Cont. and started to deny evidence that contradicted them whether it be from Joseph Graves, Jared Diamond, or just sociological and genetic studies. A lot of these "freethinkers" are far from the word.
I think you're onto something about privilege. Start talking about religion in non white communities/countries, many of these atheists (majority white, at least on YT) turn racist. Start talking about the misuse of faith in the sex industry, they back down. Talk about sexism, they become right wingers. Gay rights, yay, because everyone else is doing it. What really turned me off the YT atheism was this race debate crap. A lot of atheists pretty much became creationists.
I think there IS a split here. The split being between people who will go no holds barred after any religitard that attacks science, and people who want to be SOMEWHAT nice to them, especially if they're from other cultures.
I lean a little more towards the former, but with some reservations. I would NEVER for example support someone solely for an anti-religious stance. Take the imbecile Geert Wilders in my country. He says global warming is a scam. So clearly an anti-science advocate himself.
For that matter I even (quite strongly!) disagree with Sam Harris when he says the muslim suicide bombers are worse then the fundies who shoot abortion doctors. They ARE both religious nuts who commit violence.
I think islam should be criticized same as anything else. But I do also think alot of people don't know as much about the muslims either. (I mean 75% of them that identify as muslim where I live are NOT observant for example.) I mean I'm not a fan of Islam at all but still
Fact with the muslims is, that though Islam is a handy propaganda tool for those who want to commit violence, alot of muslim violence is more like guerilla war. If the US got out of the mid-east, stopped killing them and stopped throwing it's weight behind the colonial apartheid state known as Israel, I don't think the muslims would be anywhere even NEAR as violent, if at all.
Islam's still fair game sure, but again... I think things are nuanced to a degree here.
@TheSkunkCat Yes, aggression breeds aggression, I completely agree: if it's all you know as a "solution" to getting what you want, you're still responsible for your actions, though. I just wish we could all approach each other with respect, giving the benefit of the doubt, first. Imagine the butt hurt that would save us all!
@TheSkunkCat I know exactly what you mean: a lot of folk follow "religion" simply because it's their tradition, a habit, like brushing one's teeth. We need to sort out Islamic bull spit from Muslims, just as with any other unquestioning faith.
@TheSkunkCat Aminiken admitted she was wrong re: Darwin using evolution 2 excuse white supremacy. She could have learned more, if she hadn't been bullied, abused so badly. I don't think an Anglo, atheist male ought come on so strongly 2 someone so very different from him; their life experiences r too different. TF has NO idea what Aminakin's life is like. I think we need 2 listen, rather than scream insults @ each other in these cases. Pro "creationists?" Go ahead & blast 'em.
@fullygodfullyhuman Thanks! Got a really disturbed MRA Islamophobe troll in here today, screaming sexist insults, etc. I blocked him THREE TIMES and he KEPT opening new sock accounts, just to troll in here. So, a simple "liked" is like a bouquet of roses by comparison. Thank you.
@Bigpussycat5 Please stop commenting. You're taking too much of my time. I am vision impaired and this is very hard to read. I'm not going to read any more comments from you. Others deserve some attention.
@Bigpussycat5 as a person with brain injuries, I sincerely hate the use of words ending in "tard," or epithets like "stupid, crazy, brain dead, etc." because they just stigmatize ppl like me, reinforce stereotypes and encourage abuse.
@Bigpussycat5 Do you want people to grow, or just to avoid you, because you're abusive? Are we trying to make the world better, or just congratulate ourselves for being right?
@MrAmericanzombie You are a prejudiced, abusive, arrogant jerk. If you can listen to my deconversion story and say that, you are too closed down to think.
@LoopQuantum It makes you a person who doesn't listen, who prejudges and who has no idea what's going on outside your own head. You've put words in my mouth that are not mine, and never were. You don't know a thing and you learned nothing. You're just like the people you deride: narrow minded, judgmental, prejudiced, brittle, small and scared. I'm SO GLAD I'm not like you. Enjoy your pseudo-intellectual masturbation. You can't learn.
I was never relious, was raised by athiests...I don't understand how a soposedly intelagent person could belive in fiction. id like to know if you still belive in god? not nessisarily the faithz but in a suprime being? ive known many people that stop beliving in god because they dissagree with thier church but also many that have never been to church that belive in . . . something out there. as for your vid soso moast of us just see belivers as morons or cowards LOL sheep
@Lordpoison67 This is very difficult to read, so I can't reply except to say: if you watch this video, you'll know what I do or do not believe re: theism. Don't waste people's time with comments, asking questions that are clearly answered in their work. It's disrespectful.
I suspect that thunderfoots calling her a girl and pretty young thing etc. was a poke at the responses potholer got. Everyone got all butthurt and accused him (potholer) of "attacking an innocent girl" etc.
They played the sexism card by suggesting Amenakin wasn't a fair target for criticism as she was just an innocent girl.
It seemed to me that this is what Tfoot was taking the piss out of.
@TheCelticChimp CC, I could just HUG you! EXACTLY: "played sexism card!" Like GWBush, pretending we invaded Afghanistan to "liberate" women from burqa! US doesn't give flying FIG re: women's rights! Yeah, that "attacking innocent GIRL" stuff: I hadn't seen it. THANK YOU! She's a grown woman & needs 2 B accountable; anybody says different is ANTIfeminist, exploiting REAL oppression for their own slogans! I didn't know that, but will not take down vid. May edit; don't know. damn tired right now!
I agree totally about women needing to be accountable and should be treated as accountable adults. I also agree that it is anti-feminist to deprive women of that responsibility or try to shield them from it.
Also, it is fantastic to see that some folk on you tube are open to changing their minds with new information. I'm honestly not sure what I think of TF these days but I think he is innocent of this particular sexism charge.
@TheCelticChimp "This particular sexism charge" ahem. LOL. Ok, look, I don't like it when white dudes call ppl of color certain words, either. Screw the context; I sincerely believe it's not his privilege &, if he's lampooning those "poor girl" comments, he SERIOUSLY needed to make that clear! I ain't ms. cleo, the psychic, y'know?. He's lost cred with me. I cannot, in good conscience, recommend him. His personal attacks make atheism look like RABIES! Anger boi fail syndrome: gets subs, tho
@NIXIMvideo Ah! Excellent! I've fooled another, gullible atheist, eh? I'm KIDDING! I am NOT PamPamTamela...or TamTamPamela... or TogTogRogi or RogRogTogi or whatever. I'm too old to sustain a lie. Thanks and welcome. Hope I don't disappoint too badly.
I don't know about you but when some religious whack-O tells me I'm going to hell I WILL tell them to go fuck themselves! Stop capitulating to those ignorant morons with respect they did NOT earn!
@MsWanderer1 A nobody did that here. B you obviously didn't watch my video. C no capitulation here. My very LIFE is on the line for being an "out" atheist and Queer where I live. And I AM coming out, even though it might, quite literally, get me killed. My neighbors are fundamentalists, racists; they wear GUNS to the GROCERY! I have some damn big, brass ovaries, child. I've earned my propers.
@rriverstone1 Take an old dyke's advice, honey; buy a gun and learn to use it! If you you're surrounded by those bible thumping freaks you'll eventually need to use it.
@MsWanderer1 I have brain injuries & post traumatic stress. I've had serious, psychotic behaviors modeled to me by my mentally ill parent. I do NOT dare own a lethal weapon. Forget homicide; in a suicidal depression, I need to white knuckle out of it and not do something stupid. Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
@Bigpussycat5 TLD? Cuz he goes after PROFESSIONAL snake oil sales persons! And I've worked up a ball of spit (ie "courage") to finally address the "twat" issue with him. I LOVE hearing him give an articulate, detailed, science- and reason-based argument against Comfort, then blast, "Shut the fuck up and piss off!" in that sophisticated-sounding Brit accent! I hear him in my head, sometimes, when I've had a particularly gruesome encounter with a local fundy; makes me smile & gives me courage!
@sol3a1 This video is not about TF. I worked very hard and risked a lot. I'm exposing myself to actual danger, producing these. Did you watch ANY of the rest of it? Do you know how new I am, how scared I am, how much courage it took to even broadcast this? Do you want me to shut up b4 I even get started? I can't shut up; that's a living death to me, so, if the neighbors find out what I'm doing and blow my head off, at least, for this short time, I'll have been alive.
@rriverstone1 No he didn't, just because he used terms like girl and stuff, get over it. he insulted her intelligence when it comes to religion and evolution. you are digging into and looking for anything you can find against TF. its absurd. i know you will block me, you are a censorhips whore and do not care about freedome of speech. desenting opionions will always be block by the ignorant.
@KspekEvo Don't TELL me what I think. LISTEN. And, no, I do not tolerate abuse. I have brain injuries, post traumatic stress and mutilated genitals; I've had enough abuse in my life, thank you. You can address me respectfully, or move on to whatever public toilets you choose to jerk off in, but not with me. I value freedom of speech more than you will EVER know, little boy. I also value responsible speech. If you have psychosexual issues with your mommy, go kick her & leave me out of it, troll
Sorry Riverstone, your critism of Thunderf00t here is at best nit picking and at worst semantics. scientific illtieracy is being dumb about science. he was right.saying girl over woman, get over yourself. thunderf00t never makes a claim that if you do not think like him you are an idiot.
@KspekEvo I may have far more clue than u. How we speak is how we think. It's also how we teach. TF can model better than this. If u want to dismiss me, it's your loss. But your attitude and approach make thoughtful, respectful discussion impossible. Your loss. Best wishes.
@Bigpussycat5 TLD addresses arguments, not physical attributes. Speak with respect 2 ppl u don't know; learn from them; address them w/respect. Am changed her mind re: evolution = white supremacy; she could have learned more. Infantilization of women is FUNDAMENTAL 2 fundamentalism! Does not mean she cannot learn, but she's not going 2 want 2 now, is she? Speak 2 ppl's POTENTIAL, not their limitations, restrictions. Absolutely ridicule ideas, not ppl. Am not pro. like Ray Comfort, selling bunk.
@FiverBeyond I would NEVER give up on rational, expansive, reality-affirming conversation! There's too much work left to do, like Atheists Helping the Homeless, like that crap re: branding innocent kids as "witches," thx 2 fundamentalist propaganda. I promised Dr. Sagan that I won't go gently into this impending Dark Ages and will fight 'til my last breath to prevent it. I just hope the atheist agenda expands to theism's most abused victims. Peace.
@Bigpussycat5 TF does NOT ask; he TELLS: presumptuous. Then, goes on to say hijabs, beards mandatory; not complying causes ostracism, punishment, possible death. It's HIS argument, not mine. U r unaware of "honor killings" in "western" countries? We don't know Y Am. wears hijab; nobody's bothered 2 find out. If TF is concerned re: apostate Muslims, what is he doing 2 help?: Am. is teachable & changed 1 position; she could have changed others. Now, she retreats 2 her comfort zone: Islam.
@rriverstone1 That answer can't be liked enough. Well said. It's going to be a tough fight to deal with decades of conditioning of the population, and now belligerence seems the norm here. Even something as banal as mobile phones is a battlefield of "religious warfare". Peace. <3
After reading the info i can say this, if anyone actually claimed religion was akin to down syndrome that would be offensive, people with down syndrome arent retarted by choice.
Also, for those unaware potholers video was put back up
rriverstone1, great vid. Very articulate and thought provoking. I must respectfully disagree. We need Thunderfoots to ridicule and harass pervayors of faith. I found it highly effective in cementing my atheism. Seeing how easily the information can be shown to be completely absurd was the turning point for me. In remembering where we came from I would add that we all came from different places. We need "good cops" AND "bad cops" in this. Again beautiful vid.
@elbowbiter1 I love debunkers. I hate the "isms" TF employed that aren't part of a rational debate. It's important for the "big trees" to model comportment to the rest of us, and cheap shots are bad form & useless. Nobody's convinced to change if some ass hat calls them names and ridicules appearances. That dripping contempt TF employed validates every suspicious impulse of theists; he literally hisses like a snake!
@rriverstone1 Debunkers? Sounds like a label. I don't think that T.Foot had any intentions of converting the Muslim Lady. I think he did however wish to ridicule her theistic ideas for the benefit of the luke warm believers (as you condone in your vid). Furthermore he was mainly attacking his critics in the vid you have highlighted. Please Miss Stone don't break with your beautiful point of view. What did Nietzsche say about battling monsters? I too can see the contempt in your vid and words.
@elbowbiter1 Did not call TF debunker; that's yer assumption. He ridiculed her gender, not her ideas. Don't know what Nietzche says re: monsters; little formal educ. here; priority survival; vision impaired, dyslexic, brain injuries, memory issues. If I read him, I sure don't remember. What is wrong with the label, "debunkers?" Luke warm believers run for hills with vitriol like this; I sure would. TF is a buly. simple. Am is kidding self, scared. simple. Irrational speech not good arguments.
@rriverstone1 assuming I assumed you called TF a debunker is also an assumption. He ridiculed her gender in a particular way. He ridiculed her in such a way as to draw scorn at his critics, who he implied only saw a pretty girl being attacked by an ugly hairy troll who "Hisses like a snake." Nietzche said that those that grapple with monsters become monsters themselves. I was a luke warm believer... now I am an atheist because of the vitriol and there are more like me. TF is bullying the bully.
@elbowbiter1 Maybe u r not writing yr points clearly enuff, which is maj. fault w/ YT comments, damn it! I'm not grappling TF, so much as critiquing. Have no interest in flame wars, etc. I think it's necessary 2 have crit. dialogue w/in atheism. TF not monster; more burn-out, att'n seeking? Dunno. She's not the bully. She's another fly, caught in the web. I want 2 make space 4 ppl to pull selves out, b4 spiders consume them. Generally like REAL spiders, but not religions, so prob. bad analogy?
@rriverstone1 There you go again with the attacks on his person... "burn out" "attention seeking" sure you haven't lowered yourself to base street slang but it is still an ad hominem at best. Political correctness has a flaw. It ruins the language and does nothing to address the intent. People get caught up on the buzz words and forget the intent sometimes. I think a reviewing of the vid with special effort to look at what the message actually is rather than the buzzwords is in order.
@elbowbiter1 What did you think of my deconversion story, and coming out as Queer? Do you have any supportive feedback or suggestions for my ideas about informing victims of theocracy, for modeling alternatives to superstition? What did you think of my position, as an economically disadvantaged, Queer, atheist woman, living in a fundamentalist, rural town? What did you think of my thoughts on the Library of Alexandria. Video not about TF
@rriverstone1 I think that story was absolutely beautiful and moving. I think your position is very strong and your points were well articulated. I especially loved the Alexandria story. You would have defended the library to the death. How? It made me wonder? Passively or tooth and nail. Thunderfoots video, the one you are critiquing, was doing precisely that. The theists were attempting to remove offending knowledge with a false DMCA instead of fire this time around. T. Foot et. al. defended.
@elbowbiter1 How long have I been on YT? How many vid have I produced (answer: 4)? How many subs? (under 100). I'm putting my life in literal danger, just by broadcasting, if locals find out what I'm doing. I have serious disabilities, incl. brain injuries. I am very, very poor. I haven't much to lose, but no way to protect it. TF has academic bg, network, class priv, gender priv, etc. I have seat of pants intelligence, resourcefulness & rather large heart. I desperately need support, respect.
@elbowbiter1 Amenikin lives in the burned-out ruins of the Library, thinking she knows reality. How can I assist my sisters? That "hairy troll," as someone here called him, just frightens. Find in Am something to respect; build on that; form alliance. I guess I identify with Islamic women b/c I have mutilated genitals (child abuse, incest), b/c grew up fundy, b/c couldn't get educated, b/c low income, b/c voice silenced long time. Am is limited, but trying, even tho not my way.
@rriverstone1 So, I rather feel compassion for Am, whether she would for me, or not. See CelticChimp comment; there was stuff I didn't know when I made this. I know terror. I know choking on self censorship. I know being silenced b/c female. I know fundy world view & how nearly insurmountable is breaking away. Am was foolish, but not stupid. She can learn; she DID learn. Her channel FILLED with hate speech, so that kernel of doubt is probably forever dead in her now. What about her kids? Grief
@rriverstone1 I am not so sure I subscribe to all that. I think Amenikin is more sensitive to what she says now. She knows that a lot of people become upset with her when she puts forward that particular world view. She also learned that being intellectually dishonest and unscrupulously filing a false DMCA is not cool. Theists need to learn that lesson hard... they need to know that there is an ugly reaction to such nonsense. The same could be said of racists and sexists, I'm sure you'd agree.
@elbowbiter1 PPL went to Am's channel and said vile, racist, sexist, abusive shit. I do not and will not excuse that. Should she be challenged, ideologically? Absolutely.
While I don't agree with Tunderfoot's way in the slightest, I think it's fair to say that the response of a pwning video is defferent if the subject is a men or a woman. Many poeple will call "Sexist" anyone who attack a woman's argument, in the same way they would for a man. That's probably what Tunderfoot tried to say at the beginning of the video.
@oralyon No, he attacked her as a woman, not as an ideologue.eg: "pretty thing." That's bad form. He barely mentions her arguments. POTHOLER54 dissected every aspect of her argument, without regard to her gender, ethnicity, culture or religion. He did a legit job of reaming her a new one. He EVEN got her to reconsider her false position that Darwin says white ppl more evolved. THAT was a chink in her beliefs, a doubt that was squandered by others' hate speech toward her, damn it.
@oralyon He also got called an apologist for Islam. Ppl are very flawed beings & crave our comfort zones. It's so easy to filter others' words, actions and motivations through our own definitions of reality and create skewed results. These topics are profound and intimidating. It's tempted to feel threatened. And people who are threatened get defensive and angry. I'm proud of Potholer54 for having broad shoulders and a cool head.
@rriverstone1 Yes and I totally agree with you. But the point is those people defended amenakin by insulting Pothler, not because amenakin argument was good of because Pother had gone to far, but pricicely because she is a woman. I think that pretty much what Thunderfoot tried to point out at the start of his video. I still don't agree with thunderfoot way but I think that's what he was going for.
@oralyon oh! THOSE people! Those r not what I'd call "feminist" attacks. A truly feminist position would realize Aminakin is a HUMAN and an equal. THOSE comments were from a paternalistic, Muslim mindset that says women need protection and should be treated differently from men! No, those weren't classically feminist arguments; those buy in to the concept that women are too weak and dependent to stand on our own, 2 feet. They were cheap shots, as well and pretty damn silly.
Feminism is mostly about woman getting their way. If there is and injustice that favor them, most of them won't rise their voice. They get to be those strong powerful women when it suit them and when it doesn't it's back to the weak woman. I've seen so many feminist act like that. When have you ever seen a feminist protest for father right, any men's issue at all ?
It's double standard of our own culture, pure and simple, it's not the Muslim mindset.
@oralyon You're wrong about feminism. U don't know me. Don't make assumptions re: ppl who r fighting for civil rights. When have u seen a men's movement that says, "Don't rape," instead of a women's movement that says, "Don't get raped?" Feminism is about women's issues, primarily. We're being genitally mutilated, murdered, kept uneducated, etc. We have a lot on our plates, as it is. Why would u think it's our responsibility to take more care of men? U ask Blacks 2 do whites' work, 2?
@rriverstone1 It's not your responsability, but then, you don't get to claim that you are about equality for all. What you are commiting is the "No true Scottman Falacy" Where you say about those people who attacked Pother "Oh but they're not true feminist !" It's the same as when christian claim " Oh but those weren't true Christian"
@oralyon I'm about equality 4 WOMEN; that's my priority. No, those ppl's motives informed by Muslim apologia, not by feminism. Period. If I say I'm vegetarian while eating a hamburger, I'm "no true Scotsman," now, am I? YOU called them "feminist;" they did not, nor do I, as a feminist. They're not unicorns, either.
@rriverstone1 Eating a hamburger isn't vegetarian. The No True Scotsman fallacy doesn't apply here because the guidelines for the group has not been respected. If you were a vegetarian and you were eating some eggs then, yes, someone calling you 'no true vegetarian' would be making the NTS fallacy.
@IKillBabyKittensLOL It's an ANALOGY for ceiling Am's defenders, who use her gender as their argument for easy treatment, "feminist." They are not; they don't even define themselves as such & ceiling them "feminist" is disingenuous, a strawman argument. Even if they were to describe themselves as "feminist," just cuz someone appropriates a term doesn't mean they are what they call themselves, does it? guidelines 4 group have not been respected. exactly my point
This was damn good video :) I think the atheist community is dead as it was though when everyone was united against creationists. I think a problem is that one cannot make community soley on disbelife. I mean two atheists can disagree everything and onlu hold the disbelive.
@Eopyk I think we have a moral duty to model life beyond belief. These are very dark times. We could be activists, protecting children from charges of witchcraft, working in local communities to popularize science...particularly in low income neighborhoods, where churches prey on the vulnerable, etc. It's more than just disbelief. It's liberation from belief and I think we should pay it forward, for the sake of our species AND the rest of the planet.
Excellent vid Rogi..True..Alienation only creates larger barriers..I do feel concerned & at times horrified by the hateful attacks on Islamic individuals..Ive always preferred science & exposure of inhumane practices as a means to reach fundamentalists..I do, however acknowledge, the horror of abuse perpetrated in the name of Allah & how at times I am so sickened that i, too want to yell abuse. I don't, however, i feel that these horrors will never cease.
@777ren Oh, I know the damage religion does, believe me. Even if they're not outright trying to kill you, they're either telling you how unworthy you are to live, how dirty you are or how thinking for one's self is damnable. I have the xian Taliban, to this day, playing in my head and have to consciously work to counteract that poison when it attacks me.
@Klingschor I has olives in my fridge. I is Heinz57: African American, Cherokee, English, Scottish and, for unknown reasons, Greek. I looks like white grrl, but hair is all confused.
I thought I looked "white" as well, but everyone thinks I'm Middle-Eastern: My Islamic Professor thought I was an Arab, AlmightyAtheismo thought I was Persian or Turkish, and now after this video ---> (/watch?v=ymZYRymwIvY) someone guessed me to be Pakistani.
Best Vid yet. I wanted to defend TF but found i couldn't. This was a very honest & well thought out post & the more i watched the more i began to understand. Great Stuff.
@bismarket oh, thanks. Mind you, TF has a LOT to offer. I think he's just gotten a fat head. I hope it's only temporary. Carl Sagan would slap the shit out of him...
@Eopyk oh, he's busy, being a "tall tree." The phallic symbolism doesn't go unnoticed. Keeping the rest of us stunted and in the dark. Yeah, that's him. Have u seen his latest vid on the stagnation of YT atheism? He may be so stagnant he stinks, but the rest of us just need him to shut up long enough for the rest of us to get a chance. WildwoodClaire1 suggested today he do more "shout outs," pointing peeps 2 newer YouTubers. Gasp. Share the sun? Never!
In my hiippie days, I wore the long skirts and peasant blouses because I was uncomfortable with my body and didn't know how to deal with "the male gaze". My momma hadn't taught me much while I was growing up. Eventually, I realized that it is not what you wear that causes men to rape women. The fact that fundamentalist Islamic women haven't figured this out doesn't mean they are stupid. btw long flowing robes can be sexy depending on how you wear them.
@pirbird14 I'm an incest and rape survivor. I am very protective of my body. Only those I select, and they're very high-caliber people, are privy to that intimacy. I empathize with the FEMINIST, Muslim argument that women ought to be respected as intellectual peers, not judged like cattle at an auction. I wonder if there's a theme among some atheist men: women should be available for men's pleasure. Hence, no modesty and NO boundaries about treating us professionally eg: Rebecca Watson.
@rriverstone1 I think it's part and parcel of their intellectual arrogance. It's amazing how imbecilic some of these people become when they step outside their field of expertise. I first unsubbed from T'foot when he made his amateurish biblical criticism vid and refused to take critique from knowledgeable people. There are centuries of scholarly work into the questions of what religion is, how it came to be, the origins of Christianity, etc - but he refuses to look at it.
@pirbird14 Willful ignorance is probably my worst source of impatience. When an academic does it, I can barely restrain an impulse toward physical violence. Seriously. I studied to be a Unitarian Universalist minister, until the $ ran out. My fav. subjects were feminist exegeses of sacred texts. It's a real mind-blower. It adds to the profundity of what we can't even imagine has been lost from human culture because of the exclusion of women. Humility: not a natural, academic trait.
@rriverstone1 I see you still have rhymaiden in your subbs. You know she closed down that channel and re-opened as WildwoodClaire? Also, have you checked out AngieAntiTheist? She live tweeted her abortion and did Youtube video of it. Very brave woman.
@pirbird14 Claire is on my sub list, or do u mean she was subbed to me (I find the latter hard to believe, as I'm very new here)? Thanks for the tip on AngieAntiTheist. I hadn't heard of her. What a brave person! I'll sub right now. Thanks!
@62netty You can say it. Take your time. Don't be self conscious or worry what Other People Think. Turn on the camera and just say it to someone you trust. You can edit out all the stupidity later. I did. I hope.
@62netty Please do. You can set it to I think it's "private," so only people YOU give links to can see your video. I seriously believe self publication is transformative. We need to broadcast our experiences, network and build support. You've got mine. If you produce something, please send me a link, ok?
@goxster Guy, I didn't even expect to HEAR from you, 'til after you get that horse out of the barn! I'm flattered that you stopped by; this is a long video. You're already signed up, in my book, baby. I am honored that you want to address the topics in this. Take your time. Have some fun with those Turkish cigarettes, Cuban cigars and $1/liter European beers & excellent wines...oh, and the slender, Bavarian women. I'm so jealous! Mad love, Rogi! Info in Description
This is so eloquent and compassionate! You are brilliant, and you should be recognized as one of our generation's best writers. You are every bit as gifted as anyone who has been published and on a best-seller list. How do I mirror this onto my profile? Is it possible to do that on a mobile device?
@TheWhimsicalMimzy I don't know how to do mobile things. I'll ask Atheist YouTube Community on FaceBook. Maybe someone there would know. Can you put a "download" app on your mobile? That's what I did, through FireFox. I have Download Helper, but there are others. Thanks for the gee whiz compliments. That wasn't written, by the way. It was a ramble. My hair was dirty, cuz it's been 2 cold 2 bathe and the lighting sucked, so I edited the audio and slapped on pictures. This is how I think . . .
... You can also add it to your channel as a "favorite" or put it in a "playlist." It would still be on my channel, but folks could find it there, and so could you. I have NO plans to take this down, unless Thunderf00t files a DMCA against me....snicker
It was good to see potholer and amenakin come together to condemn the hate speech on both sides. It was also good to see that Potholer stuck to his guns and that the DMCA request was not upheld; in a proper manner. For a moment, it felt like YouTube were about to bow to religion but ... heck, everyone has the right to be offended.
@msknight5 Oh, I understood PH54's motives in that combined vid with Amenakin: the ethic of not insulting people and vilifying them, rather than actually conversing. I was very proud of PH54. I was also impressed that Amenakin admits her assertions that the theory of evolution is an argument 4 the superiority of while people was not founded on Darwin's book, and she's not sure where she got it. There's a kernel of doubt in her world view now. This is a good thing. Bashing her squandered that.
"Great minds talk about ideas, average minds about things and small minds about other people". I try to stay on the great to average end of things, but how does one separate the willful ignorance and superstition that leads to children being slaughtered as witches from people like Ray Comfort and Ken Ham who make millions promoting it? That said, you're dead on about the ivory tower atheists who regard the "lower eschelon atheists" like us with such undisguised contempt.
@TheMudbrooker I think, for those who can actually stand to listen long enough to propagandists, in order to debunk them, that this work is necessary and helpful. For issues like the "witches" in Africa, I hope we can build alliances with, and help fund, if not volunteer for, organizations, even churches, who resist this cruelty. The people who've most expressed burn out are the meanest mouths out there in atheism. Good. Let them be quiet; others need a chance to speak. You're awesome.
@TheMudbrooker I think, for those who can actually stand to listen long enough to propagandists, in order to debunk them, that this work is necessary and helpful. For issues like the "witches" in Africa, I hope we can build alliances with, and help fund, if not volunteer for, organizations, even churches, who resist this cruelty. The people who've most expressed burn out are the meanest mouths out there in atheism. Good. Let them be quiet; others need a chance to speak. You're awesome.
Cont. and started to deny evidence that contradicted them whether it be from Joseph Graves, Jared Diamond, or just sociological and genetic studies. A lot of these "freethinkers" are far from the word.
HybridD91 1 month ago
@HybridD91 yes, I hear you. unfortunately, I agree
rriverstone1 1 month ago
I think you're onto something about privilege. Start talking about religion in non white communities/countries, many of these atheists (majority white, at least on YT) turn racist. Start talking about the misuse of faith in the sex industry, they back down. Talk about sexism, they become right wingers. Gay rights, yay, because everyone else is doing it. What really turned me off the YT atheism was this race debate crap. A lot of atheists pretty much became creationists.
HybridD91 1 month ago
I think there IS a split here. The split being between people who will go no holds barred after any religitard that attacks science, and people who want to be SOMEWHAT nice to them, especially if they're from other cultures.
I lean a little more towards the former, but with some reservations. I would NEVER for example support someone solely for an anti-religious stance. Take the imbecile Geert Wilders in my country. He says global warming is a scam. So clearly an anti-science advocate himself.
TheSkunkCat 2 months ago
@TheSkunkCat
For that matter I even (quite strongly!) disagree with Sam Harris when he says the muslim suicide bombers are worse then the fundies who shoot abortion doctors. They ARE both religious nuts who commit violence.
I think islam should be criticized same as anything else. But I do also think alot of people don't know as much about the muslims either. (I mean 75% of them that identify as muslim where I live are NOT observant for example.) I mean I'm not a fan of Islam at all but still
TheSkunkCat 2 months ago
@TheSkunkCat
Fact with the muslims is, that though Islam is a handy propaganda tool for those who want to commit violence, alot of muslim violence is more like guerilla war. If the US got out of the mid-east, stopped killing them and stopped throwing it's weight behind the colonial apartheid state known as Israel, I don't think the muslims would be anywhere even NEAR as violent, if at all.
Islam's still fair game sure, but again... I think things are nuanced to a degree here.
TheSkunkCat 2 months ago
@TheSkunkCat Yes, aggression breeds aggression, I completely agree: if it's all you know as a "solution" to getting what you want, you're still responsible for your actions, though. I just wish we could all approach each other with respect, giving the benefit of the doubt, first. Imagine the butt hurt that would save us all!
rriverstone1 2 months ago
@TheSkunkCat I know exactly what you mean: a lot of folk follow "religion" simply because it's their tradition, a habit, like brushing one's teeth. We need to sort out Islamic bull spit from Muslims, just as with any other unquestioning faith.
rriverstone1 2 months ago
@TheSkunkCat Aminiken admitted she was wrong re: Darwin using evolution 2 excuse white supremacy. She could have learned more, if she hadn't been bullied, abused so badly. I don't think an Anglo, atheist male ought come on so strongly 2 someone so very different from him; their life experiences r too different. TF has NO idea what Aminakin's life is like. I think we need 2 listen, rather than scream insults @ each other in these cases. Pro "creationists?" Go ahead & blast 'em.
rriverstone1 2 months ago
liked and subbed
Nylonbeast 2 months ago
@Nylonbeast Why thank you!
rriverstone1 2 months ago
rriverstone, I liked and favourited this video when it finished. <3 Can't find my comment or your anwer to it, so just posting this.
NielsC68 3 months ago
@NielsC68 thank you
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@NielsC68
rriverstone1 3 months ago
Liked!
fullygodfullyhuman 3 months ago 2
@fullygodfullyhuman Thanks! Got a really disturbed MRA Islamophobe troll in here today, screaming sexist insults, etc. I blocked him THREE TIMES and he KEPT opening new sock accounts, just to troll in here. So, a simple "liked" is like a bouquet of roses by comparison. Thank you.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 it was deserved
fullygodfullyhuman 3 months ago
@fullygodfullyhuman :)
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@fullygodfullyhuman thank you
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@ThePhysicsTheorist You are mentally unstable, abusive and unwelcome here. My channel is a place for rational discussion ONLY.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@LoopQuantum You're an unbalanced person, aren't you? Please leave my channel. There's no room for irrationality here. Thanks.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@Bigpussycat5 Please stop commenting. You're taking too much of my time. I am vision impaired and this is very hard to read. I'm not going to read any more comments from you. Others deserve some attention.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@Bigpussycat5 as a person with brain injuries, I sincerely hate the use of words ending in "tard," or epithets like "stupid, crazy, brain dead, etc." because they just stigmatize ppl like me, reinforce stereotypes and encourage abuse.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@Bigpussycat5 Do you want people to grow, or just to avoid you, because you're abusive? Are we trying to make the world better, or just congratulate ourselves for being right?
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@MrAmericanzombie I wasn't competing. It's not the point. Stay off my channel.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@MrAmericanzombie You are a prejudiced, abusive, arrogant jerk. If you can listen to my deconversion story and say that, you are too closed down to think.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@LoopQuantum It makes you a person who doesn't listen, who prejudges and who has no idea what's going on outside your own head. You've put words in my mouth that are not mine, and never were. You don't know a thing and you learned nothing. You're just like the people you deride: narrow minded, judgmental, prejudiced, brittle, small and scared. I'm SO GLAD I'm not like you. Enjoy your pseudo-intellectual masturbation. You can't learn.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
I can relate to this so much, i, too, subscribed (and then unsubscribed) to thunderf00t for the same reasons as you.
ThinkerResearcher 3 months ago
@ThinkerResearcher Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
I was never relious, was raised by athiests...I don't understand how a soposedly intelagent person could belive in fiction. id like to know if you still belive in god? not nessisarily the faithz but in a suprime being? ive known many people that stop beliving in god because they dissagree with thier church but also many that have never been to church that belive in . . . something out there. as for your vid soso moast of us just see belivers as morons or cowards LOL sheep
Lordpoison67 3 months ago
@Lordpoison67 This is very difficult to read, so I can't reply except to say: if you watch this video, you'll know what I do or do not believe re: theism. Don't waste people's time with comments, asking questions that are clearly answered in their work. It's disrespectful.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
I suspect that thunderfoots calling her a girl and pretty young thing etc. was a poke at the responses potholer got. Everyone got all butthurt and accused him (potholer) of "attacking an innocent girl" etc.
They played the sexism card by suggesting Amenakin wasn't a fair target for criticism as she was just an innocent girl.
It seemed to me that this is what Tfoot was taking the piss out of.
TheCelticChimp 3 months ago 2
@TheCelticChimp CC, I could just HUG you! EXACTLY: "played sexism card!" Like GWBush, pretending we invaded Afghanistan to "liberate" women from burqa! US doesn't give flying FIG re: women's rights! Yeah, that "attacking innocent GIRL" stuff: I hadn't seen it. THANK YOU! She's a grown woman & needs 2 B accountable; anybody says different is ANTIfeminist, exploiting REAL oppression for their own slogans! I didn't know that, but will not take down vid. May edit; don't know. damn tired right now!
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1
I agree totally about women needing to be accountable and should be treated as accountable adults. I also agree that it is anti-feminist to deprive women of that responsibility or try to shield them from it.
Also, it is fantastic to see that some folk on you tube are open to changing their minds with new information. I'm honestly not sure what I think of TF these days but I think he is innocent of this particular sexism charge.
TheCelticChimp 3 months ago
@TheCelticChimp "This particular sexism charge" ahem. LOL. Ok, look, I don't like it when white dudes call ppl of color certain words, either. Screw the context; I sincerely believe it's not his privilege &, if he's lampooning those "poor girl" comments, he SERIOUSLY needed to make that clear! I ain't ms. cleo, the psychic, y'know?. He's lost cred with me. I cannot, in good conscience, recommend him. His personal attacks make atheism look like RABIES! Anger boi fail syndrome: gets subs, tho
rriverstone1 3 months ago
You got me to subscribe as you at least sound rational, I will listen and read with interest. thanks for posting and stimulating the debate.
NIXIMvideo 3 months ago
@NIXIMvideo Ah! Excellent! I've fooled another, gullible atheist, eh? I'm KIDDING! I am NOT PamPamTamela...or TamTamPamela... or TogTogRogi or RogRogTogi or whatever. I'm too old to sustain a lie. Thanks and welcome. Hope I don't disappoint too badly.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@NIXIMvideo Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
I don't know about you but when some religious whack-O tells me I'm going to hell I WILL tell them to go fuck themselves! Stop capitulating to those ignorant morons with respect they did NOT earn!
MsWanderer1 3 months ago
@MsWanderer1 A nobody did that here. B you obviously didn't watch my video. C no capitulation here. My very LIFE is on the line for being an "out" atheist and Queer where I live. And I AM coming out, even though it might, quite literally, get me killed. My neighbors are fundamentalists, racists; they wear GUNS to the GROCERY! I have some damn big, brass ovaries, child. I've earned my propers.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 Take an old dyke's advice, honey; buy a gun and learn to use it! If you you're surrounded by those bible thumping freaks you'll eventually need to use it.
MsWanderer1 3 months ago
@MsWanderer1 I have brain injuries & post traumatic stress. I've had serious, psychotic behaviors modeled to me by my mentally ill parent. I do NOT dare own a lethal weapon. Forget homicide; in a suicidal depression, I need to white knuckle out of it and not do something stupid. Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
dont let the door hit you on the way out
mboundtogether 3 months ago
@mboundtogether to whom, and why, is this addressed?
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@Bigpussycat5 TLD? Cuz he goes after PROFESSIONAL snake oil sales persons! And I've worked up a ball of spit (ie "courage") to finally address the "twat" issue with him. I LOVE hearing him give an articulate, detailed, science- and reason-based argument against Comfort, then blast, "Shut the fuck up and piss off!" in that sophisticated-sounding Brit accent! I hear him in my head, sometimes, when I've had a particularly gruesome encounter with a local fundy; makes me smile & gives me courage!
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@KspekEvo TF insulted her gender. You are abusive and not welcome to return. period.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 "TF insulted her gender. You are abusive and not welcome to return" no he insulted her for her dogma and narrow mindedness
Just because it's someone's faith doesn't mean it can't be mocked
sol3a1 3 months ago
@sol3a1 He mocked her gender.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1: Nope, he mocked her ignorance. He was not mocking women but how some women sell out their gender for fables
sol3a1 3 months ago
@sol3a1 This video is not about TF. I worked very hard and risked a lot. I'm exposing myself to actual danger, producing these. Did you watch ANY of the rest of it? Do you know how new I am, how scared I am, how much courage it took to even broadcast this? Do you want me to shut up b4 I even get started? I can't shut up; that's a living death to me, so, if the neighbors find out what I'm doing and blow my head off, at least, for this short time, I'll have been alive.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1: Welcome to the club. I have my face on my vids and I live in the bible belt
sol3a1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 No he didn't, just because he used terms like girl and stuff, get over it. he insulted her intelligence when it comes to religion and evolution. you are digging into and looking for anything you can find against TF. its absurd. i know you will block me, you are a censorhips whore and do not care about freedome of speech. desenting opionions will always be block by the ignorant.
KspekEvo 3 months ago
@KspekEvo Don't TELL me what I think. LISTEN. And, no, I do not tolerate abuse. I have brain injuries, post traumatic stress and mutilated genitals; I've had enough abuse in my life, thank you. You can address me respectfully, or move on to whatever public toilets you choose to jerk off in, but not with me. I value freedom of speech more than you will EVER know, little boy. I also value responsible speech. If you have psychosexual issues with your mommy, go kick her & leave me out of it, troll
rriverstone1 3 months ago
Sorry Riverstone, your critism of Thunderf00t here is at best nit picking and at worst semantics. scientific illtieracy is being dumb about science. he was right.saying girl over woman, get over yourself. thunderf00t never makes a claim that if you do not think like him you are an idiot.
you really need to get a clue on this one.
KspekEvo 3 months ago
@KspekEvo I may have far more clue than u. How we speak is how we think. It's also how we teach. TF can model better than this. If u want to dismiss me, it's your loss. But your attitude and approach make thoughtful, respectful discussion impossible. Your loss. Best wishes.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@Bigpussycat5 I have no idea what any of this means. Who? What? I have no idea
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@Bigpussycat5 TLD addresses arguments, not physical attributes. Speak with respect 2 ppl u don't know; learn from them; address them w/respect. Am changed her mind re: evolution = white supremacy; she could have learned more. Infantilization of women is FUNDAMENTAL 2 fundamentalism! Does not mean she cannot learn, but she's not going 2 want 2 now, is she? Speak 2 ppl's POTENTIAL, not their limitations, restrictions. Absolutely ridicule ideas, not ppl. Am not pro. like Ray Comfort, selling bunk.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
Excellent work, Riverstone. Please don't give up on the youtube atheist community, let's try to influence it in the right direction.
FiverBeyond 3 months ago
@FiverBeyond I would NEVER give up on rational, expansive, reality-affirming conversation! There's too much work left to do, like Atheists Helping the Homeless, like that crap re: branding innocent kids as "witches," thx 2 fundamentalist propaganda. I promised Dr. Sagan that I won't go gently into this impending Dark Ages and will fight 'til my last breath to prevent it. I just hope the atheist agenda expands to theism's most abused victims. Peace.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@FiverBeyond Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
Well done, Rogi.
Braxtonmccoy 3 months ago
@Braxtonmccoy muchisimas gracias!
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@Braxtonmccoy Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@Bigpussycat5 TF does NOT ask; he TELLS: presumptuous. Then, goes on to say hijabs, beards mandatory; not complying causes ostracism, punishment, possible death. It's HIS argument, not mine. U r unaware of "honor killings" in "western" countries? We don't know Y Am. wears hijab; nobody's bothered 2 find out. If TF is concerned re: apostate Muslims, what is he doing 2 help?: Am. is teachable & changed 1 position; she could have changed others. Now, she retreats 2 her comfort zone: Islam.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 That answer can't be liked enough. Well said. It's going to be a tough fight to deal with decades of conditioning of the population, and now belligerence seems the norm here. Even something as banal as mobile phones is a battlefield of "religious warfare". Peace. <3
NielsC68 3 months ago
@NielsC68 Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
After reading the info i can say this, if anyone actually claimed religion was akin to down syndrome that would be offensive, people with down syndrome arent retarted by choice.
Also, for those unaware potholers video was put back up
deathman1021 3 months ago
@deathman1021 1 I agree. 2 I know. thanks
rriverstone1 3 months ago
rriverstone1, great vid. Very articulate and thought provoking. I must respectfully disagree. We need Thunderfoots to ridicule and harass pervayors of faith. I found it highly effective in cementing my atheism. Seeing how easily the information can be shown to be completely absurd was the turning point for me. In remembering where we came from I would add that we all came from different places. We need "good cops" AND "bad cops" in this. Again beautiful vid.
elbowbiter1 3 months ago
@elbowbiter1 I love debunkers. I hate the "isms" TF employed that aren't part of a rational debate. It's important for the "big trees" to model comportment to the rest of us, and cheap shots are bad form & useless. Nobody's convinced to change if some ass hat calls them names and ridicules appearances. That dripping contempt TF employed validates every suspicious impulse of theists; he literally hisses like a snake!
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 Debunkers? Sounds like a label. I don't think that T.Foot had any intentions of converting the Muslim Lady. I think he did however wish to ridicule her theistic ideas for the benefit of the luke warm believers (as you condone in your vid). Furthermore he was mainly attacking his critics in the vid you have highlighted. Please Miss Stone don't break with your beautiful point of view. What did Nietzsche say about battling monsters? I too can see the contempt in your vid and words.
elbowbiter1 3 months ago
@elbowbiter1 Did not call TF debunker; that's yer assumption. He ridiculed her gender, not her ideas. Don't know what Nietzche says re: monsters; little formal educ. here; priority survival; vision impaired, dyslexic, brain injuries, memory issues. If I read him, I sure don't remember. What is wrong with the label, "debunkers?" Luke warm believers run for hills with vitriol like this; I sure would. TF is a buly. simple. Am is kidding self, scared. simple. Irrational speech not good arguments.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 assuming I assumed you called TF a debunker is also an assumption. He ridiculed her gender in a particular way. He ridiculed her in such a way as to draw scorn at his critics, who he implied only saw a pretty girl being attacked by an ugly hairy troll who "Hisses like a snake." Nietzche said that those that grapple with monsters become monsters themselves. I was a luke warm believer... now I am an atheist because of the vitriol and there are more like me. TF is bullying the bully.
elbowbiter1 3 months ago
@elbowbiter1 Maybe u r not writing yr points clearly enuff, which is maj. fault w/ YT comments, damn it! I'm not grappling TF, so much as critiquing. Have no interest in flame wars, etc. I think it's necessary 2 have crit. dialogue w/in atheism. TF not monster; more burn-out, att'n seeking? Dunno. She's not the bully. She's another fly, caught in the web. I want 2 make space 4 ppl to pull selves out, b4 spiders consume them. Generally like REAL spiders, but not religions, so prob. bad analogy?
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 There you go again with the attacks on his person... "burn out" "attention seeking" sure you haven't lowered yourself to base street slang but it is still an ad hominem at best. Political correctness has a flaw. It ruins the language and does nothing to address the intent. People get caught up on the buzz words and forget the intent sometimes. I think a reviewing of the vid with special effort to look at what the message actually is rather than the buzzwords is in order.
elbowbiter1 3 months ago
@elbowbiter1 What did you think of my deconversion story, and coming out as Queer? Do you have any supportive feedback or suggestions for my ideas about informing victims of theocracy, for modeling alternatives to superstition? What did you think of my position, as an economically disadvantaged, Queer, atheist woman, living in a fundamentalist, rural town? What did you think of my thoughts on the Library of Alexandria. Video not about TF
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 I think that story was absolutely beautiful and moving. I think your position is very strong and your points were well articulated. I especially loved the Alexandria story. You would have defended the library to the death. How? It made me wonder? Passively or tooth and nail. Thunderfoots video, the one you are critiquing, was doing precisely that. The theists were attempting to remove offending knowledge with a false DMCA instead of fire this time around. T. Foot et. al. defended.
elbowbiter1 3 months ago
@elbowbiter1 How long have I been on YT? How many vid have I produced (answer: 4)? How many subs? (under 100). I'm putting my life in literal danger, just by broadcasting, if locals find out what I'm doing. I have serious disabilities, incl. brain injuries. I am very, very poor. I haven't much to lose, but no way to protect it. TF has academic bg, network, class priv, gender priv, etc. I have seat of pants intelligence, resourcefulness & rather large heart. I desperately need support, respect.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@elbowbiter1 Amenikin lives in the burned-out ruins of the Library, thinking she knows reality. How can I assist my sisters? That "hairy troll," as someone here called him, just frightens. Find in Am something to respect; build on that; form alliance. I guess I identify with Islamic women b/c I have mutilated genitals (child abuse, incest), b/c grew up fundy, b/c couldn't get educated, b/c low income, b/c voice silenced long time. Am is limited, but trying, even tho not my way.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 So, I rather feel compassion for Am, whether she would for me, or not. See CelticChimp comment; there was stuff I didn't know when I made this. I know terror. I know choking on self censorship. I know being silenced b/c female. I know fundy world view & how nearly insurmountable is breaking away. Am was foolish, but not stupid. She can learn; she DID learn. Her channel FILLED with hate speech, so that kernel of doubt is probably forever dead in her now. What about her kids? Grief
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 I am not so sure I subscribe to all that. I think Amenikin is more sensitive to what she says now. She knows that a lot of people become upset with her when she puts forward that particular world view. She also learned that being intellectually dishonest and unscrupulously filing a false DMCA is not cool. Theists need to learn that lesson hard... they need to know that there is an ugly reaction to such nonsense. The same could be said of racists and sexists, I'm sure you'd agree.
elbowbiter1 3 months ago
@elbowbiter1 PPL went to Am's channel and said vile, racist, sexist, abusive shit. I do not and will not excuse that. Should she be challenged, ideologically? Absolutely.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 Gladly.
elbowbiter1 3 months ago
@elbowbiter1 Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
While I don't agree with Tunderfoot's way in the slightest, I think it's fair to say that the response of a pwning video is defferent if the subject is a men or a woman. Many poeple will call "Sexist" anyone who attack a woman's argument, in the same way they would for a man. That's probably what Tunderfoot tried to say at the beginning of the video.
oralyon 3 months ago
@oralyon No, he attacked her as a woman, not as an ideologue.eg: "pretty thing." That's bad form. He barely mentions her arguments. POTHOLER54 dissected every aspect of her argument, without regard to her gender, ethnicity, culture or religion. He did a legit job of reaming her a new one. He EVEN got her to reconsider her false position that Darwin says white ppl more evolved. THAT was a chink in her beliefs, a doubt that was squandered by others' hate speech toward her, damn it.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 Yes but pothler STILL got called sexist by many, So much that he had to make a second video to clarify.
oralyon 3 months ago
@oralyon He also got called an apologist for Islam. Ppl are very flawed beings & crave our comfort zones. It's so easy to filter others' words, actions and motivations through our own definitions of reality and create skewed results. These topics are profound and intimidating. It's tempted to feel threatened. And people who are threatened get defensive and angry. I'm proud of Potholer54 for having broad shoulders and a cool head.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 Yes and I totally agree with you. But the point is those people defended amenakin by insulting Pothler, not because amenakin argument was good of because Pother had gone to far, but pricicely because she is a woman. I think that pretty much what Thunderfoot tried to point out at the start of his video. I still don't agree with thunderfoot way but I think that's what he was going for.
oralyon 3 months ago
@oralyon oh! THOSE people! Those r not what I'd call "feminist" attacks. A truly feminist position would realize Aminakin is a HUMAN and an equal. THOSE comments were from a paternalistic, Muslim mindset that says women need protection and should be treated differently from men! No, those weren't classically feminist arguments; those buy in to the concept that women are too weak and dependent to stand on our own, 2 feet. They were cheap shots, as well and pretty damn silly.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 My Ass they were !
Feminism is mostly about woman getting their way. If there is and injustice that favor them, most of them won't rise their voice. They get to be those strong powerful women when it suit them and when it doesn't it's back to the weak woman. I've seen so many feminist act like that. When have you ever seen a feminist protest for father right, any men's issue at all ?
It's double standard of our own culture, pure and simple, it's not the Muslim mindset.
oralyon 3 months ago
@oralyon You're wrong about feminism. U don't know me. Don't make assumptions re: ppl who r fighting for civil rights. When have u seen a men's movement that says, "Don't rape," instead of a women's movement that says, "Don't get raped?" Feminism is about women's issues, primarily. We're being genitally mutilated, murdered, kept uneducated, etc. We have a lot on our plates, as it is. Why would u think it's our responsibility to take more care of men? U ask Blacks 2 do whites' work, 2?
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 It's not your responsability, but then, you don't get to claim that you are about equality for all. What you are commiting is the "No true Scottman Falacy" Where you say about those people who attacked Pother "Oh but they're not true feminist !" It's the same as when christian claim " Oh but those weren't true Christian"
oralyon 3 months ago
@oralyon I'm about equality 4 WOMEN; that's my priority. No, those ppl's motives informed by Muslim apologia, not by feminism. Period. If I say I'm vegetarian while eating a hamburger, I'm "no true Scotsman," now, am I? YOU called them "feminist;" they did not, nor do I, as a feminist. They're not unicorns, either.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 Eating a hamburger isn't vegetarian. The No True Scotsman fallacy doesn't apply here because the guidelines for the group has not been respected. If you were a vegetarian and you were eating some eggs then, yes, someone calling you 'no true vegetarian' would be making the NTS fallacy.
What is your point here?
IKillBabyKittensLOL 3 months ago
@IKillBabyKittensLOL It's an ANALOGY for ceiling Am's defenders, who use her gender as their argument for easy treatment, "feminist." They are not; they don't even define themselves as such & ceiling them "feminist" is disingenuous, a strawman argument. Even if they were to describe themselves as "feminist," just cuz someone appropriates a term doesn't mean they are what they call themselves, does it? guidelines 4 group have not been respected. exactly my point
rriverstone1 3 months ago
while i dont agree that the atheist community on YT is death, i like the video and you made some very good points. nice video :)
Aanthanur 3 months ago
@Aanthanur Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
I found a new person to subscribe to! :-)
Nice video!
fullygodfullyhuman 3 months ago
@fullygodfullyhuman Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
This was damn good video :) I think the atheist community is dead as it was though when everyone was united against creationists. I think a problem is that one cannot make community soley on disbelife. I mean two atheists can disagree everything and onlu hold the disbelive.
All love from me Jasmine
Eopyk 3 months ago
@Eopyk I think we have a moral duty to model life beyond belief. These are very dark times. We could be activists, protecting children from charges of witchcraft, working in local communities to popularize science...particularly in low income neighborhoods, where churches prey on the vulnerable, etc. It's more than just disbelief. It's liberation from belief and I think we should pay it forward, for the sake of our species AND the rest of the planet.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@Eopyk Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
Excellent vid Rogi..True..Alienation only creates larger barriers..I do feel concerned & at times horrified by the hateful attacks on Islamic individuals..Ive always preferred science & exposure of inhumane practices as a means to reach fundamentalists..I do, however acknowledge, the horror of abuse perpetrated in the name of Allah & how at times I am so sickened that i, too want to yell abuse. I don't, however, i feel that these horrors will never cease.
777ren 3 months ago
@777ren Oh, I know the damage religion does, believe me. Even if they're not outright trying to kill you, they're either telling you how unworthy you are to live, how dirty you are or how thinking for one's self is damnable. I have the xian Taliban, to this day, playing in my head and have to consciously work to counteract that poison when it attacks me.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@777ren Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
I haz olive skin also :)
Klingschor 3 months ago
@Klingschor I has olives in my fridge. I is Heinz57: African American, Cherokee, English, Scottish and, for unknown reasons, Greek. I looks like white grrl, but hair is all confused.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1
I thought I looked "white" as well, but everyone thinks I'm Middle-Eastern: My Islamic Professor thought I was an Arab, AlmightyAtheismo thought I was Persian or Turkish, and now after this video ---> (/watch?v=ymZYRymwIvY) someone guessed me to be Pakistani.
Who's right? Is mystery :)
Klingschor 3 months ago
Best Vid yet. I wanted to defend TF but found i couldn't. This was a very honest & well thought out post & the more i watched the more i began to understand. Great Stuff.
bismarket 3 months ago
@bismarket oh, thanks. Mind you, TF has a LOT to offer. I think he's just gotten a fat head. I hope it's only temporary. Carl Sagan would slap the shit out of him...
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 I think he is too much a bigot to do that to be honest. One can hope still though. I wish he purely talked about science as well.
All love and respect
Eopyk 3 months ago
@Eopyk oh, he's busy, being a "tall tree." The phallic symbolism doesn't go unnoticed. Keeping the rest of us stunted and in the dark. Yeah, that's him. Have u seen his latest vid on the stagnation of YT atheism? He may be so stagnant he stinks, but the rest of us just need him to shut up long enough for the rest of us to get a chance. WildwoodClaire1 suggested today he do more "shout outs," pointing peeps 2 newer YouTubers. Gasp. Share the sun? Never!
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@Eopyk Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@bismarket Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
In my hiippie days, I wore the long skirts and peasant blouses because I was uncomfortable with my body and didn't know how to deal with "the male gaze". My momma hadn't taught me much while I was growing up. Eventually, I realized that it is not what you wear that causes men to rape women. The fact that fundamentalist Islamic women haven't figured this out doesn't mean they are stupid. btw long flowing robes can be sexy depending on how you wear them.
pirbird14 3 months ago
@pirbird14 I'm an incest and rape survivor. I am very protective of my body. Only those I select, and they're very high-caliber people, are privy to that intimacy. I empathize with the FEMINIST, Muslim argument that women ought to be respected as intellectual peers, not judged like cattle at an auction. I wonder if there's a theme among some atheist men: women should be available for men's pleasure. Hence, no modesty and NO boundaries about treating us professionally eg: Rebecca Watson.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 I think it's part and parcel of their intellectual arrogance. It's amazing how imbecilic some of these people become when they step outside their field of expertise. I first unsubbed from T'foot when he made his amateurish biblical criticism vid and refused to take critique from knowledgeable people. There are centuries of scholarly work into the questions of what religion is, how it came to be, the origins of Christianity, etc - but he refuses to look at it.
pirbird14 3 months ago
@pirbird14 Willful ignorance is probably my worst source of impatience. When an academic does it, I can barely restrain an impulse toward physical violence. Seriously. I studied to be a Unitarian Universalist minister, until the $ ran out. My fav. subjects were feminist exegeses of sacred texts. It's a real mind-blower. It adds to the profundity of what we can't even imagine has been lost from human culture because of the exclusion of women. Humility: not a natural, academic trait.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 I see you still have rhymaiden in your subbs. You know she closed down that channel and re-opened as WildwoodClaire? Also, have you checked out AngieAntiTheist? She live tweeted her abortion and did Youtube video of it. Very brave woman.
pirbird14 3 months ago
@pirbird14 Claire is on my sub list, or do u mean she was subbed to me (I find the latter hard to believe, as I'm very new here)? Thanks for the tip on AngieAntiTheist. I hadn't heard of her. What a brave person! I'll sub right now. Thanks!
rriverstone1 3 months ago
Awesome video. You said what I wanted to say, but didn't know how to say it. Thanks.
62netty 3 months ago
@62netty You can say it. Take your time. Don't be self conscious or worry what Other People Think. Turn on the camera and just say it to someone you trust. You can edit out all the stupidity later. I did. I hope.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 Thanks for the encouragement. I might give it a try one of these days.
62netty 3 months ago
@62netty Please do. You can set it to I think it's "private," so only people YOU give links to can see your video. I seriously believe self publication is transformative. We need to broadcast our experiences, network and build support. You've got mine. If you produce something, please send me a link, ok?
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@62netty Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
Where can i sign? I have downloaded all this videos to do my own answer, i will need a lot of time after i have finished my big video.
goxster 3 months ago
@goxster Guy, I didn't even expect to HEAR from you, 'til after you get that horse out of the barn! I'm flattered that you stopped by; this is a long video. You're already signed up, in my book, baby. I am honored that you want to address the topics in this. Take your time. Have some fun with those Turkish cigarettes, Cuban cigars and $1/liter European beers & excellent wines...oh, and the slender, Bavarian women. I'm so jealous! Mad love, Rogi! Info in Description
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@goxster Too bad you're in Bulgaria & have a girlfriend, and I'm in USA, and have no teeth! Not that I want to bite you, particularly.... LOL
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1
This makes biting more easy, you can always send the teeth by mail! ;-)
goxster 3 months ago
This is so eloquent and compassionate! You are brilliant, and you should be recognized as one of our generation's best writers. You are every bit as gifted as anyone who has been published and on a best-seller list. How do I mirror this onto my profile? Is it possible to do that on a mobile device?
TheWhimsicalMimzy 3 months ago
@TheWhimsicalMimzy I don't know how to do mobile things. I'll ask Atheist YouTube Community on FaceBook. Maybe someone there would know. Can you put a "download" app on your mobile? That's what I did, through FireFox. I have Download Helper, but there are others. Thanks for the gee whiz compliments. That wasn't written, by the way. It was a ramble. My hair was dirty, cuz it's been 2 cold 2 bathe and the lighting sucked, so I edited the audio and slapped on pictures. This is how I think . . .
rriverstone1 3 months ago
... You can also add it to your channel as a "favorite" or put it in a "playlist." It would still be on my channel, but folks could find it there, and so could you. I have NO plans to take this down, unless Thunderf00t files a DMCA against me....snicker
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@TheWhimsicalMimzy Thanks. Please "like" the video, if you haven't. Apparently, a horde of trolls has come to "dislike" my first serious attempt.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
It was good to see potholer and amenakin come together to condemn the hate speech on both sides. It was also good to see that Potholer stuck to his guns and that the DMCA request was not upheld; in a proper manner. For a moment, it felt like YouTube were about to bow to religion but ... heck, everyone has the right to be offended.
msknight5 3 months ago
@msknight5 Oh, I understood PH54's motives in that combined vid with Amenakin: the ethic of not insulting people and vilifying them, rather than actually conversing. I was very proud of PH54. I was also impressed that Amenakin admits her assertions that the theory of evolution is an argument 4 the superiority of while people was not founded on Darwin's book, and she's not sure where she got it. There's a kernel of doubt in her world view now. This is a good thing. Bashing her squandered that.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@rriverstone1 "Bashing her squandered that." - agreed.
msknight5 3 months ago
"Great minds talk about ideas, average minds about things and small minds about other people". I try to stay on the great to average end of things, but how does one separate the willful ignorance and superstition that leads to children being slaughtered as witches from people like Ray Comfort and Ken Ham who make millions promoting it? That said, you're dead on about the ivory tower atheists who regard the "lower eschelon atheists" like us with such undisguised contempt.
TheMudbrooker 3 months ago
@TheMudbrooker I think, for those who can actually stand to listen long enough to propagandists, in order to debunk them, that this work is necessary and helpful. For issues like the "witches" in Africa, I hope we can build alliances with, and help fund, if not volunteer for, organizations, even churches, who resist this cruelty. The people who've most expressed burn out are the meanest mouths out there in atheism. Good. Let them be quiet; others need a chance to speak. You're awesome.
rriverstone1 3 months ago
@TheMudbrooker I think, for those who can actually stand to listen long enough to propagandists, in order to debunk them, that this work is necessary and helpful. For issues like the "witches" in Africa, I hope we can build alliances with, and help fund, if not volunteer for, organizations, even churches, who resist this cruelty. The people who've most expressed burn out are the meanest mouths out there in atheism. Good. Let them be quiet; others need a chance to speak. You're awesome.
rriverstone1 3 months ago