Berlin loses Xmas Sunday shopping

[shmuli9]

Do you mean "their" and not "there"? I "rilly" hope so...

[NationalApostasy]

The founders of America wisely sought to guard against the employment of secular power on the part of the church, with its inevitable result-- intolerance and persecution. In both the EU and the U.S., such safeguards are being dismantled and the sure result will be persecution. Notice that this video's description says that "Germany's highest court sides WITH CHURCH PLEA to overturn Berlin's liberal shopping laws." These developments forecast events of the greatest magnitude.

[thelastcrisis]

FORCING all of society to observe the day that the majority observe! Some faiths observe Friday as their Sabbath, some observe Saturday - thus this law forces those to observe Sabbath two days a week. All such Sunday laws are nothing short of tyranny. Clearly such laws are a sign of the times - they make abundantly clear that liberty of conscience is no longer respected. Whenever the church gains political power she punishes dissent from her dogmas. This is just the beginning of what will be.

[tclhoneyabby]

It's a good decision to ban Sunday shopping. Families need time to spend together. And at the same we are saving the environment,

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby And what if, not that this has EVER happened, but what if someone doesn't have a family "to spend time together" with? That's sort of like saying "sex is for procreation". Does that mean that if a woman has a total hysterectomy, she and her husband should NOT have sex?

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 Sex has nothing to do with it. If I did not have a family I wouldn't want others not to have that time together. I would support it either way. Besides the point, those people who do not have families would still have the option of shopping six days a week plus evenings. So letting one day set aside for families isn't being that selfish. All the money that workers have contributed to the country, asking for one day isn't to much to ask for.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby I think everyone should have two days off a week , but everyone doesn't HAVE to have the same day off (Sunday, let's say)... It's sort of interesting that Germans make LAWS (it's aginst the law to shop on Sunday; it's against the law to give someone the finger, etc.) where most countries just rely on common sense... And we all know what law-loving Germany did with its laws in the 1930s and 1940s...

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby If shop owners want to open on Sunday, someone who disagrees doesn't HAVE to either shop or get employed there...

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 Shop owners have laws to abide by just like you and I. We have a minimum wage in our area that owners have to abide by. They also have to close down on a Holiday and pay Holiday pay. If we can tell a business owner what to do with his or her money, we can tell them when to close. That's what we have a government for.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby We have a minimum wage, too (it varies by state/province, but it is relatively high in Washington - quite a bit higher than the federal governments mandate). But I really disagree that why we have a government - what, to tell us when we dare and dare not shop, like we're in kindergarten? If no one comes into a shop on Sunday, THAT does give a message.

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 you are not getting it are you??The government legislates a minimum wage. They are telling business owners what to do. Telling a business owner how to spend his money is no different than telling him when to close. Thats why we have laws. Millions of people were brainwashed by the media about freedom to shop. People are not getting it...you can shop six days and that law was in place for a reason. To give employee's a day off. They deserve it. Aren't we human any more ?

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby I "get it" just fine. And I agree that EVERYONE should have two days off in a row every week, just that it doesn't HAVE to be the SAME two days for EVERYBODY (one of which HAS to be Sunday?) A lot of restaurants are closed on Mondays here, but not by some law, just because they want to. And even now, in the US, and probably many countries, if an employee is not specifically hired to work weekends, by law one has to have at least every other weekend off.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby And regardless of what "leave Sunday alone" people might say, isn't it funny that Sunday "just happens" to be the Christian Sabbath and the main naysayers happen to be the Catholic and Lutheran churches? Not everyone DOES celebrate the Sabbath on Sunday (most 'guest workers' from Turkey don't, nor Jews, nor many other religion).

[tclhoneyabby]

.@shmuli9 If you have looked on our web site I have suggested a vote Monday to Sunday, pick you're day. We all need a common day to spend together.Corporations are laughing at all religions and people because they are a religion itself. They love the fact that all religions do not agree on a common day. If Monday is chosen fine..and yes I would vote for Sunday as that was our traditional day of rest. To suggest that we can not rest on Sunday because churches hold services is out and out wrong.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby So SAGST Du... But as I said in the post above, do people REALLY "spend a day together"? Ich habe gefunden, dass es nicht passiert... And actually, I think a Monday closing day for stores might actually work better. People NOT in the retail industry work M-F, and people IN the retail industry work Wed-Su... Therein is the big problem... if SHOP people and everyone else work the same days, when, exactly, are non-shop people supposed to shop?

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 People used to spend time together here in Nova Scotia when stores were closed on Sundays. You claim Monday might be better. But if a vote was held the people could make that choice one way or another. Years ago we all survived without seven day shopping. We can do it again

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby Oh, we DID do without Sunday shopping, but there were ALWAYS places that traded on Sundays... for at least 100 years... (and before that, most people lived on farms, where they had food anyway...)

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby You are right about Corporations thinking that they are religions. (Something that really annoys me.) Auf der anderen Hand, thinking "traditionally" brings up things like "the Earht must be flat, and the Sun revolves around the Earth, because TRADITIONALLY this is what we think, so it must be true..."

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 there are some things that were traditional and not worth giving up. Families are suffering because they can no longer have Sundays to be together.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby I don't think ANYONE is "suffering" because they can't spend SUNDAYS together... but if you include sausages and apples or the Sunday roast, well, I suppose perhaps some THINGS might suffer... I think buying milk at Sobey's or the Real Atlantic Superstore might be better for all...

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 how can you be sure? The workers are not having quality time together. We are humans not robots for commercialism. You can buy milk the other six days of the week can't you? What happens if we have a major snow storm on Sunday and the stores close or the power goes off ? We do with out. Don't we? Can't we put a little effort into ensuring our families have one common day off to spend together?

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby You keep bringing up this "spend quality time with the FAMILY" thing... And as for the snow and power outage (power outages, here anyway, rarely cause supermarkets to close, and neither do snow storms, either), and in any case those two scenarios rarely happen. Certainly not week in/week out, ad infinitum.

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 Of course I'm bringing up spending quality time with our families. That's not a bad thing to want that option is it? You tell me that it is rare that snow or a power outage could cause a super market to close..but the fact is it is a chance that it can happen. Point is we would all survive. We never had Sunday shopping years ago and we all survived .

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby Not everyone HAS a "family to spend quality time with" (and some people don't WANT to spend quality time with their families). You're right, that we never had Sunday shopping years ago (well, WE did, but only at 7-11, and a rotating list of open pharmacies on Sunday), but we also didn't have cell phones, birth control, running water,computers, antibiotics, antihistamines years ago, and so forth, and we survived. Should we go back to a time when none of those things existed?

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 you are correct in saying not everyone has a family. But why should billions of them be penalized because others do not have a family? It's not likewe are asking to close stores down two days a week, we are asking for one. Yes we did have pharmacies and that's an essential service , you need medication. How can you compare that to buying a can of corn? Cell phones, birth control , computers do not hold people hostage! If stores are open billions of people are forced to work on Sundays.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby From what I have seen, people ARE held slave to both computers (as in "you have to turn in such-and-such an assignment in Word or PowerPoint format, because everyone has a PC, right?) AND cell phones.

As I mentioned before, people don't HAVE to work on Sundays if they don't want that particular job, nor do companies HAVE to open their doors on Sunday. But making it ILLEGAL to do so is bizarre...

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 No people are addicted to computers. Comparing it to an employer who is pressuring you to work on Sundays is a total different issue. We all have our addictions that's for sure. Don't you think shopping is an addiction where you are so for it seven days a week? People do not have to work on Sundays..hmm depends on who they are...and if they can handle the guilt and fear that the employers put on them for refusing. 80% as a guess cave under pressure and work Sundays.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby Read my last posting again. Some people are addicted to computers, but when a professor or teacher REQUIRES something of the students or pupils to be turned in a computer format, that IS pressuring people... Actually, I'm NOT addicated to shopping at all. And again, why is it OK for SOME places of business to be open Sundays (like cinemas, bakeries, restaurants), but not OTHERS? If you supported closing those, I might see some merit it your position, but you haven't yet...

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 Of course some people are addicted to computers. A teacher can requite anything but it's not like they will lose a home over it. Being forced to work on Sundays...face it we all have to pay bills and most people are scared to death. Personally I'd like to see all non essential places closed on Sundays. Whether you flip hamburgers or work at a call center. Google Chick Fil A they are a restaurant and are closed on Sundays. It can be done.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby Students might not lose a home over it, but they can be totally screwed if they receive a failing grade, and not get a college degree... Yes, Chick-Fil-A doesn't open on Sundays, and guess what? They base it TOTALLY on religion. A better example is Bergen County, New Jersey, which requires non-food stores to close on Sunday, though the county's Orthodox Jewish and Muslim community don't like that very much, since they don't shop on their Sabbath, which begins at Sunset Friday.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby (And sunset in summer comes conveniently right around the same time stores close.) Saturdays are not shopping days either, until the first three stars come out (again, conveniently about the same time stores close). So not every has the option of spending Sundays in the living room holding hands with one's family and singing "Kum-bay-Ya".

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 No not everyone has that option we are all different. That doesn't mean that one occupation can't have Sundays home because others work does it? We do not expect letter carriers to work Sundays because other people work it. We are human beings. Don't knock those people who want Sundays home. If some people are gay we do not expect everyone to be gay. If the retail sector would rather have Sundays off why should anyone else decide it?

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby Why should anyone else decide? Hmm...There are some people who might not want to work at all, but do... Should we let them decide?

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 the fact is retail workers want one day off not seven! Are you that addicted to shopping that you can not let retail workers have one day off? Why should you decide? Can you decide what letter carriers do?

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby AS I SAID, I'm not at all addicted to shopping... I think you really need to calm down and perhaps actually READ, but of course, please don't read on Sunday.

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 you are not addicted. Ok then why are you so worried? Of course i'm calm. Now that's silly why cant I read on Sunday? Just because some people work on Sunday doesn't mean everyone should. To many people out there were brainwashed and had that programed into their heads. Are you one of them? And I'm calm how about you? :-)

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby I'm not "worried". I don't even live in Germany, so it's an intellectual enterprise and it won't affect me at all. You shouldn't read on Sunday, because, of course it would be SELFISH to do so, unless, of course, you're reading aloud to your family, or from the Bible. (Yes, well into the 20th century, people actually thought like that, and if they did then, then they should now.)

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 What does reading on Sunday have to do with spending time with you're families? What does the bible have to do with anything? Yes this is the 20th Century, we should treat our families better than this. We all need one common day to spend together whether it is Monday , Tues. or Sunday. One common day and I will vote for Sunday as it was always on Sunday.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby Just because it's ALWAYS been on Sunday doesn't mean it HAS to, without a doubt, be on Sunday. Actually, I think Wednesday might be the best day for stores to close... And actually, this is the 21ST century... (though I don't have a flying car yet, darnit!)

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 you are right this is why on our web site I made a suggestion to have a vote Monday to Sunday. Pick you're day of rest. I would pick Sunday because it was always on Sunday but if they picked Friday I'd have to accept it. At least then families would have one common day to spend together. What does the 21st Century have to do with anything?? I would think that our families would be first priority in the 21st Century!!

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby Um... I mentioned it was the 21st Century because YOU (and read it again, if you've forgotten what you wrote) that "this is the 20th Century". It really isn't, and hasn't been for nearly a decade.

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 but what is the 20th century supposed to be like? I would think that putting our families first would be a lot better than spending it in stores 24/7.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby Perhaps.  I'm SURE a child would understand something like "I'm sorry, Billy, but you can't have a cake because I didn't think ahead and buy TWO cartons of eggs. However, we can spend the day together, and that's what's important, right? "

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 A child has to learn from his parents right? A child may want candy but that doesn't mean the parents will give it to them. It's a small sacrifice to make. But it's worth it as it will give families time to be together. If we forget to get something with stores open six days and six nights, it's our own fault. We had the time and did not get the items. Time to give back to others who want to be home.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby Oh, I agree IF one doesn't buy something... But IF something dreadful happens (like dropping the milk or if - and yes, this happened to me) someone ELSE in the house decides to boild all the eggs - and of course put them back in the same carton so it LOOKS like there are lots of eggs), then there is a problem. But as I said in my previous post, I'm SURE a child will understand the situation, because children ALWAYS understand EVERYTHING, right?

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 we all have rules to abide by. It's called time management and seriously the world won't fold up because stores are closed for one day. Kids will be happy to have there mom and dad home on Sundays. BTW you can always by extra milk and eggs. It's called planning. As I pointed out before the power could go out. Or we could have a major snow storm. Then what would people do? They would survive!

[tclhoneyabby]

@shmuli9 Lets say that the public voted for Friday as the day to rest. Would you complain that it was the muslin day of rest and that we shouldn't have it? Aren't we humans any more that we need everything open day and night? I miss one day that we had a down time with no traffic and that families could spend time together. We all need that back.

[shmuli9]

@tclhoneyabby The question is: do people REALLY spend all day Sunday with their families? I don't think so, not even in Germany. After all, CINEMAS and restaurants are open on Sunday in Germany... What do you have to say about that? Supermarkets (at least) should be open on Sunday, to avoid those "oops, I dropped an entire carton of eggs" situations turning into "I could have spent 2 Euros for a carton of eggs, but I had to spend 30 Euros to eat at a restaurant"...

[Asperuaca]

Why are SDA's trying to make this seem like the end time prophecy?? This was already in their own constitution!!! I hate religious spin!!

[flythatbyme]

Wow ....I guess Jesus won't be shopping after church on Sunday...Since He won't shop on the Sabbath (saturday). ( this is a parody + your supposed to think about how controversial this would be if He acctually instituted these Laws in the first place) 4th Commandment " Remember The Sabbath Day to Keep it Holy...but which day is it really ? ? ? Bible said its the 7th day...Sunday is the first day ! Think about it ........

[GodLovesUs100]

oh no,

God have mercy on us all.

[TaberLion]

Evil Catholicism is on the rise once again enforcing satans false doctrine, as is evil islam.

[Jondadon2006]

The image is being formed

[SeatonRyan]

People will only understand these issues when the shoe is on the other foot : What ? you think because Adventists are challenged to work on Saturdays that we would want to Legally-LEGALLY-lock down people's retail and manufacturing, shipping on a Saturday ? No. Once more , I dare anybody to show me where the SDA church has sought to legally impose Saturdays on folk as if we wanted to turn the world into a Giant Israel by our Own works!

[SeatonRyan]

If stores in Germany were only allowed to open on ten SAMSTAGs (Saturdays) throughout the year excluding the four Saturdays leading up to Christmas, you'd protest , wouldn't u? No? w-what? oh because its the status quo & you would have to go with the flow? well hear wha...only dead fish go with the flow... , & ...as n Adventist , I can assure u that even if--IF-- stores were locked down in Germany on many Saturdays to honor Jews of the Holocaust in Germany , we would never support it --legally.

[CalicoatMaker]

Because everyone knows if you stop people from shopping on Sunday, they wont shop any other day.

Germany sure went to shit after WW2. All halfbreeds from russian & black-raped German women.

Sad, all the brainwashed idiots running Germany now.