The Mind in a Mythless Universe

[TheVisualOtaku]

13:15

We are animals

[Carmellito1]

I had an experience with mushrooms, high dose, where i actually joined this state you are talking of, where there is no thinking, but just feeling. I have been there several times. It`s like the mind is broken somehow. There is the knowledge of having the ability of thinking, but it isn`t possible. It feels dumb somehow and when the feeling is not liked this can be a hard thing. But it is possible to enter this state; i think, not only with mushrooms.

[tecnoblix]

This is only vaguely on topic, but did you see the latest Zeitgeist movie? And if so, what did you think of it?

[TWITfromURANUS]

Fred's Concept Soup.

Brought to you by Consciousness.

It does exactly what it says on the tin, man.

[cardellacole4]

you are the projection you are that perception as sub conscious vission, from the sub atomic the sub conscious as mind,,,, to the conscious atomic displayed as the real

[conferencereport]

@PostNeutral No problem. You don't remember the name of the documentary by any chance do you?

[conferencereport]

@PostNeutral Is this experiment about the Iowa Gambling Task video I did?

[jak1428]

oh. and i think the big bang theory says something like that there was a singularity in which matter and space time appeared at the same moment. it's only atoms that formed later on.

[jak1428]

sounds like some damasio story about a man who had a brain damage which made him loose emotions. he could still think clearly but didn't come to any decisions...

[conferencereport]

@jak1428 Phineas Gage was his name. Very interesting stuff

[jak1428]

@conferencereport oh. i read about the sad railway worker story as well. but this time i was refering to an interview i recently saw on foratv. the title is "Antonio Damasio: This Time With Feeling ". he talks about one of his still living patients in the 4th segment ("How Emotion Affects Decision-Making")

[conferencereport]

@jak1428 Oh yes, I saw that one. Really good I thought.

[HigherPlanes]

IMO, when you say that anesthesia can switch off consciousness, that's a tough statement to validate. There are two sides to that coin. Is consciousness a phenomenon that is tethered to the individual and uniquely separated from every other individual and reality. Or is consciousness a harmonic expression of the universe? With the latter, you see that it can never be switched off.

[conferencereport]

@HigherPlanes I've never seen any evidence that it's a harmonic expression of the universe.

[HigherPlanes]

@conferencereport Okay. Obviously conceptualizing consciousness is difficult. A box model is probably not the best way to look at it... where we have consciousness as a container with all conscious beings inside that container, but it does help me understand that there is a single phenomenon of consciousness in the universe, and when one human being ceases to exist, it does not shut down the phenomenon that is consciousness. Then again, I subscribe to the notion that the universe is linked.

[conferencereport]

@HigherPlanes Fair enough, thanks for fleshing that out for me.

[HigherPlanes]

@conferencereport No problem, my friend. Of course it's all just my opinion. But I'd like to hear your thoughts on this notion that we're all linked, that every proton in the universe is linked to every other proton, etc...

[conferencereport]

@HigherPlanes I don't know much about physics so I think I'd be out of my depth with that stuff.

[HigherPlanes]

@HigherPlanes Understandable. Insightful channel nonetheless.

[cardellacole4]

around its centre

[cardellacole4]

@cardellacole4 the dream was instantainious the dream was like love to divide and multiply,,thus bang

[cardellacole4]

before the begining there was nothing but thought but that thought was of nothing,,,,before the begining there was nothing but a centering but that centering was from nowhere,,, but then the thought began to dream ,,, but then the centre began to drift like sleep walk ,drift in its polarity

[endofthecosmos]

This, makes me remember when I went under General Anesthesia for surgery. I remember seeing a sort of form of Purgatory whiteness and felt like I'm floating in and out of consciousness and eventually time and my mind were out of place and this feeling was felt so surreal. I haven't forgotten it since. It feels way different from sleep. Very intriguing..

[wonderpope]

I recently watched a video by a guy called athenewins (he's well known on youtube for World of warcraft videos and together with his friends for internet neutrality activism). He made a video about consciousness in the context of the theory of everything (which he makes a proposition for): watch?v=dbh5l0b2-0o

I found it interesting. It doesn't state completely new and revolutionary things about conciousness but he has a very interesting take on it (and the video is very well crafted).

[invanorm]

12:25 Almost sounds like large doses of LSD. Sensation/emotions increases dramatically, rational thought and ability to wrestle with language dramatically decreased. I suppose with rationality decreased the subject will unwillingly experience irrational interpretations that are in some sense already latent with the object of experience, but are usually thrown away by the subconscious before it enters our awareness.

[conferencereport]

@invanorm I think you have something there. Certainly my experiences with LSD (a long time ago obviously) had that quality, although I would probably say that interpretations of all kinds tended to be suspended, not just the rational ones. I vividly remember experiencing the colour of grass, for example, in a way that felt 'direct', not accompanied by (and covered over with) the layers of interpretation that normal perception has.

[zarkoff45]

@conferencereport "Certainly my experiences with LSD (a long time ago obviously) had that quality..."

And then there is the possibility that such experiences, psychedelic and psychotic, become interpreted as religious experiences:

watch?v=WYY1PIRZF8g

[GeistWerk]

@zarkoff45 "And then there is the possibility that such experiences, psychedelic and psychotic, become interpreted as religious experiences"

the funny thing is that some experiences that are induced by spiritual practice like yogic meditation and breathing techniques are very similar to psychedelic experiences. the problem is that there is no way of deciding whether psychedelic experience are misinterpreted as spiritual or vice versa

[cardellacole4]

for me an atom is a centering of thought attention from the electron dream energy that revolves around it

[MrRobotoToo]

14:10 Great point about matter not always having been in the universe. Energy first made its appearance as various forms of radiation: massless particles all traveling at the speed of light. It was only after the breaking of certain symmetries that some of those particles acquired mass and became more recognizable forms of 'matter'.

[cardellacole4]

@MrRobotoToo massless particles, or centres of energy

[cardellacole4]

for me its not consciousness that is switched of, but the brains (matter)ability to respond (organise) to it, if you switch of a the brains light bulbs, the electrisity is still there in the house, but the connection to the bulbs has been interupted, the patient is not brain dead more in a deep induced sleep

[cardellacole4]

@cardellacole4 its perception thats turned of not consciousness

[invanorm]

@cardellacole4 I have a hard time separating the two, to the point where I'm at a loss as to how you can have one without the other.

[cardellacole4]

@invanorm its not a thought or a dream , consciousness is the energy that thoughts and dreams polarise out of into matter as laid down memmory as a brain, the problem is that the mind is an organised extension of personalised experience out of it , what jung calls a complex , an overall ballance, and people call this consciousness,when a baby is formed or born it is conscious, waiting to form a mind, consciousness is inherrent in brain matter,

[Saerain]

@cardellacole4 Being brain dead isn't simply not being conscious, it's lacking any brain activity at all.

It's very easy to reduce someone to an unconscious state, and general anesthesia is certainly one way in which it happens all the time.

[cardellacole4]

@Saerain where has the consciousness gone, has not the perception of it dissapeared, no perception nothing for it to be activated or messured by, all electrons neutrons and protons are still there, without them there is no brain , matter is formed by the atomic forces, when a dendrite is formed electrons neutrons and protons stream around the polaric fields in synchronisity with mind that is imagining , the sub atomic formations leaves a trace as memory

[cardellacole4]

@Saerain yes saerain i get what you said now