DSOUZA is a little missionary child, he dilutes the past to make christianity seem better, but this fool is a macauleyite, a person from birth who has been raised in a pro christian setting, his arguments are so flawed it makes me laugh, his assertion that not many people died during the inquistions, or the spanish invasion of south america, or slavery, is beyond a joke, here we are talking about morality and slave name da souza is talkling about numbers
@LilyWhiteRiot wow. so your saying that hitler did have christian beleifs, of which where supported by the vatican?....DAM christians are in denial, and the hollywood make over machine is in full effect right here!!, next your gona say christians didnt have a slave code!!...the past always catches up, and thats when christians decide to dilute the past.
@OneDharmaYouMovement No, I'm saying that by referencing Hitler you automatically fail in any argument you're trying to make. I'm neither in favour of Hitler nor Christianity but you still suck at making a point.
@LilyWhiteRiot the question is this....and its very simple
was hitler a christian, in which he went to church, priased christ, wanted the final solution to the problem of jews, the christ killers, and when the vatican praised hitler, celebrated his birthday, and when the vatican told its ministers to aid and assit the nazi party.........after all these things, is he christian..or are christians themselves undergoing the biggest whitewash of their own history?.....the answer is YES!
@LilyWhiteRiot so while missionary boy slave name da souza is fighting an argument for his masters, the white europeans, he can never addres the reality of christianity, as a racist, slave owning, convert forcing, conversion attacking, intolerant empire...he talks about was christ alive, how many slaves ACTUALLY died, HE avoid the subject matter, why would god make european enslave others, torture them, beat them, covnert them, enslave them, and today what we just forget that!.lol..ud like that!
@kainen789 Really?! You must be easily impressed! All I'm hearing is the same old tired self-refuting guff I always hear from Hitchens in any of his debates.
quite wrong chap///its religion always telling us that Sodom and Gommorrah is out there,ppl who don't believe in religion but are hedonists,and Jews/Christians are taught to separate our nefish(HEbrew for animal spirit,which we also have)and Neshuma(human soul)...religion tells us to separate the two and live on higher plane...hedonism tells us to give in to nefish and all instincts,living like animals..so yes,religion does put something unique and different contrary to evolution and law of the
hitchens argument falls apart wheneve he doles out specific crimes of humanity to Christians..like if no one eve killed in the name of god,we'd be better off, ok..sure,then why did atheist regimes like Mao,Stalin,Hitler(Hitchens has inaccurately portrayed Nazis' as religious) who killed 40-50 MILLION ppl.not more than cupl hund thou killed in "name of god"...so is he saying ppl who don't believe in morals or god somehow don't feel hate,anger,revenge,murder???quite the opposite,its religion that
@cykoaudio777 google gott mit uns. google oath to hitler and read the first four words. Look these things up and I guarantee you'll wish you could rewrite your comment. However, this is besides the point. I ask you to listen to the proposition Hitchens puts forth at 2:23. It is a direct answer to your question; believe me you are not the first to raise those points. Take his proposition as a challenge and try to contest it honestly. I've found his point to be quite irrefutable.
The Nazi's WERE religious. BIg time. HItler's first action was outlawing an athiest organization and turning their meeting center into a christian outreach center. His first political deal was with the Vatican. His people and he constantly preached the bible. They wore belt buckles that said "god is with us" Like it or not....Hitler is CHristian baggage. Mao and Stalin replaced God with state worship...they were a theocracy that moved the goalpost.
@cykoaudio777 stop the press. One point is that someone kills because they believe their religion tells them to do so,,,,, the other point is that someone/group that do not follow a god do bad things. Its not their lack of belief in a deity that makes them do bad things, its simply because they are scum bags. He does not say athesits do not feel negative emotions, not at all. I dont follow your god but am not inclind to go and kill or rape for that reason.
you did commit crime,thats the whole idea behind resurrection and need for all of Gods children forgiveness..because NONE of us can say we're perfect...we have all "fallen short of the glory of God" and therefore need to be washed white to be in His presence,,,whether you agree,is it that hard to understand?...
And how does being in opposition to Christ make one evil? I can think of many things that are in opposition to Christ and aren't evil. Personally, I don't care for Jesus' acceptance of slavery. I don't think Jesus' endorsement of the Laws of Moses is good, hell, if anyone followed that everyone would be dead (kill your kids if they talk back to you? Burn in hell if you eat shellfish?) And I really don't like that Jesus' obligates me to love him for paying for a crime I didn't commit.
I don't know whether Hitler was a Christian and neither do you. He certainly used religious imagery and fed on religious hatreds and I don't think anyone could argue that Germany wasn't a Christian nation. Hitler could not have done what he did without convincing his people that they were doing God's work. The Holocaust was the culmination of centuries of Christian hatred for the Jews. There were entire towns of Jews being wiped out before Hitler for cracker abuse and all sorts of religious crap
Well, you can say using Hitler makes me look stupid but surprisingly you didn't give any evidence to the contrary even though, as you say, it's apparently out there. The fact is Darwin never said a word about survival of the fittest and evolution survives on biological diversity not eugenics so Hitler would not be advancing evolution. German and European anti-semitism was a continuation of 1000 years of religious fueled hatred of the jews. Hitler didn't start anti-semitism, Christianity did.
Well, there's an important distinction to be made in the killing department. First off, I'll only hold accountable religious people that do their evil deeds as a direct result of their religion. A christian nation goes to war over land, it's not Christianities fault. Africa however, is a perfect modern example. Millions of people are suffering the most miserable lives and dying much to young because of Catholic dogma concerning condoms. The massacres in Rwanda were also began at the pulpit.
Wow, I'm glad you're able to characterize secular morals. It changes like the wind? This is what Christians tell themselves to demonize secularists. I have a very firm morality, I do whatever I want because what I want is generally good. I don't need divine permission to act nice or ancient texts to tell me how to act. I have an ingrained sense that guides me to make my life better while also trying to make my world better. If there's something wrong with that let me be wrong.
Why do Christians tend to be more hateful? Because they feel they have divine authority to commit their bigotry. Of course when you have a God that gets off on killing children and slicing off the tips of their penis's, while referring to women as property, hating gays (and shellfish for some reason), condoning slavery and saying that anyone that doesn't submit to him will suffer forever and that his followers are above the lesser non-believers, it's easy to understand why Christians are hateful
@senortonyful: Wrong answer pal. True Christians only HATE that which is evil (anything in opposition to Christ) and unfortunately that means your hateful God denying beliefs pal. There is nothing wrong with hating evil and loving good according to God's standard of righteousness. Unlike atheists who do right in their own eyes through a subjective shape shifting morality that changes like the wind, "if it feels good at them moment, do it!" But God's standard is universal and objective.
Hell, up until a century ago Christians had a monopoly on all violence. Like I said in the beginning atheists kill just as much as Christians. When someone believes they have God on their side that's when you have children's arms cut off for receiving innoculations. B.T.W neither I nor any other atheist I know has ever killed anyone and we generally tend to be moral people. However, Christians, like yourself, feel the need to call people Idiots for no reason and tend to be very hateful people.
@senortonyful: Ya, uneducated Christians who could never afford a Bible until the mid 1800's killed a few hundred people but it's nothing compared to the 100 plus million that atheist leaders killed in the last century. Ya can't properly blame Christians for what happened long before the printing press was invented in 1440 AD. It was Spanish missionaries who caused the King of Spain to stop the Conquistadors during the Spanish crusade. You are seriously misinformed about history.
I don't know how you can call the Japanese Emperor an atheist since he believed he was a shinto God. Not a christian but certainly not an atheist. The horrible massacres in Rwanda were strictly inter-denominational Christian fighting and like I said that's when you get to the really sick stuff. Hell, how many millions of africans are dying today because they can't use condoms. You wanna talk about seeing someone suffer watch them die of aids.
Learn your history, Hitler never renounced Catholicism, his first ever alliance was with the Vatican, all soldiers swore an oath"to the fuhrer in front of almighty God" all German soldiers wore a belt buckle inscribed "Got me Unts" God on Our Side. Several times in Mein Kampf Hitler says he is fulfilling his duties to God. The European Culture of anti-semitism was a direct result of Christian doctrine dating back over a millenia. You may not want to claim Hitler, but he's all yours.
@senortonyful: Hitler's God was natural selection, survival of the fitest, evolution , and himself. I can't even remember how many times some moron said exactly what you did and I went and found all the evidence to explain the claims you make and prove Hitler was an atheist who hated Christians, Jews, any race that wasn't white, as well as religion. Stop using Hitler to defend your posiotion. It only makes you look stupid.
@johnspartan98 Hitler was a Catholic, irregardless evil is evil....it's in the doing.....it's not a "being". Besides the Germans who followed Hitler were mostly Christians who despised the Jews. Why didn't they stop Hitler?? I guess they weren't "real" christians...The USSR was Orthodox before the communists rose to power, guess the "turn the other cheek" thing allows the evil guys to run amuck, so much for love your enemy. The Pope took a neutral stance during WWII, Hypocracy..........
@johnspartan98 Hitler was a great opponent of Darwin, as witnessed by his table talks and his proscriptions against Darwinian writings in 1935.
Der Bucherie 2:6 (1935), P279
6. Schriften weltanschaulichen und lebenskundlichen Charakters, deren Inhalt die falsche naturwissenschaftliche Aufkl�rung eines primitiven Darwinismus und Monismus ist (H�ckel).
Moses was a Nazi, invented genocide, and he never heard of Darwin.
I guarantee you that you can't find a single instance of atheist violence that doesn't have an equal, if not more terrible, Christian corollary. People kill, regardless of whether they consider themselves Godly or not, all people commit atrocities in equal numbers. It's only when someone believes they have a higher calling that they can go to the furthest lengths of depravity. Cutting childrens appendages off, burning people alive, wiping out villages over cracker abuse, you gotta own your side.
@senortonyful: You said: "I guarantee you that you can't find a single instance of atheist violence that doesn't have an equal, if not more terrible, Christian corollary." Oh really? Well here is your history lesson for Atheist leaders committing genocide from the last century: 1. Mao Ze-Dong (China, 1958-61 and 1966-69, Tibet 1949-50) over 100 million killed. 2. Jozef Stalin (USSR, 1932-39) over 23 million killed, 3. Adolf Hitler (Germany, 1939-1945) over 12 million killed. continued'
@senortonyful: Athesist leaders mass killings in the last century continued. 4.Leopold II of Belgium (Congo, 1886-1908) 8 million killed. 5.Hideki Tojo (Japan, 1941-44) 5 million killed. 6. Ismail Enver (Turkey, 1915-20)1,200,000 Armenians (1915) + 350,000 Greek Pontians and 480,000 Anatolian Greeks (1916-22) + 500,000 Assyrians (1915-20). You want me to continue or do you see how absurd your statement is when you say you guarantee Christians are equal to atheists for committing genocide? FOOL!
@senortonyful said:"I guarantee you that you can't find a single instance of atheist violence that doesn't have an equal, if not more terrible, Christian corollary."
Really? Here you go pal: 1.Mao Ze-Dong (China, 1958-61 and 1966-69, Tibet 1949-50)over 100 million killed. 2.Jozef Stalin (USSR, 1932-39) 23 million killed. 3. Adolf Hitler (Germany, 1939-1945) over 12 million killed. Seriously? Atheist leaders killed more people in the last century than all wars in all known previous history.
@johnspartan98 Did an atheist ever kill EVERY LIVING THING on the PLANET (Babies included....) save for a 500 year old guy who built a big boat and loaded it with 7 pair of every kind of "clean animal" and his family? By the way I think I'll leave Senortonyful to continue to hand you your ass on a plate, I got better things to do than reply to someone who won't even read his own Book much less the books he compares them to......which by the way read like sequels to his own.
Yes atheists, christians and people of all faiths kill people, and the statistics are equivalent. Everyone kills people. I wonder what source you get your information from that designates all these bad actions as being committed exclusively by atheists or are you just making that up. Thankfully there isn't anyone that takes that hateful desert mythology seriously. Could you imagine the death that would happen if people really followed the Bible. Read Leviticus and get back with me.
@senortonyful: Wrong, I just made two posts containing only a fraction of the atheist leaders of the last century and their record of genocide. There is nothing even close you can pin on Christians you IDIOT. Learn your history before shooting off your mouth and maligning your creator and his people.
Of course you've just made all that up. What balls it takes to just make shit like that up. Where did you get your info? What's your reference? I can't believe the balls of Christians, making shit up off the top of their head and presenting it as established fact. Sure it hurt, but anyone in their right mind would go through that if they were guaranteed a spot at the right hand of God in heaven. You can't rectify that decision. A few hours of pain for a life time in paradise. Sign me up.
When intelligence and reason can take you no further, that's where faith takes over and gives you the strength to go beyond our natural limits. People without faith are the walking dead. Confusion, meanness, selfishness, drunkenness, drug addictions, gossiping, obsessive compulsive behaviors, phobias, fights, wars, destruction, and death follow them wherever they go.
@johnspartan98 By the way, where do you get this evidence? It seems like you're just making shit up again. Yes, I agree where intelligence and reason stop faith begins, but that's not a good thing. You're just making everything up about the problems of people without faith. We're all drug addicted gossipers? Ha Ha! Wow, Christians will make up the craziest shit without one shred of evidence. If you really want to know the people to fear, it's those that believe they have God on their side
@senortonyful: I don't have to make it up. The work of you godless atheists and evolutionists floods the daily news with killings, break-ins, robberies, frauds, greedy fascist leaders killing their own people, mothers and fathers killing their own spouses/children, baby killings, morons going postal, etc. etc. You godless pukes make me sick with all the death and destruction you leave in your wake all over the world.
@senortonyful said: " If you really want to know the people to fear, it's those that believe they have God on their side."
Ya got that right pal. We don't put up with your atheist, communist, god hating, Christian bashing crap for very long before you get the HELL you ask for from us. Just keep warning your atheist pals about what we are capable of when you push too hard and you will be doing the right thing.
@senortonyful said: "If you really want to know the people to fear, it's those that believe they have God on their side."
Ya only need to fear us when you start getting in our faces with your atheist, communist, fascist, oppressive, freedom robbing doctrines. So keep warning your atheist pals about us in the hope you save them from their due calamity.
Thank You, that's exactly what I'm saying. If he's the son of God he KNOWS that there is a heaven and KNOWS that after a few days of torment he will sit in heaven at the right hand of God. That's no sacrifice whatsoever. I'd volunteer in a heartbeat, if I knew there was a heaven and was sure I was going there. So many people get all sappy about this supposed act when anyone with half a brain cell would gladly step up in his shoes. Their entire faith is based on a lie.
@senortonyful: Not really, Jesus still suffered and died for our sins and He became the Christ. Sure he knew His destiny, and He may have had some comfort knowing it, but He was hurting so bad that He expressed a desire to not go through with it "if it were possible, take this cup from me." So your revelation changes nothing and does not make faith in Christ a lie. It is your own thought processes that feed you lies.
Flawless argument, Mr. Hitchens! But unfortunately even your precise logic can't pierce the shields of utter buffoonery that creationists refer to as "faith" in their devotion to ignorance in the face of overwhelming facts.
@keithhickson: The world is littered with atheists like you who went too far pushing around Christians and Jews. We only take so much of your oppressive antics and then it's game on pal...so just remember that when you act like a Nazi thug. Don't believe me? Look at what Christians did to the Muslims beginning in 1097 AD. It took them a 1000 years to regroup and become a pain in the world's ass again. Ya want some of that? Judgment Day is coming pal, whether you believe it or not.
and reasoning based on scientifically verifiable evidence is the broom that sweeps you archaic-minded fools off the face of the planet. Take solace, however, in knowing your mythology of magic, coercion, and superstition, and psychological mind games served only as a cautionary tale in what humans "used to do before we wised up and started thinking reasonably." So thank you for coming forth and showing us what not to do.
@keithhickson: "mythology of magic, coercion, and superstition, and psychological mind games"
Sounds exactly like atheism to me pal. I don't see any of that being taught in the Bible and I have studied it for over 50 years....but I did learn how to identify what makes a FOOL and FOOL and atheists top the list of FOOLS.
mythology- Any story that can't be verified as actually taking place even if meant as "allegorical" or "metaphorical." 2 of all animals in a boat, for example
magic- Water to wine, levitation, rod became a snake, resurrection
coercion- kill those that try and persuade you not to believe in Christianity
superstition- precognition, Armageddon, interpretation of events as "judgement"
mind games- "no matter what you've done you're already a sinner so you have to repent"
And saying "oppressive antics [of atheists]" has got to be the most ridiculous statement I've heard coming out of the mouth of a creationist who's predecessors took part in the Salem witch trial and the Crusades, which you admitted to. Civilized society is done with you fear-based propagandists spouting your rhetorical bigotry. Rational thinking
@keithhickson: Ya Salem witch trials saw 14 women and 5 men put to death by people most likely suffering from ergot poisoning...that was terrible...but not much of a holocaust eh pal? The crusades? If you are talking about the one against the ottoman empire against the Muslims who were killing Christians and Jews who would not bow to Allah....ya...sure...and if you were one being persecuted back then you would have cursed any Christian that would not fight against that oppressive beast.
Thank you for proving my point and for giving me my best laugh of the week with your utterly buffoon-ish comment. First of all, I'm a secular Humanist not an atheist. I side with atheists insofar as supernaturalism shouldn't be the basis of rational thinking.
@keithhickson: Thank you for the insult. In all the universe of things, there are but two possible states for nature to exist. 1. is nature left to itself and it's own inner workings, and 2. is God manifested in nature(the supernatural). In your natural state, you can only do what is natural. You can no more rise above your own nature than darkness can turn itself into light. When God's Spirit is placed within you, then you have the ability to rise above your natural state. Do you see?
If you're trying to poetically say that enlightenment or the raising of consciousness, in terms of "getting smarter" "becoming wiser" "comprehension/understanding" etc. ONLY comes from Christianity then no I don't accept that. Creationism isn't a prerequisite to wisdom.
@keithhickson: I didn't think you would get it. Enlightenment can also be natural but will only yield natural results. To transform the heart of man so that man can know and understand God requires a supernatural birth within the very heart of man. This is why atheists don't understand true believers.....they don't have the Spirit which searches all things, teaches, and guide and casts out all fear. You fear what you don't understand, and that is why you want to rid the world of faith.
Again, with the psychological mind games. You've tried to curtail spirituality to mean: only Christian's have it right because only Christian's have "the Spirit which searches all things..." Transcendence doesn't require creationism. Opening one's mind to the possibilities of that which exists outside of the physical/natural doesn't mean one has to be a Christian or accept what Christians purport to be "the truth."
@keithhickson: No mind games pal. You cannot transcend nature while under the power of nature because nature is a closed loop. It is what it is, does what it does, and nothing more. Only by a union with the Spiritual realm can one transcend their natural state. But be warned. There are two Spiritual realms. As within man is good and evil, so it is in the supernatural. Faith in the Divine Nature and character of God, His Word, and His son is your only defence against the forces of evil.
Your conception of the supernatural is based on your conception of the natural, just like an 11th century human would conceptualize the supernatural differently than a 21st century human because of the difference in the natural world and the mind of the observer. Therein lies your viewpoint, which I do not share: Christianity is the "only defense against evil." That is another loaded statement a.k.a "mind game."
@keithhickson: No, my conception of the supernatural is based on a union with the supernatural. It is the same union with the supernatural God that is my reason for belief, and such a union is all the evidence I need. How about you? What evidence do you need? Do you seek any? Just wondering pal. Have a nice day.
You keep reiterating that creationism is the ONLY WAY to spiritual enlightenment because your conception of the natural world (what the bible says) is how you imagine the supernatural world HAS TO be. What do you think heaven/paradise "is like"? And would you agree your conceptualization is different than say a Pantheistic view of paradise? Yes. Because your idea is "better" than all other view points because, as you said, "[Christianity] is the ONLY defense against evil."
All faithful are cowards. All faithful are failed fallen farcical faith fanatics. These things easily find access to oxygen and food and this oxygen and food consumption has a zero return on it.In fact, when resources are consumed by the faithful my species suffers as a result. Carbon monoxide cures religion. Help free our species from the grip of anchoring failure, convince a religitard to spend time in the garage with their car. If you believe in a god then go fucking see him.
god's philosophy or moral values is very simple - love. all the academic babble distracts people from the fact you can't prove love, and there is absoultely nothing wrong with unfailing love and a willingness to human sacrifice one's self.
@rogerchua16 God's values are subservience to him and jealousy. God repeatedly tells his chosen people to wipe out neighboring tribes saving only the young virgins for their own personal use. His first four commandments are about only worshiping him and his jealous nature and makes no injunction against genocide,rape, child abuse. He asks Abraham to kill his own son. He destroys the Earth. And what does "you can't prove love" mean. It's not a scientific claim of course you can't prove it.
would you consider a parent who loves and forgives his child unconditionally immoral? would you consider a parent who would give up his/her life so that the child may live, immoral? god gave his son so that humans may live. whether or not you believe it, the philosophy is not immoral. it's an expression of ultimate love and sacrifice. suggesting acts of ultimate love and sacrifice as immoral is absurd.
would you consider a parent who loves and forgives his child unconditionally immoral? woudl you consider a parent who would give up his/her life so that the child may live, immoral? god gave his son so that humans may live. whether or not you believe it, the philosophy is not immoral. it's an expression of ultimate love and sacrifice. suggesting acts of ultimate love and sacrifice as immoral is absurd.
@rogerchua16 No one said anything about loving your child being immoral. As far as the Jesus story goes. If I were the son of God and knew I would go to heaven and sit at the right hand of God, a few days suffering on the cross would be kinda trivial. I think anyone would go Jesus' route had they had his reward to look forward too. It wasn't a sacrifice on the part of either God or Jesus. Offer me eternal bliss for a few days of suffering and I'd take the offer without hesitation.
@senortony1111 Agreed, millions of soldiers have made much greater sacrifices, Jesus "knew" what would become of himself (Actually he was more likely deranged like David Koresh but still applies) Honestly if the story was true, which it is unlikely, the sacrifice was trivial, if it wasn't, he was crazy, but most likely....It's a fairy tale.
@Cougar139tweak: Read the Bible and find out. Open your mind and stop being so arrogant and pig headed all your life. God won't turn away from a man who is humble and contrite. You man enough to handle that truth pal?
@johnspartan98 Very aggressive tone my bible thumping friend. Actually I was a Southern Baptist in Texas for much of my life until I decieded to read the Bible cover to cover after my sister became a Mormon (has since left and went back to a non demoninational church) Hate to break it to you but reading the Bible is what made me leave Christianity. Leviticus and Exodus and just coming to terms with Genesis was honestly enough but the complete lack of answers from my pastor sealed the deal.
@Cougar139tweak: You were a southern baptist until you decided to read the Bible? So you went and read it cover to cover? It seems you started out backwards. One becomes a Christian by the Holy Spirit working through faithful followers of Christ and God's word, the Gospel message. The Bible is a collection of books one studies and uses as spiritual food. You best study the Bible and study the commentaries of respected scholars such as John F. MacArthur Jr., Mathew Henry, Andrew Murray, etc.
@johnspartan98 I'm sorry that at the age of 8 I was unable to decipher the Bible. I don't need others to deciper the bible either, dashing children against the rocks and sacrificing your daughter to God (without his intervention, hmmm guess he liked Issac better) doesn't need any deep explination. Genocide is genocide any way you want to slice it. By the way this holy spirit crap is garbage as I've seen these same guys bash gays and blacks. How very christian, what a crock
@Cougar139tweak: Ha, ha, ha. It's so much like an atheist to critisize the Bible and Christians for not living up to your own standard of what you think a Christian should be. If you feel you could be a better Christian then give it a whirl, repent, and accept Jesus as Lord and savior then show us how it's done...LOL.
I live a good life without a skydaddy holding a gun to my head, besides someone who would condone what "God" condoned in the bible needs to get on the next bus to Bellevue. By the way which one of the 40,000 christian cults are you a part of?
@Cougar139tweak: I live a good life with no skydaddy holding a gun to my head too....LOL. What did gone condone that has you upset? If you were alive back when God ordered the eradication of the Amalekites you would have cursed God if He didn't order it because the people were "completely corrupt." What is it about "completely" that you don't understand? Think about a society of serial killers, cannabols, and people who enjoy murder and rape for entertainment (multiplied times 100).
@johnspartan98 What did god condone that has you upset?-- well he's omnicient and omnipresent he could have changed them in the same way he hardened the pharoahs heart right? Better than killing women and babies as he can do ANYTHING. Why not appear to these people and scare them? Besides that God condones through his apathy Human Sacrifice, rapist marrying their victims as punishment and selling daughters into sexual slavery, yeah I have a few disagreements with YHWY....small as they may seem
@Cougar139tweak: It ain't God killing women and babies now is it? It's atheist serial killers and abortion rights activists who twist the bible to justify their perversions doing the killing. What God commanded back then was completely justified because the people were "completely corrupt." What don't you understand about the concept: "completely corrupt?" Think of it as a society of Charles Manson type serial killers and canabols that enjoy killing, raping, and eating each other. Understand?
@johnspartan98 By the way, "GOD" as a concept is not universially Abrahamic and honestly Christianity is only good in that it doesn't take itself seriously like Islam does. Follow what your bible teaches and you will quickly find youself in a 5X9 cell.
@Cougar139tweak: You said: "Follow what your bible teaches and you will quickly find yourself in a 5X9 cell." In an Islamic nation your statement would be true. BUT, in the USA, unless you follow a bastardized interpretation that does not respect hermeneutic principals of interpretation, your statement is foolish. But, foolish is what I expect from and atheist.
@johnspartan98 "bastardized interpretation?" So stoning a woman on her fathers front doorstep because she is not a virgin on her wedding night is not going to get you locked up? How do you cherry pick when God is right and when he is wrong, do you own a cliff notes version of the Bible I'm not aware of? Last time I read a passage from the bible which was yesterday (it's one of my favorite books of fiction ironically) I didn't see any revisions, I thought it was every jot and tittle?!
@Cougar139tweak: The Bible does not teach that. Jesus stopped a woman from being stoned for committing adultery. Your comments are better suited for Muslims and the Koran, not Christians and the Bible. You are not only cherry picking, you are deliberately misinterpreting the Bible to suit your own confirmation bias. The Bible is not a work of fiction. It contains philosophy, prophecy, history, judicial laws recongnized around the world, sociology, psychology, the wisdom of God etc.
@johnspartan98 What do you profess to know about the Koran? Quote me some verses. Besides you are also cherry picking. Don't follow the OLD Testament teachings? Well? Which ones and who says, what the ones you like...how convenient, you would have been in good company in the south in the early 1800's regarding slavery. I'm not delibrately interpreting...it's their for all to see as long as you are willing to accept it. I read the bible because I wanted to believe, and finished disgusted.
@johnspartan98 By the way I've read the Koran and the Hadeeth, the Bible is just as violent (by the way the muslims believe in the same "God" you do and so do the Jews. If I tell you I have a Uncle Norman...and he died a few years ago.....and he came back to life.....which of these claims need extraordinary proof. Also even if it were true it would not mean he was the messiah, would it? That's the difference between History and Myth. Now go drip some blood on a leper.
@Cougar139tweak: Ya, you read some religious books and now you are a scholar. Look pal, if I wanted your shitty lay opinion I would squeeze it out of your head. Allah is not the same God that Christians put their faith in so take your ignorant uneducated opinion and put it where the sun don't shine.
@johnspartan98 Ahhh now there's that classic Christian sentiment....when I can't win the argument with my 2000+ year old dead/contridictory text I'll just call you names and get mad......now make sure you watch out and don't run over skeeter when you back out of the driveway on the way to the monter truck rally. By the way it sounds like you haven't read the bible and if you have it was read V e r y ..... s l o w l y.... Allah is YHWY, do you know why there are 3 Abrahamic religions?
@Cougar139tweak: Why do fool atheists like you argue against things you don't even believe in and make yourselves look even more foolish? As a Christian I can call God Allah and YHWY and they are the same, but the Allah Muslims worship is nothing like the God of the Bible and they don't believe Jesus became Christ or that He is One with God and God, or Savior. They don't follow the same God. So you lose again pal.
@Cougar139tweak Hmmmmm I guess you got me, you're right he's a figment of my imagination. A Fairy tale can't have a son can he?, you win............. :)
if you decide to live your entire life in a certain way purely on the strength of some ancient stories...and if you want tax breaks because of this belief....and if you want these stories taught in school in preference to tried and tested science....and if you want to claim the moral high ground because of these stories (which are full of terrible atrocities and permission for them)....then....YOU NEED SOME CONCRETE EVIDENCE!
"but sumfink can't cum from nuffink tho! Please....grow....up.
Hitchings gives no Data stastictical sources,For his statements regarding negative comments.Its clear he regards himself,As the authorty on the topic.he says the bible came at a time we knew nothing...Oldest writing 5,000 yrs old,sumerian clay tablets show the sun centrel.knowledge the people had back then is v interesting,cant be underestimated.The grt pyramid advanced math.Giant monolith weight,Heavier than we can lift today.Advanced knowledge,unlike this guy.Does he get paid for that!?
If I were to argue against Hitchens relentless logic, I would better come prepare to bite bullets. D'Souza's argument at best is a bundle of fancy words that carries no weight nor delivers any substance. Humanity must unchain itself from religion, this decomposed lie.
@bbkingzor I don't think any of them were particularly good in this debate, but you would have to be the kind of person that is swayed by rhetoric and not by logic to think Hitchens is anything but a high-school drop-out on this subject. He's a walking, talking logical fallacy.
@bbkingzor There is no doubt in your mind, because you have different standards of forming beliefs than Ace does. Your standards are by no means better or worse, they are just different. Study philosophy a bit more, and you'll see the near-impossibility of knowledge and supremacy of beliefs. But the overwhelming majority of mankind disagrees with your belief-forming methods. What Hitchens is saying is not rooted in any kind of truth, nor is it philosophical.
RIdicule does not prove a point. Hitchens needs to do some more homework. Pliny, Seutonius, Josephus, Tacitus and the Mishna are hostile, non-Chrisitian sources which document the existence of Jesus.
HItchens again utilizes circular reasoning. He assumes what he is trying to prove and then uses that as evidence for his point.
@Mike82ARP I had to do some research on some nonchristian websites and found much evidence to dispute your claim about these guys. SUPPOSEDLY, Pliny and Tacitus were born well after Jesus' death and Josephus was born early enough to possibly have known people who had actually met Jesus, but again, it's all hearsay. Noone knows. They want to know for emotional reasons and I get that. I really do. But it's not evidence. Sorry.
Hitchens is brilliant. The simple fact is that unproven faith and blind belief can not hold water in 21 century. Humanity must rid itself of religion, this rabid mental disease, if it is to experience peace and harmony.
@Aliof I disagree. There are some religions, if practiced correctly, would definitely bring about peace in a society. I think peace and harmony is experienced when humanity gets rid of the idea that race and social status gives one person the right to exploit another person. I'm not arguing that religions are necessary for people to respect and cooperate with each other. I'm just making the point that not all religions are to blame for the ills of our society.
@MishuTaste There are no religions that can be practiced correctly because they are all deception based, they are all invented by man to enslave man for the purpose of money and power. Further, religion ask me to believe blindly in something that is out of the realm of logic, I refuse to do that.
"How do I account for Kim Jong II"? What are you trying to say? The argument is about god, religion and whether or not we should burden ourselves with their none sense.
Well what about atheists who kill in the name of atheism...persecution of those who serve one religion or another? You tend to ignore atrocities committed AGAINST religion for the sake of emphasizing the atrocities committed in its name.
The test here is not about how many have been killed because of religion and or atheism, although opposite of your argument is true.
The test is whether legends of gad and what religions have been brain washing simple minded people like yourself, hold water.
Hitchens successfully argues the absence of god and invalidity of religion. D'Suza however, seems to go around the same sorry circle, using fancy words, devoid of any substance.
@Aliof: I disagree Adolf....oops....Aliof...LOL(mistake intended beacuse you are talking like a freedom robbing jack booted Nazi thug). Learn from history which shows Christians don't stand for oppression from anyone for too long and they always end up kicking the asses of their opressors back to the dark ages in the end. I don't see Christians going out and attacking atheists in the shit spewing manner Chris Hitchens does....not until backed into a corner by atheist fools like you.
You missed the boat all together Jack.....oops John. I don't think I mentioned Christianity but all religions in general. I rather be a jack booted Nazi thug than a moron like you who has swallowed the bait, the line, the weight and the sinker thrown at him by religious zealots. You should read the comment and understand it before you put your foot in your mouth. Every time I come across someone like you on You Tube I realize how detectable is the stench of stupidity.
@Aliof: I didn't miss anything and if you can't stand the stench of stupidity then I guess you can't stand your own primate atheist self because that's what you atheists think human beings are is just another animal primate species....nothing special....no special purpose....right? Ya, I'm right because I heard Hitchman and Dawkman preaching their God denying rhetoric all over the Internet like they are on the devil's mission to recruit any fool they can into buying their crappy books.
You need to find some place and get lost or get to your bible study Jack. I can't stand the tunnel vision fools like you. Read your reply before posting it moron.
@Aliof: Once again you need to look in a mirror and engage your brain before you put your accusing mouth in gear Adolf. YOU are the one who is suffering from tunnel vision for rejecting the God of the Bible, His Son, His Word, and His offer for eternal life. You need to stop being so close minded to God and quit believing in men like Hitchens who love to drag company along with them as they travel the road to Hell.
Eternal life you said!!!!!! There is the core of your problem like many before. You silly believers pretend to believe in supernatural, a fairy tail in the hope of living for ever, a scientifically impossible reward. On the other hand if there is a "Hell" I gladly walk up to it if accompanied by an intellectual like Hitchens and I reject "paradise" to keep away from religious morons like you. You need to wake up and smell the coffee Jack, eternal life my ass, this is it.
@Aliof: Hey Adolf, Hell is just the holding tank for atheists' spirits until Judgment Day, and after that your spirits will not be experiencing anything because your spirit will be eternally dead. You can deny the existence of the Spirit realm all you want but it makes no difference to whether it's there or not. We know it is there, but you are closed minded and in denial of it. Open your mind to God and His Word and you will gain some spiritual wisdom, which is what you are void of.
@Aliof: Does that mean you are done with bothering me pal? I sure hope so because my inbox is filled every five minutes by God denyong fools like you who seem to travel in packs and love to victimize others with their attacks and insults aimed at God and people of faith. I'm here to give you a taste of your's and Hitchens' own medicine and you fools get all upset and tell me I'm being a big meany LOL. Hypocrites! You theists love to dish it out but you can't take it when given back to you.
You don't have to correct yourself Jack. Every thing you have said so far has been rubbish. "Adolf, eternal life, god and his bible, nazi, booted Nazi" ......and nothing of substance. Remember you replied to my comment and yes I want to leave you with your God, hoping he will take you to start up your eternal life. BTW are you by any chance Jewish?
@Aliof: I am a spiritual jew, grafted into the vine through the supernatural power of God and made a joint heir with Israel. And you are? Oh ya, an atheist who bows to Hitchens every word.
@johnspartan98 "Oh ya, an atheist who bows to Hitchens every word."
And you are insignificant in this universe....sorry. You can be as spiritual as you like to give you all the warm fuzzies inside, however, the fact is that if mother Earth decides to fart or itch its nose, all of humanity will perish with nobody left to tell our story.....
@SechyoolarYOOESAY: Like I need you to tell me how insignificant I am. We are all like flees on a camels ass pal, INLCUDUING YOU! You talk like earth has a conscience. You personify earth with the term "mother." Do you seriously believe the earth decides anything? You are embarrassing your atheist pals by believing things that amount to projecting fairytale delusions. The physical chaos we see in the universe, and natural disasters on earth, is the result men and demons rebelling against God.
His close was to caricature his version of the Christian world view and to imply that if there were a God that he would never act that way. First of all, this does nothing to disprove the existence of a diety. Secondly, he presupposes that his (and by inferrence the audience's) notion of what God might be like must be more rational than how God might be found to be, or reveal himself to be. Where is his source for these qualities of God which he implies must be rational? He has none.
Christophers faith is unbelievable. I truly wish as a Christion my faith was as strong in truth as his in a lie.But thats the humdrum. Quality of faith is resiliant only by one standard ultimately,and that is how he thinks on his death bed and how he feels about his faith,in conscience when they say,Chris the game is over.The money and prestige this guy makes not on the backs of believers but unbelievers is worthy of a false teacher. Who milks through the prosperity gospel the weak.
Give me a break... If you're going to accuse one of the most intellectual men on the planet of being an idiot, at least learn how to spell before doing so.
With regard to your accusing Christopher of being a man of faith, I can seldom recall a time when I've read something THAT hypocritical. I genuinely feel sorry for you, it's such a shame that people exist that have been indoctrinated from a young age and have no desire to think for themselves.
Hitchens has a remarkable command of rhetoric. This masks the weak points in his arguments. His trick is to delight the audience with a witty turn of phrase while simultaneously saying the most outrageously insulting things possible about those he disagrees with.
Hmm. No actually I wouldn't say that Hitchens was accurate. His contention is irrelevant in a discussion about the existance of God. It is one more example of hyperbole preetending to be reason.
hitchens is so fucking boring. wow
nadinkrah 1 month ago
Hitchens is irreplaceable. The best of the best.
preemptivestrike20 1 month ago
Love all three of these guys. Losing any one of them is a devistating loss. Rest in peace, Hitch.
Tomer1776 2 months ago
DSOUZA is a little missionary child, he dilutes the past to make christianity seem better, but this fool is a macauleyite, a person from birth who has been raised in a pro christian setting, his arguments are so flawed it makes me laugh, his assertion that not many people died during the inquistions, or the spanish invasion of south america, or slavery, is beyond a joke, here we are talking about morality and slave name da souza is talkling about numbers
OneDharmaYouMovement 2 months ago
I am an atheist but I found Prager's and D'Souza's arguments to be superior. Hitchen's it seemed to me relied too often on sophistry.
tubelarr 2 months ago
Hitchens destroys Prager and D'Souza
mmissinglink 2 months ago
They look like really comfortable chairs.
danielmalpollitt 3 months ago
if you want to know christian attitude for the last 2000years barring the last 30years of pure capitalism.........GOOGLE A GUY CALLED
Mr. Hitler.
OneDharmaYouMovement 3 months ago
@OneDharmaYouMovement Fail by Godwin's Law
LilyWhiteRiot 2 months ago
@LilyWhiteRiot wow. so your saying that hitler did have christian beleifs, of which where supported by the vatican?....DAM christians are in denial, and the hollywood make over machine is in full effect right here!!, next your gona say christians didnt have a slave code!!...the past always catches up, and thats when christians decide to dilute the past.
OneDharmaYouMovement 2 months ago
@OneDharmaYouMovement No, I'm saying that by referencing Hitler you automatically fail in any argument you're trying to make. I'm neither in favour of Hitler nor Christianity but you still suck at making a point.
LilyWhiteRiot 2 months ago
@LilyWhiteRiot the question is this....and its very simple
was hitler a christian, in which he went to church, priased christ, wanted the final solution to the problem of jews, the christ killers, and when the vatican praised hitler, celebrated his birthday, and when the vatican told its ministers to aid and assit the nazi party.........after all these things, is he christian..or are christians themselves undergoing the biggest whitewash of their own history?.....the answer is YES!
OneDharmaYouMovement 2 months ago
@LilyWhiteRiot so while missionary boy slave name da souza is fighting an argument for his masters, the white europeans, he can never addres the reality of christianity, as a racist, slave owning, convert forcing, conversion attacking, intolerant empire...he talks about was christ alive, how many slaves ACTUALLY died, HE avoid the subject matter, why would god make european enslave others, torture them, beat them, covnert them, enslave them, and today what we just forget that!.lol..ud like that!
OneDharmaYouMovement 2 months ago
@OneDharmaYouMovement What on earth are you bangin' on about?
LilyWhiteRiot 2 months ago
@LilyWhiteRiot im bangin on like your bangin on about summit ...and i DONT know what your on about either..lol
OneDharmaYouMovement 2 months ago
Is Hitchens a bi-sexual?
Snotra 3 months ago
Yay
blakeesmith84 4 months ago
In Hitchens We Trust.
someThinkingApe 8 months ago 3
@someThinkingApe On the dollar bill ftw.
mrabdrum 7 months ago
Love Hitch.
thinlizzybone 10 months ago 11
@thinlizzybone Me, too.
writersblock26 6 months ago
Once again HItch delivers an amazing opening statement. Just Wow!!!!
kainen789 10 months ago 21
@kainen789 Really?! You must be easily impressed! All I'm hearing is the same old tired self-refuting guff I always hear from Hitchens in any of his debates.
BloodOfRayne 7 months ago
@BloodOfRayne If the argument is tired and self-refuting, perhaps you should straighten him out. Show us lowly simpletons where he is wrong.
hungryman211 3 months ago
@hungryman211 I thought that was YOUR job!
BloodOfRayne 3 months ago
@kainen789 Quite a remarkable first line. He seems to forget that you can be seated and erect at the same time.
Learnerwp 2 months ago
quite wrong chap///its religion always telling us that Sodom and Gommorrah is out there,ppl who don't believe in religion but are hedonists,and Jews/Christians are taught to separate our nefish(HEbrew for animal spirit,which we also have)and Neshuma(human soul)...religion tells us to separate the two and live on higher plane...hedonism tells us to give in to nefish and all instincts,living like animals..so yes,religion does put something unique and different contrary to evolution and law of the
cykoaudio777 10 months ago
hitchens argument falls apart wheneve he doles out specific crimes of humanity to Christians..like if no one eve killed in the name of god,we'd be better off, ok..sure,then why did atheist regimes like Mao,Stalin,Hitler(Hitchens has inaccurately portrayed Nazis' as religious) who killed 40-50 MILLION ppl.not more than cupl hund thou killed in "name of god"...so is he saying ppl who don't believe in morals or god somehow don't feel hate,anger,revenge,murder???quite the opposite,its religion that
cykoaudio777 10 months ago
@cykoaudio777 google gott mit uns. google oath to hitler and read the first four words. Look these things up and I guarantee you'll wish you could rewrite your comment. However, this is besides the point. I ask you to listen to the proposition Hitchens puts forth at 2:23. It is a direct answer to your question; believe me you are not the first to raise those points. Take his proposition as a challenge and try to contest it honestly. I've found his point to be quite irrefutable.
chrismx24 10 months ago
@cykoaudio777
The Nazi's WERE religious. BIg time. HItler's first action was outlawing an athiest organization and turning their meeting center into a christian outreach center. His first political deal was with the Vatican. His people and he constantly preached the bible. They wore belt buckles that said "god is with us" Like it or not....Hitler is CHristian baggage. Mao and Stalin replaced God with state worship...they were a theocracy that moved the goalpost.
ThieleM 10 months ago 2
@cykoaudio777 stop the press. One point is that someone kills because they believe their religion tells them to do so,,,,, the other point is that someone/group that do not follow a god do bad things. Its not their lack of belief in a deity that makes them do bad things, its simply because they are scum bags. He does not say athesits do not feel negative emotions, not at all. I dont follow your god but am not inclind to go and kill or rape for that reason.
gateshead1000 10 months ago
you did commit crime,thats the whole idea behind resurrection and need for all of Gods children forgiveness..because NONE of us can say we're perfect...we have all "fallen short of the glory of God" and therefore need to be washed white to be in His presence,,,whether you agree,is it that hard to understand?...
cykoaudio777 10 months ago
And how does being in opposition to Christ make one evil? I can think of many things that are in opposition to Christ and aren't evil. Personally, I don't care for Jesus' acceptance of slavery. I don't think Jesus' endorsement of the Laws of Moses is good, hell, if anyone followed that everyone would be dead (kill your kids if they talk back to you? Burn in hell if you eat shellfish?) And I really don't like that Jesus' obligates me to love him for paying for a crime I didn't commit.
senortonyful 10 months ago
I don't know whether Hitler was a Christian and neither do you. He certainly used religious imagery and fed on religious hatreds and I don't think anyone could argue that Germany wasn't a Christian nation. Hitler could not have done what he did without convincing his people that they were doing God's work. The Holocaust was the culmination of centuries of Christian hatred for the Jews. There were entire towns of Jews being wiped out before Hitler for cracker abuse and all sorts of religious crap
senortonyful 10 months ago
Well, you can say using Hitler makes me look stupid but surprisingly you didn't give any evidence to the contrary even though, as you say, it's apparently out there. The fact is Darwin never said a word about survival of the fittest and evolution survives on biological diversity not eugenics so Hitler would not be advancing evolution. German and European anti-semitism was a continuation of 1000 years of religious fueled hatred of the jews. Hitler didn't start anti-semitism, Christianity did.
senortonyful 10 months ago
Well, there's an important distinction to be made in the killing department. First off, I'll only hold accountable religious people that do their evil deeds as a direct result of their religion. A christian nation goes to war over land, it's not Christianities fault. Africa however, is a perfect modern example. Millions of people are suffering the most miserable lives and dying much to young because of Catholic dogma concerning condoms. The massacres in Rwanda were also began at the pulpit.
senortonyful 10 months ago
Wow, I'm glad you're able to characterize secular morals. It changes like the wind? This is what Christians tell themselves to demonize secularists. I have a very firm morality, I do whatever I want because what I want is generally good. I don't need divine permission to act nice or ancient texts to tell me how to act. I have an ingrained sense that guides me to make my life better while also trying to make my world better. If there's something wrong with that let me be wrong.
senortonyful 10 months ago
Why do Christians tend to be more hateful? Because they feel they have divine authority to commit their bigotry. Of course when you have a God that gets off on killing children and slicing off the tips of their penis's, while referring to women as property, hating gays (and shellfish for some reason), condoning slavery and saying that anyone that doesn't submit to him will suffer forever and that his followers are above the lesser non-believers, it's easy to understand why Christians are hateful
senortonyful 10 months ago
@senortonyful: Wrong answer pal. True Christians only HATE that which is evil (anything in opposition to Christ) and unfortunately that means your hateful God denying beliefs pal. There is nothing wrong with hating evil and loving good according to God's standard of righteousness. Unlike atheists who do right in their own eyes through a subjective shape shifting morality that changes like the wind, "if it feels good at them moment, do it!" But God's standard is universal and objective.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
Hell, up until a century ago Christians had a monopoly on all violence. Like I said in the beginning atheists kill just as much as Christians. When someone believes they have God on their side that's when you have children's arms cut off for receiving innoculations. B.T.W neither I nor any other atheist I know has ever killed anyone and we generally tend to be moral people. However, Christians, like yourself, feel the need to call people Idiots for no reason and tend to be very hateful people.
senortonyful 10 months ago
@senortonyful: Ya, uneducated Christians who could never afford a Bible until the mid 1800's killed a few hundred people but it's nothing compared to the 100 plus million that atheist leaders killed in the last century. Ya can't properly blame Christians for what happened long before the printing press was invented in 1440 AD. It was Spanish missionaries who caused the King of Spain to stop the Conquistadors during the Spanish crusade. You are seriously misinformed about history.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
I don't know how you can call the Japanese Emperor an atheist since he believed he was a shinto God. Not a christian but certainly not an atheist. The horrible massacres in Rwanda were strictly inter-denominational Christian fighting and like I said that's when you get to the really sick stuff. Hell, how many millions of africans are dying today because they can't use condoms. You wanna talk about seeing someone suffer watch them die of aids.
senortonyful 10 months ago
Learn your history, Hitler never renounced Catholicism, his first ever alliance was with the Vatican, all soldiers swore an oath"to the fuhrer in front of almighty God" all German soldiers wore a belt buckle inscribed "Got me Unts" God on Our Side. Several times in Mein Kampf Hitler says he is fulfilling his duties to God. The European Culture of anti-semitism was a direct result of Christian doctrine dating back over a millenia. You may not want to claim Hitler, but he's all yours.
senortonyful 10 months ago
@senortonyful: Hitler's God was natural selection, survival of the fitest, evolution , and himself. I can't even remember how many times some moron said exactly what you did and I went and found all the evidence to explain the claims you make and prove Hitler was an atheist who hated Christians, Jews, any race that wasn't white, as well as religion. Stop using Hitler to defend your posiotion. It only makes you look stupid.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
@johnspartan98 Hitler was a Catholic, irregardless evil is evil....it's in the doing.....it's not a "being". Besides the Germans who followed Hitler were mostly Christians who despised the Jews. Why didn't they stop Hitler?? I guess they weren't "real" christians...The USSR was Orthodox before the communists rose to power, guess the "turn the other cheek" thing allows the evil guys to run amuck, so much for love your enemy. The Pope took a neutral stance during WWII, Hypocracy..........
Cougar139tweak 10 months ago
@johnspartan98 Hitler was a great opponent of Darwin, as witnessed by his table talks and his proscriptions against Darwinian writings in 1935.
Der Bucherie 2:6 (1935), P279
6. Schriften weltanschaulichen und lebenskundlichen Charakters, deren Inhalt die falsche naturwissenschaftliche Aufkl�rung eines primitiven Darwinismus und Monismus ist (H�ckel).
Moses was a Nazi, invented genocide, and he never heard of Darwin.
gamesbok 8 months ago
I guarantee you that you can't find a single instance of atheist violence that doesn't have an equal, if not more terrible, Christian corollary. People kill, regardless of whether they consider themselves Godly or not, all people commit atrocities in equal numbers. It's only when someone believes they have a higher calling that they can go to the furthest lengths of depravity. Cutting childrens appendages off, burning people alive, wiping out villages over cracker abuse, you gotta own your side.
senortonyful 10 months ago
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@senortonyful: You said: "I guarantee you that you can't find a single instance of atheist violence that doesn't have an equal, if not more terrible, Christian corollary." Oh really? Well here is your history lesson for Atheist leaders committing genocide from the last century: 1. Mao Ze-Dong (China, 1958-61 and 1966-69, Tibet 1949-50) over 100 million killed. 2. Jozef Stalin (USSR, 1932-39) over 23 million killed, 3. Adolf Hitler (Germany, 1939-1945) over 12 million killed. continued'
johnspartan98 10 months ago
@senortonyful: Athesist leaders mass killings in the last century continued. 4.Leopold II of Belgium (Congo, 1886-1908) 8 million killed. 5.Hideki Tojo (Japan, 1941-44) 5 million killed. 6. Ismail Enver (Turkey, 1915-20)1,200,000 Armenians (1915) + 350,000 Greek Pontians and 480,000 Anatolian Greeks (1916-22) + 500,000 Assyrians (1915-20). You want me to continue or do you see how absurd your statement is when you say you guarantee Christians are equal to atheists for committing genocide? FOOL!
johnspartan98 10 months ago
@senortonyful said:"I guarantee you that you can't find a single instance of atheist violence that doesn't have an equal, if not more terrible, Christian corollary."
Really? Here you go pal: 1.Mao Ze-Dong (China, 1958-61 and 1966-69, Tibet 1949-50)over 100 million killed. 2.Jozef Stalin (USSR, 1932-39) 23 million killed. 3. Adolf Hitler (Germany, 1939-1945) over 12 million killed. Seriously? Atheist leaders killed more people in the last century than all wars in all known previous history.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
@johnspartan98 Did an atheist ever kill EVERY LIVING THING on the PLANET (Babies included....) save for a 500 year old guy who built a big boat and loaded it with 7 pair of every kind of "clean animal" and his family? By the way I think I'll leave Senortonyful to continue to hand you your ass on a plate, I got better things to do than reply to someone who won't even read his own Book much less the books he compares them to......which by the way read like sequels to his own.
Cougar139tweak 10 months ago
Yes atheists, christians and people of all faiths kill people, and the statistics are equivalent. Everyone kills people. I wonder what source you get your information from that designates all these bad actions as being committed exclusively by atheists or are you just making that up. Thankfully there isn't anyone that takes that hateful desert mythology seriously. Could you imagine the death that would happen if people really followed the Bible. Read Leviticus and get back with me.
senortonyful 10 months ago
@senortonyful: Wrong, I just made two posts containing only a fraction of the atheist leaders of the last century and their record of genocide. There is nothing even close you can pin on Christians you IDIOT. Learn your history before shooting off your mouth and maligning your creator and his people.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
Of course you've just made all that up. What balls it takes to just make shit like that up. Where did you get your info? What's your reference? I can't believe the balls of Christians, making shit up off the top of their head and presenting it as established fact. Sure it hurt, but anyone in their right mind would go through that if they were guaranteed a spot at the right hand of God in heaven. You can't rectify that decision. A few hours of pain for a life time in paradise. Sign me up.
senortonyful 10 months ago
When intelligence and reason can take you no further, that's where faith takes over and gives you the strength to go beyond our natural limits. People without faith are the walking dead. Confusion, meanness, selfishness, drunkenness, drug addictions, gossiping, obsessive compulsive behaviors, phobias, fights, wars, destruction, and death follow them wherever they go.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
@johnspartan98 By the way, where do you get this evidence? It seems like you're just making shit up again. Yes, I agree where intelligence and reason stop faith begins, but that's not a good thing. You're just making everything up about the problems of people without faith. We're all drug addicted gossipers? Ha Ha! Wow, Christians will make up the craziest shit without one shred of evidence. If you really want to know the people to fear, it's those that believe they have God on their side
senortonyful 10 months ago
@senortonyful: I don't have to make it up. The work of you godless atheists and evolutionists floods the daily news with killings, break-ins, robberies, frauds, greedy fascist leaders killing their own people, mothers and fathers killing their own spouses/children, baby killings, morons going postal, etc. etc. You godless pukes make me sick with all the death and destruction you leave in your wake all over the world.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
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@senortonyful said: " If you really want to know the people to fear, it's those that believe they have God on their side."
Ya got that right pal. We don't put up with your atheist, communist, god hating, Christian bashing crap for very long before you get the HELL you ask for from us. Just keep warning your atheist pals about what we are capable of when you push too hard and you will be doing the right thing.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
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@senortonyful said: "If you really want to know the people to fear, it's those that believe they have God on their side."
Ya only need to fear us when you start getting in our faces with your atheist, communist, fascist, oppressive, freedom robbing doctrines. So keep warning your atheist pals about us in the hope you save them from their due calamity.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
Thank You, that's exactly what I'm saying. If he's the son of God he KNOWS that there is a heaven and KNOWS that after a few days of torment he will sit in heaven at the right hand of God. That's no sacrifice whatsoever. I'd volunteer in a heartbeat, if I knew there was a heaven and was sure I was going there. So many people get all sappy about this supposed act when anyone with half a brain cell would gladly step up in his shoes. Their entire faith is based on a lie.
senortonyful 11 months ago
@senortonyful: Not really, Jesus still suffered and died for our sins and He became the Christ. Sure he knew His destiny, and He may have had some comfort knowing it, but He was hurting so bad that He expressed a desire to not go through with it "if it were possible, take this cup from me." So your revelation changes nothing and does not make faith in Christ a lie. It is your own thought processes that feed you lies.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
If you want to find a creationist or Christian you can do it in three easy steps.
1. Press Ctrl F
2. Search- Pal or FOOL
3. Scan for spelling and grammatical errors.
Cougar139tweak 11 months ago
Flawless argument, Mr. Hitchens! But unfortunately even your precise logic can't pierce the shields of utter buffoonery that creationists refer to as "faith" in their devotion to ignorance in the face of overwhelming facts.
keithhickson 11 months ago
@keithhickson: The world is littered with atheists like you who went too far pushing around Christians and Jews. We only take so much of your oppressive antics and then it's game on pal...so just remember that when you act like a Nazi thug. Don't believe me? Look at what Christians did to the Muslims beginning in 1097 AD. It took them a 1000 years to regroup and become a pain in the world's ass again. Ya want some of that? Judgment Day is coming pal, whether you believe it or not.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
and reasoning based on scientifically verifiable evidence is the broom that sweeps you archaic-minded fools off the face of the planet. Take solace, however, in knowing your mythology of magic, coercion, and superstition, and psychological mind games served only as a cautionary tale in what humans "used to do before we wised up and started thinking reasonably." So thank you for coming forth and showing us what not to do.
keithhickson 11 months ago
@keithhickson: "mythology of magic, coercion, and superstition, and psychological mind games"
Sounds exactly like atheism to me pal. I don't see any of that being taught in the Bible and I have studied it for over 50 years....but I did learn how to identify what makes a FOOL and FOOL and atheists top the list of FOOLS.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
mythology- Any story that can't be verified as actually taking place even if meant as "allegorical" or "metaphorical." 2 of all animals in a boat, for example
magic- Water to wine, levitation, rod became a snake, resurrection
coercion- kill those that try and persuade you not to believe in Christianity
superstition- precognition, Armageddon, interpretation of events as "judgement"
mind games- "no matter what you've done you're already a sinner so you have to repent"
keithhickson 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
And saying "oppressive antics [of atheists]" has got to be the most ridiculous statement I've heard coming out of the mouth of a creationist who's predecessors took part in the Salem witch trial and the Crusades, which you admitted to. Civilized society is done with you fear-based propagandists spouting your rhetorical bigotry. Rational thinking
keithhickson 11 months ago
@keithhickson: Ya Salem witch trials saw 14 women and 5 men put to death by people most likely suffering from ergot poisoning...that was terrible...but not much of a holocaust eh pal? The crusades? If you are talking about the one against the ottoman empire against the Muslims who were killing Christians and Jews who would not bow to Allah....ya...sure...and if you were one being persecuted back then you would have cursed any Christian that would not fight against that oppressive beast.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
So murder in the name of creationism is justified? Perhaps only if the person doesn't share your beliefs of creationism?
keithhickson 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
Thank you for proving my point and for giving me my best laugh of the week with your utterly buffoon-ish comment. First of all, I'm a secular Humanist not an atheist. I side with atheists insofar as supernaturalism shouldn't be the basis of rational thinking.
keithhickson 11 months ago
@keithhickson: Thank you for the insult. In all the universe of things, there are but two possible states for nature to exist. 1. is nature left to itself and it's own inner workings, and 2. is God manifested in nature(the supernatural). In your natural state, you can only do what is natural. You can no more rise above your own nature than darkness can turn itself into light. When God's Spirit is placed within you, then you have the ability to rise above your natural state. Do you see?
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
If you're trying to poetically say that enlightenment or the raising of consciousness, in terms of "getting smarter" "becoming wiser" "comprehension/understanding" etc. ONLY comes from Christianity then no I don't accept that. Creationism isn't a prerequisite to wisdom.
keithhickson 11 months ago
@keithhickson: I didn't think you would get it. Enlightenment can also be natural but will only yield natural results. To transform the heart of man so that man can know and understand God requires a supernatural birth within the very heart of man. This is why atheists don't understand true believers.....they don't have the Spirit which searches all things, teaches, and guide and casts out all fear. You fear what you don't understand, and that is why you want to rid the world of faith.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
Again, with the psychological mind games. You've tried to curtail spirituality to mean: only Christian's have it right because only Christian's have "the Spirit which searches all things..." Transcendence doesn't require creationism. Opening one's mind to the possibilities of that which exists outside of the physical/natural doesn't mean one has to be a Christian or accept what Christians purport to be "the truth."
keithhickson 11 months ago
@keithhickson: No mind games pal. You cannot transcend nature while under the power of nature because nature is a closed loop. It is what it is, does what it does, and nothing more. Only by a union with the Spiritual realm can one transcend their natural state. But be warned. There are two Spiritual realms. As within man is good and evil, so it is in the supernatural. Faith in the Divine Nature and character of God, His Word, and His son is your only defence against the forces of evil.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
Your conception of the supernatural is based on your conception of the natural, just like an 11th century human would conceptualize the supernatural differently than a 21st century human because of the difference in the natural world and the mind of the observer. Therein lies your viewpoint, which I do not share: Christianity is the "only defense against evil." That is another loaded statement a.k.a "mind game."
keithhickson 11 months ago
@keithhickson: No, my conception of the supernatural is based on a union with the supernatural. It is the same union with the supernatural God that is my reason for belief, and such a union is all the evidence I need. How about you? What evidence do you need? Do you seek any? Just wondering pal. Have a nice day.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
You keep reiterating that creationism is the ONLY WAY to spiritual enlightenment because your conception of the natural world (what the bible says) is how you imagine the supernatural world HAS TO be. What do you think heaven/paradise "is like"? And would you agree your conceptualization is different than say a Pantheistic view of paradise? Yes. Because your idea is "better" than all other view points because, as you said, "[Christianity] is the ONLY defense against evil."
keithhickson 11 months ago
All faithful are cowards. All faithful are failed fallen farcical faith fanatics. These things easily find access to oxygen and food and this oxygen and food consumption has a zero return on it.In fact, when resources are consumed by the faithful my species suffers as a result. Carbon monoxide cures religion. Help free our species from the grip of anchoring failure, convince a religitard to spend time in the garage with their car. If you believe in a god then go fucking see him.
699backstab 1 year ago
Whats with Hitchens and Dinesh, theyre always together?!?!?
Im guessing Dinesh is one of those intelligent indians who figured fuck im gonna make some money.
KurtCobainof21 1 year ago
god's philosophy or moral values is very simple - love. all the academic babble distracts people from the fact you can't prove love, and there is absoultely nothing wrong with unfailing love and a willingness to human sacrifice one's self.
rogerchua16 1 year ago
@rogerchua16 God's values are subservience to him and jealousy. God repeatedly tells his chosen people to wipe out neighboring tribes saving only the young virgins for their own personal use. His first four commandments are about only worshiping him and his jealous nature and makes no injunction against genocide,rape, child abuse. He asks Abraham to kill his own son. He destroys the Earth. And what does "you can't prove love" mean. It's not a scientific claim of course you can't prove it.
senortony1111 1 year ago
@senortony1111 STOP BLASPHEMER lol
surshot56 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
would you consider a parent who loves and forgives his child unconditionally immoral? would you consider a parent who would give up his/her life so that the child may live, immoral? god gave his son so that humans may live. whether or not you believe it, the philosophy is not immoral. it's an expression of ultimate love and sacrifice. suggesting acts of ultimate love and sacrifice as immoral is absurd.
rogerchua16 1 year ago
would you consider a parent who loves and forgives his child unconditionally immoral? woudl you consider a parent who would give up his/her life so that the child may live, immoral? god gave his son so that humans may live. whether or not you believe it, the philosophy is not immoral. it's an expression of ultimate love and sacrifice. suggesting acts of ultimate love and sacrifice as immoral is absurd.
rogerchua16 1 year ago
@rogerchua16 No one said anything about loving your child being immoral. As far as the Jesus story goes. If I were the son of God and knew I would go to heaven and sit at the right hand of God, a few days suffering on the cross would be kinda trivial. I think anyone would go Jesus' route had they had his reward to look forward too. It wasn't a sacrifice on the part of either God or Jesus. Offer me eternal bliss for a few days of suffering and I'd take the offer without hesitation.
senortony1111 1 year ago
@senortony1111 Agreed, millions of soldiers have made much greater sacrifices, Jesus "knew" what would become of himself (Actually he was more likely deranged like David Koresh but still applies) Honestly if the story was true, which it is unlikely, the sacrifice was trivial, if it wasn't, he was crazy, but most likely....It's a fairy tale.
Cougar139tweak 11 months ago
@rogerchua16 In what way was Jesus Gods son? :) Can't wait for the answer..........
Cougar139tweak 1 year ago
@Cougar139tweak: Read the Bible and find out. Open your mind and stop being so arrogant and pig headed all your life. God won't turn away from a man who is humble and contrite. You man enough to handle that truth pal?
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98 Very aggressive tone my bible thumping friend. Actually I was a Southern Baptist in Texas for much of my life until I decieded to read the Bible cover to cover after my sister became a Mormon (has since left and went back to a non demoninational church) Hate to break it to you but reading the Bible is what made me leave Christianity. Leviticus and Exodus and just coming to terms with Genesis was honestly enough but the complete lack of answers from my pastor sealed the deal.
Cougar139tweak 11 months ago
@Cougar139tweak: You were a southern baptist until you decided to read the Bible? So you went and read it cover to cover? It seems you started out backwards. One becomes a Christian by the Holy Spirit working through faithful followers of Christ and God's word, the Gospel message. The Bible is a collection of books one studies and uses as spiritual food. You best study the Bible and study the commentaries of respected scholars such as John F. MacArthur Jr., Mathew Henry, Andrew Murray, etc.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98 I'm sorry that at the age of 8 I was unable to decipher the Bible. I don't need others to deciper the bible either, dashing children against the rocks and sacrificing your daughter to God (without his intervention, hmmm guess he liked Issac better) doesn't need any deep explination. Genocide is genocide any way you want to slice it. By the way this holy spirit crap is garbage as I've seen these same guys bash gays and blacks. How very christian, what a crock
Cougar139tweak 11 months ago
@Cougar139tweak: Ha, ha, ha. It's so much like an atheist to critisize the Bible and Christians for not living up to your own standard of what you think a Christian should be. If you feel you could be a better Christian then give it a whirl, repent, and accept Jesus as Lord and savior then show us how it's done...LOL.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
I live a good life without a skydaddy holding a gun to my head, besides someone who would condone what "God" condoned in the bible needs to get on the next bus to Bellevue. By the way which one of the 40,000 christian cults are you a part of?
Cougar139tweak 10 months ago
@Cougar139tweak: I live a good life with no skydaddy holding a gun to my head too....LOL. What did gone condone that has you upset? If you were alive back when God ordered the eradication of the Amalekites you would have cursed God if He didn't order it because the people were "completely corrupt." What is it about "completely" that you don't understand? Think about a society of serial killers, cannabols, and people who enjoy murder and rape for entertainment (multiplied times 100).
Well?
johnspartan98 10 months ago
Comment removed
Cougar139tweak 10 months ago
@johnspartan98 What did god condone that has you upset?-- well he's omnicient and omnipresent he could have changed them in the same way he hardened the pharoahs heart right? Better than killing women and babies as he can do ANYTHING. Why not appear to these people and scare them? Besides that God condones through his apathy Human Sacrifice, rapist marrying their victims as punishment and selling daughters into sexual slavery, yeah I have a few disagreements with YHWY....small as they may seem
Cougar139tweak 10 months ago
@Cougar139tweak: It ain't God killing women and babies now is it? It's atheist serial killers and abortion rights activists who twist the bible to justify their perversions doing the killing. What God commanded back then was completely justified because the people were "completely corrupt." What don't you understand about the concept: "completely corrupt?" Think of it as a society of Charles Manson type serial killers and canabols that enjoy killing, raping, and eating each other. Understand?
johnspartan98 10 months ago
@johnspartan98 By the way, "GOD" as a concept is not universially Abrahamic and honestly Christianity is only good in that it doesn't take itself seriously like Islam does. Follow what your bible teaches and you will quickly find youself in a 5X9 cell.
Cougar139tweak 10 months ago
@Cougar139tweak: You said: "Follow what your bible teaches and you will quickly find yourself in a 5X9 cell." In an Islamic nation your statement would be true. BUT, in the USA, unless you follow a bastardized interpretation that does not respect hermeneutic principals of interpretation, your statement is foolish. But, foolish is what I expect from and atheist.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
@johnspartan98 "bastardized interpretation?" So stoning a woman on her fathers front doorstep because she is not a virgin on her wedding night is not going to get you locked up? How do you cherry pick when God is right and when he is wrong, do you own a cliff notes version of the Bible I'm not aware of? Last time I read a passage from the bible which was yesterday (it's one of my favorite books of fiction ironically) I didn't see any revisions, I thought it was every jot and tittle?!
Cougar139tweak 10 months ago
@Cougar139tweak: The Bible does not teach that. Jesus stopped a woman from being stoned for committing adultery. Your comments are better suited for Muslims and the Koran, not Christians and the Bible. You are not only cherry picking, you are deliberately misinterpreting the Bible to suit your own confirmation bias. The Bible is not a work of fiction. It contains philosophy, prophecy, history, judicial laws recongnized around the world, sociology, psychology, the wisdom of God etc.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
@johnspartan98 What do you profess to know about the Koran? Quote me some verses. Besides you are also cherry picking. Don't follow the OLD Testament teachings? Well? Which ones and who says, what the ones you like...how convenient, you would have been in good company in the south in the early 1800's regarding slavery. I'm not delibrately interpreting...it's their for all to see as long as you are willing to accept it. I read the bible because I wanted to believe, and finished disgusted.
Cougar139tweak 10 months ago
@johnspartan98 By the way I've read the Koran and the Hadeeth, the Bible is just as violent (by the way the muslims believe in the same "God" you do and so do the Jews. If I tell you I have a Uncle Norman...and he died a few years ago.....and he came back to life.....which of these claims need extraordinary proof. Also even if it were true it would not mean he was the messiah, would it? That's the difference between History and Myth. Now go drip some blood on a leper.
Cougar139tweak 10 months ago
@Cougar139tweak: Ya, you read some religious books and now you are a scholar. Look pal, if I wanted your shitty lay opinion I would squeeze it out of your head. Allah is not the same God that Christians put their faith in so take your ignorant uneducated opinion and put it where the sun don't shine.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
@johnspartan98 Ahhh now there's that classic Christian sentiment....when I can't win the argument with my 2000+ year old dead/contridictory text I'll just call you names and get mad......now make sure you watch out and don't run over skeeter when you back out of the driveway on the way to the monter truck rally. By the way it sounds like you haven't read the bible and if you have it was read V e r y ..... s l o w l y.... Allah is YHWY, do you know why there are 3 Abrahamic religions?
Cougar139tweak 10 months ago
@Cougar139tweak: Why do fool atheists like you argue against things you don't even believe in and make yourselves look even more foolish? As a Christian I can call God Allah and YHWY and they are the same, but the Allah Muslims worship is nothing like the God of the Bible and they don't believe Jesus became Christ or that He is One with God and God, or Savior. They don't follow the same God. So you lose again pal.
johnspartan98 10 months ago
@Cougar139tweak Hmmmmm I guess you got me, you're right he's a figment of my imagination. A Fairy tale can't have a son can he?, you win............. :)
Cougar139tweak 11 months ago
if you decide to live your entire life in a certain way purely on the strength of some ancient stories...and if you want tax breaks because of this belief....and if you want these stories taught in school in preference to tried and tested science....and if you want to claim the moral high ground because of these stories (which are full of terrible atrocities and permission for them)....then....YOU NEED SOME CONCRETE EVIDENCE!
"but sumfink can't cum from nuffink tho! Please....grow....up.
MrFitz7 1 year ago
if religious people really must have it they should study buddhism. buddhism actually helps you and has something real to offer.
truthseeker8010 1 year ago
i love Prager, he's a great man... but he's no match for Hitchens. I can't stand D'Souza though.
Composer19691 1 year ago
Hitchings gives no Data stastictical sources,For his statements regarding negative comments.Its clear he regards himself,As the authorty on the topic.he says the bible came at a time we knew nothing...Oldest writing 5,000 yrs old,sumerian clay tablets show the sun centrel.knowledge the people had back then is v interesting,cant be underestimated.The grt pyramid advanced math.Giant monolith weight,Heavier than we can lift today.Advanced knowledge,unlike this guy.Does he get paid for that!?
SharpTwoEdgedSword 1 year ago
@SharpTwoEdgedSword I'm having a hard time understanding what your point is....
and I ask this nondisrespectfully but is English not your first language?
mmeasy123 1 year ago
If I were to argue against Hitchens relentless logic, I would better come prepare to bite bullets. D'Souza's argument at best is a bundle of fancy words that carries no weight nor delivers any substance. Humanity must unchain itself from religion, this decomposed lie.
Aliof 1 year ago
C'mon, guys. Hitchens does a lot of hand-waving. He's nothing but rhetoric. Brilliant rhetoric, sure, but the substance is just not there.
Ace91939 1 year ago
@Ace91939 What are you talking about? Talking about substance, there's no doubt of whom has the better position.
bbkingzor 1 year ago
@bbkingzor I don't think any of them were particularly good in this debate, but you would have to be the kind of person that is swayed by rhetoric and not by logic to think Hitchens is anything but a high-school drop-out on this subject. He's a walking, talking logical fallacy.
Ace91939 1 year ago
@Ace91939 Where exactly does he fall to be logical? Point it out, please.
bbkingzor 1 year ago
@bbkingzor There is no doubt in your mind, because you have different standards of forming beliefs than Ace does. Your standards are by no means better or worse, they are just different. Study philosophy a bit more, and you'll see the near-impossibility of knowledge and supremacy of beliefs. But the overwhelming majority of mankind disagrees with your belief-forming methods. What Hitchens is saying is not rooted in any kind of truth, nor is it philosophical.
dbmcmillan 1 year ago
RIdicule does not prove a point. Hitchens needs to do some more homework. Pliny, Seutonius, Josephus, Tacitus and the Mishna are hostile, non-Chrisitian sources which document the existence of Jesus.
HItchens again utilizes circular reasoning. He assumes what he is trying to prove and then uses that as evidence for his point.
Sorry, thumbs down.
Mike82ARP 1 year ago
@Mike82ARP I had to do some research on some nonchristian websites and found much evidence to dispute your claim about these guys. SUPPOSEDLY, Pliny and Tacitus were born well after Jesus' death and Josephus was born early enough to possibly have known people who had actually met Jesus, but again, it's all hearsay. Noone knows. They want to know for emotional reasons and I get that. I really do. But it's not evidence. Sorry.
richwfd2002 1 year ago
D'Souza never gets tired of getting his ass kicked. I think he likes it.
cperez1000 1 year ago 3
Hitchens is brilliant. The simple fact is that unproven faith and blind belief can not hold water in 21 century. Humanity must rid itself of religion, this rabid mental disease, if it is to experience peace and harmony.
Aliof 1 year ago 17
@Aliof I disagree. There are some religions, if practiced correctly, would definitely bring about peace in a society. I think peace and harmony is experienced when humanity gets rid of the idea that race and social status gives one person the right to exploit another person. I'm not arguing that religions are necessary for people to respect and cooperate with each other. I'm just making the point that not all religions are to blame for the ills of our society.
MishuTaste 1 year ago
@MishuTaste There are no religions that can be practiced correctly because they are all deception based, they are all invented by man to enslave man for the purpose of money and power. Further, religion ask me to believe blindly in something that is out of the realm of logic, I refuse to do that.
Aliof 1 year ago
@Aliof How do you account for Kim Jong Il? Castro? Back a bit...Stalin?
JASmahler 1 year ago
@JASmahler
"How do I account for Kim Jong II"? What are you trying to say? The argument is about god, religion and whether or not we should burden ourselves with their none sense.
Humanity must get rid of these stupid legends.
Aliof 1 year ago
@Aliof
Well what about atheists who kill in the name of atheism...persecution of those who serve one religion or another? You tend to ignore atrocities committed AGAINST religion for the sake of emphasizing the atrocities committed in its name.
JASmahler 1 year ago
@JASmahler
The test here is not about how many have been killed because of religion and or atheism, although opposite of your argument is true.
The test is whether legends of gad and what religions have been brain washing simple minded people like yourself, hold water.
Hitchens successfully argues the absence of god and invalidity of religion. D'Suza however, seems to go around the same sorry circle, using fancy words, devoid of any substance.
Aliof 1 year ago
@Aliof: I disagree Adolf....oops....Aliof...LOL(mistake intended beacuse you are talking like a freedom robbing jack booted Nazi thug). Learn from history which shows Christians don't stand for oppression from anyone for too long and they always end up kicking the asses of their opressors back to the dark ages in the end. I don't see Christians going out and attacking atheists in the shit spewing manner Chris Hitchens does....not until backed into a corner by atheist fools like you.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
You missed the boat all together Jack.....oops John. I don't think I mentioned Christianity but all religions in general. I rather be a jack booted Nazi thug than a moron like you who has swallowed the bait, the line, the weight and the sinker thrown at him by religious zealots. You should read the comment and understand it before you put your foot in your mouth. Every time I come across someone like you on You Tube I realize how detectable is the stench of stupidity.
Aliof 11 months ago
@Aliof: I didn't miss anything and if you can't stand the stench of stupidity then I guess you can't stand your own primate atheist self because that's what you atheists think human beings are is just another animal primate species....nothing special....no special purpose....right? Ya, I'm right because I heard Hitchman and Dawkman preaching their God denying rhetoric all over the Internet like they are on the devil's mission to recruit any fool they can into buying their crappy books.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
You need to find some place and get lost or get to your bible study Jack. I can't stand the tunnel vision fools like you. Read your reply before posting it moron.
Aliof 11 months ago
@Aliof: Once again you need to look in a mirror and engage your brain before you put your accusing mouth in gear Adolf. YOU are the one who is suffering from tunnel vision for rejecting the God of the Bible, His Son, His Word, and His offer for eternal life. You need to stop being so close minded to God and quit believing in men like Hitchens who love to drag company along with them as they travel the road to Hell.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
Eternal life you said!!!!!! There is the core of your problem like many before. You silly believers pretend to believe in supernatural, a fairy tail in the hope of living for ever, a scientifically impossible reward. On the other hand if there is a "Hell" I gladly walk up to it if accompanied by an intellectual like Hitchens and I reject "paradise" to keep away from religious morons like you. You need to wake up and smell the coffee Jack, eternal life my ass, this is it.
Aliof 11 months ago
@Aliof: Hey Adolf, Hell is just the holding tank for atheists' spirits until Judgment Day, and after that your spirits will not be experiencing anything because your spirit will be eternally dead. You can deny the existence of the Spirit realm all you want but it makes no difference to whether it's there or not. We know it is there, but you are closed minded and in denial of it. Open your mind to God and His Word and you will gain some spiritual wisdom, which is what you are void of.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
I want you to have the "spiritual wisdom", stem from "God and His Word" along with that promised "eternal life",
now you may find some else to bother.
Aliof 11 months ago
@Aliof: Does that mean you are done with bothering me pal? I sure hope so because my inbox is filled every five minutes by God denyong fools like you who seem to travel in packs and love to victimize others with their attacks and insults aimed at God and people of faith. I'm here to give you a taste of your's and Hitchens' own medicine and you fools get all upset and tell me I'm being a big meany LOL. Hypocrites! You theists love to dish it out but you can't take it when given back to you.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98 Correction to my last comment in the last sentence "theists" should be "atheists." A key had something under it making it skip.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98
You don't have to correct yourself Jack. Every thing you have said so far has been rubbish. "Adolf, eternal life, god and his bible, nazi, booted Nazi" ......and nothing of substance. Remember you replied to my comment and yes I want to leave you with your God, hoping he will take you to start up your eternal life. BTW are you by any chance Jewish?
Aliof 11 months ago
@Aliof: I am a spiritual jew, grafted into the vine through the supernatural power of God and made a joint heir with Israel. And you are? Oh ya, an atheist who bows to Hitchens every word.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
@johnspartan98 "Oh ya, an atheist who bows to Hitchens every word."
And you are insignificant in this universe....sorry. You can be as spiritual as you like to give you all the warm fuzzies inside, however, the fact is that if mother Earth decides to fart or itch its nose, all of humanity will perish with nobody left to tell our story.....
SechyoolarYOOESAY 11 months ago
@SechyoolarYOOESAY: Like I need you to tell me how insignificant I am. We are all like flees on a camels ass pal, INLCUDUING YOU! You talk like earth has a conscience. You personify earth with the term "mother." Do you seriously believe the earth decides anything? You are embarrassing your atheist pals by believing things that amount to projecting fairytale delusions. The physical chaos we see in the universe, and natural disasters on earth, is the result men and demons rebelling against God.
johnspartan98 11 months ago
Big chairs make everyone look teeny-tiny.
MultiUniv3rsal 1 year ago 23
If I was sitting next to that woman I'd be "erect" :)
andyrooney11 1 year ago
His close was to caricature his version of the Christian world view and to imply that if there were a God that he would never act that way. First of all, this does nothing to disprove the existence of a diety. Secondly, he presupposes that his (and by inferrence the audience's) notion of what God might be like must be more rational than how God might be found to be, or reveal himself to be. Where is his source for these qualities of God which he implies must be rational? He has none.
Gomanson 1 year ago
Christophers faith is unbelievable. I truly wish as a Christion my faith was as strong in truth as his in a lie.But thats the humdrum. Quality of faith is resiliant only by one standard ultimately,and that is how he thinks on his death bed and how he feels about his faith,in conscience when they say,Chris the game is over.The money and prestige this guy makes not on the backs of believers but unbelievers is worthy of a false teacher. Who milks through the prosperity gospel the weak.
polopowers1 1 year ago
How much money has and does the church make on the backs of the believers? Tax free.
Resenbrink 1 year ago 2
Give me a break... If you're going to accuse one of the most intellectual men on the planet of being an idiot, at least learn how to spell before doing so.
With regard to your accusing Christopher of being a man of faith, I can seldom recall a time when I've read something THAT hypocritical. I genuinely feel sorry for you, it's such a shame that people exist that have been indoctrinated from a young age and have no desire to think for themselves.
Forgot about your religion, and enjoy freedom.
ubernaffa 1 year ago 2
lol christopher is so strange
Christopher: "Shall I Be Erect" lol
Normal Person: "Should I Stand Up"
Christopher: "Am I Audible To all"
Normal Person: "Can u all hear me"
:D
TheWinepusher 2 years ago
I have a man crush on Hitchens
mcgra8bc 2 years ago 2
@mcgra8bc don't we all?
iamthe1337est 2 years ago
Hitchens has a remarkable command of rhetoric. This masks the weak points in his arguments. His trick is to delight the audience with a witty turn of phrase while simultaneously saying the most outrageously insulting things possible about those he disagrees with.
TruthWatch 2 years ago
What you mean that God sat around for 80,000 years and did nothing? That doesn't sound wrong at all.
SocialDissimulation 2 years ago
So how does this relate to my comment?
TruthWatch 2 years ago
That was one of the weak points in his argument.
SocialDissimulation 2 years ago
Oh, I see. Thanks.
TruthWatch 2 years ago
I'm glad you can agree that that argument is actually pretty accurate.
SocialDissimulation 2 years ago
Hmm. No actually I wouldn't say that Hitchens was accurate. His contention is irrelevant in a discussion about the existance of God. It is one more example of hyperbole preetending to be reason.
TruthWatch 2 years ago