NOVA - Inside Chernobyl's Sarcophagus part 2

[teddythebenny]

One has to understand, Nuclear power is not a threat to people. It is how we utilize the power harnessed, not for the people, but for self-ideological, & self-beneficial. for example, Chernobly occurred on grounds of a bureaucratically naive regime, as well as today`s US nuclear industry been largely subsidized by the government. while we radioactively pollute the earth using Uranium class weapons.. its the typical a chicken for a AK47 in Africa, killing more people, then a Silo in texas. 

[122metalmaniak221]

Brutal.



[MegaDragonWizard]

acually 3 reactors fully melted down and a 4th could possibly... with 55 total reactors in japan if they evacuate a biggr radius they well just be leaving more reactors to melt potentially up to 55 reactors could meltdown in japan

[freecomptechreview]

for all people who think all nuclear reactors are a Chernobyl waiting to happen. these days it is impossible for a reactor to melt down remember japan there reactor was hit by a earth quake and it was close to melting down but did not. basically the only way a reactor could melt down would be and earth quake at least a 9.0 and no humans to keep it under control

[dawsondaily]

@freecomptechreview Once upon a time humanity said "these days it's impossible for an oceanliner to sink." Then, the Titanic came along... You think scientists weren't talking up the safety of reactors at the time of Chernobyl? You think they didn't tout impressive statistics and numbers which would prove to the public that nuclear reactors were perfect creations and could never do any wrong?

[freecomptechreview]

@dawsondaily you are right but the power plant in japan still withstood a 9.0 earth quake, and boats all over the world use a modified system the titanic. new ocean liners almost never sink especially in Identical circumstances. and trust me no one will make the same mistakes that doomed Chernobyl.

[teddythebenny]

@freecomptechreview whats laughable, is that since three mile island, no nuclear power station has been built in the US. However, the US public utilities amendment of 2005, allows nuclear power plants in the US to remain in operation for another 25 years. Also, although the US government does not allow the construction of new plants, they endorse the creation of such plants overseas. Using the world bank and IMF, to bankroll the project, Bataan been one, and whats more its a 1980s design.

[freecomptechreview]

@teddythebenny not to be rude but the real laughable thing is that you are surprised the American government is a hypocrite.

[teddythebenny]

@freecomptechreview lol, and how might i ask, did you deduce that... every nation is a hyprocrite.. they just dont teach that at school..

[freecomptechreview]

@teddythebenny Every nation is not a hypocrite but the usa is the definition of a hypocrite society.

[teddythebenny]

@freecomptechreview name one nation which is not. The US controls the world bank, the UN, NATO, the IMF, the international courts. In effect, any nation on earth, is influenced by the systems of globalization. To obtain a loan, one has to privatize/denationalize industries, open the economy to market forces, i.e global companies. As a developing nation, pays off its interest payments, let alone its wholesale debts, it can not achieve promises of governance.. & called by the people a hypocrite.

[freecomptechreview]

@teddythebenny America's population has since reached over 50% poor, and this so-called world saving capitalist government has a horrible track record for making the world worse. let me name a few things, Liberation of Arab countries, Liberation of Vietnam, The Hiroshima bomb in japan, and not to mention the god forsaken Hydrogen and Atomic bomb. There is a reason why most first world countries hate America as well as the basically all third world countries do as well.

[teddythebenny]

@freecomptechreview dont forget, the CIA has publicly stated that it will do its utmost to maintain the status quo. that been regardless of a democratic government or a tyrant, if it goes against the national interests of the US, it will act. We japs, dont hate America though. Even after 67 years, since the end of the war, I still see, propeller airplanes flying in the sky..

[123mrresidentevil]

@freecomptechreview chernobyl was caused by two drunk idiots who were not thinking and could of easily been prevented

[freecomptechreview]

@123mrresidentevil yes and no Chernobyl had massive flaws in its construction and it was ran by idiots. 

[mucbeanz]

@freecomptechreview ran by idiots?? have you not read the accounts? drunks? you must be the states .. full of US MSM propaganda

[freecomptechreview]

@mucbeanz You are funny first of all I am in Canada, second of all I watch RT every single day and nothing else. all I know is a reactor melted down and the story says it was caused by both human error and mechanical error.

[wildsugarfly]

I respect how you see the things , but I'm not agree . We have other sources of energie , nuclear is only a question of business / money . Different solution existes . Anyway this energy cannot be safe beacause " zero risk" DOESN'T existe and the consequances of little mistake are terrible .There is nothing that can "make sure shit like this does not happen" .

[SsSLAURSsS]

i read a documentary that said thet the orkers who opreate the reactor to this explosion were new there and they was like some sort of students there

[chillaxer1993]

10,000 roentgens? that's like death within seconds

[halfpipefreak]

@chillaxer1993 within one hour ...

[Convict147]

Finally! I was searching for these episodes for some time now :)

[OldGreggTheBubbler]

How about we just have geo thermal power plants and never have to worry about radiation, pollution, running out of power, ?

Oh that's right nobody could make billions off of it...

[ferraris26]

@OldGreggTheBubbler Geothermal is not a viable alternative. It can't be done everywhere for a start, then there's the scale of things. It can't replace the large scale power plants.

[Inanimatus]

Like you said, Jim, "When done right". If only everybody was doing it right and not cutting corners, whether it's the nuclear industry in Japan not getting any real oversight, or some place like Diablo Canyon fudging the details. They all need to understand with something as dangerous as this, safety precautions must be carried out to the letter, no short cuts, no excuses and no BS. No matter how much it costs, no matter how much time it takes, these reactors MUST be safe.

[jeffs1000]

It all can come down to a failed valve, and a portion of the earth becomes uninhabitable for 100's of thousands of years! I'll take breathing in the CO2 from coal any day.

[ichabod1101]

No matter how careful people are it only takes one mistake with technology like this. I cannot support Nuclear Energy. People and their designs are just not that perfect. There is always something that can go wrong , and with Nuclear radiation it is just not worth it - wed be better off running around in animal skins without any power.

[vencugar]

I expect many of thease poor soules died an untimely death.

[maurcd]

Those are the bravest men in Earth. Their kindness is probably saving lots of lives.

[logwind]

Scary as hell.

[igotN0ceilings]

what people don't realize is that the japanese reactors are 44 year old designs. For those wondering the situation in Japan could not happen in the US and it could not happen at any modern reactor. I read that inside parts of the sarcophagus today levels are as high as 100 sieverts per hour. this is thousands of times as high as the levels in Japan, so those comparing Fukushima to Chernobyl are making it a larger deal than it actually is

[ohgoditsjames94]

@igotN0ceilings 30 Sieverts is enough to kill you in Minutes, those the firemen and the workers who were sent to check the reactor suffered around 40-50, killed them in days. 100 Sieverts would kill you in less than 10minutes, I'm guessing that the 100sieverts pre hour is where the molten fuel is?

[igotN0ceilings]

@ohgoditsjames94 yeah, I'm pretty sure its below the reactor where large concentrations of molten fuel are. You would think that the reactor would be the most radioactive place, but I read there's actually a type of moss growing on the walls of the reactor core now. It's pretty interesting stuff to research

[buzzzz1964]

Heros.

R.I.P.

[odsall]

Got to say these Russian workers are pretty brave. Biorobots? i call them heroes to be honest.

[airbreathingengine]

i feel like im getting a lifetime dose of radiation just watching this.

[Mootuto]

god...If they put sand and boron in the plants in Fukushima, that shit will turn to lava basically, extremely radioactive lava....if they pour water into reactor 2, criticality will occur, and a result from that is an extreme dirty bomb...fuck.

[ChiLLaXN1337]

for all that radioactive dust why not just use air filterers

the good kinds with the electricity that grabs the dust in the panels not the paper filterers

[hiccupoflife]

Look at these guys calling nuclear energy safe. Japan's earthquake has proved what can happen to fission reactors when mother nature (not some imaginary sky daddy) decides to stretch a bit. These guys probably think nuclear weapons are necessary and safe too. ALTERNATIVE SOURCES OF ENERGY ARE NEED OF THE HOUR. F THESE HYPOCRITES. BRING ON THE NEXT HIPPIE MOVEMENT!

[spayum2]

@Lizardman6900 Unfortunately it is indeed true, or very nearly. All but three or four of the men who worked on the roof died of radiation exposure or cancer within five years.

[migkillertwo]

How would rain getting into the reactor core cause a self-sustained reaction?

[ferraris26]

@migkillertwo Water can act as a moderator, needed to slow neutrons down enough for the reaction. Dry reactor has too few slow neutrons to sustain a chain reaction.

[migkillertwo]

@ferraris26 yeah I looked that up. The problem is that the fuel is natural uranium, not enriched uranium. you would need a lot of graphite, or some heavy water to start another reaction

[CoatedTrout]

I WANT A RC TANK NOW

[onefugowie]

4:00 and on....all those men died..you cant imagine what they are doing ...small particles are ripping right thru there DNA ..its like a million small bullets going thru you...bless them

[rob4109]

alll of those poor fuckers are now dead

[schizle32]

@rob4109 yeah but they didnt know that it was 200 runtgen

[Bluecoatca]

@rob4109 Don't hate dude, don't think that the states or any other country had any better equipment than the soviets. If they hadnt went in there, more people would have died, you may have never existed depending on where you were born.

[realsgtskywalker]

The english subtitles aren't so good. You never fully translate what someone is trying to say in another language if you aren;t from the same culture than the person itself, but even then, there's not enough words to describe what he's trying to say. Im not just talking about this, im talking in general

[freedo333]

about a minute into this part, the russian guy says they don't have the necessary equipment to safely work in the area. i'm surprised the rest of the civilized nations haven't all thrown in & bought some decent equipment for those folks. it's the 21st century, for petes sake!

[FloCp3]

@freedo333 do you think that "the rest of the civilized nations" had a better technology/equipment ?

[freedo333]

@FloCp3 i would hope so. it's been a few weeks since i watched the vid, but i got the impression that poor broke russia can't or won't pony up the cash for some modern safer equipment. i think they should devise some sprayable rubber compound with lead or something in it. maybe if they coated the reactor & surroundings, when the inevitable collapse happens, much of the deady dust will be trapped under the rubber. clever eh?

[brucekirk89]

is there not a little Williage right close to this place??

[dinmagic]

Such an eerie place to be in.

[youngdones]

What are the radiation readings (rads per hour) inside the sarcophagus?

[ZR3FR1K]

they need to dig a trench around the entire thing and make it 500ft down then build a square fortification all the way from the bottom. And then fill the square fortification with trillions of tons of concrete and then jump trillions of tons of gravel, dirt, rock and build a hill over it.

[ZR3FR1K]

Plant grass and burry the entire area so it is hundreds of feet below the surface and then build another square fortification and repeat the process a hundred times over. until the 500 mile radius is burried and a hill the size of mount everest

[EvilWarlock666]

couldnt happen to a nicer group of people.

russian pigs

[severussnape222]

what is wrong with shut up russians are awesome so shut your damn mouth and dont open it unless you have something human beings can comprehend.

[EvilWarlock666]

You should give your mum the same advice, maybe then she wont be called the Blowjob Queen of Chernobyl.

[severussnape222]

@EvilWarlock666 First off, not saying dumb things and giving blowjobs are totally unrelated. Secondly, she can't have that nickname cause it's already been taken. By you, jerkoff. lolololololol!!!11!

[EvilWarlock666]

you sound like the expert on blowjobs... has your mum being giving you some tips ?

[severussnape222]

@EvilWarlock666 you are the expert, so who is at your house right now, what are you doing, having a gay party? well probably you are giving blowjobs to five guys at a time FAGGOT!!

[EvilWarlock666]

Whats with all the homophobic words, you trying to tell us all something ?

And why you so interested in what I do, if you want to know just ask your mum.

[EvilWarlock666]

sounds like your definitely speaking from experience... hahaha

[yoeeb]

@EvilWarlock666 You relise they are Ukrainians, not Russians...

[EvilWarlock666]

Same shit different bucket

[Jimdangello]

Nuclear Energy is very safe & efficient, when done right

The accident at Chernobyl was caused by a combination of several factors.

Faulty safety equipment, Flawed reactor design, Operator Errors, and Bureaucratic Suppression all led to the destruction of the No.4 reactor.

In contrast, the 3-mile-island accident in the U.S. happened in a similar way, but the fail-safe reactor design & the reactor containment building (which Chernobyl didn't think they needed) limited the accident substantially

[12agent47]

exactly. we need to utilize more nuclear power, those commies just cant do anything right.

[luvig1234]

@Jimdangello

> Nuclear Energy is very safe & efficient, when done right

That's true, but what are the chances of people doing it wrong if you have lots of reactors spread around that are ran under so many human/political/economical different contexts?

Murphy's laws says it: if something can be done wrong, someone, somewhere, sometime will do it.

[luvig1234]

@Jimdangello

> Nuclear Energy is very safe & efficient, when done right

That's true, but what are the chances of people doing it wrong if you have lots of reactors spread around that are ran under so many human/political/economical different contexts?

Murphy's laws says it: if something can be done wrong, someone, somewhere, sometime will do it.

[schizle32]

@Jimdangello + erm they bought weak resources so it fail chans wuz high

[sluterry]

@Jimdangello

bullshit you can never promise such a promise, it is as shown here incredibly dangerous and should never be messed with, it is pure idiocy, each nuclear reactor on the face of the earth is a ticking time bomb

[GBVendettaGB]

@Jimdangello Nothing is 100% safe when dealing with nuclear energy. Chernobyl's incident was because of impatience and just not being smart about it. 3-mile island accident doesn't mean next time it can't be worse. Its like saying just because you have a seatbelt in a car, doesn't mean you can't die. Anything is possible and we can keep telling ourselves its safe until reality hits us.

[RichPfoutz]

@Jimdangello

Tell that to Japan, and Mothernature.

[MeskovicZ]

@RichPfoutz

You can't compare Japan with Chernobyl. Japan had natural disaster (earthquake + tsunami) while in Chernobyl disaster was caused by human error.

Nuclear energy is pretty safe if it is handled properly. Nuclear reactors in Fukushima are not leaking ,they only have 1 problem,how to cool off reactor. The steam that is building in reactors is being controllable relieced in air ,not allowing reactor to blow like one in Chernobyl.

Sure there will be contamination ,but not nearly as close.

[agtheking]

@MeskovicZ You are not very up to date. It's pretty certain now that containment is broken on reactor 2 and is leaking. Radioactive steam has also been released when cooling failed and three explosions of secondary containment have released even more radioactive particles. Sure it's not as explosive of an event as Chernobyl but it's very much the same in that they have lost control and can't do much to stop it.

[MeskovicZ]

@agtheking

The way i heard it on news this morning ,they said that there is leakage of radioactive fuel that was stored near reactors. It looks that Japanese don't have separate radioactive fuel dump from their nuclear plants.

I don't know how badly damaged are nuclear reactors it self ,but GE reactors have a lot lot more safety precautions than the reactors Soviets used in Chernobyl.

Still nobody can't say anything about current situation ,media could make cover up so that people don't get ->

[MeskovicZ]

@agtheking

-> scared about it. Only people that know real status are the employees at plant.

I really hope they will get this thing under control ,because one Chernobyl is one too many !

We don't need another one ,and i hope it won't happen !!!!

[StaffSergeantTbag]

@MeskovicZ its already happened, dont listen to the "its only as bad as 3 mile" lies. japan has had multiple reactors blown

[MeskovicZ]

@StaffSergeantTbag

For the sake of Japan and Humanity ,i hope that ain't the truth !!!!

[igotN0ceilings]

@agtheking the situation in Japan will never be as bad as the one in Chernobyl. The chernobyl was a lot bigger and the explosion occurred while it was producing energy. There was also no containment vessel around the reactor at Chernobyl, so radioactive debris could spread freely. Thank god we can do some things to control it, and hopefully it wont require 600,000 people to handle the situation in Japan like it did in Chernobyl

[agtheking]

@igotN0ceilings I never claimed it would be as bad I just refuted some statements and that it was closer to Chernobyl than first expected. Containment has been breached in one reactor and that's probably what have lead to some radioactivity in the groundwater. While there won't be a huge explosion spreading the material over as big an area as Chernobyl did the local repercussions might be similar in a worst case scenario.

[MeskovicZ]

@RichPfoutz

And that is good thing. Even if reactors melt down (which at this point is possible) ,the contamination will still be kept to minimal possible ,since nuclear reactors are been surrounded by 5 - 7 meters thick reinforced concrete walls. You should listen to scientist on television what they are saying.

[analihilator]

@Jimdangello AND NOW WHAT ? japan's disaster had all the failsafes and the container ... but mother nature has a way of toppling all man's best-laid plans. the stakes are too high and us humans simply cant depend on our ability to attain the 100% certainty in our technology that is evidently necessary for a venture as potentially hazardous as nuclear energy generation.

[Danny77uk]

@analihilator The Japanese situation is terrifying but we literally DO NOT HAVE A CHOICE. Fossil fuels are running out and 'green' energy is not a viable alternative given existing technology. In the future we may perfect cold fusion or technology to harness energy from moon beams and good intentions, but for our generation, there is no alternative.

[ferraris26]

@analihilator Japanese reactors had some minor flaws, which have been corrected in newer designs. And seriously, give me one alternative we have to nuclear energy that works. Solar, geothermal, wind...they don't. Fusion is some time away.

[analihilator]

@ferraris26 LOL what about the 'minor flaws' in the planning and safety culture that directly caused the current crisis ? will the 'corrections' to the 'minor design flaws' suddenly alter these ? or just cause them to reoccur ? because why bother planning for this kind of accident if your designs are just SO DAMN SAFE that you dont bother having enough radiation suits on hand because that'll SEND THE WRONG MESSAGE ?

sheeesh

[ferraris26]

@analihilator I won't go into the technical details, I won't know where to stop(I am an engineering student). No one had ever expected the tsunami to be that high. Planning was done according to whatever data was available for the last 150 years, taking a safety margin of 3x. And to be honest, too much has been made of whatever happened in Fukushima. The reactor was never designed to take what happened, and still, all the reactors held up. And in the recent past, there was another tsunami->

[ferraris26]

@analihilator ->in the Indian Ocean. The Indian reactors on the East coast had absolutely no problem. Safety is very crucial, I will never say otherwise. But Fukushima has been made into more than it is. It's nowhere close to Chernobyl, at least not as close as media and "planners" are saying it is. Accidents happen all the time, you can only be prepared to an extent. The highest tsunami in Fukushima had been 2m, they put a 6m tsunami barrier. Who could have expected an 8m tsunami to come?

[analihilator]

@ferraris26 - yes well nature has a way of demolishing man's best-laid plans, hmm ? we can never have 100% certainty in our technology, just ask 14 dead shuttle astronauts (NASA predicted 1 shuttle loss per 100,000 flights) ... the magnitude and duration of the risk from accidents like this are simply too great for us to accept a non-negligible chance of mishap, and regardless of any increments in safety tech i think it it pretty god damn clear that chance is non-negligible.

[ferraris26]

@analihilator New reactors have passive safety, so that even if the reactor has no external power, and is submerged in water with complete loss of active cooling, the reactor will not have any issue. The only way of doing some damage to these reactors is to go to them physically, and then attach a lot of explosives and blow it up(even that might not work). The policy makers, the media, and the anti-nuclear lobby has spread more fear than it's worth. Everything is risky, nuclear power is lot less

[analihilator]

@ferraris26 - mate do you have any idea how much water they are pumping into these things ? if putting an olympic smimming pool above every reactor was the MAGIC INCREDIBLY SIMPLE IDEA THAT SAVES ANY REACTOR FROM GOING WRONG EVER ..... why didnt someone think of it sooner ?

you're not even reading what i said, are you ? increments of safety improvement make it LESS likely that anyone will plan properly for accidents tike this, not more. why bother with suits etc if its SO SAFE.

[ferraris26]

@analihilator I can understand your point, but money is limited, so you either spend time stocking up on all kinds of safety equipment for when the reactor goes wrong, or spend it on making the reactor even safer, so that nothing happens in the first place. I'd spend it on latter, and that's what everyone is doing.

You seem to have misunderstood me: I meant to say that new reactors can work even if the building is completely flooded, and no power is available to the station from anywhere.->

[ferraris26]

@analihilator ->What worse can happen? Reactors scram anyway during earthquakes, even Fukushima did, and it survived a 9.0 earthquake although the design was for 8.0 only. You really can't blame the designers for missing out....who'd expected a 9.0 earthquake and an 8m tsunami? In a region where the worst possible was predicted 8.0 and 2m. And that new reactors have even more backups, so even that situation doesn't arise. They are much safer than most power sources on earth, and cleaner.

[analihilator]

@ferraris26 its not a question of BLAME, its a question of whether there is any increment of safety technology that can reduce the risk of an accident to 0. when part of the reason the accident is so severe is because they didnt bother preparing for a worst case scenario, excuse me if i am not reassured by the solution of 'oh but now we've made another increment of safety technology so this worst case scenario cant happen again!' ... they said it couldnt happen this time either, hmm ?

[ferraris26]

@analihilator It's never humanely possible to reduce the risk of accident to 0, but ignoring Chernobyl and Kyshtym, how many lives have been lost due to the Nuclear Industry? Barely any. Even at Fukushima, the situation is serious, but it does not mean the plant is killing anyone, or causing direct/indirect damage to anyone. The ocean will disperse the radioactive waste and make it harmless for humans. You are being too paranoid about radiation...it's too insignificant to cause any harm->

[analihilator]

@ferraris26 BUT THERE *ARE* PEOPLE WHO PREDICTED WHAT WOULD HAPPEN ! and what did TEPCO say ? 'oh ho ho its wildly improbable that an accident could happen and even if it did our safety tech will save us' ... it wasnt convincing before this accident and its sure as hell not convincing now. and if you think having nuclear fuel fissioning uncontrollably and escaping from its containment vessel counts as 'withstanding' anything, well i'd hate to see what YOU think a worstcase scenario looks like !

[ferraris26]

@analihilator I'd like to know who told you that "fuel" had leaked from the reactor, or there was uncontrollable fission. The reactor had a SCRAM when the earthquake came, that shut it down, the only heat is decay heat. You come and argue with me when you don't have any idea about what happened. Seriously, you should get your facts right. The only thing that "leaked" was mildly radioactive cooling water. For a worst case scenario, look at Chernobyl. That is what happens when there is no safety.

[analihilator]

@ferraris26 try professor chris busby. he states that isotopes have been detected that can only be produced by criticality excursion events, and that the levels and patterns of radioactivity being emitted indicate a breach in the containment vessel(s). i can understand what incentive TEPCO and G.E. and nuclear power fans have to attempt to conceal this. i don't see what incentive prof. busby has to lie about it.

[analihilator]

@ferraris26

try dubdubdubdotjapantodaydotcom/c­ategory/national/view/meltdown­-may-have-occurred-also-at-nos­-2-3-reactors

maybe YOU should get YOUR facts right, poindexter. mildly radioactive water LOL. if you are actually an engineering student there is no excuse for your level of disingenuity on this topic. why do you sound exactly like a TEPCO spokesperson ? 'ohh its not THAT bad, a bit of mildly radioactive water never hurt anyone' while the thing is BURNING because the fuel is ON FIRE.

[analihilator]

@ferraris26 you've really got some nerve. TEPCO admitted 5 days ago that #1 had mostly melted 16 hours after the quake and had breached the containment vessel. and you have the hide to sneer at me over your engineering degree and tell me to get my facts straight before i bring my game to you ?

you're a clown, mate. but i guess when you are so dead set certain already that this isn't a big problem then why would you bother keeping up on the 'facts'.

[ferraris26]

@analihilator ->to anyone. I know it will do irreparable damage to the original group working there, and it'd be rude to say it's a very small number, but it is much less than any other power source. The two USSR accidents were a result of rubbish Soviet policies, nothing to do with nuclear safety. And you should see Fukushima and TMI as testimonies to the level of safety they have. Both cases, the unexpected happened, but both plants stood up to the torture they were never designed to take.

[analihilator]

@ferraris26 we have no idea how much radiation will end up being released and we have no idea what effect that amount of radiation being dumped into the ocean will have on the food chain. your casual, 'so what' attitude towards this accident strikes me as obtuse. your words replicate precisely the attitudes that led to disaster in the USSR and Japan and very nearly at TMI. 'this is so safe nothing bad could ever happen', and then when it DOES 'how could we ever have predicted this could happen'

[ferraris26]

@analihilator I'm sorry about the mildly part....I was typing something else and forgot to delete the word :D

Prof. Busby does not seem to be a very reliable source on this one, he's claiming a hydrogen explosion(it was designed to explode) was a nuclear one. Partial meltdown has been confirmed in all 3 reactors. I've told you discussing Chernobyl is irrelevant-it had improper containment, a Soviet problem. And the entire accident was in part triggered by political pressure. Read it up on wiki.

[ferraris26]

@analihilator As of April 12, 10% of Chernobyl had leaked from Fukushima, and Chernobyl was landlocked, this is next to Pacific. It'll dilute it so much that long term effects will be negligible.

I'm not quoting what I read from TEPCO and GE, I know they will suppress it. I had guessed very early it wasn't a level 4. I was guessing level 6 2-3 days after the incident. I have discussed it with my Professors, and some other experts, and studied the data and Indian reactor safety.

[analihilator]

@ferraris26 my point regarding chernobyl and TMI and fukushima is not that the technology was the same (it wasnt) ... but the ATTITUDES were the same. they all thought it couldnt happen, they all cut corners on inspections and such, they all didnt bother having the right safety gear in place, they all put too much faith in their technology, and they all committed human error.

do you understand my point ? at all ? humans are just too short sighted to do nuclear safely, regardless of politics.

[ferraris26]

@analihilator It's not fair to blame technology, if the operators are at fault. I agree there is a risk of corners being cut, but trust me, both TMI and Fukushima had nothing to do with that. In both cases, the problems were flawed design.New reactors are designed such that they do NOT depend on human predictions. They are designed to work if cut off from absolutely anything. Unless blown up, they won't have such issues. Designers have taken the unpredictability and corner cutting seriously,

[analihilator]

@ferraris26 mate i believe the manufacturers have an incentive to say THIS TIME WE HAVE FINALLY MADE IT TOTALLY SAFE AND ELIMINATED HUMAN ERROR, but that exact attitude is what *causes* the human error, because why should you bother training people properly for a scenario which you say CAN'T HAPPEN ? i am talking about HUMANS and the way WE work, not the technology. maybe you understand technology better than you understand human nature.

[ferraris26]

@analihilator People are trained, they are prepared for any emergency.

If you think I don't know about human nature, I'm sorry, but I have worked with one of the worst public systems in the world, the Indian system. As an Indian, it hurts me to say this, but our system is rubbish. So design is done to eliminate as much human intervention as is possible. I told you about the power plants. You should see the work culture there. West will never be 10% as slack. And still, nothing happens.

[ferraris26]

@analihilator And they have tried to ensure that anything going wrong shuts the plant. I have seen a much less strict version of this in a thermal plant, result: they have had no problems for the last 20 odd years they have been operating. Computer control has bumped up safety a lot.

I won't tell you to take my word as is. Think about it, do some research, look at the data, and deduce for yourself. Come up with your own conclusions. I'm only stating my conclusions. You are entitled to your own.

[ferraris26]

@analihilator A little about the explosion which I'm using against Busby: The outer containment was designed to explode if the gas pressure rose too much. This was to prevent the hydrogen from blowing up inside the building and damaging primary containment. It was like a safety valve. If you see the photos, the explosion is fairly regular, the building has disintegrated in proper pieces, and all the debris has been thrown outwards, nothing went into the building. It was designed to do that.

[Danny77uk]

@Jimdangello I agree with you on the necessity of nuclear power and high-safety standards which are typically maintained (the ongoing Japanese incident is totally unprecedented). The problem is the long-term consequences - the decommissioning of old sites and the storage of spent fuel. We've already buried millions of tons of the stuff and it must remain buried for thousands of years. This storage may be comparatively safe, but the long-term implications cannot be ignored.

[shawntwnty]

@Jimdangello yes thank you! nuclear energy if we could just some how find a way to get rid of the waste.... some how.... we would have no energy crisis's anymore nuclear energy is pretty mutch free energy, all you have to have is some atoms and what not and boom! energy! and there is no running out of this fuel! too bad..

[csskalet]

@Jimdangello You still want to stand by those assertions, in light of the Fukushima situation?

[wildsugarfly]

@Jimdangello sure ! Nuclear energy is very , very safe ..when it's done right !! Just look on Fukushima right now , building their sacrophagus ...This is to dangerous ,numerous technically challenging issues...the are always the risk

[fmpanic000]

@wildsugarfly in regards to the disasters to the amount of nuclear reactors yes it is a safe source of energy. compare this with the amount of cars and car accidents for example. but yes when we do fuck a reactor up the consequences are major.....for me i dont mind having nuclear power but better measures need to be put in place to make sure shit like this does not happen.

[jpmac098]

Or we could use hydrogen reactors, much safer. No chance of meldown and low radiation, but more energy and less polution than nuclear reactors

[trucker44100]

@jpmac098 But thats very expensive. Hydrogen costs losts of money these days. They have tryed it, but concluded that it would cost billions to run it every hour.

[seethebob]

i hope that Chernobyl never happends again....the US and other contriers should go with energy like wind turbines and solor

[zachk1983]

I hope you like sacrificing your electricity then, because solar cells and wind turbines aren't nearly efficiant enough to power the world. Turn your computers off and kiss electric appliances good bye.

[MgPinky]

Haha loved their idea with the toy tank

[AlienFirefox]

are those soldiers specnaz

they look it

[Basetornado]

This is a really good video