RC Sproul Jr Highlands Study Center Boozement Tapes

[ByGodsGrace40]

People need to be called onto the carpet.  Others need to be warned. In the Bible, Paul named names and we should, too. Thank you!

[sparkescadman]

If you read Gerstner or any "Reformed" men from Calvin to before the late 60 's, "Reformed" meant something very different than it does now.

Culture has changed Presbyterians in many ways since then. .

If you read Doug Wilson and John Gerstner, they teach 2 entiely opposed ways of salvation. Who's right?

[JohnH091]

Seems to me there was something about making slanderous allegations against a brother in the Bible. I trust BenAliGtor has proof to back up his allegations or are you just a disgruntled ex congregant of St Peter?

[parakeethands]

Just being honest about what Calvinism leads to? I am a Calvinist and I do not have a problem with drinking. Your claim is false. Do you know all Calvinists in the world?

[Bookborn]

Calvinism leads to this kind of apostasy. They turn the grace of God into lasciviousness and license to sin. The whole group are a bunch of Hollywood loving, booze-drinking, pipe-smoking 'sinning' saints (all for God's glory of course). Of course, God predestined and pre-decreed R.C. Sproul Jr.'s substance abuse, right?

[calvinduden]

If "sinning saints" could invalidate a theological position look no further than the freakish world of Arminianism: Robert Tilton, Jim Bakker, Jim Jones, Lonnie Frisbee, Jimmy Swaggart, Billy James Hargis, Ted Haggard, Peter Popoff... An endless parade of freakish "sinning saints." By comparison Calvinism is tame. Yes, we've got a few of our own scandals. RC Sproul Jr is among them. He and the late Dr. Gene Scott, who smoked cigars as he preached. RC Sproul Jr drinks and preaches. It's shameful.

[NotYourTypicalNegro]

I have no idea what he's talking about. What the heck is he talking about? Is he drunk?

[OmegaIsNear]

Sad to see the guy has drinking problems-it's a common theme throughout history, you have a great man and then his son seems to fall short and have serious problems in his personal life-I pray Jr. overcomes his issues. :(

[BenAliGtor]

It needs to be noted that among the reasons Sproul was defrocked was his misappropriation of another church's tax exempt ID number for his own personal finances. He's also been accused of plying kids with alcohol- and that goes above & beyond whether he merely enjoys a beverage now & then.

[thornwellhead]

Elders are held to a higher standard, and their public sins need to be dealt with publically.

[scratcherback]

I'm sorry to hear R.C. Sproul Jr. is down. I can believe that getting defrocked would be hard. Didn't he deserve it though?

If he's "down" as you say, shouldn't he be turning to Jesus for comfort? Why is he turning to booze for comfort? He's not lessening his sins by getting sloshed in front of his little flock. I find it hard to be sympathetic if this is the best he can do in coping with his personal problems.

I hope this isn't behavior that his father taught him.

[carvermanor]

RC Sproul Snr. preaches, "Christian liberty is not a license to sin." (Ligonier podcast "rym20080904"). So if we can go by what Sproul Snr. preaches, then no "this isn't behavior that his father taught him". That's not to say what Sproul Snr. personally practices might not be at variance with what he preaches. There are reports of widespread hypocrisy throughout clan Sproul. But if Sproul Jr listens to what his father preaches, he's without excuse.

[LastDaysMinstrel]

Sad, but true... Drinking may not always be sinful, but Christian leaders are called to a higher standard. All things are lawful, but not all are expedient.

[callyourmomtoday]

Agreed.

"Who has woe? Who has sorrow? Who has contentions? Who has complaining? Who has wounds without cause? Who has redness of eyes? Those who LINGER LONG over wine, Those who go to taste mixed drink. Do not look on the wine when it is red, When it sparkles in the cup, When it goes down smoothly; At the last it bites like a serpent, And stings like a viper. Your eyes will see strange things, And your mind will utter perverse things... 'When shall I awake? I will seek another drink'." Prov 23

[carvermanor]

It's scary that there could be "pastors" with such serious character defects, leading their congregations astray by their evil examples. It's even more scary to know there are people foolish enough to follow them, even though he's been defrocked. No wonder he's been accused of being a cult leader. Real pastors don't act that way, and real Christians don't follow after men who act that way. I've got some ocean front property in Bristol I'd like to sell Sproul's disciples.

[RedBeetle]

I used to work in a bar, and one thing you learn quickly is how to spot a man who has had a bit too much to drink. Such a man has the same signs as R.C. Sproul Jr. has in the video above: bright red face, slow slurred speech, daddy issues, rambling speech with no coherent point, thinking Federal Vision is Reformed, and so on. If you don't believe me, then compare his behavior here with other Sproul Jr. videos on Youtube.

[scratcherback]

So your experience and training tell you that if R.C. Sproul Jr. were at a bar, rather than in his basement, and he ordered another drink, he'd probably be refused because the physical signs indicate that he's seriously impaired, if not drunk? If that's true I'm far more concerned about this than I was before.

As you suggested I watched some of his other videos. You're right. Big difference. No red face. No incoherent, rambling speech. In other words, he can be sober... when he wants to be.

[thornwellhead]

I agree, Monty. I've noticed that many Christians in reformed circles tend to take too many liberties in order to avoid looking like Arminian fundamentalists. Spurgeon smoked so it's okay, Luther and Calvin drank so it's okay, etc. Many reformed people are very antinomian.

[carvermanor]

If RC Sproul Jr is your example of "reformed people" then I can understand why you think that reformed people are antinomians. But Sproul Jr isn't Reformed, notwithstanding his claims. He's far more Federal Vision. Sproul Jr is probably not antinomian, any more so than are any *real* Reformed people. But Sproul Jr is an autonomist, as the record of his defrocking indicates.

[thornwellhead]

True - Federal Vision is definitely not reformed.

[boyfromtrini9]

Firstly,if you have a problem someone,don't post a video on you tube and blaspheme someone and stoke fires for confusion and hatred.Go to that person alone and confront them.(Matthew 18) Secondly,don't bring up accusations against an elder without two or three witnesses.Unless you have witnesses that have proof and can say for sure that he is defrocked and running a cult,then keep your mouth shut,and leave the man alone!

[FledMendota]

Boy, I can't help but see the extreme irony in your calling it "blasphemy" to say that Sproul is running a cult. There's only One who it could be possible to blaspheme. Perhaps you're one of Sproul's worshippers, but that doesn't make Sproul the Almighty.

You also say, "that have proof and can say for sure that he is defrocked". So news is a little slow making it to Trinidad? Still, you obviously have the internet. Why are you oblivious that Sproul was defrocked over two years ago?

[scratcherback]

I seriously doubt that R.C. Sproul Sr. sits around Ligonier Ministries drinking while he's recording his ministry messages. Strange that his son does. Probably not a very good image.

Still, it is his choice. If R.C. Jr. wants to booze in his basement while he's recording his theology talks why should anyone really care? If people are offended by it then they don't have to buy his Basement Tapes.

[callyourmomtoday]

I agree it's his choice. It's not very smart to let it be videotaped though. Like you say, it's hard to imagine his father getting liquored up at Ligonier while he's recording his messages.

The bible says that pastors are supposed to have a good reputation. Seeing this kind of thing doesn't exactly help me think very highly of him.

[thornwellhead]

Right on. Pastors and elders are held to a higher standard. Why are reformed Christians so liberal?

[carvermanor]

That's stereotyping. When it comes to matters of Christian liberty (such as smoking, alcohol), Reformed are "moderationists." You sound like an "abstainer" Thornwellhead, but moderation vs abstinence isn't what's being argued here. Sproul, claiming to be Reformed, should practice moderation in all things. But as you say, Sproul is a "liberal" not a moderate. That much seems true.

[thornwellhead]

Maybe moderate is a better term, as you say. I'm reformed and not a total abstainer. We have wine in the Lord's Supper and I do have a drink now and again. I just think that many reformed people become too lax in many areas.

[callyourmomtoday]

Wow! Is this the son of R. C. Sproul? And he's a preacher too? Shocking! I see R. C. Sproul, Jr. has quite a reputation as a boozehound. Doing a search on his name and I found a site dedicated to his tippling. With such a bad reputation you'd think he'd try and tone it down. But no! Here he is recording a theological discussion to sell through his ministry and right there strewn out on the table are half a dozen liquor bottles! Absolutely shameful. "The Boozement Tapes" certainly sums it up.