William F Buckley & Charlie Rangel debate war on drugs circa '91

[DCUPtoejuice]

Kinsley! I forgot to be thankful I have not seen his dumb mug in almost a decade!

[davebex13]

I love watching WFB videos. It goes to show how "Republican" and "Democrat" mean nothing, as political parties' positions can shift 180 degrees in decades.

[HurricaneTBag]

Charlie Rangel supporting the war on drugs and Bill Buckley flying the flag for decriminalization of narcotics? Just twenty years ago? My god. High level of discussion, not just talking points but actual arguments. Arguments based on hypotheticals and arguments based on empirical data. Man, I miss this stuff.

[davebex13]

@HurricaneTBag Modern pop culture has degraded our society to inarticulate morons. I agree - this reflects a better time...

[EllyMcCormack]

William F Buckley kicked his assss!

[xtrmsprts]

@ChuckNorrisKratosLOL well, yes, he later claimed that he had fashioned himself after the antagonists in james bond movies.

[WintersWar]

when rangel says "they should spend the rest of their lives in prison" I think of him and his tax evasion.

[Dsky40]

Did either gentleman win this debate?

[etijerino2008]

@Dsky40 Is there any doubt? Rangel sounded like a fool using foolish arguments.

[HurricaneTBag]

@etijerino2008 Buckley had this weird gambit set up, where he said that "police enforcement isn't working and it's a huge waste of money" (I agree completely, and I wish he'd tell Mr. Boehner that) then he goes on to say that "because of this, unless were going to execute the drug dealer, which no one wants to do, we may as well legalize drugs." Rangel was merely suggesting that there may be a middle ground between the status quo, and legalization.

[closer71]

Anyone who thinks Rangel won that debate is a complete idiot.

[YourNameHere1212]

The world misses you William F. Buckley jr. Charlie Rangel is complete garbage, an excellent reason why large government makes no one, except those in power, better off.

[soccerjones84]

It's important to note that the decriminalization of cannabis has no supporting evidence to cite that it will positively affect America. It's more interesting to wonder, why do Americans need drugs so badly? Is life that terrible that so many must escape it? I've never really experienced any "benefits" from drug use, and all my honest drug using friends admit it's a destructive diversion as opposed to an investment.

[FRSFreeState]

The "War on Drugs" has failed because its been fought in the wrong way by treating Drug Dealers and Addicts equally.

[DaceFalar7]

Rangel is a clown

[wohs145]

Crazy how my parents think Im nutty for being against the drug war while claiming conservatism - all while the fathers of modern conservatism like Barry Goldwater and William F Buckley were against marijuana prohibition during their own time.

[aussieguy2109]

@wohs145 thats because people who call themselves conservatives today are just ultranationalistic religious zealots.

[disamjisa]

Agh.. would love to see the rest

[rudarisfinaris]

Blow hard rangel

[BrianDrewry]

WFB is pure genius!!!

[ballersack]

WFB is a pompous zombie

[larrywheels]

i once had a professor in college lectures always\ say- rap rap class, I can make words mean whatever i want them to mean." buckley would sell out america in a hearbeat to keep the game rigged in his favor all the while you john bircher yahoos would be cheering. only you would have to send your sons to die in viet nam - he and bush send their sons to the ivy league- read some of his old stuff in that cia rag national review.

[Nintendomanwill]

I had this very argument with some quasi-Socialist students. They couldn't understand why I was saying that the logical conclusion of trying to ban drugs is to SEVERELY punish those who take drugs else you'll only create a lucrative market for those who can sell them. You have to weaken demand for them, else the 'war on drugs' just lines the pockets of coercers.

The counterproductive war on selling drugs is a product of apathetic govt-'war' bringing guns and gangs to the sale of that commodity.

[AtomicEagleOfDoom87]

ffef

[AtomicEagleOfDoom87]

I wish there were more full debates of Buckley available on YouTube or google. I've only been able to find a few clips. I've always liked his style of argument and he was really good at debates

[Haaggus]

I like the last line, "I dont know, and YOU dont know!"

[FrsBigeasy]

If there is 1 War that America should reform its the "War on Drugs". Drug Dealers & Users are pretty much treated as the same as Criminals which is 1 reason why the US Prison System is over crowded. We could collapse the Drug Trade Market by treating Drug Users as patients & sending them to Drug Treatment Centers instead of prison & get them off drugs while continuing to send Drug Dealers to prison & Drug Dealers would have less customers to sell their dope to.

[mowriter]

Up is down and down is up, Conservatives are pitching legalization. Liberals are staying on target with law enforcement PLUS EDUCATION.

[aussieguy2109]

@mowriter legalizing seems the only way to fix the failed antidrug policy

[MuammarAlGathafi]

So somebody sells something harmless like marijuana to a 16 year old, they deserve capitol punishment?

How about we bus in the KKK to hold a keg party in your front yard Mr.crooked politician tax cheater terrorist type person.

[Nintendomanwill]

@MuammarAlGathafi

Fear the man who builds arguments of pyramids of ad-hoc fallacies and emotional appeals, ignore or defeat this man for he is the advocate of tyranny-force as the response to any and all problems!

[MuammarAlGathafi]

You can be his bodyguard for this party, good luck.

May i also suggest you come up with something original, instead of the copy and paste routine?

[Nintendomanwill]

You think I copied that comment of mine? Talk about prejudicial.

One would think that it is becoming obvious to any and all reasonable Americans that government has only made life worse in piling interventions on top of each other; if you use force to ban drugs you give monopolies to the worst sort of violent, clandestine coercive groups and you give them such lucrative ability that youths have little incentive to pursue education when they can make a killing by selling illegal drugs.

[MuammarAlGathafi]

First of all, America does not have a legitimate government, and the system they have created is designed to destroy the average persons life through enslavement by debt, by massive taxation, and by the enforcement of it's tyrannical laws.

[Nintendomanwill]

Well, that's pretty much what I was trying to say. I don't believe in interventionism nor in the right to take people's money without their consent and to deliberately spend it on unproductivity-tax and spend would harm us less if the money was spent by thieves trying to profit from spending our money, rather than government deliberately wasting it and calling that 'charity.' And yes, monetising debt through credit-expansion leads to eras of unproductivity and more debt which the GOVT should pay

[Nintendomanwill]

As in the people responsible for accumulating that debt. Let all the Democrats and other advocates of big government, who spuriously see the will of the people in the action of men whose sole virtue is that they are chosen by some of the people and do not 'earn' their money through contract but by force, let all of the people responsible for letting this shit slide, pay the bills and not those who voted against tax/spending increases and have spent their lives fighting Leviathan. Pay up Chomsky

[aussieguy2109]

@MuammarAlGathafi wow did jefferson tell you that? there is no way you could possibly know that. Secondly what do you think a welfare state does other then have everyone dependent on the government..

[MuammarAlGathafi]

@aussieguy2109 You would need food stamps too if you had to pay all those ridiculous taxes and the inflated prices they charge for everything.

[chifour66]

You were never properly smacked down until you were smacked down by WFB.

[creigaunnalara]

Yeah, loved the 'I don't know and you don't know' line.

[tinseltownsman]

All I know is, somebody named RobertCornhole and Reggie1971 managed to make statements and then retracted both--not to mention the video in question involves a cartoonish Charlie Rangel's attempts to debate the venerable WFB. The programming itself is hysterical--but why did somebody named RobertCornhole (Cornholio?) comment to begin with, and what could he possibly have said? I'm laughing hard while typing this.

[etijerino2008]

Robert's brother, Dick, made him remove it because the comment was asinine.

[bbburton]

How Rangel keeps getting elected to Congress is beyond me. This guy is a socialist. The drug war is an utter failure, much like our foreign policy. A police state is not the answer to anything but the pursuit of power itself. Not only has the drug war failed to curb the availability of drugs, it has failed to sway the public's attitude about drugs. How can a culture obsessed with promoting a pharmaceutical industry at the same time promote a war on drugs? It's insane, and hypocritical.

[mikeshanklin]

Decent post, thanks. Peace

[phchartrand]

Ron Paul's son Rand is running for Senate in Kentucky. He's having a moneybomb on August 20th, the day of his father's birthday. Imagine what the father-and-son team could do from both sides of Capitol Hill !

Pledge at runrandrun(.)com

[etijerino2008]

That must be for the seat currently held by Jim Bunning. I've disliked that guy since he threw that father's day perfect game vs the Mets - on the day I graduated from grade school; & his politics are primitive. Who are the repugnants running, I know Bunning's out?

[phchartrand]

The two most important: Trey Grayson, Secretary of State in Kentucky, a former Clinton delegate who has the support of the establishment. And Rand Paul, son of Congressman and former presidential candidate Ron Paul.

[levanyzzuf]

Buckley looks as if he's had 5 or 6 facelifts and the latest one must have been a real hackjob.

And while I agree with Buckley, it seems to me that Rangel actually won the argument.

[etijerino2008]

Based on what criteria? Rangel never answered Buckley's question re the changes he would make to change the futility of the law enforcement approach. This was before the position of "Drug Czar" was created. Rangel may have started the ball rolling that resulted in the creation of that position that has continued to spend billions of $, $44 Billion annually at last count, with nothing to show for it.

With the benefit of hindsight, Rangel seems even more clearly to be the loser

[etijerino2008]

What you're seeing is traces of his reptilian ancestry.

[bertiethetoupee4]

@levanyzzuf I like Buckley, but his face is genuinely terrifying.

[davebex13]

@bertiethetoupee4 Imagine how it felt to the people trying to debate him!