Better than incest..incest causes high health hazards for the beings created from those relationships..if people really do love eachother..no lust or hormone misleading you..then good for you people..
Thank you for posting this video. It's always wonderful to know about how other people practice polyamory and how they maintain successful relationships.
Did you think about having children with both men, with a DNA test on the first one to know who should father the second child (this can be done making the first father wearing condoms while the FUTURE father of the second child can have bareback sex) ??? Or you don´t want each man to have an equal reproductive value???
Where do you find other polyamory partners besides paying websites?My wife and I are very interested in Polyamory relationship but cant find partners what can we do?
What an asshole, HELLO DARLING! JESUS LIKE U WANT IN YOUR CUTE BIG BOOK, NEVER EXIST!... HE WAS A OPEN MIND HIPPE, with an open mind, he wanted to support diversity and understanding, among human beings, but as alpha males dominated the world at that time did not suit them what Jesus preached, he died crucified.
@Kosmologiikka You are pretty stupid, even for a Christian I might add. Why don't you fuck off and leave this comment section to nice and reasonable people who actually want to make a meaningful comment?
I work for the Bill Cunningham Show. The topic of my teams upcoming show the show is going to be about romantic relationships that involve more then 2 people. We are a show that deals with conflict resolution, so if there is any discord from either inside or outside of this atypical arrangement, we would aim to help solve it. If selected we cover all your travel(Flights, cars, hotels, food $). If interested write me back here or give me a call at 212-419-7479.
I also challenge you to catch up to the 21st century Democratic way of practicing relationships rather than being stuck on the Bible. Even Monogamy was bad in the Bible since women were often bought from their fathers and exchanged like property, rape victims had to marry their rapist (Deuteronomy 22:28-29) ,etc. You call that better than polygamy? Have you considered that there are GOOD ways BEYOND to practice POLY beyond what ancient GOAT HERDERS wrote about in the 'old book'?
You say polygamy was an allegory to show it was evil? Well that still does not equate to being sin otherwise since when does God give instructions on how to commit a sin or let sin unpunished? Poly being an allegory in Bible is UNSUPPORTED speculation and doesn't square with theology of an ALL good and wrathful God that killed kids for insulting and disobeyong parents, let alone stoned ADULTERs which poly would be if it were wrong, yet no consequences for it.
Great video, glad to see somebody else with a similar relationship, I'm in a long term triad right now with my wife, and our girlfriend, it's been going on for over 15 years, I agree, IT'S NOT EASY, but it can be a beautiful thing if done correctly. We follow many of the guidelines you mentioned, especially communication.
Thank you for recording this. I have been considering talking to my partner about entering polyamory. Your thoughts have given me some really good things to think about! Thanks!
Thank you for posting this. I'm a 28 year old woman who's new to polyamory with a girlfriend who has a husband. My question to you is how did your family take it, if they know? I'm stuck on introducing them as "My girlfriend and her husband".
So I am currently in a poly relationship with two other people. Now that I see that this video is a few years old I am wondering what the status of your relationship is. Have you found that the polyamorous relationship model is stable over a long period of time?
i don't understand.. being polyamorous and being married is the biggest contradiction. And there are no rules in polyamory, only the pursuit of happiness in others and allowance of that for others... maybe i'm going about this a little differently than others. I think marriage is a severely destructive force to healthy relationships.
@vans4menu All the people I know who are in poly relationships have guidelines and boundaries, saying "there are no rules in polyamory" is a nice theory but unlikely to work in actual relationships.
Aside from some religious people, who opposes the legalization of Poly? From what I have seen it looks like some Gay Marriage supporters, but not the Gays themselves, don't believe Poly is or should be next. Am running into them saying "its a fallacy". What kind of thinking are these people using? Either you oppose both or support both.
Preach on sister, polyamory is not polygamy, it's not just about sex, it's about caring for and loving more than one person too, and the best friends make the best lovers!
This is awesome. I'm actually in a class, so I don't have time to watch the whole video, but I may message you with some questions. I've been looking for a polyamorous relationship for about 6 years, but I never knew there was a word for it. I made a (mostly) logical conclusion.
Since I found the term, I've been finding tons of information on Google. It's awesome and inspiring.
@TEAmattBAGGER *laugh* Well that's certainly a possibility. But in most of the polyamorous relationships I've encountered, the 'primary couple' has a healthy sex life, but they trust one another enough to allow each other to seek additional fulfillment elsewhere. Or sometimes the primary couple mutually decide to invite a third person with whom to share their lives. It's rather awe-inspiring, I think, that people can love and trust each other to such an extent.
@TEAmattBAGGER Over a decade ago, when I was in high school, I only liked one girl at a time. It was "law". Even if I just had a crush, I got tunnel vision. Skip ahead--now, I "keep my options open"; I know what attracts me, and I've found more than one female possesses those characteristics.
When a monogamous person dates,if they find two potentially good mates, they'll "fine tooth comb" until one stands out.
A polyamorous person would just date them both, not force a choice.
Great for you guys. I wish there were more like you and less of those who have too low of an IQ to think for themselves. And kudos to you for being open about it.
False. There are no laws anywhere in the united states which forbid being in love with multiple people simultaneously. Polygamy is illegal - but that's being MARRIED to multiple people, which is very different.
@DendrilopisXaggro "polyamory its just a pesudo-neologist term for whoring"
"whoring" is when a person receives money in exchange for sexual favors. "Polyamory" has to do with a relationship in which one or more people are romantically involved with multiple people. I'm not sure what one has to do with the other.
@xxsanttxx "hmm? having sex with other ppl without being a cheater interesting...."
Every couple is allowed to write their own set of rules for their relationship. If you're not breaking those rules, then you're not 'cheating.' At least that's how I see it.
@xxsanttxx By definition, cheating is breaking rules. If you and your partner decide that having sex with other people is part of the rules, then you're not cheating.
At that point, if someone calls it cheating, he thinks his rules are more important than your relationship.
Do you think it's weird that I feel really uncomfortable with the idea of another man for my wife but the idea of having a new female spiritual partner sounds a possibility?
I watched an episode of strange sex and it showed a polyamory couple. I'm wondering how a relationship can work when jealousy is second nature, a universal human emotion, and is not influenced by culture/society. The girl on the show said she never gets jealous because she's self confident in herself, but really??... Just sounds like she's in denial.
@Deimos69r It's possible that she was in denial and/or insecure. People of all walks of life can have denial and insecurities. Just because the 'girl on the show' was potentially insecure or in denial, that has no reflection on polysexuality. In my experience, poly-people are often quite confident people, and often have lives with an abundance of questions and mysteries.
Humans act against their natures all the time. It is in a man's nature to screw every woman he can. But most monogamous men deny this nature to help sustain their marriage. If a man can, for a good cause, suppress his instinct to screw around, why can't a woman suppress her natural jealousy for a good cause? And much as a man can eventually feel comfortable with just one woman, a woman (or man) can eventually learn to not feel her jealousy.
@BailiffQuimby Yeah, that's arguing genetics vs. free will. Human beings can adapt, and they have relatively large brains...so, I agree. You can be born needy and jealous, but train yourself to be otherwise.
@Cinique1984 "You can be born needy and jealous, but train yourself to be otherwise."
Agreed. And moreover, human traits are always on a bell-curve. For example, there is an average height, and a few people are way way shorter and some are way way taller. Similarly, if the average human has X amt of jealousy, then some people might have a 2X amt and get jealous over everything, and some might have zero or close to zero, just from their natural brain chemistry.
@ArnacMGS Then if it' a logical conclusive system then everyone is doing. Obviously in the face of convention the norm is wrong and for recorded history the object of singilurism is incorrect. All it took was your incomplete comment on reasoning. I i will subjugate several awkward slightly overweight women such as Silverhuntress into a plural relationships...long as they have a bitch sword collection and every Eclipse book memorized it should work out. If they speak Eleven it's even better.
@ArnacMGS I'm saying be wise in your Multiamory lifestyle and only be involved with those able to provide a nice collection of collectable dragon figurines or a couple that can get crafty with hand made chainmail that have promise with a Bell Book & Candle store that's turning a good profit. Be wise, Multiamory wise.
@ArnacMGS You mean dumb it down? If you're a hot slightly socially awkward woman with endowments that's no stranger to make up we can talk. Especially if you have a season pass to Renfair.
@ArnacMGS Immaturity or maturity isn't a prerequisite for a relationship. The human paradigm is of single continuity. You can only ever love one person at a time of the opposite sex and at various aspects or facets of their personality; some come to light, other passions and or desires, needs and or personality traits wax or wane. Any and all cases in history of multiple marriages/life partners are for power, financial expansion and political posturing.
@totenkray "You can only ever love one person at a time..."
Says who? Most people experience love for two people simultaneously at some point in their lives. They just suppress it because jealousy tends to render such feelings moot.
"Any and all cases in history of multiple marriages/life partners are for power, financial expansion and political posturing. "
Flatly false. The ones you hear about in your history books are, because marriages that don't have to do with politics don't make it into history books. And even if your claim were true, that says nothing of a person's capability to love multiple people simultaneously.
@totenkray Those people had goals and polyamory served them, and polyamory varies. What form it takes depends on the people involved. My experiences have taught me that true love is virtually selfless. A relationship requires some selfishness; the degree of it varies.
I don't believe love is exclusive or magical, and I don't believe humans are all COMPLETELY different from each other. Love isn't what stops you from finding and loving another.
HA HA!!! The barbarian is led by the passions, the only life worth living is the restrained life. The barbarians are within the gate, and western civilization is about to collapse for no other reason that gross personal gratification, and the seven deadly sins...
@Mortaryan The seven deadly sins: arrogance, self-righteousness, imposing your beliefs on others, speaking on behalf of god, restricting the rights of others, judging others, being driven by hate rather than love. Are those the seven sins you meant?
@BailiffQuimby only a whore-monger, like Saul of Tarsus, perverts the Gospel to justify the the whoring sins of his fathers, Herod. And only a whore-monger turns hatred and addiction and lust into love, liberty and freedom.
@Mortaryan I don't know how you look at a loving caring relationship between consenting adults and see "hatred and addiction," but I feel sorry for you. And I'm sure that if Jesus were around, you would have his pity as well. Consider turning off the negativity and loving your neighbor instead of judging him. I suspect your god would approve.
@BailiffQuimby so says a fornicator and adulterer. Jesus said those who lust in their hearts have already committed adultery, and there is no divorce accept for adultery, to lust for other than your mate is a sin. Polyamory is sin of lust, lust blinds the heart and mind of the spiritual, and attaches consciousness to the temporal and phenomenal, and as the body rots and turns to dust so do you, only to be raised and condemned to everlasting suffering by Satan your father.
Whether or not you personally approve of my decisions or whether an old book approves has no bearing on the validity of my arguments. I claim that there is nothing morally wrong with multiple-partner relationships if all people involved are consenting, safe, and treat each other with love and respect. If you want to pose a counter-argument, you'll need something better than an unsubstantiated argument from authority.
"The old book," does not inform but, validates science concerning psychological and sociological healthy relationships - one man and one woman. Your lifestyle "choice" is based on nothing more than the gratification of NPD, and is symptomatic of an unhealthy pop-culture established for the purpose of cultural implosion. Polyamory is a symptom, one amongst many, of a break down in valid healthy social values and morals, not a valid alternative to cultural decay. You should examine your motives.
LOL! Science like the earth being flat? Science like a geo-centric universe spread across a sky-dome? I couldn't fit the amount of incorrect science and history in the bible into the Grand Canyon (which wasn't formed by Noah's flood.)
@BailiffQuimby Again, self justifying modern narcissistic bunk (just like polyamory). The ancients never believed the earth was flat, that was catholic bunk based on "pagan" philosophy of a dark age. Um...the prevailing theory, based on the most recent evidence, is that the grand canyon was created by a massive flooding effect. Science is not truth, but theories (best guesses) based on what is observable, and in regards to what is observable, that is nothing but a mere fraction of the total.
@Mortaryan "Again, self justifying modern narcissistic bunk"
The demonstrable fact that the bible gets a lot of science incorrect is narcissistic bunk? Please explain.
"(just like polyamory)"
Narcissism is love of oneself. Polyamory is, if anything, the opposite of that.
"The ancients never believed the earth was flat"
Apart from a few greek and arabic early astronomers, EVERYONE used to think the earth was flat. And certainly the authors of the bible did, as it is written.
@Mortaryan "Um...the prevailing theory, based on the most recent evidence, is that the grand canyon was created by a massive flooding effect."
No it isn't. Look at any scientific journal or website not affiliated with a religious agenda. No objective scientist believes that a single 40-day flood can carve one mile through stone.
"Science is not truth"
Science is a process by which we find truth, or at least the most accurate truth we can get from available evidence.
"Theories" are not simple "best guesses". Look up the requirements for a scientific assertion to reach the level of "theory"
"that is nothing but a mere fraction of the total."
It's the greatest claims we can assert based on everything we know. To pretend we know more than the evidence tells us is to be intellectually dishonest.
@Mortaryan "Your lifestyle "choice" is based on nothing more than the gratification of NPD"
You have no clue about my choices and why I make them. You would love to believe that everybody who doesn't think exactly like you is suffering from some kind of personality disorder, I'm sure. Too bad for you this isn't true, and I think you're smart enough that, at some level, you know that.
@Mortaryan "the behavior (the observable) is the symptom upon which my diagnosis is made."
The behavior of polyamory? Well then we're back to your begging the question. You claim that my behavior hurts myself and other people and is evidence of NPD. Support the claim with reason, logic and evidence, or admit that you're just talking out of your ass again. Does the DSM list polyamory as a symptom of NPD? Do you know how someone is being hurt by my behavior?
"Intolerance is a symptom. The disease is ignorance. You're still not presenting me with arguments for what's wrong with Polyamory. You just keep repeating "It's bad, it's a sin, it's a symptom of sinful pop-culture, blah blah blah" WHY do you think it's bad?
"You should examine your motives."
My motives for what? Being in a healthy adult relationship or arguing with your indoctrinated ass?
@BailiffQuimby you cannot hear what you don't/won't want to, your not listening, because you are suffering from NPD, and like the drug addict, don't want to hear that you are out of control and hurting yourself and those around you...the only way you will face the destruction of your life choices are when you are face down in the gutter, and the suffering of your choices have brought you or those you love to ruin...or you won't and it will be too late.
"...don't want to hear that you are out of control and hurting yourself and those around you"
If you're going to make such an accusation, you need to back it up with evidence. You have none. If I accused you of having schizophrenia, you would be right to doubt me unless I backed it up with evidence. Before an assertion you make has any value, you need to support it. Can you support your claim that I have NPD and that I hurt myself and those around me?
If the 'old book' you're referring to is the Bible, then even there we find God approved multiple partner relationships, although those were within a marriage. I wonder how did you draw the conclusion that ONLY monogamy is good when polygamy has been suppressed by laws (at least for now) or hasn't been given a fair chance? Show me a study showing that CONSENSUAL poly is bad. I'd only say non-marital polyamory is bad if we go by BIBLICAL morals but show me scientifically, please.
No, God didn't. God created Adam and Eve to be help mates to each other (monogamy), and every instance of polygamy is an allegory to teach why it is evil and does not work. and the one law that allows it was not because God wanted that for human beings but because God recognized the evil that was in the hearts of human beings at the time, and that was even with a people God set apart as the holiest of people on the earth, so think how bad the rest of humanity was and you desire returning to that
How God created things in the beginning does not always stand for a rule, otherwise everyone would have to be married or not be single, donate their ribs to their wife, and be naked. Also, are you familar with 'plural' marriage which is having more than one marriage at a time. Yes, Adam and Eve can indicate that there's TWO people per marriage but it doesnt mention how many marriages a person can have, only how many involved in a marriage. So 2 wives can be two separate marriages
@Mortaryan "Jesus said ... is a sin. Polyamory is sin of lust...as the body rots and turns to dust so do you, ...everlasting suffering by Satan your father..."
Unless you can provide some evidence or rational reason why I should accept your particular brand of Christianity as an accurate portrayal of reality, your ranting, preaching and empty threats are about as compelling as an Odin worshipper trying to convert you.
The only limitations we have in love are those we place upon ourselves.
I'm about > < that close to entering into my first true polyamorous relationship. It's been a dream of mine sinc I first heard the term 12 years ago. I've talked to the couple, and am excited- and just a little bit nervous- to meet them in person. I know that they are madly in love with each other, and have thus far been nothing but wonderful to me. But we shall see what happens when we meet in person! <3
@seawind0721 I'd only do it if the man is a member of the SCA and the woman has a nice collection of original TekWar books. Otherwise don't do it if she just has a erotic candle business that only sells online and at Renaissance Fairs.
@seawind0721 12 years!? Jeez. I came to the idea of polyamory, about 6 - 7 years ago...became convinced I wanted to do it (at age 21), and I had no idea, until last week...that anyone else in the world had similar desires. I sure snow-snot didn't know there's a community behind it.
Let's just call a spade a spade. Polyamory is still fornication and adultery rolled into one. It's funny how humans "dress" sins to make it look good and palatable. They invent terms to avoid words like lesbianism, homosexuality, abortion, and even beastiality. Anyway, you can do everything you like but remember this, God will judge every wicked people in this world. You will find yourself in front of Jesus and will be accountable to all you've said and done. Be holy for God is holy.
@ByJustified I'm sorry, just where did this woman mention religion in her video? Why can't religious people just leave well enough alone? Perhaps you can't stand the thought that other people don't take such nonsense and superstition as seriously as you do. If you didn't notice, what they're doing is not adultery. Or have you never read in the Bible the fact that many of the patriarchs had multiple wives and concubines? Something you might want to stop and think about.
@jazztbvwr69 Unfortunately, many people are ignorant as to why David and Solomon had to marry women. They actually did it not because God told them to do so but they see it as a political advantage of expanding their own geographical kingdom. God did not condone their practice. Remember, every human was given the freedom to decide for himself whether he will follow the Lord or not. If Jesus Christ Himself supported monogamy then who are we to tamper with God's original design? (Read Matt.19:5)
@ByJustified It would appear that you are ignorant as well. 1st, Jesus did not live in old testament times. The main reason for them having concubines was to produces heirs, especially in the case of a woman being barren, as was the case with Abraham and Sarah. Give me one scripture in the old testament where god condemned the practice and thus they weren't following the lord? Your comment is based on the assumption of some unity between OT and NT that doesn't exist!
@ByJustified 2nd, if it was such a sin for them, then why aren't they going to hell that everyone else Christians would so easily condemn? In NT times things changed. Frankly, the NT writers could make Jesus say whatever they wanted or that would suit them. That's obviously the reason why people find contradictions in the Bible! Admit the truth, the Bible is man's word, not god's. You're right, people do have the right to reject superstion and I'm glad to see that they're doing it!
@jazztbvwr69 So tell me what book have you exhaustively studied and read from the Scripture and let's discuss it point by point. Since the Bible was written in Hebrew and Greek, let's go back to those ancient language. I had the opportunity to study that language formally so let's see what you've got. I'm on. Unfortunately, people who wants to discredit the Bible justifies homosexuality, incest, perversions, lesbianism, adultery, and fornication and uses flowery term to describe these sins.
@ByJustified The challenge was for you to produce one OT passage condemning the practice. You're the one condemning the practice. Since you're so familiar with the original language that shouldn't be hard for you, should it?
Just because I don't take the bible seriously doesn't mean I justify the things you mentioned. But I'd caution you to tread carefully about certain things. For example, Abraham married Sarah even though she was his half-sister (incest). Yet god blessed her.
@jazztbvwr69 The question would be does their culture allow such practices? How about your culture? Does your culture allow such practice of marrying your half-sister? Tell me. Oh, by the way, even though God did not verbally condemn the immoral practice of Abraham with Hagar, David with Bathsheba, and Solomon with his many wives and concubines does not mean God commends such practices. You still have to go back and read the past laws in the book of Genesis and Leviticus.
@ByJustified What law in Genesis and Leviticus do you refer to? You still have yet to provide the reference. Maybe your putting words in your gods mouth. Not surprising, since this is what men do anyway. And you only have hearsay evidence for your god in the first place. The lifestyle suggested here may be immoral in your book, but you can't argue it's unethical, and that's my point.
@ByJustified By the way, the examples you lumped together are not all the same. In the bible god specifically condemned David, as well as Solomon, though the problem with Solomon was turning to other gods. Abraham was not condemned as immoral. Curious Lev 18:8 (NLT) would tell them not to have relations with any of their father's WIVES. Why not tell them not to have multiple wives? Or Deuteronomy 21:15-17 that speaks of a man having two wives. Why not condemn it right here? He doesn't.
@ByJustified Adultery is wrong because you've lied to your partner that you'll follow the rules. But if the rules are polyamory, not monogamy, how can you be said to break the rules? I think your problem is that you don't want people to have the power to make ethical decisions on their own. Just because people disparage the bible doesn't automatically mean they become contemptible human beings. Some of America's founding fathers fit the category but their character was exemplary.
@jazztbvwr69 Adultery is a sin because you transgress the law of God which says "Thou shalt not commit adultery." God designed humans to have only one husband or wife. Whether the couple agreed with consent to take in the "boyfriend" or "girlfriend" of the wife or the husband in the circle of that "polygamous" relationship does not make it right in the eyes of God or man. To redesign this divine union is to go against the original design of God to protect humanity from self-destruction.
@ByJustified As I said in the beginning, who said this couple is religious? You can scream all you want about your invisible gods law, but the fact of the matter is, not everyone believes your definition of terms in this case. Why are you trying to force your gods way on others? You don't have that right. People have the right to disagree. Christianity is not the only philosophy out there. It may be the only one legit for YOU, but that does not make it so for others.
@jazztbvwr69 Remember, these tyoe of immorality has been dealt with by the God of the Israelites and Christian believers many centuries ago. Even before Buddha, Muhammad, and Confucius were born. People today are just trying to revised these wicked immoral behavior by clothing it with their own definition. Whatever you may call this kind of relationship, it is still outright adultery and fornication. The writer of Ecclesiastes is right when he wrote, "There is nothing new under the sun." Ec. 1:9
@ByJustified You are so narrow in your thinking it's not funny. It sounds as if you believe EVERYONE was informed back then of how the god of the bible felt about certain behaviors. There WERE people who had never heard of him, believe it or not. The real problem with adultery is it's an act of deception. A married woman has sex with someone other than her spouse, gets pregnant, yet gives birth to the child as though it were her husband's. THAT is the real problem. e.g David and Bathsheba.
@ByJustified But what if there is consent by both husband and wife? No deception. Consider the fact that several of the biblical patriarchs conceived children via their concubines/handmaidens. This was socially acceptable because having children was of primary importance, especially if the wife was barren. Was that adultery, too? At any rate, have at your little narrow view of the world, Your holy book also says judge not that you be not judged., because it will be measured back to you.
@BailiffQuimby ... Why don't you study these words of Jesus Christ, "Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,' and said, 'For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh'? Matt. 19:4-5 Uhmmm... Did Jesus said "united to his wives?" I hope everyone of you who practices adultery and fornication out there will be convicted of Jesus words. May you come to your senses.
@ByJustified "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife,..."
This does not specifically condemn polygamy. Did Jesus say, "You should never be married to more than one person"?
"united to his wives?"
Absence of condonement does not equal condemnation. The bible often refers a person's son or a person's daughter. Does that mean you can never have multiple children?
@ByJustified "I hope everyone of you who practices adultery and fornication out there will be convicted of Jesus words. May you come to your senses."
And I hope that you will one day see that what consenting adults decide to do and with whom in the privacy of their homes is neither yours nor Jesus' nor anyone else's business.
@BailiffQuimby... Well, Jesus knows that these things will happen even before you and I are not yet born. I hope you will quit sinning and return to Him. One day you will surely realize that your Christian relatives are right that you need to give your life to Christ.
@ByJustified "Well, Jesus knows that these things will happen even before you and I are not yet born"
What things? What are you talking about?
"I hope you will quit sinning"
Your definition of "sin" and my concept of morality are worlds apart. By secular moral standards, I'm a good person. By any other standards, you need to demonstrate that they matter first.
"One day you will surely realize that your Christian relatives are right"
My "christian relatives" are as non-existent as your god. I'm ethnically jewish and philosophically secular.
"that you need to give your life to Christ."
I've already offered my life to my wife, children, family, friends, and students. I can't also give it to your god. There's only so much of me to go around, and I'd rather give my life to people I know exist.
@BailiffQuimby... Have you seen an atomic particle? If you have not seen one, will you believe this particle is existent despite the fact that you haven't personally seen it yourself? I hope you get my point. Giving your life to your love ones is very temporary but giving your life to Jesus who is called Yahweh is fulfilling. Why don't you try it. In fact,
"[would] you believe this particle is existent despite the fact that you haven't personally seen it yourself?"
I might, depending on the reliability or the scientist. Particle physicists have established a history of being demonstrably right about things. So they've earned a certain amount of reasonable trust. Mind you, it depends on the claim - if a particle physicist tells me he has a pet dragon, I'll require further evidence.
Point gotten and refuted. There are two differences between believing a priest when he tells you that there are magical invisible beings controlling our fates and a scientist telling me about protons and electrons: The earned trust of the scientist and the fantastical nature of the claim made by the priest.
@ByJustified "Giving your life to your love ones is very temporary"
I disagree. Devoting my life to my loved ones perpetuates a meme that shifts the human race towards a more rational and compassionate race. This is very long-term, perhaps as long-term as the human race will survive. I'm only a small piece of the puzzle, but every piece helps.
"but giving your life to Jesus who is called Yahweh is fulfilling."
Whether or not it gives you a nice warm fuzzy feeling doesn't indicate whether or not this being exists. And if he doesn't, then you're being incredibly unproductive with your limited time of existence.
"Why don't you try it."
Obviously because I can't devote my life to a being that I don't believe exists. It's the same reason you couldn't arbitrarily start devoting your life to Thor.
@ByJustified Anyhow, the topic of the video is Polyamory. So to get back to the subject matter, love is real. Love is demonstrably a good thing when it is practiced in a way where people aren't hurt. Whether or not there's a god, I can't believe he would tell us to love less. Jesus never condemned polyamory in the bible, and he DID say that love was a good thing. So I'm placing your god squarely on my side of the debate.
@BailiffQuimby Hmm... It seems like the atheists here could not even defend their position. A simple understanding of faith and science troubles them eh! A wife will always be hurt deep inside if the love of her husband is being shared with another woman. You may not see that from the outside but I am sure they will deny their feelings. Men and women involve in this so-called "polyamorous" relationship which is really adultery and fornication are hurting deep inside because of their past.
@BailiffQuimby... No need for telepathy friend. All you need to do is start counseling women and you will be surprise that they are not really happy with their adulterous condition... I'm sure you are also hurting deep inside because of your past hurts. I understand that your parents probably have not spent time with you while you grow up. Did they? Is your parents still living together? I hope they are. Do they give you advise or suggestions? Did they teach you to love the Lord? Think about it.
@ByJustified "All you need to do is start counseling women"
Are you actually a counselor? If you aren't, you don't know what you're talking about. If you are, then you are seeing a select group of women who have issues, and not an unbiased sample. Neither my wife nor I are unhappy, and we know our emotions better than you do. I had a happy childhood, my folks are still together and happy, and they taught me to think for myself and be who I want to be without judging others.
@BailiffQuimby Y=In order for you to experience true happiness you really have to start loving Jesus Christ by forsaking all immoralities and perversion.Why not start doing it today.
@ByJustified "In order for you to experience true happiness you really have to start loving Jesus Christ"
False, and provably false. I am truly happy and I don't even believe in Jesus as god. So there, just kinda blew your argument out of the water. You should be careful not to make generalized statements that you can't support with evidence.
"by forsaking all immoralities and perversion"
What you find immoral and perverse, other people may find just fine.
@BailiffQuimby That is temporal happiness friend. What's I'm talking about is true happiness that does not come from this world. Would you like to receive Jesus now through prayer?
@ByJustified I was raised Christian and loved Jesus. I knew happiness then. I have since experienced many things outside the miniscule circle that is the church and am now polyamorous and following the wisdom of Odin, Fraija, Ulr, Vili and Wayland. I have never been happier in my entire life.
If you think that you can convert anyone through the comments on youtube then you do not understand how people work. Try being a missionary by example instead of being argumentative.
@drflybane... Remember, emotions can be very deceiving at times. Emotion should not be our authority but the Word of God (the Bible). The Lord created and designed you so please don't pretend to know what's best for you. Satanism have their motto: "If it feels good then do it." All they care is their flesh and emotion. The apostle Paul warned us not to live in the flesh but by the Spirit of God. Why don't you start seeking what is true joy in the Lord and not that temporal "happiness."
@ByJustified More arguments, ok. Joy is an emotion as well. Following your line of reasoning, joy can be deceiving. The Christian bible has many emotionally influenced passages too. More deception? How can the Christian bible be an authority when the Catholic church has put out more editions then the Oxford Univ Press has put out dictionaries? Why are there more books based on letters from Paul then gospels of Jesus? You are a Paulian, not a Christian.
@ByJustified Why are you not eating kosher? Jesus never said to stop. The laws of kashrut are still in the old testament. There is nothing in the new testament that says that all the laws of the old testament no longer apply.
What does any of this have to do with polyamory or this well done video? NOTHING. You are just throwing your religion around. You can not convince people that they need saving this way. This is not your god's desire, this is your ego's desire. This just makes you feel good.
@drflybane... The Bible states, "Without holiness no one will see the Lord." Heb. 12:14. Do you think this "polyamory" ("adultery & fornication") is holy and even pleasing to the Lord Jesus Christ? By the way, eating "kosher" is a law for the Jews. If a Christian wants to eat "kosher" just because he likes it then no problem. However, the Bible says, "For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit," (Rom. 14:17)
@ByJustified Odin had Goddesses Frigga, Jord, Rinde, the giantess Gyrd all as wives as well as others hinted at but not named. There are also many royal families who claim they are descended from Odin through other sons. So is a polyamory style of relationship holy? Probably not but it sure isn't frowned upon. Is it pleasing to the Jesus fellow? I don't care. Not in my pantheon.
I see you are also continuing to quot from your "savior" Paul. Seems like this guy is more important then your Christ.
@ByJustified "Do you think this "polyamory" is...pleasing to the Lord Jesus Christ?"
I've already confessed that since there is no evidence that your (or any) god exists, I don't believe. But I can claim no absolute knowledge on the subject. So I will add that, if your god or any of the many other gods exist, I believe that they are horribly embarrassed by people who claim to know how they feel about a particular issue and impose their views on others, imagining that god must feel the same way.
This is the best description of polyamory, very true to all points and very in depth. Thank you.
MrKoshak 1 week ago
Thanks. xx
DIAMONdKEEN 3 weeks ago
Thank you for putting up this video. Honesty and trust are the underlying principles I believe.
templeofned 1 month ago
im just sayin how stupid do u feel knowing your girl is getting fucked by sum other guy. yall r just to stupid to care.
RickTrololo 1 month ago
Better than incest..incest causes high health hazards for the beings created from those relationships..if people really do love eachother..no lust or hormone misleading you..then good for you people..
furiousjuffowup 1 month ago
Thank you for posting this video. It's always wonderful to know about how other people practice polyamory and how they maintain successful relationships.
nl6 1 month ago
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just a bunch of bisexual faggots that love to spred aids to there hermaphrodite offspring
RickTrololo 1 month ago
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@RickTrololo re: "just a bunch of bisexual faggots that love to spred aids to there hermaphrodite offspring"
You didn't get a lot of hugs growing up, did you?
BailiffQuimby 1 month ago
@RickTrololo FUCK. YOU.
guilmon182 1 month ago
@guilmon182 point proven, lol damn hermaphrodite
RickTrololo 1 month ago
@RickTrololo obvious troll is obvious
AnubisEye009 1 month ago
Did you think about having children with both men, with a DNA test on the first one to know who should father the second child (this can be done making the first father wearing condoms while the FUTURE father of the second child can have bareback sex) ??? Or you don´t want each man to have an equal reproductive value???
kaledon6 2 months ago
Where do you find other polyamory partners besides paying websites?My wife and I are very interested in Polyamory relationship but cant find partners what can we do?
MrHykeem 3 months ago
@MrHykeem I'd suggest looking to people/couples you both are already close to that you think might be interested in trying it too.
HorrorHiro 3 months ago
What an asshole, HELLO DARLING! JESUS LIKE U WANT IN YOUR CUTE BIG BOOK, NEVER EXIST!... HE WAS A OPEN MIND HIPPE, with an open mind, he wanted to support diversity and understanding, among human beings, but as alpha males dominated the world at that time did not suit them what Jesus preached, he died crucified.
MissParadoja 4 months ago
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Filthy whore! Jesus will torture you in hell you dirty slut!
Kosmologiikka 4 months ago
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@Kosmologiikka "Filthy whore! Jesus will torture you in hell you dirty slut!"
Will he? I didn't realize that Jesus was such a hate-filled dick. Why does Jesus despise the concept of love so much? Did he have a bad breakup?
BailiffQuimby 4 months ago
@BailiffQuimby Because Jesus taught us that you can only fuck one boy at a time.
Kosmologiikka 4 months ago
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@Kosmologiikka "Because Jesus taught us that you can only fuck one boy at a time."
You already indicated that. Why did he teach us this?
BailiffQuimby 4 months ago
@Kosmologiikka You are pretty stupid, even for a Christian I might add. Why don't you fuck off and leave this comment section to nice and reasonable people who actually want to make a meaningful comment?
cyclopwarriorgunman 4 months ago
@Kosmologiikka Jesus would torture someone? Jesus spends his time in hell? Sounds like you need to read the bible a little more often.
JohnAdamZiolkowski 2 months ago
I work for the Bill Cunningham Show. The topic of my teams upcoming show the show is going to be about romantic relationships that involve more then 2 people. We are a show that deals with conflict resolution, so if there is any discord from either inside or outside of this atypical arrangement, we would aim to help solve it. If selected we cover all your travel(Flights, cars, hotels, food $). If interested write me back here or give me a call at 212-419-7479.
RandiGodshaw 4 months ago
Mortaryan,
I also challenge you to catch up to the 21st century Democratic way of practicing relationships rather than being stuck on the Bible. Even Monogamy was bad in the Bible since women were often bought from their fathers and exchanged like property, rape victims had to marry their rapist (Deuteronomy 22:28-29) ,etc. You call that better than polygamy? Have you considered that there are GOOD ways BEYOND to practice POLY beyond what ancient GOAT HERDERS wrote about in the 'old book'?
PolyPride3 4 months ago
cont'd post to Mortaryan.
You say polygamy was an allegory to show it was evil? Well that still does not equate to being sin otherwise since when does God give instructions on how to commit a sin or let sin unpunished? Poly being an allegory in Bible is UNSUPPORTED speculation and doesn't square with theology of an ALL good and wrathful God that killed kids for insulting and disobeyong parents, let alone stoned ADULTERs which poly would be if it were wrong, yet no consequences for it.
PolyPride3 4 months ago
Great video, glad to see somebody else with a similar relationship, I'm in a long term triad right now with my wife, and our girlfriend, it's been going on for over 15 years, I agree, IT'S NOT EASY, but it can be a beautiful thing if done correctly. We follow many of the guidelines you mentioned, especially communication.
fuzzylimpkin 4 months ago
very interesting! never heard of this! good information!
angkittykat09 4 months ago
Polygamy & Polyandry has existed for centuries among different societies and cultures.
I dont have a problem with polyamory.
1NX9 4 months ago
Thank you for recording this. I have been considering talking to my partner about entering polyamory. Your thoughts have given me some really good things to think about! Thanks!
MmmSauceNeal 5 months ago
Thank you for posting this. I'm a 28 year old woman who's new to polyamory with a girlfriend who has a husband. My question to you is how did your family take it, if they know? I'm stuck on introducing them as "My girlfriend and her husband".
binxis2cute 5 months ago
@binxis2cute
For me I wouldnt care what my family thinks.
Ultimately its my life and your life. And life is too short.
1NX9 4 months ago
sometimes ya just need a good threeway!
reptilia5 6 months ago
So I am currently in a poly relationship with two other people. Now that I see that this video is a few years old I am wondering what the status of your relationship is. Have you found that the polyamorous relationship model is stable over a long period of time?
s3harvey 6 months ago
i don't understand.. being polyamorous and being married is the biggest contradiction. And there are no rules in polyamory, only the pursuit of happiness in others and allowance of that for others... maybe i'm going about this a little differently than others. I think marriage is a severely destructive force to healthy relationships.
vans4menu 7 months ago
@vans4menu All the people I know who are in poly relationships have guidelines and boundaries, saying "there are no rules in polyamory" is a nice theory but unlikely to work in actual relationships.
KristofskiKabuki 6 months ago
Aside from some religious people, who opposes the legalization of Poly? From what I have seen it looks like some Gay Marriage supporters, but not the Gays themselves, don't believe Poly is or should be next. Am running into them saying "its a fallacy". What kind of thinking are these people using? Either you oppose both or support both.
ImperialGenKlenner 8 months ago
Preach on sister, polyamory is not polygamy, it's not just about sex, it's about caring for and loving more than one person too, and the best friends make the best lovers!
macelius 8 months ago
This is awesome. I'm actually in a class, so I don't have time to watch the whole video, but I may message you with some questions. I've been looking for a polyamorous relationship for about 6 years, but I never knew there was a word for it. I made a (mostly) logical conclusion.
Since I found the term, I've been finding tons of information on Google. It's awesome and inspiring.
Cinique1984 8 months ago
So I am going to have a guess at how this genrally works!
So you find a man that you truly love, who is a great husband and a great Father and who brings money home and supports his family.....
..... BUT!!! Polyamory starts to exist in the relationship because he sucks in bed??? is this how it normally pans out???
TEAmattBAGGER 8 months ago
@TEAmattBAGGER *laugh* Well that's certainly a possibility. But in most of the polyamorous relationships I've encountered, the 'primary couple' has a healthy sex life, but they trust one another enough to allow each other to seek additional fulfillment elsewhere. Or sometimes the primary couple mutually decide to invite a third person with whom to share their lives. It's rather awe-inspiring, I think, that people can love and trust each other to such an extent.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@TEAmattBAGGER Over a decade ago, when I was in high school, I only liked one girl at a time. It was "law". Even if I just had a crush, I got tunnel vision. Skip ahead--now, I "keep my options open"; I know what attracts me, and I've found more than one female possesses those characteristics.
When a monogamous person dates,if they find two potentially good mates, they'll "fine tooth comb" until one stands out.
A polyamorous person would just date them both, not force a choice.
Cinique1984 8 months ago
interesting.
ghosttoco 9 months ago
Great for you guys. I wish there were more like you and less of those who have too low of an IQ to think for themselves. And kudos to you for being open about it.
drakara01 9 months ago
thanks for posting, as you can see below, there are a lot of idiots in the world.
hcolfer 9 months ago
hoe, polyamory is illegal in the US. you're a polygamist
Novascova 9 months ago
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@Novascova "polyamory is illegal in the US"
False. There are no laws anywhere in the united states which forbid being in love with multiple people simultaneously. Polygamy is illegal - but that's being MARRIED to multiple people, which is very different.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
polyamory its just a pesudo-neologist term for whoring
DendrilopisXaggro 9 months ago
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@DendrilopisXaggro "polyamory its just a pesudo-neologist term for whoring"
"whoring" is when a person receives money in exchange for sexual favors. "Polyamory" has to do with a relationship in which one or more people are romantically involved with multiple people. I'm not sure what one has to do with the other.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
It seems alot like its just the two of you are going after others as just fuck buddies thats not a polyamory relationship
kakairuislove 9 months ago
hmm? having sex with other ppl without being a cheater interesting....
xxsanttxx 9 months ago
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@xxsanttxx "hmm? having sex with other ppl without being a cheater interesting...."
Every couple is allowed to write their own set of rules for their relationship. If you're not breaking those rules, then you're not 'cheating.' At least that's how I see it.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@xxsanttxx By definition, cheating is breaking rules. If you and your partner decide that having sex with other people is part of the rules, then you're not cheating.
At that point, if someone calls it cheating, he thinks his rules are more important than your relationship.
Cinique1984 8 months ago
I liked the vid, good info.
MacHamish 10 months ago 3
you are an idiot
musiclover21187 10 months ago
This is inspirational
Do you think it's weird that I feel really uncomfortable with the idea of another man for my wife but the idea of having a new female spiritual partner sounds a possibility?
ArnacMGS 10 months ago
Slut!
neverstandingstill20 10 months ago
@neverstandingstill20 "Slut!"
Why? I can't find any definition of the word into which this woman would fit.
BailiffQuimby 10 months ago
Silvurhuntress you're an inspiration!!
alohaoliwa 10 months ago
If you're straight all 3. How do you 3 do it?
a. (2)-MF are on and the 3rd-M is watching (same room).
b. (2)-MF are on and doing it behind a foldable screen while the 3rd-M is watching a movie or doing something else (same room).
c. MFM sandwich.
d. none of the above
babiaka 11 months ago
@babiaka Or perhaps all of the above at various times, depending on their mood?
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
I watched an episode of strange sex and it showed a polyamory couple. I'm wondering how a relationship can work when jealousy is second nature, a universal human emotion, and is not influenced by culture/society. The girl on the show said she never gets jealous because she's self confident in herself, but really??... Just sounds like she's in denial.
Deimos69r 11 months ago
Comment removed
alohaoliwa 10 months ago
@Deimos69r It's possible that she was in denial and/or insecure. People of all walks of life can have denial and insecurities. Just because the 'girl on the show' was potentially insecure or in denial, that has no reflection on polysexuality. In my experience, poly-people are often quite confident people, and often have lives with an abundance of questions and mysteries.
alohaoliwa 10 months ago
@Deimos69r "...when jealousy is second nature"
Humans act against their natures all the time. It is in a man's nature to screw every woman he can. But most monogamous men deny this nature to help sustain their marriage. If a man can, for a good cause, suppress his instinct to screw around, why can't a woman suppress her natural jealousy for a good cause? And much as a man can eventually feel comfortable with just one woman, a woman (or man) can eventually learn to not feel her jealousy.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@BailiffQuimby Yeah, that's arguing genetics vs. free will. Human beings can adapt, and they have relatively large brains...so, I agree. You can be born needy and jealous, but train yourself to be otherwise.
Cinique1984 8 months ago
@Cinique1984 "You can be born needy and jealous, but train yourself to be otherwise."
Agreed. And moreover, human traits are always on a bell-curve. For example, there is an average height, and a few people are way way shorter and some are way way taller. Similarly, if the average human has X amt of jealousy, then some people might have a 2X amt and get jealous over everything, and some might have zero or close to zero, just from their natural brain chemistry.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@BailiffQuimby Wow...awesome analogy. You just got a spot on my awesome list. I love you, lol.
Cinique1984 8 months ago
@Cinique1984 And I love you too. Isn't it wonderful to live in a world where saying that doesn't somehow negate our love for anyone else?
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
Polyamory is wrong, you can't mix a greek and a latin root.
Multiamory was invented by men to enslave stupid women into not wanting solidity but ambiguity.
You're just being used honey.
totenkray 11 months ago
@totenkray
To follow this absurd reasoning
If someone had to be the user and someone used. Don't you think it's she's the user with two male partners?
But ofcourse your entire reasoning is wrong
ArnacMGS 10 months ago
@ArnacMGS Then if it' a logical conclusive system then everyone is doing. Obviously in the face of convention the norm is wrong and for recorded history the object of singilurism is incorrect. All it took was your incomplete comment on reasoning. I i will subjugate several awkward slightly overweight women such as Silverhuntress into a plural relationships...long as they have a bitch sword collection and every Eclipse book memorized it should work out. If they speak Eleven it's even better.
totenkray 10 months ago
@totenkray So what are you saying?
ArnacMGS 10 months ago
@ArnacMGS I'm saying be wise in your Multiamory lifestyle and only be involved with those able to provide a nice collection of collectable dragon figurines or a couple that can get crafty with hand made chainmail that have promise with a Bell Book & Candle store that's turning a good profit. Be wise, Multiamory wise.
totenkray 10 months ago
@totenkray
Speaka da normal language okay?
ArnacMGS 10 months ago
@ArnacMGS You mean dumb it down? If you're a hot slightly socially awkward woman with endowments that's no stranger to make up we can talk. Especially if you have a season pass to Renfair.
totenkray 10 months ago
@totenkray
To sadden your intuition, I am not a woman
I just don't posses english as my native language
ArnacMGS 10 months ago
@ArnacMGS No because women can't control men. That's absurd.
totenkray 8 months ago
@totenkray
Your logic is pretty absurd
ArnacMGS 8 months ago
@ArnacMGS Your assumption at my absurdity is absurd.
totenkray 8 months ago
@totenkray
You talk about control in a relation
A relation is not about control
but apparantly you don't know much about it regarding your immature comments
ArnacMGS 8 months ago
@ArnacMGS Immaturity or maturity isn't a prerequisite for a relationship. The human paradigm is of single continuity. You can only ever love one person at a time of the opposite sex and at various aspects or facets of their personality; some come to light, other passions and or desires, needs and or personality traits wax or wane. Any and all cases in history of multiple marriages/life partners are for power, financial expansion and political posturing.
totenkray 8 months ago
@totenkray "You can only ever love one person at a time..."
Says who? Most people experience love for two people simultaneously at some point in their lives. They just suppress it because jealousy tends to render such feelings moot.
"...of the opposite sex"
So you don't believe homosexuals exist?
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@totenkray
"Any and all cases in history of multiple marriages/life partners are for power, financial expansion and political posturing. "
Flatly false. The ones you hear about in your history books are, because marriages that don't have to do with politics don't make it into history books. And even if your claim were true, that says nothing of a person's capability to love multiple people simultaneously.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@totenkray Those people had goals and polyamory served them, and polyamory varies. What form it takes depends on the people involved. My experiences have taught me that true love is virtually selfless. A relationship requires some selfishness; the degree of it varies.
I don't believe love is exclusive or magical, and I don't believe humans are all COMPLETELY different from each other. Love isn't what stops you from finding and loving another.
Cinique1984 8 months ago
@totenkray "Multiamory was invented by men to enslave stupid women into not wanting solidity but ambiguity. You're just being used honey. "
Do you feel the same way about polyamorous relationships which are instigated by women?
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
the bible is a book. Get over it ;)
Heretiik 1 year ago 12
@Heretiik restrain your gentiles, have values and morals, get over yourself.
Mortaryan 8 months ago
@Mortaryan I would love to restrain the Gentiles. But they're a loud and obnoxious bunch...
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
HA HA!!! The barbarian is led by the passions, the only life worth living is the restrained life. The barbarians are within the gate, and western civilization is about to collapse for no other reason that gross personal gratification, and the seven deadly sins...
Mortaryan 8 months ago
@Mortaryan The seven deadly sins: arrogance, self-righteousness, imposing your beliefs on others, speaking on behalf of god, restricting the rights of others, judging others, being driven by hate rather than love. Are those the seven sins you meant?
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@BailiffQuimby only a whore-monger, like Saul of Tarsus, perverts the Gospel to justify the the whoring sins of his fathers, Herod. And only a whore-monger turns hatred and addiction and lust into love, liberty and freedom.
Mortaryan 7 months ago
@Mortaryan I don't know how you look at a loving caring relationship between consenting adults and see "hatred and addiction," but I feel sorry for you. And I'm sure that if Jesus were around, you would have his pity as well. Consider turning off the negativity and loving your neighbor instead of judging him. I suspect your god would approve.
BailiffQuimby 7 months ago
@BailiffQuimby so says a fornicator and adulterer. Jesus said those who lust in their hearts have already committed adultery, and there is no divorce accept for adultery, to lust for other than your mate is a sin. Polyamory is sin of lust, lust blinds the heart and mind of the spiritual, and attaches consciousness to the temporal and phenomenal, and as the body rots and turns to dust so do you, only to be raised and condemned to everlasting suffering by Satan your father.
Mortaryan 6 months ago
@Mortaryan "so says a fornicator and adulterer"
Whether or not you personally approve of my decisions or whether an old book approves has no bearing on the validity of my arguments. I claim that there is nothing morally wrong with multiple-partner relationships if all people involved are consenting, safe, and treat each other with love and respect. If you want to pose a counter-argument, you'll need something better than an unsubstantiated argument from authority.
BailiffQuimby 6 months ago
"The old book," does not inform but, validates science concerning psychological and sociological healthy relationships - one man and one woman. Your lifestyle "choice" is based on nothing more than the gratification of NPD, and is symptomatic of an unhealthy pop-culture established for the purpose of cultural implosion. Polyamory is a symptom, one amongst many, of a break down in valid healthy social values and morals, not a valid alternative to cultural decay. You should examine your motives.
Mortaryan 6 months ago
@Mortaryan ""The old book," does not inform"
No argument here.
"but, validates science"
LOL! Science like the earth being flat? Science like a geo-centric universe spread across a sky-dome? I couldn't fit the amount of incorrect science and history in the bible into the Grand Canyon (which wasn't formed by Noah's flood.)
BailiffQuimby 6 months ago
@BailiffQuimby Again, self justifying modern narcissistic bunk (just like polyamory). The ancients never believed the earth was flat, that was catholic bunk based on "pagan" philosophy of a dark age. Um...the prevailing theory, based on the most recent evidence, is that the grand canyon was created by a massive flooding effect. Science is not truth, but theories (best guesses) based on what is observable, and in regards to what is observable, that is nothing but a mere fraction of the total.
Mortaryan 4 months ago
@Mortaryan "Again, self justifying modern narcissistic bunk"
The demonstrable fact that the bible gets a lot of science incorrect is narcissistic bunk? Please explain.
"(just like polyamory)"
Narcissism is love of oneself. Polyamory is, if anything, the opposite of that.
"The ancients never believed the earth was flat"
Apart from a few greek and arabic early astronomers, EVERYONE used to think the earth was flat. And certainly the authors of the bible did, as it is written.
BailiffQuimby 4 months ago
@Mortaryan "Um...the prevailing theory, based on the most recent evidence, is that the grand canyon was created by a massive flooding effect."
No it isn't. Look at any scientific journal or website not affiliated with a religious agenda. No objective scientist believes that a single 40-day flood can carve one mile through stone.
"Science is not truth"
Science is a process by which we find truth, or at least the most accurate truth we can get from available evidence.
BailiffQuimby 4 months ago
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@Mortaryan
"but theories (best guesses)"
"Theories" are not simple "best guesses". Look up the requirements for a scientific assertion to reach the level of "theory"
"that is nothing but a mere fraction of the total."
It's the greatest claims we can assert based on everything we know. To pretend we know more than the evidence tells us is to be intellectually dishonest.
BailiffQuimby 4 months ago
@Mortaryan "Your lifestyle "choice" is based on nothing more than the gratification of NPD"
You have no clue about my choices and why I make them. You would love to believe that everybody who doesn't think exactly like you is suffering from some kind of personality disorder, I'm sure. Too bad for you this isn't true, and I think you're smart enough that, at some level, you know that.
BailiffQuimby 6 months ago
@BailiffQuimby the behavior (the observable) is the symptom upon which my diagnosis is made.
Mortaryan 4 months ago
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@Mortaryan "the behavior (the observable) is the symptom upon which my diagnosis is made."
The behavior of polyamory? Well then we're back to your begging the question. You claim that my behavior hurts myself and other people and is evidence of NPD. Support the claim with reason, logic and evidence, or admit that you're just talking out of your ass again. Does the DSM list polyamory as a symptom of NPD? Do you know how someone is being hurt by my behavior?
BailiffQuimby 4 months ago
@Mortaryan
"is symptomatic of an unhealthy pop-culture established for the purpose of cultural implosion. "
Pop culture is deliberately designed to implode culture? And how many hits did you take for this intellectual gem?
BailiffQuimby 6 months ago
@Mortaryan "Polyamory is a symptom..."
"Intolerance is a symptom. The disease is ignorance. You're still not presenting me with arguments for what's wrong with Polyamory. You just keep repeating "It's bad, it's a sin, it's a symptom of sinful pop-culture, blah blah blah" WHY do you think it's bad?
"You should examine your motives."
My motives for what? Being in a healthy adult relationship or arguing with your indoctrinated ass?
BailiffQuimby 6 months ago
@BailiffQuimby you cannot hear what you don't/won't want to, your not listening, because you are suffering from NPD, and like the drug addict, don't want to hear that you are out of control and hurting yourself and those around you...the only way you will face the destruction of your life choices are when you are face down in the gutter, and the suffering of your choices have brought you or those you love to ruin...or you won't and it will be too late.
Mortaryan 4 months ago
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@Mortaryan "you cannot hear what you don't/won't want to"
Don't I wish. Then the construction downstairs wouldn't keep me awake.
"because you are suffering from NPD"
What have I said to indicate this to you, and where did you get your doctorate of psychology?
BailiffQuimby 4 months ago
@Mortaryan
"...don't want to hear that you are out of control and hurting yourself and those around you"
If you're going to make such an accusation, you need to back it up with evidence. You have none. If I accused you of having schizophrenia, you would be right to doubt me unless I backed it up with evidence. Before an assertion you make has any value, you need to support it. Can you support your claim that I have NPD and that I hurt myself and those around me?
BailiffQuimby 4 months ago
@Mortaryan
If the 'old book' you're referring to is the Bible, then even there we find God approved multiple partner relationships, although those were within a marriage. I wonder how did you draw the conclusion that ONLY monogamy is good when polygamy has been suppressed by laws (at least for now) or hasn't been given a fair chance? Show me a study showing that CONSENSUAL poly is bad. I'd only say non-marital polyamory is bad if we go by BIBLICAL morals but show me scientifically, please.
PolyPride3 4 months ago
No, God didn't. God created Adam and Eve to be help mates to each other (monogamy), and every instance of polygamy is an allegory to teach why it is evil and does not work. and the one law that allows it was not because God wanted that for human beings but because God recognized the evil that was in the hearts of human beings at the time, and that was even with a people God set apart as the holiest of people on the earth, so think how bad the rest of humanity was and you desire returning to that
Mortaryan 4 months ago
@Mortaryan "every instance of polygamy is an allegory to teach why it is evil and does not work"
Including the instances where God specifically GAVE multiple wives to his favored subjects?
BailiffQuimby 4 months ago
@Mortaryan
How God created things in the beginning does not always stand for a rule, otherwise everyone would have to be married or not be single, donate their ribs to their wife, and be naked. Also, are you familar with 'plural' marriage which is having more than one marriage at a time. Yes, Adam and Eve can indicate that there's TWO people per marriage but it doesnt mention how many marriages a person can have, only how many involved in a marriage. So 2 wives can be two separate marriages
PolyPride3 4 months ago
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@Mortaryan "Jesus said ... is a sin. Polyamory is sin of lust...as the body rots and turns to dust so do you, ...everlasting suffering by Satan your father..."
Unless you can provide some evidence or rational reason why I should accept your particular brand of Christianity as an accurate portrayal of reality, your ranting, preaching and empty threats are about as compelling as an Odin worshipper trying to convert you.
BailiffQuimby 6 months ago
The only limitations we have in love are those we place upon ourselves.
I'm about > < that close to entering into my first true polyamorous relationship. It's been a dream of mine sinc I first heard the term 12 years ago. I've talked to the couple, and am excited- and just a little bit nervous- to meet them in person. I know that they are madly in love with each other, and have thus far been nothing but wonderful to me. But we shall see what happens when we meet in person! <3
seawind0721 1 year ago 2
@seawind0721 I'd only do it if the man is a member of the SCA and the woman has a nice collection of original TekWar books. Otherwise don't do it if she just has a erotic candle business that only sells online and at Renaissance Fairs.
totenkray 10 months ago
@seawind0721 12 years!? Jeez. I came to the idea of polyamory, about 6 - 7 years ago...became convinced I wanted to do it (at age 21), and I had no idea, until last week...that anyone else in the world had similar desires. I sure snow-snot didn't know there's a community behind it.
Cinique1984 8 months ago
Let's just call a spade a spade. Polyamory is still fornication and adultery rolled into one. It's funny how humans "dress" sins to make it look good and palatable. They invent terms to avoid words like lesbianism, homosexuality, abortion, and even beastiality. Anyway, you can do everything you like but remember this, God will judge every wicked people in this world. You will find yourself in front of Jesus and will be accountable to all you've said and done. Be holy for God is holy.
ByJustified 1 year ago
@ByJustified I'm sorry, just where did this woman mention religion in her video? Why can't religious people just leave well enough alone? Perhaps you can't stand the thought that other people don't take such nonsense and superstition as seriously as you do. If you didn't notice, what they're doing is not adultery. Or have you never read in the Bible the fact that many of the patriarchs had multiple wives and concubines? Something you might want to stop and think about.
jazztbvwr69 1 year ago
@jazztbvwr69 Unfortunately, many people are ignorant as to why David and Solomon had to marry women. They actually did it not because God told them to do so but they see it as a political advantage of expanding their own geographical kingdom. God did not condone their practice. Remember, every human was given the freedom to decide for himself whether he will follow the Lord or not. If Jesus Christ Himself supported monogamy then who are we to tamper with God's original design? (Read Matt.19:5)
ByJustified 1 year ago
@ByJustified It would appear that you are ignorant as well. 1st, Jesus did not live in old testament times. The main reason for them having concubines was to produces heirs, especially in the case of a woman being barren, as was the case with Abraham and Sarah. Give me one scripture in the old testament where god condemned the practice and thus they weren't following the lord? Your comment is based on the assumption of some unity between OT and NT that doesn't exist!
jazztbvwr69 1 year ago
@ByJustified 2nd, if it was such a sin for them, then why aren't they going to hell that everyone else Christians would so easily condemn? In NT times things changed. Frankly, the NT writers could make Jesus say whatever they wanted or that would suit them. That's obviously the reason why people find contradictions in the Bible! Admit the truth, the Bible is man's word, not god's. You're right, people do have the right to reject superstion and I'm glad to see that they're doing it!
jazztbvwr69 1 year ago
@jazztbvwr69 So tell me what book have you exhaustively studied and read from the Scripture and let's discuss it point by point. Since the Bible was written in Hebrew and Greek, let's go back to those ancient language. I had the opportunity to study that language formally so let's see what you've got. I'm on. Unfortunately, people who wants to discredit the Bible justifies homosexuality, incest, perversions, lesbianism, adultery, and fornication and uses flowery term to describe these sins.
ByJustified 1 year ago
@ByJustified The challenge was for you to produce one OT passage condemning the practice. You're the one condemning the practice. Since you're so familiar with the original language that shouldn't be hard for you, should it?
Just because I don't take the bible seriously doesn't mean I justify the things you mentioned. But I'd caution you to tread carefully about certain things. For example, Abraham married Sarah even though she was his half-sister (incest). Yet god blessed her.
jazztbvwr69 1 year ago
@jazztbvwr69 The question would be does their culture allow such practices? How about your culture? Does your culture allow such practice of marrying your half-sister? Tell me. Oh, by the way, even though God did not verbally condemn the immoral practice of Abraham with Hagar, David with Bathsheba, and Solomon with his many wives and concubines does not mean God commends such practices. You still have to go back and read the past laws in the book of Genesis and Leviticus.
ByJustified 1 year ago
@ByJustified What law in Genesis and Leviticus do you refer to? You still have yet to provide the reference. Maybe your putting words in your gods mouth. Not surprising, since this is what men do anyway. And you only have hearsay evidence for your god in the first place. The lifestyle suggested here may be immoral in your book, but you can't argue it's unethical, and that's my point.
jazztbvwr69 1 year ago
@ByJustified By the way, the examples you lumped together are not all the same. In the bible god specifically condemned David, as well as Solomon, though the problem with Solomon was turning to other gods. Abraham was not condemned as immoral. Curious Lev 18:8 (NLT) would tell them not to have relations with any of their father's WIVES. Why not tell them not to have multiple wives? Or Deuteronomy 21:15-17 that speaks of a man having two wives. Why not condemn it right here? He doesn't.
jazztbvwr69 1 year ago
@ByJustified Adultery is wrong because you've lied to your partner that you'll follow the rules. But if the rules are polyamory, not monogamy, how can you be said to break the rules? I think your problem is that you don't want people to have the power to make ethical decisions on their own. Just because people disparage the bible doesn't automatically mean they become contemptible human beings. Some of America's founding fathers fit the category but their character was exemplary.
jazztbvwr69 1 year ago
@jazztbvwr69 Adultery is a sin because you transgress the law of God which says "Thou shalt not commit adultery." God designed humans to have only one husband or wife. Whether the couple agreed with consent to take in the "boyfriend" or "girlfriend" of the wife or the husband in the circle of that "polygamous" relationship does not make it right in the eyes of God or man. To redesign this divine union is to go against the original design of God to protect humanity from self-destruction.
ByJustified 1 year ago
@ByJustified As I said in the beginning, who said this couple is religious? You can scream all you want about your invisible gods law, but the fact of the matter is, not everyone believes your definition of terms in this case. Why are you trying to force your gods way on others? You don't have that right. People have the right to disagree. Christianity is not the only philosophy out there. It may be the only one legit for YOU, but that does not make it so for others.
jazztbvwr69 1 year ago
@jazztbvwr69 Remember, these tyoe of immorality has been dealt with by the God of the Israelites and Christian believers many centuries ago. Even before Buddha, Muhammad, and Confucius were born. People today are just trying to revised these wicked immoral behavior by clothing it with their own definition. Whatever you may call this kind of relationship, it is still outright adultery and fornication. The writer of Ecclesiastes is right when he wrote, "There is nothing new under the sun." Ec. 1:9
ByJustified 1 year ago
@ByJustified You are so narrow in your thinking it's not funny. It sounds as if you believe EVERYONE was informed back then of how the god of the bible felt about certain behaviors. There WERE people who had never heard of him, believe it or not. The real problem with adultery is it's an act of deception. A married woman has sex with someone other than her spouse, gets pregnant, yet gives birth to the child as though it were her husband's. THAT is the real problem. e.g David and Bathsheba.
jazztbvwr69 1 year ago
@ByJustified But what if there is consent by both husband and wife? No deception. Consider the fact that several of the biblical patriarchs conceived children via their concubines/handmaidens. This was socially acceptable because having children was of primary importance, especially if the wife was barren. Was that adultery, too? At any rate, have at your little narrow view of the world, Your holy book also says judge not that you be not judged., because it will be measured back to you.
jazztbvwr69 1 year ago
@ByJustified "God did not condone their practice."
Please quote a bible verse in which God specifically condemns polygamy.
"If Jesus Christ Himself supported monogamy..."
...then he would have practiced it instead of disappearing for weekends at a time with twelve dudes an a hooker.
BailiffQuimby 10 months ago
@BailiffQuimby ... Why don't you study these words of Jesus Christ, "Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,' and said, 'For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh'? Matt. 19:4-5 Uhmmm... Did Jesus said "united to his wives?" I hope everyone of you who practices adultery and fornication out there will be convicted of Jesus words. May you come to your senses.
ByJustified 8 months ago
@ByJustified "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife,..."
This does not specifically condemn polygamy. Did Jesus say, "You should never be married to more than one person"?
"united to his wives?"
Absence of condonement does not equal condemnation. The bible often refers a person's son or a person's daughter. Does that mean you can never have multiple children?
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@ByJustified "I hope everyone of you who practices adultery and fornication out there will be convicted of Jesus words. May you come to your senses."
And I hope that you will one day see that what consenting adults decide to do and with whom in the privacy of their homes is neither yours nor Jesus' nor anyone else's business.
PS - you don't speak for Jesus. TRUST ME!
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@BailiffQuimby... Well, Jesus knows that these things will happen even before you and I are not yet born. I hope you will quit sinning and return to Him. One day you will surely realize that your Christian relatives are right that you need to give your life to Christ.
ByJustified 8 months ago
@ByJustified "Well, Jesus knows that these things will happen even before you and I are not yet born"
What things? What are you talking about?
"I hope you will quit sinning"
Your definition of "sin" and my concept of morality are worlds apart. By secular moral standards, I'm a good person. By any other standards, you need to demonstrate that they matter first.
"...and return to Him"
I can't return to someone I've never been with.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@ByJustified
"One day you will surely realize that your Christian relatives are right"
My "christian relatives" are as non-existent as your god. I'm ethnically jewish and philosophically secular.
"that you need to give your life to Christ."
I've already offered my life to my wife, children, family, friends, and students. I can't also give it to your god. There's only so much of me to go around, and I'd rather give my life to people I know exist.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@BailiffQuimby... Have you seen an atomic particle? If you have not seen one, will you believe this particle is existent despite the fact that you haven't personally seen it yourself? I hope you get my point. Giving your life to your love ones is very temporary but giving your life to Jesus who is called Yahweh is fulfilling. Why don't you try it. In fact,
ByJustified 8 months ago
@ByJustified "Have you seen an atomic particle?"
Yes.
"[would] you believe this particle is existent despite the fact that you haven't personally seen it yourself?"
I might, depending on the reliability or the scientist. Particle physicists have established a history of being demonstrably right about things. So they've earned a certain amount of reasonable trust. Mind you, it depends on the claim - if a particle physicist tells me he has a pet dragon, I'll require further evidence.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@ByJustified "I hope you get my point."
Point gotten and refuted. There are two differences between believing a priest when he tells you that there are magical invisible beings controlling our fates and a scientist telling me about protons and electrons: The earned trust of the scientist and the fantastical nature of the claim made by the priest.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@ByJustified "Giving your life to your love ones is very temporary"
I disagree. Devoting my life to my loved ones perpetuates a meme that shifts the human race towards a more rational and compassionate race. This is very long-term, perhaps as long-term as the human race will survive. I'm only a small piece of the puzzle, but every piece helps.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@ByJustified
"but giving your life to Jesus who is called Yahweh is fulfilling."
Whether or not it gives you a nice warm fuzzy feeling doesn't indicate whether or not this being exists. And if he doesn't, then you're being incredibly unproductive with your limited time of existence.
"Why don't you try it."
Obviously because I can't devote my life to a being that I don't believe exists. It's the same reason you couldn't arbitrarily start devoting your life to Thor.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@ByJustified Anyhow, the topic of the video is Polyamory. So to get back to the subject matter, love is real. Love is demonstrably a good thing when it is practiced in a way where people aren't hurt. Whether or not there's a god, I can't believe he would tell us to love less. Jesus never condemned polyamory in the bible, and he DID say that love was a good thing. So I'm placing your god squarely on my side of the debate.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@BailiffQuimby Hmm... It seems like the atheists here could not even defend their position. A simple understanding of faith and science troubles them eh! A wife will always be hurt deep inside if the love of her husband is being shared with another woman. You may not see that from the outside but I am sure they will deny their feelings. Men and women involve in this so-called "polyamorous" relationship which is really adultery and fornication are hurting deep inside because of their past.
ByJustified 8 months ago
@ByJustified "It seems like the atheists here could not even defend their position"
What position do you want me to defend?
"A simple understanding of faith and science troubles them"
I'm fairly confident that my understanding of both of these things is better than yours. But this really isn't the purpose of my being here.
"A wife will always be hurt deep inside if the love of her husband is being shared with another woman"
No.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@ByJustified
"You may not see that from the outside but I am sure they will deny their feelings"
You must be telepathic that you can understand women's feelings better than they do themselves. You should rent out your magic powers hourly.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@BailiffQuimby... No need for telepathy friend. All you need to do is start counseling women and you will be surprise that they are not really happy with their adulterous condition... I'm sure you are also hurting deep inside because of your past hurts. I understand that your parents probably have not spent time with you while you grow up. Did they? Is your parents still living together? I hope they are. Do they give you advise or suggestions? Did they teach you to love the Lord? Think about it.
ByJustified 8 months ago
@ByJustified "All you need to do is start counseling women"
Are you actually a counselor? If you aren't, you don't know what you're talking about. If you are, then you are seeing a select group of women who have issues, and not an unbiased sample. Neither my wife nor I are unhappy, and we know our emotions better than you do. I had a happy childhood, my folks are still together and happy, and they taught me to think for myself and be who I want to be without judging others.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@ByJustified Your comment about "loving the lord," indicating that it is a prerequisite for happiness just lost you all credibility. Think about it.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@BailiffQuimby Y=In order for you to experience true happiness you really have to start loving Jesus Christ by forsaking all immoralities and perversion.Why not start doing it today.
ByJustified 8 months ago
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@ByJustified "In order for you to experience true happiness you really have to start loving Jesus Christ"
False, and provably false. I am truly happy and I don't even believe in Jesus as god. So there, just kinda blew your argument out of the water. You should be careful not to make generalized statements that you can't support with evidence.
"by forsaking all immoralities and perversion"
What you find immoral and perverse, other people may find just fine.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@ByJustified
"Why not start doing it today."
Because I'm already truly happy, like I said.
BailiffQuimby 8 months ago
@BailiffQuimby That is temporal happiness friend. What's I'm talking about is true happiness that does not come from this world. Would you like to receive Jesus now through prayer?
ByJustified 8 months ago
@ByJustified I was raised Christian and loved Jesus. I knew happiness then. I have since experienced many things outside the miniscule circle that is the church and am now polyamorous and following the wisdom of Odin, Fraija, Ulr, Vili and Wayland. I have never been happier in my entire life.
If you think that you can convert anyone through the comments on youtube then you do not understand how people work. Try being a missionary by example instead of being argumentative.
drflybane 8 months ago
@drflybane... Remember, emotions can be very deceiving at times. Emotion should not be our authority but the Word of God (the Bible). The Lord created and designed you so please don't pretend to know what's best for you. Satanism have their motto: "If it feels good then do it." All they care is their flesh and emotion. The apostle Paul warned us not to live in the flesh but by the Spirit of God. Why don't you start seeking what is true joy in the Lord and not that temporal "happiness."
ByJustified 8 months ago
@ByJustified More arguments, ok. Joy is an emotion as well. Following your line of reasoning, joy can be deceiving. The Christian bible has many emotionally influenced passages too. More deception? How can the Christian bible be an authority when the Catholic church has put out more editions then the Oxford Univ Press has put out dictionaries? Why are there more books based on letters from Paul then gospels of Jesus? You are a Paulian, not a Christian.
drflybane 8 months ago
@ByJustified Why are you not eating kosher? Jesus never said to stop. The laws of kashrut are still in the old testament. There is nothing in the new testament that says that all the laws of the old testament no longer apply.
What does any of this have to do with polyamory or this well done video? NOTHING. You are just throwing your religion around. You can not convince people that they need saving this way. This is not your god's desire, this is your ego's desire. This just makes you feel good.
drflybane 8 months ago
@drflybane... The Bible states, "Without holiness no one will see the Lord." Heb. 12:14. Do you think this "polyamory" ("adultery & fornication") is holy and even pleasing to the Lord Jesus Christ? By the way, eating "kosher" is a law for the Jews. If a Christian wants to eat "kosher" just because he likes it then no problem. However, the Bible says, "For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit," (Rom. 14:17)
ByJustified 8 months ago
@ByJustified Odin had Goddesses Frigga, Jord, Rinde, the giantess Gyrd all as wives as well as others hinted at but not named. There are also many royal families who claim they are descended from Odin through other sons. So is a polyamory style of relationship holy? Probably not but it sure isn't frowned upon. Is it pleasing to the Jesus fellow? I don't care. Not in my pantheon.
I see you are also continuing to quot from your "savior" Paul. Seems like this guy is more important then your Christ.
drflybane 8 months ago
@ByJustified "Do you think this "polyamory" is...pleasing to the Lord Jesus Christ?"
I've already confessed that since there is no evidence that your (or any) god exists, I don't believe. But I can claim no absolute knowledge on the subject. So I will add that, if your god or any of the many other gods exist, I believe that they are horribly embarrassed by people who claim to know how they feel about a particular issue and impose their views on others, imagining that god must feel the same way.