John Stowell - Melodic Minor Applications

[lukegreenhalgh225]

and lol at jiloch saying everyone only cares about the major scale modes.....u cant play jazz with just major scale modes

[brwnhornet59]

 You can but you need proper passing tones, which in effect gives you MM if you know what you are doing.

[lukegreenhalgh225]

Hey Danlovesnan, playing a c melodic minor will sound cool over a G7 cos essentially u r playing mixolydian b6,

1 2 3 4 5 b6 b7 works well either minor 2 5 1s as well

[danlovesnan]

hello, I have a question. If I play a Cmelodic minor on a G7 it sounds good, but if I play a Gsharp melodic minor it doesn't..isn't it strange? I was playing the Ab melodicMinor thinking of the triton substitution G7/D7b (C#7)...Have you got any idea?

[PattenDevin]

@danlovesnan If you play Ab Melodic Minor over G7 you get the altered extensions. Altered meaning, altered 9's and 5's. Ab Melodic minor consists of Ab the b9 of G7, Bb the #9 of G7, Cb/B the 3rd, Db #11, Eb b13, F b7, G root. So you get the sound of G7(b13,#11,#9,b9). Which is a really cool and jazzy sound. You could play C Melodic over G7 but I wouldn't, just because of the C, haha. But you can do what ever you want man, it's your solo

[brwnhornet59]

@PattenDevin If you are playing an unaltered V chord Myxo b6 sounds great. The C, (11), if played properly is treated as a passing tone. Over a V7b9 I love the sound of Dorian b9 as well.

I prefer playing the altered scale over the tritone of the V, which is Lydian b7, (tritone of G7 is Db7, Db lydian b7 is Ab MM), The #11,(G), is a beautiful lead into CM7.

[ihroch]

@danlovesnan Do you still have the problem?(; It depends on what kind of G7 you played it. C melodic minor gives you only one altered note, namely Eb (D#). Ab melodic minor, on the other hand, gives you all four altered notes. If you use it you wanna make sure some of those alterations are also present in the chord...

[jloch85]

best thing about the melodic minor scale is no one gives a shit it. the major scale and all of its modes are the only ones worth knowing.

[synth77]

@jloch85 Yeah but that one leading not (i prefer harmonic minor) makes all the difference you get diminished and augmented chords and is there was no minor scales all we would have is shitty pop songs :)

[andym87]

The people at the back look kinda bored...

[ArkRed1]

Interesting looking classical guitar. What brand is it?

[BlikeNave]

This is inspiring.

[TheJazzyFrenchman]

Melodic Minor is often played up the scale as Melodic Minor and back down as Natural Minor. It's weird and hard to do mentally, but it sounds sooo cool.

[synth77]

@TheJazzyFrenchman I don't know with songs that don't have ascending and descending scales its kinda hard to working into a song.

[scalethesummit]

so confused. trying to learn the arpeggio pharse that starts at 2:05. he says the arp structure is 1, b3, 5 and 7. But clearly plays a G, Ab in the beginning which is a 5 to b6. When the melodic minor arp doesn't have a 6 and if it did it would have to be a natural 6, not a b6. So lost. Anyone get what I mean?

[SonicArchives]

b6 is harmonic minor so he made a small mistake but probably would sound OK as a outside passing tone.

[whereamigoingnow]

@scalethesummit yes ,absolutely lol

[effsixteenblock50]

cm0220ster - Are there any audio / video examples of someone approaching a 12 bar blues in E in that manner? Curious....

[FFXGuitar]

@effsixteenblock50 work that V chord with the altered scale/melodic minor arpeggios

[cm0220ster]

For rock/blues guitarists wanting a fusion-y injection in their blues, memorize the A melodic minor shape. Play that scale over a 12 bar blues in E. Once you get that shape memorized, try moving the scale (shape) up to B and play that over the same E 12 Bar Blues. Try with going back and forth between those and the E pentatonic. Sometimes best used in short little licks and then followed up with the pentatonic. Rinse. Repeat. Once you have that down work on memorizing it all over the neck.

[highintel]

very cool...thank you..

i don't get why we use alphabet instead if numbers.

makes more sense to me when spoken like this,

Notes of D7 are 1-5-3-b7. Notes of A Melodic Minor are 1-2-b3-4-5-6-7-1. (Which is like a Dorian with a Major7)

then just put the 1 on the root or alphabet.

it seems unnatural to use letters instead of numbers. Looks a lot simpler this way.

I guess it makes it hard to see any relationship right?

[mattdogg86]

Yeah I probably should have started off saying that. I guess I was just trying to show how the chords set up the tonic of C melodic minor. It seems like anything you give the dominant to becomes the tonic. I am over analytical though. thanks for hearing me out! lol

[mattdogg86]

C melodic minor comes from Bb major. C Dorian is the second mode of Bb major. You create an aeolian dominant chord (G7) to give C Dorian a major 7th (B). the major 6th (A) is naturally in the mode. Harmonic minor is giving a Phrygian dominant (D7) to the G Aeolian mode to create the major 7th note of F#. the minor 6th is naturally in the mode.

[Drblooter99]

C melodic minor is not a mode of Bb major.

[mattdogg86]

C Dorian is the 2nd mode of Bb major. When you give the V chord in C Dorian a major 3rd you create C Dorian's V7 chord. C DEb F G ABb C are the notes that naturally occur in the mode. (C Dorian.) now...by giving C Dorian a V7 chord we RAISE the Bb to B natural...This gives us melodic minor...C melodic minor that is. That's where it comes from. Harmonic minor comes from giving Aeolian mode a V7 chord.

[Drblooter99]

Thanks, but I still do not quite get it. I understand that If you give a V7 chord to C Dorian, you get G7. But G7 does not contain Eb (#5/b6), so it cannot give C melodic minor. Please explain.

[mattdogg86]

We're in the key of Bb major. The key of Bb has two flats. Bb and Eb...To get C melodic minor all you are doing is raising the third of the V chord in C dorian (which contains Bb and Eb) ..from G min to G7. This is the G7 Aeolian dominant of Bb major. Keep in mind we're not talking the G7 Mixolydian dominant of C major. The notes go C DEb F G A BC. The G7 chord would have a b13 though which is (Eb). We're not in C major. we're in C melodic minor. Does that help?

[Drblooter99]

Yes, I see now thanks. We're in Bb major, We take the II degree, C Dorian (Dm7).

We take the 5th mode of C Dorian and raise its 3rd. Thus Bb is replaced by B while Eb remains. So we get a dominant G7 with a b13, which implies the tonic C melodic minor.

Instead of all this rigmarole, why not just think: raise the b7 of C Dorian to a natural and get C melodic minor!!!

[musimath]

You can think of melodic minor as a major scale with a minor third ... if you vamp on a D7 chord, you can use A melodic minor. C7 with G melodic minor, Bb7 with F melodic minor, ect... but no, it is not a mode of Bb major.

[highintel]

how do you play A Melodic minor over D7? Wouldn't it have to be a D7#11 or D7 with diminished 5th or raised 4th? The 5th in D7 is the Maj7 in A Melodic minor right?

This shit makes no sense to me....I'm going back to neo-classical...lol

[cm0220ster]

Notes of D7 are D-A-F#-C. Notes of A Melodic Minor are A-B-C-D-E-F#-G#-A. Notes the dominant 7 chords in this are from the fourth and fifth degrees of the scale (in A, D7 and E7). To get the sounds of this, and a good place to start for rock guitar players is to record a Vamp of say A minor and d7, or Am E7. Or simply an E7 vamp or D7 vamp. Try that first if you are primarily a rock or blues guitarist to get the feel of this scale and give you something to practice with. Very fusion-y.

[DomFuriani]

@Drblooter99 he didn't say that c melodic minor was related to Bb major.

[Nickiefive]

@Drblooter99 no its not.

[JazzmanJibilla]

His left hand is beautiful to watch. Very elegant.

[KeithWhalen11]

Simply amazing! Great teaching, playing and sound!

[VW421]

WOW! John Stowell and Sid Jacobs occassionally play at a club I frequent. Unfortunately, to my knowledge, never together. That would be WAY amazing.

[area51restroom]

John you the man!

[bluemonk82]

What I love about John Stowell and this goes for Ben Monder and Bill Frisell is that they're harmonically adventurous players.

Being into chords and chordal voicings is what Stowell so unique. Most jazz players want to rip scales all day long, but John isn't like that at all. He is harmonically driven, which ultimately makes his music more enjoyable or at least for me.

Yes, he does talk fast, but most geniuses can't possibly tell you what's going on inside their head.

[bungNik]

John is a really really nice guy and low profile also..he's a great human being..i had the chance to study with him for a while. :)

[zebopper]

Wow - what a cool guitar! What kind of guitar is that - anyone know the make? John Stowell seems like a nice low key guy, too.

[ShrimpCatProductions]

It's a Doolin, custom. It doesn't really sound like it, but it's actually running through two amps. And yeah, John is a really nice guy. That bit about him talking too fast is totally true though, his brain works too fast.