Re: Archbishop Niederauer and Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence

[Galadraal]

This is a beautiful video, well done. Greatest responce I've seen on youtube to a hateful video!

[monktogod]

Wrong!.Yes,Jesus say that he came to earth to save all sinners but at same time he say  that sinners NEED TO CHANGE THEY SINNERS LIFE AND BECOME SAINTS.I belief that was wrong gave holy communion to those fake nuns that everybody knows are PUBLIC SINNERS.LOVE THE SINNER BUT HATE THE SIN!Pax

[AnbaKyrillos]

All should be welcome in the Body of Christ. Let us remember that we were bought for a price and that we do not belong to ourselves. Acting upon manifestly sinful acts is not welcomed. Having temptations or orientations to said sins is not sinful. This response seems to use the Social Justice part of our faith as window dressing for the Dogmatic and Moral Theology part. I have to answer for my own sins, but truth is immutable. You're either accept or deny it. Being faithful isn't easy!

[hugh164]

I am not sure what you are saying. Actually the understanding of Eucharist and the authority of the Ordinary to determine who should receive communion supports the Archbishop's decision to give the two Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence Holy Communion. Remember that the SPI has long ago morphed into an important charity organization. Both of these "Sisters" were Catholic. The man who came up from San Jose was there to film the AB giving communion to homosexuals filming the SPI was an extra.

[AnbaKyrillos]

The song talks about all being welcome in this place yet we know not all are welcome to receive Holy Communion. Living in manifest sin as a practicing homosexual constitutes reason enough to abstain from communion until metanoia is reached. The bishop/ordinary can give communion to whomever, but that makes them no more fit to act as a tabernacle. The point is that we are to welcome all into our midst, but cannot pride ourselves on being a community that engages in lives of mortal sin.

[AnbaKyrillos]

My comment is based upon the first words seen in the video.  I am not judging the actions of the Archbishop of the two communicants but take from the traffic below and the comment that the point is we are allowed to be a parish that supports people who choose a lifestyle filled with a type of sexual perversion. Heterosexuals can be in mortal sin as well, but the pastor will not put on his bulletin or board that acting out on these heterosexual perversions is ok. That's the premise of my posts.

[hugh164]

We disagree on so many points. What is this business of choosing a lifestyle? What is this business about the pastor puting in the bulletin or board that acting out is ok. Honestly, you are making assumptions upon assumptions. Heterosexuals can be in mortal sin? Please what century are you living in. I also do not believe you when you say that you are not judging the Archbishop. I hear you judging all over the place. You just will not admit it.

[AnbaKyrillos]

Read the statement written above the mission statement in the official parish website. All of us are supposed to be sexually oriented to chastity unless we are celibates. Orienting yourself sexually to a member of the same sex and acting on those feelings, a choice, is gravely sinful. We may disagree on many things but I pray it isn't on matters of orthodox Catholic theology. Refer to the CCC & Scriptures (like Romans 1:24 to end of Rom 1) to see if my comment is in error.

[hugh164]

Oh yes, AnbaKyrillos you are in error. Your understanding of "orientation" is both scientifically incorrect and misunderstanding Catholic teaching. Chastity is not an orientation and orientations are not chosen.

This is why the Catholic Church teaches that sexual orientation itself is not sinful. MHR exists in the heart of the Gay Community and it is appropriate for MHR to focus on ministry to the gay community.

[AnbaKyrillos]

All baptized are called to chastity (CCC 2348). 'Sexuality...becomes personal and truly human when it is integrated into the relationship of one person to another, in the complete and lifelong mutual gift of a man and a woman (CCC 2337). dfn. Sexual orientation: interest in the other, same, or both sexes. A homosexual person's orientation can only be seen as acceptable in Church teaching when they refrain from 'interest' in their own sex in a way isolated from its unitive purposes (CCC 2351).

[AnbaKyrillos]

'MHR is an inclusive Catholic community -- embracing all people of good faith --...-- regardless of their background, gender, race, social status or sexual orientation.' DO minister to active homosexuals by preaching the Truth in harmony with the CCC & Bible, all the while being there when they do fall. Accepting individuals is not the same as accepting their orientation. I'm done posting here but feel free to PM me if you'd wish to discuss the CCC, its teachings, and how it relates @ MHR.

[brycejacksoncvt]

@AnbaKyrillos - so then you have never had pre-marital sex then have you ... as you wouldnt wanna be in mortal sin yourself ... right?

[AnbaKyrillos]

@brycejacksoncvt - I think you do get it: the way that love can be authenticated as imagining Christ's is when it is both fruitful and vowed. The conjugal act, when it occurs betweenn those who are heterosexual and not married or those who engage in homosexual acts, is not vowed. There can be fruitfulness in premarital sex, but it is in total inaccord with authentic love. Homosexual acts are intrinsically evil; the two are admittedly both evils but they are not in the same ballpark.

[brycejacksoncvt]

@AnbaKyrillos Fair enough . For the record though , after two years of this I am retiring from religious and theological debate to focus on work , college (and seminary ) , and to get away from all these pointless debates that I have come to realize do not pertain to me or effect me as Im not a homosexual . Anyway, peace be with you and have your pets spayed or neutered lol .

[LaReinaDelBarrio]

Thank you for this response that includes us all, and not just Catholics scared of anyone different then themselves... from a recovering Catholic

[fuoco9]

this video response is the essence and true meaning of god: he lives in all of us.

[destinee382436]

I believe that the Archbishop and Most Holy Reedemer are embracing the true meaning of Christianity. Christ accepted all people. He does not place limits on his love.

[justacatholic]

Yes, you are accurate in that Christ does not place limits on His love. But the Church, founded by God and gen authority to rule in His name by Christ Himself; the Church that gives you His Body and Blood in His name, does put a limit on who may receive. It is taught quite completely in the Catechism of the Catholic Church 1387 and 1415 and in Canon Law 915

[hugh164]

The Ordinary of the Archdiocese made a determination to give those 2 SPI holy communion. No matter what you think the film of this event shows that they were respectful and caused no disturbance.

The man who came from outside the diocese with the intention of filming the AB giving communion to homosexuals hit the jackpot when the AB decided (after asking them if they were Catholic) to give them communion.

[hugh164]

The chief representative of the Church in a particular local is the Ordinary. In the case of San Francisco the Ordinary is the Archbishop. The Archbishop represents the church here so it follows that the Church did not in this instance place a limit on these two Catholic homosexual men on receiving Holy Communion. -- The Church ministers to all and that is the way it should be.

[wwcdmeister]

"the Churhc ministers to all...should be." Agreed. These two men clearly reject the teachings of this ministry and are advertising that they are not in communion with that ministry. Enough to receive only a blessing and to deny communion. Please learn more about true and false statements. Then research Catholicism. It's all about love! "The truth w/o love is a deceptive lie. Love without truth is counterfiet love." JPII

[yoshikurisu]

I think that the Archbishop was not wrong in giving communion to whomever wishes to receive in faith. To judge at the Table of the Lord is to act in contradiction to the give of the Eucharist. I know that there are people who feel the necessity of creating conditions for the gift of grace. Thank God that only God is in the position to judge and to welcome. Most Holy Redeemer is a great example of a welcoming community!

[RealOak]

A beautiful response, a smile and embrace offered to the face of hatred and fear.

[justacatholic]

In what do you see hatred and fear? Are you not judging others when you assume that they hate?

[sfav13]

Thank you for sharing our wonderful liturgy. My heart has truly found a home at Most Holy Redeember.