yet wrong again let me copy and paste a sentence this will be my last post i promise =).
"Marx drew ideas from Socialism throughout history but the one and only thing that truly defines Communism as Communism and separates it from Socialism is the elimination of the Bourgeois, elimination of Capital motivation and private property."
Communism is not Socialism and it did not exist before Marx. Your interpretation is false and fundamentally wrong.
@MrPloverwi Look i'm simply getting tired of this conversation because you are either Inept or Ignorant of the true facts and Ideology behind Communism and Socialism. Its tiresome it really is because you can't put up a credible argument and when you have nothing intellectual left to say you revert to colonialism and "white thieve's" as if it still exists in China or Vietnam. I have tried to explain to you why Communism Destroys nations but you simply do not have an open mind. I'm done
@MrPloverwi Also the US government did not "adopt" socialist policies to defeat the Russians. unions had to fight with strikes thought the depression era to get established. That is simply how democracy works people will pass reforms, lobby and inevitably they will be adopted if they are fair and sustainable. Government funded projects in the US also existed before the depression its not a new thing either. Socialism simply is the Majority Rule in government and business by the People.
@MrPloverwi You say i take things out of context? Dude it says all these things in the books i have taken nothing out of context. Marx drew ideas from Socialism throughout history but the one and only thing that truly defines Communism as Communism and separates it from Socialism is the elimination of the Bourgeois, elimination of Capital motivation and private property. Lenin/Stalin/Mao all believed in it. Socialism on the other hand allows all 3 to exist.
@MrPloverwi Mao's so called "great reforms" where all abolished after his predecessor took chairman and even during Mao's Rule. Even then People only had partial property rights and little if any intellectual property rights until the Tienanmen Square in the 90's. Also Socialism and socialist ideas existed long before Marx since the time of the Greeks or even before. Democracy is a Socialist implement so America was somewhat socialist from its inception.
@MrPloverwi No your wrong Mao did unite the country but farmer's still owned their own property before he instituted "The Great Leap Forward" which was when his Commune's where established removing private property from Farmers. After that Farmer's where not allowed to own even their own Livestock. Mao was greatly concerned with private property rights and greatly concerned with its impact in the future he even mentions this in the red book.
@MrPloverwi And it is true that Communism has been modified but very little and to great failure. It is because Marx did not clearly define how such a system would be run or how it would be implemented therefore this resulted in authoritarian rule in order to control a system that is ultimately impossible to sustain (as proven by history). If Mao respected property rights he would not have instituted his Agricultural-Communes and complete Government Control of Industry.
@MrPloverwi If you have read the books and understand them then you would understand Communism is not modifiable. Communism is based around the Proletarian and the Classless society anything less than that is Socialism. Communism is based on the theory that the Rich (Bourgeois) if allowed to exist will always rule over the majority in Politics and Economics. Communism is the system created by Marx and all Communist countries adhere to, to prevent the rise of the Upper class (Bourgeois).
@MrPloverwi You make many misconceptions here I never related Communism to Imperialism that is your own mistake. However i will have you note that China would not be the way it is today if Mao's policies had not ended and Capitalist economic Policies enacted. The fact that there are Bourgeois and private business throughout China is something that goes against Mao's teachings.
@MrPloverwi I cant believe i am responding once more but you are wrong yet again. Mao's teachings Include Marx/Lenin in the Red Book, Proletarian vs Bourgeois Uprising, Dictatorship of the Proletarian, The Classless Society, ect all core believe of communism. I have Defined Communism as its true meaning where as you define communism to fit your own personal believes that is wrong. If you had read the books you would know all these concepts it is obvious you have not.
@MrPloverwi This will be my last response. I can tell from your comments that you have not read any of the 3 books front to cover and therefore you can clearly not define communism nor is it within your ability to provide a credible argument for it. Mao's philosophies hold the core beleives of Marx/Lenin in plain text as referenced from the Red Book. As i mentioned before, Marx brought about the idea of communism and you are trying to redefine it to suite your own personal believes.
@MrPloverwi Until you do this i cannot continue a conversation with you simply because you do not understand the underlying subject and it is plainly obvious that you don't. You continue to confuse community values with communism but this is not the case; Mao also clearly explains in the Red Book the difference between Socialism and Communism so does Marx in the manifesto. I suggest you read up on these Ideas and Philosophies before relating them to real world issues.
@MrPloverwi I'm sorry but i don't think you understand the concepts of Communism or its variations. The English version of the Red book is on par with its Chinese version just like the English version of Marx's books that was translated German to English by Engels. You can buy the Red Book, Communist Manifesto, and Capital and all 3 books will be credible and unedited. Mao also mentions in the Red Book that no communist should go without reading Marx-Lenin teachings and understand them.
@MrPloverwi When you speak of the Early days and Railroads i assume you are thinking of the intercontinental railroad (Thats the one with all the Chinese) there was the Union Pacific (constructed by mostly Irish immigrants) and a Central Pacific (constructed by mostly Chinese Immigrants). Chinese immigrants that came to work where paid fairly but the ones that came directly from China to work on the railroads where not paid so fairly. Also this happened after the Emancipation of the slaves.
@MrPloverwi Finally no Ho Chi Minh and Mao's Plan was originally to set up a classless society. Their idea's stemmed from that of Marx/Lenin Communism to have all workers equal. However Equality does not work in a socialist/capitalist society so now with Economic freedom in china there is a Lower class a Middle Class and an Upper Class it is most certenly not in the red book. This is something against Communist Ideology not what Mao or Stalin envisioned but fought against.
@MrPloverwi I'm not going to argue that Vietnam was wrong because it was. The objective was to support the South and it was none of our business just like Afghanistan was none of Russia's during the 70's. But do not tell me we went in there to steal copper and iron ore that is ridiculous when both where in more than abundant supply at the time.
@MrPloverwi Colonialism is simply imperialism on an intercontinental level. it is said everything that has happened in the modern world has already happened in ancient Asia. You call them "white thieves" but it is only because they are different color. Ancient China has had revolution after revolution conquered its neighbors and been conquered by them under imperialism. Do not point the Root cause and Europeans and the it was simply human nature.
@MrPloverwi I would not put the Russians Down in terms of Propaganda and military. Russia has more experience in Military application and Propaganda than its much younger Rival the USA dating all the way back through its imperialist days. how do you think they managed to send millions of conscripts to their death at the hands of the Germans during WWI. Soviets where poorer but that is the implementation of Communism to support what is unsustainable (in a modern sense).
@MrPloverwi Your Theory of how Propaganda is used does not make sense, you say it is so powerful a tool it controls the United States but yet you stated that the so called "victim nations" cannot be controlled through Propaganda. However that contradicts your theory that the CIA has implanted propaganda campaigns to start revolution in the middle east as that effects your so called "victim nations" via the use of Propaganda. It doesn't add up
@MrPloverwi A country's right to protect its national interests at least in my opinion ends when you start gunning down protesters or people who practice political speech that makes the government uncomfortable and sending them to prison. It is our right to say what we wish many of your fellow americans may not agree with you but will take up arms to defend your right to say it freely. And trust me there are plenty of guns to go around kind of makes the government wary of pissing us off.
@MrPloverwi Well where to start. First its widely acknowledged that the soviet union had killed and imprisoned political dissidents numbering in the 6 figures for far less than what you have posted on this video. When Guantanamo Bay got shut down there where less than 300 prisoners there, to get sent to prisons like that you have to be suspected of immediate danger to civilian life. True some maybe innocent some not but you dont send unarmed protesters/dissidents there nor do you arrest them.
@MrPloverwi now i'm not agreeing with you on the CIA thing but lets say hypothetically the CIA instituted propaganda campings to start revolution. Is it right for these governments to lock up unarmed protesters/dissidents, shoot them in the streets, put them in re-education camps or tourcher them en-mass simply for their believes right or wrong? you are allowed to say what you want speak freely and be a dissident there are other countries in the world not so lucky.
@MrPloverwi So your going to tell me that the Soviet had the right to invade Poland because Stalin wanted to help them? the soviets where just terrible ruled all the caucuses with an iron fist and helped Vietnam only to spite the west with good reason. Russia didn't want the USA in Vietnam just like we didn't want them in Cuba. its not about help when your country still has an imperialist undertone.
@MrPloverwi often people who fight for revolution like Ho Chi Minh, Lenin, Mao find that when they are gone things don't go the way they planned. People who start the Revolution rarely finish it and often times the result is a distortion of the original thing.
@MrPloverwi We don't need any slave labor china has enough cheap labor for the US and Vietnam still doesn't have freedom. any dissidents they round up put in prison, execute, or if your too popular to disappear they put you on house-arrest. Even if they do normalize trade with the US and get into the WTO what then what if the Vietnamese want more say in their government? are you going to tell me if they start a revolution its the CIA's fault?
@MrPloverwi your going back to the CIA conspiracy nonsense now the discussion on communism socialism and capitalism was a much more meaniful conversation. The soviets where just as bad as us they took communism and warped it to suit an imperialistic undertone. Why do you think when the USSR broke up there are many countries around Russia that just plain hate them and no its not the CIA. I live in Minnesota, US we have Russian and Ukrainian immigrants here they all hated the USSR.
@MrPloverwi The only problem with your theory is there was nothing in Vietnam just a bunch of bush and not all that much oil off the coast. There was nothing in Vietnam to steal so when you say "white thieves" your just talking about irrational fear. Its like Korea Prevent the spread of communism because its evil was the believe there was nothing truly to be gained from it except peace of mind.
@MrPloverwi That is true but you have to realize the soviets acted the same as the US during the cold war. they would invade countries KGB causing problems, even invaded Afghanistan in the 70's on the pretense of stabilizing the government. Giving the people the intent they where going in to help the Afghanistan government then the Tribesmen dislike the communists because of their somewhat anti-religious views take up arms and get help from the CIA. Ironic the Russians did the same to us in Viet
@MrPloverwi Most people even Vietnam veterans will tell you Vietnam was a mistake the USA paid for that. No one in the US prides themselves on the Vietnam war not even the Korean War (the forgotten war as i call it). both wars started over a fear of communism and misunderstanding of what it was.
@MrPloverwi no but i'm sure the caveman many Milena ago had the concept of trade and greed. the same concept applies to Marx's teachings that the idea of wealth achieved through greed by means of capital and or trade must be overcome in order to have Communism and true paradise. again this is not the western version of events this is the true communism as Marx defined it i'm not giving you some watered down version here this is marx.
@MrPloverwi Lenin and Stalin believed in no borders the USSR had many countries under its mantel many of them forced to join at gunpoint. Stalin however alienated himself from the west and the west followed as well. this popular concept that Communism was a force of evil and godlessness and could have been avoided but as nationalistic views go. remember that the East has demonized the west just as much as the west has demonized the East. There are numerous 60's propaganda videos on the net.
@MrPloverwi Communism on the other hand is an ideology that revolves around both social and economic. Cavemen did not have a word for Communism and it is part of the western media to define all far left socialistic countries with a dictator like regime as Communist. But that is the "popular" believe and not the factual one.
@MrPloverwi now you seem to be answering to different comments at different points in time so i'm going to continue with this discussion on communism and economy since i am already into it. "Capital'-'ism' "ism being a suffix for Ideology. Therefore Capitalism means a believe or ideology based around Capital. Capitalism does not mean Capital it is an economic ideology that revolves around capital.
@MrPloverwi I also Forget if it was either Marx or Lenin that wanted to abolish the idea of Nationalism and borders in order to unite the world as a whole under Communism. However this vision of the future is very different from the ones that Current communist Countries hold it is unachievable at their current level of development and ours as well. This is why the USSR fell apart and other Communist countries continue to suffer controlling the economy and industry to the point of collapse.
@MrPloverwi no your misunderstanding Marx didn't want to get rid of Capital (initially) he wanted to remove it as a motivator for building the community since he believed greed and exploitation is based around it through control of the community and of Capital/Trade. Eventually he believed people would not need capital and hence forth it would not exist (at least in the form it does now). This transition is what he explained socialism was and that further along the closer communism would get.
@MrPloverwi But that is the problem you mix the word Communism with Community it is not what the word means you cant define it as that. Call what you will MrPloverwism but not Communism because the word has already been defined by Marx. People will get confused what you mean when you use it in that way. i do not call a bird a tree nor would i call a cat a mailbox.
@MrPloverwi Communism on the Level of say a commune or small village is easy to manage. when you take Communism to a new level say that of a whole nation it becomes more complicated. People are not willing to abide by these rules and often times lack motivation since there is not enough to go around. Logistics become complicated like that of a bureaucracy that is why adaptations such as Stalin or Mao even their's i would not consider to be Communism at all.
@MrPloverwi Marx brought about the inception of Communism, Leninism is a very similar variation that is why i include the both of them when i Reference communism.
@MrPloverwi Then if you want to talk about "Community" do not try and relate it to Communism which builds on the Idea of the Community but takes it in an entirely new direction. The old idea of community is built around capital, "capital" or "trade" being required to motivate people to help build the community. Communism at its most basic philosophy is the Ideology that there is a way to eliminate the need for "capital" as a motivator through the use of control over the community.
"The thieves who you are defending is defining Communism as an evil ideology that focus only on killing and not valuing life"
Again you assume this is what i am implying but i am not. i am simply stating it is an impractical method of running the world and peoples lives. It is simply because a government cannot run and grow all levels of production and real-estate without the free enterprise of the private sector. through socialism you can regulate it but not control it.
@MrPloverwi What you are thinking of is socialism. Lenin/Marx coined the word Communism hence forth the defined the word to mean what it truly does. if you want to redefine what it means you would have to travel back in time and write the Manifesto before they did. that is why they call its variations Stalinist or Maoism and not refer to it as Communism in its basic terms because they are variations or watered down and distorted versions of true Communism.
@MrPloverwi Also we did not win against the Russians because of more Socialist Implementations. We won because of responsible spending and averaging our budget. We Have never spent over 7% of GDP on the military Never not even now with 2 wars going. Currently even after the cold war Russia spends over 25% of its GDP on the military. Not to mention the amount of money spent on socialist programs and running the entire country with no true business enterprise.
@MrPloverwi now now you keep making the mistake of confusing Socialism with Communism. Socialism is the Transition between Capitalism and Communism or so Defined by Marx/Lenin. Being as true Communism has never been achieved except in perhaps small Communes I use it as an Example as the Un-Obtainable Extreme Leftist example. Communism as you know it is actually Extreme Socialism but popular culture leads me to just simply call it Communism so i will simply just call it that.
@MrPloverwi I never Defined Communism as an Ideology of killing others. It simply has proven itself in the past to be an inferior motivator for the reasons i explained in previous posts. It is also an unrealistic ideology until man can become completely selfless or a perfect leader can be created through whatever means. You can clearly see what Communism turns into when put into practice and i don't want that for my country because people need and often times this system cannot provide.
@MrPloverwi you never heard of John Brown before you read that book? because there are many novels about him he is far from an obscure character there are also a few movies.
@MrPloverwi "White thieves and you seem to preach hatred against Socialism and only seem to embrace Selfishism."
This is your opinion of me because it is completely incorrect? I am not against Socialism i support it but Communism is not the same thing you understand? you should go back through history to find out why. also i am against interfering in other countries affairs but you seem to assume everything happening today is the result of a CIA plot this i do not agree with.
@MrPloverwi So in your mind it is the white man's fault again for causing problems between the two? It is like trying to blame African-Americans for Violent crime it is racist and ignorant. Any wealthy white land owners where stripped of their possessions sometimes even imprisoned they had no power no money so tell me who had the power and money in Vietnam and China. It was the Leaders of the two countries who held so tightly to "nationalism" something Lenin hoped to destroy btw.
@MrPloverwi But China and other communist countries at the time didn't do it right either did they. the early half of the 20th century was full of exploitation it was not until the 50's that the United States developed a wealthy middle class so this concept of a middle class in free economics is newer than communism. The US however Prevailed achiving this without the use of Communism but through small socialist implementations. where as China and Russia went to the other Extreme that ended badly
@MrPloverwi to say you have an open mind and that I am wrong and you are right is completely self defeating and hypocritical. you have your indoctrinated believes and its obvious you cant see any middle ground that makes you somewhat close minded.
@MrPloverwi you say i am close minded about these things and just because there was a coup with Mosaddegh almost 60 years ago does not mean that the CIA is responsible for Revolution the the middle east. was the US responsible for Revolution in Russia no they where not unless you think otherwise?
@MrPloverwi your not getting it The form of communism that currently exists is not true communism as Defined by Lenin and Marx. it is a watered down form of Communism that has been adapted to somewhat work Chinese have ownership and Intellectual property rights now Because of this. True communism can't exist and Socialism as Lenin defined it is what China has reverted to.
@MrPloverwi A People's History of the United States is a book based on opinion and analysis by an educated man but there are many educated men as well as there are many books that depict the history of the united states. Also Socialist implements have existed before Communism has and had circulated around the united states prior to.
@MrPloverwi Abraham Lincon did not return the slaves back to their owners he emancipated them You should read up carefully on american history. He originally wanted to free the slaves but because of the south being Pro-Slavery he was afraid he would split the country in two. Not to mention that Half of the United states had already banned slavery
@MrPloverwi The word Communism is a Word used to Explain a form of socialism it is not Synonymous with Community you can reference this in the Dictionary/Encyclopedia. Communism has strong ties to control of all levels of economy, culture, and leadership and is supposed to run all levels of the state. this is how Communism works and china having a free market defies one of the rules of Communism
@MrPloverwi oh really so what if a Dictatorship is supported by oh say the USSR? or perhaps Iran? it suites us to support the Saudi's just like it suites the Chinese or the Russians we all want stability and the oil flowing.
@MrPloverwi I would also have you note that it was the US that sold China tooling and factory equipment from the get go like that of the now defunct Tupperware plant. I will also note that China spies on the US and that every country spies on one another. Spying and Sabotage is a completely different thing the US is not the cause of China's past poverty and pollution problems. The US never blockaded China they never wanted our goods in past so you know what they never bought them its their loss.
@MrPloverwi it is American and European Corporations that contract China to build things for them they employ the Chinese they buy the Chinese goods and manufacturing. They set up and pay for the tooling necessary to make many of the products in Chinese factories. The investment and initial equipment necessary for china to grow was bought from the West or invested in China by the West. It was the Communists that prevented this for the longest of time.
@MrPloverwi Also US companies where not permitted with doing business practices in china until the Regime changed its mind on globalism that is why business with china was conducted through Taiwan and Hong Kong. this Policy of Independence from foreign ventures is the policy of Mao's Regime supposedly to protect itself from exploitation however the regime in the end caused great spread famine and pollution across china from crude coal plants to unsafe industry.
@MrPloverwi No i stated Community Values and Communism are not synonymous and that Community values exist in the united states and have been around before the creation of communism. be sure to read my comments carefully
@MrPloverwi I will also state that Discrimination in China still continued during Communist rule this had little to do with the government body but rather with popular opinion. Despite whatever Mao had intended for China's future The future that china has now is nothing what Mao could have wanted aside from the success of his people there is very little left of Communism left in china except the Dictator like Regime. Those you call "white thieves" if you really think about it helped save China.
@MrPloverwi I will also note that the Economic decay that followed China after becoming communist was not attributed to USA involvement. CIA operations ceased in Taiwan when International Relations Normalized with China Following the Vietnam Era. China still continued to decay financially and became impoverished during this time. It was not until Chinese protesters forced the government to give the people economic freedom opening the doors for Foreign investment and construction efforts.
@MrPloverwi What you may or may not understand is that Dictatorships do not work they will not work long term. this is because regardless of who or what these Dictators are or do the people will eventually want them gone and another leader installed one that the people choose by popular opinion. For example Bush could not be president for more than 8 years Democracy gives us a chance to oust leaders at our whim without violence and with popular opinion.
@MrPloverwi Community exists in the USA and it is not synonymous with Communism. People pitch money together to fund charities and help each other no Human would refuse to do so. Also the ideas of Conservation and protection of the environment have existed in the USA long before Communism plagued the planet and Communists have not infiltrated the Democratic party either. I will also have you note that it was Republicans that freed the slaves.
@MrPloverwi Also no one is stopping these communist nations from being successful there is no grand scheme to keep them poor they simply just do not acknowledge their potential. Communism is a poor motivator it gives the people little incentive or ability to create their own large scale operations because there is no true private ownership or intellectual property rights. do not confuse communism with socialism the 2 ideologies are similar but not the same.
"If you are a free thinker like me, you should learn to acknowledge the possibility that the CIA are part of this. You are too quickly to dismiss it so you are not a free thinker"
Which confirms you have absolutely no idea whether or not the CIA has been involved in any of the previous 20+ statements you just made about them and their so called "white thief masters" as it is all speculation and opinion and not fact
@MrPloverwi First off If Vietnam, North Korea and Cuba embraced Capitalism and Free trade they would have their own Mega Corporations and abundant Gross Domestic Product. Second you seem confused China fought with Vietnam briefly over Cambodia because Vietnam wanted to expand its influence and territory China didn't want that and China lost being unwilling to escalate to an invasion force.
@MrPloverwi It wasn't until Tienanmen Square Massacre where the communist troops gunned down Chinese students that the Communist leaders allowed capitalism and my god look how well their country has come since then. Mao's policies doomed China to stagnation and led to the starving death of over 30 million people because he simply wanted to grow different crops. Perhaps that is what the Libyans just a handful more freedom inspired by the Tunisian revolution.
@MrPloverwi Blaming White People and Corporatism is an easy way to justify poverty and stagnation of other countries. But the truth is countries like Vietnam, North Korea, Cuba ect... didn't want what we embraced capitalism built us a future communism and or extreme socialism couldn't. look at Taiwan or Hong Kong for instance they have money, infrastructure, manufacturing and no oil or natural resources. Free market and hard work made it possible communism is a poor motivator.
@MrPloverwi I should mention within a few months the PLA took heavy looses and had to retreat from Vietnam. the Vietnamese also still occupied Cambodia till the late 80's. And no Obama is not being bribed or in anyones pocket that is honestly just your opinion. Dictatorship/Royalty is how the Middle East has worked Pre-21st Century we will support one Dictator and not another because frankly you can't support them all now can you? Also your Comments are very Repetitive and Nonfactual.
@MrPloverwi I will also have you know that China has a history of "Race Superiority Complex" for instance there are many different kinds of Asian people. The Chinese people in particular thought very lowly of the Vietnamese and following the invasion of Cambodia by the Vietnamese after the American withdraw in the 70's. The Chinese sent troops and armored divisions into Vietnam to "Punish them for invading Cambodia" with a scorched the earth policy.
@MrPloverwi White people, Europe and the USA don't owe anything to anyone. Should the Ottomans AKA Turks pay Greece for Enslaving them and invading their country over 500 years ago? Also the Chinese are very capitalistic and is very much like the US is now, we have a good relationship with China only minor trade disputes like the tarrifs on tires or poultry. The USA has had good ties with China since the Vietnam era, also when Chinese-Russian ties broke the 2 became enemies.
@MrPloverwi that so called "Theory" i made up to show you exactly how easy it is to come up with this kind of stuff. I am a free thinker as well but none of the stuff you are trying to say has substance. I'm just trying to tell you how ridiculous it sounds and if your going to try and talk about made up conspiracy stories you should at least read up on the middle east and current events before going overboard.
Gaddafi is best described as a mad dog. How can someone be killing his own people with massive weapons of war? The WEST adviced him to stop killing his own people although he gave a deaf ear. Its time to get rid of the mad dog so tht libyan people can have a better life, freedom and fundamental human right to live with dignity and not oppression and terrorism.
@MrPloverwi or for example i will concoct a conspiracy theory to service you as an example. Oil co. and friends think the Oil business has too much competition so they come up with this idea of green energy. They buy politicians to sell this idea of global warming and green energy. next they start a war in the Middle East to try and Skyrocket gas prices by destabilizing the middle east all to make us buy their green energy product and monopolize the market. see how easy that was?
@MrPloverwi The Obama Regime has done some good things mind you he has stopped more coal plants from being built now companies are making Natural Gas plants that are cheap and efficient and produce the same amount of energy with much less emissions and pollution Is that a conspiracy? Haliburton Dick Cheney's Evil Corporation and its Evil green energy somehow got the Democrats in their pocket? I mean common man this could go on forever... With enough Imagination you can make anything connect.
@MrPloverwi i don't watch football, i'm of mixed race, obviously you can tell i keep up with current events. but i will tell you i don't believe Obama is in anyones pocket he has his limitations because he isn't a dictator. I don't believe white people steal things they buy them with money they earned and I certainly don't believe there is some conspiracy. But in all honesty tell me If Obama had a golden throne and wore Gold Silk robes would you stand for it?
@MrPloverwi Just LOOK at Gaddafi LOOK at him the man wears golden robes and sits on a golden throne! he spends all his money on the military leaving his people in poverty. he spends little if any money on infrastructure what do you think would happen if there was no oil left the people would have nothing. Saddam had gold all over his palace he even had GOLD PLATED AK-47 just like the drug lords in Mexico! so tell me who is the real theif is it really the "white man"?
@MrPloverwi We give aid and support to their countries and leaders and when they grow tired of them they curse us for it hate us even. there is no conspiracy created by this so called "white thief" just irrationality the middle east has been in conflict since the time predating Mohamed it is not the White Mans fault look at Darfur for example learn the history of the region learn the culture and you will understand.
@MrPloverwi maybe 200 years ago we profited from slavery but those days are over. this is globalism and capitalism if the Arabs don't like us buying their oil or drilling it for them then we will find another Fuel and they will be left with Oil that no one wants. Without us they or the consumers of the world they would be poor and living in sand. We don't cause the problems in their countries Saddam would have attacked Iran regardless if we helped him or not.
@MrPloverwi I would point out that Al Qaeda didn't do anything but make us stay longer and fight harder. If they had hid in caves and kept quiet for a year we would have been gone 9 years earlier but Al Qaeda isn't that smart.
@MrPloverwi i will agree the Europeans feel guilty for something perhaps slavery that happend over a century ago. the EU takes in these people educates them gives them jobs or opportunities but they also give the same opportunities to nationals not just immigrants. oh and BTW i was talking about Europe not america giving government aid. there is no reason for the US to give government aid to anyone but Native Americans and Senior citizens.
@MrPloverwi perhaps you should talk about the "Black Thief" barak obama then or starting this war on Libya without the approval of "white thieve" congress.
@MrPloverwi also Natural Gas is being harvested in the US like crazy you can thank Dick Cheney and Haliburton for starting the whole Natural gas thing. Natural Gas produces 30% the emissions of Gasoline and the United States is perhaps one of the largest reserves of Shale with which to mine. Conversion of a Gasoline Engine to Natural Gas is actually quite easy, much more easy than Ethanol to Conversion. it will take time before Cars and trucks use it however there are NG power plants all over.
@MrPloverwi these "white theives" as you call them open European borders give government aid like no other countries in the world to immigrants from other countries including middle eastern ones. then you call them thieves?
@MrPloverwi actually there are still white people in china many manufacturing and new jobs produced in china are done by US and other Western companies. if you really think about it rich white people employ the chinese.
@MrPloverwi Saddam really didn't make the country any better but he was brutal and knew how to keep the country under control at gunpoint its the only thing to respect about Saddam. More likely he was an irrational leader who made decisions on impulse. If the US is responsible for uprisings in the middle east like you claim Iran should thank us for starting theirs. Also look at the Debt and GDP of IRAQ during the rule of Saddam you will see his rule was terrible.
@MrPloverwi If blaming the White Man makes people feel better then by all means blame the White Man because he is an easy target. hopefully in 20 years the US will be using Natural Gas to fuel cars and never have to buy oil from Middle Eastern countries or even look at it on a map ever again. The reason there is poverty in countries like Libya is not because of some international conspiracy for oil. its because dictators like Gaddafi choose to waste the wealth of a nation instead of use it.
@MrPloverwi also you have misread my post, i am talking of the incompetence of western leaders. But i will agree with you countries in the middle east do have incompetent leaders in power. However its definitely not the fault of the US government or the CIA. Its funny to me however i have seen these arguments before every time there is a dictatorship everyone blames the US for installing it but when there is an uprising or revolution against said dictator everyone blames the US.
@MrPloverwi also your mind is going off in tangents from the 8 posts i read. Its pretty much the same stuff you said in your previous posts nor have you linked any source material. Everything you have stated is basically just your opinions or the opinions of other like minded people you associate with. You act like you know the CIA are you sure your not involved with them LOL
@MrPloverwi first off let me address your concerns about Iraqi oil the contract to drill oil states companies will be able to drill and receive a set salary but will not share in the profits. Oil goes to Iraq, Iraq pays a set fee for companies to drill thats fair. Second off there are companies around the world that get to drill including some from China and Russia. Third Saddam got paid to fight Iran not commit Genocide and kill Kurds.
@MrPloverwi Giving Stinger missiles and Guns to "terrorists" is one thing but you got unarmed protesters being shot by Gaddafi and they are the terrorists? Now Al-Qaeda supposedly broke into some Gaddafi's Munitions Stores and stole a bunch of Anti-Air Missiles how the Hell does this whole situation help the US? Oh and say what you will about Europeans but know that their success is based on ingenuity that brought industrialization and many wonders to the world, colonialism is over.
@MrPloverwi This is Libya, Iraq and Afghanistan here not Kuwait we didn't walk in save the country and grab some oil to pay for a short war. We went to war for what all the Oil in Iraq? we don't get exclusive rights to any of the oil its ridiculous even with your so called "puppet government" installed even the Kurds are selling Iraqi oil to Iran. Leaders are just incompetent if you want to draw conclusions and conspiracy theories go ahead its just another excuse for stupid actions in the ME.
@MrPloverwi Revolutions don't happen without the support of the people, military coup maybe but not Revolutions. However this idea you have of the CIA planting the seeds of Revolution around the middle east is ridiculous. What do you think would happen to Saudi Arabia if the people just decided to have a revolution. It would be a Disaster for the US this revolution trend spreading across the middle east probably has the CIA running scared.
@MrPloverwi Again nothing but Speculation and Opinion, also a little racist. Gaddafi lives in a world of terrorism because he helped sponsor "terrorism" one of many countries in the middle east that did. Just because Gaddafi had a hard life doesn't mean it is right for him to go against his own people who demand he step down.
If there is plenty of evidence to support your claims of CIA involvement in Libya please site your sources and link them in the next post.
@MrPloverwi PS there is no credible evidence to support the theory that the CIA is responsible for the actions in Libya i would seriously doubt the US government even would give a damn about Libya if it wasn't for NATO and the EU whining about it. Gaddafi has kept to himself since the 80's and not bothered the rest of the world with his bullcrap for quite some time he is no threat to the US or its interests. Libya has oil but marginal compared to the rest of the middle east.
@MrPloverwi and Libya didn't support terrorist like the "IRA" or other so called freedom fighters? many countries support terrorism, "terrorism" itself is a silly word or misconception very broad in its definition or usage. To say the US is responsible for terrorist actions in the middle east is just that Speculation and Biased opinion they have existed for most of the 20th and 21st century. Perhaps the Libyans could be legitimate, Gaddafi can be irrational and brutal at times albeit charismatic
Fuck you America. Don't interfere into Internal problems of countries. We saw your activities in Iraq. Please Libiyans don't get help from USA. You and your country will be lost as soon as future. Pls collaborate to remove Americans from your Country after that try to solve your own problem.
@ponsiya americans are only minor party on this one. france and britan have more intrest in this. allso usa is bussy to fall back on this one. they dont really have much intrest in libya.
what is so wrong with democracy that you cannot keep it in your country why do you have to make everybody democratic....if the world accepts gay rights the world also accepts democratic rights---but not spread it and contiminate other countries....this rebels might be thinking that the democratic country will help them in their talking about freedom that is the reason for this wars...
@winglibato democracy doesnt work. nowhere. yet. its not about keeping democracy (you can not keep whats not there), its all about the process to create democracy. The west fights against feudalsim and Africa is doing this as well. The west with the tools he developed, Africa with the tools they have developed. Whatever is going on in Libya is a case for Libyans. But if they asks us for help to protect them from a maniac, we will help. Whatever the political background of this struggle may be.
@MillyVanillification you said it is a process and it is good in some ways where you can choose what you want to do and you can defend yourself--but in the end the rich and smart are still in advantage and it does brings more unfairness compared to being control by one leader...and one thing people should know that democracy is not about being totally free--but rather you become a slave to your country and to your laws and you will hve additional responsibility on to contribute to the whole...
Brother Gadhafi is not going anywhere, he is going to work even harder when all this is over with the development of the African continent and Africans in the diaspora.
The evil western nations and some of the racist middle eastern nations are against the rise of black people in Africa. For this reason they are jealous of brother Gadhafi for his foresight and vision into the future.
@shawnkwill yes. Leave him alone so he can kill more innocents... hmmm. If I was born and raised in Lybia to see these days, I'd have happily picked up a rifle to fight for freedomn in my own country.
Gadaffi, is a tyrant, a worthless piece of garbage that you cannot portray as a man. I'd hate to have someone like that leading my country. Respect to the revolutionists.
Gaddafi is not a mentally stable man. He wants to blow up the Oil fields, he Cuts the Balls of people that are against him politically not only that he burns his own Solders who don't want to fight for him. What kind of beast is he. He must be killed that 's the only way Libya can get Freedom and Peace. He has no support from his people or other neighboring countries . His is a Brutal Man.
To whomever flagged my comment as spam. How is this considered spam?: "I've read 'The Nazi Connection to Islamic Terrorism: Adolf Hitler and Haj Amin al-Husseini' by Chuck Morse. It clearly explains what the world is dealing with when it comes to people like you. (theunsilentgrave1488 spammer.) I've also researched the ideology of Hassan al-Banna, Sayyid Qutb and Muhammad Amin al-Husseini. So I know exactly what I'm dealing with when I address your self-deceiving, bogus arguments."
U.N had closed the door for Qaddafi & his family to leave Libya by threatening him & his government with International arrest warrant. U.N is a tool western countries use to destroy third world countries. Western countries are after Libyan oil. Only Arshad Khan can help. click Justice party UK.
it's high time for the libyan people to throw off the iron yoke of the 42 y.o. gadaffi regime without delay. LET'S HELP THE LIBYAN PEOPLE GAIN THE FIGHTING CHANCE TO CHARTER THE COURSE OVER THE DESTINY THEIR COUNTRY BY WAY OF DEMOCRACY.
AL JAZEERA IS FAKE NEWS AND HAS EXPOSED ITSELF TO BE THE ENEMY OF GOOD CHRISTIANS AND MUSLIMS. AL JAZEERA WILL BE EXPOSED AND HATED FOR FOR THEIR LIES AND WILL NOT BE TRUSTED WHEN ALL THIS IS OVER.
AL JAZEERA WILL BE HATED IN THE MUSLIM WORLD FOR THEIR CONTINUED LIES ABOUT THE LEADER OF LIBYA AND THE LIBYAN PEOPLE.
MAY ALLAH BLESS BROTHER MUAMMMAR GADHAFI AND THE GOOD PEOPLE OF LIBYA
why must people blame their problems on the american people???? It's not us doing harm unto you its the dam zionist that have had control over our country and everyone else for thousands of years...... we need to unite as one and stand up against them together stop letting them pull us further apart that is what they want!!!!! WAKE UP
If Qaddafi goes then another poodle of foreign governments will be put in his place, Same as in Egypt. Egyptian army had been poodle of foreigners for last 60 years, now Egyptian army is torturing Egyptians people. Libyan people will solve there difficulties & not foreign governments. only Arshad Khan can help. click Justice party UK.
@007opfer Man is inherently evil. Doesn't matter which religion they belong to. That's why democracy is vital in the process of eliminating evil. It acts as a check and balance system to prevent excessive evil from prevailing. Democracy may not be the best form of government, but as Churchill said: "It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried." Same goes for America.
@guardian1111 its not the system its the people. when they had enough they rite same way for millions of year will never change no matter what you call it
@guardian1111 You are a lying son of a bitch trolling lies on here about Democracy... Man being inheritly evil is a false idea that Marxists have instilled into people. Democracy is an evil system and is a FARCE. Democracy translates to MOB RULE... Churchill was a lying sweatbag who brought Germany and the world into WW2, a senseless war to begin with... READ YOUR HISTORY. QADDAFI IS DEFENDING HIS PEOPLE AND HIS OIL FROM THE ZIONIST JEWS, LIKE SADDAM HUSSEIN DID.
@theunsilentgrave1488 All people are evil. And absolute power corrupts absolutely. Saddam and Qaddafi are good examples of that. On the other hand, Democracy provides checks and balances so that such evil dictators can't get into office and stay there for 30 years.
As for Churchill starting WW2, that's a distorted perception. Hitler started WW2 by invading other countries. Of course I'm not surprised you side with Hitler on the matter. Saddam and Qaddafi are just clones of the same mentality.
@guardian1111 You are dead wrong... People are not inheritly evil, and the fact that you think that goes to show your ignorance... Saddam and Qaddafi defended their oil, as I've said, and they have every right to defend themselves to the death... That is what Saddam did... Every time a country defends itself and refuses to submit to Israel, it gets persecuted by Israel and the US.
@theunsilentgrave1488 The people rising up against Qaddafi aren't after his oil. They're after freedom and human dignity. Dictatorships don't provide that. Democracy does. Case closed.
@guardian1111 Wrong again... The people rising up against Qaddafi are people being incited to go against him by the Jews... Some of them are drug addicts... It's nothing but a propaganda campaign... Qaddafi's house was bombed in the 80's, why haven't we heard him to be this "AWFUL DICTATOR" for all this time up until now? Sounds similar to the case with Saddam Hussein and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. You fell for the lies...
@theunsilentgrave1488 So far you've held Hitler, Saddam Hussein, Qaddafi and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad up as model examples of your cause. Most telling as the common denominator between them is they're all demented people who used the lowest qualities of humanity to get into power and stay in power!!
@theunsilentgrave1488 I've read "The Nazi Connection to Islamic Terrorism: Adolf Hitler and Haj Amin al-Husseini" by Chuck Morse. It clearly explains what the world is dealing with when it comes to people like you. I've also researched the ideology of Hassan al-Banna, Sayyid Qutb and Muhammad Amin al-Husseini. So I know exactly what I'm dealing with when I address your self-deceiving, bogus arguments.
@theunsilentgrave1488 what !!! ehm i dont know where you are from but how did chirchill bring germany and the world in to ww2 he wasnt even the primeminister when the war started. he diffended his country from a german invation and fought it back. i know that it was great britain that dicleard war against germany but they did it becouse they invadid france and poland. and what does the jews have to do with this are you a nazi ??
@dasauto100 Churchill declared war on Hitler in 1940, but even before entering office, he claimed during the Nazi Olympics that Hitler will have war whether he wants to go to war or not... Churchill was DETERMINED to go to war... Read up on your history, you are believing a whole bunch of bullshit... The JEWS Declared war against Germany.
@theunsilentgrave1488 when you say that the jews declared war ehm who do you mean ? the jews didnt have a country until after ww2 so how did they declared war ? and i realy want to know where the fuck you get these facts and you are a nazi right.. you parents must be proud
U.S government is the source of all problems in the world ! They support Zionists in Israel & the dictators (oil thieves) in the arab world, they want to invade our countries & kill us! NEVER trust them!
@007opfer Your a faggot I was just correcting you because you generalize a whole nation when its only our government.You look ignorant fix it in your copy and paste message that as soon as you post it gets marked as spam.
Why can't someone in the inner circle assassinate this man? I'm not understanding why this action is so difficult. This man will not leave and he said he wouldn't. These protesters have to come up with better tactics.
Its our leaders in the west, our goverments , who support him for oil amd money . Where the weapons from and the munitie. Now its time to help this people. And now, before its to late.
Thank God the animal is gone!
nema1218 3 months ago
Gaddafi is dead and the Libyan people are free - and freedom is always worth the price. Now he is getting his photo taken with the families of his victims only he is in hell and his body is propped up for photos... how very fitting.
LaReinaDelBarrio 4 months ago
A Question to be made by al jazeeraTV Report now??? A Question in Saudi Arabi support with the Americans, France, England, Italy. LOL Stupid Arabs. They selling there people. What you expect they were slave traders before. Follow a strong Muslim. Not Arabs
nadnetuk 4 months ago
“Get hold of fifty of the wealthiest Jewish financiers and you will put an end to all wars” — Henry Ford
Freedom3777 8 months ago
Long live Gaddafi! May he be successful in putting down the treasonous dogs!
CommunistWarrior1917 8 months ago
@CommunistWarrior1917 He failed and such a coward pleaded not to be shot but he bombed little children like a filthy hetero would!!!
LaReinaDelBarrio 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
qaddafi likes to give grandiose speeches in which he talks of defiance. saddam, miloshevich, mubarak, ceausescu, tojo, mussolini, they too gave grandiose speeches & spoke of defiance.
ArmenOfTheNorth 9 months ago
@MrPloverwi Educate yourself brother i know for a fact your making up half of this shit because it doesn't fit the timeline nor have i said anything about US involvement in China because there wasn't any. You accuse me of being politically "motivated" ( you spelled it wrong its not "motovated") i don't have any political motivation. I know you brother your not here to convince me your here to convince yourself. I will leave you with your own illusions do not expect a response.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi You continue to make Historical Mistakes and Grammatical errors in your posts. This leads me to conclude you either have a limited understanding of English or you are sightly uneducated.
My Family lives in the Philippines and i visit every so often. My aunt married a Chinese man who's brother was shot at in the Tienanmen Protests. Do not tell me Tienanmen changed nothing or was some CIA hoax because that is false and an insult to the people who stood up for the greater good.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi The communist party kept its policies on restricting private ownership from the 40's to the 90's. However Mao's Great Leap Forward introduced even more extremes revoking private ownership almost completely and it caused Famine and Economic decay throughout China this is why his policies where abolished. Tienanmen Square was the people calling out for change and free Entrepreneurial policies, now Bourgeois allowed to exist in china once more.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi Correction you should reread my previous post. If you knew your history properly Tienanmen Square happened in '89 that would make it 21-22 years ago from this day. read this Quote carefully this time
"Tienanmen Square happened 15 years after Mao's reforms where abolished by Chairman Hua Guofeng." that happened in the 70's. Mao has nothing to do with the economic success Post-Tienanmen Square.
PS: Your definitions are politically motivated, mine are based on historical facts.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
How does Chinese history have to do with Libya!
MrBigBEARHUNTER 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi Mao is only loved by the indoctrinated, such as yourself.
IrishWigwam 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi Im sorry but i just read one of your posts and i could not help myself because you are just so wrong. Tienanmen Square happened 15 years after Mao's reforms where abolished by Chairman Hua Guofeng. So where the hell do you get this idea its as if you don't know even know Chinese history. Educate yourself my god man! anyhow just adding to my previous post im done with this conversation.
PS: you don't need to post 11 responses and try to keep them coherent just a little advice for you
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi You are yet wrong again let me copy and paste a sentence this will be my last post i promise =).
"Marx drew ideas from Socialism throughout history but the one and only thing that truly defines Communism as Communism and separates it from Socialism is the elimination of the Bourgeois, elimination of Capital motivation and private property."
Communism is not Socialism and it did not exist before Marx. Your interpretation is false and fundamentally wrong.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi Look i'm simply getting tired of this conversation because you are either Inept or Ignorant of the true facts and Ideology behind Communism and Socialism. Its tiresome it really is because you can't put up a credible argument and when you have nothing intellectual left to say you revert to colonialism and "white thieve's" as if it still exists in China or Vietnam. I have tried to explain to you why Communism Destroys nations but you simply do not have an open mind. I'm done
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi Also the US government did not "adopt" socialist policies to defeat the Russians. unions had to fight with strikes thought the depression era to get established. That is simply how democracy works people will pass reforms, lobby and inevitably they will be adopted if they are fair and sustainable. Government funded projects in the US also existed before the depression its not a new thing either. Socialism simply is the Majority Rule in government and business by the People.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi You say i take things out of context? Dude it says all these things in the books i have taken nothing out of context. Marx drew ideas from Socialism throughout history but the one and only thing that truly defines Communism as Communism and separates it from Socialism is the elimination of the Bourgeois, elimination of Capital motivation and private property. Lenin/Stalin/Mao all believed in it. Socialism on the other hand allows all 3 to exist.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi Mao's so called "great reforms" where all abolished after his predecessor took chairman and even during Mao's Rule. Even then People only had partial property rights and little if any intellectual property rights until the Tienanmen Square in the 90's. Also Socialism and socialist ideas existed long before Marx since the time of the Greeks or even before. Democracy is a Socialist implement so America was somewhat socialist from its inception.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi No your wrong Mao did unite the country but farmer's still owned their own property before he instituted "The Great Leap Forward" which was when his Commune's where established removing private property from Farmers. After that Farmer's where not allowed to own even their own Livestock. Mao was greatly concerned with private property rights and greatly concerned with its impact in the future he even mentions this in the red book.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi And it is true that Communism has been modified but very little and to great failure. It is because Marx did not clearly define how such a system would be run or how it would be implemented therefore this resulted in authoritarian rule in order to control a system that is ultimately impossible to sustain (as proven by history). If Mao respected property rights he would not have instituted his Agricultural-Communes and complete Government Control of Industry.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi If you have read the books and understand them then you would understand Communism is not modifiable. Communism is based around the Proletarian and the Classless society anything less than that is Socialism. Communism is based on the theory that the Rich (Bourgeois) if allowed to exist will always rule over the majority in Politics and Economics. Communism is the system created by Marx and all Communist countries adhere to, to prevent the rise of the Upper class (Bourgeois).
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi You make many misconceptions here I never related Communism to Imperialism that is your own mistake. However i will have you note that China would not be the way it is today if Mao's policies had not ended and Capitalist economic Policies enacted. The fact that there are Bourgeois and private business throughout China is something that goes against Mao's teachings.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi I cant believe i am responding once more but you are wrong yet again. Mao's teachings Include Marx/Lenin in the Red Book, Proletarian vs Bourgeois Uprising, Dictatorship of the Proletarian, The Classless Society, ect all core believe of communism. I have Defined Communism as its true meaning where as you define communism to fit your own personal believes that is wrong. If you had read the books you would know all these concepts it is obvious you have not.
assmonkey626 10 months ago
@MrPloverwi This will be my last response. I can tell from your comments that you have not read any of the 3 books front to cover and therefore you can clearly not define communism nor is it within your ability to provide a credible argument for it. Mao's philosophies hold the core beleives of Marx/Lenin in plain text as referenced from the Red Book. As i mentioned before, Marx brought about the idea of communism and you are trying to redefine it to suite your own personal believes.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Until you do this i cannot continue a conversation with you simply because you do not understand the underlying subject and it is plainly obvious that you don't. You continue to confuse community values with communism but this is not the case; Mao also clearly explains in the Red Book the difference between Socialism and Communism so does Marx in the manifesto. I suggest you read up on these Ideas and Philosophies before relating them to real world issues.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I'm sorry but i don't think you understand the concepts of Communism or its variations. The English version of the Red book is on par with its Chinese version just like the English version of Marx's books that was translated German to English by Engels. You can buy the Red Book, Communist Manifesto, and Capital and all 3 books will be credible and unedited. Mao also mentions in the Red Book that no communist should go without reading Marx-Lenin teachings and understand them.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi When you speak of the Early days and Railroads i assume you are thinking of the intercontinental railroad (Thats the one with all the Chinese) there was the Union Pacific (constructed by mostly Irish immigrants) and a Central Pacific (constructed by mostly Chinese Immigrants). Chinese immigrants that came to work where paid fairly but the ones that came directly from China to work on the railroads where not paid so fairly. Also this happened after the Emancipation of the slaves.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Finally no Ho Chi Minh and Mao's Plan was originally to set up a classless society. Their idea's stemmed from that of Marx/Lenin Communism to have all workers equal. However Equality does not work in a socialist/capitalist society so now with Economic freedom in china there is a Lower class a Middle Class and an Upper Class it is most certenly not in the red book. This is something against Communist Ideology not what Mao or Stalin envisioned but fought against.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I'm not going to argue that Vietnam was wrong because it was. The objective was to support the South and it was none of our business just like Afghanistan was none of Russia's during the 70's. But do not tell me we went in there to steal copper and iron ore that is ridiculous when both where in more than abundant supply at the time.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Colonialism is simply imperialism on an intercontinental level. it is said everything that has happened in the modern world has already happened in ancient Asia. You call them "white thieves" but it is only because they are different color. Ancient China has had revolution after revolution conquered its neighbors and been conquered by them under imperialism. Do not point the Root cause and Europeans and the it was simply human nature.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I would not put the Russians Down in terms of Propaganda and military. Russia has more experience in Military application and Propaganda than its much younger Rival the USA dating all the way back through its imperialist days. how do you think they managed to send millions of conscripts to their death at the hands of the Germans during WWI. Soviets where poorer but that is the implementation of Communism to support what is unsustainable (in a modern sense).
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Your Theory of how Propaganda is used does not make sense, you say it is so powerful a tool it controls the United States but yet you stated that the so called "victim nations" cannot be controlled through Propaganda. However that contradicts your theory that the CIA has implanted propaganda campaigns to start revolution in the middle east as that effects your so called "victim nations" via the use of Propaganda. It doesn't add up
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi A country's right to protect its national interests at least in my opinion ends when you start gunning down protesters or people who practice political speech that makes the government uncomfortable and sending them to prison. It is our right to say what we wish many of your fellow americans may not agree with you but will take up arms to defend your right to say it freely. And trust me there are plenty of guns to go around kind of makes the government wary of pissing us off.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Well where to start. First its widely acknowledged that the soviet union had killed and imprisoned political dissidents numbering in the 6 figures for far less than what you have posted on this video. When Guantanamo Bay got shut down there where less than 300 prisoners there, to get sent to prisons like that you have to be suspected of immediate danger to civilian life. True some maybe innocent some not but you dont send unarmed protesters/dissidents there nor do you arrest them.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi PS not calling you a dissident its just merely and example.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi now i'm not agreeing with you on the CIA thing but lets say hypothetically the CIA instituted propaganda campings to start revolution. Is it right for these governments to lock up unarmed protesters/dissidents, shoot them in the streets, put them in re-education camps or tourcher them en-mass simply for their believes right or wrong? you are allowed to say what you want speak freely and be a dissident there are other countries in the world not so lucky.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi So your going to tell me that the Soviet had the right to invade Poland because Stalin wanted to help them? the soviets where just terrible ruled all the caucuses with an iron fist and helped Vietnam only to spite the west with good reason. Russia didn't want the USA in Vietnam just like we didn't want them in Cuba. its not about help when your country still has an imperialist undertone.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi often people who fight for revolution like Ho Chi Minh, Lenin, Mao find that when they are gone things don't go the way they planned. People who start the Revolution rarely finish it and often times the result is a distortion of the original thing.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi We don't need any slave labor china has enough cheap labor for the US and Vietnam still doesn't have freedom. any dissidents they round up put in prison, execute, or if your too popular to disappear they put you on house-arrest. Even if they do normalize trade with the US and get into the WTO what then what if the Vietnamese want more say in their government? are you going to tell me if they start a revolution its the CIA's fault?
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi your going back to the CIA conspiracy nonsense now the discussion on communism socialism and capitalism was a much more meaniful conversation. The soviets where just as bad as us they took communism and warped it to suit an imperialistic undertone. Why do you think when the USSR broke up there are many countries around Russia that just plain hate them and no its not the CIA. I live in Minnesota, US we have Russian and Ukrainian immigrants here they all hated the USSR.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi The only problem with your theory is there was nothing in Vietnam just a bunch of bush and not all that much oil off the coast. There was nothing in Vietnam to steal so when you say "white thieves" your just talking about irrational fear. Its like Korea Prevent the spread of communism because its evil was the believe there was nothing truly to be gained from it except peace of mind.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi That is true but you have to realize the soviets acted the same as the US during the cold war. they would invade countries KGB causing problems, even invaded Afghanistan in the 70's on the pretense of stabilizing the government. Giving the people the intent they where going in to help the Afghanistan government then the Tribesmen dislike the communists because of their somewhat anti-religious views take up arms and get help from the CIA. Ironic the Russians did the same to us in Viet
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Most people even Vietnam veterans will tell you Vietnam was a mistake the USA paid for that. No one in the US prides themselves on the Vietnam war not even the Korean War (the forgotten war as i call it). both wars started over a fear of communism and misunderstanding of what it was.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi no but i'm sure the caveman many Milena ago had the concept of trade and greed. the same concept applies to Marx's teachings that the idea of wealth achieved through greed by means of capital and or trade must be overcome in order to have Communism and true paradise. again this is not the western version of events this is the true communism as Marx defined it i'm not giving you some watered down version here this is marx.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Lenin and Stalin believed in no borders the USSR had many countries under its mantel many of them forced to join at gunpoint. Stalin however alienated himself from the west and the west followed as well. this popular concept that Communism was a force of evil and godlessness and could have been avoided but as nationalistic views go. remember that the East has demonized the west just as much as the west has demonized the East. There are numerous 60's propaganda videos on the net.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Communism on the other hand is an ideology that revolves around both social and economic. Cavemen did not have a word for Communism and it is part of the western media to define all far left socialistic countries with a dictator like regime as Communist. But that is the "popular" believe and not the factual one.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi now you seem to be answering to different comments at different points in time so i'm going to continue with this discussion on communism and economy since i am already into it. "Capital'-'ism' "ism being a suffix for Ideology. Therefore Capitalism means a believe or ideology based around Capital. Capitalism does not mean Capital it is an economic ideology that revolves around capital.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I also Forget if it was either Marx or Lenin that wanted to abolish the idea of Nationalism and borders in order to unite the world as a whole under Communism. However this vision of the future is very different from the ones that Current communist Countries hold it is unachievable at their current level of development and ours as well. This is why the USSR fell apart and other Communist countries continue to suffer controlling the economy and industry to the point of collapse.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi no your misunderstanding Marx didn't want to get rid of Capital (initially) he wanted to remove it as a motivator for building the community since he believed greed and exploitation is based around it through control of the community and of Capital/Trade. Eventually he believed people would not need capital and hence forth it would not exist (at least in the form it does now). This transition is what he explained socialism was and that further along the closer communism would get.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi But that is the problem you mix the word Communism with Community it is not what the word means you cant define it as that. Call what you will MrPloverwism but not Communism because the word has already been defined by Marx. People will get confused what you mean when you use it in that way. i do not call a bird a tree nor would i call a cat a mailbox.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Communism on the Level of say a commune or small village is easy to manage. when you take Communism to a new level say that of a whole nation it becomes more complicated. People are not willing to abide by these rules and often times lack motivation since there is not enough to go around. Logistics become complicated like that of a bureaucracy that is why adaptations such as Stalin or Mao even their's i would not consider to be Communism at all.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Marx brought about the inception of Communism, Leninism is a very similar variation that is why i include the both of them when i Reference communism.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Then if you want to talk about "Community" do not try and relate it to Communism which builds on the Idea of the Community but takes it in an entirely new direction. The old idea of community is built around capital, "capital" or "trade" being required to motivate people to help build the community. Communism at its most basic philosophy is the Ideology that there is a way to eliminate the need for "capital" as a motivator through the use of control over the community.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi
"The thieves who you are defending is defining Communism as an evil ideology that focus only on killing and not valuing life"
Again you assume this is what i am implying but i am not. i am simply stating it is an impractical method of running the world and peoples lives. It is simply because a government cannot run and grow all levels of production and real-estate without the free enterprise of the private sector. through socialism you can regulate it but not control it.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi What you are thinking of is socialism. Lenin/Marx coined the word Communism hence forth the defined the word to mean what it truly does. if you want to redefine what it means you would have to travel back in time and write the Manifesto before they did. that is why they call its variations Stalinist or Maoism and not refer to it as Communism in its basic terms because they are variations or watered down and distorted versions of true Communism.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Also we did not win against the Russians because of more Socialist Implementations. We won because of responsible spending and averaging our budget. We Have never spent over 7% of GDP on the military Never not even now with 2 wars going. Currently even after the cold war Russia spends over 25% of its GDP on the military. Not to mention the amount of money spent on socialist programs and running the entire country with no true business enterprise.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi now now you keep making the mistake of confusing Socialism with Communism. Socialism is the Transition between Capitalism and Communism or so Defined by Marx/Lenin. Being as true Communism has never been achieved except in perhaps small Communes I use it as an Example as the Un-Obtainable Extreme Leftist example. Communism as you know it is actually Extreme Socialism but popular culture leads me to just simply call it Communism so i will simply just call it that.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I never Defined Communism as an Ideology of killing others. It simply has proven itself in the past to be an inferior motivator for the reasons i explained in previous posts. It is also an unrealistic ideology until man can become completely selfless or a perfect leader can be created through whatever means. You can clearly see what Communism turns into when put into practice and i don't want that for my country because people need and often times this system cannot provide.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi you never heard of John Brown before you read that book? because there are many novels about him he is far from an obscure character there are also a few movies.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi "White thieves and you seem to preach hatred against Socialism and only seem to embrace Selfishism."
This is your opinion of me because it is completely incorrect? I am not against Socialism i support it but Communism is not the same thing you understand? you should go back through history to find out why. also i am against interfering in other countries affairs but you seem to assume everything happening today is the result of a CIA plot this i do not agree with.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi So in your mind it is the white man's fault again for causing problems between the two? It is like trying to blame African-Americans for Violent crime it is racist and ignorant. Any wealthy white land owners where stripped of their possessions sometimes even imprisoned they had no power no money so tell me who had the power and money in Vietnam and China. It was the Leaders of the two countries who held so tightly to "nationalism" something Lenin hoped to destroy btw.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi But China and other communist countries at the time didn't do it right either did they. the early half of the 20th century was full of exploitation it was not until the 50's that the United States developed a wealthy middle class so this concept of a middle class in free economics is newer than communism. The US however Prevailed achiving this without the use of Communism but through small socialist implementations. where as China and Russia went to the other Extreme that ended badly
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi to say you have an open mind and that I am wrong and you are right is completely self defeating and hypocritical. you have your indoctrinated believes and its obvious you cant see any middle ground that makes you somewhat close minded.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi you say i am close minded about these things and just because there was a coup with Mosaddegh almost 60 years ago does not mean that the CIA is responsible for Revolution the the middle east. was the US responsible for Revolution in Russia no they where not unless you think otherwise?
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi your not getting it The form of communism that currently exists is not true communism as Defined by Lenin and Marx. it is a watered down form of Communism that has been adapted to somewhat work Chinese have ownership and Intellectual property rights now Because of this. True communism can't exist and Socialism as Lenin defined it is what China has reverted to.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi A People's History of the United States is a book based on opinion and analysis by an educated man but there are many educated men as well as there are many books that depict the history of the united states. Also Socialist implements have existed before Communism has and had circulated around the united states prior to.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Abraham Lincon did not return the slaves back to their owners he emancipated them You should read up carefully on american history. He originally wanted to free the slaves but because of the south being Pro-Slavery he was afraid he would split the country in two. Not to mention that Half of the United states had already banned slavery
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi The word Communism is a Word used to Explain a form of socialism it is not Synonymous with Community you can reference this in the Dictionary/Encyclopedia. Communism has strong ties to control of all levels of economy, culture, and leadership and is supposed to run all levels of the state. this is how Communism works and china having a free market defies one of the rules of Communism
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi PS the USSR does not exist anymore but i used it as an example
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi oh really so what if a Dictatorship is supported by oh say the USSR? or perhaps Iran? it suites us to support the Saudi's just like it suites the Chinese or the Russians we all want stability and the oil flowing.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I would also have you note that it was the US that sold China tooling and factory equipment from the get go like that of the now defunct Tupperware plant. I will also note that China spies on the US and that every country spies on one another. Spying and Sabotage is a completely different thing the US is not the cause of China's past poverty and pollution problems. The US never blockaded China they never wanted our goods in past so you know what they never bought them its their loss.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi it is American and European Corporations that contract China to build things for them they employ the Chinese they buy the Chinese goods and manufacturing. They set up and pay for the tooling necessary to make many of the products in Chinese factories. The investment and initial equipment necessary for china to grow was bought from the West or invested in China by the West. It was the Communists that prevented this for the longest of time.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Also US companies where not permitted with doing business practices in china until the Regime changed its mind on globalism that is why business with china was conducted through Taiwan and Hong Kong. this Policy of Independence from foreign ventures is the policy of Mao's Regime supposedly to protect itself from exploitation however the regime in the end caused great spread famine and pollution across china from crude coal plants to unsafe industry.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi No i stated Community Values and Communism are not synonymous and that Community values exist in the united states and have been around before the creation of communism. be sure to read my comments carefully
assmonkey626 11 months ago
Serbia support Gaddafi & Libya people ,free Libya !!!
FUCK NATO,USA,UK,FRANCE,EU,UN
Rebels=Al qaida
SRBINnbg29untilidie 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I will also state that Discrimination in China still continued during Communist rule this had little to do with the government body but rather with popular opinion. Despite whatever Mao had intended for China's future The future that china has now is nothing what Mao could have wanted aside from the success of his people there is very little left of Communism left in china except the Dictator like Regime. Those you call "white thieves" if you really think about it helped save China.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I will also note that the Economic decay that followed China after becoming communist was not attributed to USA involvement. CIA operations ceased in Taiwan when International Relations Normalized with China Following the Vietnam Era. China still continued to decay financially and became impoverished during this time. It was not until Chinese protesters forced the government to give the people economic freedom opening the doors for Foreign investment and construction efforts.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi What you may or may not understand is that Dictatorships do not work they will not work long term. this is because regardless of who or what these Dictators are or do the people will eventually want them gone and another leader installed one that the people choose by popular opinion. For example Bush could not be president for more than 8 years Democracy gives us a chance to oust leaders at our whim without violence and with popular opinion.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Community exists in the USA and it is not synonymous with Communism. People pitch money together to fund charities and help each other no Human would refuse to do so. Also the ideas of Conservation and protection of the environment have existed in the USA long before Communism plagued the planet and Communists have not infiltrated the Democratic party either. I will also have you note that it was Republicans that freed the slaves.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Also no one is stopping these communist nations from being successful there is no grand scheme to keep them poor they simply just do not acknowledge their potential. Communism is a poor motivator it gives the people little incentive or ability to create their own large scale operations because there is no true private ownership or intellectual property rights. do not confuse communism with socialism the 2 ideologies are similar but not the same.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Third you mentioned this
"If you are a free thinker like me, you should learn to acknowledge the possibility that the CIA are part of this. You are too quickly to dismiss it so you are not a free thinker"
Which confirms you have absolutely no idea whether or not the CIA has been involved in any of the previous 20+ statements you just made about them and their so called "white thief masters" as it is all speculation and opinion and not fact
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi First off If Vietnam, North Korea and Cuba embraced Capitalism and Free trade they would have their own Mega Corporations and abundant Gross Domestic Product. Second you seem confused China fought with Vietnam briefly over Cambodia because Vietnam wanted to expand its influence and territory China didn't want that and China lost being unwilling to escalate to an invasion force.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi It wasn't until Tienanmen Square Massacre where the communist troops gunned down Chinese students that the Communist leaders allowed capitalism and my god look how well their country has come since then. Mao's policies doomed China to stagnation and led to the starving death of over 30 million people because he simply wanted to grow different crops. Perhaps that is what the Libyans just a handful more freedom inspired by the Tunisian revolution.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Blaming White People and Corporatism is an easy way to justify poverty and stagnation of other countries. But the truth is countries like Vietnam, North Korea, Cuba ect... didn't want what we embraced capitalism built us a future communism and or extreme socialism couldn't. look at Taiwan or Hong Kong for instance they have money, infrastructure, manufacturing and no oil or natural resources. Free market and hard work made it possible communism is a poor motivator.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I should mention within a few months the PLA took heavy looses and had to retreat from Vietnam. the Vietnamese also still occupied Cambodia till the late 80's. And no Obama is not being bribed or in anyones pocket that is honestly just your opinion. Dictatorship/Royalty is how the Middle East has worked Pre-21st Century we will support one Dictator and not another because frankly you can't support them all now can you? Also your Comments are very Repetitive and Nonfactual.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I will also have you know that China has a history of "Race Superiority Complex" for instance there are many different kinds of Asian people. The Chinese people in particular thought very lowly of the Vietnamese and following the invasion of Cambodia by the Vietnamese after the American withdraw in the 70's. The Chinese sent troops and armored divisions into Vietnam to "Punish them for invading Cambodia" with a scorched the earth policy.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi White people, Europe and the USA don't owe anything to anyone. Should the Ottomans AKA Turks pay Greece for Enslaving them and invading their country over 500 years ago? Also the Chinese are very capitalistic and is very much like the US is now, we have a good relationship with China only minor trade disputes like the tarrifs on tires or poultry. The USA has had good ties with China since the Vietnam era, also when Chinese-Russian ties broke the 2 became enemies.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi that so called "Theory" i made up to show you exactly how easy it is to come up with this kind of stuff. I am a free thinker as well but none of the stuff you are trying to say has substance. I'm just trying to tell you how ridiculous it sounds and if your going to try and talk about made up conspiracy stories you should at least read up on the middle east and current events before going overboard.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
Gaddafi is best described as a mad dog. How can someone be killing his own people with massive weapons of war? The WEST adviced him to stop killing his own people although he gave a deaf ear. Its time to get rid of the mad dog so tht libyan people can have a better life, freedom and fundamental human right to live with dignity and not oppression and terrorism.
kind4love 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi or for example i will concoct a conspiracy theory to service you as an example. Oil co. and friends think the Oil business has too much competition so they come up with this idea of green energy. They buy politicians to sell this idea of global warming and green energy. next they start a war in the Middle East to try and Skyrocket gas prices by destabilizing the middle east all to make us buy their green energy product and monopolize the market. see how easy that was?
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi The Obama Regime has done some good things mind you he has stopped more coal plants from being built now companies are making Natural Gas plants that are cheap and efficient and produce the same amount of energy with much less emissions and pollution Is that a conspiracy? Haliburton Dick Cheney's Evil Corporation and its Evil green energy somehow got the Democrats in their pocket? I mean common man this could go on forever... With enough Imagination you can make anything connect.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi i don't watch football, i'm of mixed race, obviously you can tell i keep up with current events. but i will tell you i don't believe Obama is in anyones pocket he has his limitations because he isn't a dictator. I don't believe white people steal things they buy them with money they earned and I certainly don't believe there is some conspiracy. But in all honesty tell me If Obama had a golden throne and wore Gold Silk robes would you stand for it?
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Just LOOK at Gaddafi LOOK at him the man wears golden robes and sits on a golden throne! he spends all his money on the military leaving his people in poverty. he spends little if any money on infrastructure what do you think would happen if there was no oil left the people would have nothing. Saddam had gold all over his palace he even had GOLD PLATED AK-47 just like the drug lords in Mexico! so tell me who is the real theif is it really the "white man"?
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi We give aid and support to their countries and leaders and when they grow tired of them they curse us for it hate us even. there is no conspiracy created by this so called "white thief" just irrationality the middle east has been in conflict since the time predating Mohamed it is not the White Mans fault look at Darfur for example learn the history of the region learn the culture and you will understand.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi maybe 200 years ago we profited from slavery but those days are over. this is globalism and capitalism if the Arabs don't like us buying their oil or drilling it for them then we will find another Fuel and they will be left with Oil that no one wants. Without us they or the consumers of the world they would be poor and living in sand. We don't cause the problems in their countries Saddam would have attacked Iran regardless if we helped him or not.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi I would point out that Al Qaeda didn't do anything but make us stay longer and fight harder. If they had hid in caves and kept quiet for a year we would have been gone 9 years earlier but Al Qaeda isn't that smart.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi i will agree the Europeans feel guilty for something perhaps slavery that happend over a century ago. the EU takes in these people educates them gives them jobs or opportunities but they also give the same opportunities to nationals not just immigrants. oh and BTW i was talking about Europe not america giving government aid. there is no reason for the US to give government aid to anyone but Native Americans and Senior citizens.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi perhaps you should talk about the "Black Thief" barak obama then or starting this war on Libya without the approval of "white thieve" congress.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi also Natural Gas is being harvested in the US like crazy you can thank Dick Cheney and Haliburton for starting the whole Natural gas thing. Natural Gas produces 30% the emissions of Gasoline and the United States is perhaps one of the largest reserves of Shale with which to mine. Conversion of a Gasoline Engine to Natural Gas is actually quite easy, much more easy than Ethanol to Conversion. it will take time before Cars and trucks use it however there are NG power plants all over.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi these "white theives" as you call them open European borders give government aid like no other countries in the world to immigrants from other countries including middle eastern ones. then you call them thieves?
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi actually there are still white people in china many manufacturing and new jobs produced in china are done by US and other Western companies. if you really think about it rich white people employ the chinese.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Saddam really didn't make the country any better but he was brutal and knew how to keep the country under control at gunpoint its the only thing to respect about Saddam. More likely he was an irrational leader who made decisions on impulse. If the US is responsible for uprisings in the middle east like you claim Iran should thank us for starting theirs. Also look at the Debt and GDP of IRAQ during the rule of Saddam you will see his rule was terrible.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi If blaming the White Man makes people feel better then by all means blame the White Man because he is an easy target. hopefully in 20 years the US will be using Natural Gas to fuel cars and never have to buy oil from Middle Eastern countries or even look at it on a map ever again. The reason there is poverty in countries like Libya is not because of some international conspiracy for oil. its because dictators like Gaddafi choose to waste the wealth of a nation instead of use it.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi also you have misread my post, i am talking of the incompetence of western leaders. But i will agree with you countries in the middle east do have incompetent leaders in power. However its definitely not the fault of the US government or the CIA. Its funny to me however i have seen these arguments before every time there is a dictatorship everyone blames the US for installing it but when there is an uprising or revolution against said dictator everyone blames the US.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi also your mind is going off in tangents from the 8 posts i read. Its pretty much the same stuff you said in your previous posts nor have you linked any source material. Everything you have stated is basically just your opinions or the opinions of other like minded people you associate with. You act like you know the CIA are you sure your not involved with them LOL
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi first off let me address your concerns about Iraqi oil the contract to drill oil states companies will be able to drill and receive a set salary but will not share in the profits. Oil goes to Iraq, Iraq pays a set fee for companies to drill thats fair. Second off there are companies around the world that get to drill including some from China and Russia. Third Saddam got paid to fight Iran not commit Genocide and kill Kurds.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Giving Stinger missiles and Guns to "terrorists" is one thing but you got unarmed protesters being shot by Gaddafi and they are the terrorists? Now Al-Qaeda supposedly broke into some Gaddafi's Munitions Stores and stole a bunch of Anti-Air Missiles how the Hell does this whole situation help the US? Oh and say what you will about Europeans but know that their success is based on ingenuity that brought industrialization and many wonders to the world, colonialism is over.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi This is Libya, Iraq and Afghanistan here not Kuwait we didn't walk in save the country and grab some oil to pay for a short war. We went to war for what all the Oil in Iraq? we don't get exclusive rights to any of the oil its ridiculous even with your so called "puppet government" installed even the Kurds are selling Iraqi oil to Iran. Leaders are just incompetent if you want to draw conclusions and conspiracy theories go ahead its just another excuse for stupid actions in the ME.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Revolutions don't happen without the support of the people, military coup maybe but not Revolutions. However this idea you have of the CIA planting the seeds of Revolution around the middle east is ridiculous. What do you think would happen to Saudi Arabia if the people just decided to have a revolution. It would be a Disaster for the US this revolution trend spreading across the middle east probably has the CIA running scared.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Again nothing but Speculation and Opinion, also a little racist. Gaddafi lives in a world of terrorism because he helped sponsor "terrorism" one of many countries in the middle east that did. Just because Gaddafi had a hard life doesn't mean it is right for him to go against his own people who demand he step down.
If there is plenty of evidence to support your claims of CIA involvement in Libya please site your sources and link them in the next post.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi PS there is no credible evidence to support the theory that the CIA is responsible for the actions in Libya i would seriously doubt the US government even would give a damn about Libya if it wasn't for NATO and the EU whining about it. Gaddafi has kept to himself since the 80's and not bothered the rest of the world with his bullcrap for quite some time he is no threat to the US or its interests. Libya has oil but marginal compared to the rest of the middle east.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi and Libya didn't support terrorist like the "IRA" or other so called freedom fighters? many countries support terrorism, "terrorism" itself is a silly word or misconception very broad in its definition or usage. To say the US is responsible for terrorist actions in the middle east is just that Speculation and Biased opinion they have existed for most of the 20th and 21st century. Perhaps the Libyans could be legitimate, Gaddafi can be irrational and brutal at times albeit charismatic
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi ah yes speculation and biased opinion.
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi oh really got any proof of that?
assmonkey626 11 months ago
@MrPloverwi Now normally I'd trust that you know what you are saying, but you provide no facts AND you spelled Libyan wrong.
Phaelenxe 11 months ago
Fuck you America. Don't interfere into Internal problems of countries. We saw your activities in Iraq. Please Libiyans don't get help from USA. You and your country will be lost as soon as future. Pls collaborate to remove Americans from your Country after that try to solve your own problem.
ponsiya 11 months ago
@ponsiya americans are only minor party on this one. france and britan have more intrest in this. allso usa is bussy to fall back on this one. they dont really have much intrest in libya.
gooddarkjedi 11 months ago
what is so wrong with democracy that you cannot keep it in your country why do you have to make everybody democratic....if the world accepts gay rights the world also accepts democratic rights---but not spread it and contiminate other countries....this rebels might be thinking that the democratic country will help them in their talking about freedom that is the reason for this wars...
winglibato 11 months ago
@winglibato democracy doesnt work. nowhere. yet. its not about keeping democracy (you can not keep whats not there), its all about the process to create democracy. The west fights against feudalsim and Africa is doing this as well. The west with the tools he developed, Africa with the tools they have developed. Whatever is going on in Libya is a case for Libyans. But if they asks us for help to protect them from a maniac, we will help. Whatever the political background of this struggle may be.
MillyVanillification 11 months ago
@MillyVanillification you said it is a process and it is good in some ways where you can choose what you want to do and you can defend yourself--but in the end the rich and smart are still in advantage and it does brings more unfairness compared to being control by one leader...and one thing people should know that democracy is not about being totally free--but rather you become a slave to your country and to your laws and you will hve additional responsibility on to contribute to the whole...
winglibato 11 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
You are lier
TatjanaDimitrijevic 11 months ago
LONG LIVE BROTHER GADHAFI.
Brother Gadhafi is not going anywhere, he is going to work even harder when all this is over with the development of the African continent and Africans in the diaspora.
The evil western nations and some of the racist middle eastern nations are against the rise of black people in Africa. For this reason they are jealous of brother Gadhafi for his foresight and vision into the future.
Brother Gadhafi is loved all over the earth.
WARNING: Leave Gadhafi alone!!!
shawnkwill 11 months ago
@shawnkwill shawnkwill im sure GADHAFI s@ck your balls,,,, and your are one of his dogs...
marieviec 11 months ago
@shawnkwill yes. Leave him alone so he can kill more innocents... hmmm. If I was born and raised in Lybia to see these days, I'd have happily picked up a rifle to fight for freedomn in my own country.
Gadaffi, is a tyrant, a worthless piece of garbage that you cannot portray as a man. I'd hate to have someone like that leading my country. Respect to the revolutionists.
lxlCyanidelxl 11 months ago
LIBYA BELONG TO LIBYAN PEOPLE NOT WESTREN OR ASIA
cobra09006 11 months ago
Gaddafi is not a mentally stable man. He wants to blow up the Oil fields, he Cuts the Balls of people that are against him politically not only that he burns his own Solders who don't want to fight for him. What kind of beast is he. He must be killed that 's the only way Libya can get Freedom and Peace. He has no support from his people or other neighboring countries . His is a Brutal Man.
edwardoalvarez22 11 months ago
To whomever flagged my comment as spam. How is this considered spam?: "I've read 'The Nazi Connection to Islamic Terrorism: Adolf Hitler and Haj Amin al-Husseini' by Chuck Morse. It clearly explains what the world is dealing with when it comes to people like you. (theunsilentgrave1488 spammer.) I've also researched the ideology of Hassan al-Banna, Sayyid Qutb and Muhammad Amin al-Husseini. So I know exactly what I'm dealing with when I address your self-deceiving, bogus arguments."
guardian1111 11 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
U.N had closed the door for Qaddafi & his family to leave Libya by threatening him & his government with International arrest warrant. U.N is a tool western countries use to destroy third world countries. Western countries are after Libyan oil. Only Arshad Khan can help. click Justice party UK.
justicepartyuk 11 months ago
it's high time for the libyan people to throw off the iron yoke of the 42 y.o. gadaffi regime without delay. LET'S HELP THE LIBYAN PEOPLE GAIN THE FIGHTING CHANCE TO CHARTER THE COURSE OVER THE DESTINY THEIR COUNTRY BY WAY OF DEMOCRACY.
neilcms1 11 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
AL JAZEERA IS FAKE NEWS AND HAS EXPOSED ITSELF TO BE THE ENEMY OF GOOD CHRISTIANS AND MUSLIMS. AL JAZEERA WILL BE EXPOSED AND HATED FOR FOR THEIR LIES AND WILL NOT BE TRUSTED WHEN ALL THIS IS OVER.
AL JAZEERA WILL BE HATED IN THE MUSLIM WORLD FOR THEIR CONTINUED LIES ABOUT THE LEADER OF LIBYA AND THE LIBYAN PEOPLE.
MAY ALLAH BLESS BROTHER MUAMMMAR GADHAFI AND THE GOOD PEOPLE OF LIBYA
shawnkwill 11 months ago
Lol "the gadhafi government"...there is no government in Libya-that would be the point..lets use the word regime to articulate
AtopaMesa 11 months ago
why must people blame their problems on the american people???? It's not us doing harm unto you its the dam zionist that have had control over our country and everyone else for thousands of years...... we need to unite as one and stand up against them together stop letting them pull us further apart that is what they want!!!!! WAKE UP
MRAuToMaTiCZ 11 months ago
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If Qaddafi goes then another poodle of foreign governments will be put in his place, Same as in Egypt. Egyptian army had been poodle of foreigners for last 60 years, now Egyptian army is torturing Egyptians people. Libyan people will solve there difficulties & not foreign governments. only Arshad Khan can help. click Justice party UK.
justicepartyuk 11 months ago
@007opfer we dont support dictators thats all you have in your country ,dumb ass, get a elected president will support him then dumb ass
tomanyasses 11 months ago
@007opfer Man is inherently evil. Doesn't matter which religion they belong to. That's why democracy is vital in the process of eliminating evil. It acts as a check and balance system to prevent excessive evil from prevailing. Democracy may not be the best form of government, but as Churchill said: "It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried." Same goes for America.
guardian1111 11 months ago 2
@guardian1111 its not the system its the people. when they had enough they rite same way for millions of year will never change no matter what you call it
tomanyasses 11 months ago
@guardian1111 You are a lying son of a bitch trolling lies on here about Democracy... Man being inheritly evil is a false idea that Marxists have instilled into people. Democracy is an evil system and is a FARCE. Democracy translates to MOB RULE... Churchill was a lying sweatbag who brought Germany and the world into WW2, a senseless war to begin with... READ YOUR HISTORY. QADDAFI IS DEFENDING HIS PEOPLE AND HIS OIL FROM THE ZIONIST JEWS, LIKE SADDAM HUSSEIN DID.
theunsilentgrave1488 11 months ago
@theunsilentgrave1488 All people are evil. And absolute power corrupts absolutely. Saddam and Qaddafi are good examples of that. On the other hand, Democracy provides checks and balances so that such evil dictators can't get into office and stay there for 30 years.
As for Churchill starting WW2, that's a distorted perception. Hitler started WW2 by invading other countries. Of course I'm not surprised you side with Hitler on the matter. Saddam and Qaddafi are just clones of the same mentality.
guardian1111 11 months ago
@guardian1111 You are dead wrong... People are not inheritly evil, and the fact that you think that goes to show your ignorance... Saddam and Qaddafi defended their oil, as I've said, and they have every right to defend themselves to the death... That is what Saddam did... Every time a country defends itself and refuses to submit to Israel, it gets persecuted by Israel and the US.
theunsilentgrave1488 11 months ago
@theunsilentgrave1488 The people rising up against Qaddafi aren't after his oil. They're after freedom and human dignity. Dictatorships don't provide that. Democracy does. Case closed.
guardian1111 11 months ago 2
@guardian1111 Wrong again... The people rising up against Qaddafi are people being incited to go against him by the Jews... Some of them are drug addicts... It's nothing but a propaganda campaign... Qaddafi's house was bombed in the 80's, why haven't we heard him to be this "AWFUL DICTATOR" for all this time up until now? Sounds similar to the case with Saddam Hussein and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. You fell for the lies...
theunsilentgrave1488 11 months ago
@theunsilentgrave1488 So far you've held Hitler, Saddam Hussein, Qaddafi and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad up as model examples of your cause. Most telling as the common denominator between them is they're all demented people who used the lowest qualities of humanity to get into power and stay in power!!
guardian1111 11 months ago
@guardian1111 Clearly you have never studied the history behind any of those leaders or their countries...
theunsilentgrave1488 11 months ago
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guardian1111 11 months ago
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@theunsilentgrave1488 I've read "The Nazi Connection to Islamic Terrorism: Adolf Hitler and Haj Amin al-Husseini" by Chuck Morse. It clearly explains what the world is dealing with when it comes to people like you. I've also researched the ideology of Hassan al-Banna, Sayyid Qutb and Muhammad Amin al-Husseini. So I know exactly what I'm dealing with when I address your self-deceiving, bogus arguments.
guardian1111 11 months ago
@theunsilentgrave1488 what !!! ehm i dont know where you are from but how did chirchill bring germany and the world in to ww2 he wasnt even the primeminister when the war started. he diffended his country from a german invation and fought it back. i know that it was great britain that dicleard war against germany but they did it becouse they invadid france and poland. and what does the jews have to do with this are you a nazi ??
dasauto100 11 months ago
@dasauto100 Churchill declared war on Hitler in 1940, but even before entering office, he claimed during the Nazi Olympics that Hitler will have war whether he wants to go to war or not... Churchill was DETERMINED to go to war... Read up on your history, you are believing a whole bunch of bullshit... The JEWS Declared war against Germany.
theunsilentgrave1488 11 months ago
@theunsilentgrave1488 when you say that the jews declared war ehm who do you mean ? the jews didnt have a country until after ww2 so how did they declared war ? and i realy want to know where the fuck you get these facts and you are a nazi right.. you parents must be proud
dasauto100 11 months ago
Lets stop messing around, this is a disgusting tyrant of our earth, kill him, period.
knoose 11 months ago
U.S government is the source of all problems in the world ! They support Zionists in Israel & the dictators (oil thieves) in the arab world, they want to invade our countries & kill us! NEVER trust them!
SugerDodi 11 months ago
لعنـة الله عليك يالقذافي يا حقير
SugerDodi 11 months ago
@007opfer Your a faggot I was just correcting you because you generalize a whole nation when its only our government.You look ignorant fix it in your copy and paste message that as soon as you post it gets marked as spam.
WhyAreYouSoJelly 11 months ago
@WhyAreYouSoJelly
"You're" The words are "You are".
borjon23 11 months ago
@007opfer You mean our government you dickhead.
WhyAreYouSoJelly 11 months ago
Why can't someone in the inner circle assassinate this man? I'm not understanding why this action is so difficult. This man will not leave and he said he wouldn't. These protesters have to come up with better tactics.
crit1227 1 year ago 2
2:44.. Shot in the dick. OUCH
azn182 1 year ago
Its our leaders in the west, our goverments , who support him for oil amd money . Where the weapons from and the munitie. Now its time to help this people. And now, before its to late.
aanstekerful 1 year ago