It's such a sad,sad and tragic scene, but I cannot help myself, it is also one of the most beautiful love confessions ever.There is no intent behind it, it's just so very raw.
And really, who can truly blame the girl for falling in love with that divine creature? Ah, why couldn't you have just taken that friggin train together?Sigh.
I know the main problem is the fact that its like she should be punished, with oher movies its somehow 'cured' its a shame but thats what they thought and its the same when dealing with women working or equal rights for minority groups. I think were eveolving in baby steps, nothing is equal yet.
so i waas watching an anime call "rec" and the female character quotes alot to hepburn and 1 episode she talks about this lesbian character so i came her and i see this video she realize she is a lesbian cuz the child told a lie/true looks interesting movie and i start to falling in love with audrey hepburn beautiful face and awesome performance
I cant tell you how much this film breaks my heart. When I wacth it I get torn up inside. Shirley Maclaine is so so wonderful and was not reconigised by the Academy which shows the truth in her perfomance. This film is one that has such an effect and Shirley Maclaine is just wonderful
@82emilia Really? Maybe cause ur seeing it out of context - cause i totaly felt what she was feeling I know what u mean but u have to admire that level of emotion Im gona look up Victim though
If u look at this video, Susie Bright on The Children's Hour, it might be intresting to u - What Susie Bright said about the loathing i think is what makes me so sad - how badly she feels about herself to get to this state really makes u feel for her - thats what i think is good about the perfomance
I loved this film. Though they smeared the quality of the ending by making Mrs Tilford arrive before Martha's suicide and having her hear everything. It was much more tragic in the play when Martha thought there was no way out.
Really? I thought it was more painful that Martha hung herself in spite of Miss. Tilford's pitiful apology, that it showed how, despite almost being given a way out of her situation, she was still crippled by the 'shame of being gay and felt that suicide would somehow be her last generous gesture to her friend.
Anyways, I loved this film and this scene pains me so much everytime I see it, and yet sometimes I feel compelled to see it again and again...
I agree, it was more painful for Martha to hear Tilford's apology because in the end, what did it solve? Their reputations were ruined. Nothing was going to fix that. I think the "happy ending" came when Karen went to Martha's room and told her they'd leave on the train the next morning because think about it, her best friend just confessed to being in love with her, her rutations been ruined as a result of the scandal, you'd think Karen wouldn't go anywhere near her!
@Bluebeldam This is where I believe it shows that Karen deep down knew she was also in love with Martha. At the end where she smiles, I interpret it as being that she knew all along she was in love in Martha but it also took something tragic (Martha's suicide), to make her realize this. I felt like because she never really wanted to marry Joe, it didn't necessarily mean she was gay, but would rather live with Martha for the rest of her life and be happy..whatever the relationship may be called.
i agree with you. i would really like to see it "Happy Ending" not by killing every lesbian in the 60s!. it would be amazing seeing them togerther, but not like this!.
Kenya101 part 3. So with that in mind, you tell all the Bible and Koran thumping people who are experts on who is going to hell; if your going, you won't be alone. Please be happy and well, our time in this world is far too short. I have to go, I have to thank a the dude in the next office who sent me the "Bertram and Ernest" vid.
I'm glad I found this vid. I also have to help this dude (ahem) count his $1 bills, big weekend coming up. (relax I'm just kidding). Please be well and happy. Salaam
Kenya101 part 2, This black muslim straight brother wishes you well, and does not want you to cary any shame, its too heavy (joy and love are much lighter). As long as you don't hurt anyone and help as many as you can who can say paradise is not for you? So what, if your a lesbian. There might be a dude (ahem) who (used to) go to certain establishments where lovely naked black women performed table dances (hey stop laughing, I didn't say it was me!)
this was the first Shirley mcClaine movie i saw when i was little. She's a terrific actress! and i love Audrey Heffburn she was such a pretty lady and good actress as well!
Breathtaking performances by both of them. This film touches me every time I watch it. It may be a classic film, and we may all say that times have changed, but I think that it is still true for so many people.
I use to relate to Martha when I was in high school but I don't feel that way anymore. I still love this scene and I always wished that I would tell her 'It is okay that you feel that way, don't torture yourself and don't blame yourself. You are beautiful'.
I just want to cry like a fool everytime I watch this scene. Even though this was years ago, I think every LGBT person goes through this. Some even have Martha's fate. I myself still have an ounce of guilt deep within me, it's like no matter how proud I am of my homosexuality, there'll always be some small part of me who weeps on the inside, who feels so damn sick and dirty.
I can just feel Martha's pain. And I know that Only Shirly MacLaine portray this. Could awaken that shame inside of me.
The part of you that feels shame, sick, and dirty is the part of you that buys in to all that you were taught by ignorant human society. Sell that thought to wind my friend.
Hey Kenya101, I'm not an expert on Gay and Lesbian issues. I had a good friend from high school and we both made Eagle Scout in the same boy scout troop.
He is gay, and told me; I didn't know what to say, and we lost touch. However he called about a month ago, and I don't care if he is gay or straight; I'm just glad I got my friend back. I always trust people to know who they are. I'm sorry if you ever felt anything like this and hope I never contribute to these types of feelings. Cont.
@circushead That part of the inside which weeps is the repression forced on society by the wicked and the stupid, like you. Decency has nothing to do with what goes on between consenting adults.
@MrHeslopian What you wrote makes no grammatical sense, but I take it you object to what I wrote. Consider the modern homosexual. He has 'pride' parades, yet he feels shame. He calls himself 'gay', yet he is the furthest thing from happy. It is not 'society' or 'repression', or even wicked and stupid people like me who condemn him. It is what's left of his own human decency. His own noble nature, besieged as it is. I applaud Kenya 101's honesty. It's a quality so rarely seen in the discussion.
@circushead My comment makes perfect grammatical sense, or at least it should, considering I run almost everything I write through a spell checker, then review it at least twice, before publication. You make the mistake of generalising people. I am gay, but I don't approve of pride parades. I find them detrimental to the cause. And what is so ignoble about the simple fact of gay sex? It's consensual and doesn't hurt anybody else. Thus the shame imposed upon it comes purely from bigots like you.
@MrHeslopian Repression cannot weep. It can cause people to weep, but it cannot weep. That's part of what I think made no grammatical sense in your comment.
I'm glad to hear you don't approve of pride parades. Every time I see images of them, I feel a profound embarrassment for everyone involved. For all of humanity, actually.
I have a couple of questions, if you don't mind. Why do you find pride parades 'detrimental' to the cause? And what exactly is the cause of which you write?
@circushead I wasn't saying that repression can weep, just as you weren't saying that decency can weep in your original comment.
I think pride parades are detrimental to the cause because they focus solely on sex; half naked men wearing leather and thongs won't help promote civil rights; on the contrary, they reduce the whole cause to a joke, and make people believe that all homosexuals are exhibitionist creeps. Most gay and lesbian folk have feelings beyond what they do with their genitals.
@MrHeslopian I agree, pride parades are grotesque and licentious exhibitions, and utterly obsessed with sex. But, unfortunately, they are wholly reflective of the community they represent. Poor devils. They do themselves far more harm than anyone else ever dreamed to. The parades are displays of degeneracy because homosexuality is a disorder of the soul, and a perversion of life.
As for civil rights, we've reached a point where my tax dollars fund the shame parade. Is that civil righty enough?
@circushead No they don't reflect the community, as I think I've proven, given that I and people I know disapprove of such parades. However, you can't pick and choose where your tax dollars go based on your own bigotries; public money is just that: public, and thus should help support all law-abiding citizens. There are no doubt many causes which you approve of that are funded with taxpayer's cash.
@MrHeslopian The parades represent the vast majority of the gay community.
Yes, there are many things my tax money funds of which I disapprove. My point is that when you identify the struggle for gay rights as an ongoing cause when tax money funds their sodomy parades, well, all I can say is that I guess you guys won. Unfortunately. But let's not call it a struggle any more, mmmkay?
@circushead Teenagers are still killing themselves because of abuse regarding their sexualities. Gay people are sometimes victimised by employers and even the police. In some corners of the globe gay sex is punishable by death. You call that winning?
@MrHeslopian Teenagers killing themselves is tragic, whether they're gay or straight. Do you know how many heterosexual teenage girls kill themselves? It's not an exclusively gay issue. If gay people are victimized by the police or by their employees on the basis of their orientation, that is against the law in the country where you live, and they may and they should seek redress.
I agree that making homosexuality a capital offense is barbaric. Care to take it up with the Muslims?
@circushead At no point did I say that teenage suicide is an exclusively gay issue. All I said was that teenagers have been killing themselves because of their sexualities. Please stop twisting my words.
I live in England, and yes, technically, victimising someone on the basis of their sexual preference is illegal. But that doesn't mean that it doesn't go on, and that our respective governments don't sometimes turn a blind eye when it does.
@MrHeslopian I don't twist your words, sir, I just read them where you leave them lying.
So you'll agree that discriminating against or victimizing someone based on their sexual orientation is illegal in your country. Just as I thought. Kind of lets the air out of the gay rights cause thing.
Anyone who ignores this law is breaking the law, and should be prevented from doing so. You have equality. The end.
@circushead Homosexuality as capital offence isn't an exclusively Muslim issue. Jamaica, an extremely Christian country, also endorses it.
I'm not comparing Ted Bundy to Christian beliefs. Again, stop twisting my words. You said your tax dollars fund a parade you don't believe in, so I said public money also goes towards causes which don't interest me (including gay pride), yet I don't complain. You took a minority and used them to represent the whole, so I did the same thing with Mr. Bundy.
@MrHeslopian No, you made an asinine gutter slur against Christian teaching because you are, well, an ass. 'Mr. Bundy' indeed. Such respect you show a butcher of human flesh.
Comparing the sodomy parade to Christian education is also specious, because we both agree that the former is a regrettable, immoral abomination, while Christian education, as anyone with a sense of fairness must concede, imagined and invented the society you and I both live in and enjoy, even while we are arguing.
@circushead My God, I'm arguing with a fucking idiot. Just because somehing has been passed into law, doesn't mean that it's enforced. If you were truly reading my comments as they lie, you would know that I wasn't comparing Bundy to Christian teachings, I was giving a rebuttal to your claim that gay pride paraders represent all homosexuals. AS I'VE ALREADY EXPLAINED. If a Christian society is so perfect, why have we been moving away from it throughout history?
@MrHeslopian You say I'm a fucking idiot? Well, so you say. The argument that the struggle for gay rights continues a little silly when gays' rights are fully protected by law, and it is illegal to discriminate against gays.
Yes, we have been moving away from Christianity throughout history. I don't know that we ever really tried it. A great pity, I think. Do you like where England's moving now?
Should sharia arrive, you may well pray for what you have now.
@circushead You said: "The argument that the struggle for gay rights continues a little silly when gays' rights are fully protected by law, and it is illegal to discriminate against gays."
Once again: Just because somehing has been passed into law, doesn't mean that it's enforced.
Also, you've just contradicted yourself. You say Christianity has never been tried (wrong, by the way, as even a cursory glance at the history books will reveal) but earlier you said that it created our society.
@MrHeslopian Those laws ARE enforced, and you know it.
Proper Christianity has never been tried. Probably too difficult. But if everyone treated others as we'd like them to treat us, wouldn't it be a better world?
And that doesn't mean accepting and normalizing all types of sin. Just the opposite, actually.
Proper Christianity has never been tried, but the influence of the Christian outlook on the laws, the arts, and everything else about the society we both enjoy cannot be denied.
@circushead There you go contradicting yourself again. Christians formed our society and yet their religion has never been tried.Why is homosexuality a sin? For something to be wrong, it has to be detrimental. My loving other men has never hurt a single soul, and you know it. And those laws aren't enforced always, and you know that too. Yes, the world would be a better place if we treated each other how we'd like to be treated. But that works both ways. Homosexuals deserve respect, not just you.
@MrHeslopian I do respect homosexuals. But I do not accept the sin, just as I cannot accept the sin of heterosexual fornication. Your understanding of Christian belief is flawed, yet you condemn it. Unfortunate, but typical.
@circushead I know homosexuality isn't wrong, and you know it too, deep down in your cold, black, ignorant heart. We could spend all day going around in circles, but really, what's the point. You'll never change for the better, and I'll never adopt your stupid, pathetic, hateful beliefs.
@MrHeslopian Homosexuals are protected by the law. The laws are enforced. You know this. Homosexuality is a disorder of the soul. I pity you for it. Christianity is not a hateful belief. Quite the opposite. I am a sinner. You are a sinner. The sins we commit are different but we are all in need of God's mercy. That is not a hateful belief, nor will your name calling ever make it so.
@circushead You know, for a few minutes I thought you'd answer my question. Not with anything intelligent, mind. I imagined you'd just say something like "because the Bible says so," but you're even incapable of that! Why is fornication a sin? It's fun, jolly, doesn't hurt anyone, can serve as an expression of love between two mates...
Oh, and I don't condemn the Christian faith. I condemn your interpretation of it. And if the laws are enforced, then why are some gay people still victimised?
@MrHeslopian Why should I give you the Biblical explanation? I could, mind you, but I don't fancy setting the ball up on the tee so you can abuse the Word of God. So if it's all the same to you, I won't. Okay, mate? You've seen the "pride" parade, right? Any sane person who looks at that gets a pretty good idea of why homosexuality is regarded as a sin.
Any interpretation that claims homosexuality is not a sin, a disorder of the soul, is not really authentically Christian. So there goes that.
Here's my final word on this, as you'll never listen to anything I say, and trying to engage you in intelligent debate is giving me a headache: The gay pride parade doesn't represent all homosexuals. We have the same sex drive as our straight counterparts. The basic fact of our sexualities has no effect on society. Yet we still have to fight for our rights and, regardless of what you say, still sometimes lose.
@MrHeslopian If the gay parade doesn't represent homosexuals, then why don't you get them to stop having it?
You don't have to fight for any rights. You have them. You are supported by the law. The taxpayer funds your pathetic and immoral self-esteem parades. What are you lacking? Nothing. The 'gay rights' struggle is not a struggle for equality anymore, but appears to many to be a struggle to impose superiority, and to harass and prosecute beliefs systems that don't embrace homosexuality.
@EffLabels 'Homophobic' is a meaningless word meant to stifle conversation. It literally means 'fear of man'. But, to answer your question, speaking truly here, I was looking at videos of my old childhood pals Ernie and Bert (the muppet guys), and I thought, by the title, that this might be some kind of Sesame Street 'Masterpiece Theatre'
take on the two of them.
There's been some speculation that perhaps Henson named the puppets after this, but apparently it's just a coincidence.
@EffLabels Oh, I thought it was Latin. So, it actually makes even less sense than I first thought it did.
Actually, the word 'homophobe' is to our time what the word 'commie' was to the 1950s. It's a word designed to tar its target as a bad person without any evidence. To even reply to the accusation would seem to be an admission of guilt. It kills dialogue. It's a fascist's tool.
I don't believe Ernie and Bert weren't gay lovers. I believe they were bachelor puppets without lower body parts.
@circushead I know homophobic people are incapable of rational thinking and feeling emotion, but you could keep your opinions (or should I say, irrational beliefs?) to yourself.
@capitanzach What a meaningless word 'homophobia' is. Full of parlour room psychology and designed merely to shut down debate, much the way the word 'commie' was wielded decades ago. On the contrary, I excel at rational thinking, hence the conclusions I've drawn. I think what you mean to convey is that you are infuriated that I hold beliefs and standards startlingly different to those of you and your friends.
Well, that's life, old chum. Vive la (actual) difference of opinions.
@circushead Languages and thoughts, symbolic meanings and emotions, are transitory phenomena. How could one create a well though out argument that homosexuality is wrong without using thoughtless rhetoric? Such as it simply is because it is, or the Bible says so. I see people, who they are and realize that this is not a choice, rather they are that way. With your logic, I could say being a woman is wrong because well... it simply is. This makes little sense.So does what you say
@MrHeslopian What gay people are victimized. If they're assaulted, they can press charges, as they should be able to do. If they're discriminated against by employers, they can and do raise suits and win, as they should.
You cannot claim that gays are treated as anything less than first-class citizens in your country.
@circushead but they really are treated less otherwise people wouldn't call me a downright sinner when honestly i haven't done anything wrong other than just being me and loving someone who just happens to be a girl. Sure there are laws that help us and a lot of people nowadays accept us for who we are but still we are not treated as equals to straight people, not yet.
@Msfreakingprincess Yeah, actually, you are. Except, of course, in Arab countries. But in the west, it is illegal to discriminate against people based on their sexual orientation, as I believe it should be. I think what certain homosexuals want is not equality, but in fact a kind of enshrined superiority. That ain't happening, sister. And you simply cannot legislate against hurt feelings. Everybody has their feelings hurt occasionally. That's just life.
@circushead But i know this girl who believes in God, who knows her bible and who is a faithfull christian. Christ had one simple message to build his beliefs and his religion on and that is love, love for our neighbours, love and acceptance.It was not Jesus but it was Saint Paul who said those hatefull things .For you to say these things merely proves that you do not understand being a Christian like jesus meant for you to be otherwise you would accept and love like she does.
@Msfreakingprincess Jesus' message does not involve the blithe acceptance of sin. We are all sinners, you, me, and everybody, and we should earnestly try to do better. You willfully misinterpret Christ's message when you invoke it as a directive to rubber stamp anything anyone wants to do as 'okay'. If you want a 'spiritual' leader who preaches that, there are plenty of bogus knobs like Deepak Chopra around to satisfy you.
@circushead But why the fuck am I wasting time arguing with an obvious cretin? Perhaps because I'm sick of you simpletons encouraging shame, and thus death among gay teens, and repression among those who simply wish to love, to think and to feel how they choose, without hurting anybody else.
You don't believe in fairness, at least not for anyone other than yourself. You're an ignorant, conformist dunce, intent on justifying his own vile hatred through an archaic belief system.
@MrHeslopian I've always found that the point in the discussion when all my opponent can do is call me names, (oh dear, I'm feeling somewhat cyber bullied right now), is the point at which he's acknowledging he is out of arguments and ideas.
And as I just said, you're going to long for my 'archaic' belief system to reinstate itself should a certain other belief system take hold in your country. The satisfaction of saying "I told you so" in the execution line won't be much satisfaction.
@circushead Rich considering you've ignored almost everything I've said, or at least the stuff which you can't respond to. That's why I called you a fucking idiot. You contradict yourself, you have no arguments, just a vague understanding of Christianity, and a hateful outlook on life. You make no sense, are burdened by a childish arrogance... The list goes on. Though perhaps I'm just as pathetic in arguing with you at all, when clearly you're devoid of logic and sense.
@MrHeslopian I've not called you a single name. You have called me a variety of quite foul ones. I will let this comparison speak for itself. People may wish to draw their own conclusions.
@circushead And once again you disregard my arguments, pouncing on a single aspect of what I said several comments ago and using it to conceal your ignorance. You are a fucking idiot (the ONLY foul name I've called you, twice now, after becoming exasperated with your hateful stupidity) and anyone with sense will see that if they bother to read our conversation.
I know you're incapable of answering this, as you keep proving, but what the hell: "WHY is homosexuality a sin"?
@circushead You've said that you think gayness is wrong, but you haven't said why. You've simply taken a small contingent and used it to represent the whole. By that logic, I could claim all straight men are evil because Ted Bundy was among this group. Nonsensical? Of course, but if that's nonsensical, then so is claiming that a few extroverts prove homosexuality is a disorder.
Our basic preference has no effect on society at large, adverse or otherwise, so you have no right to criticise it.
@MrHeslopian Please direct me to a place where I may view footage of the annual Ted Bundy Pride parade, funded by you and me. If you can't direct me to such footage, kindly drop the analogy. Thanks.
A 'few extroverts. Puhlease.
Make no mistake, as Obama often says, I have every right to criticize whatever I feel like criticizing, whenever I feel like criticizing it.
Funny thing is, we absolutely agree about the sodomy parade. That's the team you're stuck with. It's sad.
@circushead I could reply to all three of your comments, but really I don't see the point. I give you logic, and you respond with an inferiority complex. My comment about Bert and Ernie the puppets wasn't an attack on you in any way whatsoever; that you would see it as such is evidence of your pervasive paranoia. No, we don't have a Ted Bundy pride parade, but we do fund Christian schools and sects which encourage exclusionism. And I'm not part of any "team." Unlike you, I'm an individual.
@MrHeslopian I'm just going to let your comparison of Ted Bundy to Christian education lie there like the little gutter insult it so obviously is.
But surely the separation of Church and State runs both ways, and we don't want to interfere with a religion's right to teach morality as it sees fit, even if that morality does not embrace everything you're interested in.
@MrHeslopian I do believe that homosexuality is a disorder of the soul and is indecent, you are correct. I found this video because I learned it's one of the possible sources of inspiration for Sesame Street's Ernie and Bert characters. Another possibility is the Bert and Ernie characters in Frank Capra's 'It's a Wonderful Life'. I wonder if it's one of these, or neither.
@circushead A pair of fictional lesbians inspired puppets on Sesame Street? Strange... Rather like that brouhaha about the Batman comics in the fifties, which some conservative nutballs claimed promoted homosexuality,
@MrHeslopian You asked me how I found this video. I told you. It's cited as one of the possible sources for the naming of Bert and Ernie the Muppets, but Jim Henson never confirmed which is the true source. What that has to do with people in the 50s I fail to see. I guess it was just another opportunity for you to call people who disagree with you mentally ill.
@Kenya101 When you're able to formulate a sentence that doesn't solely involve insults, write it down and we'll discuss it. Until then, you're just a feces-thrower.
I saw this movie today GAY PRIDE DAY, I cried when she hung herself and felt so sad when she came out to the Audrey Hepburn character. I have seen the movie numerous times and read the play. This is a sad movie.
I am playing Martha for a scene assignment in my acting class. I love the character and this play is just amazing! I think its interesting after already beginning the rehearsal process to see another way of performing it.
Lucky you! I want to play "Martha" so bad! I always cry @ the moment of her confession. I went to an audition for "The Children's Hour" in a community theater in my hometown & I asked to audition for Martha, but since I'm African-American the producers only wanted me to read as Mrs. Tilbert's maid, which really pissed me off. I hope that someday, some1, somewhere, will let me "read" for "Martha" & that I'll get it! In the meantime, from 1 actress to another, "Break A Leg!" {{{{^_^}}}}
The maid??!? That's....so sad, that they are so stuck and narrowminded. Good grief. Don't let stuff like that stop you from doing what you want! Good luck!
Thank u 4 the encouragement! Unfortunately, that's how it still is. I've played so many maids & nurses, it's not even funny. Sometimes I feel like that's all I'll ever get. But I don't want to turn down what's being offered because then I'll look like I'm "difficult to work w/". I'm so conflicted over this... I'm auditioning for "The Bad Seed" next week. I'm going for the few smaller female parts. (I think there's a maid in that 1, too.) I really want to play Mrs. Daigel but...
robynsegg: Obviously, I don't know your whole situation - but keep in mind, you CAN take the reigns yourself, and not wait till someone "lets" you have the roles you want. Consider you can produce small productions yourself, no matter HOW small - you'll get the experience at least and you may start to re-educate others in your acting community to start seeing things differently in the process. (Think creatively! Tape something for community access - get it out there) Don't give up!! Much luck!
i cant get over this film. I love it...absolutely powerful. do you think that hepburns character could have loved her more than portrayed? could it have ever developed?
that movie makes me cry. I was so horrified by the ending. I even felt sorry for that awful little girl- that guilt. Why did she hang herself? it is just so sad and awful.
Finally I watch this in the original version - this has always been the most emotional scene of all movies I have seen in my life. I've seen this this often and still I cannot watch it without crying and always - the moment she says LISTEN TO ME! This is best drama movie ever!
You are sooooo right. LoL! Everytime I've heard her do that, it's ON. This movie is worth the award for basically that exclamation alone, like it's just screaming "OSCAR WIN - here I am!" at the same time. Go for it, Shirley "Martha" Maclaine (smile).
Isn't it amazing to look at how far we've come in a little time, yet there is still so much non-acceptance towards people and their differences, though the very differences do not keep us from practicing to worship and live by forms of government?
This movie is another that is so revolutionary, and it deserves much praise as even a greater classic than it already is. But I think folks are becoming more and more aware of just how important it is to history.
martha made my eyes water. eventually i cried when she said she felt sick and dirty. I'm acting out Karen't monologue for class tomorrow. gambatteru!!
I have a complete transcript of the scene if anyone who acts is interested in performing it. :-) I am taking this scene to a theatre competition with a friend of mine. Scenes from film !!! Hoorah !!
I'll be playing Martha and my friend will be playing Karen.
Katharine Hepburn was never OPENLY involved with another woman...it was just a rumour, never substantiated by real proof. She was in love with Spencer Tracy as far as truth is concerned.
I love THIS scene ! I think I may perform it at competition this next year.
How tragic, it would break my heart.
They both do so well in this movie.
It's such a sad ending.
Indescribable. Shirley is so heartbreaking in this part of the film.
Shirley was so believable - what a job she did. I thought that scene was very well-written and acted. Shirley commented once that many of her scenes were cut, such as lovingly preparing a meal for Audrey or doing special things for her...the director got scared, thought it was TOO gay and cut those scenes. I think they would have helped the movie. And by the way, Shirley is gay friendly but not a lesbian. Those comments are so juvenile.
This has been flagged as spam show
Also, am I correct in saying that the actors speak in a Mid-Atlantic accent throughout the film?
capitanzach 2 months ago
Comment removed
capitanzach 2 months ago
Comment removed
capitanzach 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Were they both really lesbians or is it never known?
capitanzach 2 months ago
Comment removed
capitanzach 2 months ago
Shirley Maclaine. That is all.
janemansfield73 2 months ago
How old do you think Mary is in this play??? And what is the time period! 1940's??
luv2laffgurlXD 2 months ago
@luv2laffgurlXD The hairstyles/clothes suggest late 50's early '60's (the film was released in 1961). Mary appears to be no more than 11 or 12.
faeryquene 2 months ago
It's such a sad,sad and tragic scene, but I cannot help myself, it is also one of the most beautiful love confessions ever.There is no intent behind it, it's just so very raw.
And really, who can truly blame the girl for falling in love with that divine creature? Ah, why couldn't you have just taken that friggin train together?Sigh.
amidola 1 year ago 5
This movie pulls at my heart strings, it deserves so much more recognition! Audrey and Shirley were phenomenal together in this. Amazing! :')
PaintTheSilence1 1 year ago 3
I know the main problem is the fact that its like she should be punished, with oher movies its somehow 'cured' its a shame but thats what they thought and its the same when dealing with women working or equal rights for minority groups. I think were eveolving in baby steps, nothing is equal yet.
RebelFanzel 1 year ago
so i waas watching an anime call "rec" and the female character quotes alot to hepburn and 1 episode she talks about this lesbian character so i came her and i see this video she realize she is a lesbian cuz the child told a lie/true looks interesting movie and i start to falling in love with audrey hepburn beautiful face and awesome performance
rockero1590 1 year ago
I cant tell you how much this film breaks my heart. When I wacth it I get torn up inside. Shirley Maclaine is so so wonderful and was not reconigised by the Academy which shows the truth in her perfomance. This film is one that has such an effect and Shirley Maclaine is just wonderful
RebelFanzel 1 year ago
Comment removed
82emilia 1 year ago
@82emilia Really? Maybe cause ur seeing it out of context - cause i totaly felt what she was feeling I know what u mean but u have to admire that level of emotion Im gona look up Victim though
RebelFanzel 1 year ago
If u look at this video, Susie Bright on The Children's Hour, it might be intresting to u - What Susie Bright said about the loathing i think is what makes me so sad - how badly she feels about herself to get to this state really makes u feel for her - thats what i think is good about the perfomance
RebelFanzel 1 year ago
Shirley rocks! Good performance!
CalicoRoses 2 years ago 5
Maclaine should have won the Oscar for her outstanding performance but unfortunately, The Children's Hour was a movie made way before it's time.
kcufmalsi 2 years ago 20
amen! amazing perfomance it made me cry and cry!
ClassicMovieClub 2 years ago
@kcufmalsi Yes it was and she was very good in it, loved it, wish they had it on DVD
AzzedineAliaFan 2 years ago
This movie.....Before it's time.
Classic!
504Diva 2 years ago
i didn't know this was a cut scene, it was on channel 4 in the UK the other night and this was in it..
at least now people can see this scene and hopefully understand the film, and peoples' experiences better.
elleruth 2 years ago
I loved this film. Though they smeared the quality of the ending by making Mrs Tilford arrive before Martha's suicide and having her hear everything. It was much more tragic in the play when Martha thought there was no way out.
NonNPC 2 years ago
Really? I thought it was more painful that Martha hung herself in spite of Miss. Tilford's pitiful apology, that it showed how, despite almost being given a way out of her situation, she was still crippled by the 'shame of being gay and felt that suicide would somehow be her last generous gesture to her friend.
Anyways, I loved this film and this scene pains me so much everytime I see it, and yet sometimes I feel compelled to see it again and again...
MrHeslopian 2 years ago
I agree, it was more painful for Martha to hear Tilford's apology because in the end, what did it solve? Their reputations were ruined. Nothing was going to fix that. I think the "happy ending" came when Karen went to Martha's room and told her they'd leave on the train the next morning because think about it, her best friend just confessed to being in love with her, her rutations been ruined as a result of the scandal, you'd think Karen wouldn't go anywhere near her!
Bluebeldam 1 year ago
@Bluebeldam This is where I believe it shows that Karen deep down knew she was also in love with Martha. At the end where she smiles, I interpret it as being that she knew all along she was in love in Martha but it also took something tragic (Martha's suicide), to make her realize this. I felt like because she never really wanted to marry Joe, it didn't necessarily mean she was gay, but would rather live with Martha for the rest of her life and be happy..whatever the relationship may be called.
mzzzhedison 1 year ago
BRAVO! Shirley McLaine at her best.
udlab0y 2 years ago 4
I saw this yesterday. One of my favorite movies. What a different, and much more awesome time!
Sharingonsandninja 2 years ago
That loathing! It's just awful! It kills me every time I see it.
Contrast this with the final scene in "Some Like it Hot." Why was it so different for women?
jfulbright 2 years ago
i agree with you. i would really like to see it "Happy Ending" not by killing every lesbian in the 60s!. it would be amazing seeing them togerther, but not like this!.
BlonDDyKe 2 years ago 2
Comment removed
deontyk 2 years ago
Damn, pretty groundbreaking
ilovetogofast88 2 years ago
They both where so beautiful when they where young, really beauties,...!
BigFatCode 2 years ago
Comment removed
honeegrrl 2 years ago
Kenya101 part 3. So with that in mind, you tell all the Bible and Koran thumping people who are experts on who is going to hell; if your going, you won't be alone. Please be happy and well, our time in this world is far too short. I have to go, I have to thank a the dude in the next office who sent me the "Bertram and Ernest" vid.
I'm glad I found this vid. I also have to help this dude (ahem) count his $1 bills, big weekend coming up. (relax I'm just kidding). Please be well and happy. Salaam
rayburne 2 years ago
Kenya101 part 2, This black muslim straight brother wishes you well, and does not want you to cary any shame, its too heavy (joy and love are much lighter). As long as you don't hurt anyone and help as many as you can who can say paradise is not for you? So what, if your a lesbian. There might be a dude (ahem) who (used to) go to certain establishments where lovely naked black women performed table dances (hey stop laughing, I didn't say it was me!)
cont....
rayburne 2 years ago
My women's playwrights class in high school did a theater production that included this scene.
soapfan1977 2 years ago 3
this was the first Shirley mcClaine movie i saw when i was little. She's a terrific actress! and i love Audrey Heffburn she was such a pretty lady and good actress as well!
ladynikkie 2 years ago 3
Breathtaking performances by both of them. This film touches me every time I watch it. It may be a classic film, and we may all say that times have changed, but I think that it is still true for so many people.
rainbowpride76 2 years ago 4
I'm doing this scene in school. I have to play Karen. I feel like such a horrible person afterwards. Poor Martha.
Mosessgyrl 2 years ago 5
amazing!!!!!
fdomf 2 years ago
I use to relate to Martha when I was in high school but I don't feel that way anymore. I still love this scene and I always wished that I would tell her 'It is okay that you feel that way, don't torture yourself and don't blame yourself. You are beautiful'.
orlandobabe 3 years ago 5
and what if she wasnt beautyfull
then her words wouldnt mean a shit?
lazesmelita 2 years ago
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
orlandobabe 2 years ago 3
I just want to cry like a fool everytime I watch this scene. Even though this was years ago, I think every LGBT person goes through this. Some even have Martha's fate. I myself still have an ounce of guilt deep within me, it's like no matter how proud I am of my homosexuality, there'll always be some small part of me who weeps on the inside, who feels so damn sick and dirty.
I can just feel Martha's pain. And I know that Only Shirly MacLaine portray this. Could awaken that shame inside of me.
Kenya101 3 years ago 31
The part of you that feels shame, sick, and dirty is the part of you that buys in to all that you were taught by ignorant human society. Sell that thought to wind my friend.
blusanz 2 years ago 8
Hey Kenya101, I'm not an expert on Gay and Lesbian issues. I had a good friend from high school and we both made Eagle Scout in the same boy scout troop.
He is gay, and told me; I didn't know what to say, and we lost touch. However he called about a month ago, and I don't care if he is gay or straight; I'm just glad I got my friend back. I always trust people to know who they are. I'm sorry if you ever felt anything like this and hope I never contribute to these types of feelings. Cont.
rayburne 2 years ago 3
@Kenya101 your not dirty if you are gay. at least i dont think so.
o0LARCenCiel 1 year ago
@Kenya101 That part on the inside of you that weeps is your last shred of decency. Nurture it. Grow it.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead That part of the inside which weeps is the repression forced on society by the wicked and the stupid, like you. Decency has nothing to do with what goes on between consenting adults.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian What you wrote makes no grammatical sense, but I take it you object to what I wrote. Consider the modern homosexual. He has 'pride' parades, yet he feels shame. He calls himself 'gay', yet he is the furthest thing from happy. It is not 'society' or 'repression', or even wicked and stupid people like me who condemn him. It is what's left of his own human decency. His own noble nature, besieged as it is. I applaud Kenya 101's honesty. It's a quality so rarely seen in the discussion.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead My comment makes perfect grammatical sense, or at least it should, considering I run almost everything I write through a spell checker, then review it at least twice, before publication. You make the mistake of generalising people. I am gay, but I don't approve of pride parades. I find them detrimental to the cause. And what is so ignoble about the simple fact of gay sex? It's consensual and doesn't hurt anybody else. Thus the shame imposed upon it comes purely from bigots like you.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian Repression cannot weep. It can cause people to weep, but it cannot weep. That's part of what I think made no grammatical sense in your comment.
I'm glad to hear you don't approve of pride parades. Every time I see images of them, I feel a profound embarrassment for everyone involved. For all of humanity, actually.
I have a couple of questions, if you don't mind. Why do you find pride parades 'detrimental' to the cause? And what exactly is the cause of which you write?
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead I wasn't saying that repression can weep, just as you weren't saying that decency can weep in your original comment.
I think pride parades are detrimental to the cause because they focus solely on sex; half naked men wearing leather and thongs won't help promote civil rights; on the contrary, they reduce the whole cause to a joke, and make people believe that all homosexuals are exhibitionist creeps. Most gay and lesbian folk have feelings beyond what they do with their genitals.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian I agree, pride parades are grotesque and licentious exhibitions, and utterly obsessed with sex. But, unfortunately, they are wholly reflective of the community they represent. Poor devils. They do themselves far more harm than anyone else ever dreamed to. The parades are displays of degeneracy because homosexuality is a disorder of the soul, and a perversion of life.
As for civil rights, we've reached a point where my tax dollars fund the shame parade. Is that civil righty enough?
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead No they don't reflect the community, as I think I've proven, given that I and people I know disapprove of such parades. However, you can't pick and choose where your tax dollars go based on your own bigotries; public money is just that: public, and thus should help support all law-abiding citizens. There are no doubt many causes which you approve of that are funded with taxpayer's cash.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian The parades represent the vast majority of the gay community.
Yes, there are many things my tax money funds of which I disapprove. My point is that when you identify the struggle for gay rights as an ongoing cause when tax money funds their sodomy parades, well, all I can say is that I guess you guys won. Unfortunately. But let's not call it a struggle any more, mmmkay?
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead Teenagers are still killing themselves because of abuse regarding their sexualities. Gay people are sometimes victimised by employers and even the police. In some corners of the globe gay sex is punishable by death. You call that winning?
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian Teenagers killing themselves is tragic, whether they're gay or straight. Do you know how many heterosexual teenage girls kill themselves? It's not an exclusively gay issue. If gay people are victimized by the police or by their employees on the basis of their orientation, that is against the law in the country where you live, and they may and they should seek redress.
I agree that making homosexuality a capital offense is barbaric. Care to take it up with the Muslims?
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead At no point did I say that teenage suicide is an exclusively gay issue. All I said was that teenagers have been killing themselves because of their sexualities. Please stop twisting my words.
I live in England, and yes, technically, victimising someone on the basis of their sexual preference is illegal. But that doesn't mean that it doesn't go on, and that our respective governments don't sometimes turn a blind eye when it does.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian I don't twist your words, sir, I just read them where you leave them lying.
So you'll agree that discriminating against or victimizing someone based on their sexual orientation is illegal in your country. Just as I thought. Kind of lets the air out of the gay rights cause thing.
Anyone who ignores this law is breaking the law, and should be prevented from doing so. You have equality. The end.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead Homosexuality as capital offence isn't an exclusively Muslim issue. Jamaica, an extremely Christian country, also endorses it.
I'm not comparing Ted Bundy to Christian beliefs. Again, stop twisting my words. You said your tax dollars fund a parade you don't believe in, so I said public money also goes towards causes which don't interest me (including gay pride), yet I don't complain. You took a minority and used them to represent the whole, so I did the same thing with Mr. Bundy.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian No, you made an asinine gutter slur against Christian teaching because you are, well, an ass. 'Mr. Bundy' indeed. Such respect you show a butcher of human flesh.
Comparing the sodomy parade to Christian education is also specious, because we both agree that the former is a regrettable, immoral abomination, while Christian education, as anyone with a sense of fairness must concede, imagined and invented the society you and I both live in and enjoy, even while we are arguing.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead My God, I'm arguing with a fucking idiot. Just because somehing has been passed into law, doesn't mean that it's enforced. If you were truly reading my comments as they lie, you would know that I wasn't comparing Bundy to Christian teachings, I was giving a rebuttal to your claim that gay pride paraders represent all homosexuals. AS I'VE ALREADY EXPLAINED. If a Christian society is so perfect, why have we been moving away from it throughout history?
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian You say I'm a fucking idiot? Well, so you say. The argument that the struggle for gay rights continues a little silly when gays' rights are fully protected by law, and it is illegal to discriminate against gays.
Yes, we have been moving away from Christianity throughout history. I don't know that we ever really tried it. A great pity, I think. Do you like where England's moving now?
Should sharia arrive, you may well pray for what you have now.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead You said: "The argument that the struggle for gay rights continues a little silly when gays' rights are fully protected by law, and it is illegal to discriminate against gays."
Once again: Just because somehing has been passed into law, doesn't mean that it's enforced.
Also, you've just contradicted yourself. You say Christianity has never been tried (wrong, by the way, as even a cursory glance at the history books will reveal) but earlier you said that it created our society.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian Those laws ARE enforced, and you know it.
Proper Christianity has never been tried. Probably too difficult. But if everyone treated others as we'd like them to treat us, wouldn't it be a better world?
And that doesn't mean accepting and normalizing all types of sin. Just the opposite, actually.
Proper Christianity has never been tried, but the influence of the Christian outlook on the laws, the arts, and everything else about the society we both enjoy cannot be denied.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead There you go contradicting yourself again. Christians formed our society and yet their religion has never been tried.Why is homosexuality a sin? For something to be wrong, it has to be detrimental. My loving other men has never hurt a single soul, and you know it. And those laws aren't enforced always, and you know that too. Yes, the world would be a better place if we treated each other how we'd like to be treated. But that works both ways. Homosexuals deserve respect, not just you.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian I do respect homosexuals. But I do not accept the sin, just as I cannot accept the sin of heterosexual fornication. Your understanding of Christian belief is flawed, yet you condemn it. Unfortunate, but typical.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead I know homosexuality isn't wrong, and you know it too, deep down in your cold, black, ignorant heart. We could spend all day going around in circles, but really, what's the point. You'll never change for the better, and I'll never adopt your stupid, pathetic, hateful beliefs.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian Homosexuals are protected by the law. The laws are enforced. You know this. Homosexuality is a disorder of the soul. I pity you for it. Christianity is not a hateful belief. Quite the opposite. I am a sinner. You are a sinner. The sins we commit are different but we are all in need of God's mercy. That is not a hateful belief, nor will your name calling ever make it so.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead You know, for a few minutes I thought you'd answer my question. Not with anything intelligent, mind. I imagined you'd just say something like "because the Bible says so," but you're even incapable of that! Why is fornication a sin? It's fun, jolly, doesn't hurt anyone, can serve as an expression of love between two mates...
Oh, and I don't condemn the Christian faith. I condemn your interpretation of it. And if the laws are enforced, then why are some gay people still victimised?
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian Why should I give you the Biblical explanation? I could, mind you, but I don't fancy setting the ball up on the tee so you can abuse the Word of God. So if it's all the same to you, I won't. Okay, mate? You've seen the "pride" parade, right? Any sane person who looks at that gets a pretty good idea of why homosexuality is regarded as a sin.
Any interpretation that claims homosexuality is not a sin, a disorder of the soul, is not really authentically Christian. So there goes that.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead I'm not your mate.
Here's my final word on this, as you'll never listen to anything I say, and trying to engage you in intelligent debate is giving me a headache: The gay pride parade doesn't represent all homosexuals. We have the same sex drive as our straight counterparts. The basic fact of our sexualities has no effect on society. Yet we still have to fight for our rights and, regardless of what you say, still sometimes lose.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian If the gay parade doesn't represent homosexuals, then why don't you get them to stop having it?
You don't have to fight for any rights. You have them. You are supported by the law. The taxpayer funds your pathetic and immoral self-esteem parades. What are you lacking? Nothing. The 'gay rights' struggle is not a struggle for equality anymore, but appears to many to be a struggle to impose superiority, and to harass and prosecute beliefs systems that don't embrace homosexuality.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead If you are homophobic, why are you watching this movie? lol
EffLabels 10 months ago
@EffLabels 'Homophobic' is a meaningless word meant to stifle conversation. It literally means 'fear of man'. But, to answer your question, speaking truly here, I was looking at videos of my old childhood pals Ernie and Bert (the muppet guys), and I thought, by the title, that this might be some kind of Sesame Street 'Masterpiece Theatre'
take on the two of them.
There's been some speculation that perhaps Henson named the puppets after this, but apparently it's just a coincidence.
circushead 10 months ago
@circushead Actuallyt the word 'Homophobia' means fear of same.( I am fluent in Greek)
Homo =same Phobia=fear. If it were 'fear of man' (as you stated) then it would be 'Androphobia'
BTW Werent Ernie and Bert gay lovers? LOL
EffLabels 10 months ago
@EffLabels Oh, I thought it was Latin. So, it actually makes even less sense than I first thought it did.
Actually, the word 'homophobe' is to our time what the word 'commie' was to the 1950s. It's a word designed to tar its target as a bad person without any evidence. To even reply to the accusation would seem to be an admission of guilt. It kills dialogue. It's a fascist's tool.
I don't believe Ernie and Bert weren't gay lovers. I believe they were bachelor puppets without lower body parts.
circushead 10 months ago
@circushead I know homophobic people are incapable of rational thinking and feeling emotion, but you could keep your opinions (or should I say, irrational beliefs?) to yourself.
capitanzach 2 months ago
@capitanzach What a meaningless word 'homophobia' is. Full of parlour room psychology and designed merely to shut down debate, much the way the word 'commie' was wielded decades ago. On the contrary, I excel at rational thinking, hence the conclusions I've drawn. I think what you mean to convey is that you are infuriated that I hold beliefs and standards startlingly different to those of you and your friends.
Well, that's life, old chum. Vive la (actual) difference of opinions.
circushead 1 month ago
@circushead Languages and thoughts, symbolic meanings and emotions, are transitory phenomena. How could one create a well though out argument that homosexuality is wrong without using thoughtless rhetoric? Such as it simply is because it is, or the Bible says so. I see people, who they are and realize that this is not a choice, rather they are that way. With your logic, I could say being a woman is wrong because well... it simply is. This makes little sense.So does what you say
capitanzach 1 month ago
@MrHeslopian What gay people are victimized. If they're assaulted, they can press charges, as they should be able to do. If they're discriminated against by employers, they can and do raise suits and win, as they should.
You cannot claim that gays are treated as anything less than first-class citizens in your country.
circushead 1 year ago 2
@circushead but they really are treated less otherwise people wouldn't call me a downright sinner when honestly i haven't done anything wrong other than just being me and loving someone who just happens to be a girl. Sure there are laws that help us and a lot of people nowadays accept us for who we are but still we are not treated as equals to straight people, not yet.
Msfreakingprincess 1 year ago
@Msfreakingprincess Yeah, actually, you are. Except, of course, in Arab countries. But in the west, it is illegal to discriminate against people based on their sexual orientation, as I believe it should be. I think what certain homosexuals want is not equality, but in fact a kind of enshrined superiority. That ain't happening, sister. And you simply cannot legislate against hurt feelings. Everybody has their feelings hurt occasionally. That's just life.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead But i know this girl who believes in God, who knows her bible and who is a faithfull christian. Christ had one simple message to build his beliefs and his religion on and that is love, love for our neighbours, love and acceptance.It was not Jesus but it was Saint Paul who said those hatefull things .For you to say these things merely proves that you do not understand being a Christian like jesus meant for you to be otherwise you would accept and love like she does.
Msfreakingprincess 1 year ago
@Msfreakingprincess Jesus' message does not involve the blithe acceptance of sin. We are all sinners, you, me, and everybody, and we should earnestly try to do better. You willfully misinterpret Christ's message when you invoke it as a directive to rubber stamp anything anyone wants to do as 'okay'. If you want a 'spiritual' leader who preaches that, there are plenty of bogus knobs like Deepak Chopra around to satisfy you.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead But why the fuck am I wasting time arguing with an obvious cretin? Perhaps because I'm sick of you simpletons encouraging shame, and thus death among gay teens, and repression among those who simply wish to love, to think and to feel how they choose, without hurting anybody else.
You don't believe in fairness, at least not for anyone other than yourself. You're an ignorant, conformist dunce, intent on justifying his own vile hatred through an archaic belief system.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian I've always found that the point in the discussion when all my opponent can do is call me names, (oh dear, I'm feeling somewhat cyber bullied right now), is the point at which he's acknowledging he is out of arguments and ideas.
And as I just said, you're going to long for my 'archaic' belief system to reinstate itself should a certain other belief system take hold in your country. The satisfaction of saying "I told you so" in the execution line won't be much satisfaction.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead Rich considering you've ignored almost everything I've said, or at least the stuff which you can't respond to. That's why I called you a fucking idiot. You contradict yourself, you have no arguments, just a vague understanding of Christianity, and a hateful outlook on life. You make no sense, are burdened by a childish arrogance... The list goes on. Though perhaps I'm just as pathetic in arguing with you at all, when clearly you're devoid of logic and sense.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian I've not called you a single name. You have called me a variety of quite foul ones. I will let this comparison speak for itself. People may wish to draw their own conclusions.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead And once again you disregard my arguments, pouncing on a single aspect of what I said several comments ago and using it to conceal your ignorance. You are a fucking idiot (the ONLY foul name I've called you, twice now, after becoming exasperated with your hateful stupidity) and anyone with sense will see that if they bother to read our conversation.
I know you're incapable of answering this, as you keep proving, but what the hell: "WHY is homosexuality a sin"?
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@circushead You've said that you think gayness is wrong, but you haven't said why. You've simply taken a small contingent and used it to represent the whole. By that logic, I could claim all straight men are evil because Ted Bundy was among this group. Nonsensical? Of course, but if that's nonsensical, then so is claiming that a few extroverts prove homosexuality is a disorder.
Our basic preference has no effect on society at large, adverse or otherwise, so you have no right to criticise it.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian Please direct me to a place where I may view footage of the annual Ted Bundy Pride parade, funded by you and me. If you can't direct me to such footage, kindly drop the analogy. Thanks.
A 'few extroverts. Puhlease.
Make no mistake, as Obama often says, I have every right to criticize whatever I feel like criticizing, whenever I feel like criticizing it.
Funny thing is, we absolutely agree about the sodomy parade. That's the team you're stuck with. It's sad.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead I could reply to all three of your comments, but really I don't see the point. I give you logic, and you respond with an inferiority complex. My comment about Bert and Ernie the puppets wasn't an attack on you in any way whatsoever; that you would see it as such is evidence of your pervasive paranoia. No, we don't have a Ted Bundy pride parade, but we do fund Christian schools and sects which encourage exclusionism. And I'm not part of any "team." Unlike you, I'm an individual.
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian I'm just going to let your comparison of Ted Bundy to Christian education lie there like the little gutter insult it so obviously is.
But surely the separation of Church and State runs both ways, and we don't want to interfere with a religion's right to teach morality as it sees fit, even if that morality does not embrace everything you're interested in.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead Cont. from previous comment - As for why I'm telling you this, it's because I feel it necessary to present both sides of the argument.
Now may I ask you a question? What made you, as someone who believes that homosexuality is "indecent," bother viewing this video at all?
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian I do believe that homosexuality is a disorder of the soul and is indecent, you are correct. I found this video because I learned it's one of the possible sources of inspiration for Sesame Street's Ernie and Bert characters. Another possibility is the Bert and Ernie characters in Frank Capra's 'It's a Wonderful Life'. I wonder if it's one of these, or neither.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead A pair of fictional lesbians inspired puppets on Sesame Street? Strange... Rather like that brouhaha about the Batman comics in the fifties, which some conservative nutballs claimed promoted homosexuality,
MrHeslopian 1 year ago
@MrHeslopian You asked me how I found this video. I told you. It's cited as one of the possible sources for the naming of Bert and Ernie the Muppets, but Jim Henson never confirmed which is the true source. What that has to do with people in the 50s I fail to see. I guess it was just another opportunity for you to call people who disagree with you mentally ill.
circushead 1 year ago
@circushead Really?
You're petty. And clearly baboonishly ignorant. Go wash.
Kenya101 6 months ago
@Kenya101 When you're able to formulate a sentence that doesn't solely involve insults, write it down and we'll discuss it. Until then, you're just a feces-thrower.
circushead 6 months ago
@circushead You insulted me. Am I not entitled to insult you back?
You know what. You're evil. And not bright. And not even worth my time or words.
I don't see why you would want to attack my sexuality when you don't even know me.
I know who I am, and I know whose I am....
God bless you.
Kenya101 6 months ago
@Kenya101 Again, when you're ready to formulate an argument instead of resorting to insult, I'll be here.
circushead 6 months ago
poor martha. I just want to giver her a hug every time I watch this. shirley mclaine did an excellent job.
coloh08 3 years ago 7
This is a great movie with a deep subject ahead of its time...McLaine and Hepburn were terrific together and the script was pure gold..
AmericanEvita 3 years ago 38
Very right! And the way it is filmed, tremendous! In all facets, this movie is a 10 out of a 10
r8448 2 years ago
wow...pretty deep,for a classic film.
babz1991 3 years ago
There's nothing new in this old world.
eyeinidas 2 years ago
dude! I did this scene with a friend! It was amazing!
mousehellsing 3 years ago
at 2:30 she says "i'm cold"
sharielawless 3 years ago
very intense movie, this scene and the ending gets me everytime.
RayneDead 3 years ago 3
Comment removed
Ilovecats112233 3 years ago 3
I did, but I never said anything.
Now I wish I had.
Now she's gone.
Treemeadow 2 years ago
does anyone know what audrey hepburn mouths while shirley is talking on the couch? it's around 2:50.
weetigers 3 years ago
oh my god
scaryme1982 3 years ago
"i'm cold" actually
thelouisfanclub 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
wassup remember this webpage? meetyourfling(.Com)
raghu
280922929
mfgaffemfg 3 years ago
This was one of Shirley MaClaines best performances.
luvsmovies79 3 years ago 8
I saw this movie today GAY PRIDE DAY, I cried when she hung herself and felt so sad when she came out to the Audrey Hepburn character. I have seen the movie numerous times and read the play. This is a sad movie.
BobbieJeanEndZone 3 years ago
i luv this ive got to see the film properly it looks really good and intense and romantic
sussie5 3 years ago 2
If you like this film/story...
Please take a look at my Martha Dobie tribute videos....
"The Silent Hour"
and
"I Will Fix You"
And please..leave a comment...I appreciate the feedback.
By the way.
We did this scene at competition and made it all the way to Finals ! And not to mention we received an A on the scene for our Advanced Theatre Class.
Martha Dobie will always be close to my heart. Always. It was an extraordinary honour to play her.
Kiyraesyn 3 years ago
I love this movie.
It makes me cry everytime I watch it.
So sad...
dulcisIulia 3 years ago 2
i loooov this movie!!
does anyone know where i can watch the whole thing??! i seen in=t twice on TCM but its never on TV.......
cinnamintacobell 3 years ago
Ditto that gof!!! She's perfection.
cincygurl 3 years ago
Audrey Hepburn would've made me go lesbian too
gofshteyn 3 years ago 15
I am playing Martha for a scene assignment in my acting class. I love the character and this play is just amazing! I think its interesting after already beginning the rehearsal process to see another way of performing it.
GottaLoveMel 3 years ago
I'm playing Karen in the play.
This is the hardest part for me to stage without crying my eyes out while I think of Shirley doing it.
sexiibisnitch 3 years ago
Lucky you! I want to play "Martha" so bad! I always cry @ the moment of her confession. I went to an audition for "The Children's Hour" in a community theater in my hometown & I asked to audition for Martha, but since I'm African-American the producers only wanted me to read as Mrs. Tilbert's maid, which really pissed me off. I hope that someday, some1, somewhere, will let me "read" for "Martha" & that I'll get it! In the meantime, from 1 actress to another, "Break A Leg!" {{{{^_^}}}}
robynsegg 3 years ago 3
The maid??!? That's....so sad, that they are so stuck and narrowminded. Good grief. Don't let stuff like that stop you from doing what you want! Good luck!
rhyfeddu 3 years ago
Thank u 4 the encouragement! Unfortunately, that's how it still is. I've played so many maids & nurses, it's not even funny. Sometimes I feel like that's all I'll ever get. But I don't want to turn down what's being offered because then I'll look like I'm "difficult to work w/". I'm so conflicted over this... I'm auditioning for "The Bad Seed" next week. I'm going for the few smaller female parts. (I think there's a maid in that 1, too.) I really want to play Mrs. Daigel but...
robynsegg 3 years ago
robynsegg: Obviously, I don't know your whole situation - but keep in mind, you CAN take the reigns yourself, and not wait till someone "lets" you have the roles you want. Consider you can produce small productions yourself, no matter HOW small - you'll get the experience at least and you may start to re-educate others in your acting community to start seeing things differently in the process. (Think creatively! Tape something for community access - get it out there) Don't give up!! Much luck!
rhyfeddu 3 years ago
THANK YOU SO MUCH!!! CAN DO!!! Do you mind if I add you as a friend?
robynsegg 3 years ago
why this lie? she found the lie with an ounce of truth....wow....i have so much respect for shirley maclaine..outstanding performance
tabathajc1981 3 years ago
theres always been something wrong..something wrong for as long as i can remember..powerful line also
tabathajc1981 3 years ago
now this is what i consider real acting
fallingfast08 3 years ago 4
Ahh, Shirley Maclaine is so pretty!
chevon2020 3 years ago 5
wow. That is moving.
catatonic18 3 years ago 2
i cant get over this film. I love it...absolutely powerful. do you think that hepburns character could have loved her more than portrayed? could it have ever developed?
tabathajc1981 4 years ago
that movie makes me cry. I was so horrified by the ending. I even felt sorry for that awful little girl- that guilt. Why did she hang herself? it is just so sad and awful.
MAMHOH 4 years ago
Oiuser lol
mrsdarcy26 4 years ago 2
Yeah. Oiuser was a hottie back in the day, eh?
Oochkah!
BooKittyRadley 4 years ago
we are doing this play at my theatre! yea
1pinkgal1 4 years ago
I found the play by Lillian Hellman on my book shelf and I wish I had found it sooner.
This story is timeless.
FedByTheMoonlight 4 years ago
Poor Martha! I want to bundle her up in arms! My husband and I would want to help her. Poor, poor Martha. Why wouldn't she fight?
jfulbright 4 years ago
Finally I watch this in the original version - this has always been the most emotional scene of all movies I have seen in my life. I've seen this this often and still I cannot watch it without crying and always - the moment she says LISTEN TO ME! This is best drama movie ever!
mikeskyeHB 4 years ago
"LISTEN TO ME!"
That line RIGHT theeeeere, man!
You are sooooo right. LoL! Everytime I've heard her do that, it's ON. This movie is worth the award for basically that exclamation alone, like it's just screaming "OSCAR WIN - here I am!" at the same time. Go for it, Shirley "Martha" Maclaine (smile).
twilightfun 3 years ago 2
this is the best acting......maclaine...is brilliant.....
tabathajc1981 4 years ago
omg!!!!! maclaine is brilliant
tabathajc1981 4 years ago
man times have not changed very much I swear this movie is my life
phoenixforce26 4 years ago
I love the eyes of Audrey trying to understand her friend... Wonderful Shirley
AuroraDeVenessia 4 years ago
Why did Maclaine not get an Oscar nomination???
bdwriley 4 years ago 2
this is audrey hepburn NOT katherine hepburn. katherine is another actress who was involved with spencer tracey.
womanruntings 4 years ago
eso es: wow
arlak86 4 years ago
Isn't it amazing to look at how far we've come in a little time, yet there is still so much non-acceptance towards people and their differences, though the very differences do not keep us from practicing to worship and live by forms of government?
This movie is another that is so revolutionary, and it deserves much praise as even a greater classic than it already is. But I think folks are becoming more and more aware of just how important it is to history.
twilightfun 4 years ago 4
martha made my eyes water. eventually i cried when she said she felt sick and dirty. I'm acting out Karen't monologue for class tomorrow. gambatteru!!
wallyqueerboy 4 years ago 2
I have a complete transcript of the scene if anyone who acts is interested in performing it. :-) I am taking this scene to a theatre competition with a friend of mine. Scenes from film !!! Hoorah !!
I'll be playing Martha and my friend will be playing Karen.
Kiyraesyn 4 years ago
wow
mikhapsy 4 years ago
I typed out a transcript of the majority of the scene....message me for it. :)
Kiyraesyn 4 years ago
Shirley breaks my heart.
I love her. :)
It is so tragic.
I think I may just perform this scene at competition this next year.
She makes me want to cry. It's so sad.
I never cared much for Audrey Hepburn, but I REALLY love her in this movie.
Kiyraesyn 4 years ago 2
Katharine Hepburn was never OPENLY involved with another woman...it was just a rumour, never substantiated by real proof. She was in love with Spencer Tracy as far as truth is concerned.
I love THIS scene ! I think I may perform it at competition this next year.
How tragic, it would break my heart.
They both do so well in this movie.
It's such a sad ending.
Indescribable. Shirley is so heartbreaking in this part of the film.
Kiyraesyn 4 years ago
this is soo intense. omg the acting was amazing!!!!!!!!
dreamer4eva1234 4 years ago
This is SO sad. Poor, poor Martha. None of this had to happen.
I'm stunned that this film got made at all.
jfulbright 4 years ago 4
what a magnificient film
SergioOliver 4 years ago 2
Shirley was so believable - what a job she did. I thought that scene was very well-written and acted. Shirley commented once that many of her scenes were cut, such as lovingly preparing a meal for Audrey or doing special things for her...the director got scared, thought it was TOO gay and cut those scenes. I think they would have helped the movie. And by the way, Shirley is gay friendly but not a lesbian. Those comments are so juvenile.
magictime11 4 years ago 2
I just recently watched this movie, and it just blew me away! They both did an amazing job, for such a difficult role.
ladyxdulcina 4 years ago
I love this play/movie. But you cut it off before Martha kills herself
TheJadeSabre 4 years ago
what a performance..
FlyingKitties 4 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
I bet both these actresses had some pussy in their day..especially Hepburn
mib14 4 years ago
They all did... Katherine, Greta (openly-bi), even my darling Vivien...
Scarlettdahlin 4 years ago