First let me say that you sound like you have a very good instrument. Now, you are singing dark, but improperly dark by a bit of laryngeal depression together with losing proper chiaro (vowel fineness and clarity). Forget placing anything. There is no such thing as placing sound. You have to go for the correct balance of chiaro and scuro while relieving constriction. The darkness is good, but I would like to hear you add vowel clarity (AH EH EE OH OO) with a very squillante edge to it...
Squillante and squillo are the same thing. That ringing, brassy edge. That is the fineness of the vowel through the proper development and coordination of the chest register. That needs to be added to the dark sound you already have, but without adding extra pressure or constriction.
Humming doesn't really do anything for singing. Lamperti used to say that if you cannot sing well you cannot hum well. So get the singing right first. :)
Good. I teach ideal function. So it is very direct and is based on getting everything developed and working efficiently. Let me know how it works out, but it is very hard to do on your own. Mainly because there are so many things that can come into tension that interfere or because they way we hear ourselves in our heads is not how the sound is outside. Good luck with it all!
Some do teach, initially, to TRY to keep the tongue tip near the teeth, tongue arched, in an attempt to keep the root off the larynx. But don't force it anywhere, as MrCafiero says...
Ha ha, OK. Thanks again. So maybe I will make another video, like this one, but attempting to sing the vowels more clearly then. I know youtube is no substitute for long-term vocal coaching ;-( but do you have any tips for extending the upper register a bit? (healthily of course?) :-)
SD....I agree with the others. You are a baritone, possibly a bass-baritone. I do agree with someone else on here that it sounds like you are darkening your sound more than it should be. I think you need to lighten the voice a bit, and try to focus more on a placement that is "higher". All this damned Melocchi lowered larynx stuff is affecting you! :-)
Well as I have said to others, I do not *intend* to darken my voice but I may be, I don't know... so how do I "lighten" it? And get "higher placement?"
Nah I really have no interest in the Melocchi technique beyond the fact that it's interesting in a general way to opera fans. =) I have certainly not tried to implement any of it- I wouldn't know how anyway. :P Thanks for the comment!
Nice work! Wish I could have nice vibrato! My vibrato doesn't work sometimes :P. My mum enjoyed this, said it sounds nicer than my scales (I can get high ...like at around Ab6 .. it's very unpleasant to listen to). If you're wondering what your range is, from what I have heard, I think its Baritone, possibly Bass Baritone BUT I can't tell you for sure, I know too many singers who are really tenors or sopranos who don't know how to use their whole range.
OK, I have some expert advice on the humming. You are correct, partially. It's a good idea, but not on "mmmm". Hum instead with your jaw loose and lips partially open, on an "ng" and you'll be doing yourself great favors!
Thanks. :) The advice I got was as follows: Drop your jaw, keeping lips closed but not tight. Hum the first note that comes, something in your middle, whatever's easy. Than slowly go up a couple steps and then come back down (do re mi re do or something like that.) Then after 5 minutes or so open the mouth slowly while trying to keep the jaw etc in about the same position. You should feel the resonance more in the head/mouth and better vibrato. It works! I'll try it your way though ;)
Very nice voice...rich and smooth. I'm confused below where you say you sang una furtiva lagrima but can't reach an A-flat yet. But at any rate, I agree with Moorhe that you might be darkening your tone.
A few things I can think of: first, I'm not sure about the humming. I don't think you should be singing on resonant consonants like that, never heard that advice from any teacher...that might be darkening your tone, especially since you start on them so often. More...
I meant I can't reach a *TENOR* A flat. (not even a Baritone high A I don't think) I was singing a tenor aria but I'm pretty sure I'm not a tenor, ha ha.
The humming is something I read from a vocal teacher and it has been confirmed by some others. It's supposed to contribute to correct placement by focusing the resonance in the front of the mouth so to speak (rather than in the throat) and it definitely seems to help. I use it as a warm up exercise but obviously not when singing lyrics. ;-D
Let's talk actual notes. A above middle C is A5. That is the A in Una Furtiva Lagrima. What is a "Baritone High A"?
I agree about the placement not being in the throat, but it sounds an awful lot like you're learning about "masques" and that can be dangerous. It is a very misleading concept.
High A for a baritone would A4 wouldn't it? That's high, but high or "Verdi baritones" hit high A4's and G's routinely. I think I would need almost another whole octave on the top of my voice to have the full range of a typical operatic baritone. I'm not 100% sure about anything though :P
Well I haven't had any training or any professional advice really. I've just picked up a few smatterings here and there. I doubt if I can do any real damage dabbling like I do :D Thanks though
Ok, high C for a tenor is C5. I thought the numbers went from A-G#, but am I incorrect? What is an A below C5? A5, or A4?
At any rate, yes, that's the high A in Una Furtiva Lagrima, and it's a high A for a tenor, too. I don't know of any tenors who could hit an A above that in modal voice! =D
So, you transposed Una Furtiva Lagrima down an octave? I think I get it now! Can't believe I didn't figure that out from what else you said.
Sing on italian vowels. The sound you're starting with is a mixture of a (ah) and e (eh), and is not as conducive to proper technique. Sing on a (ah), e (eh), i (ee), o (oh), and u (oo). Your vowel choice can darken your voice as well.
I can describe some good exercises (Marchesi) in message, or just demo them on my channel if you like.
Finally, you darken your voice when you don't raise your zygomatic arch (soft palate). more...
So, next time you sing, try this. Start your note, humming first if you want, and once you're set on the vowel with your mouth open, take your index finger and push it a little in past your teeth, resting on your lower lip.
You should feel your soft palate arch away defensively, and that is what you need to maintain as you sing. I still don't do it all the time, and it kills my head voice when I fail to raise it. Picture opening down AND out, and you'll raise it.
The raising of the soft palate is a RESULT of proper technique, not something you DO to GET good technique. It will raise on its own in due time if you are doing everything right. It's like a low and stable larynx. Those things happen automatically when you singing correctly, you don't 'lower your larynx' to sing correctly. Hope I make sense. Same thing with 'singing from the diaphragm', singing into the 'mask', the vocal 'cover', etc. All these things do nothing but confuse.
I think you have a lovely warm timber to your voice... It doesn't sound strained at all in your upper register... This is of course from an untrained ear!
I think you should maybe record yourself singing an aria and posting it - I for one would definitely be interested in hearing it!
Such an improvement to the videos you had up a while ago, except the voice is so much darker than I remember it being. Are you sure you aren't darkening it artificially?
You do have a natural singing voice, but remember to breathe on the low notes as well as the higher notes. Sounds to be just about the same range as my voice, apart from the fact that I have quite a few notes more on the bottom of my range (which I'm sure you could get with correct support). Thank a lot for the video.Good fun.
I only remember having one video up before actually. The "una furtiva lagrima" which I saw fit to remove =P
I think this is a big improvement because since then I have learned to warm up first, and my range has absolutely increased by a few notes on top and bottom probably just because I've been singing a lot more (to myself =P) and doing some humming exercises etc; also the acoustics are better here than they were in my kitchen (on that old video.) ;-P
I hope I'm not darkening artificially! :P At least, I am making no *conscious* effort to do so. I just warm up well and try to get the placement in the proper place by humming scales etc with my jaw relaxed and throat open (or at least, I try to do so. >_> ) Thanks a lot for listening, I'll remember what you said about breathing.
hey that's actually really good. I'm assuming you aren't trained? Really good natural voice, great overtones, and very even and true vibrato, you could definitely make something out of this voice. You've got a natural placement. Where's your passaggio? Sounds like a baritone to me, although you have to keep in mind I'm not a know all :P
Yeah I'm serious too, you've really got a great voice. I don't say that to everyone. You should be thankful because not many people are born with a natural placement and have a voice with such rich overtones as yours.
Natural placement is when your voice has the ability to achieve a certain degree of resonance before you've had any training. I suppose it's synonymous with having a naturally 'operatic voice', which you do. If someone doesn't have that natural placement, chances are they won't be a good singer no matter how much training they go through.
If it's D4 you are definitely a baritone or bass-baritone. High baritones who sing Verdi usually have passagio at about Eb. But remember there is no voice that meets all the 'standard statistics', that's what makes each of us human.
Thanks again. The only "training" I've had is humming to myself with my jaw relaxed :P and I try to keep my throat open but beyond that I have no idea what I'm doing =\
So do you think the upper register probably needs extending more than the lower?
Hey GOS I'm confused about something. My passagio is probably F4, maybe even F#4, but I've been told multiple times that I'm a baritone, not a tenor. Could I be a tenor? I'm just worried that I'll hurt my voice if I'm singing in the wrong voice type.
My range is from around F#2 or F2 to Bb4. I can crackle some lower notes and scream some higher notes, but I don't think that counts. :)
Unless I hear you I can't be sure. Try going down from high C in reinforced falsetto and see where you crack at or break into chest. That helps. Note I said reinforced falsetto, not pure falsetto, because it won't work if you do the latter. If you post a recording of yourself I may be able to help. Untrained tenors sometimes sound like baritones because they put too much weight on their voices.
Based simply on tonal quality, I'd say baritone, possibly bass-baritone, though it appears you have more freedom at the top of your range than at the bottom (the opposite of me :). It would help to determine where your registration points are. The normal speech inflection range will end at the primo passaggio, which is around B or B-flat3 for most baritones, and just lower for bass-baritones. The secondo passaggio, where head voice begins, will generally occur at E or E-flat4.
Keep in mind, however, that every singer is different, and that your register "changes" might fall between these pitches. Also as francotenelli mentioned, look through the vocal literature to see how you manage the tessitura of various pieces.
Your timbre is quite attractive, and you really should consider serious studies.
Interesting stuff, thanks! My knowledge of singing technique is quite rudimentary at best. I appreciate the compliment of your suggestion that I study voice =) however I'm afraid that's not an option for me, At least not now. I'll mess around with my piano a little more though to see if I can get a better understanding of the passaggio. My voice breaks pretty-much right around D4, righat about where you indicated, so that's the secondo passaggio I guess? Thanks =)
As far as managing the tessitura of actual pieces its a mixed bag. I either don't have the low notes or don't have the high notes usually. :) I was messing with "O tu palermo" today from "Vespri" (a bass aria of course) And that actually "fit" better than most baritone arias but that's probably just because my range is limited. I was probably singing it an octave higher than a bass would anyway, ha ha. (I get confused about that sometimes.)
What happened to my comment of days ago? Youtube has been very strange lately Well I repeat myself. Nice dark tone of voice, good amplitude. Baritone? Yes, that's for sure. Bass-B.? The video sound does not let you detect that with accuracy. Wasn't that room too big to get a good recording sound may be? Remember the small size of the Studios where Lanza recorded many of his big successes? Nevertheless that BIG voice could be recorded no matter how small or big the size of the room...
Thanks for the comment. =) Well I could have been closer to the recorder but then it's too loud and distorts badly. This is about as good a quality recording as I can get.
very nice timbre! Natural Voice range, timber,passagio, tessitura and power whiin that determins voice cathegory. Speaking voice quite often fools singers.
Here you sound like a baritone but to be sure one needs to know how powerful are these notes(always difficult to say by recordings)
This was recorded in quite a large room, pretty good acoustics, no amplification, I was about 6 feet from the mic. Power I really don't know how to measure.
It's hard sometimes to catagorize one's voice without having complete understand of it. You could have a timbre of lyric tenor and not have a high range or have a timbre of baritone and have great range in the voice. I want to believe you are a bass-baritone just need to develop high range in your voice. I myself is a tenor, with a range of high A on a good days until I developed and embellished it and now I can sing up to high C's and D's.
Actually, to be bass baritone wouldn't the lower register need more development? I can handle the upper register of baritone roles with ease, it's the bottom I struggle with.
You are right to the degree that lower register need to be developed but It's is more essential to develope secure middle register. If you are studying operatic arias, for a bass-baritone, your voice needs to flourish on the middle C,D,E's and F's but you must aquire G's and Ab's. Don't worry about exteme low notes if you are not a true bass.
Well, there aren't many complete arias I can sing really. :P My range is too limited and its hard finding backing tracks. I get confused as to what octave to sing in. If I sing too high I don't have the high notes, if I sing too low I don't have the low notes :P But I'll post some singing of actual lyrics next time, sure.
Well, you just have to break through the barriers. You've only got one direction, is to go upward, not down. Most people have three to four octives. You should be abel to sing G's and Ab's. You sang the lowest note in the video which is low F below low C so you should be able to sing F above middle C and higher. It's within your range.
I can give you a few tips but it doesn't work that way, it takes time, practice and consistant training with a second ear who can guide you to a correct singing. Tips and gimmick or quick fix, this comes after you understand your instrument. Then you combind them with your innate talent which you have. You have good instrument. Invest in it. Make sacrifices. You might regret it later in you life if you don't.
You are not going to hurt anything. I don't mean for you to sing too bright but more clear. You are only singing with uh vowel not ah vowel through out the whole range. Try to make your vowels bit more clear with definition below passaggio and cover on your passaggio areas or modify the vowel to uh. My humble opinion =)
OK. It does sound on this recording like I'm just singing "uh" but when I was actually doing it I'm pretty sure I was forming the "ah" sound a bit more than it sounds, might be the recording a bit. But yes, thanks very much for the advice! I'll try that.
Dude, like I said before, your voice is amazing, I would say you are a Baritone with a deep range, but definitely not a true bass. Even though I'm sure you could easily hit some bass notes. You almost have the perfect baritone voice for such a song as "Toreador song" etc.
Wow, thanks, I appreciate your complimentary-ness =P
Yeah I don't think a true bass either, and, I am at least pretty confident I'm not a tenor. he he. I just can't quite hit the lowest notes of the baritones range but then, I've never had any training.. so I'd say baritone is a pretty safe bet. Maybe I'll try the toreador song sometime for kicks =P
Plenty of resonance. I feel it's too covered but not for sure because of the quality of recording. I think you are a bass-baritone but not for sure because you only sang up to middle C. Not a bass because your low F is not solid enough. Where or on what notes do you feel passaggio? Your voice has alot of potential to be exploided.
I thought it sounded as if the higher baritone range came more easily--and it has a good resonance. Voice categories sometimes just get in the way; the main thing is to see which way you can extend your range and keep the resonance you have at the most comfortable point as you vocalize through a scale.
Heh. I'm not at all sure that I do "have something" ha ha.
Sure I'd like to sing better for my own enjoyment but I'm not looking to profit by it, even if I WAS talented enough. Thanks for your comment, that's 2 for 2 so far.. :-D
Thanks. Interesting you should say that, I had thought just baritone, but now I'm leaning toward bass/baritone too. Range is rather limited though >_> tough to say
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Could someone tell me how to sing with vibrato! Thanks
parvizpiano 1 year ago
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Could someone tell me how to sing with vibrato! Thanks
parvizpiano 1 year ago
Could someone tell me how to sing with vibrato! Thanks
parvizpiano 1 year ago
First let me say that you sound like you have a very good instrument. Now, you are singing dark, but improperly dark by a bit of laryngeal depression together with losing proper chiaro (vowel fineness and clarity). Forget placing anything. There is no such thing as placing sound. You have to go for the correct balance of chiaro and scuro while relieving constriction. The darkness is good, but I would like to hear you add vowel clarity (AH EH EE OH OO) with a very squillante edge to it...
MrCafiero 2 years ago 4
without losing the darkness. Also, humming basically is good for humming.
MrCafiero 2 years ago
Wow, thanks for your prompt and informative comments....
So I will try to make my vowel sounds more clear. I know what squillo is but could you elaborate on what you mean by a "squillante edge?"
So, you would recommend no more humming? It seemed to help.... but I wouldn't know =) Thanks!!!!
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Squillante and squillo are the same thing. That ringing, brassy edge. That is the fineness of the vowel through the proper development and coordination of the chest register. That needs to be added to the dark sound you already have, but without adding extra pressure or constriction.
Humming doesn't really do anything for singing. Lamperti used to say that if you cannot sing well you cannot hum well. So get the singing right first. :)
MrCafiero 2 years ago
Also, don't grab and the tongue or shove it down or hold it behind the tip of the teeth. Allow it to naturally move where it needs to for the vowel.
MrCafiero 2 years ago
OK thanks for the tongue tip too. From what I'm hearing I really like your approach...... ;-D
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Good. I teach ideal function. So it is very direct and is based on getting everything developed and working efficiently. Let me know how it works out, but it is very hard to do on your own. Mainly because there are so many things that can come into tension that interfere or because they way we hear ourselves in our heads is not how the sound is outside. Good luck with it all!
MrCafiero 2 years ago
Thanks again! :-)
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Some do teach, initially, to TRY to keep the tongue tip near the teeth, tongue arched, in an attempt to keep the root off the larynx. But don't force it anywhere, as MrCafiero says...
aaronsande 2 years ago
Ha ha, OK. Thanks again. So maybe I will make another video, like this one, but attempting to sing the vowels more clearly then. I know youtube is no substitute for long-term vocal coaching ;-( but do you have any tips for extending the upper register a bit? (healthily of course?) :-)
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
I can only do that in person. That is the most difficult thing to get right; i.e. the cover.
MrCafiero 2 years ago
Yeah. I understand. Thanks again
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
SD....I agree with the others. You are a baritone, possibly a bass-baritone. I do agree with someone else on here that it sounds like you are darkening your sound more than it should be. I think you need to lighten the voice a bit, and try to focus more on a placement that is "higher". All this damned Melocchi lowered larynx stuff is affecting you! :-)
moorfan1 2 years ago
Well as I have said to others, I do not *intend* to darken my voice but I may be, I don't know... so how do I "lighten" it? And get "higher placement?"
Nah I really have no interest in the Melocchi technique beyond the fact that it's interesting in a general way to opera fans. =) I have certainly not tried to implement any of it- I wouldn't know how anyway. :P Thanks for the comment!
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
you sound like a tenor.
svjatazarov 2 years ago
Nice work! Wish I could have nice vibrato! My vibrato doesn't work sometimes :P. My mum enjoyed this, said it sounds nicer than my scales (I can get high ...like at around Ab6 .. it's very unpleasant to listen to). If you're wondering what your range is, from what I have heard, I think its Baritone, possibly Bass Baritone BUT I can't tell you for sure, I know too many singers who are really tenors or sopranos who don't know how to use their whole range.
Becibu 2 years ago
Thanks a lot for the comment... =)
Yeah, I know. Hard to say without training. Baritone/Bass baritone seems to be the consensus though. I'm pretty sure I'm not a tenor. :)
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
you have a really good voice!
i hope to hear you sing an aria or song sometime
dutchbaritone08 2 years ago
Thanks! I might.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
OK, I have some expert advice on the humming. You are correct, partially. It's a good idea, but not on "mmmm". Hum instead with your jaw loose and lips partially open, on an "ng" and you'll be doing yourself great favors!
aaronsande 2 years ago
Thanks. :) The advice I got was as follows: Drop your jaw, keeping lips closed but not tight. Hum the first note that comes, something in your middle, whatever's easy. Than slowly go up a couple steps and then come back down (do re mi re do or something like that.) Then after 5 minutes or so open the mouth slowly while trying to keep the jaw etc in about the same position. You should feel the resonance more in the head/mouth and better vibrato. It works! I'll try it your way though ;)
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
And thank you in turn for your return advice!
aaronsande 2 years ago
Very nice voice...rich and smooth. I'm confused below where you say you sang una furtiva lagrima but can't reach an A-flat yet. But at any rate, I agree with Moorhe that you might be darkening your tone.
A few things I can think of: first, I'm not sure about the humming. I don't think you should be singing on resonant consonants like that, never heard that advice from any teacher...that might be darkening your tone, especially since you start on them so often. More...
aaronsande 2 years ago
I meant I can't reach a *TENOR* A flat. (not even a Baritone high A I don't think) I was singing a tenor aria but I'm pretty sure I'm not a tenor, ha ha.
The humming is something I read from a vocal teacher and it has been confirmed by some others. It's supposed to contribute to correct placement by focusing the resonance in the front of the mouth so to speak (rather than in the throat) and it definitely seems to help. I use it as a warm up exercise but obviously not when singing lyrics. ;-D
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Let's talk actual notes. A above middle C is A5. That is the A in Una Furtiva Lagrima. What is a "Baritone High A"?
I agree about the placement not being in the throat, but it sounds an awful lot like you're learning about "masques" and that can be dangerous. It is a very misleading concept.
aaronsande 2 years ago
High A for a baritone would A4 wouldn't it? That's high, but high or "Verdi baritones" hit high A4's and G's routinely. I think I would need almost another whole octave on the top of my voice to have the full range of a typical operatic baritone. I'm not 100% sure about anything though :P
Well I haven't had any training or any professional advice really. I've just picked up a few smatterings here and there. I doubt if I can do any real damage dabbling like I do :D Thanks though
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Ok, high C for a tenor is C5. I thought the numbers went from A-G#, but am I incorrect? What is an A below C5? A5, or A4?
At any rate, yes, that's the high A in Una Furtiva Lagrima, and it's a high A for a tenor, too. I don't know of any tenors who could hit an A above that in modal voice! =D
So, you transposed Una Furtiva Lagrima down an octave? I think I get it now! Can't believe I didn't figure that out from what else you said.
No, I don't think you're doing any damage.
aaronsande 2 years ago
And yes sorry I sang it down an octave though in the same key. :)
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Sing on italian vowels. The sound you're starting with is a mixture of a (ah) and e (eh), and is not as conducive to proper technique. Sing on a (ah), e (eh), i (ee), o (oh), and u (oo). Your vowel choice can darken your voice as well.
I can describe some good exercises (Marchesi) in message, or just demo them on my channel if you like.
Finally, you darken your voice when you don't raise your zygomatic arch (soft palate). more...
aaronsande 2 years ago
So, next time you sing, try this. Start your note, humming first if you want, and once you're set on the vowel with your mouth open, take your index finger and push it a little in past your teeth, resting on your lower lip.
You should feel your soft palate arch away defensively, and that is what you need to maintain as you sing. I still don't do it all the time, and it kills my head voice when I fail to raise it. Picture opening down AND out, and you'll raise it.
aaronsande 2 years ago
Thanks for the tip I'll try it. :) Others have said yawning has this effect.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
That's the idea but yawning is too extreme. You'll sound silly if you try to shape a yawn when you sing. =D
I'm sure you would immediately notice that, though!
aaronsande 2 years ago
The raising of the soft palate is a RESULT of proper technique, not something you DO to GET good technique. It will raise on its own in due time if you are doing everything right. It's like a low and stable larynx. Those things happen automatically when you singing correctly, you don't 'lower your larynx' to sing correctly. Hope I make sense. Same thing with 'singing from the diaphragm', singing into the 'mask', the vocal 'cover', etc. All these things do nothing but confuse.
GermanOperaSinger 2 years ago 3
I think you have a lovely warm timber to your voice... It doesn't sound strained at all in your upper register... This is of course from an untrained ear!
I think you should maybe record yourself singing an aria and posting it - I for one would definitely be interested in hearing it!
May even post something of myself... (",)
nomorewoe 2 years ago
Thanks! I may post an actual aria....maybe. =P
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Such an improvement to the videos you had up a while ago, except the voice is so much darker than I remember it being. Are you sure you aren't darkening it artificially?
You do have a natural singing voice, but remember to breathe on the low notes as well as the higher notes. Sounds to be just about the same range as my voice, apart from the fact that I have quite a few notes more on the bottom of my range (which I'm sure you could get with correct support). Thank a lot for the video.Good fun.
Mooorhe 2 years ago
I only remember having one video up before actually. The "una furtiva lagrima" which I saw fit to remove =P
I think this is a big improvement because since then I have learned to warm up first, and my range has absolutely increased by a few notes on top and bottom probably just because I've been singing a lot more (to myself =P) and doing some humming exercises etc; also the acoustics are better here than they were in my kitchen (on that old video.) ;-P
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
I hope I'm not darkening artificially! :P At least, I am making no *conscious* effort to do so. I just warm up well and try to get the placement in the proper place by humming scales etc with my jaw relaxed and throat open (or at least, I try to do so. >_> ) Thanks a lot for listening, I'll remember what you said about breathing.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
hey that's actually really good. I'm assuming you aren't trained? Really good natural voice, great overtones, and very even and true vibrato, you could definitely make something out of this voice. You've got a natural placement. Where's your passaggio? Sounds like a baritone to me, although you have to keep in mind I'm not a know all :P
GermanOperaSinger 2 years ago
Yeah I'm serious too, you've really got a great voice. I don't say that to everyone. You should be thankful because not many people are born with a natural placement and have a voice with such rich overtones as yours.
GermanOperaSinger 2 years ago
Well, thanks again! I appreciate your good opinion very much.
I know what placement is pretty-much but could you elaborate on what you mean by "natural placement?"
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Nope no training whatsoever. (I wish)
Thanks very much for the compliments! Passaggio seems to be about D4.
I know you're not a know all, but it's a pretty safe bet you know more than me. ;-)
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Natural placement is when your voice has the ability to achieve a certain degree of resonance before you've had any training. I suppose it's synonymous with having a naturally 'operatic voice', which you do. If someone doesn't have that natural placement, chances are they won't be a good singer no matter how much training they go through.
GermanOperaSinger 2 years ago
If it's D4 you are definitely a baritone or bass-baritone. High baritones who sing Verdi usually have passagio at about Eb. But remember there is no voice that meets all the 'standard statistics', that's what makes each of us human.
GermanOperaSinger 2 years ago
Thanks again. The only "training" I've had is humming to myself with my jaw relaxed :P and I try to keep my throat open but beyond that I have no idea what I'm doing =\
So do you think the upper register probably needs extending more than the lower?
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
You should be able to vocalize up to at least Ab once you've extended your top. I'm not really sure about the bottom register, sorry.
GermanOperaSinger 2 years ago
Thanks, that helps (ouch, nowhere close, lol.) I assume that my voice breaks into falsetto past the passaggio, if untrained?
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Yeah that's what happens. Unless you push it. lol
GermanOperaSinger 2 years ago
Yeah. :P Thanks.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Hey GOS I'm confused about something. My passagio is probably F4, maybe even F#4, but I've been told multiple times that I'm a baritone, not a tenor. Could I be a tenor? I'm just worried that I'll hurt my voice if I'm singing in the wrong voice type.
My range is from around F#2 or F2 to Bb4. I can crackle some lower notes and scream some higher notes, but I don't think that counts. :)
Thanks.
leadoffeohippus 2 years ago
Unless I hear you I can't be sure. Try going down from high C in reinforced falsetto and see where you crack at or break into chest. That helps. Note I said reinforced falsetto, not pure falsetto, because it won't work if you do the latter. If you post a recording of yourself I may be able to help. Untrained tenors sometimes sound like baritones because they put too much weight on their voices.
GermanOperaSinger 2 years ago
Haha I tried your exercise and broke at around E or Eb. :-P
I'll try and post a video of myself if I have time. Thanks.
leadoffeohippus 2 years ago
Based simply on tonal quality, I'd say baritone, possibly bass-baritone, though it appears you have more freedom at the top of your range than at the bottom (the opposite of me :). It would help to determine where your registration points are. The normal speech inflection range will end at the primo passaggio, which is around B or B-flat3 for most baritones, and just lower for bass-baritones. The secondo passaggio, where head voice begins, will generally occur at E or E-flat4.
khankonchak 2 years ago
Keep in mind, however, that every singer is different, and that your register "changes" might fall between these pitches. Also as francotenelli mentioned, look through the vocal literature to see how you manage the tessitura of various pieces.
Your timbre is quite attractive, and you really should consider serious studies.
khankonchak 2 years ago
Interesting stuff, thanks! My knowledge of singing technique is quite rudimentary at best. I appreciate the compliment of your suggestion that I study voice =) however I'm afraid that's not an option for me, At least not now. I'll mess around with my piano a little more though to see if I can get a better understanding of the passaggio. My voice breaks pretty-much right around D4, righat about where you indicated, so that's the secondo passaggio I guess? Thanks =)
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
As far as managing the tessitura of actual pieces its a mixed bag. I either don't have the low notes or don't have the high notes usually. :) I was messing with "O tu palermo" today from "Vespri" (a bass aria of course) And that actually "fit" better than most baritone arias but that's probably just because my range is limited. I was probably singing it an octave higher than a bass would anyway, ha ha. (I get confused about that sometimes.)
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
(cont.)
... was, but he prefered small sized recording studios. I suppose many tenors do.
I add what I wrote in the first comment lost: keep on it, your voice deserves.
pianist527 2 years ago
heh. thanks again.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
What happened to my comment of days ago? Youtube has been very strange lately Well I repeat myself. Nice dark tone of voice, good amplitude. Baritone? Yes, that's for sure. Bass-B.? The video sound does not let you detect that with accuracy. Wasn't that room too big to get a good recording sound may be? Remember the small size of the Studios where Lanza recorded many of his big successes? Nevertheless that BIG voice could be recorded no matter how small or big the size of the room...
pianist527 2 years ago
Thanks for the comment. =) Well I could have been closer to the recorder but then it's too loud and distorts badly. This is about as good a quality recording as I can get.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
very nice timbre! Natural Voice range, timber,passagio, tessitura and power whiin that determins voice cathegory. Speaking voice quite often fools singers.
Here you sound like a baritone but to be sure one needs to know how powerful are these notes(always difficult to say by recordings)
francotenelli 2 years ago
Thanks very much, I am honored by your comment. =)
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
This was recorded in quite a large room, pretty good acoustics, no amplification, I was about 6 feet from the mic. Power I really don't know how to measure.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
I was going by when the voice started to thin out but not by the actual break. My mistake.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
It's hard sometimes to catagorize one's voice without having complete understand of it. You could have a timbre of lyric tenor and not have a high range or have a timbre of baritone and have great range in the voice. I want to believe you are a bass-baritone just need to develop high range in your voice. I myself is a tenor, with a range of high A on a good days until I developed and embellished it and now I can sing up to high C's and D's.
steakopera 2 years ago
Actually, to be bass baritone wouldn't the lower register need more development? I can handle the upper register of baritone roles with ease, it's the bottom I struggle with.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
You are right to the degree that lower register need to be developed but It's is more essential to develope secure middle register. If you are studying operatic arias, for a bass-baritone, your voice needs to flourish on the middle C,D,E's and F's but you must aquire G's and Ab's. Don't worry about exteme low notes if you are not a true bass.
steakopera 2 years ago
Thanks again for the info although I am limited in my ability to implement it. =) It's appreciated.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Upload your arias next time. :)
steakopera 2 years ago
Well, there aren't many complete arias I can sing really. :P My range is too limited and its hard finding backing tracks. I get confused as to what octave to sing in. If I sing too high I don't have the high notes, if I sing too low I don't have the low notes :P But I'll post some singing of actual lyrics next time, sure.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
I'll look forward to hear you. hehehe.
steakopera 2 years ago
Well, you just have to break through the barriers. You've only got one direction, is to go upward, not down. Most people have three to four octives. You should be abel to sing G's and Ab's. You sang the lowest note in the video which is low F below low C so you should be able to sing F above middle C and higher. It's within your range.
steakopera 2 years ago
Thanks again for the comment.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
I can give you a few tips but it doesn't work that way, it takes time, practice and consistant training with a second ear who can guide you to a correct singing. Tips and gimmick or quick fix, this comes after you understand your instrument. Then you combind them with your innate talent which you have. You have good instrument. Invest in it. Make sacrifices. You might regret it later in you life if you don't.
steakopera 2 years ago
You're right though, timbre and coloring of the voice is not necessarily an indication of voice type.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Ah. the highest note I can hit without cracking is D natural. Above the middle C. Sorry =P
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
You are not going to hurt anything. I don't mean for you to sing too bright but more clear. You are only singing with uh vowel not ah vowel through out the whole range. Try to make your vowels bit more clear with definition below passaggio and cover on your passaggio areas or modify the vowel to uh. My humble opinion =)
steakopera 2 years ago
OK. It does sound on this recording like I'm just singing "uh" but when I was actually doing it I'm pretty sure I was forming the "ah" sound a bit more than it sounds, might be the recording a bit. But yes, thanks very much for the advice! I'll try that.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Dude, like I said before, your voice is amazing, I would say you are a Baritone with a deep range, but definitely not a true bass. Even though I'm sure you could easily hit some bass notes. You almost have the perfect baritone voice for such a song as "Toreador song" etc.
Chivalryaintdead 2 years ago
Wow, thanks, I appreciate your complimentary-ness =P
Yeah I don't think a true bass either, and, I am at least pretty confident I'm not a tenor. he he. I just can't quite hit the lowest notes of the baritones range but then, I've never had any training.. so I'd say baritone is a pretty safe bet. Maybe I'll try the toreador song sometime for kicks =P
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
Plenty of resonance. I feel it's too covered but not for sure because of the quality of recording. I think you are a bass-baritone but not for sure because you only sang up to middle C. Not a bass because your low F is not solid enough. Where or on what notes do you feel passaggio? Your voice has alot of potential to be exploided.
steakopera 2 years ago
I thought it sounded as if the higher baritone range came more easily--and it has a good resonance. Voice categories sometimes just get in the way; the main thing is to see which way you can extend your range and keep the resonance you have at the most comfortable point as you vocalize through a scale.
sospello 2 years ago
Yeah. The high note at 0:35 was a C of course, but I'm just not entirely sure what C, ha ha- C4 I guess?
But yeah that's the thing. Which way to extend. Again, I don't know. I would prefer to strengthen the lower register.
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
I would say baritone with a nice dark sound, but if you try to extend your range, is that easier to do up or down the scale?
sospello 2 years ago
Keep working, why not? Since you have something why not go ahead with it even if you just use it for fun? I sure would. Must Be Bass Baritone.
halavey 2 years ago
Heh. I'm not at all sure that I do "have something" ha ha.
Sure I'd like to sing better for my own enjoyment but I'm not looking to profit by it, even if I WAS talented enough. Thanks for your comment, that's 2 for 2 so far.. :-D
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago
I'd guess bass-baritone, more on the bass side. Very nice sound.
Yoni89 2 years ago
Thanks. Interesting you should say that, I had thought just baritone, but now I'm leaning toward bass/baritone too. Range is rather limited though >_> tough to say
ShawDAMAN 2 years ago