@slevian34 (from Ben Harms) With a single exception, I have not found any historical evidence that bounced strokes have ever been used by timpanists. The exception is Ernst Pfundt (1849), who states that during long rolls when the rest of the orchestra is playing (e.g., William Tell Overture) he will sometimes - in order to alleviate fatigue - use a double stroke "field drum" roll, reverting to the proper single stroke "timpani" roll when the timpani is part is exposed.
@pI8Sv9b4 - aren't double-strokes used in Beethoven? - eg 8th Symphony finale FF-ff-FF-ff, and Missa Solemnis dd-AA-dd-AA etc. I played the latter hand-to-hand initially, but maybe it could be played better (more control over the crescendo) using double stokes?
@lawrence18uk I'll refer you to the response to slevian34 (above). For any dynamic beyond pianissimo, I have never been able to get anything close to even dynamics with "field drum"bounces on timpani: the response from the skin is too slow. Alternating strokes for passages like the ones you cite - illustrated in the 1840's books by Kastner, Pfundt, and Reinhardt - provide convincing enough evidence that timpanists could (and would) perform them in that manner. Then there's all the improv...
Dang! Timpani 25 beat me to it! My undergraduate dissertation was on Berlioz's use of percussion in SF along with his requiem. In it I gave a historical survey on things like baroque timpani, performance practice, stick usage, etc. But I'm loving this vid. Amazing plauing and variations.
@Sothe1424 remember, the wooden sticks were used to good effect when the timpani were played from horseback. later, german timpanists experimented with leather coverings, but felt or sponge covered sticks were not specifically asked for until around 1823 (by berlioz). therefore, the baroque timpani style would call for wood (or ivory) headed sticks.
@timpani25 (from Ben Harms) Re: wooden sticks. A recent archival discovery in Germany has pushed back the making of felt-covered sticks to 1775 (a signed receipt from a furniture maker for 8 timpani sticks covered with felt as well as 4 uncovered). This is found on p 177 in a monumental collection of articles on historical percussion presented at a 2007conference in michaelstein cloister (Germany). It's Volume ("Heft") 75 of their publication series. 7 articles in English, 19 in German.
it's historical practice to use harder mallets in baroque playing, especially on period instruments. why? in the baroque era, softer mallets were virtually non-exsistant.
No. It appears most of the German virtuosos of the 18th c. played with the lower drum on the right (there may have been exceptions). As a modern American I learned the other way around. Basically, both hands (and wrists) need to be strong and flexible.
I really appriciate the articulation that you apply to the Baroque timps. I takes a great deal of controll to emulate the correct type of sound on the baroque timpani. It takes a great ear and proper hands to give the sound that you are properly demonstrating. I am espeacially found of the baroque timpani. I mean nothing beats a great set of Dres timps. But these timps are sooo awesome.
The main reason for putting up this video was to demonstrate Baroque timpani technique - rhythmic variations, flourishes, etc.
The tone quality - when played on my laptop with good headphones - is acceptable in my opinion (the skins were at the end of their usefulness, as can be seen on the video). Drums of this design have been used to satisfaction in numerous places, including the Metropolitan Opera, Toronto's Tafelmusik, etc.
I'll address the matter of the intonation in a future post.
No. This theme is found at the top of p 130 of Altenburg's book on trumpet and timpani playing ("Versuch einer Anleitung zur heroisch-musikalischen Trompeter- und Paukerkunst"). His concerto for seven trumpets and timpani is found on p 133-142 of the same book.
Thank you Ben for posting these great variations on the Aufzug. Some time back I did a transcription. You can see my recording on the video response
norinflanders 2 months ago
Comment removed
norinflanders 2 months ago
Very nice playing! Bravo!
jbnh 3 months ago
Hi Ben; i'm really looking forward to your live performance of this next week!
Hertzogxx 9 months ago
Is this Josef Firtzl on the timpanis?
madberlin 11 months ago
this is pretty special! I'm doing a music history paper about ornimentation on timpani during the baroque period...could i ask you some questions?
drumlikebonzo 1 year ago
largissimo
StopTheMoti0n 1 year ago
is the player George Brown from Utah Symphony? thanks
bowiedj 1 year ago
@bowiedj No. It's Ben Harms.
pI8Sv9b4 1 year ago
uhh can techniques used in the snare can also be used in the timpany ?? like say 2 strokes?? or 3 strokes ??
slevian34 1 year ago
@slevian34 (from Ben Harms) With a single exception, I have not found any historical evidence that bounced strokes have ever been used by timpanists. The exception is Ernst Pfundt (1849), who states that during long rolls when the rest of the orchestra is playing (e.g., William Tell Overture) he will sometimes - in order to alleviate fatigue - use a double stroke "field drum" roll, reverting to the proper single stroke "timpani" roll when the timpani is part is exposed.
pI8Sv9b4 1 year ago
@pI8Sv9b4 - aren't double-strokes used in Beethoven? - eg 8th Symphony finale FF-ff-FF-ff, and Missa Solemnis dd-AA-dd-AA etc. I played the latter hand-to-hand initially, but maybe it could be played better (more control over the crescendo) using double stokes?
lawrence18uk 8 months ago
@lawrence18uk I'll refer you to the response to slevian34 (above). For any dynamic beyond pianissimo, I have never been able to get anything close to even dynamics with "field drum"bounces on timpani: the response from the skin is too slow. Alternating strokes for passages like the ones you cite - illustrated in the 1840's books by Kastner, Pfundt, and Reinhardt - provide convincing enough evidence that timpanists could (and would) perform them in that manner. Then there's all the improv...
pI8Sv9b4 8 months ago
Dang! Timpani 25 beat me to it! My undergraduate dissertation was on Berlioz's use of percussion in SF along with his requiem. In it I gave a historical survey on things like baroque timpani, performance practice, stick usage, etc. But I'm loving this vid. Amazing plauing and variations.
DrumLuv23 1 year ago
que masacote
BayonneNick 1 year ago
great performance!
finnishredder 1 year ago
Great, where's the sheet music?
andrealmaid1 1 year ago
Comment removed
opus88888 1 year ago
great, but are those mallets too hard?
it sounds like there is too much sound from contact, and if you used softer mallets, it would make them sound much better
Sothe1424 2 years ago
@Sothe1424 remember, the wooden sticks were used to good effect when the timpani were played from horseback. later, german timpanists experimented with leather coverings, but felt or sponge covered sticks were not specifically asked for until around 1823 (by berlioz). therefore, the baroque timpani style would call for wood (or ivory) headed sticks.
timpani25 2 years ago
@timpani25 (from Ben Harms) Re: wooden sticks. A recent archival discovery in Germany has pushed back the making of felt-covered sticks to 1775 (a signed receipt from a furniture maker for 8 timpani sticks covered with felt as well as 4 uncovered). This is found on p 177 in a monumental collection of articles on historical percussion presented at a 2007conference in michaelstein cloister (Germany). It's Volume ("Heft") 75 of their publication series. 7 articles in English, 19 in German.
pI8Sv9b4 1 year ago
it's historical practice to use harder mallets in baroque playing, especially on period instruments. why? in the baroque era, softer mallets were virtually non-exsistant.
dbaerg 2 years ago
true, thanks
i think he should post of video of how the same solo sounds of modern timpani with soft mallets, it would sound great
Sothe1424 2 years ago
does it matter if the lower timpani is on the left side or the right side?
luvwithpiggy 2 years ago
No. It appears most of the German virtuosos of the 18th c. played with the lower drum on the right (there may have been exceptions). As a modern American I learned the other way around. Basically, both hands (and wrists) need to be strong and flexible.
harms42 2 years ago 2
Nice double tap
grooms63941 2 years ago
Actually, they are all single strokes
harms42 2 years ago
congratulations, i want to know if you can send me your e-mail becasue i want to be in contact with you. thanks
percutercu2 2 years ago
I really appriciate the articulation that you apply to the Baroque timps. I takes a great deal of controll to emulate the correct type of sound on the baroque timpani. It takes a great ear and proper hands to give the sound that you are properly demonstrating. I am espeacially found of the baroque timpani. I mean nothing beats a great set of Dres timps. But these timps are sooo awesome.
kingcap1226 2 years ago 3
is it easier to roll from one to the other when they are tilted like that?
reallyrandomdude23 2 years ago
The main reason for putting up this video was to demonstrate Baroque timpani technique - rhythmic variations, flourishes, etc.
The tone quality - when played on my laptop with good headphones - is acceptable in my opinion (the skins were at the end of their usefulness, as can be seen on the video). Drums of this design have been used to satisfaction in numerous places, including the Metropolitan Opera, Toronto's Tafelmusik, etc.
I'll address the matter of the intonation in a future post.
harms42 3 years ago
Comment removed
opus88888 2 years ago
Comment removed
opus88888 3 years ago
Wow, this is cool!
I didn't know how inspirating Timpani could be. - Thanks for sharing! :-)
Anuz92 3 years ago
Great Job! LOl at 0:55
geniousyo 3 years ago
is this from the concerto for 7 trumpets by altenburg?
dreuxschwartz 3 years ago
No. This theme is found at the top of p 130 of Altenburg's book on trumpet and timpani playing ("Versuch einer Anleitung zur heroisch-musikalischen Trompeter- und Paukerkunst"). His concerto for seven trumpets and timpani is found on p 133-142 of the same book.
harms42 3 years ago
Terrific!
swalt587 3 years ago
Impressive chops! Thanks for sharing
marine775 3 years ago