While I may not always agree with the good doctor's delivery, there is no denying the truth of his words and the eloquent way he handled the two directors. It was like a father explaining his two sons to the rest of the family. Well done Dr. West.
Shame on you Dr. West. You turned a teachable moment into another form of "black" on "black" crime. Perry said it best when he said that blacks have been doing this to each other for as far back as Booker T. Washington. We work against each other. It doesn't always have to be political but given the current political climate, everything we do is political. From what we wear, to what we say, everything is understood as political. Dr. West, you could have done better here, but you failed.
@09Lucas01 HOW DOES WHAT WE WEAR HAVE TO DEAL WITH POLITICS? AND WHO CONTROLLED THOSE BLACKS THAT TORE OTHER BLACKS DOWN DURING OOKER T. WASHINGTON ERA? BE HONEST ABOUT IT.. THOSE HOUSE SLAVES THAT WERE TELLING ON RUN AWAY SLAVES WHO WERE THEY WORKING FOR? YOU ARE THE ONE WHO FAILED YOU ARE AFRAID TO SEE THE TRUTH WHEN ITS RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR FACE.. CAN YOU TELL ME ANY MOVIE TYLER PERRY DOES THAT TRUELY DEALS WITH THE BLACK STRUGGLE? ALL TYLER MOVIES CANT COMPARE TO ONE OF SPIKES MOVIE
That's his opinion. If being great means stupid films and less money then I want to be good like Tyler Perry. Everybody has an opinion, and this is Dr. West opinion.
@EagleEyeGolfer, u r incorrect about white actors n what AA's are going out 2 c. I see them n the movies they pay 4. The same way Spike was alleging that theatres were providing tickets 2 other movies when his were hitting the screen several years back. My point was simply, Spike did not pave the way, Bill Duke opnd the door 4 Spike. Tyler has provided some movies with content. His plays were "chitterling circut". We can agree to disagree, I am fine with that.
@samlammo, please see my previous post to JimBowie1133. I believe that Tyler Perry's life speaks volumes about where we may often find too many African Americans, but his example offers a solution. One of many. He took an idea, the risk of believing in himself even when conventional wisdom might suggest otherwise, and took appropriate action to implement his plans and turn his dreams into reality. It's the American dream personified. I'd rather learn his methods than dump on his work.
@JimBowie1133, I agree that there are a good number of things that is wrong with our society. I believe that the only way to be represented positively in all avenues is represent ourselves instead of looking to others to do it for us. A great physicist might suck at being a comedian. Does that lessen his contribution to society? Not if his one burning desire is to be a physicist. All I'm saying is instead of being critical of how one man paints pictures why not pick up our own brush and paint.
I respect what Dr West has to say, but I disagree. I don't believe that every African American has to be a verbal spokesperson for our social and political condition in America. His life does that by default. I applaud Mr Perry's ability to use the tools available to him to achieve success in terms that he can accept. They are two different type of directors. Both have their place in engraved in history as such. We don't try to make Jerry Seinfeld grow to be Bill Mahr do we?
@celtee066 It is clear that the African American community is not in good condition. We are disproportionately jailed, unemployed and killed in America. So, who is going to stand up for the black community? It must be the people with the power and influence from the black community who can make a difference. Tyler Perry definitely fits that roll.I agree with Dr. West. Its now time for him to grow up and make some real art that's socially conscious or at least help some young filmmakers do that.
@celtee066 , i understand, but its a lot different for blacks because of general lack of representation. Whites have much more balance in terms of media portrayal.
Tyler focus has been on restoring relationships. That's whats in him . Spike- social problems. that's what's in him..No one should be pressured to do anything that they are not creatively inspired to do.I respect Dr. West , he want's to stir up a healthy competition,but every things not a debate. I thought being original was good .Granted Blk man have dressed up as women b4, but some churches sweep issues under a rug. the education on "relationship basics" is needed.
I listen to Cornell West all the time on the radio. I've seen every Spike Lee movie. And, though I don't care for Tyler Perry''s work that much, I have an enormous amount of respect for him. It's good dialogue and necessary for intellectual purposes of not so much defining what must be or not be represented by a race, but rather feeling confident about representing all the different genres to a race. I mean really, Spike, it's like comparing Abbott & Costello to Saving Private Ryan. S'all ok
on some real shit what the fuck does Cornell west do for the community except for pontificate he teaches at Princeton so he not really helping anybody from the community he is just another typical armchair black revolutionary
@tsteph217 Well for one the role of government. He was on a tv show recently asking what is the government going to do for poor people and the government cant do anything legally beside have a strong economy. He was looking for the government to create or take wealth from someone else and give it to them. The economy is another thing and politics is also another one.
@lilsm555 ITS NOT THE GOVERNMENT ROLE TO GIVE MONEY TO POOR BLACKS.. BECAUSE IF THAT WAS THE CASE THE GOVERNMENT WOULDNT GIVE MONEY TO ANYONE INCLUDING WHIT NATIONS SUCH AS ISREAL TO STOCKPILE WEAPONS ITS AMAZING TO ME HOW WHEN ITS TIME TO DO FOR THE PEOPLE THAT AMERIKKKA HAS OPPRESSED THE MOST ITS NEVER THEIR JOB AND THEN THEY FIND SILLY NEGROS TO AGREE... THE GOVERNMENT TAKES WEALTH EVERYDAY DIDNT THEY TAKE THIS LAND? DIDNT THEY TAKE A LAND AND GIVE IT TO WHITES IN ISREAL.
@tsteph217 No its him. Just because he is a famous teacher or w/e does not mean he is rational and intelligent dont get me wrong hes a very nice guy and means well but that just means he did his work like a good zombie in school. He is very wrong about the role of government. You need to go and learn about the role of government and why the government is so fucked up. Maybe stop watching mainstream news which is owned by corporations and stop coming up with solutions that are illegal.
@lilsm555 ACTUALLY IF HE WAS TRUELY A ZOMBIE HE WOULD BE LIKE BILL COSBY AND OBAMA AND LARRY ELDER... BUT HE CHOOSES TO TELL THE TRUTH... YOU DIDNT ADRESS ANYTHING I SAID ABOUT AMERIKKKA GIVING AWAY MONEY TO HELP WHTE FOLKS WHY NOT? DOESNT THE GOVERNMENT TAKE WEALTH EVERYDAY? YES OR NO? DONT THEY TAKE LAND? YES OR NO AND WHO DO THEY GIVE THOSE LAND TO? AND WHAT NEWS DO IT WATCH? SINCE YOU SEEM TO KNOW SO MUCH... AND JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE MAKIN UNFOUNDED ACCUSATIONS DOESNT MEAN U ARE RATIONAL
@tsteph217 Bro i know its hard to understand that the guy you have been following for a while really doesnt know shit about politics or the role of government. He tells the truth from a ignorant perspective. THE GOVERNMENT CANNOT create wealth and give it to poor people like he suggested. They do take wealth and give it to other people today and that is exactly part of the reason this country is fucked up and maybe you guys should recognize the problem instead of being mouth breathers.
@lilsm555 wow u seem to know alot about what i wartch and who i follow for how long.. how long have i been following the man? answer plz... how is he telling it from an ignorant perspective when everything you claim the government cant do i gave you examples of them doing it... havent i? can it be that they have been takin money and only givin it to the 1%... you just admitted this that they gave money and take it.. and it did not just start happening...oh and what news do i watch again?
First Spike was not the conscious of AA film industry.First check your history. Gordon Parks,
Carl Franklin, Melvin Van Peebles and Oscar Micheaux. Spike has done some things, but he also provided us with some mess. So, Tyler is making his way. You have to build your "bank" because Hollywood does not strongly fund and WE dont support AA movies. We will bootleg them and/or not go out to spend our money to support them. But we will spend the dollars on the next young white actor and their movie.
@flipovergirl "But we will spend the dollars on the next youg white actor and their movie". Speak for yourself. Please name for me the last "white actor" we spent our money on? We are talking about movies... not the music industry. If you had said Justin Bieber then you would have a point, because this kid is getting treated like Elvis and The Beetles AND HE'S NOT EVEN AN AMERICAN. You may not like what Spike has to say but you can't deny his place in history and as a pioneer.
Mr. Cornel West speaks the truth. Who will listen? Will Tyler Perry listen? Will Clifton Powell listen? I said it once and I'll say it again: if there was no Spike Lee there would be no Tyler Perry. Mr. Perry, don't let the money blind you bruh. There were those who came before you and you need to respect those that paved the way for you Tyler Perry. Clifton Powell is just a damn ignorant fool. He shows no respect for Spike Lee who IS a pioneer and has paved the way for many todays black actors.
@EagleEyeGolfer: AMEN!!! I agree. My mom and I were debating this because she loves the 'Madea' movies, but I haven't seen any of them because as a Masters degree educated Black woman, I feel that it's common day coonery. Straight up. His other movies, like 'Why Did I Get Married?' and 'I Can Do Bad By Myself' were cool. But overall, Spike is much deeper and has more political content. Spike makes you think things over in your head after watching one of his movies. One love!!
@EagleEyeGolfer I'm pretty sure Tyler perry is a christian.That means the only person that he will be paying homage to for his gifts and talents is Jesus Christ .Please Correct me if I totally missed the mark on this one?
@coliwood OH please! Leave that brotha alone! So much divisiveness in the black community! His films/characters are just NOT FOR YOU! It's a sad thing when our embarrassment of our people outweighs the love for our people ...Tyler has good intentions w/ his films, even if you don't believe he is the best director ...I look at a brothas INTENTIONS ...He, also, has good intentions for his community, offering jobs to black actors and blacks who would go overlooked by Hollywood..so, it aint worf it
@Lashid4u The Road to hell is paved with good intentions. It is not the intent that matters, it is the consequences of the actions. Perry's movies, are as Spike put it, are "Connery Bafoonery". His movies are poorly produced, written, directed, and they are repetitive. Everyone of them is like a 2 hours special of "Good Times" What you have to realize is that we have we live in a community. Perry casts a negative light on all blacks.
@coliwood Okay ...First, I wanna ask your definition of "coonery" ...Second, I want to you to tell me the negative effects of his films ...and third, I have a video titled "STOP WORRYING ABOUT BEING STEREOYPED!" that I'd like for you to check out, if you get the chance ("Good Times" is my all-time fav tv series, btw)
@coliwood Now, I think Spike's the better director ..but I'm not gonna say that his movies have more of a positive influence ...I remember seeing "She's Gotta Have it", when I was 12, and the perception it gave me of how women should view their sexuality..it was confusing, cuz this character was sexing fellas left & right, but she was highly intelligent...she was, actually, a Jezebel stereotype ...and "She Hates Me" which is Spike, obviously, giving us his fantasy, w/ this "black buck" character
@coliwood .and should I even mention "Girl 6"? So, who is Spike to try to claim that Tyler has any more of a negative influence?..Even with Malcolm X..Before its release, there was all this hype over a new, black nationalist movement ..young blacks were wearing X caps, listening to X-Clan, and going to hear Farrakhan speak...but the movie gave an unfair view of the NOI (as if they were, primarily, behind Malcolm's murder), pushing blacks away from the movement...by 93, they were on the "Chronic"
Tyler & Spike need to continue to do what each is best at, entertaining us. Ultimately, one needs to continue on the path of what one excels at, and if that is generates income, then all the more to it. I wish both men success in their respective endeavor, Spike is from the 1990s and Tyler is from 2000s. So let's celebrate Tyler's newly found niche, making black people reflect on their grandmas' and moms' behavior. After all, Black people have more resident grandmas & moms than grandpas & paps.
black people always try to put one against the other. let spike do spike. and let tyler do tyler. there only a few blacks in holliwood anyway tha doing way spike and tyler do
tyler perry aint nothing but a big country ass nigga thats how country ass nigga think in 2011 they think that mess is entertaining or art I bet the white tv executives had no problem in encouraging tyler to make films like that,oh! by the way I just move to new orleans 6 months ago from chicago and that tyler perry mentality is live and well down here.
Why as black people must we project the idea that we are a single unit? Each person is an individual. Some folks like to see The Browns. I watch it myself sometime. I also love Spike Lee flicks. If you want to see socially conscious subject manner watch Lee. Tyler never suggested that he was socially conscious in his art. Spike is. I think Perry has a more universal approach with his movies. Spike set out to be for "the people". Lighten up folks we are not ALL Malcolm X ALL of the time.
@erfbgu "Tyler never suggested that he was socially conscious in his art. " Um actually he did. All of his movies are socio-political, that's the point.
@erfbgu To use a medical metaphor, Spike is looking at what the Black race (patient) needs for uplifting and health and he believes the diet should be changed to more whole grains, vegetables and water, and less dessert, candy, and soda pop. Consuming occasional dessert, candy, or soda pop is fine, we all enjoy them. But the bulk of our sustenance should be enrichment, otherwise not only will the patient's health not be uplifted, it deteriorates, like trends we see in poverty, jail, drop outs
@DreamsCumTrue469 I understand Spike Lee. Questions for you though, 1-who says that everyone wants enrichment when viewing a movie or that they even want it at all? 2-Who says that Tyler Perry's work cannot empower folks and for the arguments sake, black folk particularly? Perry always has an underlining positive message in his work - messages that promote wellness for all people not just blacks. I've always had a sense of pride for my race but real talk we have to rise above this race stuff.
Our outside appearance is just a container. Who you are is much more predicated on what you are inside. And this isn't to say that race isn't a problem...its obvious it is. But maybe its time folks change their perspective. But back to the issue. I've always liked many of Spike's films, but I think it wouldn't be a stretch to say that he in a way reinforces the fear and anxiety in people, mostly blacks and whites with a good number of his films. But I'm not knocking that.
...one more thing. Tyler, you should have kept Madea's Big Happy Family as a play. You put way too much emphasis on that "hood rat" stereotype. Although, it's EXTREMELY funny. But, the reason it's funny is b/c well, I'm not a ghetto, loud-mouth, baby mama who whines when she speaks. So, I wonder how the chicks that ARE that way felt? Hm.
Anyhoot. Diary Of A Mad Black Women is still my favorite. And I love the ending in Family Reunion.
I think Perry & Lee BOTH make socially conscious movies, however, Spike's delivery seems to go over alot of Black folks heads. Which is one of the things I love about his writing. It's subtle, yet definitive. Perry doesn't allow the audience to figure it out for themselves. Whoever does the writing for the sitcom Meet The Browns, please tell them that we don't need the punchline EXPLAINED to us every time someone cracks a joke. If Mr. Brown says something incorrectly...LEAVE IT BE!
why cant each man make the kind of movies that he wants. spike makes social conscious movies and tyler makes whatever movie he makes. not downing tyler. but each man is great at that which he does and in the way he does it. do they have to take the same path to greatness.
Spike did the right thing regardless of how it was delivered, what everyones forgotten is that it was one of the BET employees whose brought up Tyler Perry. Here watch?v=Ciwhh3fB6vE&feature=related @ 0:58 NOT SPIKE LEE; REGARDLESS. Cornel makes more sense in his delivery on the subject matter.
I do feel that both men are speaking from different places. My relatives from the east coast REALLY DO think that the way we behave, think and speak in the south is a bad reflection on the race especially when we come from the rural areas in the south. Also, African American Muslims do appear to look at every act as either for or against the race. By the same token, Mr. Lee is a legend in our culture and his opinion should be respected if not agreed with.
Muhammad Ali became the most famous person on Earth because he was forced to relinquish the heavyweight title as a result of taking a principled stand refusing to serve in the Vietnam War. He wasn't famous becasue he got rich. He told America where to get off, and which exit to take.
@2112murphy I agree with you, some people think greatness only deals with big budget films with special effects and high paid actors and actresses. I don't subscibe to that, because Spike Lees films are timeless, have deep messages in them, and he has made alot of block buster stars..Spike Lee is a Genius and great film maker, true indeed.
I couldn't hear a word the Dr said because people in the audience kept trying to sounds smart by interrupting and going YEAH. THATS RIGHT. YEAH. THATS RIGHT.
I love Tyler! I don't think they're hattn on Tyler Perry. Its just with more fame there can be more power. Tyler Perry has potential to be a very powerful film maker and help break away the African American stereotypes. Lately his films and shows are the same or Mediocre and very stereotypical. After a while it gets kinda old and not as funny. It almost make him seem lazy. He should slow down and really put something together that's amazing and seriously showcases his wonderful talent.
Why does anyone continues to pay this quack and psuedointellectual any attention? He has absolutely nothing of any importance to say as it relates to black empowerment, and the fact that he is wasting his time and energy making excuses for Tyler Perry the koonery king proves this point. The true leaders of the black community are the positive black business owners, engineers, scientist and mathematicians, the people who have the knowledge and skills to actually build and empower a people.
Yall Please this is a shame. We need to all get a clue. We are all diff they are insulting anyone who love Tyler Perry Movies. Please subscribe to my channel so we can all grow laugh learn how to love each other. Love Yall
I support Tyler but on the real ALL of his movies make brothers look grimey. Spike can care less if his movies are box office hits and I respect that because that is true artistry. Tyler will come around one of these days.
@tyler2june How can you say his movies make black men look bad? We have good black men, we have bad black men. I really dont have a problem with Tyler Perry....I just think Spike Lee is jealous of him because hes not making money anymore and Tyler has taken over. Comedy is comedy and I like Madea...I think Tyler needs to do something different because Madea is getting old, but I wish the brutha much success.
@Xziau1 well his movies are "black movies" and in every movie, women are being tortured by black men, in some way or form, so for that reason, someone who's not black, watches these black movies and it just seems like black men are really bad to black women. just like in that one movie when that drunnk guy dropped his girlfriends kids out the window. For colored girls. i mean that is so unrealistic but his movies are suppose to be serious, he seems like he always on female side, he dresses up 2
@tyler2june I see your point of view. I think the character Will Brown is a positive black man. I also think all of the black men in the movie "The Family that Preys" were positive black men. The black men in that movie were hardworking and they did not cheat on their wives.
For Colored Girls is a dark movie. Everyone in that movie had issues including the black women LOL...
I am very aware but with all due respect most black people are so far removed from Africa I find it silly to even try to compare any struggles to those of the slaves and the generations after them. I have had the history drilled into me I know it was hard for them all the more reason to pull together and support each other am I correct?
I feel Spike Lee needs to find a corner somewhere and sit his ass down. I appreciate his movies like School Daze and Crooklyn, but fall back. As for Tyler Perry that's my dude and I can look at Madea over and over again.
@Limekiln You are a hateful person and really prove my point thanks. At any rate I forgive you for your hateful remarks and youre right not just black folks snipe each other everyone does it it just shows up more in black people. I have struggled more than black or white people will ever know or understand yet I love everyone unconditionally I am just sad that instead of helping words are hurting. I hope you can be color blind soon you need to be.
@TheBlackSpiralDancer i am not hateful in the least but you are blind if you don't realize what hurtful, hateful things you said in both your comments. i'm sorry you have suffered but you have NOT suffered more than the africans who were ripped from their homelands,marched sometimes over 100 miles on foot,baptized then loaded and chained to the bottom of rat and maggot infested slave ships,and brought here to suffer the worst kind of chattel known to man! ....
@TheBlackSpiralDancer would kill hundreds who had nothing to do with it! just to teach the others not to buck the system! it was torture,terror an mental conditioning that is unprecidented in human history. if they found out that you were trying to learn to read you and whoever was suspected of teaching you were dead.but still we rose. but not without scars! the type you see manifested today in our turning on eachother and sparing the white christian order its due blame!
cornell west is a loudmouth bitch! who should be speaking out against spike lee and his sad sack cant win, bad end low life portrayals of blacks! what a bitch spike is! his movies have done nothing to uplift the black condition in america
@Limekiln71 , you're wrong, at the time of Spike Lee films black people were more conscious of their history and position society - Malcolm X, Jungle Fever, Do the Right Thing- are classic genius films that did uplift the black condition. Tyler Perry movies are nothing but a damn minstrel show, a coon show.
@JimBowie1133 tell me what was uplifting to the black condition in jungle fever and do the right thing? if i'm not mistaken myself, my family and most of my friends were and still are african american and NONE of us found any of those films anything but one dimensional garbage. as far as malcom x goes, i am a muslim and i found it to be empty, shallow and full of inaccuracies. examp=when he was put into jail and disrespected by the whites he was in real life 15 yrs old.
@JimBowie1133 tell me what was uplifting to the black condition in jungle fever and do the right thing? if i'm not mistaken myself, my family and most of my friends were and still are african american and NONE of us found any of those films anything but one dimensional garbage. as far as malcom x goes, i am a muslim and i found it to be empty, shallow and full of inaccuracies. examp=when he was put into jail and disrespected by the whites he was in real life 15 yrs old.
@JimBowie1133 tell me what was uplifting to the black condition in jungle fever and do the right thing? if i'm not mistaken, myself, my family and most of my friends were and still are african american and NONE of us found any of those films anything but one dimensional garbage. as far as malcom x goes, i am a muslim and i found it to be empty, shallow and full of inaccuracies. examp, when he was put into jail and disrespected by the whites he was in real life 15 yrs old.
@JimBowie1133 heres another stupid but little noticed thing he chose "shot gun" as the theme song for the movie! "shot gun!" whose lyrics go "shot gun! shoot him fo he run now! shoot em down baby!" for the movie malcom x! the movie about a great civil rights leader who was shot to death with shot guns! how dumb is that?!
Give an asshole a microphone and he thinks hes a pro movie critic. Only black folks tear into each other like this. Im so tired of it I am ashamed to be half black. Tyler Perry talks more about family and how life can be screwed up and he lightens the experience with characters like Madea. I know life isnt rainbow and sunshine all the time but its not all dismal either. You have to laugh to heal. All these jokers wanna hate, I have one question, WHY?
@TheBlackSpiralDancer fuck your half black ass!! if this incident makes you ashamed of your "black half" then we don't need you! go be white because as we all know they are "perfect" and don't display and jealousy or hatred toward anyone. they are just little angels without wings. go dye your hair blond and scrub real hard with bleach and maybe you can forget the part you are ashamed of. meanwhile i and others like me will fight on since we can't opt out of who we are.
@TheBlackSpiralDancer they then began a cycle in this country of life as persona non grata. you are nothing but a piece of property to be raped on a whim, beaten, murdered, your children sold or given away like a litter of puppies. no redress in court for over 240 years! pit against eachother by your white christian captors for the yellowish hughe of your skin or the deep mocha tone you were designated "house" or "field". if you revolt and there were many the militias would kill hundreds not ..
@TheBlackSpiralDancer they then began a cycle in this country of life as persona non grata. you are nothing but a piece of property to be raped on a whim, beaten, murdered, your children sold or given away like a litter of puppies. no redress in court for over 240 years! pit against eachother by your white christian captors for the yellowish hughe of your skin or the deep mocha tone you were designated "house" or "field". if you revolt and there were many the militias would kill hundreds not
Tyler Perry is a disgusting Fag that dresses up like a Bitch because White People LOOVE to see a Black Man in a Dress Dave Chappelle talked about Hollywood trying to put him in a Dress but Chapelle had dignity. Almost every Black Actor must at some point in his career put on a Dress or play a Homo. Denzel Washington's first movie was Carbon Copy where he plays a Homo. White people love Homosexuality from Greece-America.Dave Chappelle left Hollywood for a damn good reason,,to keep his soul.
We cannot compare apples and oranges. Spike Lee emphasizes the racist bullshit in his work. Tyler Perry emphasizes the the patriarchic bullshit in his work. Both attempt to give voices to the voiceless. Abused women and Gays are no less important than abused Blacks and browns. We should all try to accept our innate equality and move on.
@Magnesiumfire good point, but where do you draw the line on buffoonery, because racist whites love the madea thing. Some blacks love it, but some are still conditioned to say the N word too. Should a message get out by any means necessary<(ha, ha didn't realize the X quote), or does the messenger put that out in a less buffoonery type way? Striking up the debate since we are talking about it.
@whoelseknows Not so useful to track what others love, aren’t they likely to fall for anything? Don’t others, occasionally, lie? More useful to keep sight of your love, isn’t that all we really CAN know? I don’t tend to draw lines in the sand, but I’ll know bullshit when I see it. It’s about what the heart knows more than about what the mind thinks. A racist can always find a way to exploit any rule, but racism cannot comprehend the heart: a racist doesn’t acknowledge the pain of other races.
Dr. West brings an excellent point between Lee and Perry. If you come from less than stellar background more oftern you will pretty much sell your soul to become famous and rich than someone from an "bougouise" background who can afford to more political and social conscious and isn't doing for the "money". I like Tyler but you can only do so many single parent, abused, and molested shows until it becomes tiresome. Not every black person like myself went through any of those things....
I don't understand why others don't understand how it is important for black america to take control of their image. The image of black america today exploits and ignores far more positive aspects of of our history, and culture that destroy most of the stereotypes (mature) black american have to carry as a burden throughout their lives.
Whenever black people have a conversation on this guy, 2 things come out:
1. Arrogance
2. Homophobia
Both worse than Madea. Ya'll really need to get over urselves. u have no reason to be arrogant and homophobia is stupid. Regardless if you're Christian, you are not of such a high caliber that you can rightfully judge the next man/woman b/c his/her sexual orientation is not the same as yours'. And no i don't think Tyler is gay, I just see he has a tendency to bring self-righteous homophobes out.
"That's right, the people don't come because you grandiose motherfuckers don't play shit that they like. If you played the shit that they like, then people would come, simple as that." ~Shadow Henderson (Wesley Snipes), Mo' Better Blues
CW is a trip. He just don't care, he's gonna do him. For all the ppl who criticize spike he is not God, but sitting around laughing & showcasing the lowest denomination of our race has never gotten us anywhere. Political consciousnes is what has always allowed us progress. As long as we perpetuate bofoonery we will continue to struggle. Some may get rich but many will be left behind.
This is some bullshit! We as black people are always talking shit and trying to bring other black people down as soon as they become successful. Leave Tyler Perry alone and let him do his thing. Spike Lee is not God!!! We need to support our people not keep bringing them down.
Cornell talking that where we come from stuff. He is from Sac, Cali and just wants to be upper class East Coast so he caters to them. Cornell is smart always smart, smart enough to fool people that he actually knows about every black enough to pick who we are to regard or not. Perry is not the Soulja Boy of film, his plays and movies are constructed in an entertaining way to convey messeges like Spike did in the day. Spike had the same criticism and some same critcs when he was rolling strong.
This "division" points at the viewpoint that Black Americans haven't "made it" far enough to laugh at themselves. White people laugh at themselves all the time without compunction. Most black people, when in reflective mode, feel we need to put a more politically active intellectual face out in the mainstream while laughing at each other behind closed doors. The sad thing is these people may be correct.
@NATSUNPRESIDENT Wow I'm looking at my old post and it's muddy as hell. If put succinctly, I say that most educated Black Americans feel that Black Americans haven't "made it far" enough in America to allow themselves to be seen laughing at themselves publicly i.e. liking Tyler Perry movies.
Example: I believe the average American non-Black believes Tyler's movies are silly and that black people sure like to go to movies that feature Black people in over-the-top-silly roles. There is some
@aceirmada Thank you, that is exactly how I feel about this issue. Minorities do not have a enough footing in Hollywood to be laughed at so freely. White people on the other hand have prestigious cinema going back the 1940's which is likely why Perry's works are criticized more harshly than something like National Lampoon's Whatever.
Why do we have to put division among each other? I have been the recipent of so many crazy non-sense movies done by directors e.g. Mean Girls, Bill and Ted Adventure....and the like....they are just silly movies to make u laugh. Why can't we have serious, funny, divine, intellectual and even silly? Why must every movie represent every black person? We are diverse. . . Tyler represents only one facet of one man's thoughts....let someone else tell a story.
(cont.) About the black people vs. niggas argument. When Tyler makes a movie where the black people aren't coons the movie doesn't make as much money as the Madea movies......that's a reflection on us. There's still too many of us who like being niggas and have no interest in being black. Chris Rock said it so perfectly in his classic routine on this issue. Type in "Black People vs. Niggas" on Youtube and he explains it way better and funnier than I ever could
When Tyler makes a movie where the black people aren't coons the movie doesn't make as much money as the Madea movies......that's a reflection on us.<-FALSE! The movies w/ less "cooning" have an audience less diverse. So it says less about "us" collectively and more about the perceptions that OTHERS have of us, so get it right. if anyone supports the movies that DON'T make us "look like coons" it IS US.
@DivinelyMochaDipped If by diverse you mean racial, that's not a factor. Tyler has a near zero white audience base, his success is totally based on black people going to his movies. Whites are not going to the theater to see Madea and Mr. Brown movies, or any of Tyler's movies for that matter. The Madea and Mr. Brown movies have black people and niggas going to see them (mostly niggas), the movies without Madea and Brown mostly have black people going to see them (almost no niggas).
@iamtryinglord Are you in every movie theater in the country? For Perry to have accumulated the fortune he has it is definitely many white people going to his movies. The entertainment industry (movies) are targeting the white teenage male. Have you noticed the behaviors of this group now a days? The even call eachother nigger. If you were to look at the top 10 grossing movies in history you will find the majority are children's movies and the others are films designed to get white males.
@DivinelyMochaDipped (Pt.2) Your point about how "Others" see us is an interesting one. As quiet as it's kept, Tyler is backed by Rueben Cannon and Assoc. It's a major film distribution company, they can get a movie on 1000 or more movie screens without blinking. No other black filmaker can get anywhere near that exposure, isn't interesting that Tyler can? The filmaker that has coonin' buckdancing negroes in a bunch of his movies has the most exposure of any black filmaker EVER!!
@DivinelyMochaDipped (Pt. 3) How come Spike doesn't get that level of exposure like Tyler? Or John Singleton? Or F. Gary Gray? No black filmaker gets the exposure that Tyler does and Tyler's movies too often depict black people in a way that the "Others" like to see their negroes, Ignorant and Happy.
There are still too many powerful white people in the movie business that don't like to see black people as real people.......they prefer to see niggas and coons
I agree with most if not all of Spike's criticism but I don't "go in" on Tyler as much as others for this reason. It's a classic case of black people vs. niggas, when Tyler makes a movie with Madea or Leroy Brown and other coonery type characters, niggas show up in droves and some black people show up also. But when Tyler makes a movie where the black people are fly and educated, niggas are nowhere to be found but black people show up at the theatre.
Milton Berle and Jonathan Winters (both white) performed in drag their entire careers. I never heard any criticisms about them. What's up with all this focus on how Tyler Perry does his act? I don't even recall all this haterade being thrown at Flip Wilson (Jeraldine). We don't need the klan to hold us back. We're doing a fine job all by ourselves.
@mxj1665 Milton Berle, Jonathan Winters and Flip Wilson are comedians. It's not unusual for male comics to dress up in drag. Perry is a director, please tell me other directors that dress up in woman's clothing in thier movies.
His statements are ignorant. Ignorance because he does not know Tyler Perry personally to make these assumptions. How dare he say he has not been educated. Education does not just depend on economic background. Tyler Perry educates about abuse, surrendering to a God and forgiveness. Spike Lee hasn't been great since "Malcolm X".
@missVeemack You don't need to know someone to know they are doing wrong. If i kill someone for no reason at all this is wrong. Wearing drag hurts the psyche of young boys and girls. do you think it's a coincidence out of the limited movies of us on the wide screen and t.v you have all these demasculanted black men, big momma's house, white girls, norbit, sha nene, wanda. It is not coincidence this is what hollywood approves for our men in film. oh there's another one pardon the pun!
@kingmu1 i dont mean any disrespect but thats kinda bullshit. big mommas house, white girls, sha nene, norbit and so on and so forth were spawned from the minds of black creators and black audiences eat it up. you can't blame hollywood for that. if black people didn't approve these pictures and characters would not be successful. if blacks want something different they have to put their money on something different, it's as simple as that.
@0utthe0ther They are spawned from black creators but everything and i mean everything made has to be green lighted by the powers that be in movie and t.v industry like producers, movie companies. They like to green light buffonery like this because it denigrates consciously and subconsciously the psyche of our people especially children. Who said our people were smart in there movie and t.v choices. They are 400 years into the demoralization, terrorism and subculture of former slave masters.
@kingmu1 and what's most harmful to the community is not a man on stage in drag no matter what his color, it's the neglect of children by their parents. when parents aren't there to direct their kids lives then they open the door for others to do so and others could be a man in drag, a thug with agun, a racist, a whatever...and anyone who doesn't just want their kids to be a whatever...will take responsibility for their kids and their communities and not point fingers so much. it never helps.
and lastly you can't say whether Perry is any less concerned about the black community than Spike Lee. They are both black men and they both know the struggles of black people. They choose their own ways of addressing the issues and in many ways they help while in others they don't help. The beautiful thing about it is that these two men provide models of success and discipline to young boys and girls all over.
@0utthe0ther What you said doesn't make sense. Tyler does not provide a model of success and discpline to young boys and girls. In fact he shows the exact opposite. Again any man who makes his fame by wearing a dress and promoting amos and andy like t.v shows is detrimental to the development of young black children who are already lost in the maze of white european domination. A good book for you to read is the isis papers by Dr. Francis Cress Welsing. Please read this book then reply to me!
They are different filmmakers. Spike makes politically based, sociological movies. Tyler makes more humorous, moral based movies. Sometimes they have political connotations, but its very slight to the point to rare.
Are you secure with your masculinity? Because it seems that you are a big supporter of Homosexuality and drag. Are you gay? Because that would explain alot. And i only spoke of my education because you had questioned it in a previous post. Comedy is making fun of people and situations. Drag is not funny, and is destructive to our community. The end.
@kingmu1 I'm secure with my masculinity and am a big supporter of drag and homosexuality. You're the insecure one because you think drag can turn you gay. Like I said before, your baggage. You're a hate-monger and deeply disturbed.
@kingmu1 Madea does not promote homosexuality. Drag is not exclusive to the black community. Not exposing sexual abuse is killing our community more than anything. Tyler does this. Spike is not a great film maker. And us not working together is destroying the black community. Tyler deals with: abuse, keeping the family together, unity, forgiveness, drug abuse and surrendering to God. All very important issues. Because his issues are so deep, it needs the comedy element to lighten the load.
@missVeemack Madea does promote gender confusion. The primary character is a man in old woman drag. Enough said! Drag is not exclusive to our community but the real question you should be asking is, is it neccessary and that is no. Sexual abuse needs to be exposed in our community. Spike is an exceptional film maker...do the right thing, Malcolm X, Bamboozeled, Drop Squad, 25th hour just to name a few. Tyler does deal with real issues but doing it in drag is harmful to the community.
This is what i feel.....This life is not about us ...... God is a Jealous God,....if you have to KO your Bro to draw attention to yourself......or if you have to wear a dress to get laughs .... remember...... this life is not about you.......
This is BS. Tyler has done more than Madea. What's the big deal? Drag has always been a part of theater. And buffoonery has always been a part of show business. I've never liked those Mammy roles, but all of this criticism towards Perry has really pissed me off. He wants to work out his demons wearing drag, that's his business. Spike needs to make movies that people want to see. Film is expensive!!! And NOONE wants to part with their money - even those folks who claim to love Spike.
@kgmaj But Madea is what he is known for! That's the big deal. I don't know if you are black or not. But in the state of affairs in black society. A black man who puts on drag and is the pivotal character in a movie is a threat to the developing psyche of little black boys and girls. Cut and dry. There is no wavering. Spike had it right his movie is buffonery.
@kgmaj I do agree that the our community has other problems.But let's not kid ourselves there are many fractured households in our community where there is no strong male presensce.These kids go to the streets, go to the jails, and are inundated with visual garbage that teaches them that to achieve fame and fortune you have to be a buffon.Such as drag,homosexuality,criminal,oreo,tom,miscegantion,etc... These kids procreate and repeat the cycle. The cycle has to stop somewhere;why not the media
@kgmaj I agree with self-determinism but i am speaking for those children who are in the system and have no structure. My parents are/were my heroes growing up. Most kids don't have this. As an educated black man with a "master's" degree i like most black men should want to be a positive force in the youth's life. It is not a postive being a black man in drag especially one this influential. In my definition an oreo is someone who acts white because they hate plack people/themselves.
@kgmaj Well i will agree he is a doer. But a doer of what? A doer of teaching black kids that to achieve success you have to creat a whole production predicated on buffonery. And you really need to check yourself if you think that drag and homosexuality are alright or role model material. Hey no one is perfect but atleast black men in the media should have the decency to try and strive for visual perfection. Especially when you are a supposed role model to children.
@hamzatu Re: ''Perry is doing it his way...'' Maybe the question that some ppl have is ''exactly what is Perry doing or bringing to the table- besides mere 'entertainment'?'' Will the black community be improved in the wake of Perry's body of work? Are the Perry characters and imagery something we aspire to see acted out more in our community? It seems to me that the blk community has too many 'Mad-deas' already. I'm not partial to Spike or Perry. The History Channel interests me. lol
why does everything have to be political.. this is community no movement was made off spike lee movies... he took was he seen and made movies.. living in the hood ... he was alive or read a book on malcolm x ... an blah blah blah
While I may not always agree with the good doctor's delivery, there is no denying the truth of his words and the eloquent way he handled the two directors. It was like a father explaining his two sons to the rest of the family. Well done Dr. West.
bearpath100 2 days ago
Did he say Rah Digga! lmfao!
MrDjspoon79 4 days ago
Shame on you Dr. West. You turned a teachable moment into another form of "black" on "black" crime. Perry said it best when he said that blacks have been doing this to each other for as far back as Booker T. Washington. We work against each other. It doesn't always have to be political but given the current political climate, everything we do is political. From what we wear, to what we say, everything is understood as political. Dr. West, you could have done better here, but you failed.
09Lucas01 1 week ago
@09Lucas01 HOW DOES WHAT WE WEAR HAVE TO DEAL WITH POLITICS? AND WHO CONTROLLED THOSE BLACKS THAT TORE OTHER BLACKS DOWN DURING OOKER T. WASHINGTON ERA? BE HONEST ABOUT IT.. THOSE HOUSE SLAVES THAT WERE TELLING ON RUN AWAY SLAVES WHO WERE THEY WORKING FOR? YOU ARE THE ONE WHO FAILED YOU ARE AFRAID TO SEE THE TRUTH WHEN ITS RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR FACE.. CAN YOU TELL ME ANY MOVIE TYLER PERRY DOES THAT TRUELY DEALS WITH THE BLACK STRUGGLE? ALL TYLER MOVIES CANT COMPARE TO ONE OF SPIKES MOVIE
tsteph217 1 week ago
Everything doesn't have to be political damn smh
MegaHeavyhitta 1 week ago
That's his opinion. If being great means stupid films and less money then I want to be good like Tyler Perry. Everybody has an opinion, and this is Dr. West opinion.
mrbilingual 2 weeks ago
i believe tyler perry can grow as well
butternuttt 2 weeks ago
@EagleEyeGolfer, u r incorrect about white actors n what AA's are going out 2 c. I see them n the movies they pay 4. The same way Spike was alleging that theatres were providing tickets 2 other movies when his were hitting the screen several years back. My point was simply, Spike did not pave the way, Bill Duke opnd the door 4 Spike. Tyler has provided some movies with content. His plays were "chitterling circut". We can agree to disagree, I am fine with that.
flipovergirl 1 month ago
@samlammo, please see my previous post to JimBowie1133. I believe that Tyler Perry's life speaks volumes about where we may often find too many African Americans, but his example offers a solution. One of many. He took an idea, the risk of believing in himself even when conventional wisdom might suggest otherwise, and took appropriate action to implement his plans and turn his dreams into reality. It's the American dream personified. I'd rather learn his methods than dump on his work.
celtee066 1 month ago
@JimBowie1133, I agree that there are a good number of things that is wrong with our society. I believe that the only way to be represented positively in all avenues is represent ourselves instead of looking to others to do it for us. A great physicist might suck at being a comedian. Does that lessen his contribution to society? Not if his one burning desire is to be a physicist. All I'm saying is instead of being critical of how one man paints pictures why not pick up our own brush and paint.
celtee066 1 month ago
I respect what Dr West has to say, but I disagree. I don't believe that every African American has to be a verbal spokesperson for our social and political condition in America. His life does that by default. I applaud Mr Perry's ability to use the tools available to him to achieve success in terms that he can accept. They are two different type of directors. Both have their place in engraved in history as such. We don't try to make Jerry Seinfeld grow to be Bill Mahr do we?
celtee066 1 month ago
@celtee066 It is clear that the African American community is not in good condition. We are disproportionately jailed, unemployed and killed in America. So, who is going to stand up for the black community? It must be the people with the power and influence from the black community who can make a difference. Tyler Perry definitely fits that roll.I agree with Dr. West. Its now time for him to grow up and make some real art that's socially conscious or at least help some young filmmakers do that.
samlammo 1 month ago
@celtee066 , i understand, but its a lot different for blacks because of general lack of representation. Whites have much more balance in terms of media portrayal.
JimBowie1133 1 month ago
Tyler focus has been on restoring relationships. That's whats in him . Spike- social problems. that's what's in him..No one should be pressured to do anything that they are not creatively inspired to do.I respect Dr. West , he want's to stir up a healthy competition,but every things not a debate. I thought being original was good .Granted Blk man have dressed up as women b4, but some churches sweep issues under a rug. the education on "relationship basics" is needed.
messiahmedia 2 weeks ago
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messiahmedia 2 weeks ago
I listen to Cornell West all the time on the radio. I've seen every Spike Lee movie. And, though I don't care for Tyler Perry''s work that much, I have an enormous amount of respect for him. It's good dialogue and necessary for intellectual purposes of not so much defining what must be or not be represented by a race, but rather feeling confident about representing all the different genres to a race. I mean really, Spike, it's like comparing Abbott & Costello to Saving Private Ryan. S'all ok
jbenbush 1 month ago
on some real shit what the fuck does Cornell west do for the community except for pontificate he teaches at Princeton so he not really helping anybody from the community he is just another typical armchair black revolutionary
thepriceification 1 month ago
@thepriceification Do some research brother. Cornell West do not sit up in an Ivory tower.
samlammo 1 month ago
@samlammo cornell west is a good guy but he is very ignorant about a lot of things in politics.
lilsm555 1 month ago
@lilsm555 WHAT IS HE IGNORANT ABOUT? EXAMPLES PLEASE
tsteph217 1 week ago
@tsteph217 Well for one the role of government. He was on a tv show recently asking what is the government going to do for poor people and the government cant do anything legally beside have a strong economy. He was looking for the government to create or take wealth from someone else and give it to them. The economy is another thing and politics is also another one.
lilsm555 1 week ago
@lilsm555 ITS NOT THE GOVERNMENT ROLE TO GIVE MONEY TO POOR BLACKS.. BECAUSE IF THAT WAS THE CASE THE GOVERNMENT WOULDNT GIVE MONEY TO ANYONE INCLUDING WHIT NATIONS SUCH AS ISREAL TO STOCKPILE WEAPONS ITS AMAZING TO ME HOW WHEN ITS TIME TO DO FOR THE PEOPLE THAT AMERIKKKA HAS OPPRESSED THE MOST ITS NEVER THEIR JOB AND THEN THEY FIND SILLY NEGROS TO AGREE... THE GOVERNMENT TAKES WEALTH EVERYDAY DIDNT THEY TAKE THIS LAND? DIDNT THEY TAKE A LAND AND GIVE IT TO WHITES IN ISREAL.
tsteph217 1 week ago
@lilsm555 SO MAYBE ITS YOU THATS IGNORANT TO THE TRUTH.. ANYONE THAT THINKS WESTERN POLITICS IS FOR THE BETTERMENT OF BLACK PEOPLE YALL ARE CRAZY
tsteph217 1 week ago
@tsteph217 No its him. Just because he is a famous teacher or w/e does not mean he is rational and intelligent dont get me wrong hes a very nice guy and means well but that just means he did his work like a good zombie in school. He is very wrong about the role of government. You need to go and learn about the role of government and why the government is so fucked up. Maybe stop watching mainstream news which is owned by corporations and stop coming up with solutions that are illegal.
lilsm555 1 week ago
@lilsm555 ACTUALLY IF HE WAS TRUELY A ZOMBIE HE WOULD BE LIKE BILL COSBY AND OBAMA AND LARRY ELDER... BUT HE CHOOSES TO TELL THE TRUTH... YOU DIDNT ADRESS ANYTHING I SAID ABOUT AMERIKKKA GIVING AWAY MONEY TO HELP WHTE FOLKS WHY NOT? DOESNT THE GOVERNMENT TAKE WEALTH EVERYDAY? YES OR NO? DONT THEY TAKE LAND? YES OR NO AND WHO DO THEY GIVE THOSE LAND TO? AND WHAT NEWS DO IT WATCH? SINCE YOU SEEM TO KNOW SO MUCH... AND JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE MAKIN UNFOUNDED ACCUSATIONS DOESNT MEAN U ARE RATIONAL
tsteph217 1 week ago
@tsteph217 Bro i know its hard to understand that the guy you have been following for a while really doesnt know shit about politics or the role of government. He tells the truth from a ignorant perspective. THE GOVERNMENT CANNOT create wealth and give it to poor people like he suggested. They do take wealth and give it to other people today and that is exactly part of the reason this country is fucked up and maybe you guys should recognize the problem instead of being mouth breathers.
lilsm555 1 week ago
@lilsm555 wow u seem to know alot about what i wartch and who i follow for how long.. how long have i been following the man? answer plz... how is he telling it from an ignorant perspective when everything you claim the government cant do i gave you examples of them doing it... havent i? can it be that they have been takin money and only givin it to the 1%... you just admitted this that they gave money and take it.. and it did not just start happening...oh and what news do i watch again?
tsteph217 1 week ago
Classic...
nu2thgame 1 month ago
First Spike was not the conscious of AA film industry.First check your history. Gordon Parks,
Carl Franklin, Melvin Van Peebles and Oscar Micheaux. Spike has done some things, but he also provided us with some mess. So, Tyler is making his way. You have to build your "bank" because Hollywood does not strongly fund and WE dont support AA movies. We will bootleg them and/or not go out to spend our money to support them. But we will spend the dollars on the next young white actor and their movie.
flipovergirl 1 month ago
@flipovergirl "But we will spend the dollars on the next youg white actor and their movie". Speak for yourself. Please name for me the last "white actor" we spent our money on? We are talking about movies... not the music industry. If you had said Justin Bieber then you would have a point, because this kid is getting treated like Elvis and The Beetles AND HE'S NOT EVEN AN AMERICAN. You may not like what Spike has to say but you can't deny his place in history and as a pioneer.
EagleEyeGolfer 1 month ago
Mr. Cornel West speaks the truth. Who will listen? Will Tyler Perry listen? Will Clifton Powell listen? I said it once and I'll say it again: if there was no Spike Lee there would be no Tyler Perry. Mr. Perry, don't let the money blind you bruh. There were those who came before you and you need to respect those that paved the way for you Tyler Perry. Clifton Powell is just a damn ignorant fool. He shows no respect for Spike Lee who IS a pioneer and has paved the way for many todays black actors.
EagleEyeGolfer 1 month ago
@EagleEyeGolfer Agreed.
DerrickDmx 1 month ago
@EagleEyeGolfer: AMEN!!! I agree. My mom and I were debating this because she loves the 'Madea' movies, but I haven't seen any of them because as a Masters degree educated Black woman, I feel that it's common day coonery. Straight up. His other movies, like 'Why Did I Get Married?' and 'I Can Do Bad By Myself' were cool. But overall, Spike is much deeper and has more political content. Spike makes you think things over in your head after watching one of his movies. One love!!
morena1022 1 month ago
@morena1022 An educated black woman is an asset to society. Congrats to you>>morena<< receiving your Masters Degree!! Thanks for the support. ;-)
EagleEyeGolfer 1 month ago
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@EagleEyeGolfer I'm pretty sure Tyler perry is a christian.That means the only person that he will be paying homage to for his gifts and talents is Jesus Christ .Please Correct me if I totally missed the mark on this one?
messiahmedia 2 weeks ago
it comes down to one word JEALOUSLY!!!
docjam99 1 month ago
Tyler Perry is an AWFUL film maker. Tyler Perry sets black back, in the film industry.
coliwood 2 months ago
@coliwood OH please! Leave that brotha alone! So much divisiveness in the black community! His films/characters are just NOT FOR YOU! It's a sad thing when our embarrassment of our people outweighs the love for our people ...Tyler has good intentions w/ his films, even if you don't believe he is the best director ...I look at a brothas INTENTIONS ...He, also, has good intentions for his community, offering jobs to black actors and blacks who would go overlooked by Hollywood..so, it aint worf it
Lashid4u 2 months ago
@Lashid4u The Road to hell is paved with good intentions. It is not the intent that matters, it is the consequences of the actions. Perry's movies, are as Spike put it, are "Connery Bafoonery". His movies are poorly produced, written, directed, and they are repetitive. Everyone of them is like a 2 hours special of "Good Times" What you have to realize is that we have we live in a community. Perry casts a negative light on all blacks.
coliwood 2 months ago
@coliwood Okay ...First, I wanna ask your definition of "coonery" ...Second, I want to you to tell me the negative effects of his films ...and third, I have a video titled "STOP WORRYING ABOUT BEING STEREOYPED!" that I'd like for you to check out, if you get the chance ("Good Times" is my all-time fav tv series, btw)
Lashid4u 2 months ago
@coliwood Now, I think Spike's the better director ..but I'm not gonna say that his movies have more of a positive influence ...I remember seeing "She's Gotta Have it", when I was 12, and the perception it gave me of how women should view their sexuality..it was confusing, cuz this character was sexing fellas left & right, but she was highly intelligent...she was, actually, a Jezebel stereotype ...and "She Hates Me" which is Spike, obviously, giving us his fantasy, w/ this "black buck" character
Lashid4u 2 months ago
@coliwood .and should I even mention "Girl 6"? So, who is Spike to try to claim that Tyler has any more of a negative influence?..Even with Malcolm X..Before its release, there was all this hype over a new, black nationalist movement ..young blacks were wearing X caps, listening to X-Clan, and going to hear Farrakhan speak...but the movie gave an unfair view of the NOI (as if they were, primarily, behind Malcolm's murder), pushing blacks away from the movement...by 93, they were on the "Chronic"
Lashid4u 2 months ago
@Lashid4u but Girl 6 WAS BRILLIANT!!!!!!!
orlanduce 1 month ago
Props to Dr. West
travelinman 2 months ago
I enjoyed your input on Tyler & Spike. What to think about the film by Client Eastwood J Edgar? I authored, "What's Done In The Dark Movie. Com.
anauthormentoringnew 2 months ago
Tyler & Spike need to continue to do what each is best at, entertaining us. Ultimately, one needs to continue on the path of what one excels at, and if that is generates income, then all the more to it. I wish both men success in their respective endeavor, Spike is from the 1990s and Tyler is from 2000s. So let's celebrate Tyler's newly found niche, making black people reflect on their grandmas' and moms' behavior. After all, Black people have more resident grandmas & moms than grandpas & paps.
Airforcing 2 months ago
black people always try to put one against the other. let spike do spike. and let tyler do tyler. there only a few blacks in holliwood anyway tha doing way spike and tyler do
earlsutton 2 months ago
tyler perry aint nothing but a big country ass nigga thats how country ass nigga think in 2011 they think that mess is entertaining or art I bet the white tv executives had no problem in encouraging tyler to make films like that,oh! by the way I just move to new orleans 6 months ago from chicago and that tyler perry mentality is live and well down here.
MrSteven2945 2 months ago
Why as black people must we project the idea that we are a single unit? Each person is an individual. Some folks like to see The Browns. I watch it myself sometime. I also love Spike Lee flicks. If you want to see socially conscious subject manner watch Lee. Tyler never suggested that he was socially conscious in his art. Spike is. I think Perry has a more universal approach with his movies. Spike set out to be for "the people". Lighten up folks we are not ALL Malcolm X ALL of the time.
erfbgu 2 months ago
@erfbgu "Tyler never suggested that he was socially conscious in his art. " Um actually he did. All of his movies are socio-political, that's the point.
LimelightsFaded 2 months ago
@LimelightsFaded
Let me clarify. Tyler Perry never meant to have black socially concious material. This is the argument Lee uses against Perry.
erfbgu 2 months ago
@erfbgu To use a medical metaphor, Spike is looking at what the Black race (patient) needs for uplifting and health and he believes the diet should be changed to more whole grains, vegetables and water, and less dessert, candy, and soda pop. Consuming occasional dessert, candy, or soda pop is fine, we all enjoy them. But the bulk of our sustenance should be enrichment, otherwise not only will the patient's health not be uplifted, it deteriorates, like trends we see in poverty, jail, drop outs
DreamsCumTrue469 2 months ago
@DreamsCumTrue469 I understand Spike Lee. Questions for you though, 1-who says that everyone wants enrichment when viewing a movie or that they even want it at all? 2-Who says that Tyler Perry's work cannot empower folks and for the arguments sake, black folk particularly? Perry always has an underlining positive message in his work - messages that promote wellness for all people not just blacks. I've always had a sense of pride for my race but real talk we have to rise above this race stuff.
erfbgu 2 months ago
@DreamsCumTrue469 cont
Our outside appearance is just a container. Who you are is much more predicated on what you are inside. And this isn't to say that race isn't a problem...its obvious it is. But maybe its time folks change their perspective. But back to the issue. I've always liked many of Spike's films, but I think it wouldn't be a stretch to say that he in a way reinforces the fear and anxiety in people, mostly blacks and whites with a good number of his films. But I'm not knocking that.
erfbgu 2 months ago
@DreamsCumTrue469 cont-
Maybe he intends to make folks uncomfortable in an attempt to have dialogue about the issues.
erfbgu 2 months ago
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Spike Lee is dead right. Black people should be offended by Tyler Perrys work.
huntman125 3 months ago
...one more thing. Tyler, you should have kept Madea's Big Happy Family as a play. You put way too much emphasis on that "hood rat" stereotype. Although, it's EXTREMELY funny. But, the reason it's funny is b/c well, I'm not a ghetto, loud-mouth, baby mama who whines when she speaks. So, I wonder how the chicks that ARE that way felt? Hm.
Anyhoot. Diary Of A Mad Black Women is still my favorite. And I love the ending in Family Reunion.
Ok. I'm done rambling. lol
iluvlycheenuts 3 months ago
I think Perry & Lee BOTH make socially conscious movies, however, Spike's delivery seems to go over alot of Black folks heads. Which is one of the things I love about his writing. It's subtle, yet definitive. Perry doesn't allow the audience to figure it out for themselves. Whoever does the writing for the sitcom Meet The Browns, please tell them that we don't need the punchline EXPLAINED to us every time someone cracks a joke. If Mr. Brown says something incorrectly...LEAVE IT BE!
iluvlycheenuts 3 months ago
why cant each man make the kind of movies that he wants. spike makes social conscious movies and tyler makes whatever movie he makes. not downing tyler. but each man is great at that which he does and in the way he does it. do they have to take the same path to greatness.
royalblue19 3 months ago
@royalblue19 He had to be given heat...
Spike did the right thing regardless of how it was delivered, what everyones forgotten is that it was one of the BET employees whose brought up Tyler Perry. Here watch?v=Ciwhh3fB6vE&feature=related @ 0:58 NOT SPIKE LEE; REGARDLESS. Cornel makes more sense in his delivery on the subject matter.
Sileni 2 months ago
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I do feel that both men are speaking from different places. My relatives from the east coast REALLY DO think that the way we behave, think and speak in the south is a bad reflection on the race especially when we come from the rural areas in the south. Also, African American Muslims do appear to look at every act as either for or against the race. By the same token, Mr. Lee is a legend in our culture and his opinion should be respected if not agreed with.
TheChocolateIndian 3 months ago
perry movies do be on that coon shit
MrBlackmask27 3 months ago
Ignorance at it's best!!!!
whoiam75 3 months ago
Loving Pressure? Is that like prison rape?
andrewjacksonbr 3 months ago
Muhammad Ali became the most famous person on Earth because he was forced to relinquish the heavyweight title as a result of taking a principled stand refusing to serve in the Vietnam War. He wasn't famous becasue he got rich. He told America where to get off, and which exit to take.
bapyou 3 months ago
@2112murphy I agree with you, some people think greatness only deals with big budget films with special effects and high paid actors and actresses. I don't subscibe to that, because Spike Lees films are timeless, have deep messages in them, and he has made alot of block buster stars..Spike Lee is a Genius and great film maker, true indeed.
mia919100 3 months ago
haha
aitch3 3 months ago
I couldn't hear a word the Dr said because people in the audience kept trying to sounds smart by interrupting and going YEAH. THATS RIGHT. YEAH. THATS RIGHT.
flicfan416 3 months ago
@flicfan416 BLACK PEOPLE LOOOOOOOOOOOL
tomboy287 3 months ago
I love Tyler! I don't think they're hattn on Tyler Perry. Its just with more fame there can be more power. Tyler Perry has potential to be a very powerful film maker and help break away the African American stereotypes. Lately his films and shows are the same or Mediocre and very stereotypical. After a while it gets kinda old and not as funny. It almost make him seem lazy. He should slow down and really put something together that's amazing and seriously showcases his wonderful talent.
Dgwal22 3 months ago
Why does anyone continues to pay this quack and psuedointellectual any attention? He has absolutely nothing of any importance to say as it relates to black empowerment, and the fact that he is wasting his time and energy making excuses for Tyler Perry the koonery king proves this point. The true leaders of the black community are the positive black business owners, engineers, scientist and mathematicians, the people who have the knowledge and skills to actually build and empower a people.
lamarjlp914 3 months ago
Yall Please this is a shame. We need to all get a clue. We are all diff they are insulting anyone who love Tyler Perry Movies. Please subscribe to my channel so we can all grow laugh learn how to love each other. Love Yall
firsttopnotch101 3 months ago
Very wise statements. I think Dr. Cornel West is bringing balance to this whole Spike Vs Tyler beef.
YellowDiamondz100 4 months ago
sorry but this is nonsense spike lee aint no great filmmaker. he's had a few good movies but mostly mediocre crap.
fishpawsable 4 months ago
I support Tyler but on the real ALL of his movies make brothers look grimey. Spike can care less if his movies are box office hits and I respect that because that is true artistry. Tyler will come around one of these days.
Tanisha0782 4 months ago
That shitty book has all their heads filled with bullshit.
It's a discussion of quality and expression- and this man has missed the point.
noogetful 4 months ago
i think tylers perrys movies makes black men look terrible. i really believe hes gay
tyler2june 4 months ago
@tyler2june Agree.
harveysuperboy 4 months ago
@tyler2june How can you say his movies make black men look bad? We have good black men, we have bad black men. I really dont have a problem with Tyler Perry....I just think Spike Lee is jealous of him because hes not making money anymore and Tyler has taken over. Comedy is comedy and I like Madea...I think Tyler needs to do something different because Madea is getting old, but I wish the brutha much success.
Xziau1 4 months ago
@Xziau1 well his movies are "black movies" and in every movie, women are being tortured by black men, in some way or form, so for that reason, someone who's not black, watches these black movies and it just seems like black men are really bad to black women. just like in that one movie when that drunnk guy dropped his girlfriends kids out the window. For colored girls. i mean that is so unrealistic but his movies are suppose to be serious, he seems like he always on female side, he dresses up 2
tyler2june 4 months ago
@tyler2june I see your point of view. I think the character Will Brown is a positive black man. I also think all of the black men in the movie "The Family that Preys" were positive black men. The black men in that movie were hardworking and they did not cheat on their wives.
For Colored Girls is a dark movie. Everyone in that movie had issues including the black women LOL...
Xziau1 4 months ago
I am very aware but with all due respect most black people are so far removed from Africa I find it silly to even try to compare any struggles to those of the slaves and the generations after them. I have had the history drilled into me I know it was hard for them all the more reason to pull together and support each other am I correct?
TheBlackSpiralDancer 4 months ago
I feel Spike Lee needs to find a corner somewhere and sit his ass down. I appreciate his movies like School Daze and Crooklyn, but fall back. As for Tyler Perry that's my dude and I can look at Madea over and over again.
qbbowles 4 months ago
@Limekiln You are a hateful person and really prove my point thanks. At any rate I forgive you for your hateful remarks and youre right not just black folks snipe each other everyone does it it just shows up more in black people. I have struggled more than black or white people will ever know or understand yet I love everyone unconditionally I am just sad that instead of helping words are hurting. I hope you can be color blind soon you need to be.
TheBlackSpiralDancer 4 months ago
@TheBlackSpiralDancer i am not hateful in the least but you are blind if you don't realize what hurtful, hateful things you said in both your comments. i'm sorry you have suffered but you have NOT suffered more than the africans who were ripped from their homelands,marched sometimes over 100 miles on foot,baptized then loaded and chained to the bottom of rat and maggot infested slave ships,and brought here to suffer the worst kind of chattel known to man! ....
Limekiln71 4 months ago
@TheBlackSpiralDancer would kill hundreds who had nothing to do with it! just to teach the others not to buck the system! it was torture,terror an mental conditioning that is unprecidented in human history. if they found out that you were trying to learn to read you and whoever was suspected of teaching you were dead.but still we rose. but not without scars! the type you see manifested today in our turning on eachother and sparing the white christian order its due blame!
Limekiln71 4 months ago
cornell west is a loudmouth bitch! who should be speaking out against spike lee and his sad sack cant win, bad end low life portrayals of blacks! what a bitch spike is! his movies have done nothing to uplift the black condition in america
Limekiln71 4 months ago
@Limekiln71 , you're wrong, at the time of Spike Lee films black people were more conscious of their history and position society - Malcolm X, Jungle Fever, Do the Right Thing- are classic genius films that did uplift the black condition. Tyler Perry movies are nothing but a damn minstrel show, a coon show.
JimBowie1133 4 months ago
@JimBowie1133 tell me what was uplifting to the black condition in jungle fever and do the right thing? if i'm not mistaken myself, my family and most of my friends were and still are african american and NONE of us found any of those films anything but one dimensional garbage. as far as malcom x goes, i am a muslim and i found it to be empty, shallow and full of inaccuracies. examp=when he was put into jail and disrespected by the whites he was in real life 15 yrs old.
Limekiln71 4 months ago
@JimBowie1133 tell me what was uplifting to the black condition in jungle fever and do the right thing? if i'm not mistaken myself, my family and most of my friends were and still are african american and NONE of us found any of those films anything but one dimensional garbage. as far as malcom x goes, i am a muslim and i found it to be empty, shallow and full of inaccuracies. examp=when he was put into jail and disrespected by the whites he was in real life 15 yrs old.
Limekiln71 4 months ago
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@JimBowie1133 tell me what was uplifting to the black condition in jungle fever and do the right thing? if i'm not mistaken, myself, my family and most of my friends were and still are african american and NONE of us found any of those films anything but one dimensional garbage. as far as malcom x goes, i am a muslim and i found it to be empty, shallow and full of inaccuracies. examp, when he was put into jail and disrespected by the whites he was in real life 15 yrs old.
Limekiln71 4 months ago
@JimBowie1133 heres another stupid but little noticed thing he chose "shot gun" as the theme song for the movie! "shot gun!" whose lyrics go "shot gun! shoot him fo he run now! shoot em down baby!" for the movie malcom x! the movie about a great civil rights leader who was shot to death with shot guns! how dumb is that?!
Limekiln71 4 months ago
Give an asshole a microphone and he thinks hes a pro movie critic. Only black folks tear into each other like this. Im so tired of it I am ashamed to be half black. Tyler Perry talks more about family and how life can be screwed up and he lightens the experience with characters like Madea. I know life isnt rainbow and sunshine all the time but its not all dismal either. You have to laugh to heal. All these jokers wanna hate, I have one question, WHY?
TheBlackSpiralDancer 4 months ago
@TheBlackSpiralDancer fuck your half black ass!! if this incident makes you ashamed of your "black half" then we don't need you! go be white because as we all know they are "perfect" and don't display and jealousy or hatred toward anyone. they are just little angels without wings. go dye your hair blond and scrub real hard with bleach and maybe you can forget the part you are ashamed of. meanwhile i and others like me will fight on since we can't opt out of who we are.
Limekiln71 4 months ago
@TheBlackSpiralDancer they then began a cycle in this country of life as persona non grata. you are nothing but a piece of property to be raped on a whim, beaten, murdered, your children sold or given away like a litter of puppies. no redress in court for over 240 years! pit against eachother by your white christian captors for the yellowish hughe of your skin or the deep mocha tone you were designated "house" or "field". if you revolt and there were many the militias would kill hundreds not ..
Limekiln71 4 months ago
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@TheBlackSpiralDancer they then began a cycle in this country of life as persona non grata. you are nothing but a piece of property to be raped on a whim, beaten, murdered, your children sold or given away like a litter of puppies. no redress in court for over 240 years! pit against eachother by your white christian captors for the yellowish hughe of your skin or the deep mocha tone you were designated "house" or "field". if you revolt and there were many the militias would kill hundreds not
Limekiln71 4 months ago
@TheBlackSpiralDancer not all black people can relate to what tyler puts out and all his movies are the same
yankee2013 4 months ago
Tyler Perry is a disgusting Fag that dresses up like a Bitch because White People LOOVE to see a Black Man in a Dress Dave Chappelle talked about Hollywood trying to put him in a Dress but Chapelle had dignity. Almost every Black Actor must at some point in his career put on a Dress or play a Homo. Denzel Washington's first movie was Carbon Copy where he plays a Homo. White people love Homosexuality from Greece-America.Dave Chappelle left Hollywood for a damn good reason,,to keep his soul.
nandansho 5 months ago
Dr West is the man.
nightmathzombieethan 5 months ago
We cannot compare apples and oranges. Spike Lee emphasizes the racist bullshit in his work. Tyler Perry emphasizes the the patriarchic bullshit in his work. Both attempt to give voices to the voiceless. Abused women and Gays are no less important than abused Blacks and browns. We should all try to accept our innate equality and move on.
Magnesiumfire 5 months ago
@Magnesiumfire good point, but where do you draw the line on buffoonery, because racist whites love the madea thing. Some blacks love it, but some are still conditioned to say the N word too. Should a message get out by any means necessary<(ha, ha didn't realize the X quote), or does the messenger put that out in a less buffoonery type way? Striking up the debate since we are talking about it.
whoelseknows 4 months ago
@whoelseknows Not so useful to track what others love, aren’t they likely to fall for anything? Don’t others, occasionally, lie? More useful to keep sight of your love, isn’t that all we really CAN know? I don’t tend to draw lines in the sand, but I’ll know bullshit when I see it. It’s about what the heart knows more than about what the mind thinks. A racist can always find a way to exploit any rule, but racism cannot comprehend the heart: a racist doesn’t acknowledge the pain of other races.
Magnesiumfire 3 months ago
Dr. West brings an excellent point between Lee and Perry. If you come from less than stellar background more oftern you will pretty much sell your soul to become famous and rich than someone from an "bougouise" background who can afford to more political and social conscious and isn't doing for the "money". I like Tyler but you can only do so many single parent, abused, and molested shows until it becomes tiresome. Not every black person like myself went through any of those things....
kamikani08 5 months ago
@kamikani08 I like your view and im only 16 and ive been saying that since ive been 13
yankee2013 4 months ago
@yankee2013 thank you sweetheart!
kamikani08 4 months ago
I don't understand why others don't understand how it is important for black america to take control of their image. The image of black america today exploits and ignores far more positive aspects of of our history, and culture that destroy most of the stereotypes (mature) black american have to carry as a burden throughout their lives.
OutSpokenGamer 5 months ago
Whenever black people have a conversation on this guy, 2 things come out:
1. Arrogance
2. Homophobia
Both worse than Madea. Ya'll really need to get over urselves. u have no reason to be arrogant and homophobia is stupid. Regardless if you're Christian, you are not of such a high caliber that you can rightfully judge the next man/woman b/c his/her sexual orientation is not the same as yours'. And no i don't think Tyler is gay, I just see he has a tendency to bring self-righteous homophobes out.
DivinelyMochaDipped 5 months ago
@massivelockdown
Thank you for being an African-American other than myself who gets it!
DivinelyMochaDipped 5 months ago
"That's right, the people don't come because you grandiose motherfuckers don't play shit that they like. If you played the shit that they like, then people would come, simple as that." ~Shadow Henderson (Wesley Snipes), Mo' Better Blues
ageinGamer 5 months ago
CW is a trip. He just don't care, he's gonna do him. For all the ppl who criticize spike he is not God, but sitting around laughing & showcasing the lowest denomination of our race has never gotten us anywhere. Political consciousnes is what has always allowed us progress. As long as we perpetuate bofoonery we will continue to struggle. Some may get rich but many will be left behind.
2tim149 5 months ago
@2tim149 Great comment & thx for a very good video, SFTA.
lynn125lynn 5 months ago
This is some bullshit! We as black people are always talking shit and trying to bring other black people down as soon as they become successful. Leave Tyler Perry alone and let him do his thing. Spike Lee is not God!!! We need to support our people not keep bringing them down.
kmac606 5 months ago
@kmac606 agree
kiasky1 5 months ago
Cornell talking that where we come from stuff. He is from Sac, Cali and just wants to be upper class East Coast so he caters to them. Cornell is smart always smart, smart enough to fool people that he actually knows about every black enough to pick who we are to regard or not. Perry is not the Soulja Boy of film, his plays and movies are constructed in an entertaining way to convey messeges like Spike did in the day. Spike had the same criticism and some same critcs when he was rolling strong.
bamjungle 6 months ago
Fuck all that "Tyler needs goooo"
Mr123Gibson 6 months ago
Preach...
MsDeandrea 6 months ago
This "division" points at the viewpoint that Black Americans haven't "made it" far enough to laugh at themselves. White people laugh at themselves all the time without compunction. Most black people, when in reflective mode, feel we need to put a more politically active intellectual face out in the mainstream while laughing at each other behind closed doors. The sad thing is these people may be correct.
aceirmada 6 months ago
@aceirmada Do you really feel that way, honestly?
NATSUNPRESIDENT 5 months ago
@NATSUNPRESIDENT Wow I'm looking at my old post and it's muddy as hell. If put succinctly, I say that most educated Black Americans feel that Black Americans haven't "made it far" enough in America to allow themselves to be seen laughing at themselves publicly i.e. liking Tyler Perry movies.
Example: I believe the average American non-Black believes Tyler's movies are silly and that black people sure like to go to movies that feature Black people in over-the-top-silly roles. There is some
aceirmada 5 months ago
@aceirmada Thank you, that is exactly how I feel about this issue. Minorities do not have a enough footing in Hollywood to be laughed at so freely. White people on the other hand have prestigious cinema going back the 1940's which is likely why Perry's works are criticized more harshly than something like National Lampoon's Whatever.
Welleby 5 months ago
Why do we have to put division among each other? I have been the recipent of so many crazy non-sense movies done by directors e.g. Mean Girls, Bill and Ted Adventure....and the like....they are just silly movies to make u laugh. Why can't we have serious, funny, divine, intellectual and even silly? Why must every movie represent every black person? We are diverse. . . Tyler represents only one facet of one man's thoughts....let someone else tell a story.
themaninsilver 6 months ago
(cont.) About the black people vs. niggas argument. When Tyler makes a movie where the black people aren't coons the movie doesn't make as much money as the Madea movies......that's a reflection on us. There's still too many of us who like being niggas and have no interest in being black. Chris Rock said it so perfectly in his classic routine on this issue. Type in "Black People vs. Niggas" on Youtube and he explains it way better and funnier than I ever could
derals869 7 months ago
@derals869
When Tyler makes a movie where the black people aren't coons the movie doesn't make as much money as the Madea movies......that's a reflection on us.<-FALSE! The movies w/ less "cooning" have an audience less diverse. So it says less about "us" collectively and more about the perceptions that OTHERS have of us, so get it right. if anyone supports the movies that DON'T make us "look like coons" it IS US.
DivinelyMochaDipped 5 months ago
@DivinelyMochaDipped If by diverse you mean racial, that's not a factor. Tyler has a near zero white audience base, his success is totally based on black people going to his movies. Whites are not going to the theater to see Madea and Mr. Brown movies, or any of Tyler's movies for that matter. The Madea and Mr. Brown movies have black people and niggas going to see them (mostly niggas), the movies without Madea and Brown mostly have black people going to see them (almost no niggas).
iamtryinglord 5 months ago
@iamtryinglord Are you in every movie theater in the country? For Perry to have accumulated the fortune he has it is definitely many white people going to his movies. The entertainment industry (movies) are targeting the white teenage male. Have you noticed the behaviors of this group now a days? The even call eachother nigger. If you were to look at the top 10 grossing movies in history you will find the majority are children's movies and the others are films designed to get white males.
wronghand1 5 months ago
@DivinelyMochaDipped (Pt.2) Your point about how "Others" see us is an interesting one. As quiet as it's kept, Tyler is backed by Rueben Cannon and Assoc. It's a major film distribution company, they can get a movie on 1000 or more movie screens without blinking. No other black filmaker can get anywhere near that exposure, isn't interesting that Tyler can? The filmaker that has coonin' buckdancing negroes in a bunch of his movies has the most exposure of any black filmaker EVER!!
iamtryinglord 5 months ago
@DivinelyMochaDipped (Pt. 3) How come Spike doesn't get that level of exposure like Tyler? Or John Singleton? Or F. Gary Gray? No black filmaker gets the exposure that Tyler does and Tyler's movies too often depict black people in a way that the "Others" like to see their negroes, Ignorant and Happy.
There are still too many powerful white people in the movie business that don't like to see black people as real people.......they prefer to see niggas and coons
iamtryinglord 5 months ago
I agree with most if not all of Spike's criticism but I don't "go in" on Tyler as much as others for this reason. It's a classic case of black people vs. niggas, when Tyler makes a movie with Madea or Leroy Brown and other coonery type characters, niggas show up in droves and some black people show up also. But when Tyler makes a movie where the black people are fly and educated, niggas are nowhere to be found but black people show up at the theatre.
derals869 7 months ago
that's true....so true i won't add to it.
mazaratialbum 6 months ago
Milton Berle and Jonathan Winters (both white) performed in drag their entire careers. I never heard any criticisms about them. What's up with all this focus on how Tyler Perry does his act? I don't even recall all this haterade being thrown at Flip Wilson (Jeraldine). We don't need the klan to hold us back. We're doing a fine job all by ourselves.
mxj1665 7 months ago
@mxj1665 Milton Berle, Jonathan Winters and Flip Wilson are comedians. It's not unusual for male comics to dress up in drag. Perry is a director, please tell me other directors that dress up in woman's clothing in thier movies.
derals869 7 months ago
His statements are ignorant. Ignorance because he does not know Tyler Perry personally to make these assumptions. How dare he say he has not been educated. Education does not just depend on economic background. Tyler Perry educates about abuse, surrendering to a God and forgiveness. Spike Lee hasn't been great since "Malcolm X".
missVeemack 7 months ago
@missVeemack You don't need to know someone to know they are doing wrong. If i kill someone for no reason at all this is wrong. Wearing drag hurts the psyche of young boys and girls. do you think it's a coincidence out of the limited movies of us on the wide screen and t.v you have all these demasculanted black men, big momma's house, white girls, norbit, sha nene, wanda. It is not coincidence this is what hollywood approves for our men in film. oh there's another one pardon the pun!
kingmu1 7 months ago
@kingmu1 i dont mean any disrespect but thats kinda bullshit. big mommas house, white girls, sha nene, norbit and so on and so forth were spawned from the minds of black creators and black audiences eat it up. you can't blame hollywood for that. if black people didn't approve these pictures and characters would not be successful. if blacks want something different they have to put their money on something different, it's as simple as that.
0utthe0ther 7 months ago
@0utthe0ther They are spawned from black creators but everything and i mean everything made has to be green lighted by the powers that be in movie and t.v industry like producers, movie companies. They like to green light buffonery like this because it denigrates consciously and subconsciously the psyche of our people especially children. Who said our people were smart in there movie and t.v choices. They are 400 years into the demoralization, terrorism and subculture of former slave masters.
kingmu1 7 months ago
@kingmu1 and what's most harmful to the community is not a man on stage in drag no matter what his color, it's the neglect of children by their parents. when parents aren't there to direct their kids lives then they open the door for others to do so and others could be a man in drag, a thug with agun, a racist, a whatever...and anyone who doesn't just want their kids to be a whatever...will take responsibility for their kids and their communities and not point fingers so much. it never helps.
0utthe0ther 7 months ago
and lastly you can't say whether Perry is any less concerned about the black community than Spike Lee. They are both black men and they both know the struggles of black people. They choose their own ways of addressing the issues and in many ways they help while in others they don't help. The beautiful thing about it is that these two men provide models of success and discipline to young boys and girls all over.
0utthe0ther 7 months ago
@0utthe0ther What you said doesn't make sense. Tyler does not provide a model of success and discpline to young boys and girls. In fact he shows the exact opposite. Again any man who makes his fame by wearing a dress and promoting amos and andy like t.v shows is detrimental to the development of young black children who are already lost in the maze of white european domination. A good book for you to read is the isis papers by Dr. Francis Cress Welsing. Please read this book then reply to me!
kingmu1 6 months ago
DR. WEST!!! SPIKE LEE WAS A GREAT FLIM MAKER AND TYLER PERRY IS A VERY GOOD FLIM WRITTER
ltdee1970 7 months ago
I've never heard Cornel West say anything remotely insightful or profound.
andrehendrik 7 months ago
Tyler Perry is brilliant. His haters are insane.
kgmaj 7 months ago
They are different filmmakers. Spike makes politically based, sociological movies. Tyler makes more humorous, moral based movies. Sometimes they have political connotations, but its very slight to the point to rare.
stringerboi 7 months ago
Are you secure with your masculinity? Because it seems that you are a big supporter of Homosexuality and drag. Are you gay? Because that would explain alot. And i only spoke of my education because you had questioned it in a previous post. Comedy is making fun of people and situations. Drag is not funny, and is destructive to our community. The end.
kingmu1 7 months ago
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kgmaj 7 months ago
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kgmaj 7 months ago
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kgmaj 7 months ago
@kingmu1 I'm secure with my masculinity and am a big supporter of drag and homosexuality. You're the insecure one because you think drag can turn you gay. Like I said before, your baggage. You're a hate-monger and deeply disturbed.
kgmaj 7 months ago
@kingmu1 Madea does not promote homosexuality. Drag is not exclusive to the black community. Not exposing sexual abuse is killing our community more than anything. Tyler does this. Spike is not a great film maker. And us not working together is destroying the black community. Tyler deals with: abuse, keeping the family together, unity, forgiveness, drug abuse and surrendering to God. All very important issues. Because his issues are so deep, it needs the comedy element to lighten the load.
missVeemack 7 months ago
@missVeemack Madea does promote gender confusion. The primary character is a man in old woman drag. Enough said! Drag is not exclusive to our community but the real question you should be asking is, is it neccessary and that is no. Sexual abuse needs to be exposed in our community. Spike is an exceptional film maker...do the right thing, Malcolm X, Bamboozeled, Drop Squad, 25th hour just to name a few. Tyler does deal with real issues but doing it in drag is harmful to the community.
kingmu1 7 months ago
This is what i feel.....This life is not about us ...... God is a Jealous God,....if you have to KO your Bro to draw attention to yourself......or if you have to wear a dress to get laughs .... remember...... this life is not about you.......
crystaljones3434 7 months ago
Why can't we just appreciate both?...
I think Dr Cornell is right for the most part though.
We have a variety of tastes and ONE person can't do it all
I LOVE Spike and I LOVE Tyler and most people feel the same way
atlasshrugged2u 8 months ago
This is BS. Tyler has done more than Madea. What's the big deal? Drag has always been a part of theater. And buffoonery has always been a part of show business. I've never liked those Mammy roles, but all of this criticism towards Perry has really pissed me off. He wants to work out his demons wearing drag, that's his business. Spike needs to make movies that people want to see. Film is expensive!!! And NOONE wants to part with their money - even those folks who claim to love Spike.
kgmaj 8 months ago
@kgmaj But Madea is what he is known for! That's the big deal. I don't know if you are black or not. But in the state of affairs in black society. A black man who puts on drag and is the pivotal character in a movie is a threat to the developing psyche of little black boys and girls. Cut and dry. There is no wavering. Spike had it right his movie is buffonery.
kingmu1 7 months ago
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kgmaj 7 months ago
@kgmaj I do agree that the our community has other problems.But let's not kid ourselves there are many fractured households in our community where there is no strong male presensce.These kids go to the streets, go to the jails, and are inundated with visual garbage that teaches them that to achieve fame and fortune you have to be a buffon.Such as drag,homosexuality,criminal,oreo,tom,miscegantion,etc... These kids procreate and repeat the cycle. The cycle has to stop somewhere;why not the media
kingmu1 7 months ago
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kgmaj 7 months ago
@kgmaj I agree with self-determinism but i am speaking for those children who are in the system and have no structure. My parents are/were my heroes growing up. Most kids don't have this. As an educated black man with a "master's" degree i like most black men should want to be a positive force in the youth's life. It is not a postive being a black man in drag especially one this influential. In my definition an oreo is someone who acts white because they hate plack people/themselves.
kingmu1 7 months ago
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kgmaj 7 months ago
@kgmaj Well i will agree he is a doer. But a doer of what? A doer of teaching black kids that to achieve success you have to creat a whole production predicated on buffonery. And you really need to check yourself if you think that drag and homosexuality are alright or role model material. Hey no one is perfect but atleast black men in the media should have the decency to try and strive for visual perfection. Especially when you are a supposed role model to children.
kingmu1 7 months ago
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kgmaj 7 months ago
a look-e here!
southerndandy89 8 months ago
black pride
GlitchingGod48 8 months ago
good thought success vs achievement, and helping others to grow and evolve
uranusisnotfunny 8 months ago
This is petty...Judging an artist in this way...and trifling...Perry is doing it his way and so is Spike...
hamzatu 8 months ago
@hamzatu your missing the point.
6angelo9 8 months ago
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@6angelo9 I re-watched it again...I think you are missing my point.
hamzatu 8 months ago
@hamzatu Re: ''Perry is doing it his way...'' Maybe the question that some ppl have is ''exactly what is Perry doing or bringing to the table- besides mere 'entertainment'?'' Will the black community be improved in the wake of Perry's body of work? Are the Perry characters and imagery something we aspire to see acted out more in our community? It seems to me that the blk community has too many 'Mad-deas' already. I'm not partial to Spike or Perry. The History Channel interests me. lol
jhvenus2004 8 months ago
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hamzatu 8 months ago
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hamzatu 8 months ago
why does everything have to be political.. this is community no movement was made off spike lee movies... he took was he seen and made movies.. living in the hood ... he was alive or read a book on malcolm x ... an blah blah blah
SuchADamnFreak