Trap, Neuter, and Release: Bad for Cats, Disaster for Birds

[johnt0148]

The problem is not the cats, it is the cat owners. Their ignorance about their cat's effect on wild bird populations in compounded by their lack of concern for the balance of nature. Educate cat owners and fine them everytime their cat steps out of their house.

[ebolaoutkast]

@robbiethree It's not 'insane'. If your cats magically don't hunt (they probably do), great. But don't pretend that most of them don't.

[gabfestt]

My garden was paradise; filled with flora. Mother got cancer; I was gone 6 mos. Came back & it is now an ecological desert. Loads of fat, jewel collared kitties loll about in the sun but nothing else remains but poop, piss and bird feathers. No amphibians or lg insects. I kept cats out for years. Now all gone in 6 mos. Guests and I can delightedly while away the time watching them scan for something to pounce on or chew or a spot to dig up and shit in.

[sweetvegan74]

All cats can hunt yes, but I rather have a few lazy fixed ferals then many unaltered hungry ones breeding and killing more animals to survive. Plus people kill more wildlife then anything.

[ebolaoutkast]

@sweetvegan74 People DO kill more wildlife than anything. Especially when they bring over invasive animals like cats. Is that a serious defense?

[summerbrezz74]

Of course it is. I'm saying if you remove the cats.. more come in and it doesn't end. In a perfect world cats would not be feral. But where's there people.. there's cats. I've seen trap and kill and it just does not work for long. I have a few ferals in my area. Their fixed. Birds come by and they don't even look twice.

Again Trap and Kill does not work the only thing it does is kill cats, time and resources of tax payers.

[sweetvegan74]

@summerbrezz74

Yes that's what I am trying to explain here. Thank you (-:

[ebolaoutkast]

@summerbrezz74 If we destroy/ adopt out any number of cats, that will lessen the impact to the environment. It's not like if you kill one 2 more will grow back. The birds that that cat would have killed will still be living. That's how I see it. As many as possible need to go.

[sweetvegan74]

But 2 more WILL come back. It always does. Before I came to my area, people told me they found kittens in their back yard every summer. Some of the kittens would be taken to the shelter or given away. People tried getting the adults. But they always came back. I started TNR in 2002, my neighbor across from me said since me, she has found no more litters of kits. The numbers are going down. Not up. Would you prefer 20 dozen or 2 dozen ferals? I think the birds would go for the later.

[ebolaoutkast]

@sweetvegan74 With that logic we'll have thriving cat populations throughout the country that need to be 'cared for' which I find crazy.

I dunno, we had a litter of cats roaming around here, and we adopted them out, and I haven't seen anymore for years. When I do see one, they seem not to last, most likely due to their short life span. It sounds like lack or proper trapping is the real issue here, if people can't keep trapping until the populations are reduced.

[ebolaoutkast]

If they do pour into cat-less areas, it seems as though this whole area will be under siege from them and that will permanently alter the ecosystem. Somehow someway, aside from idiots who free roam their cats, they haven't made their way here, and I don't think that's due to TNR.

[sweetvegan74]

@ebolaoutkast

Yes people are the reason why there are feral cats. So they need to be controlled by people. Removing just causes the vacuum effect. My friend is seeing this in her neighborhood. It's never good for cats nor the birds.

[ebolaoutkast]

@sweetvegan74 I wholehardly agree! They do need to be controlled. Releasing them into the ecosysytem is not the answer. Explain the 'vacuum effect' to me please.

[sweetvegan74]

It's not pretty. The vacuum effect means when a large amount of cats are taken from an area. The cats left behind breed and fill up twice the cats that were taken away. Cats that are neutered keep unaltered ones away, the few ones that are accepted are also neutered. And the numbers go down since they no longer breed. Neither choice is ideal, but I prefer TNR then killing and adding double the cats later.

[ebolaoutkast]

@sweetvegan74 It sounds to me that concentrating on one area to eliminate ferals would cause more to pour in to that area. I have a hard time believing that if the WHOLE region was dedicated to their removal that cats would 'pour' in since they have nowhere to 'pour in' from. It's like you're implying that if we eradicate the first colony, then we just...stop. People need to be more proactive with ferals EVERYWHERE. These ferals, when unpampered, have crappy lives.

[sweetvegan74]

Trust me hon, I have two other friends that do TNR in my neighborhood and friends that do their own area as well. If everyone just helped out then the crisis would not be so bad. Instead of removing and doubling and making things worse.

[sweetvegan74]

I volunteer for Forgotten Cats and is has MANY volunteers that help. I also help people that need getting some cats fixed in their areas when need be. You can talk about your opinion to you are blue in the face. It is working for me and neutered ferals do not live as bad as you might think. They are clean and healthy.

[AgainstCruelty1]

I seen lots of cats who people feed yet have no home die of diseases - people think these outdoor cats are happy? These cats die in a few years. HUNDREDS of fleas biting their entire body every second of every day-many of these cats become anemic from the multitudes of fleas and ticks. Hundreds of parasitic worms eating their guts. Cats eat birds and lizards-all harboring internal parasites. Run over by cars, human cruelty, poisoned, even cat fights have put out eyes. TNR=cruelty. Awful.

[sweetvegan74]

Cats that are NOT managed do led short hard lives. But cats that are neutered and fed daily live just about as long as a house cat. I had a feral that was past 10 years old but past away to KIdney Disease. My ferals are clean, plump and happy. They rather watch butterflies then chase birds anymore. TNK just makes more cats come in.