To everyone that read my comment, That was my younger 14 year old brother. He is very immatuure. I am very sorry for the comment he made. To be honest, I'm actully athiest. But as i said, I give you all my most humble apologies.
@michaelsdhfsj Question for you. Between MetaBob's video and your own reaction, who is expressing forgiveness and love? Perhaps neither?
Did MetaBob insult you in the video itself? Did he denigrate your religion in the video? Why might a person tell you not to enter, then neither evict you or berate you after you do?
If you are lured into a room, by whatever means, and then are handed a gift (you may like the gift of not, accept the gift or not), is the giver deserving of being insulted?
Im a Christian, i just have one very very simple questions for any athiest no matter what level of knowledge, but HOW WAS THE EARTH CREATED? im 14 so let me have it with your theological advanced words of wisdom! :D ( sarcasm )
Alan Watts is really good at pulling bits of meaning out of the nihilistic ether, like pulling a quarter from the air.
I like Robert Anton Wilson better for healing the rift between science and mysticism, without compromising either, and for his excellent sense of humor.
I like James Burke for pulling sensational bits of meaning out of the scientific mish mosh, for generating a narrative for the evolution of science, and it's role in the whole of human progress, without mythologizing it.
(Philippians 2:10-11):.."that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father".
This was written 300 years before the Koran. Even the demons will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord. It will be a forced bow but EVERYONE will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord when He comes again.
@ImagesByDavid jesus is not the lord.... jesus is a prophet god sent down to warn the people that what they were doing was wrong. you shouldnt praise him cuz hes not god. he is nothing compared to god! he isnt gods son or god, he is a prophet just like noah,gabriel,moses,and muhammed!
(Philippians 2:10-11):.."that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father".
This was written 300 years before the Koran. Even the demons will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord. It will be a forced bow but EVERYONE will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord when He comes again.
(Philippians 2:10-11):.."that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father".
This was written 300 years before the Koran. Even the demons will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord. It will be a forced bow but EVERYONE will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord when He comes again.
"that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, 11 and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father". (Philipians 2:10-11)
(Philippians 2:10-11):.."that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father".
This was written 300 years before the Koran. Even the demons will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord. It will be a forced bow but EVERYONE will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord when He comes again.
Wow, It seems like some of the posters didn't even watch the video. Or if they did, they're so blinded by indoctrination that they didn't hear what they were listening to. In any case, I wish that everybody would read "The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are," by Watts. It was life-transforming for me.
Genius!! Yep, I'm Christian and I listened in on the whole thing against your wishes lol. I always argue with atheists that Christianity was meant to be a very spiritual thing and not religious, and that we all have access to the powers of the Holy Spirit for the betterment of the here and now- which is what I feel you instinctively identify as that "oneness". But, I'm sure you and I may differ on that idea.
Knocked my socks off, I know what book I'll be reading for summer.
Or perhaps if He was omniscient, he does this to show us all what terrible things we are capable of and to fully realize how messed the world has come to be because of us, and therefore how much we need Him.
Well Sobe, all I can say is that 98% of Christan scholars would disagree with you regarding God's omni-powers. To address your second point, God allows bad things to happen just to show us what horrible little creatures we are? But it's God that is allowing all this to happen by allowing us to do it, that was my whole point earlier. We are God's killer robots napalming children from my example below, so God is responsible for making us. You haven't advanced your point at all.
My previous comment was to SobeDragon7, and this is a continuation of that. Thanks YouTube for posting a comment reply at the top of the whole conversation.
God's omnipotence and omniscience pretty much makes him responsible for everything that happens in our universe anywhere, since he made it all knowing exactly everything that is going to happen in it at any given moment. It therefore stands to reason that there is exactly as much suffering in the world as God wanted when he made it.
For some reason the replies go directly to the top when I post them.
God is not omniscient and omnipotent if He gave us free will to choose. This comes down to the timeless question: do we have free will or not? No one can answer that, we don't know enough about the brain.
You must forgive me; as watts said, Its impossible for the thing to describe it-self, and so I've had to go around it-self, but now I think its even more lost than if I had just let it show it-self.
I haven't watched this in forever, and can't work up much enthusiam for listening to me stumble and digress around what I want to say, which is the way I remember this.
But whatever I may have said here, your comments above are pretty close to how I would have liked to express it.
I know that in several videos I used the word "person" inaccurately, since "persona" refers to the mask-like aspect of self. But yes, the idea I was trying to get at was that behind all our personas, we share the same consciousness, and that that indefinable "essence" can be called the consciousness of God. "God" in the pantheistic, impersonal sense. Or as my fellow YouTube atheist philhellenes once put it, "we are the universe made conscious." Atheism meets mysticism.
I have. Some of his ideas seem interesting in a science fictiony, speculative way. But to me he veers too far toward the "other/higher reality that science cannot judge" type of thinking. What I like about Alan Watts is that he teases out the realities in mystic religious tradition without denying or contradicting what empirical evidence supports.
Consciousness, is the blankness behind my vision. Consciousness, is the existance beyond my perceptions--that which experiences them. And the ego, the mask, the person that dies, is but a trinket. There is no worry in your consciousness (because it is impersonal) YOU worry, and you will worry until death, unless you realize that your true self is consciousness, but at that point you are god and see things playfully, without worry. Death of person= the return to truth.
My consciousness, my conscious. Well, first, what is consciousness to you? You can understand consciousness, surely you can because I do, and if I do, you do because I and you are the same thing--but not the same person (mask). The mask is experience, the mask is the perceptions, the sensations. When we die, the mask, the temperary perceptions and experiences fade away, and we are pure conscious again. Without the restricting valve of the brain, consciousness is infinite.
Metabob. "we wake up and we are the same person." Consciousness bob, consciousness! Personality, ego, they have no connection, no similarity to consciousness. To be conscious (and i mean conscious as a noun here) is to be god. God as the awareness of existance as it is, rather than as words would describe it, wither it, and turn it into a human game. The truth is that everything is relative, literally. That time and matter are one, and that time is the motion of matter, and not a force outside.
Ever taken DMT? research "pineal gland" I guaranty you your on to something. and all i can say is the it is scientifically impossible to measure an individuals person reality such as "emotions" "dreams" "thoughts" emotional reality etc yet it exists this is what the current left hemisphere paradigm is ignoring, but don't take my word for it ANY ONE can prove to them selves there is more to life then squares and numbers. good luck....
listen i think this seperation of US. That being Atheists, Theists, or anything else is one of our biggest problems. We really need to learn to stop labeling ourselves. We are US! The religious, or non-religious beliefes we have are just holding us back from living in peace with one another. We are human and need to let go of this negative thinking that we are somehow seperarte from one another.
if all you do is think of your life,you do not get anywhere If you act you progress in any which way,a worse path or a good path.If you think about it though,Christianity is set into a good path,but Christians arent perfect in anyway,such as everyone else. But they[at least try]to devote their life to following God,because with Him you feel whole,from my personal experience IM NOT telling you to become Christian,that is ur choice. i just say try everything for ur self,stick with ur good choice
well friend, your presentation of the information here was... messy :/
but, the message was still there. and its pre-enlightenment. any person, when stripped of their ego, pride, and selfishness, is reduced to the same nature.. that of God! too many people view themselves as seperate from God, when in reality, they are of God. so when you pass a stranger on the street, view them as of God.., as of You. treat your neighbor as yourself, because you are the same :D Peace!
the question didnt came out quite right... like why are we like we are and not just live and die like animals? We live 2 think and progress, why? If you r god, (and i hav some same thinkin line there) why did u begin urself wif a life? (hard 2 ask questions u cant really put into words but only thoughts lol)... oh and why the why's?? xD
for long i felt and still do feel that i hate to think. funny to say it but the more i think the more i make sense and the more questions come and the more i am an outcast and the more its hard to blend in wif my family and friends. only my parents know how i feel,all the rest doesnt. just because they wud ask why and keep tryin 2 preach 2 me in a way and worry bout me that i dont want.. anyhow,off the point. the main question, why do we excist and why do we get emotional deep inside us bout it?
I was an realllly strong christian and neva eva cud hav thought i cud change my mind. evrybody always turned 2 me 4 questions. but last year i joined some church (also christianity) but they are way diff then normal christians. they believ in another way of things. they teached me 2 think in another way and after 6 months i just started thinking and came down 2 da same thinking place what u described here. All u said/read u put into words what i was thinking :) i still hav many questions though.
"You're my kind of people!"... I like that. Never felt like was part of something before! Kind of an outcast when ur atheist. At least in the dirty south! I'm glad there are other smart people out there.
I wonder if these people have actually read the bible fully and understand what it means. Everyone (including christians) gets the wrong idea of it. Paul does say that. He didn't mean we're all the same person, he meant that Jesus is within all of us and the capacity to do the things he did is also within us. God doesn't condone suffering. People condone it. God can't tell us what to do because that's, of course, not right. You wouldn't be able to choose whether to be atheist or christian.
I would like some evidence that says God Creates "terminal cancer, children being burned with napalm, concentration camps, the inquisition"
3 out of 4 of those are caused directly by other humans. Terminal cancer is just like tons of diseases that can be caused by radiation, hazardous chemicals, or genetic defects. In the ideal world where humans have not created any of these things and are protected pretty well in their natural habitat, cancer would not appear
You forget that God created us knowing full well what we will do when he made us, that whole omnipotent thing. So if I made a robot that I fully knew was going to napalm children then it's pretty easy to say that I was to blame for that child's fiery death. The same goes for the chemicals and radation we produce. God in fact made the tools (us) that made those carcinogens.
Watts tends to quote the bible not for its proper context but as a cultural bridge. BTW, atheism (or disbelief) is not a choice, it's an inescapable conclusion for those who follow their thoughts thru. I can no more choose to be a Christian than I can choose to believe the earth is flat. If it's unbelievable to me, I can't choose to make it believable. If a good God somehow, for some reason, allows gratuitous suffering and evil, this God has in fact left me no "choice" but unbelief.
perhaps i missed something, but why does Watts not continue his argument for 'what i would do if i were god' (which was to create 'a surprise button') to a possible reason for god(and why pain/suffering occurs). ie; man is god's surprise button
[nb; god would be assumed here to have no effect on current earth- he is merely watching]
Well Logos, I don't know how you could watch Watts and think "closed minded" in any way. And I am an atheist and don't appreciate being called closed-minded. However, Alan Watts would be considered an atheist toward Christianity because he didn't exactly address the idea of a divine son given to man to purge our sins. He favored a more transcendent view of god. Religion is just words that clutter the perfection of perception of existence.
I wish all christians would listen to this. You said very important things. I consider myself a christian, gnostic, non-catholic, among other things, lol. The christian myth must be understood in a new way, different from the way the catholic church preached. To understand what is a myth is totally important. Interesting video, very different from the stuff I´ve seen on youtube. I´ll check out your other videos later.
I worry that you pain Watts as an atheist, which he clearly was not. I don't think it does his reputation much good since it makes him look close-minded.
I enjoy the "digressions" you remind me slightly of a friend of mine. You both have a wonderful way with speaking/words and you both have a very..... insightful ... similar... vibes... though good vibes.
thanks for posting these videos, now i feel a little more informed :-)
I found your first video on Allen Watts because I was looking for infos/vids on Watts. Though before that I found a sound bite of his, and agreed with it, and decided to look him up one day... I enjoyed your videos and your views.
I am a former Christian, turned militant atheist, who has recently discovered Zen and Alan Watts. My whole perspective on life has been changed because of this man. I think if there really is a "good news" to be spread, it would be the good news of Alan Watts.
@scienceprodigy I practice what is called Naturalistic Buddhism by some. Admittedly, I am biased toward Zen, because they never tried to push an idea of literal reincarnation on me. All that I was told is that everything is reborn each moment, and that people's characteristics can pass to the next generation because the next generation learns the behavior. Also, Karma is just the fact that every action has a reaction.
36)Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37)Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38)This is the first and great commandment.
39)AND THE SECOND IS LIKE UNTO IT, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Have you read any Thomas Merton? Zen and the Birds of Appetite. Watts' background sounded the same. Its been years but his opening paragraph is worth the google. This was his last book and published in 1968. I believe he was a priest as well.
I just watched the Watts piece on Reproduction, after your recommendation of him. It was eerie to hear the exact fantasy I went through quite intensely in my teens — that we could be hooked into a massive reproduction with no way of knowing we were. The intense feeling of being watched in my private life prompted all kinds of exhausting, distorted behaviour which I had to give up in the end. Thanks for pointing me towards this guy's fascinating work.
I was a Christian until I discovered Alan Watts. To be honest with you, you're not doing any good by looking down upon people of different beliefs. Watts' greatest quality other than the fact that he was a bodhisattva, was that he was a uniter, not a divider. The title of your video drives people away and makes people frown upon the real teachings of the Way.
Try and checkout --do a search of 'Alan Watts Death' --you might have to experiment cause that could take you to lionks about HIS death. But he actually wrote an amazing chapter about his views on Death. It is best speculation I have ever read!
I think what wilmn and many atheists overlook is that atheism is a non-belief in supernatural vs. natural dualism being literlly true. We lead our lives, then die, case closed.
But if everything turns out to be god and we are all ultimately the same person (pantheism) then how is that ontologically different from scientific materialism? I see pantheism as trivial, i.e., how does it screw someone up - like theism?
enjoyed a vid with some ideas! Couldn't agree more with psychtruth though when he said what does watts have to do with atheism? watts thought everything and everybody was god. maybe you should define god and atheism. watts was a everything is it, enlightenmen guy. god (or conciousness) is everything...
There's nothing like being told not to do something! Yes here I am again and again I appreciate your measured views. I have no idea or assurance about life after death. It's irrelevant to my life here and now. This moment is all I have now and I'll live it and enjoy it. My instinct is ala Don McLean: "the book of life is brief and when a page is read, all but love is dead, that is my belief". So raise a glass with me to love - but not Pepsi.
I'm confused. As a person who has studied comparative religion as a hobby, I both understand and agree with (for the most part) what Mr. Watts had to say. These are DEEPLY spiritual ideas. What the hell does that have to do with Atheism?
It doesn't necessarily. God is not central belief to all religions. Why does god have to be some old fart sitting on a thrown? Read about "emanationism." Most "atheist" are really just materialist. Watt's was talking about a more eastern view of the divine though.
Also the idea of life after death has EVERYTHING to do with spirituality. Objectively we see the body dies. There is no argument that bodies die. The question as you put at the end of the video is, "Does conscience continue after body death?" If so, that is the spirit. The spirit is a central concept in all religions where as god is not.
Life after death has NOTHING to do with spirituality as it has been EXPERIENCED by every "spiritual" person who has ever lived. Because they were alive, not dead, while they were feeling "spiritual." Whether or not Jesus meant it this way when he said it*, "The Kingdom of Heaven is within you now."
Very cool stuff. I loved your discussion of myth after the reading. I also like your idea of life after death (as a concept). I'm with ya, man, and I hope to see more videos going in depth on this stuff.
In India God isn't with you, you are a part of the supreme being, Vishnu. Bharaman, Krishna, and Shiva, Creator, Savior, and Destroyer, are parts of Vishnu. All the gods are a part of Vishnu, everything is a part of Vishnu. If you say you are god, it isn't a big deal because you were already a part of Vishnu.
i've read alot of watts. i have a number of his audio and video tapes. you can find some limited watts here on utube. he helped start the beat generation here in the US... reading watts is what caused my backsliding to agnosticism. yes, i'm a fence sitter... :) i veiw buddhism more a philosophy after reading buddhism: the religion of no religion.
Do NOT backslide into agnosticism! Be a complete and total atheist -- you don't need to believe anthing that an atheist disbelieves in order to get what Watts if offering. He's NOT offering "a guy in the sky" or an afterlife.
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youre going to hell
blizzard4422 5 months ago
Hi dude, cool vids, I really liked the end of this one, ah, ah! Just brilliant :)
ScalinoCorleone 6 months ago
To everyone that read my comment, That was my younger 14 year old brother. He is very immatuure. I am very sorry for the comment he made. To be honest, I'm actully athiest. But as i said, I give you all my most humble apologies.
michaelsdhfsj 9 months ago
Hey bitch. Im christian. What are you gona do about it, Jump through the computer and beat the shit out of me. Heh, I belive not.
Dickface.
michaelsdhfsj 9 months ago
@michaelsdhfsj Question for you. Between MetaBob's video and your own reaction, who is expressing forgiveness and love? Perhaps neither?
Did MetaBob insult you in the video itself? Did he denigrate your religion in the video? Why might a person tell you not to enter, then neither evict you or berate you after you do?
If you are lured into a room, by whatever means, and then are handed a gift (you may like the gift of not, accept the gift or not), is the giver deserving of being insulted?
riverwindbonsai 9 months ago
Im a Christian, i just have one very very simple questions for any athiest no matter what level of knowledge, but HOW WAS THE EARTH CREATED? im 14 so let me have it with your theological advanced words of wisdom! :D ( sarcasm )
PQSCrohns 1 year ago
@PQSCrohns
watch?v=_mcC8kFacrk or type "history of the Earth" in Google and read the wiki page that comes up.
The internet with its vast world of information is at your fingertips, literally... use it!
Spetsop 11 months ago
Alan Watts is really good at pulling bits of meaning out of the nihilistic ether, like pulling a quarter from the air.
I like Robert Anton Wilson better for healing the rift between science and mysticism, without compromising either, and for his excellent sense of humor.
I like James Burke for pulling sensational bits of meaning out of the scientific mish mosh, for generating a narrative for the evolution of science, and it's role in the whole of human progress, without mythologizing it.
Jcolinsol 1 year ago
quote at the end of the vid was the best in my opinion lol
KuntOut 1 year ago
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(Philippians 2:10-11):.."that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father".
This was written 300 years before the Koran. Even the demons will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord. It will be a forced bow but EVERYONE will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord when He comes again.
ImagesByDavid 1 year ago
I'll buy that book.
blackmullen182 1 year ago
Yea its true Jesus is Alive and He Jesus is the King of Kings...
Praise you Jesus I Love you my Lord...
ImagesByDavid 1 year ago
@ImagesByDavid jesus is not the lord.... jesus is a prophet god sent down to warn the people that what they were doing was wrong. you shouldnt praise him cuz hes not god. he is nothing compared to god! he isnt gods son or god, he is a prophet just like noah,gabriel,moses,and muhammed!
nessie0bella0edward 1 year ago
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(Philippians 2:10-11):.."that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father".
This was written 300 years before the Koran. Even the demons will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord. It will be a forced bow but EVERYONE will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord when He comes again.
ImagesByDavid 1 year ago
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@nessie0bella0edward
(Philippians 2:10-11):.."that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father".
This was written 300 years before the Koran. Even the demons will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord. It will be a forced bow but EVERYONE will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord when He comes again.
ImagesByDavid 1 year ago
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@nessie0bella0edward
"that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, 11 and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father". (Philipians 2:10-11)
ImagesByDavid 1 year ago
@nessie0bella0edward
(Philippians 2:10-11):.."that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father".
This was written 300 years before the Koran. Even the demons will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord. It will be a forced bow but EVERYONE will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord when He comes again.
ImagesByDavid 1 year ago
You say in this video "I'd like to talk about Watts and what he means to me..."
make that video!
(please)
mervdogg 1 year ago
Great vid MetaBob ^5 I'm curious if you're familiar with "The Neo-Tech Discovery" and other great writings by Frank R Wallace ?
Knocks4U 2 years ago
Wow, It seems like some of the posters didn't even watch the video. Or if they did, they're so blinded by indoctrination that they didn't hear what they were listening to. In any case, I wish that everybody would read "The Book: On the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are," by Watts. It was life-transforming for me.
LanceREads 2 years ago
Comment removed
hayman4548213 2 years ago
ha ha ha ha ha ha @2:04
I love meta bob's digression
5hafayet 2 years ago
Comment removed
hayman4548213 2 years ago
Exactly. Theosophical esoteric nonsense spewed for by the Lucis(fer) trust run UN.
You have the aleister crowley look down to a T megabob.
kingstuks 2 years ago
@hayman4548213
Your lack of curiosity and your blind obedience make you look like one sad puppet.
Xigano1 2 years ago
Genius!! Yep, I'm Christian and I listened in on the whole thing against your wishes lol. I always argue with atheists that Christianity was meant to be a very spiritual thing and not religious, and that we all have access to the powers of the Holy Spirit for the betterment of the here and now- which is what I feel you instinctively identify as that "oneness". But, I'm sure you and I may differ on that idea.
Knocked my socks off, I know what book I'll be reading for summer.
waftv 3 years ago 3
good for you!! i salute you got not attacking this video!!
11889music 2 years ago
dear god you self satisfied religious ramblings make me sick
NatsukaT 2 years ago
GOD KILLED HIS OWN MOTHERFUCKING SON!
maksniper 3 years ago
He didn't we humans did but this was meant for people to be forgiven
The people did this because they thought Jesus was lying and i read this about a book about Roman mistakes in the past
kidasterorig111 2 years ago
No, we did, yet your right anyway because theres no disctinction between who we really are and God
Jonnygraham24 2 years ago
stupid
mysteryman4321 3 years ago
Or perhaps if He was omniscient, he does this to show us all what terrible things we are capable of and to fully realize how messed the world has come to be because of us, and therefore how much we need Him.
SobeDragon7 3 years ago
Well Sobe, all I can say is that 98% of Christan scholars would disagree with you regarding God's omni-powers. To address your second point, God allows bad things to happen just to show us what horrible little creatures we are? But it's God that is allowing all this to happen by allowing us to do it, that was my whole point earlier. We are God's killer robots napalming children from my example below, so God is responsible for making us. You haven't advanced your point at all.
Noz4ah2 3 years ago
My previous comment was to SobeDragon7, and this is a continuation of that. Thanks YouTube for posting a comment reply at the top of the whole conversation.
God's omnipotence and omniscience pretty much makes him responsible for everything that happens in our universe anywhere, since he made it all knowing exactly everything that is going to happen in it at any given moment. It therefore stands to reason that there is exactly as much suffering in the world as God wanted when he made it.
Noz4ah2 3 years ago
For some reason the replies go directly to the top when I post them.
God is not omniscient and omnipotent if He gave us free will to choose. This comes down to the timeless question: do we have free will or not? No one can answer that, we don't know enough about the brain.
SobeDragon7 3 years ago
You must forgive me; as watts said, Its impossible for the thing to describe it-self, and so I've had to go around it-self, but now I think its even more lost than if I had just let it show it-self.
phvalue323 3 years ago
phvalue323:
I haven't watched this in forever, and can't work up much enthusiam for listening to me stumble and digress around what I want to say, which is the way I remember this.
But whatever I may have said here, your comments above are pretty close to how I would have liked to express it.
(more)
MetaBob 3 years ago
I know that in several videos I used the word "person" inaccurately, since "persona" refers to the mask-like aspect of self. But yes, the idea I was trying to get at was that behind all our personas, we share the same consciousness, and that that indefinable "essence" can be called the consciousness of God. "God" in the pantheistic, impersonal sense. Or as my fellow YouTube atheist philhellenes once put it, "we are the universe made conscious." Atheism meets mysticism.
MetaBob 3 years ago
Have you heard of terrence mckenna?
phvalue323 3 years ago
I have. Some of his ideas seem interesting in a science fictiony, speculative way. But to me he veers too far toward the "other/higher reality that science cannot judge" type of thinking. What I like about Alan Watts is that he teases out the realities in mystic religious tradition without denying or contradicting what empirical evidence supports.
MetaBob 3 years ago
Consciousness, is the blankness behind my vision. Consciousness, is the existance beyond my perceptions--that which experiences them. And the ego, the mask, the person that dies, is but a trinket. There is no worry in your consciousness (because it is impersonal) YOU worry, and you will worry until death, unless you realize that your true self is consciousness, but at that point you are god and see things playfully, without worry. Death of person= the return to truth.
phvalue323 3 years ago
My consciousness, my conscious. Well, first, what is consciousness to you? You can understand consciousness, surely you can because I do, and if I do, you do because I and you are the same thing--but not the same person (mask). The mask is experience, the mask is the perceptions, the sensations. When we die, the mask, the temperary perceptions and experiences fade away, and we are pure conscious again. Without the restricting valve of the brain, consciousness is infinite.
phvalue323 3 years ago
Metabob. "we wake up and we are the same person." Consciousness bob, consciousness! Personality, ego, they have no connection, no similarity to consciousness. To be conscious (and i mean conscious as a noun here) is to be god. God as the awareness of existance as it is, rather than as words would describe it, wither it, and turn it into a human game. The truth is that everything is relative, literally. That time and matter are one, and that time is the motion of matter, and not a force outside.
phvalue323 3 years ago
Sir, you're so wrong about what Christianity teaches about when we die. Maybe you should try reading the bible one more time.
TheInvaderBN 3 years ago
what you are said exactly sum up your video: just a 'bunch of ideas absorbed by your head'!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! that's all it is, just a bunch of ....
sthcrox 3 years ago
cut head
DraGorian777 3 years ago
Ever taken DMT? research "pineal gland" I guaranty you your on to something. and all i can say is the it is scientifically impossible to measure an individuals person reality such as "emotions" "dreams" "thoughts" emotional reality etc yet it exists this is what the current left hemisphere paradigm is ignoring, but don't take my word for it ANY ONE can prove to them selves there is more to life then squares and numbers. good luck....
314159muse 3 years ago 2
Your account picture looks like Alan Watts haha, I don't know if you did that on purpose.
sophocles49 3 years ago
Life
kellaneric 3 years ago
listen i think this seperation of US. That being Atheists, Theists, or anything else is one of our biggest problems. We really need to learn to stop labeling ourselves. We are US! The religious, or non-religious beliefes we have are just holding us back from living in peace with one another. We are human and need to let go of this negative thinking that we are somehow seperarte from one another.
peace
kellaneric 3 years ago
A very profound final thought...glad I stuck around
Nickdap 3 years ago
if all you do is think of your life,you do not get anywhere If you act you progress in any which way,a worse path or a good path.If you think about it though,Christianity is set into a good path,but Christians arent perfect in anyway,such as everyone else. But they[at least try]to devote their life to following God,because with Him you feel whole,from my personal experience IM NOT telling you to become Christian,that is ur choice. i just say try everything for ur self,stick with ur good choice
1841518 3 years ago
well friend, your presentation of the information here was... messy :/
but, the message was still there. and its pre-enlightenment. any person, when stripped of their ego, pride, and selfishness, is reduced to the same nature.. that of God! too many people view themselves as seperate from God, when in reality, they are of God. so when you pass a stranger on the street, view them as of God.., as of You. treat your neighbor as yourself, because you are the same :D Peace!
scubajon88 3 years ago
Please prove this
Domo230 3 years ago
the question didnt came out quite right... like why are we like we are and not just live and die like animals? We live 2 think and progress, why? If you r god, (and i hav some same thinkin line there) why did u begin urself wif a life? (hard 2 ask questions u cant really put into words but only thoughts lol)... oh and why the why's?? xD
Mysteriouslylizzy 3 years ago
for long i felt and still do feel that i hate to think. funny to say it but the more i think the more i make sense and the more questions come and the more i am an outcast and the more its hard to blend in wif my family and friends. only my parents know how i feel,all the rest doesnt. just because they wud ask why and keep tryin 2 preach 2 me in a way and worry bout me that i dont want.. anyhow,off the point. the main question, why do we excist and why do we get emotional deep inside us bout it?
Mysteriouslylizzy 3 years ago
I was an realllly strong christian and neva eva cud hav thought i cud change my mind. evrybody always turned 2 me 4 questions. but last year i joined some church (also christianity) but they are way diff then normal christians. they believ in another way of things. they teached me 2 think in another way and after 6 months i just started thinking and came down 2 da same thinking place what u described here. All u said/read u put into words what i was thinking :) i still hav many questions though.
Mysteriouslylizzy 3 years ago
"You're my kind of people!"... I like that. Never felt like was part of something before! Kind of an outcast when ur atheist. At least in the dirty south! I'm glad there are other smart people out there.
relworp69 3 years ago
I wonder if these people have actually read the bible fully and understand what it means. Everyone (including christians) gets the wrong idea of it. Paul does say that. He didn't mean we're all the same person, he meant that Jesus is within all of us and the capacity to do the things he did is also within us. God doesn't condone suffering. People condone it. God can't tell us what to do because that's, of course, not right. You wouldn't be able to choose whether to be atheist or christian.
SobeDragon7 3 years ago
Evidence please.
sciencedoggy 3 years ago
I would have to quote the whole bible.
But the last point:
excerpt from Joshua 24:15
choose you this day whom ye will serve.
SobeDragon7 3 years ago
I would like some evidence that says God Creates "terminal cancer, children being burned with napalm, concentration camps, the inquisition"
3 out of 4 of those are caused directly by other humans. Terminal cancer is just like tons of diseases that can be caused by radiation, hazardous chemicals, or genetic defects. In the ideal world where humans have not created any of these things and are protected pretty well in their natural habitat, cancer would not appear
SobeDragon7 3 years ago
You forget that God created us knowing full well what we will do when he made us, that whole omnipotent thing. So if I made a robot that I fully knew was going to napalm children then it's pretty easy to say that I was to blame for that child's fiery death. The same goes for the chemicals and radation we produce. God in fact made the tools (us) that made those carcinogens.
Noz4ah2 3 years ago
Watts tends to quote the bible not for its proper context but as a cultural bridge. BTW, atheism (or disbelief) is not a choice, it's an inescapable conclusion for those who follow their thoughts thru. I can no more choose to be a Christian than I can choose to believe the earth is flat. If it's unbelievable to me, I can't choose to make it believable. If a good God somehow, for some reason, allows gratuitous suffering and evil, this God has in fact left me no "choice" but unbelief.
Michadelic 3 years ago
It's more of a cop-out, really.
Dude421 3 years ago
perhaps i missed something, but why does Watts not continue his argument for 'what i would do if i were god' (which was to create 'a surprise button') to a possible reason for god(and why pain/suffering occurs). ie; man is god's surprise button
[nb; god would be assumed here to have no effect on current earth- he is merely watching]
PelicanFrost 4 years ago
Well Logos, I don't know how you could watch Watts and think "closed minded" in any way. And I am an atheist and don't appreciate being called closed-minded. However, Alan Watts would be considered an atheist toward Christianity because he didn't exactly address the idea of a divine son given to man to purge our sins. He favored a more transcendent view of god. Religion is just words that clutter the perfection of perception of existence.
EchosideProductions 4 years ago
I wish all christians would listen to this. You said very important things. I consider myself a christian, gnostic, non-catholic, among other things, lol. The christian myth must be understood in a new way, different from the way the catholic church preached. To understand what is a myth is totally important. Interesting video, very different from the stuff I´ve seen on youtube. I´ll check out your other videos later.
wolneymartini 4 years ago
Alan Watts is a Zen. I love his all speeches. Zen Buddhist
icp101982 4 years ago
I worry that you pain Watts as an atheist, which he clearly was not. I don't think it does his reputation much good since it makes him look close-minded.
logosthedestroyer 4 years ago
I enjoy the "digressions" you remind me slightly of a friend of mine. You both have a wonderful way with speaking/words and you both have a very..... insightful ... similar... vibes... though good vibes.
thanks for posting these videos, now i feel a little more informed :-)
SmoothCollision 4 years ago
I found your first video on Allen Watts because I was looking for infos/vids on Watts. Though before that I found a sound bite of his, and agreed with it, and decided to look him up one day... I enjoyed your videos and your views.
SmoothCollision 4 years ago
its the white Paul Mooney!
BronzeEleven 4 years ago
I am a former Christian, turned militant atheist, who has recently discovered Zen and Alan Watts. My whole perspective on life has been changed because of this man. I think if there really is a "good news" to be spread, it would be the good news of Alan Watts.
Rock on brutha!
scienceprodigy 4 years ago 8
Militant atheist huh? So you are more certain there is a god than anyone else? :)
logosthedestroyer 4 years ago
@scienceprodigy I practice what is called Naturalistic Buddhism by some. Admittedly, I am biased toward Zen, because they never tried to push an idea of literal reincarnation on me. All that I was told is that everything is reborn each moment, and that people's characteristics can pass to the next generation because the next generation learns the behavior. Also, Karma is just the fact that every action has a reaction.
NewVinland 1 year ago
lol your digressions arent so bad...thanks for the video. I've watched a few Alan Watts videos and I'm gonna read some of his work. cheers :)
Z4lUS 4 years ago 2
Could it be that "Evil" actions exist because the gods wont stop practicing "evil" on themselves?
?
vzmoore 4 years ago
For consideration:
Bible KJV, Matthew 22:36-39
36)Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37)Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38)This is the first and great commandment.
39)AND THE SECOND IS LIKE UNTO IT, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
vzmoore 4 years ago
Which could be translated one should love God, thy Neighbor, and thyself with all their heart, soul, and mind. Or God = thyself and thy neighbor.
?
vzmoore 4 years ago
Have you read any Thomas Merton? Zen and the Birds of Appetite. Watts' background sounded the same. Its been years but his opening paragraph is worth the google. This was his last book and published in 1968. I believe he was a priest as well.
dynamoehummm 4 years ago
why are all atheists so big on 'christian bashing'
they are the main ones who discriminate lol
y0rgos 4 years ago
I just watched the Watts piece on Reproduction, after your recommendation of him. It was eerie to hear the exact fantasy I went through quite intensely in my teens — that we could be hooked into a massive reproduction with no way of knowing we were. The intense feeling of being watched in my private life prompted all kinds of exhausting, distorted behaviour which I had to give up in the end. Thanks for pointing me towards this guy's fascinating work.
TheraminTrees 4 years ago
I was a Christian until I discovered Alan Watts. To be honest with you, you're not doing any good by looking down upon people of different beliefs. Watts' greatest quality other than the fact that he was a bodhisattva, was that he was a uniter, not a divider. The title of your video drives people away and makes people frown upon the real teachings of the Way.
TurboRonin83 4 years ago 2
well said..I was gonna chastise this guy myself for his negativity until i read your comment.
4eyedCyclopes 4 years ago
wow, that was a beautiful reading...
i've never heard about this guy until today. im going out to get his book tomarrow.
sheepwshotguns 4 years ago
Try and checkout --do a search of 'Alan Watts Death' --you might have to experiment cause that could take you to lionks about HIS death. But he actually wrote an amazing chapter about his views on Death. It is best speculation I have ever read!
zezt 4 years ago
You may be talking about the chapter that I read from in my vid, "What does Alan Watts have to do with Atheism?"
MetaBob 4 years ago
I think what wilmn and many atheists overlook is that atheism is a non-belief in supernatural vs. natural dualism being literlly true. We lead our lives, then die, case closed.
But if everything turns out to be god and we are all ultimately the same person (pantheism) then how is that ontologically different from scientific materialism? I see pantheism as trivial, i.e., how does it screw someone up - like theism?
JGL53 4 years ago
enjoyed a vid with some ideas! Couldn't agree more with psychtruth though when he said what does watts have to do with atheism? watts thought everything and everybody was god. maybe you should define god and atheism. watts was a everything is it, enlightenmen guy. god (or conciousness) is everything...
wllmn 5 years ago
wllmn, your comment here inspired my latest vid, "What does Alan Watts have to do with Atheism?"
MetaBob 5 years ago
I love what you said at the end.
bluesinorbit 5 years ago
There's nothing like being told not to do something! Yes here I am again and again I appreciate your measured views. I have no idea or assurance about life after death. It's irrelevant to my life here and now. This moment is all I have now and I'll live it and enjoy it. My instinct is ala Don McLean: "the book of life is brief and when a page is read, all but love is dead, that is my belief". So raise a glass with me to love - but not Pepsi.
uniqlo47 5 years ago
I'm confused. As a person who has studied comparative religion as a hobby, I both understand and agree with (for the most part) what Mr. Watts had to say. These are DEEPLY spiritual ideas. What the hell does that have to do with Atheism?
psychtruth 5 years ago
I'd turn that question around and ask, what does a belief in God, or in life after death, have to do with spirituality?
MetaBob 5 years ago
It doesn't necessarily. God is not central belief to all religions. Why does god have to be some old fart sitting on a thrown? Read about "emanationism." Most "atheist" are really just materialist. Watt's was talking about a more eastern view of the divine though.
psychtruth 5 years ago
Also the idea of life after death has EVERYTHING to do with spirituality. Objectively we see the body dies. There is no argument that bodies die. The question as you put at the end of the video is, "Does conscience continue after body death?" If so, that is the spirit. The spirit is a central concept in all religions where as god is not.
psychtruth 5 years ago
Life after death has NOTHING to do with spirituality as it has been EXPERIENCED by every "spiritual" person who has ever lived. Because they were alive, not dead, while they were feeling "spiritual." Whether or not Jesus meant it this way when he said it*, "The Kingdom of Heaven is within you now."
*...yeah, fellow athiests,I know: IF he said it.
MetaBob 5 years ago
A fun video to listen to
Castaa 5 years ago
I'm so happy that you read an excerpt from his writings. I'm pretty excited to read more by him.
dearperson 5 years ago
Do you think I should read more excerpts in future vids?
MetaBob 5 years ago
:D
Thanks for the recommendation. I suppose I'm not as well read as I thought.
dearperson 5 years ago
"This will be cut out. Yes indeed, this will get cut out." Classic! Because man is beautiful due to his frailty.
burnvictim77 5 years ago
As an editor I'm supposed to be able to tell when "mistakes" are actually gold.
MetaBob 5 years ago
you didn't cut that stuff out, although watching you say "this will get cut out" is kind of cute
eldritchwizard 5 years ago
I just wikiquoted him... and im liking what i see.
Pandacraft 5 years ago
Very cool stuff. I loved your discussion of myth after the reading. I also like your idea of life after death (as a concept). I'm with ya, man, and I hope to see more videos going in depth on this stuff.
wonderist 5 years ago
5&F. Got a dogeared copy on the shelf, next to Z&TAoMM.
my15minutes 5 years ago
I deciphered "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance." But what's 5&F?
MetaBob 5 years ago
5'ed and Favorited. Little shorthand comment I came up with.
my15minutes 5 years ago
Cool. Thanks!
MetaBob 5 years ago
In India God isn't with you, you are a part of the supreme being, Vishnu. Bharaman, Krishna, and Shiva, Creator, Savior, and Destroyer, are parts of Vishnu. All the gods are a part of Vishnu, everything is a part of Vishnu. If you say you are god, it isn't a big deal because you were already a part of Vishnu.
OoogieBoogie 5 years ago
i've read alot of watts. i have a number of his audio and video tapes. you can find some limited watts here on utube. he helped start the beat generation here in the US... reading watts is what caused my backsliding to agnosticism. yes, i'm a fence sitter... :) i veiw buddhism more a philosophy after reading buddhism: the religion of no religion.
cloud hidden-whereabouts unknown
cateyesTV 5 years ago
Do NOT backslide into agnosticism! Be a complete and total atheist -- you don't need to believe anthing that an atheist disbelieves in order to get what Watts if offering. He's NOT offering "a guy in the sky" or an afterlife.
MetaBob 5 years ago