This is brilliant! Thanks! This video has helped explain what I have always found to be a little too 'mysterious' about religion. The Mormon Church is really big on feeling the presence of the 'Holy Ghost' which will: act as a comforter, bring memories back to remembrance, act as a heavily messenger, and be a source of inspiration. This sort of role as a 'still small voice' and guide/companion is so easily explained by what this video presents (-:
Did you even watch this very video that you're commenting on? I cited FOURTEEN peer reviewed articles on how to induce hallucinations in people. And that was just a casual perusal in my own spare time. There are probably dozens, if not hundreds, more demonstrations out there in the scientific literature.
Empirical evidence says that human beings all experience hallucinations on a regular basis and use those false perceptions to arrive at erroneous conclusions about reality. It's all about cognitive bias.
if any god were actually out there trying to speak to anyone, we wouldnt need a god damned book telling us how to hear him. i cant believe people fall for that shit. and holy fuck 3:58 how can someone be this dumb. oh wait ive lived with people this dumb my whole life and still do. the dumber someone is the more faith they have. coincidence? no.
God speaks to his prophets and faithful via mental illness...Nice. Lots of credibility there. What is faith again? Oh yeah, determination to believe. Huh.
I think one of my friends must be an alien or have telekinesis or something because something lifted into the air and hit me in the face while we were all sitting there playing a videogame..
An oposing theory could that people who have been hit over the head, have experienced trauma or suffer from scitzophrenia are actually Gods chosen messengers. The messages they hear are actually God talking to them.
Take for instance nephilimfree - I think it is a fair guess that he has had a few to many blows over his head and now he has like a broadband connection directly to God.
And my proof for all of this is of cause all the wonderfull and true things he says on his videos
These are very good videos. I hope you keep making them. their educational value regardless og wether or not choose to accept applying them to religious settings is great.
However I don't think the inability for an internal voice to produce physical effects for example is NESSSECARILY proof of halucination, even if that is the most reasonable deduction. its not inconcievable that an real internal voice could be limited to just audio, such as if for example telepathy werelater proven to be fact.
@TheStigma Note that I don't say that people shoud think this, but I think it would have been better worded as something like "... you have no evidence based reason to think that it is anything else than a common hallucination" rather than wording it as "an admission if common hallucinations".
I am basically just disagreeing slightly on the semantics of your point though I agree with it.
"the inability for an internal voice to produce physical effects for example is NESSSECARILY proof of halucination,"
The voice may or may not be coming from a telepathy, but we do have a purely natural explanation for where that voice could be coming from without it. We also have a long human history hearing things that aren't real. So without any compelling reason to think otherwise, Occam's razor forces us to conclude that all such experiences are hallucinations.
@AntiCitizenX In practice we think alike, but I think it would be more prudent to say that all such experiences are allmost certainly hallucinations (slight wording difference). Its a suble distinction I'm making between claiming absolute certainty, and only being very very certain that such is the case. Yes yes, I'm being nitpicky, sorry ;)
You're basically echoing me with different words. I personally prefer the modifier "without any compelling reason to think otherwise." This way we don't have to mince words about relative certainty. We can rest assured in absolute certainty, because that certainty is always tentative. That is to say, the conclusion is 100% certain, but the assumptions are not. But since evidence determines our assumptions, they remain valid until something better comes along.
You seem to have a particular interest in the Mormon faith; I was wondering if you were located in the Salt Lake area. I don't know if there is a way to talk out of the comments section in here via email or something similar, but I would seriously like to buy you lunch some time and pick your brain.
Love Richie D at the end! Lol. Btw you're awesome...I love the psychological approach! I think it would be more beneficial if some of my fellow atheists would spend less time being blindly angry towards religious people for their ignorance, and more time delving into why they believe what they do, and finding ways to prevent that mental gap for future generations. Keep doing what you do---it is much appreciated!
I did an experiment on myself when I was 15. I keep thinking about demons and noises I couldn't make out, which were generated by an AC. I keep thinking, what if they're evil spirits. I tricked myself into thinking they were because of biased beliefs. Every time I heard noises I couldn't make out, I made the same conclusions. It was obvious I knew where the nosies came from but my biased beliefs made them what they weren't.
Were you actually hearing what seemed to be voices? Or impressions? What did they actually sound like when you tried to find some kind of pattern?
This kind of reminds me of a game I used to play when I was a kid. When in a very dark room, just stare blankly at a friend's face. After 10-15 seconds, your eyes will relax a little, and the face will contort into some hideous deformation as your mind tries to fill in the blanks. It's a great game for cheap scares.
@AntiCitizenX I wasn't literally hearing voices but yes, trying to find patterns. The patterns sounded like distorted whispers. The AC was in the living room while I was in the bed room. My cousins and me used to play that game in the dark, stare at darkness and make out what it is. Pretty fun.
@amoxtlacatl The really hard part is finding actual videos of religious people openly exploiting a particular bias. However, I'd like to do at least one more video to summarize and conclude things.
The format of the pwnage video where the religious' factual mistakes and/or lies are exposed is very educational.
Your analysis in your videos cuts way deeper than that.
When pure types of bias to cover finally run out, could you possibly flesh out longer clips of preachers and others to show how they intertwine these biases in real time as they speak?
I picture it an exhaustingly complicated task - and an unquestionably educational gift to us all.
The great value in your analysis is that you go beyond WHAT they get wrong and show us HOW (even WHY) they and we all can get it wrong - and how we can be deceived and manipulated by them and others.
This is why I encourage you to do that "real-time" analysis.
I guess it must be a world of work - but at least finding videos with pure types of bias would no longer be a problem.
Kudos to you for your already great public service.
to bad that I dont have any voices in my head to show for,
a well the visual hallucinations during strong headaches make partially up for it
(totally fuck up of depth perception).
BTW is it just me(who perceives that) or are people here willing to disclose secrets they would otherwise never have told just because the topic comes up in a (well made) youtube video?(just to bud in/contribute on/to the topic?)
Yes I am! And thanks for the interest and encouragement. It's hard work making these things, and my time is limited, so at best I can only crank one out every month or two.
@AntiCitizenX If you ever want any help with research or anything like that, feel free to ask me. You probably don't, but, hey, I thought I'd offer. I'm nineteen and recently left the LDS church and BYU and am more than willing to help your cause! Lol.
That depends. Are you any good at digging through the peer-reviewed journals? Any expertise in psychology? Or anthropology? Any good with video-editing software? Got lots of free-time to waste?
Cool! Were you going through any spiritual crisis at the time? Or did it just come out at random? And was it accompanied by any strong emotional aspect as well? Like some deep sense of comfort or certainty?
There is a point of view; human desires are often insatiable and driven by an internal Ego, or desire to persist, fear of death. You can even think of this in biological terms, as an organism perpetuating itself and seeking its own existence, at least until it fulfills it's destiny, which is usually procreation and the continuation of the organisms lineage. Its like a perpetual grasping at life. But if you calm this grasping many erroneous thought patterns like you describe cease, truth is clear
@Rybot9000 If this practice were at all genuine, perhaps it could earn the title of "Voice of God", but its difficult to know if it is genuine in one's self, let alone anyone else. The idea, essentially being, that the human ego is antithetical to a true perception. The ego being the sense of existence inherited from object relations and perceptually blocked from knowing that it is entirely empty in and of itself. To exist it needs to identify or latch onto an identity. Like idolatry.
@Rybot9000 See, now I've primed you with God speak, and you may be at risk of preforming judgments based on it, as am I to the extent that I'm controlled by certain desires. Rather, might I ask, where is the doer? Who is the one that does things? Take a look at modern psychology and ask yourself where the individual is. Look at the human brain and see if you can find some-one. Who does anything? We have a strong tendency to believe 'I' am doing something.
@Rybot9000 Effectively everything gets asserted to be laws, which are usually termed causal or contiguous or related. In any case all things are believed to be rational. So what is rational? Perhaps it is rational who is the doer? If that is the case no one besides rational does or did anything. Would it be unfit to call rational God? Would it be unfit to say 'He' does everything? Maybe anthropomorphic aspect of religion provides a gateway to intellectually lazy people to some realization.
@Rybot9000 Also, I think everything in psychology can be reduced to a natural tendency to conceive of one's own existence as independent and separated from the rest of reality. As if one actually existed as a person driving themselves, and not simply as an observer along for the ride, or perhaps something else. It is not simply the tendency, as much as it is a deep desire to exist as such., and to deny the fact that we don't. Also the God-as-other idol is worshiped in various imaginations.
Nice vid! It's maybe not so relevant, but speaking as someone with bipolar disorder - I can vouch for hallucinations but also, in full blown mania, the belief that they are real.
I once saw superman(lol) and I believed it was him, and beyond belief, more like knowledge, I KNEW it was him - sound familiar?
I'm lucky in that for me it will stop and be followed by acute embarassment that I actually went round telling people that, it seems like some people never get past that state.
@AntiCitizenX I have a question: How do they keep the objectivity in the experiments in your videos? I love science, and I'm curious to the scientific side of psychology. People have told me, and after few minutes of browsing on Google also tells me that psychology is not a purely scientific subject, that it is only partial. What do you have to say to this?
I've had some thoughts about this as well. Some aspects of psychology are hugely experimental, but others sometimes feel like people making stuff up. I think much of the older Freudian psychology was very "made up," while much of the newer psychology is very experimentally based. The best advice I can give is that whenever someone makes a psychological claim, ask "how do you know that?" If they can cite the experiments, they're probably more trustworthy.
@AntiCitizenX How about the 'accuracy'? A friend of mine suggested that there are always outliers, and because the human mind and behavior are so complex and varying, it will never be completely accurate. He said that was different in other sciences, where you could make a prediction and it would come true (granted it was already experimented and 'proven').
Human behavior certainly has outliers, but it also has very predictable properties on a statistical level. No one is claiming to fully predict individual behavior. We are only talking about overall behavior of lots of people in large numbers over a long time.
I hear voices all of the time. It is usually when everything is quiet or I'm trying to fall asleep. It's not like I'm ever told to do anything, I just suddenly here a voice (or just a sound sometimes) that is actually audible.
As for the non-audible voices, I long ago realized that those were just me talking to myself. Of course if you want to believe then you will use whatever evidence you can get your hands on.
@AntiCitizenX Your videos are of high quality. More than the usual simple rants often to be found in that they contain substance. If you fancy the chance of 'plugging' yourself then I'm sure Jon Donnis of BadPsychicsdotcodotuk would love to have a short audio piece for his podcast 'The badcast' which I believe gets around 30,000 listeners weekly.
I have heard voices before...most commonly I'll hear someone call my name when nobody is around. After a few seconds I'll realize that it only occurred in my mind but it is still a weird phenomenon.
Damnit! Damnit! Damnit! Why did the first generation of our species have to be inbreed and cause such genetic damage to our weak little brains to make the stupid people dumber
Rarey, after lack of sleep and in an environment with white(ish) noise (such as a noisy fan heater) I hear what used to be described as "Raudive voices." Mostly I can't make out words, it just sounds like the pattern of speech. Sometimes I can make out words, but they tend to be repetitive. Occasionally it sounds like singing (but could be next door playing music loud).
I've never thought it was God. It's just my brain detecting patterns that aren't really there.
Funny how the first guy talks about how you will FEAR God. Remember God loves ya but thinks he should kick your ass. Why is it that God being all powerful can't just get a cell phone and call someone?
Yeah, there's a lot of inconsistencies between stories. Some people hear audible voices while others hear intrusions. Some hear "you will learn to fear me" while others hear "I love you." Some even hear mundane crap like "don't buy that."
how come those voices never tell hot girls to go have sex with fat looser bastards like me? I mean.. they're already telling a bunch of crap to lots of people, and some of that crap have caused serious damage such as holy wars. The aim of the voices seems to remain in "human destruction and/or humiliation" so why not reducing the aftermath of the voice-prompted action to... guilt at the next morning and social suicide. That would be less harmful than genocide, right?
another amazing video. its funny how ONLY religious people tend to hear gods voice, i mean, when was the last time you heard an atheist yammering about having heard gods voice...seriously
Religions (as I see it) have been logically digging their own grave for a long time now; this video series has been finally shoveling the dirt back on top of them. This vid in particular, has shoveled another (and rather large) pile of dirt into the grave of any credible religion. You are seriously under-subscribed! Keep up the shoveling, and well done!
I've had MANY drug induced voices pop into my head, some of them with the most informative shit I had ever heard. They were so clear I was able to determine that I was simply hearing lectrures that I had listened to earlier in the week.
While watching this, and in a relaxed state, I definitely heard a voice in my head. it must have been a demon, as I was ordered to go outside for a smoke. Naturally, I obeyed, for fear of some punishment.
I fully expect to receive some divine message regarding my need to go and make some coffee at any moment.
I guess that it must. Where else would an addictive chemical effect of this kind take place other than, ultimately, in the brain. n addition, however, aside from the addiction, there are associated effects on other organs of the body, whether induced by alcohol, nicotine or any other 'foreign' substance. It is the addiction that is the psychological disturbance to the natural balance.
Note the the addiction to a god is a direct psychological problem, which manifests in 'voices'.
Your cognitive bias influence chart is becoming quite large and interesting! Any chance you have a link to the JPG or original source? I'd love to print it out and hang it on my wall.
When I was younger (mid 20's) I clanked my head and had to go to hospital with a concussion and one of the things they told me was that I was likely to hear voices. According to the nurse it was routine that people with head trauma got them and that I should be warned before hand so as to not get a shock.
When I did hear them I swear they were like someone was in the room. I can see why some would not be able to differ reality from hallucination.
It's not just hallucination, it's cultural indoctrination. Many people will think that they hear voices just by coming in contact with other people who think that they do. This reinforces their belief as well. When I was seven, my parents were considering getting a minivan and I prayed to god asking if it was his will that we got one. I legitimately thought that I heard "Wait a while" whispered to me. And sure enough, we did not get a minivan immediately, but a few months later. (Contd)
To make things better, the dealer who was trying to sell my parents the minivan coincidentally couldn't be found when they wanted to make the sale. I told them about my prayer afterward and this reinforced my belief that I had indeed heard the voice of god. This anecdotal proof was used as a justification for my faith for long time before I no longer considered it a legitimate experience.
Even on top of all this, there seems to be a slight implication that the claims of "hearing the voice of God" are all actually instances where there was auditory (in this case) input.
You can't just stop at it being hallucinations, there will be a percentage (albeit, probably low) who will become so entrenched in the culture that they will trick themselves into "hearing" the voice of a deity even when no "voice" was heard at the time.
I do not intend to claim that hallucinations explain everything. Just look at the chart at 7:30. Hallucination is just a tiny little contributor in the grand scheme. Watch video 4 in the series. Misinformation effect is a great way to hear God's voice without any hallucinations.
@AntiCitizenX "I do not intend to claim that halllucinations explain everything."
I didn't mean to imply that you were. I was just saying that even in the context of hearing or seeing things, it's not necessarily going to be from an hallucination. There's a use to pointing out the obvious connections.
@AntiCitizenX "What alternative mechanisms are you suggesting here?"
That they added the stimulus in after the fact. You said it yourself, the misinformation effect.
They had an experience, and because of the people/culture around them, they started "remembering" voices that were never actually there. With each time they "remember", the memory becomes more vivid and "clear". If you asked them right after the event, they'd say they saw/heard nothing, so I'm not sure it's an hallucination.
"That they added the stimulus in after the fact. You said it yourself, the misinformation effect."
This is something I wanted to address, but did not have time in the video. In fact, if you un-mute the black lady at 1:05, she actually describes God's voice as something that can only be recognized "after the fact." That is, you think you heard something, then something good happens, so AHA! That was God!
@AntiCitizenX "if you un-mute the black lady at 1:05, she actually describes God's voice as something that can only be recognized "after the fact.""
I was actually wondering what her method for determining God's voice was... I've heard a lot of people claim they hear God, but not once have I heard a reasonable explanation of how they are so sure it is God, and not say, Satan.
Okay, I think I understand your criticism. These videos should not be taken in isolation, but rather compiled together as a whole. I did not intend to imply that all "voices" are hallucinations, but rather that many of the vivid ones can be explained as such. Going back to videos 2-4, it is easy to see how many other mechanisms can create the memory of a voice without ever actually hearing anything at all; which is what I believe you were driving at.
I don't think Cyrathil was criticizing. I think he/she was making a distinction between a hallucination, and simply convincing yourself due to a combination of confirmation bias, and wishful thinking, that the ordinary voice we all have in our heads when we're sort of talking to ourselves, is the voice of God.
Can happen early in life, too, if Mom or Dad dropped you on your head!
brettppalmer 1 month ago
Never had one..was medically dead for way too long to explain recovery.
Lots of evidence of efficacy (That's scientific for it actually worked) in NON-conventional healing practices.
Radiathesia,radionics are grotesquely suppressed for just such reasons.
YES fraud and self delusional hallucinations are evidence of something but certainly NOT the existence for or against GOD.
Again NON-SEQUITOR
You continue to attempt to use a FLAWED logic to support a conclusion.
philopolymath 1 month ago
I wonder if God also told Terri to bleach her hair and get a spray tan.
Joosybum 2 months ago
The human mind is higly suceptible to hallucinations
Which is yet another great example of how badly "designed" we are, put quite simply, we suck, big time
IVscythia 2 months ago
That "last theorem" looks a lot like the Pythagorean theorem.
FlowCell 2 months ago
@FlowCell it was born from it.
TheDcac 2 months ago
This is brilliant! Thanks! This video has helped explain what I have always found to be a little too 'mysterious' about religion. The Mormon Church is really big on feeling the presence of the 'Holy Ghost' which will: act as a comforter, bring memories back to remembrance, act as a heavily messenger, and be a source of inspiration. This sort of role as a 'still small voice' and guide/companion is so easily explained by what this video presents (-:
GiveCourage 4 months ago
@BigMarkusFella No difference.
petion2010 4 months ago
@BigMarkusFella
Did you even watch this very video that you're commenting on? I cited FOURTEEN peer reviewed articles on how to induce hallucinations in people. And that was just a casual perusal in my own spare time. There are probably dozens, if not hundreds, more demonstrations out there in the scientific literature.
AntiCitizenX 6 months ago 17
@AntiCitizenX Gee, no response from bigmarkus. What a surprise.
richwfd2002 4 months ago
@BigMarkusFella
I have experimental demonstrations to back me up. What do you have?
AntiCitizenX 6 months ago 6
@BigMarkusFella
Empirical evidence says that human beings all experience hallucinations on a regular basis and use those false perceptions to arrive at erroneous conclusions about reality. It's all about cognitive bias.
AntiCitizenX 6 months ago 15
I would suggest that the 'Hearing your own name in the supermarket' (or any location with noises, really) is just audible paradolia/apophenia.
COEXISTential 7 months ago
I have discovered a truly marvelous proof of Fermat's Last Theorem, which this comment is too narrow to contain.
piprod01 7 months ago
Moses must have been smoking something when he heard a voice from a burning bush!
BigFatHeretic 8 months ago
there's another trigger that gets everyone
it's internal dialogue
we all have it, and it rarely disagrees with us
GodsArePeopleToo 9 months ago
if any god were actually out there trying to speak to anyone, we wouldnt need a god damned book telling us how to hear him. i cant believe people fall for that shit. and holy fuck 3:58 how can someone be this dumb. oh wait ive lived with people this dumb my whole life and still do. the dumber someone is the more faith they have. coincidence? no.
LordHines420 9 months ago
God speaks to his prophets and faithful via mental illness...Nice. Lots of credibility there. What is faith again? Oh yeah, determination to believe. Huh.
Ahabite 11 months ago
“To one who has faith, no explanation is necessary. To one without faith, no explanation is possible.” - St. Thomas Aquinas
Though I still got a lot of reason for my belief, I even wrote a book about it.
AncientAeon 1 year ago
Man, I wish I'd known all this growing up. Mom heard voices of dead people and sometimes "God."
KaraRvn 1 year ago
Proof NDEs are just hallucinations: Do Christians ever see Allah and Mohammed in their NDEs? Do Muslims ever see Yahweh and Jesus in their NDEs?
FUCKyourGODmyth 1 year ago
Love the way you use ACTUAL footage of believers falling into these traps. Great work.
simcult 1 year ago
I think one of my friends must be an alien or have telekinesis or something because something lifted into the air and hit me in the face while we were all sitting there playing a videogame..
sozoid 1 year ago
often the feelings I have..
they are not really voices just feelings..
are completely correct when i reveal the top 10 cards of a deck of cards..
the psycic abilitites helped me get good grades on tests in school several times..
but I completely see them as useless because the mind it'sself gets no excersise if I just use them all the time..
sozoid 1 year ago
I never had any audible conversations with God and I am an AVID believer.. I have only had dreams with God telling me something through the dream..
sozoid 1 year ago
"Consider the following experiment."
These four words now strike fear into the heart of true believers everywhere! LOL.
vryc 1 year ago 2
An oposing theory could that people who have been hit over the head, have experienced trauma or suffer from scitzophrenia are actually Gods chosen messengers. The messages they hear are actually God talking to them.
Take for instance nephilimfree - I think it is a fair guess that he has had a few to many blows over his head and now he has like a broadband connection directly to God.
And my proof for all of this is of cause all the wonderfull and true things he says on his videos
henriktor 1 year ago
These are very good videos. I hope you keep making them. their educational value regardless og wether or not choose to accept applying them to religious settings is great.
However I don't think the inability for an internal voice to produce physical effects for example is NESSSECARILY proof of halucination, even if that is the most reasonable deduction. its not inconcievable that an real internal voice could be limited to just audio, such as if for example telepathy werelater proven to be fact.
TheStigma 1 year ago
@TheStigma Note that I don't say that people shoud think this, but I think it would have been better worded as something like "... you have no evidence based reason to think that it is anything else than a common hallucination" rather than wording it as "an admission if common hallucinations".
I am basically just disagreeing slightly on the semantics of your point though I agree with it.
TheStigma 1 year ago
@TheStigma
"the inability for an internal voice to produce physical effects for example is NESSSECARILY proof of halucination,"
The voice may or may not be coming from a telepathy, but we do have a purely natural explanation for where that voice could be coming from without it. We also have a long human history hearing things that aren't real. So without any compelling reason to think otherwise, Occam's razor forces us to conclude that all such experiences are hallucinations.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX In practice we think alike, but I think it would be more prudent to say that all such experiences are allmost certainly hallucinations (slight wording difference). Its a suble distinction I'm making between claiming absolute certainty, and only being very very certain that such is the case. Yes yes, I'm being nitpicky, sorry ;)
TheStigma 1 year ago
@TheStigma
You're basically echoing me with different words. I personally prefer the modifier "without any compelling reason to think otherwise." This way we don't have to mince words about relative certainty. We can rest assured in absolute certainty, because that certainty is always tentative. That is to say, the conclusion is 100% certain, but the assumptions are not. But since evidence determines our assumptions, they remain valid until something better comes along.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago 7
You seem to have a particular interest in the Mormon faith; I was wondering if you were located in the Salt Lake area. I don't know if there is a way to talk out of the comments section in here via email or something similar, but I would seriously like to buy you lunch some time and pick your brain.
parswarr 1 year ago
@parswarr
You can always send me a private message (PM).
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
self awareness ftw
oggleman 1 year ago
Sound in the deep HZ can also cause hallucinations. just a tip. ;)
EnervatedSociety 1 year ago
Love Richie D at the end! Lol. Btw you're awesome...I love the psychological approach! I think it would be more beneficial if some of my fellow atheists would spend less time being blindly angry towards religious people for their ignorance, and more time delving into why they believe what they do, and finding ways to prevent that mental gap for future generations. Keep doing what you do---it is much appreciated!
badassmixedchick 1 year ago
@badassmixedchick
Richie D? Oh, Richard Dawkins! LOL... I had to think about that for a second.
Thanks for the kind feedback.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX Lol! Yea I thought I'd give him an endearing nickname. I've grown rather fond of the old guy....lol. Keep up the good work. :)
badassmixedchick 1 year ago
@badassmixedchick Ditto, you saved me the chore of writing a reply. Thanks.
colourmegone 1 year ago
@colourmegone You're welcome :)
badassmixedchick 1 year ago
I did an experiment on myself when I was 15. I keep thinking about demons and noises I couldn't make out, which were generated by an AC. I keep thinking, what if they're evil spirits. I tricked myself into thinking they were because of biased beliefs. Every time I heard noises I couldn't make out, I made the same conclusions. It was obvious I knew where the nosies came from but my biased beliefs made them what they weren't.
HybridD91 1 year ago
@HybridD91
Were you actually hearing what seemed to be voices? Or impressions? What did they actually sound like when you tried to find some kind of pattern?
This kind of reminds me of a game I used to play when I was a kid. When in a very dark room, just stare blankly at a friend's face. After 10-15 seconds, your eyes will relax a little, and the face will contort into some hideous deformation as your mind tries to fill in the blanks. It's a great game for cheap scares.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX I wasn't literally hearing voices but yes, trying to find patterns. The patterns sounded like distorted whispers. The AC was in the living room while I was in the bed room. My cousins and me used to play that game in the dark, stare at darkness and make out what it is. Pretty fun.
HybridD91 1 year ago
Dear AntiCitizenX,
I have found your excellent "Psychology of Belief" extremely informative and valuable.
Is it now complete or are you planning on adding to it?
Thank you.
amoxtlacatl 1 year ago
@amoxtlacatl The really hard part is finding actual videos of religious people openly exploiting a particular bias. However, I'd like to do at least one more video to summarize and conclude things.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX
A bold suggestion:
The format of the pwnage video where the religious' factual mistakes and/or lies are exposed is very educational.
Your analysis in your videos cuts way deeper than that.
When pure types of bias to cover finally run out, could you possibly flesh out longer clips of preachers and others to show how they intertwine these biases in real time as they speak?
I picture it an exhaustingly complicated task - and an unquestionably educational gift to us all.
Thx.
amoxtlacatl 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX
You know the following, but let me say it.
The great value in your analysis is that you go beyond WHAT they get wrong and show us HOW (even WHY) they and we all can get it wrong - and how we can be deceived and manipulated by them and others.
This is why I encourage you to do that "real-time" analysis.
I guess it must be a world of work - but at least finding videos with pure types of bias would no longer be a problem.
Kudos to you for your already great public service.
amoxtlacatl 1 year ago 2
to bad that I dont have any voices in my head to show for,
a well the visual hallucinations during strong headaches make partially up for it
(totally fuck up of depth perception).
BTW is it just me(who perceives that) or are people here willing to disclose secrets they would otherwise never have told just because the topic comes up in a (well made) youtube video?(just to bud in/contribute on/to the topic?)
DeHerg 1 year ago
Are you working on a new video yet? I LOVE your videos and am checking daily for new ones. Keep up the good work!
ZhangShantian 1 year ago
@ZhangShantian
Yes I am! And thanks for the interest and encouragement. It's hard work making these things, and my time is limited, so at best I can only crank one out every month or two.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX If you ever want any help with research or anything like that, feel free to ask me. You probably don't, but, hey, I thought I'd offer. I'm nineteen and recently left the LDS church and BYU and am more than willing to help your cause! Lol.
ZhangShantian 1 year ago
@ZhangShantian
That depends. Are you any good at digging through the peer-reviewed journals? Any expertise in psychology? Or anthropology? Any good with video-editing software? Got lots of free-time to waste?
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
Are you working on a new video yet? I LOVE your videos and am constantly waiting for new ones to come out!
ZhangShantian 1 year ago
I've heard voices like this... I woke up from sleep one night, and heard.. "Just believe, Brandon (my name)... Just believe..."
DynamitePanda 1 year ago
@DynamitePanda
Cool! Were you going through any spiritual crisis at the time? Or did it just come out at random? And was it accompanied by any strong emotional aspect as well? Like some deep sense of comfort or certainty?
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
There is a point of view; human desires are often insatiable and driven by an internal Ego, or desire to persist, fear of death. You can even think of this in biological terms, as an organism perpetuating itself and seeking its own existence, at least until it fulfills it's destiny, which is usually procreation and the continuation of the organisms lineage. Its like a perpetual grasping at life. But if you calm this grasping many erroneous thought patterns like you describe cease, truth is clear
Rybot9000 1 year ago
@Rybot9000 If this practice were at all genuine, perhaps it could earn the title of "Voice of God", but its difficult to know if it is genuine in one's self, let alone anyone else. The idea, essentially being, that the human ego is antithetical to a true perception. The ego being the sense of existence inherited from object relations and perceptually blocked from knowing that it is entirely empty in and of itself. To exist it needs to identify or latch onto an identity. Like idolatry.
Rybot9000 1 year ago
@Rybot9000 See, now I've primed you with God speak, and you may be at risk of preforming judgments based on it, as am I to the extent that I'm controlled by certain desires. Rather, might I ask, where is the doer? Who is the one that does things? Take a look at modern psychology and ask yourself where the individual is. Look at the human brain and see if you can find some-one. Who does anything? We have a strong tendency to believe 'I' am doing something.
Rybot9000 1 year ago
@Rybot9000 Effectively everything gets asserted to be laws, which are usually termed causal or contiguous or related. In any case all things are believed to be rational. So what is rational? Perhaps it is rational who is the doer? If that is the case no one besides rational does or did anything. Would it be unfit to call rational God? Would it be unfit to say 'He' does everything? Maybe anthropomorphic aspect of religion provides a gateway to intellectually lazy people to some realization.
Rybot9000 1 year ago
@Rybot9000 Also, I think everything in psychology can be reduced to a natural tendency to conceive of one's own existence as independent and separated from the rest of reality. As if one actually existed as a person driving themselves, and not simply as an observer along for the ride, or perhaps something else. It is not simply the tendency, as much as it is a deep desire to exist as such., and to deny the fact that we don't. Also the God-as-other idol is worshiped in various imaginations.
Rybot9000 1 year ago
Wow...this was a huge eye-opener. Thank you!
KaraRvn 1 year ago
I'm pretty sure it's the echo in her bubblehead she's hearing.
PathogensQuest 1 year ago
Another great video. I hope you keep making more as time permits =)
jorsher123 1 year ago
Nice vid! It's maybe not so relevant, but speaking as someone with bipolar disorder - I can vouch for hallucinations but also, in full blown mania, the belief that they are real.
I once saw superman(lol) and I believed it was him, and beyond belief, more like knowledge, I KNEW it was him - sound familiar?
I'm lucky in that for me it will stop and be followed by acute embarassment that I actually went round telling people that, it seems like some people never get past that state.
wtfthatsrandum 1 year ago 17
@wtfthatsrandum
Thanks for sharing that! While researching this video I was really surprised to learn how common this stuff is.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@wtfthatsrandum Being able to meet Superman allmost seems like it would make up for the occational bouts of mania ;)
TheStigma 1 year ago
I'm a huge fan of your videos! I love the catchphrase, "Consider ..the following experiment!" Man, your videos make me want to study psychology.
Antixianos 1 year ago 3
@Antixianos
All right! Somebody is actually noticing my catch phrase! I love it when people pick up on those little things :)
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX I have a question: How do they keep the objectivity in the experiments in your videos? I love science, and I'm curious to the scientific side of psychology. People have told me, and after few minutes of browsing on Google also tells me that psychology is not a purely scientific subject, that it is only partial. What do you have to say to this?
Antixianos 1 year ago
@Antixianos
I've had some thoughts about this as well. Some aspects of psychology are hugely experimental, but others sometimes feel like people making stuff up. I think much of the older Freudian psychology was very "made up," while much of the newer psychology is very experimentally based. The best advice I can give is that whenever someone makes a psychological claim, ask "how do you know that?" If they can cite the experiments, they're probably more trustworthy.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX How about the 'accuracy'? A friend of mine suggested that there are always outliers, and because the human mind and behavior are so complex and varying, it will never be completely accurate. He said that was different in other sciences, where you could make a prediction and it would come true (granted it was already experimented and 'proven').
Antixianos 1 year ago
@Antixianos
Human behavior certainly has outliers, but it also has very predictable properties on a statistical level. No one is claiming to fully predict individual behavior. We are only talking about overall behavior of lots of people in large numbers over a long time.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
I hear voices all of the time. It is usually when everything is quiet or I'm trying to fall asleep. It's not like I'm ever told to do anything, I just suddenly here a voice (or just a sound sometimes) that is actually audible.
As for the non-audible voices, I long ago realized that those were just me talking to myself. Of course if you want to believe then you will use whatever evidence you can get your hands on.
Viperzka 1 year ago
Very well put together. I've just linked to one of them on my site BadReligiondotcodotuk and shall be putting more up over the next few days.
memrjohnno 1 year ago
@memrjohnno
Thank you for the plug! I'm honored.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX Your videos are of high quality. More than the usual simple rants often to be found in that they contain substance. If you fancy the chance of 'plugging' yourself then I'm sure Jon Donnis of BadPsychicsdotcodotuk would love to have a short audio piece for his podcast 'The badcast' which I believe gets around 30,000 listeners weekly.
memrjohnno 1 year ago
I have heard voices before...most commonly I'll hear someone call my name when nobody is around. After a few seconds I'll realize that it only occurred in my mind but it is still a weird phenomenon.
TheRatsmith 1 year ago
@TheRatsmith same happen to me! they usually mention my name
hedleypanama 1 year ago
@TheRatsmith
"After a few seconds I'll realize that it only occurred in my mind but it is still a weird phenomenon."
No, that was angels. They like to randomly call your name. Check the Bible.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago 2
Damnit! Damnit! Damnit! Why did the first generation of our species have to be inbreed and cause such genetic damage to our weak little brains to make the stupid people dumber
9noitulover 1 year ago
God spoke to me once, but it was in Latin. Drat.
rationalmuscle 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Great video in a great series!
but wait... what is that...
a voice? God's voice?
oh no nevermind. its just darkmatter2525's profile open in another tab
El3ctricPenguin 1 year ago
Comment removed
anoyingfly 1 year ago
Another excellent made video. Thank you
tombatom 1 year ago
Women at 0:41 looks like a ganguro. 0-o
HomoCyborgZombie 1 year ago
my cat fetches :D
LMFAO great video
defect530 1 year ago
Thanks a lot for this series. They are super interesting!
simsi1616 1 year ago
@simsi1616
You're welcome!
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
Rarey, after lack of sleep and in an environment with white(ish) noise (such as a noisy fan heater) I hear what used to be described as "Raudive voices." Mostly I can't make out words, it just sounds like the pattern of speech. Sometimes I can make out words, but they tend to be repetitive. Occasionally it sounds like singing (but could be next door playing music loud).
I've never thought it was God. It's just my brain detecting patterns that aren't really there.
bdf2718 1 year ago
Funny how the first guy talks about how you will FEAR God. Remember God loves ya but thinks he should kick your ass. Why is it that God being all powerful can't just get a cell phone and call someone?
vashcat 1 year ago 2
@vashcat
Yeah, there's a lot of inconsistencies between stories. Some people hear audible voices while others hear intrusions. Some hear "you will learn to fear me" while others hear "I love you." Some even hear mundane crap like "don't buy that."
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX what about the "simulacrum" described by evid3nc3?
hedleypanama 1 year ago
how come those voices never tell hot girls to go have sex with fat looser bastards like me? I mean.. they're already telling a bunch of crap to lots of people, and some of that crap have caused serious damage such as holy wars. The aim of the voices seems to remain in "human destruction and/or humiliation" so why not reducing the aftermath of the voice-prompted action to... guilt at the next morning and social suicide. That would be less harmful than genocide, right?
Viperion444 1 year ago 10
@Viperion444
"how come those voices never tell hot girls to go have sex with fat looser bastards like me?"
If the voices aren't working, then try the compliance techniques from Part 5. Statistically speaking, you're bound to score sooner or later. :)
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX
hehe, I've just watched part 5, and you're right. Unfortunately I have a conscience, that kinda keeps me from luring the hotties into my web.
Great videos btw (I think that was the point I was trying to make all the time :P)
Viperion444 1 year ago
@Viperion444 lmao good one
jorsher123 1 year ago
another amazing video. its funny how ONLY religious people tend to hear gods voice, i mean, when was the last time you heard an atheist yammering about having heard gods voice...seriously
CrazyWoWGamer 1 year ago
What's that sandvich? Kill them all? Good idea!
gpdl00355 1 year ago
Religions (as I see it) have been logically digging their own grave for a long time now; this video series has been finally shoveling the dirt back on top of them. This vid in particular, has shoveled another (and rather large) pile of dirt into the grave of any credible religion. You are seriously under-subscribed! Keep up the shoveling, and well done!
charkopolis 1 year ago
I've had MANY drug induced voices pop into my head, some of them with the most informative shit I had ever heard. They were so clear I was able to determine that I was simply hearing lectrures that I had listened to earlier in the week.
exconguitar 1 year ago
While watching this, and in a relaxed state, I definitely heard a voice in my head. it must have been a demon, as I was ordered to go outside for a smoke. Naturally, I obeyed, for fear of some punishment.
I fully expect to receive some divine message regarding my need to go and make some coffee at any moment.
I will submit and obey.
draagon66 1 year ago
@draagon66
That's an interesting insight. Do you think a nicotine craving qualifies as a psychological intrusion?
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX
I guess that it must. Where else would an addictive chemical effect of this kind take place other than, ultimately, in the brain. n addition, however, aside from the addiction, there are associated effects on other organs of the body, whether induced by alcohol, nicotine or any other 'foreign' substance. It is the addiction that is the psychological disturbance to the natural balance.
Note the the addiction to a god is a direct psychological problem, which manifests in 'voices'.
draagon66 1 year ago
lol, if I was gullible- I would might think that my returning sleep paralysis would be a demon or god fucking with me xD
KaptajnKaffe 1 year ago
oh man, I LOVE the "voice of god" crap
Craigipedia 1 year ago
Your best one yet. Very informative. I had intrusions all the time as a believer, assumed it was from god.
anubis2814 1 year ago
@anubis2814
I think the intrusion idea is probably the most pervasive. I heard the "Still small voice" idea a lot growing up.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
0:38 - LOL oompaloompa!
TheCaptainLulz 1 year ago
Your cognitive bias influence chart is becoming quite large and interesting! Any chance you have a link to the JPG or original source? I'd love to print it out and hang it on my wall.
soulure 1 year ago
@soulure
"Any chance you have a link to the JPG or original source?"
I think we can arrange that. You want one right away or maybe wait until the series is done?
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX Thank you! I am happy to wait until the series is done; the more complete the better. :)
soulure 1 year ago
Great vid and interesting research. I didn't realize that hearing voices was so not uncommon.
ozmoroid 1 year ago
@ozmoroid
Thank you for helping to inspire it. The research for this stuff blew me away.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
I hear voices, if you want to call it that. The difference is, I realize the voices for what they are: imagination.
happysplodie 1 year ago
When I was younger (mid 20's) I clanked my head and had to go to hospital with a concussion and one of the things they told me was that I was likely to hear voices. According to the nurse it was routine that people with head trauma got them and that I should be warned before hand so as to not get a shock.
When I did hear them I swear they were like someone was in the room. I can see why some would not be able to differ reality from hallucination.
It was a rather freaky episode in my life.
kalamain 1 year ago
@kalamain
That's fascinating stuff! Thanks for sharing that.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
It's not just hallucination, it's cultural indoctrination. Many people will think that they hear voices just by coming in contact with other people who think that they do. This reinforces their belief as well. When I was seven, my parents were considering getting a minivan and I prayed to god asking if it was his will that we got one. I legitimately thought that I heard "Wait a while" whispered to me. And sure enough, we did not get a minivan immediately, but a few months later. (Contd)
Raptor302 1 year ago
To make things better, the dealer who was trying to sell my parents the minivan coincidentally couldn't be found when they wanted to make the sale. I told them about my prayer afterward and this reinforced my belief that I had indeed heard the voice of god. This anecdotal proof was used as a justification for my faith for long time before I no longer considered it a legitimate experience.
Raptor302 1 year ago
lol that dude @ 0:26 he really looks like someone who hear "voices" in his head lol!
Appledude500 1 year ago
Even on top of all this, there seems to be a slight implication that the claims of "hearing the voice of God" are all actually instances where there was auditory (in this case) input.
You can't just stop at it being hallucinations, there will be a percentage (albeit, probably low) who will become so entrenched in the culture that they will trick themselves into "hearing" the voice of a deity even when no "voice" was heard at the time.
Memories are very fallible, and fascinating.
Cyrathil 1 year ago 6
@Cyrathil
I do not intend to claim that hallucinations explain everything. Just look at the chart at 7:30. Hallucination is just a tiny little contributor in the grand scheme. Watch video 4 in the series. Misinformation effect is a great way to hear God's voice without any hallucinations.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX "I do not intend to claim that halllucinations explain everything."
I didn't mean to imply that you were. I was just saying that even in the context of hearing or seeing things, it's not necessarily going to be from an hallucination. There's a use to pointing out the obvious connections.
Cyrathil 1 year ago
Comment removed
nageljr 1 year ago
@Cyrathil
" in the context of hearing or seeing things, it's not necessarily going to be from an hallucination"
But hearing/seeing something that isn't there is the very definition of a hallucination, right? What alternative mechanisms are you suggesting here?
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX "What alternative mechanisms are you suggesting here?"
That they added the stimulus in after the fact. You said it yourself, the misinformation effect.
They had an experience, and because of the people/culture around them, they started "remembering" voices that were never actually there. With each time they "remember", the memory becomes more vivid and "clear". If you asked them right after the event, they'd say they saw/heard nothing, so I'm not sure it's an hallucination.
Cyrathil 1 year ago
@Cyrathil
"That they added the stimulus in after the fact. You said it yourself, the misinformation effect."
This is something I wanted to address, but did not have time in the video. In fact, if you un-mute the black lady at 1:05, she actually describes God's voice as something that can only be recognized "after the fact." That is, you think you heard something, then something good happens, so AHA! That was God!
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago
@AntiCitizenX "if you un-mute the black lady at 1:05, she actually describes God's voice as something that can only be recognized "after the fact.""
I was actually wondering what her method for determining God's voice was... I've heard a lot of people claim they hear God, but not once have I heard a reasonable explanation of how they are so sure it is God, and not say, Satan.
Cyrathil 1 year ago
@Cyrathil
Okay, I think I understand your criticism. These videos should not be taken in isolation, but rather compiled together as a whole. I did not intend to imply that all "voices" are hallucinations, but rather that many of the vivid ones can be explained as such. Going back to videos 2-4, it is easy to see how many other mechanisms can create the memory of a voice without ever actually hearing anything at all; which is what I believe you were driving at.
AntiCitizenX 1 year ago 2
@AntiCitizenX
I don't think Cyrathil was criticizing. I think he/she was making a distinction between a hallucination, and simply convincing yourself due to a combination of confirmation bias, and wishful thinking, that the ordinary voice we all have in our heads when we're sort of talking to ourselves, is the voice of God.
TheNakedAtheist 1 year ago
this is just like.. super interesting ;p
Inmylifealive 1 year ago
And if you haven't already, you need to check out Persinger's research into deep brain stimulation with magnetic fields- look up the god helmet.
bamboo4tameshigiri 1 year ago
Temporal Lobe Epilepsy, Jerusalem Syndrome, Schizophrenia, 5HT2a agonists, Etc. That's what gives birth to religion.
bamboo4tameshigiri 1 year ago