I so agree with "jeraboo29" One can not truly describe this event in words, it's indeed an experience outside of experience. As soon as we hear the word feeling, we are quick to respond, saying things like, "for something as extraordinary as the existence of God, I personally would need more than a feeling. Lets not be critical for a momment & think. Whats happiness? A feeling, whats love? A feeling, whats peace? A feeling, this feelings would only come throught experiences.
A formal review process assigns a level of access restriction to holdings that have sacred, private, or confidential contents. However, just because a record is restricted does not mean that access is impossible. Some restricted records may be accessed with the permission of authorized department personnel. SPC policies and practices are periodically reviewed for clarity, consistency, and alignment.
But Smart never hesitated to share his wealth with the church or its members. His generosity and his devotion to the cause of claiming the Uintah Basin as a Mormon stronghold gradually dissipated his fortune.
"He entered the basin a wealthy man and left it 30 years later in poverty," the author writes in the book's introduction. "Unarguably the basin's most powerful and influential man, with easy access to church and state leaders, he ended his ministry there as an itinerant promoter of genealogy, camping out or staying with church members and hoeing weeds to pay for his board."
The Church announced plans this month to launch an aggressive program to put as many as 600 urgently needed temporary housing kits into the hands of Haitian members before the rainy season starts in April.
It is a continuing effort by the Church to restore normalcy and promote self-reliance in the country.
The consistency that I found among the geographical references contained in the Book of Mormon absolutely compliments the consistency that results from correlating those places to specific terrain, rivers, trail systems and settlement localities in Mesoamerica
Oh dear, where to begin...how about give me some archeologists who are not LDS (and therefore are not interested in proving any pre-established condition) who believe the BofM is an accurate archeological or historical record. It's just not impressive that JS (or whatever author you insert), who had access to, and was undoubtedly educated by his teacher/father about the basic geography, was able to think of N & S america, but the geographic comparison ends there.
So true and very well said! There's absolutely no archaeological or scientific evidence that the Book of Mormon is even remotely true. Not to mention the obvious anachronisms like horses, steel, barley, olives, etc. that did not occur in that part of the world at the time!
Knowing that this much is true, I can readily accept as true and valid all of the historic narrative and religious instruction as elaborated in the text. When I apply thought and prayer to the precepts, principles, and ordinances taught in the book, my appreciations for its validity and importance to mankind are amply rewarded by the Spirit, just as Moroni promises in Moroni 10:4.
So all that is necessary to change your belief in LDS theology is for the rational introduction to legitimate evidence the native american history is in no way linked to 6th century BCE israelite migrations? I commend your commitment to truth and the excellence of the scientific method, and welcome you to the liberating world of reality.
Emergency supplies: With the devastation in Haiti, this blogger believes it's time to pull out the "Emergency Supply List" to help us do a basic review of how prepared we are. Do you have a whistle in your emergency pack? What about things for personal sanitation?
State Department spokesman P.J. Crowley said in Washington that U.S. Embassy personnel were "literally in the dark" after power failed.
"They reported structures down. They reported a lot of walls down. They did see a number of bodies in the street and on the sidewalk that had been hit by debris. So clearly, there's going to be serious loss of life in this," he said.
Tuesday's quake was felt in the Dominican Republic, which shares a border with Haiti on the island of Hispaniola, and some panicked residents in the capital of Santo Domingo fled from their shaking homes. But no major damage was reported there. In eastern Cuba, houses shook but there were also no reports of significant damage.
"We felt it very strongly and I would say for a long time. We had time to evacuate," said Monsignor Dionisio Garcia, archbishop of Santiago.
Most of Haiti's 9 million people are desperately poor, and after years of political instability the country has no real construction standards. In November 2008, following the collapse of a school in Petionville, the mayor of Port-au-Prince estimated about 60 percent of the buildings were shoddily built and unsafe in normal circumstances.
The temblor appeared to have occurred along a strike-slip fault, where one side of a vertical fault slips horizontally past the other, said earthquake expert Tom Jordan at the University of Southern California. The quake's size and proximity to populated Port-au-Prince likely caused widespread casualties and structural damage, he said.
"It's going to be a real killer," he said. "Whenever something like this happens, you just hope for the best."
About the martyr bit, what makes anyone think that dying for your belief makes it true? Is anyone impressed with Islam because 19 muslims (and highly educated ones at that) died for their belief?
Most people would rather die than think, and most people do ~ Bertrand Russell.
Perhaps you may say it is not evidence it is true. It is evidence; however, that these men were sincere in their belief. Whether or not you believe its true this is powerful evidence that if they were decievers then they themselves were decieved for they obviously believed every word they spoke.
mastad23 Notwithstanding the error in logic, if you're wrong, not only did you waste your entire existence, but others may be motivated to believe as a result, as many muslim children do and emulate, with the result being tragic, and inhumane.
mastad23 that's it? you gave up just like that when you couldn't come up with a reasonable explanation to my argument? Better rethink your beliefs my friend, there's more to life than what you've got right now. What's more important than right wand wrong? Truth.
@ursowrng Lol why would I? There are millions of people who are anti-mormon just like you. Anything I have to say on this religion surely isn't going to sink in with you. So basically you are a waste of time.
mastad23 Actually, despite your ad hominem attacks, I am open to being wrong. I've been wrong in the past, and I corrected my opinion based on evidence and reason. Are you able to do the same? So far, you haven't answered my argument, nor have you presented any evidence to the contrary.
mastad23, One last comment for you consider. There are hardly millions of anti-mormons. I know the theological basis of that statement, but that's not what you intended, is it? Mormonism just isn't that impressive or significant to the world. What's even more depressing is Mormonism's flight to the orthodox evangelical right, lining up behind the likes of creationists. The real challenge is from science, and it's one you are losing. Here's a little secret for you, evolution is true.
@ursowrng Let me tell you this. The greatest good is always going to be met with the greatest opposition. This work, the church, is the GREATEST good this world will ever see. If it's not that impressive to you...move on. Why waste your time coming to a video of a Mormon apostle giving a talk. You got better things to do right? Go study become a professor on evolution.
mastad23, once again, you fail. You can have your own beliefs, but you can't have your own facts. Not only is truth independent of right or wrong, but the quantity and quality also have no relationship to it as well. For instance, evil spirits are not the cause of disease, but also, if you are a doctor and have the resources to cure someone, and you cure thousands of people, that does not validate your beliefs as correct. The two are mutually exclusive. Try again, this time engage your brain.
@ursowrng Now you send me 4 comments!! I'm flattered I have your mind rollin' so much that you revert back to this page to try to get the argument out of me again. But yet for a 3rd consecutive time YOU FAIL. YOU coming on this video is MY turf. Take your crap and your arguments and your array of silly words somewhere else. My enemy's camp...psh, I'm extending my arm with a pointed finger to the right..LEAVE, Be gone, quit looking for arguments here. You're name explains exactly what u are.
So this is how the argument from religion ends? all in a huff and not a cogent thought to even consider...it's so much easier to just tell someone to leave than deal with reality. Better yet, if you can get enough votes, you can legislate your beliefs to gain control over others actions and punish them for not believing what you demand. Guess what, the hammer blows of modernity and reason will not stop, we will not fail to ridicule your beliefs because u r so wrong.
Perhaps you should have stayed in school and learned some basic principles of reason, logic, history, science..... I'll end where I began, since you have illustrated it so well. Adieu.
Most people would rather die than think, and most people do. ~ Bertrand Russell
He seems so bitter at the end of this. Does he really think that more people have analyzed the BOM than the bible, or Shakespeare, or the Koran? 2 Billion non-LDS christians vs. 13 Million LDS. 900 Million Hindus who have been, and still are, unfazed at the BOM, and have been for over 3,300 years. 1 Billion non-religious (god bless them) who think it's not worth even opening. Really.....the fanatical religions aren't threatened, and the thinkers aren't impressed.
The two basic tours never vary much in terms of substance. For example, the narrative of the basic Restoration presentation essentially stays the same regardless of whether the audience is generally LDS or composed of nonmembers. And yet, no two tours are identical.
@ursowrng Oh I didn't even realize you left me 3 comments. But look, I came to this vid to listen to Jeffrey R. Holland not debate and rebuttal with some bozo who stands against the church. If you're looking for an argument your barkin up the wrong tree. You're probably some little science wiz who has all his theories tide up in a bundle ready to unleash his plethora of words. Not interested bro. Not interested in taking a dip in the waters of contention...get it? Ok
@mastad23 "Not interested in taking a dip in the waters of contention." Yet you insult him, calling him a bozo and a science wiz. This illustrates typical insecure mormon thinking, fake and self-righteous.
@lpokeymanl Leishman attended a conference in January 2009 where he was told that the Comfort needed supplies, but also nurses, translators and general volunteers.
All docents are trained to take tour groups throughout the entire Church History Museum. Two general, baseline tours exist: a basic Restoration-themed journey through the museum, and a more limited presentation consisting entirely of Utah history and correlated to the curriculum of the fourth-graders who frequently come to the museum on field trips.
"We send out all of our communications via e-mail," Sister Ames said. "Our coordinators are very responsible and they're very good at directing their own shift. We give a heavy load of responsibility to our shift coordinators, and then we communicate to everyone through e-mail all of the things that we need to be in sync about. We also use an electronic calendar to make sure that everyone is aware of scheduled tours."
With 12 docent groupings that essentially function independently of each other and rarely collaborate or interact, impeccable efficiency of communication is the only thing that keeps docents running on the same page.
What Elder Holland is describing is much more than "feelings and emotions" -
It's like trying to explain to a blind man who has never seen, what it is like to see, all the while he denies it exists, and you pity him, but go on loving your sight.
"A wicked man can't write something like the book of mormon, and a good man won't write it unless told to do so by God." So true. Wicked men don't do good, because it's not in their nature. With the magnitude of the book of mormon, the only way it can be written is by revelation directly by God. I add my own witness with Elder Holland that the book is TRUE and I would never deny it. I have felt it by reading it and praying about it. This I know, and not just believe.
Woo! Go, Elder Holland!!!! This is my favorite conference talk of all time. I LOVED it and find myself thinking over his words all the time. He's absolutely right, every word. :)
I don't know of a conference talk with as many logical fallacies, compressed into such a short period of time as this one.
I love the notion that the sincerity of early mormons somehow proves that the BoM and mormonism as being true. One could say the same thing about Al Queda, Hezbollah, The Republican Guard, and the Koran.
civilization literally laid at his feet and gave him Gold and everything he wanted because they thought Cortez was Quetzalcoatl the bearded God who promised them that he would come again. There is no other record of a bearded God visiting this civilization outside of the Book of Mormon. And it makes sense that after a heavenly visitation and being healed of all illnesses that they would pass this on to their children for generations.
Everyone wants proof of God. And wants proof of the correctness of the Book of Mormon and yet people WILL not do the studying necessary to see what God has already revealed. There are pyramids in Egypt and in South America. They had the same technologies and yet the world prior to Columbus was thought to be flat. How did the same technology span oceans during a time of no communication technology? What about Cortez? And his ability to walk in and take over an entire civilization? A
When God speaks to your heart and to your spirit you KNOW it. It isn't just a fleeting passing hot flash for no reason, or a chemical reason like menopause. And it is the most beautiful holy experience. Unless you are humble and ask sincerely and want to knonw for yourself you cannot have these experiences.
It's not just a feeling, it's a whole body experience. It's your spirit recognizing the Spirit of God, and when God manifests himself there is a sense of peace, warmth, love, hope, it is all encompassing, at times. There have been times where when I have receieved inspiration from God where my whole body has felt warm, just like if you were to step outside in the sunlight on an early summer day and I have felt that physically in the dead of winter. It ONLY happens when meditating or in prayer
Hmm, Catholics, Evangelicals, Muslims, Hindus, Atheists, and others describe the same sorts of (manufactured) feelings in the context of their own lives as well. I guess that means they're all true.
Try this, go a day without food -a full day begin this day with a humble (on your knees) prayer that you want to KNOW the truth not just 'feel' it. As you fast, remember to cry up in prayer anytime you feel hunger or frustration and during this day do nothing but good for those around you - remember to pray always in your mind during the day. Then, as your day ends, kneel in prayer and ask to KNOW these things - stay on your kneels til he lets you KNOW they are true.
Plus, with so many different beliefs out there and so many ideas of what God is, how can you be sure that your feelings of truth are any more credible than someone of a different faith? Everyone feels strongly about things, but for something as extraordinary as the existence of God, I personally would need more than a feeling.
Absolutely correct. However, the word "feeling" is a simple use of lexicon used by those who have had a religious experience. Specifically, for LDS, the experience is a witness of Christ that is transcendent of words. One can not truly describe this event in words, it's indeed an experience outside of experience. You truly have to partake in such an event to grasp it. And, yes, you are correct again, in receiving a true witness of Christ, you would indeed receive more than a rational "feeling."
But how do we percieve such a witness? These experiences are typically said to come through feeling. Feelings, although intense, and strong enough to make you think they mean something more, are still feelings.
crystal ball to know what the outcome would be. All I knew was that I felt what I felt and it was a strong feeling. Who knows what would have happened had I not listened to that feeling. I have seen miracle after miracle in my own life when I have listened to these feelings. So say what you will. God does not need to prove himself to man, but he does promise as we prove ourselves to him, and in faith come to him he will answer and he will not forsake us.
I'll believe that those incidents happened to you, as I do believe in miracles, but they do not point to God's doing anymore than they do to Zeus's, Allah's, or Dumbledore's. I've had such miracles happen to me with zero faith in God. Some things just happen. Just as miracles happen, freak accidents and tragedies happen but none of it points to the existence of a God or the lack of one. Sometimes people are extremely lucky. A lot of things that seem
supernatural can easily be explained through science, psychology, etc. Sometimes what people think of as miracles are due to people's knowledge (even subconscious knowledge), technology, or even crazy skills someone has.
However, I sat back and waited, I worked as I always had and let things unfold naturally though it was hard for me to do. . After 2 very stressful months HR approached me and let me know that I had been vindicated and were impressed by how I handled the situation. Threse months later upon my review I was given a raise and two months after that a promotion to a position I had wanted for the past 3 years. The outcome was much better for me though uncomfortable at the time. I didn't have a
At work last year one of the managers who was having an affair with my boss falsely accused me of things at work. I had proof of their affair and could prove that I had not done the things she accused me of. I had all my documentation ready to move forward with a law suit and to prove to HR when I felt that I should not do anything, and just sit back and be patient. This was completely contrary to what I wanted to do and felt was not in my best interest.
Last week 2 of my childrenwere very sick, both coughing with fevers. At the onset I felt I should give my youngest breathing treatments and for my eldest, I felt impressed to treat him with steam instead. It was odd to me that I would feel I should treat them differently. I later took them to the Dr. and both had H1N1 but had 2 different strains of the virus. The Dr. w/o my input prescribed the same separate treatments for my sons. I have no medical training but followed my feelings.
Somehow I don't think you really believe that. Were you FEEL that something was really hot when you put your hand on it, you would remove your hand, or if you were to FEEL a heavy weight on your chest and FEEL shooting pains up and down your left arm you would go to the ER, Were you to go outside and FEEL cold you would put on a jacket or sweater. Our feelings are evidence of our truths. I am not talking about projected feelings either I am talking about feelings without having an agenda.
I'm talking about emotional feelings, not physical ones. You HAVE physical proof that something is hot if you physically feel it. You would not rely on your emotions to tell you something is hot without testing it yourself. That is the kind of proof I'm talking about that is not existent for God.
I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints who is also a decendant of Brigham Young. As a studious, inquisitive, and informed member (having read and been exposed to anti-literature) I do not need to read the Tanners' book. I have been privy to meet some of the Prophets and Apostles. I have felt the presence of God with these men. They have been the most holy and exquisite experiences. No book will ever change the witness God has given me of their integrity & honor.
For the truth about mormonism please read "Mormonism Shadow or Reality" by Jerald and Sandra Tanner. Sandra realised her great great grandfather, Brighgam Young, was not a prohet when she read his sermons on blood atonement and the blacks. She and her husband led thousands from the church.
I know that God lives. I have a personal relationship with Him. I know that He knows me by name. He knows my every heart's desire, He knows my every heart ache. He has blessed my life in ways I never imagined possible. I have felt His love, I have heard His voice, and I have witnessed His power. I felt His holiness, his purity, and His unconditional love.
When I trust in Him, I have no need to fear. He has never failed me.
Would you believe me if I told you I had felt the arms of the Savior around me? And that others I know have had similar experiences? No you would not, you would say we were dilusional or that we had some psychotic episode that led us to hallucinate such an experience. We do not need to share our sacred experiences to prove to someone who has no faith that God exists, God reveals himself to those who first express faith in him, he will not force himself on us. If you want to know God, pray.
I wouldn't say everyone who feels these things is necessarily psychotic, but there are reasons that we feel some things that are completely psychological and not spiritual in the least. Besides, you shouldn't base truth on what you feel...feelings are unreliable.
It is sad when scriptures of any kind Bible or Book of Mormon is taken out of context. It is easy to take 2 or 3 verses and twist them anyway you want to. It has a whole different meaning when you put it in it's proper context.
Carterfamily...Matthew 7:1-5..Judge not, that ye be not judeged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. Any why beholdest thou the mote that is in they brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and behold, a beam is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye;...."
yes, only through obedience can you understand. As Jeremiah says in ch20:9 "his word was in my heart as a burning fire shut up in my bones" & Luke 15:35 "...Did not our hearts burn within us... while he opened to us the scriptures"
The truth of the Book of Mormon BURNS in my heart the same as Jeremiah & others in the Bible.
6 billion people in this world, abt 13million are LDS. Not many believe the BOM is true, so musn't be such a good lie...
Here here Elder Holland. I haven't heard such a powerful testimony in a long time. I've met Elder Holland when I was a student at BYU and he is a great man.
The Book of Mormon is very flawed. From teaching that peoples skin color reflects their sin color In Jacob 3:8,9, to teaching 3 days of darkness covering the whole earth, from the time of Jesus death, to his resurrection Helaman 14:20,26,27 & 3 Nephi 8:3,20-23 to plainly declaring there are imperfections in it Mormon 8:12 The BOM is as deceptive as the author of it. Any good lie has to appear true, or no one will believe it. Satan acieves the perfect lie, when it looks like scripture from God.
The skin color wasn't a punishment it was to distinguish the Lamanites and Nephites. There are many people of different nationalities who are part of the LDS church, and everyone is equal - despite skin color - and Heavenly Father loves them all unconditionally I believe.
Though the Bible is very clear, that God made all nations of men of one blood, and that the mark on Cain had nothing to do with the curse on Cain, and certainly does not indicate that his skin color was changed. The Book of Mormon most certainly teaches that the skin color was a curse for sin, see: 2 Nephi 5:21-24; Jacob 3:5,8,9; 3 Nephi 2:14-16; Alma 3:6-10&14--16. The Pearl of Great Price teaches the curse on Cain was a skin color change in Moses 7:22. Read carefully Genesis 4:1-16.
This man is a true apostle of the Lord and there is no deception in his words. I know because of the spirit that I felt during this talk. If you learn anything from the scriptures you don't need to see to believe. There are instances in the scriptures where people see great signs and wonders from heaven and they still hardened their hearts. The Book of Mormon AND the Bible are the word of God and E. Holland is a true apostle of the Lord. I am grateful for his courage to stand up for his beliefs
With regards to depression in UTAH. Sorry, but that is a vast generalisation. I have NO depression, never. My views on depression, not supported by a lot of church members im sure, is a conflict between spiritual body & physical body. IE we know something is true - our spirit knows the truth, but we are not acting on that and there is a conflict. Another term is "SIN" (I'm not saying I never sin) difference is I know how to repent- relying of the merits of Jesus Christ...
I second Jeffrey R Hollands testimony, as I have had countless witnesses to the divinity of the Book of Mormon, & all that pertains to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. You might not believe a white, American church leader. But, I a young lady in Australia, 1000kms away, know the same thing that he does, by way of revelation and obedience to God's laws.
The Book of Mormon IS true and God's covenant is restored again. :)
The LDS church is God's church. Israel is God's covenant people. The priesthood of God on earth today - within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints,is the same in the patriarchal order in the Old Testament & in the Jesus's Church in the New Testament.
I can stomach it. Easy. Truth brings joy to my heart, like the fruits of the spirit. Gal 5:22-23 Also you talk of the bible, how do you know the bible is true?? How did you come to that conclusion. Did God tell you? Do you feel it is true in your heart? Prove it? hmm, you believe something without seeing it. That is an interesting concept.
Jesus Christ not only healed the sick and taught, he established his Church. At the time of His baptism, His Church had not been established. Paul in asking to what baptism these individuals had received, he asked because it was prior to Christ's church being established. They were then baptized again in the name of the Lord Jesus and received what they could not receive before and that is the Gift of the Holy Ghost. Acts 19-1-6
God may not show himself to the naked eye, but he does fill the heart and soul of man when mankind is open to it. Just as suredly as I feel the wind in my face I feel the love God has for me in my heart and soul. God is not invisible, I see him in the faces of my children, in every sunrise/sunset, in the kindness and genorisity of man. Where I don't see him is in the heart of individuals who point and scoff at others to fill the void in their own lives. This is not gullible it is truly seeing
No we do not claim to have cornered the market on "God". God loves all his children no matter what their religious belief is including those who choose not to believe in Him. I have sat in many synogogues and congregations and have felt both God's love for the people and their love for God in each service. God will answer the prayers of anyone who asks him for inspiration or direction. Jesus said: "Love one another, as I have loved you" I try to live this but sadly sometimes I fall short
General Authorities do not receive a salary. However, they do receive a healthy expense account. Many leave their jobs or professions to hold their positions in the Church. They don't simply live on Savings while they serve as most serve out the rest of their lives after being called to these positions in their 40's and 50's. They are indeed supported financially. While it is not 'called' a salary...they are compensated.
Is it too hard to believe that someone loves God enough to devote his or her life to Him without getting paid? Apparenty, for you, it is. I'm sorry friend.
Why does the world believe educated men who will testify of Christ to get gain and fill their pockets and bank accounts such as many apologetic writers do and yet condemn a man who will die for what he knows to be true. A man without wealth, a formal education, who has absolutely nothing to gain by sharing what he knows to be right and true and requires nothing but for the listener to read what hsa been written and invoke their own relationship with God to receive a witness of it's truth.
The Bible is a compilation of written accounts of Christ believer determined by the Niccean Council. This compilation has been interpretted and edited by men since then NOT claiming the authority of God. Yet a man claiming the authority of God brings forth the Book of Mormon which substantiates Biblical claims of a Savior and the world scoffs. Hello? The original writings of the Bible were divinely inspired too. Yet the world will accept non-inspired men to bring forth God's word. Odd
snack, Are you familiar with the Popul Vuh and other Mesoamerican traditions? Mayan tradition, and the Popul Vuh, recorded or orally passed down the history of their ancestors having crossed by sea in vessels. It's very fascinating. I'm actually heading to Guatemala, Belize, and the Yucatan in January to explore the ruins. I will post some video of it upon my return.
LOL. Does Mormon Answer Man block peeps? I really hate blocking peeps, but I have done so if there is foul language, spam, or outright hate talk. Similarly, I block dudes who create several accounts and argue/agree with themselves, you know what I mean? :) I do this because this is a religious vid, and it deserves a basic level of intellectual and moral honesty. However, I have uploaded a disabled comments version of this talk for those wanting to share it on FB or with family and friends.
So long as those are the ground rules, that's fine. Mormon Answer Man definitely blocks anyone who can refute his ridiculous opinions. If you're fair, I promise to be civil.
The Book of Mormon read by Hyrum and mentioned in D&C 135 has been previously identified in the LDS Church news as belonging to Bathsheba Smith, the Wife of Geo. A. Smith and has her name inscribed on the front. The copy Holland is holding has no inscription.
But hey, it wouldn't be conference without a little deceit right? Paul H. Dunn would be proud...
Did I say I believed in it? Not exactly. I am taking a wait and see approach. Like Mormon prophecies have been any more successful. You may want to look through the D&C to see all of the failed prophecies from Joseph Smith.
Ah, but when several historians and researchers seem to agree on what happened based on their individual studies and evidences, it's likely not rubbish. "There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is a proof against all argument, and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance. That principle is condemnation before investigation."
LDS wonder too why "pious" people talk down. They do this out of jealousy, fear, or ignorance. As well, LDS doctrine differs from standard Christian Theism. LDS believe God & Christ are separate tangible beings, in a premortal existence, in a purposeful earthly existence as part of Gods plan, in eternal families, that humans are literal children of God, & in direct revelation. Also, Christs church was restored, by God & Christ appearing to a 14yr old farm boy Joseph Smith. Very valid to us.
In none of my replies did I talk down or belittle anyone. Those who stoop to such measures do so because they do not have any sufficient verifiable evidence to counter the argument being waged with them. Something even Jeffery R Holland is guilty of in talking down to those of us have come to a different conclusion about the BofM, and I quote:
"If anyone is foolish enough or misled enough to reject 531 pages of a heretofore unknown text, [...], without honestly attempting to account for the origin of those pages somehow, [...] if that is the case, then such persons elect or otherwise have been deceived and if they leave this church, they must do so by crawling over, or under, or around the BoM to make their exit." - Apostle Jeffery R. Holland
In this quote, Holland is directly insulting us by calling us foolish. He also assumes that we are dishonest in that we haven't "honestly" researched this issue thoroughly, only because we haven't come to the same conclusion. Search google for "The Untold story of the Death of Joseph Smith" to see how misleading this discourse is.
Are you familiar with Transcendentalism of the 1800s? Promoted by Romantic writers like Emerson, Thoreau, Whitman, and Hawthorne? They embraced the philosophy of Plato, Coleridge, Kant & theology of Calvinism, Unitarianism & Eastern thought. Specifically, they believed in the divine right of man to explore his intellect and create a direct relationship with God. This relationship solidifies a heavenly unification of man, nature, & the creator. Just curious, your comments mirror this belief.
I am vaguely familiar with some of those philosophers. I think when you tie reason and logic into beliefs regarding an after/pre-life, universalism is the most logical conclusion.
I might add that many or most of the Near Death Experiences I have read appear to confirm a universal source that accepts all of us equally and above all wants us to live according to the dictates of our own conscious, do what makes us happy. I find the experiences of those who have died and lived to tell the tale more believable and confirming than anyone who has not experienced such. But I read and study them as a whole, looking for the similarities and such.
It doesn't wash micah. First you state, You can't pretend to know what others feel and say it's different or not true to them. Then you conclude, Faith is the great cop-out. & The Book_of Mormon is not true. Regarding the spirit & God you claim, I've had such experiences both in and outside of the church...and felt the communion you describe. Yet you concur, Heaven's are shut. ETC. I believe you feel your not bitter & you will have a witty reply. But, truly check your words, & heart.
Good observation. However, I no longer believe these feelings "of the spirit" to be neither confirmation of truth, nor supernatural in origin. The beliefs I have regarding an afterlife are just that, beliefs. I make no claims as to whether that is the true nature of our destiny or origins. Thanks for the conversation. I appreciate the opportunity to express myself.
I asked about Transcendentalism because Emerson,Thoreau & those guys referred to an over-soul or god that is connected in all humans & nature via a divine spark. This could be accessed or experienced through the higher conscious and or nature, as they where all connected. Your thoughts seem to be similar which is fascinating. You would enjoy the Romantic era literature. I wrote a paper on it a while back.
That is very interesting. Currently the largest growing denomination in the US is non-religious; the "nones" as they are called. Mayan prophecies along with many other old world prophecies believed that at then end of their calendar period, a mass awakening and raising of consciousness would occur. Some believe that is what this increasingly growing number may indicate, as it continues to accelerate towards 2012. That literature does sound interesting.
Wow! I enjoy studying mayan and mesoamerican culture as well. I am familiar with the prophecies. Can't wait till 2012 to see what happens. Actually, I am headed to Mexico, Belize, & Guatemala to study the ruins in a few months, I'll post some footage.
Your on a great journey micah, when it leads you full circle back to your roots & the church, post your testimony on youtube! I'd love to hear that extraordinary ride! :)
I look forward to your footage. While I can understand your hope that my journey leads me "full circle" back to the church, I doubt that would be possible without me contracting severe amnesia. No offense, but once your mind has been opened, it's hard to close it up again. It causes too much cognitive dissonance. You might like the book "Collapse of Belief" by Kurt and Barbara Hanks, available online for free. It's a very eye opening book on relational learning.
I have never really studied LDS. I do find it curious that so many supposedly rightious pious people talk down this religion. Does it not have as much validity as any other?
I don't think what I said was very offensive...maybe if you're super sensitive, but you also have to learn how to handle blunt statements...I don't think I'm wasting my time. I have religion shoved down my throat all the time and I find it very interesting to discuss this type of stuff. I don't see how arguing means I'm not improving the quality of my life elsewhere...wtf
You fail to see that this talk isn't powerful and amazing for everyone...to some it comes off as total demagoguery. If you agree with something, of course you're going to give it a standing ovation. If you disagree, you're going to stand by your opinion just the same.
What's wrong with disagreeing and pointing out errors? If anything it's very helpful...and btw not everyone's a Christ follower anyways :P
I am not going to comment anymore because of all the haters. I will not cast pearls before swine. I just want to bear my testimony of the Book of Mormon and hope to receive a place in the Celestial Kingdom where I can be one of the priestesses to my husband and contribute to his eternal increase. I feel sorry for those of you who will have to live in the Terrestrial kingdom, with the honorable people of THE WORLD who could not see the truth. (or maybe the Telestial, you apostates)
wer afraid of anti mormons?? man wer not afraid, wer just to humble ,and arguing, debating etc isnt Christ example. we like to discuss and teach people 0-0 :D
Very inspiring, Jeffrey R. Holland...if you're a gullible ignoramus, that is...no hate, still respect the LDS apostles and prophets, but this sounds like television evangelism
Wow, I've been reading all of these comments and I'm just shaking my head. Look, arguing on the internet, where people can think about something before they say it is just a never ending path.
Just enjoy the talk. It's here to comfort. I have had a great life so far, because of the Church. My friendships have been unbreakable. It teaches us to be humble, loving and serving. Why would anyone attack such an uplifting practice? We're all just trying to live good lives. The Church helps.
Believe It Or Not...
Some people PREFER a Highly-Structured life experience!
Told ALL the details of life:
What to Believe; what to do with your $; when/where to worship.
what clothes to wear (and, what NOT); a 'suggestion' about earrings & tattoos
Simon Says; Cookie-Cutter, One Size Fits All
amarkanders777 1 month ago
Does anyone know where I can get Elder Holland's original address in 1988 of Souls, Symbols, Sacrament?
I would greatly appreciate it
SuavePapichulols 7 months ago
Over 50,000 biblical sites have been identified
a grand total of ZERO BoM sites
SCOREBOARD
Bible 50,000
BoM ZERO
bdplist 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
This is still today, my most favorite talk ever given by Elder Holland! Just wonderful and so powerful
1candyloversaydee 1 year ago
This is still today, my most favorite talk ever given by Elder Holland! Just wonderful and so powerful
1candyloversaydee 1 year ago
I so agree with "jeraboo29" One can not truly describe this event in words, it's indeed an experience outside of experience. As soon as we hear the word feeling, we are quick to respond, saying things like, "for something as extraordinary as the existence of God, I personally would need more than a feeling. Lets not be critical for a momment & think. Whats happiness? A feeling, whats love? A feeling, whats peace? A feeling, this feelings would only come throught experiences.
tubebe8 1 year ago
Everyone check out the band iwrestledabearonce!!!!!
thedudeiscj 1 year ago
A formal review process assigns a level of access restriction to holdings that have sacred, private, or confidential contents. However, just because a record is restricted does not mean that access is impossible. Some restricted records may be accessed with the permission of authorized department personnel. SPC policies and practices are periodically reviewed for clarity, consistency, and alignment.
omiolo 1 year ago
Thank you Elder Holland!
jepkemei 1 year ago 7
Elder Holland is right!
kebellutahedu 2 years ago
But Smart never hesitated to share his wealth with the church or its members. His generosity and his devotion to the cause of claiming the Uintah Basin as a Mormon stronghold gradually dissipated his fortune.
omiolo 2 years ago
"He entered the basin a wealthy man and left it 30 years later in poverty," the author writes in the book's introduction. "Unarguably the basin's most powerful and influential man, with easy access to church and state leaders, he ended his ministry there as an itinerant promoter of genealogy, camping out or staying with church members and hoeing weeds to pay for his board."
omiolo 2 years ago
Haitians walk past the destruction in Port-au-Prince, Haiti, Tuesday, Jan. 26, 2010.
omiolo 2 years ago
The Church announced plans this month to launch an aggressive program to put as many as 600 urgently needed temporary housing kits into the hands of Haitian members before the rainy season starts in April.
It is a continuing effort by the Church to restore normalcy and promote self-reliance in the country.
omiolo 2 years ago
Mormons respond to disasters around the world
omiolo 2 years ago
Confusion & Contention in the Ranks
The consistency that I found among the geographical references contained in the Book of Mormon absolutely compliments the consistency that results from correlating those places to specific terrain, rivers, trail systems and settlement localities in Mesoamerica
omiolo 2 years ago
Oh dear, where to begin...how about give me some archeologists who are not LDS (and therefore are not interested in proving any pre-established condition) who believe the BofM is an accurate archeological or historical record. It's just not impressive that JS (or whatever author you insert), who had access to, and was undoubtedly educated by his teacher/father about the basic geography, was able to think of N & S america, but the geographic comparison ends there.
ursowrng 2 years ago
@ursowrng
So true and very well said! There's absolutely no archaeological or scientific evidence that the Book of Mormon is even remotely true. Not to mention the obvious anachronisms like horses, steel, barley, olives, etc. that did not occur in that part of the world at the time!
ScienceReasonBelief 1 year ago
Knowing that this much is true, I can readily accept as true and valid all of the historic narrative and religious instruction as elaborated in the text. When I apply thought and prayer to the precepts, principles, and ordinances taught in the book, my appreciations for its validity and importance to mankind are amply rewarded by the Spirit, just as Moroni promises in Moroni 10:4.
omiolo 2 years ago
So all that is necessary to change your belief in LDS theology is for the rational introduction to legitimate evidence the native american history is in no way linked to 6th century BCE israelite migrations? I commend your commitment to truth and the excellence of the scientific method, and welcome you to the liberating world of reality.
ursowrng 2 years ago
"native american history is in no way linked to 6th century BCE israelite migrations"
you have PROOF? or just conjecture? or is lack of a dozen people 2600 years ago your proof?
You have me curious!
omiolo 2 years ago
Emergency supplies: With the devastation in Haiti, this blogger believes it's time to pull out the "Emergency Supply List" to help us do a basic review of how prepared we are. Do you have a whistle in your emergency pack? What about things for personal sanitation?
omiolo 2 years ago
The damage in Haiti, however, was clearly vast.
State Department spokesman P.J. Crowley said in Washington that U.S. Embassy personnel were "literally in the dark" after power failed.
"They reported structures down. They reported a lot of walls down. They did see a number of bodies in the street and on the sidewalk that had been hit by debris. So clearly, there's going to be serious loss of life in this," he said.
omiolo 2 years ago
Tuesday's quake was felt in the Dominican Republic, which shares a border with Haiti on the island of Hispaniola, and some panicked residents in the capital of Santo Domingo fled from their shaking homes. But no major damage was reported there. In eastern Cuba, houses shook but there were also no reports of significant damage.
"We felt it very strongly and I would say for a long time. We had time to evacuate," said Monsignor Dionisio Garcia, archbishop of Santiago.
omiolo 2 years ago
Most of Haiti's 9 million people are desperately poor, and after years of political instability the country has no real construction standards. In November 2008, following the collapse of a school in Petionville, the mayor of Port-au-Prince estimated about 60 percent of the buildings were shoddily built and unsafe in normal circumstances.
omiolo 2 years ago
The temblor appeared to have occurred along a strike-slip fault, where one side of a vertical fault slips horizontally past the other, said earthquake expert Tom Jordan at the University of Southern California. The quake's size and proximity to populated Port-au-Prince likely caused widespread casualties and structural damage, he said.
"It's going to be a real killer," he said. "Whenever something like this happens, you just hope for the best."
omiolo 2 years ago
thats so Ridiculous
jayhawk88z 2 years ago
About the martyr bit, what makes anyone think that dying for your belief makes it true? Is anyone impressed with Islam because 19 muslims (and highly educated ones at that) died for their belief?
Most people would rather die than think, and most people do ~ Bertrand Russell.
ursowrng 2 years ago
Perhaps you may say it is not evidence it is true. It is evidence; however, that these men were sincere in their belief. Whether or not you believe its true this is powerful evidence that if they were decievers then they themselves were decieved for they obviously believed every word they spoke.
jamisonslade 2 years ago
@ursowrng But if it is true, dying for that belief makes all the difference now doesn't it?
mastad23 2 years ago
mastad23 Notwithstanding the error in logic, if you're wrong, not only did you waste your entire existence, but others may be motivated to believe as a result, as many muslim children do and emulate, with the result being tragic, and inhumane.
ursowrng 2 years ago
@ursowrng yeah well guess what? I'm not. And this religion is not.
mastad23 2 years ago
mastad23 that's it? you gave up just like that when you couldn't come up with a reasonable explanation to my argument? Better rethink your beliefs my friend, there's more to life than what you've got right now. What's more important than right wand wrong? Truth.
ursowrng 2 years ago
@ursowrng Lol why would I? There are millions of people who are anti-mormon just like you. Anything I have to say on this religion surely isn't going to sink in with you. So basically you are a waste of time.
mastad23 2 years ago
mastad23 Actually, despite your ad hominem attacks, I am open to being wrong. I've been wrong in the past, and I corrected my opinion based on evidence and reason. Are you able to do the same? So far, you haven't answered my argument, nor have you presented any evidence to the contrary.
ursowrng 2 years ago
@ursowrng I'm mean you're entire youtube existence is proving mormons wrong. How pathetic is that?
mastad23 2 years ago
mastad23, One last comment for you consider. There are hardly millions of anti-mormons. I know the theological basis of that statement, but that's not what you intended, is it? Mormonism just isn't that impressive or significant to the world. What's even more depressing is Mormonism's flight to the orthodox evangelical right, lining up behind the likes of creationists. The real challenge is from science, and it's one you are losing. Here's a little secret for you, evolution is true.
ursowrng 2 years ago
@ursowrng Let me tell you this. The greatest good is always going to be met with the greatest opposition. This work, the church, is the GREATEST good this world will ever see. If it's not that impressive to you...move on. Why waste your time coming to a video of a Mormon apostle giving a talk. You got better things to do right? Go study become a professor on evolution.
mastad23 2 years ago
mastad23, once again, you fail. You can have your own beliefs, but you can't have your own facts. Not only is truth independent of right or wrong, but the quantity and quality also have no relationship to it as well. For instance, evil spirits are not the cause of disease, but also, if you are a doctor and have the resources to cure someone, and you cure thousands of people, that does not validate your beliefs as correct. The two are mutually exclusive. Try again, this time engage your brain.
ursowrng 2 years ago
@ursowrng Now you send me 4 comments!! I'm flattered I have your mind rollin' so much that you revert back to this page to try to get the argument out of me again. But yet for a 3rd consecutive time YOU FAIL. YOU coming on this video is MY turf. Take your crap and your arguments and your array of silly words somewhere else. My enemy's camp...psh, I'm extending my arm with a pointed finger to the right..LEAVE, Be gone, quit looking for arguments here. You're name explains exactly what u are.
mastad23 2 years ago
So this is how the argument from religion ends? all in a huff and not a cogent thought to even consider...it's so much easier to just tell someone to leave than deal with reality. Better yet, if you can get enough votes, you can legislate your beliefs to gain control over others actions and punish them for not believing what you demand. Guess what, the hammer blows of modernity and reason will not stop, we will not fail to ridicule your beliefs because u r so wrong.
ursowrng 2 years ago
@ursowrng See you're just making me laugh now with you incoherent babbling. Goodbye sir.
mastad23 2 years ago
Perhaps you should have stayed in school and learned some basic principles of reason, logic, history, science..... I'll end where I began, since you have illustrated it so well. Adieu.
Most people would rather die than think, and most people do. ~ Bertrand Russell
ursowrng 2 years ago
@ursowrng Yeah, Yeah, Yeah...ok. Bye now
mastad23 2 years ago
He seems so bitter at the end of this. Does he really think that more people have analyzed the BOM than the bible, or Shakespeare, or the Koran? 2 Billion non-LDS christians vs. 13 Million LDS. 900 Million Hindus who have been, and still are, unfazed at the BOM, and have been for over 3,300 years. 1 Billion non-religious (god bless them) who think it's not worth even opening. Really.....the fanatical religions aren't threatened, and the thinkers aren't impressed.
ursowrng 2 years ago
Where's the last part of his talk? This does not include his powerful testimony at the end.
travgranhes 2 years ago
The two basic tours never vary much in terms of substance. For example, the narrative of the basic Restoration presentation essentially stays the same regardless of whether the audience is generally LDS or composed of nonmembers. And yet, no two tours are identical.
omiolo 2 years ago
like rearranging deck chairs on the titanic.....
ursowrng 2 years ago
@ursowrng Oh I didn't even realize you left me 3 comments. But look, I came to this vid to listen to Jeffrey R. Holland not debate and rebuttal with some bozo who stands against the church. If you're looking for an argument your barkin up the wrong tree. You're probably some little science wiz who has all his theories tide up in a bundle ready to unleash his plethora of words. Not interested bro. Not interested in taking a dip in the waters of contention...get it? Ok
mastad23 2 years ago
@mastad23 "Not interested in taking a dip in the waters of contention." Yet you insult him, calling him a bozo and a science wiz. This illustrates typical insecure mormon thinking, fake and self-righteous.
lpokeymanl 2 years ago
@lpokeymanl Leishman attended a conference in January 2009 where he was told that the Comfort needed supplies, but also nurses, translators and general volunteers.
omiolo 1 year ago
All docents are trained to take tour groups throughout the entire Church History Museum. Two general, baseline tours exist: a basic Restoration-themed journey through the museum, and a more limited presentation consisting entirely of Utah history and correlated to the curriculum of the fourth-graders who frequently come to the museum on field trips.
omiolo 2 years ago
"We send out all of our communications via e-mail," Sister Ames said. "Our coordinators are very responsible and they're very good at directing their own shift. We give a heavy load of responsibility to our shift coordinators, and then we communicate to everyone through e-mail all of the things that we need to be in sync about. We also use an electronic calendar to make sure that everyone is aware of scheduled tours."
omiolo 2 years ago
With 12 docent groupings that essentially function independently of each other and rarely collaborate or interact, impeccable efficiency of communication is the only thing that keeps docents running on the same page.
omiolo 2 years ago
What Elder Holland is describing is much more than "feelings and emotions" -
It's like trying to explain to a blind man who has never seen, what it is like to see, all the while he denies it exists, and you pity him, but go on loving your sight.
blooit 2 years ago
It's all subjective mate...you may not understand how tasty alligator liver is and for that I pity you.
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
"A wicked man can't write something like the book of mormon, and a good man won't write it unless told to do so by God." So true. Wicked men don't do good, because it's not in their nature. With the magnitude of the book of mormon, the only way it can be written is by revelation directly by God. I add my own witness with Elder Holland that the book is TRUE and I would never deny it. I have felt it by reading it and praying about it. This I know, and not just believe.
sdeltravieso 2 years ago
What's so great about a book that plagiarizes the KJV and View of the Hebrews?
fubecabr 2 years ago
Woo! Go, Elder Holland!!!! This is my favorite conference talk of all time. I LOVED it and find myself thinking over his words all the time. He's absolutely right, every word. :)
oemaila 2 years ago
I don't know of a conference talk with as many logical fallacies, compressed into such a short period of time as this one.
I love the notion that the sincerity of early mormons somehow proves that the BoM and mormonism as being true. One could say the same thing about Al Queda, Hezbollah, The Republican Guard, and the Koran.
fubecabr 2 years ago 2
civilization literally laid at his feet and gave him Gold and everything he wanted because they thought Cortez was Quetzalcoatl the bearded God who promised them that he would come again. There is no other record of a bearded God visiting this civilization outside of the Book of Mormon. And it makes sense that after a heavenly visitation and being healed of all illnesses that they would pass this on to their children for generations.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
Ah yes, Quetzalcoatl, the black feathered serpent god (of many gods).
fubecabr 2 years ago
Quetzalcoatl has nothing to do with Cortes, or Jesus. Quetzalcoatl was one of many gods in the Mesoamerican pantheon.
There is no evidence that Mesoamericans were expecting Quetzalcoatl to "return" (or any record of a belief in a prior visitation in the first place).
The "Quetzalcoatl/Cortes" story is considered by most Mesoamericanist scholars to be one of many myths about the Spanish conquest.
NavajoJoe66 2 years ago
Everyone wants proof of God. And wants proof of the correctness of the Book of Mormon and yet people WILL not do the studying necessary to see what God has already revealed. There are pyramids in Egypt and in South America. They had the same technologies and yet the world prior to Columbus was thought to be flat. How did the same technology span oceans during a time of no communication technology? What about Cortez? And his ability to walk in and take over an entire civilization? A
angellgirl1 2 years ago
Greece, China, medieval Europe, and India also had pyramids. I guess that means that those Nephites had a lot of frequent flyer miles.
Actually, the Ancient Greeks knew the world was spherical and actually correctly calculated the circumference of the earth to within 5%.
fubecabr 2 years ago
When God speaks to your heart and to your spirit you KNOW it. It isn't just a fleeting passing hot flash for no reason, or a chemical reason like menopause. And it is the most beautiful holy experience. Unless you are humble and ask sincerely and want to knonw for yourself you cannot have these experiences.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
Ahh, so feelings and emotions, generated as a result of the power of suggestion, overrides and voids empirical fact.
MMMMKKKKKaaaaaayyyyyy
fubecabr 2 years ago
It's not just a feeling, it's a whole body experience. It's your spirit recognizing the Spirit of God, and when God manifests himself there is a sense of peace, warmth, love, hope, it is all encompassing, at times. There have been times where when I have receieved inspiration from God where my whole body has felt warm, just like if you were to step outside in the sunlight on an early summer day and I have felt that physically in the dead of winter. It ONLY happens when meditating or in prayer
angellgirl1 2 years ago
Hmm, Catholics, Evangelicals, Muslims, Hindus, Atheists, and others describe the same sorts of (manufactured) feelings in the context of their own lives as well. I guess that means they're all true.
fubecabr 2 years ago
Try this, go a day without food -a full day begin this day with a humble (on your knees) prayer that you want to KNOW the truth not just 'feel' it. As you fast, remember to cry up in prayer anytime you feel hunger or frustration and during this day do nothing but good for those around you - remember to pray always in your mind during the day. Then, as your day ends, kneel in prayer and ask to KNOW these things - stay on your kneels til he lets you KNOW they are true.
EfrajimOilcan 2 years ago
Plus, with so many different beliefs out there and so many ideas of what God is, how can you be sure that your feelings of truth are any more credible than someone of a different faith? Everyone feels strongly about things, but for something as extraordinary as the existence of God, I personally would need more than a feeling.
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
Absolutely correct. However, the word "feeling" is a simple use of lexicon used by those who have had a religious experience. Specifically, for LDS, the experience is a witness of Christ that is transcendent of words. One can not truly describe this event in words, it's indeed an experience outside of experience. You truly have to partake in such an event to grasp it. And, yes, you are correct again, in receiving a true witness of Christ, you would indeed receive more than a rational "feeling."
jeraboo29 2 years ago 3
But how do we percieve such a witness? These experiences are typically said to come through feeling. Feelings, although intense, and strong enough to make you think they mean something more, are still feelings.
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
crystal ball to know what the outcome would be. All I knew was that I felt what I felt and it was a strong feeling. Who knows what would have happened had I not listened to that feeling. I have seen miracle after miracle in my own life when I have listened to these feelings. So say what you will. God does not need to prove himself to man, but he does promise as we prove ourselves to him, and in faith come to him he will answer and he will not forsake us.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
I'll believe that those incidents happened to you, as I do believe in miracles, but they do not point to God's doing anymore than they do to Zeus's, Allah's, or Dumbledore's. I've had such miracles happen to me with zero faith in God. Some things just happen. Just as miracles happen, freak accidents and tragedies happen but none of it points to the existence of a God or the lack of one. Sometimes people are extremely lucky. A lot of things that seem
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
supernatural can easily be explained through science, psychology, etc. Sometimes what people think of as miracles are due to people's knowledge (even subconscious knowledge), technology, or even crazy skills someone has.
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
However, I sat back and waited, I worked as I always had and let things unfold naturally though it was hard for me to do. . After 2 very stressful months HR approached me and let me know that I had been vindicated and were impressed by how I handled the situation. Threse months later upon my review I was given a raise and two months after that a promotion to a position I had wanted for the past 3 years. The outcome was much better for me though uncomfortable at the time. I didn't have a
angellgirl1 2 years ago
At work last year one of the managers who was having an affair with my boss falsely accused me of things at work. I had proof of their affair and could prove that I had not done the things she accused me of. I had all my documentation ready to move forward with a law suit and to prove to HR when I felt that I should not do anything, and just sit back and be patient. This was completely contrary to what I wanted to do and felt was not in my best interest.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
Last week 2 of my childrenwere very sick, both coughing with fevers. At the onset I felt I should give my youngest breathing treatments and for my eldest, I felt impressed to treat him with steam instead. It was odd to me that I would feel I should treat them differently. I later took them to the Dr. and both had H1N1 but had 2 different strains of the virus. The Dr. w/o my input prescribed the same separate treatments for my sons. I have no medical training but followed my feelings.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
Somehow I don't think you really believe that. Were you FEEL that something was really hot when you put your hand on it, you would remove your hand, or if you were to FEEL a heavy weight on your chest and FEEL shooting pains up and down your left arm you would go to the ER, Were you to go outside and FEEL cold you would put on a jacket or sweater. Our feelings are evidence of our truths. I am not talking about projected feelings either I am talking about feelings without having an agenda.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
I'm talking about emotional feelings, not physical ones. You HAVE physical proof that something is hot if you physically feel it. You would not rely on your emotions to tell you something is hot without testing it yourself. That is the kind of proof I'm talking about that is not existent for God.
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints who is also a decendant of Brigham Young. As a studious, inquisitive, and informed member (having read and been exposed to anti-literature) I do not need to read the Tanners' book. I have been privy to meet some of the Prophets and Apostles. I have felt the presence of God with these men. They have been the most holy and exquisite experiences. No book will ever change the witness God has given me of their integrity & honor.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
For the truth about mormonism please read "Mormonism Shadow or Reality" by Jerald and Sandra Tanner. Sandra realised her great great grandfather, Brighgam Young, was not a prohet when she read his sermons on blood atonement and the blacks. She and her husband led thousands from the church.
bossendenwoodconvict 2 years ago
I know that God lives. I have a personal relationship with Him. I know that He knows me by name. He knows my every heart's desire, He knows my every heart ache. He has blessed my life in ways I never imagined possible. I have felt His love, I have heard His voice, and I have witnessed His power. I felt His holiness, his purity, and His unconditional love.
When I trust in Him, I have no need to fear. He has never failed me.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
Would you believe me if I told you I had felt the arms of the Savior around me? And that others I know have had similar experiences? No you would not, you would say we were dilusional or that we had some psychotic episode that led us to hallucinate such an experience. We do not need to share our sacred experiences to prove to someone who has no faith that God exists, God reveals himself to those who first express faith in him, he will not force himself on us. If you want to know God, pray.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
I wouldn't say everyone who feels these things is necessarily psychotic, but there are reasons that we feel some things that are completely psychological and not spiritual in the least. Besides, you shouldn't base truth on what you feel...feelings are unreliable.
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
It is sad when scriptures of any kind Bible or Book of Mormon is taken out of context. It is easy to take 2 or 3 verses and twist them anyway you want to. It has a whole different meaning when you put it in it's proper context.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
And who decides what the proper context is?
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
Carterfamily...Matthew 7:1-5..Judge not, that ye be not judeged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. Any why beholdest thou the mote that is in they brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and behold, a beam is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye;...."
angellgirl1 2 years ago
Also, I saw Elder Holland when he came to Australia this year. He is a man of service and love. I love him and his teachings.
ninabalarina4 2 years ago
yes, only through obedience can you understand. As Jeremiah says in ch20:9 "his word was in my heart as a burning fire shut up in my bones" & Luke 15:35 "...Did not our hearts burn within us... while he opened to us the scriptures"
The truth of the Book of Mormon BURNS in my heart the same as Jeremiah & others in the Bible.
6 billion people in this world, abt 13million are LDS. Not many believe the BOM is true, so musn't be such a good lie...
Truth can only come through FAITH AND OBEDIENCE
ninabalarina4 2 years ago
Here here Elder Holland. I haven't heard such a powerful testimony in a long time. I've met Elder Holland when I was a student at BYU and he is a great man.
62begonia 2 years ago
The Book of Mormon is very flawed. From teaching that peoples skin color reflects their sin color In Jacob 3:8,9, to teaching 3 days of darkness covering the whole earth, from the time of Jesus death, to his resurrection Helaman 14:20,26,27 & 3 Nephi 8:3,20-23 to plainly declaring there are imperfections in it Mormon 8:12 The BOM is as deceptive as the author of it. Any good lie has to appear true, or no one will believe it. Satan acieves the perfect lie, when it looks like scripture from God.
carterfamily8903 2 years ago
The skin color wasn't a punishment it was to distinguish the Lamanites and Nephites. There are many people of different nationalities who are part of the LDS church, and everyone is equal - despite skin color - and Heavenly Father loves them all unconditionally I believe.
Chairgrape 2 years ago
Though the Bible is very clear, that God made all nations of men of one blood, and that the mark on Cain had nothing to do with the curse on Cain, and certainly does not indicate that his skin color was changed. The Book of Mormon most certainly teaches that the skin color was a curse for sin, see: 2 Nephi 5:21-24; Jacob 3:5,8,9; 3 Nephi 2:14-16; Alma 3:6-10&14--16. The Pearl of Great Price teaches the curse on Cain was a skin color change in Moses 7:22. Read carefully Genesis 4:1-16.
carterfamily8903 2 years ago
Well apparently God didn't love black people prior to 1979, when they weren't allowed to hold the priesthood.
I mean, does that sound like something a god would do? Discriminate based on skin color? That's messed up.
NavajoJoe66 2 years ago
jesus loves you all
taahineheidi 2 years ago
This man is a true apostle of the Lord and there is no deception in his words. I know because of the spirit that I felt during this talk. If you learn anything from the scriptures you don't need to see to believe. There are instances in the scriptures where people see great signs and wonders from heaven and they still hardened their hearts. The Book of Mormon AND the Bible are the word of God and E. Holland is a true apostle of the Lord. I am grateful for his courage to stand up for his beliefs
Netwtdarkchocholate 2 years ago
With regards to depression in UTAH. Sorry, but that is a vast generalisation. I have NO depression, never. My views on depression, not supported by a lot of church members im sure, is a conflict between spiritual body & physical body. IE we know something is true - our spirit knows the truth, but we are not acting on that and there is a conflict. Another term is "SIN" (I'm not saying I never sin) difference is I know how to repent- relying of the merits of Jesus Christ...
ninabalarina4 2 years ago
I second Jeffrey R Hollands testimony, as I have had countless witnesses to the divinity of the Book of Mormon, & all that pertains to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. You might not believe a white, American church leader. But, I a young lady in Australia, 1000kms away, know the same thing that he does, by way of revelation and obedience to God's laws.
The Book of Mormon IS true and God's covenant is restored again. :)
Life is BRILLIANT because I know this :)
ninabalarina4 2 years ago 3
The LDS church is God's church. Israel is God's covenant people. The priesthood of God on earth today - within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints,is the same in the patriarchal order in the Old Testament & in the Jesus's Church in the New Testament.
ninabalarina4 2 years ago
I can stomach it. Easy. Truth brings joy to my heart, like the fruits of the spirit. Gal 5:22-23 Also you talk of the bible, how do you know the bible is true?? How did you come to that conclusion. Did God tell you? Do you feel it is true in your heart? Prove it? hmm, you believe something without seeing it. That is an interesting concept.
ninabalarina4 2 years ago
Jesus Christ not only healed the sick and taught, he established his Church. At the time of His baptism, His Church had not been established. Paul in asking to what baptism these individuals had received, he asked because it was prior to Christ's church being established. They were then baptized again in the name of the Lord Jesus and received what they could not receive before and that is the Gift of the Holy Ghost. Acts 19-1-6
angellgirl1 2 years ago
God may not show himself to the naked eye, but he does fill the heart and soul of man when mankind is open to it. Just as suredly as I feel the wind in my face I feel the love God has for me in my heart and soul. God is not invisible, I see him in the faces of my children, in every sunrise/sunset, in the kindness and genorisity of man. Where I don't see him is in the heart of individuals who point and scoff at others to fill the void in their own lives. This is not gullible it is truly seeing
angellgirl1 2 years ago
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thisfreakingname 2 years ago
Santa Claus filled my heart and soul before I realized he was pretend.
ARGUMENT FROM CREATIVE INTERPRETATION
(1) God is: (a) The feeling you have when you look at a newborn baby.
(b) The love of a mother for her child.
(c) That little still voice in your heart.
(d) Humankind's potential to overcome their difficulties.
(e) How I feel when I look at a sunset.
(f) The taste of ice cream on a hot day.
(2) Therefore, God exists.
Do you not see a problem with this?
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
No we do not claim to have cornered the market on "God". God loves all his children no matter what their religious belief is including those who choose not to believe in Him. I have sat in many synogogues and congregations and have felt both God's love for the people and their love for God in each service. God will answer the prayers of anyone who asks him for inspiration or direction. Jesus said: "Love one another, as I have loved you" I try to live this but sadly sometimes I fall short
angellgirl1 2 years ago
General Authorities do not receive a salary. However, they do receive a healthy expense account. Many leave their jobs or professions to hold their positions in the Church. They don't simply live on Savings while they serve as most serve out the rest of their lives after being called to these positions in their 40's and 50's. They are indeed supported financially. While it is not 'called' a salary...they are compensated.
chamonix1107 2 years ago
beachchic03...GTFO the internets
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
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thisfreakingname 2 years ago
Nice talk
better salary
saggley 2 years ago
the leaders of our church do not receive a salary.
AprilSkye143 2 years ago
Nope, but seminary teachers do! :P
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
maybe seminary teachers do in utah, where it's a part of the school system, but not in CA
AprilSkye143 2 years ago
They don't get paid in CA? Really now? Seminary is separate from the school system even in Utah. They get their salary out of tithing
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
Is it too hard to believe that someone loves God enough to devote his or her life to Him without getting paid? Apparenty, for you, it is. I'm sorry friend.
RainbowTrigger 2 years ago
DIS WAS MAH FAVORITE TALK N CONFRENCE
xayelyh 2 years ago
Why does the world believe educated men who will testify of Christ to get gain and fill their pockets and bank accounts such as many apologetic writers do and yet condemn a man who will die for what he knows to be true. A man without wealth, a formal education, who has absolutely nothing to gain by sharing what he knows to be right and true and requires nothing but for the listener to read what hsa been written and invoke their own relationship with God to receive a witness of it's truth.
angellgirl1 2 years ago
The Bible is a compilation of written accounts of Christ believer determined by the Niccean Council. This compilation has been interpretted and edited by men since then NOT claiming the authority of God. Yet a man claiming the authority of God brings forth the Book of Mormon which substantiates Biblical claims of a Savior and the world scoffs. Hello? The original writings of the Bible were divinely inspired too. Yet the world will accept non-inspired men to bring forth God's word. Odd
angellgirl1 2 years ago
I love Elder Holland's testimony :]
H0ney9urL 2 years ago
Who's the one that's on here all day? ;-) J/K. If nobody cares, why spend your time replying to me? I wish you well.
micah3sixty 2 years ago
Time spent wasting, isn't time wasted at all. -Cheers
micah3sixty 2 years ago
"Lamanites" and "Nephites" didn't float across the water. They walked on a land bridge. Sorry, it's still fiction no matter how emotional you get.
Let's start being conscientious about real pre-columbian history
snicketiesnack 2 years ago
snack, Are you familiar with the Popul Vuh and other Mesoamerican traditions? Mayan tradition, and the Popul Vuh, recorded or orally passed down the history of their ancestors having crossed by sea in vessels. It's very fascinating. I'm actually heading to Guatemala, Belize, and the Yucatan in January to explore the ruins. I will post some video of it upon my return.
jeraboo29 2 years ago
BTW Jeraboo29, blocking people doesn't become you. Unless of course, your name is Mormon Answer Man.
AmIWhiteYet 2 years ago
LOL. Does Mormon Answer Man block peeps? I really hate blocking peeps, but I have done so if there is foul language, spam, or outright hate talk. Similarly, I block dudes who create several accounts and argue/agree with themselves, you know what I mean? :) I do this because this is a religious vid, and it deserves a basic level of intellectual and moral honesty. However, I have uploaded a disabled comments version of this talk for those wanting to share it on FB or with family and friends.
jeraboo29 2 years ago
So long as those are the ground rules, that's fine. Mormon Answer Man definitely blocks anyone who can refute his ridiculous opinions. If you're fair, I promise to be civil.
AmIWhiteYet 2 years ago
Holland is trying to pull a fast one here.
The Book of Mormon read by Hyrum and mentioned in D&C 135 has been previously identified in the LDS Church news as belonging to Bathsheba Smith, the Wife of Geo. A. Smith and has her name inscribed on the front. The copy Holland is holding has no inscription.
But hey, it wouldn't be conference without a little deceit right? Paul H. Dunn would be proud...
AmIWhiteYet 2 years ago
It takes a couple minutes to reply to an inquiry and then I'm off to what I was doing before. lol.
micah3sixty 2 years ago
Did I say I believed in it? Not exactly. I am taking a wait and see approach. Like Mormon prophecies have been any more successful. You may want to look through the D&C to see all of the failed prophecies from Joseph Smith.
micah3sixty 2 years ago
beachchic03 is spunky!
jeraboo29 2 years ago
Ah, but when several historians and researchers seem to agree on what happened based on their individual studies and evidences, it's likely not rubbish. "There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is a proof against all argument, and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance. That principle is condemnation before investigation."
--Herbert Spencer
micah3sixty 2 years ago
LDS wonder too why "pious" people talk down. They do this out of jealousy, fear, or ignorance. As well, LDS doctrine differs from standard Christian Theism. LDS believe God & Christ are separate tangible beings, in a premortal existence, in a purposeful earthly existence as part of Gods plan, in eternal families, that humans are literal children of God, & in direct revelation. Also, Christs church was restored, by God & Christ appearing to a 14yr old farm boy Joseph Smith. Very valid to us.
jeraboo29 2 years ago
In none of my replies did I talk down or belittle anyone. Those who stoop to such measures do so because they do not have any sufficient verifiable evidence to counter the argument being waged with them. Something even Jeffery R Holland is guilty of in talking down to those of us have come to a different conclusion about the BofM, and I quote:
micah3sixty 2 years ago
"If anyone is foolish enough or misled enough to reject 531 pages of a heretofore unknown text, [...], without honestly attempting to account for the origin of those pages somehow, [...] if that is the case, then such persons elect or otherwise have been deceived and if they leave this church, they must do so by crawling over, or under, or around the BoM to make their exit." - Apostle Jeffery R. Holland
micah3sixty 2 years ago
In this quote, Holland is directly insulting us by calling us foolish. He also assumes that we are dishonest in that we haven't "honestly" researched this issue thoroughly, only because we haven't come to the same conclusion. Search google for "The Untold story of the Death of Joseph Smith" to see how misleading this discourse is.
micah3sixty 2 years ago
Are you familiar with Transcendentalism of the 1800s? Promoted by Romantic writers like Emerson, Thoreau, Whitman, and Hawthorne? They embraced the philosophy of Plato, Coleridge, Kant & theology of Calvinism, Unitarianism & Eastern thought. Specifically, they believed in the divine right of man to explore his intellect and create a direct relationship with God. This relationship solidifies a heavenly unification of man, nature, & the creator. Just curious, your comments mirror this belief.
jeraboo29 2 years ago
I am vaguely familiar with some of those philosophers. I think when you tie reason and logic into beliefs regarding an after/pre-life, universalism is the most logical conclusion.
micah3sixty 2 years ago
I might add that many or most of the Near Death Experiences I have read appear to confirm a universal source that accepts all of us equally and above all wants us to live according to the dictates of our own conscious, do what makes us happy. I find the experiences of those who have died and lived to tell the tale more believable and confirming than anyone who has not experienced such. But I read and study them as a whole, looking for the similarities and such.
micah3sixty 2 years ago
It doesn't wash micah. First you state, You can't pretend to know what others feel and say it's different or not true to them. Then you conclude, Faith is the great cop-out. & The Book_of Mormon is not true. Regarding the spirit & God you claim, I've had such experiences both in and outside of the church...and felt the communion you describe. Yet you concur, Heaven's are shut. ETC. I believe you feel your not bitter & you will have a witty reply. But, truly check your words, & heart.
jeraboo29 2 years ago
Good observation. However, I no longer believe these feelings "of the spirit" to be neither confirmation of truth, nor supernatural in origin. The beliefs I have regarding an afterlife are just that, beliefs. I make no claims as to whether that is the true nature of our destiny or origins. Thanks for the conversation. I appreciate the opportunity to express myself.
micah3sixty 2 years ago
I asked about Transcendentalism because Emerson,Thoreau & those guys referred to an over-soul or god that is connected in all humans & nature via a divine spark. This could be accessed or experienced through the higher conscious and or nature, as they where all connected. Your thoughts seem to be similar which is fascinating. You would enjoy the Romantic era literature. I wrote a paper on it a while back.
jeraboo29 2 years ago
That is very interesting. Currently the largest growing denomination in the US is non-religious; the "nones" as they are called. Mayan prophecies along with many other old world prophecies believed that at then end of their calendar period, a mass awakening and raising of consciousness would occur. Some believe that is what this increasingly growing number may indicate, as it continues to accelerate towards 2012. That literature does sound interesting.
micah3sixty 2 years ago
Wow! I enjoy studying mayan and mesoamerican culture as well. I am familiar with the prophecies. Can't wait till 2012 to see what happens. Actually, I am headed to Mexico, Belize, & Guatemala to study the ruins in a few months, I'll post some footage.
Your on a great journey micah, when it leads you full circle back to your roots & the church, post your testimony on youtube! I'd love to hear that extraordinary ride! :)
jeraboo29 2 years ago
I look forward to your footage. While I can understand your hope that my journey leads me "full circle" back to the church, I doubt that would be possible without me contracting severe amnesia. No offense, but once your mind has been opened, it's hard to close it up again. It causes too much cognitive dissonance. You might like the book "Collapse of Belief" by Kurt and Barbara Hanks, available online for free. It's a very eye opening book on relational learning.
micah3sixty 2 years ago
"...believed that at then end of their calendar period, a mass awakening and raising of consciousness would occur."
Yeah, it's called mescaline. It's the only way to fly. Maybe this is the Restoration of the Psychedelic Experience, ya?
empbac 2 years ago
I have never really studied LDS. I do find it curious that so many supposedly rightious pious people talk down this religion. Does it not have as much validity as any other?
hippership 2 years ago
Such a great and inspiring talk :)
hoolege06 2 years ago
And forget that we are all wasting our energies on youtube instead of working at the homeless shelter...
bamadudecrush 2 years ago
to freaking- life sucks dude. And the garden aint beautiful enough for me, bud. I mean, global warming sounds terribly hot and dry!
bamadudecrush 2 years ago
I don't think what I said was very offensive...maybe if you're super sensitive, but you also have to learn how to handle blunt statements...I don't think I'm wasting my time. I have religion shoved down my throat all the time and I find it very interesting to discuss this type of stuff. I don't see how arguing means I'm not improving the quality of my life elsewhere...wtf
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
You fail to see that this talk isn't powerful and amazing for everyone...to some it comes off as total demagoguery. If you agree with something, of course you're going to give it a standing ovation. If you disagree, you're going to stand by your opinion just the same.
What's wrong with disagreeing and pointing out errors? If anything it's very helpful...and btw not everyone's a Christ follower anyways :P
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
"Oh ye of little blind obedience" makes more sense.
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
I am not going to comment anymore because of all the haters. I will not cast pearls before swine. I just want to bear my testimony of the Book of Mormon and hope to receive a place in the Celestial Kingdom where I can be one of the priestesses to my husband and contribute to his eternal increase. I feel sorry for those of you who will have to live in the Terrestrial kingdom, with the honorable people of THE WORLD who could not see the truth. (or maybe the Telestial, you apostates)
Jynx67 2 years ago
Now THAT is messed up.
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
bothere are evindences of animals in BOM -0-0- BOM is true yo it testifies Christ :D
saraba51213srb1975 2 years ago
Sources plz
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
wer afraid of anti mormons?? man wer not afraid, wer just to humble ,and arguing, debating etc isnt Christ example. we like to discuss and teach people 0-0 :D
saraba51213srb1975 2 years ago
How ironic to flaunt your humility.
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
com'on man still not Christian??? my gosh soften ur hearts gezz
saraba51213srb1975 2 years ago
By which you mean dumb it down.
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
I know, me too! My 14 y/o daughter loves the Apostles. I think she has a crush on Boyd K. Packer. You can't do better than that!
Jynx67 2 years ago
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DavyCrocket2003 2 years ago
Very inspiring, Jeffrey R. Holland...if you're a gullible ignoramus, that is...no hate, still respect the LDS apostles and prophets, but this sounds like television evangelism
thisfreakingname 2 years ago
Wow, I've been reading all of these comments and I'm just shaking my head. Look, arguing on the internet, where people can think about something before they say it is just a never ending path.
Just enjoy the talk. It's here to comfort. I have had a great life so far, because of the Church. My friendships have been unbreakable. It teaches us to be humble, loving and serving. Why would anyone attack such an uplifting practice? We're all just trying to live good lives. The Church helps.
Hankskamill 2 years ago 2