A-News 18: National Atheist Parties Troy Boyle, Climate Change, Conspiracy Theory

[kenkrueger1]

Oh, crap...while I was commenting about the guy with the ENORMOUS zit, I completely missed that the douche being interviewed is named Boyle...as in ENORMOUS zit. I don't see these brain dead idiots as a threat. In your own words, a hearty fuck to you, too. What a ridiculous way to waste a life.

[kenkrueger1]

What a great site! The world need more comedy, and these goofballs are good at it. I particularly like the way the guy in the idiotic sunglasses pretends to know what Jesus is about and mocks his own Mother. Also, the other fellow with the ENORMOUS zit and his partner with the Goonies T-Shirt are good for a hearty laugh. Keep it up guys. All of those secular Christians and Pagans have got your back. Hope that works out for you.

[flashoftruth]

i love how Troy sounds like i imagine a 'god' would...

nice job Troy

[TraxTheAlien]

"Funny how not a shred of it is objectively verifiable or has shown up in one single peer-reviewed science journal."

And it never will in fear of being discredited and loss of all funding.

I get it, you're a meat sack with a miserable little blip of an existence.

I remember past lives so I'm crazy or I have a immortal consciousness and you don't.

The only difference is I want people to find out for themselves and investigate where you say they are fools and idiots for not agreeing with you.

[afkwerewolf]

@Gogreenfor2010 ...

[apartmentj]

@Gogreenfor2010 ???  trololololol

[NoizeIndexMusic]

Lee's hair is the sex. Great episode like always guys, I will be sure to spread it!

[apartmentj]

@Gogreenfor2010 apartmentj[dot}com we are working on it

[areophile]

Fiction, hallucination, all of its tricks, as it tries to find a solution to the insoluble fact that it is dying. So the brain manufactures a scenario where the person survives death outside the body...its only a few seconds long, provides a feeling of security and the person dies in a little less shock and fear. Good for the brain, I say.

[areophile]

"Remote Viewing" - more pseudoscientific crap. Doesn't it seem interesting to you that remote viewing never yields any specifically useful or verifiable information? As the patient was wheeled into the hospital and into the room they saw and created a detailed 3D map of everything they saw. Colors were noticed and pictures and vases and the location of equipment. During the death experience, the brain is desperately trying to survive and will use anything at its disposal: memory, gestalt,

[CSJWagner]

@antonahill When people tell you to be open minded about pseudoscience, link them to this. watch?v=T69TOuqaqXI

[CSJWagner]

My point being that you need to focus your argument better. NDEs are naturally explainable. I agree, they aren't people floating up to their fuzzy lord and dead friends. That you point out.

[antonahill]

@CSJWagner Sicne you admit that I point it out, what's your complaint? That I didn't say, "People clearly experience 'something', but it just as clearly is not the literal celestial journey described"? Though I'm not rewatching the piece, I'm pretty sure I ddi cover that. If it wasn't to your preference of clarity, that's room for improvement on my part, but it sounds like we're on the same page.

[CSJWagner]

'And this is, near death experiences are bullshit.' No they aren't. They're very real. That's the argument that I'm making. You say 'Near death experiences are bullshit' but they are quite real, and we are working to understand what they are. Anyone with a mind for science will of course assume a mental event which we have evidence to back up. NDEs are real, we are working to explain them, we have evidence to suggest what they are. Don't call them bullshit.

[antonahill]

@CSJWagner Pardon me, but it seems we're arguing semantics. And I think I did cover this in the piece. It's true that "something" happens. But what that something is, whether a literal celestial journey or an experience in the mind not unlike a dream, the answer is clear. The evidence points to the latter. The former, then, is bullshit.

[CSJWagner]

One part of Anton Hill's argument I don't like is the way he says 'There is no evidence of a near death experience' then immediately backtracks and says that there is and science can explain it. I would say that there IS a near death experience and that we understand how it roughly happens inside the mind. Clearly the mind reacts when people are about to die. We know this and understand this. He acts as if this is some unknown.

[antonahill]

@CSJWagner How did I backtrack? I was possibly not as clear as I should've been, but the point is that if the assertion is that there is an experience in which a subject's "soul" leaves the physical body and galavants up some celestial hole, at which point he meets dead relatives and the pick-your-poison representative of his religion, for that specific experience occurring there is not only no evidence, but it's unfalsifiable. (More...)

[antonahill]

If the assertion is that the subject sees what I've described as per dreaming, then obviously that does happen, though is still unfalsifiable. The question is, then, is the experience described literally a journey from body to sky hole or entirely occurring within the brain? The evidence points to in the brain. How did I not say that? How did I act as if it is "some unknown"?

[cheyla38]

Cody - that was awesome!!

[ashleyfeathers]

facebook.com/Atheists.in.Foxho­les check us out!!

[apartmentj]

@ashleyfeathers check out last weeks episode it was all about military atheism

[matthewtaylorbrown]

Take it from someone that used to be in dialysis (failed kidneys). I'm much better now. :)

It was common for my blood pressure to drop rapidly while 'hooked up.' The first thing you find is that you get warm, very nice when it is so cold in some of those places. Your eyes dilate, sometimes the nurses can see this happen and help, but everything gets really bright. They usually kept me from passing out, the fear was coma. It is just the mind dealing with the lack of O2. - old atheist

[aceytam]

Alright, you guys have some legit points to make, but for people to take you guys seriously, you should dress better, speak more eloquently and curse less.

If you appear more professional, people will treat you likewise, otherwise the "other side's" just going to disregard you lot as a bunch of emos, rebels & hippies.

[apartmentj]

@aceytam we like the rebel crowd. those are our audience. Not trying to make money on this just doing it because we can. it is just for entertainment and our fans, not the you should change it crowd  if they want a show that fits everything they want they should make a show .

[vulcanus30]

Atheist are believers or skeptics? Sounds like believers, attacking only one goal and defending one goal, typical one-sided talk about the NDEs etc. without almost no research behind it. Please, keep an open mind and think outside the box! Peace!

[apartmentj]

@vulcanus30 thinking outside the box requires not just passing the buck to magic but actually waiting on evidence of which there is non for NDE that can't be explained by science

[vulcanus30]

@apartmentj Maybe, maybe not... Many of the top NDE researchers have concluded otherwise. People born blind can see during a NDE, OBE perception during NDEs have been verified etc. btw. there's a stark contrast in the very accurate NDE-OBE experiences reported and then the guesses that the control group had made (Dr. Penny Sartori NDE study) I don't claim that this is scientifically proven.

[antonahill]

@vulcanus30 People born blind have brains. Those brains are capable of producing imagery even without the external stimulus of the eyes. Know how I know? Because all brains are capable of doing this. How has OBE perception during NDEs been verified? Just checked out Penny. She doesn't say she's proved literal NDEs. She says she's collected subjects' stories. How is that evidence that the literal NDEs occurred?

[vulcanus30]

@antonahill On one hand we have many NDE studies that suggest there's something weird going on and on other hand we have qualia - the hard problem of consciousness. There are many scientific theories of consciousness that suggest it's a fundamental property of the universe... or something like that :)

[antonahill]

@vulcanus30 I don't know what you mean by "fundamental property of the universe", and though I agree that consciousness is mysterious, this doesn't mean that people literally float up out of their bodies under any circumstances.

[TraxTheAlien]

@antonahill

watch?v=6qSEi_sfaSU&feature=fe­edu

[antonahill]

@TraxTheAlien Look at that! A for-profit company selling DVDs claiming to have evidence of the paranormal. Funny how not a shred of it is objectively verifiable or has shown up in one single peer-reviewed science journal.

[ashleyfeathers]

@vulcanus30 "Sounds like believers, attacking only one goal and defending one goal, typical one-sided talk about the NDEs etc. without almost no research behind it. Please, keep an open mind and think outside the box!" believers in what? reality is the only thing, and one sided yes, there is a reality side and a magical make believe side, we are the reality, no research? reseach is what makes you atheist, an education makes you atheist, keep and open mind, but not so open your brain falls out!

[antonahill]

@vulcanus30 The "keep an open mind" and "think outside the box" please are so dishonest. Can you sincerely say that you "keep an open mind" about every undemonstrated claim presented to you? In my experience, those who plead for open-mindedness always already believe in something for which they have no evidence. Rather than admit that, they ask for skeptics to agree with them without evidence, and when the skeptics don't, they accuse the skeptics of not having open minds.. (More...)

[vulcanus30]

@antonahill I do not suggest you to believe or not to believe anything, especially without the scientific evidence. Scientists launched a new major NDE study (Aware Study) that includes OBE verification test. Why they are doing this? I tell you why. Because many previous researches and a countless amount of anecdotal stories suggest that something weird is going on and needs to be studied. You may say what you want but life and consciousness is still a huge mystery :)

[antonahill]

@vulcanus30 I never said that life and consciousness weren't a huge mystery. What I said was that for the positive claim that there are (literal) NDEs, there's no evidence. If you know of some that somehow eluded the press, scientific community, and believing community, please point it out.

[antonahill]

What does it even mean to "think outside the box"? How would you suggest that be done other than the objective evaluation of evidence through controlled, reproducible experiment? How do you want NDEs to be tested? Do you sincerely suggest that we believe alleged NDEers simply because they seem earnest? If so, what's stopping us from believing every earnest claim ever made? (More...)

[antonahill]

What do you mean by "one-sided talk"? Was I supposed to bring in someone who swears they've had an NDE? How would they have proved their claim? By promising that they're not lying? If A-News has a future episode on folklore, should I bring in someone who swears that yes, there was a giant named Paul Bunyon? Since when is it necessary to present both sides of an argument as equally valid when one speaks of supernatural events for which there is zero evidence? (More...)

[antonahill]

As for a lack of research, I admit that given the time constraints in preparation and running-time of the piece, I chose to present my case on my words, not on cited material. I'll endeavor to do better next time. In my defense, however, the positive claim remains unproven and the scientific answer remains solid. If you don't believe me, google brain chemistry, personality change post brain trauma, CAT scan technology, etc.

[y0nd3r]

"specifically, a born again christian" Is there another kind?

[antonahill]

@y0nd3r Catholic, Anglican, Episcopalian, Methodist, Greek Orthodox, Russian Orthodox...

[y0nd3r]

@antonahill 'born again' is not in their doctrine?

[antonahill]

@y0nd3r I've known a few Catholics, and no, being "born again" is not part of their doctrine. I can't speak as much about Greek and Russian Orthodox, but since they're not part of the same movement as people like the Southern Baptists, I feel confident in suggesting that no, they don't hold the doctrine either. My memory of Episcopalians is also no. As for Methodists, I'm really not sure.

[y0nd3r]

@antonahill Thank you.

[canhamducbet]

@apartmentj - I get that, but my point is a morale one, not a practical one. Is forcing someone to provide something not objectionable? Can I mandate that you provide me birth control at no cost to me? It would be sweet deal for me, but is that right? Do you understand what I am saying?

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet I understand what you are saying but, they aren't saying that everyone has to take birth control just that everyone has it available at no additional cost. There is always some sort of grief when something new gets added to the table history shows that even if it doesn't affect them in the least. We have to many people who can't afford birth control and with that side also trying to stop planned parenthood its creating more kids than we need or can afford.

[canhamducbet]

@apartmentj Thank you for the reply. I am glad you are open to having this conversation. Weather it is added overhead or higher premiums, someone is paying for it directly or indirectly. To mandate that someone provide something is not an appeal to reason, it is an appeal to force. Weather it is a good idea or not, is it not wrong to force someone to do something they might otherwise not do? What if they refused to be bullied, peacefully refuse, and remain civilly disobedient till the end?

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet here is the thing it is just something new added to the pot of thing insurance covers men pay insurance that helps cover things like pap smears which they will never receive. this is just an additional thing added to the list. I know change is hard for some people but i would rather pay an extra dollar on insurance premium so that everyone has birth control available.

[canhamducbet]

@apartmentj I respect that you would be willing to pay a little more, I might do the same, and perhaps many others, but would you respect those who choose not to? I feel like you are avoiding my core concern here. Is it wrong to mandate someone be forced to provide a service? If we wish to hold up reason as a virtue, then shouldn't we be offended by an appeal to force despite how small or how well intended it may be?

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet to be honest we healthcare ALL OF IT should be included in our taxes and insurance shouldn't exist. health service should be a human right in a country like this that has the ability to afford and help its people. to many people die each year or can't get medical services they need because their health insurance company won't cover something like an MRI or something that is need to save lives. So ULTIMATELY i think that all health services should be free to every citizen.

[canhamducbet]

@apartmentj I can appreciate the need for cheap and accessible health care, but you really haven't answered my question. It seems simple to me. To force someone to provide a service puts them in a position of involuntary servitude (slavery), weather they are forced to fund it or perform the actual labor. Have you considered this, are you indifferent, or do you regard it as a necessary evil in order to achieve a greater good? Is it not preferable that people participate of their own volition?

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet I view it as a necessary good not evil we should help each other and the thought of force is abstract. no different than your parents asking to help bring in the groceries. do your part and help the whole or if you want to be a shithead and not help we will make you help.... or you can always opt out completely and get non of the benefits and fend for yourself. you can always fend for yourself the global health care would be for people who want to help others 

[canhamducbet]

@apartmentj Thanks for the continued discussion. I do appreciate you taking the time. Continuing.. By force I mean to assault, to steal from, to commit fraud against, to vandalize, to kidnap, imprison, enslave, or threaten these things. I am not arguing against helping people. Perhaps you and another person have differing ideas about the best way to help people. Would you respect this person's right to peacefully pursue their own idea, and not attempt to mandate your own?

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet if the decision to mandate my input is more effective for the whole than i could narrowly see i would have no problem with that.... Like say demanding that everyone help pay for global healthcare and a no opt out scenario(everyone just gets healthcare) is fine with me because it ultimately helps more people than it hurts the people hurt are hurt by a few dollars here and there on one side or death or continued sickness on the other

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet nice, um, jump to instant murder and mayhem and also trying to say that i would be ok with something but whatevs.... anyway the opt out as i put it would be very simple don't partake in any of it don't work, don't go to the doctor, don't use a single thing that is part of the society provided stuff..... basically opt out of the society as a whole live in the wild, catch your food, use branches and leaves for medicine. Ya know, all the fun things about not living with gov. :)

[canhamducbet]

@apartmentj Well, Is your mandate just a bluff, or do you mean to use force to support your idea? If you are not going to attempt use reason to convince people that you have a good idea, then doesn't your mandate have to at some point resort to murder and mayhem? If there is a region of people who respectfully decline to adopt your idea and would rather pursue their own. Are you going to send in the storm troopers, remove them from their homes and push them into the wilderness?

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet no not push them out just they cant play with the toys kinda like if i was part of a school yard and all i had to do was contribute a toy i could play with all of them. if i contribute no toy then i get not toy. . the option to not participate is just that you play with the toys you have to follow the rules or you can't play. offer birth control at no co-pay or don't sell insurance no one is forcing them to be an insurance company just that if they are they have rules

[canhamducbet]

@apartmentj How do you apply your toy sharing scenario to the insurance companies? That doesn't seem like a mandate situation. I mean, what if insurance companies ignore the mandate, and their customers still purchase insurance from them? Is that OK with you? If their relationship with with their customers is peaceful and purely consequential, then what is the problem?

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet I thought i was pretty clear on how to apply it to the insurance.... If you sell insurance you have these rules to abide by... that's it if you don't want to follow the rules, you can't sell insurance plain simple. You want to do business with the national currency and be part of the system of any particular society there are rules to follow. so you follow them and enjoy.

[canhamducbet]

@apartmentj So you are saying your preferred solution would be to ostracise them and those who do business with them, and that you would in know way advocate they be assaulted?

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet correct their is absolutely no reason to assault anyone

[canhamducbet]

@apartmentj I find that agreeable, but I don't think that is what Obama was purposing with his mandate.

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet well the reason im guessing to make this mandate is because the republicans keep destroying useful things like Planned parenthood that provide things like birth control and other health services to impoverished people so this is one way to help them out without hurting anyone or raising the dreaded taxes they always cry about

[canhamducbet]

I like Cody's rant. The Chariots of the Gods just doesn't interest me. Until they find an entombed alien or something as fantastic, I don't feel the need to pay it much consideration. Also, I think you missed the point Paul was making. I don't think he was objecting to birth control, just that it is being mandated. Wouldn't you find it equally as objectionable if it was mandated that insurance companies had to provide bibles and prayer cards to their customers.

[apartmentj]

@canhamducbet apples to oranges bibles aren't health services. Even if they did give you bibles you don't have to use them same as birth control they aren't forcing anyone to get birth control just that it has to be available for use at no additional cost

[TraxTheAlien]

To be clear I do not believe in god. But having an opinion on a subject like near death experiences without any real investigation and with the intent to promote your personal views makes your opinion not only irrelevant but insulting. I didn't see the rest of the video because of the aggravation from the beginning. If you wont to promote your opinion you might want to start by not attempting to insult people you disagree with.

[antonahill]

@TraxTheAlien I said that NDEs and the claims of them are bullshit. Would it be insulting to children to declare that claims of Santa Claus are bullshit? Is it an insult to, in the sight of DNA evidence, call a belief in Adam and Eve bullshit? What, someone believes something and thus it's valid? Further, how is my "opinion" on NDEs an opinion? Is there evidence you're aware of that proves that they're real that somehow eluded the press, scientific community, and believers?

[TraxTheAlien]

@antonahill

NDE experiences where the patent experiences what happened in and around the area wile unconsciousness. Not just "a tunnel of light". There is no evidence that has eluded anyone, but there is individuals ignoring or not investigating evidence that gose against their beliefs. Find out for yourself "Remote Viewing".

[antonahill]

What investigation did you have in mind? Did you want me to interview 100 NDEers to see if their stories matched? What would something like that prove other than their stories matched? As I said in the piece, for the positive claim there are NDEs, there is zero evidence. Unless you can cite some, whence derives your complaint?

[kastnmagic]

They need to remove the same damn cross from along the I-40 in COOKEVILLE, TENNESSEE!!! I DO believe that it's standing next to a public water tower as well!!!

[shade421]

I kived Cody's rant!!!!



[shadonaruto33]

i like the new back round in the parts where Brian and Lee are talking

[k2c3po01]

he was actually killed by... and my screen freezes at 14:11

[apartmentj]

@k2c3po01 that's odd it doesn't do it on my side so I don't know if there is anything i can do about it

[stevelikes2curse]

@k2c3po01 Someone doesn't want you to know the truth.

[crafty521]

frist one here