Probably did more to reduce meat intake than all the pure veggie presentation. I was a vegetarian for 3 months and now I started eating meat again. Wish me luck folks...the next time will hopefully be for much longer
I think eating some meat can be justified because animals that we eat are much more successful. Because they are useful to us they survive well. If we didn't eat meat these animals would not be mass produced and I think they would rather live to be eaten than to not live at all.
I disagree with your idea thag animals would rather live to be eaten than not live at all. In the case of traditionally hunted animals or animals that are raised in humane settings for slaughter, what you're saying may be true. But the way the animals are raised and slaughtered in the modern meat industry negates any notion that at least being alive is better than not existing at all.
If we did not eat meat these species of animal would not exist. The cows, and other domesticated animals you see today are created by humans through selective breeding, and other methods into other creatures. Forced evolution I guess you could call it, we turned them into far more productive beings, but at what moral cost?
We are also most certainly not making them healthier in many cases, just making them produce more meat, which is a pretty silly idea in retrospect.
The best and the worst thing about the human-being: the ability to think. You will NEVER see an ANIMAL be like "ew, I wont eat this because some other animal died"
"The best and the worst thing about the human-being: the ability to think. You will NEVER see an ANIMAL be like "ew, I wont eat this because some other animal died"
I've never met a vegetarian who doesn't eat meat because they're disgusted by the thought of eating a dead animal. I'm a vegetarian because the modern meat industry - unlike the traditional practice of hunting animals in the wild - is ethically and environmentally detrimental.
A more accurate way to put this would be to say that human beings have the ability to think "I won't eat this because it causes immense suffering to animals and because it is an unsustainable source of damage to our planet". Yes, humans alone possess this capacity, in the same way that we are the only animals to be able to write a declaration of universal human rights. Thank god we have this capacity because, unlike other animals, only we are capable of using our intellect to destroy our planet.
Actually Chimpanzees have the ability to think such conscious thoughts, and for all we know other animals might be able to as well, we simply haven't studied that enough. Jane Goodall exposed the fact that Chimpanzees display almost every human emotion, and characteristic. All living things have the ability to become what we are intellectually, but the chances are unfortunately against them. Evolution didn't just pick us because we were nice, it was pure chance.
I think it its a good thing that he is cutting meat out of his diet, if only slowly. I get that if more people tried this then it would help the environment drastically- but this should be considered as a jumping off point.
trust me, its not that hard to give up meat once you become educated about the processes it took to get it on your plate. If more people knew things like THAT, then change would come.
Seriously? Give this guy some credit. I've only been a vegan since the beginning if the year but I've been vegetarian for 7 years. Getting other people to follow a veg way of life (for health, environmental and ethical reasons) is difficult. It's difficult to be a "perfect" vegan-- everything you eat harms some animal in some way. If he can inspire people to change, even slightly, then I have nothing but respect and love for him.
Inherently the problem is not our decision to eat meat, but how we treat the animals, ultimately in nature they would be eaten anyways. So we as conscious beings would be doing no wrong by providing them with a better life then they could naturally poses, in exchange for food. However as we have seen some among us choose to not respect the animals, and don't give back. Then it gets even worse when you bring in the fact that most meat we eat is not natural.
@NeutralExistence My decision to become a vegan stems, inherently, from my belief in using my human nature to reduce suffering instead of cause it. I couldn’t agree with you more--the treatment of animals raised for commodity is not justifiable moral. For me, the decision to reduce suffering is one extended far beyond my own species, but that is not to say that it does not incorporate my own. I idealize those who use their potential to benefit the world, even if their action is of the
@NeutralExistence smallest measurement. I think it needs reminding that we are giants of chaos with steps of destruction, and we cant afford to be clumsy. Yes, our bodies have the ability to digest meat. Yes, animals would be naturally eaten in nature (although I don’t think it’s possible to provide a better environment for them then what is natural). The point is that growing animals to use as commodities is essential destroying
@NeutralExistence everything; our personal and national health (along side our financial pocket), our environment (as I believe was this guys point), and yes, I am a believer that it is also destroying our individual morality--for those aware of the suffering it causes
@NeutralExistence and do nothing to defend against it. We as a species should not and cannot afford to cause such destruction, especially with the exponential population expansion and loss of the worlds natural ecosystems. Any steps towards the reducing of suffering to me seems like a good thing. Sometimes logically things need to be taken in steps, despite how frustratingly obvious the answers seem to be. Thanks for being like minded.
I guess the hardest part is to change within, and if people are truly able to give up a meat eating lifestyle then no doubt we will see things change fast. Personally however I think that organic methods of farming etc.. are a better method then stopping eating meat altogether, since that would also eliminate our need for the animals. We must change our methods of farming, instead of our diets, or at least that seems the most efficient.
@NeutralExistence Cows kept in terrible environments, being fed food their stomachs weren't ever supposed to process, polluting the environment and using a significant amount of water vs no cows being born, raised and slaughtered within the system? I choose no cows. Organic, grass fed cattle will never be able to feed the same number of people that intensively farmed cows do, so clearly a change must occur in the choices of consumers. We must change our methods of farming, as well as our diets.
How do you think they would be kept if we didn't eat them? Look how we treat things we don't eat, I am sure a lab monkey would love to trade places with the cow. I think the cows have it pretty good compared to the monkeys who are tested on, and put through all sorts of cruel bullshit. At least when its food we have that little bit of guilt to keep us from making it go extinct. Stopping eating them would make entire cow species disappear, or worse.
@NeutralExistence If we didn't eat cows there would be less of them bred. Less of them to suffer needlessly and die largely for human desires, not needs.
Extinction means nothing to extinct species since non-existent beings can't suffer or be deprived of anything.
It's down to human vanity why we arbitrarily keep species going, not animal welfare.
I could torture you for the rest of your life but it's okay because I'd be keeping you alive, right? That's your logic.
In no way was that an argument supporting the treatment of domesticated bovine, but one must consider how to best go about changing the mentality of man gradually, as to reduce the risk of destroying entire species. Like I said look how we treat the things we don't eat, simply turning into vegetarians isn't going to stop the suffering of these animals, nor will it change the mentality that made us think these actions are okay.
@NeutralExistence What value is there in keeping species going from the point of view of the members of a species? Do you think the last two pandas on earth will know or care that they are the last of their kind?
99% of the species which have ever existed are now extinct.
The welfare of conscious beings (human and otherwise) is all that matters. Conservation is a massive waste of time and resources.
Well existence is a good one, living... On a biological level, the only thing that matters is creating more successful copies of one's cell's. To take it above that can hinder a species existence, we have proven this many a time...
I suppose you assume we wont find some other purpose for the millions of cows we have if we just all of a sudden stopped eating them? I don't even want to imagine what all the "cow factories" would figure out as a good solution...
@NeutralExistence Survival and reproduction is all that matters to a piece of chemistry which can accurately be described as a virus (DNA).
Unlike DNA we have intelligence and the ability to empathise. Surely the greatest thing ever to be produced by blind natural forces.
Killing (or preferably neutering) the last remaining factory cows would be worse than continuing to breed and kill them in far greater numbers and keeping the factory farms going? I think not.
That "piece of chemistry" is the building blocks for all life as we know it, one cant really even try to contrast our newly formed consciousness to DNA, which has taken many a millennium to reach its state of perfection. You think its better to moralize, then rationalize? I think the definition of intelligence is quite subjective frankly, for I know cellular life can problem solve, and personally consider the pro-creation of life in itself to be intelligence.
Who said we have to keep breeding/killing them, you seem to be missing my point.... I am all for us searching for less harmful solutions to our food problems, but I am stating that it needs to be a gradual process, otherwise everything is going to be effected. One cant change 100+ thousand years of diet in a couple years time, we need to think of alternatives, and maybe instead of risking loosing these species, we could help them back into nature slowly.
''Imagine your last hamburger'' as if there is no alternative for vegetarians... come on that's just riducule I ate a vegan burger few days ago and it was even better than one made with dead cows. He make it sound like being vegetarian is hard, it's not it's easy once you're used to it!
Man this video is horse shit. I mean I get what the dude is saying but he's basing his theory on the same principles as being addicted to cigarettes, or crack. He came to terms with everything that is wrong with meat eating, but then decided it's too hard to give it all up. "Can you imagine your last burger" That sounds all too similar with smokers. Have your last cigarette. Never take drugs again. Wake up, you're conditionally addicted to this food and it's made you too weak to drop it.
@Neutral666 its exactly like smoking. Every craving produced by your brain is longing for chemical gratification. Meat, cigarettes, sports, all produce a chemical reward. Its hardly horse shit, in fact the mechanisms are pretty well established.
La 4 unuaj minutoj estas bonegaj kaj aŭskultindaj ! Se vi ne komprenas ilin, vi povas trovi Esperanto-tradukon tie : "Kial mi estas labortaga vegetarano" : ted.com/talks/lang/epo/graham_hill_weekday_vegetarian.html
I'm vegan. 1) Vegan food is the most delicious food- vegweb.com... also, it will get easier as more people demand vegetarian food 2) my conscience is unburdened knowing my habits reduce suffering of my fellow animals - meat.org 3) I may not be able to stop war, but i can save 130 lives per year 4) I have tons of energy and do not fear obesity, cancer, diabetes and autoimmune disorders 5) I'm slim without really trying 6) reduce violence to the environment/people/animals
there is a reason humans eat meat, we are Omnivores.
its because of our Hunter brain that we don't still live in treetops.
herbivores aren't as smart as carnivores since
Herbivore: OMG LION!! RUNN!!!
Carnivore: observe herd,pick out weakest link,talk to pack, formulate strategy,sneak up on herd, execute plan, WIN!
I understand that Vegetarian is probably healthier, but what you guys do not understand is that either way Animals are gonna die because for veggies you need farm land
@spetznas101 but if ur okay with rotting meat in ur intestines, im all up for that. im not telling you should be a non meat eater, im telling you the truth.
Not all omnivores( and even carnivores) can eat rotting meat the animals that can are called Scavengers like Hyenas and certain birds.
Also like said before since for thousands of years, we haven't actually have to eat raw meat, our stomach acid got weaker. The reason those animals can eat rotting meat is because their stomach acid is strong enough to kill of bacteria and parasites.
@spetznas101 last i checked we don't have natural predators, and besides Leonardo Da Vinci was a vegetarian, and Aristotle, and Isaac Newton, infact pretty much every ancient philosophor did not eat meat, go figure, and don't prove to me you're stupid by inflicting a flame war...hope i didn't touch a nerve
Yes we have allot of natural predators bears,giant cats, hyenas,wolfs,etc.. they are all natural predators, even still now people are eaten by them.
Are you sure? I cant find any sources stating Aristotle was vegetarian, and saying "pretty much much every ancient philosopher" better have some proof of that. cause I only see 2 that you gave.
They weren't smart because they were vegetarian, they were vegetarian cause they were smart.
@spetznas101 my mistake he was a vegan, and you didn't really touch a nerve by proving me right. please don't tell me you actually used the internet to find out if these people were vegetarian
How did I prove you right? you were wrong about the natural predators,about Aristotle, and you said "almost every one" but you only gave me 3 examples ,1 of which was wrong.
Well I didn't know them personally, and since the Internet is a collection of most of human knowledge
its probably the fastest and most accurate way to find any info, you just have to check the sources.
Ranting? Thats not ranting thats proving you wrong, but maybe someone that douchy cant see the difference.
Haha dude you cant just debate with someone and then say " if you reply you are stupid" now maybe you thought i was ranting but I know you are an idiot.
@spetznas101 And no we are not omnivores. omnivores when hungry,have the killer instinct to rip an animal to shreds and eat it raw, for humans a dead animal smells disgusting, but it attracts animals and not to mention bugs. we also can't eat it raw, we would get sick and it would taste horrible, true omnivores can. it also takes a very long time to digest meat, even when u shit it out, some is still left over to rot in your lower intestines.
Yes we do have a killer instinct, if you don't eat anything for a week and someone gives you a gun/spear/knife and a squirrel, you are gonna eat it. Maybe not raw( Eskimos still eat raw Whale and Seal meat,Sushi,Medium Rare Steaks), But since human have knowledge of fire we have arent as good at eating raw meat anymore.
Yet the Chimpanzee our closest cousin regularly kills other mammals and primates, and it eats them raw.
@spetznas101 no, i mean to feel hungry then see an animal, then chase it down it down bite into it with ur teeth and rip it open and eat the bones n all then eat it raw, but our teeth aren't designed to cut into flesh
@spetznas101 Yes we do. Also, all mammals have canine teeth, including herbivores. The thing is, herbivores have SMALLER canines, almost as small as the ones we have. Well, not all. Gorillas, for example have big canine teeth, but are also mostly herbivores. You've read biology, right? What about the textbooks and the science journals?
also No not all Mammals have canine teeth, I say BS, since generally herbivore don't have canines.
Chimpanzees eat meat, Gorillas have been observed to eat meat but rarely.
Yes I read Biology and books about Evolution and every single book i read says that humans are Omnivores, not only that but every single professor says so too.
you should try to be more like SHYakka, don't try to make up science since real scientist will debunk you and it will make you look bad.
@spetznas101 "Gorillas are the largest species of primates. They are ground-dwelling, predominantly HERBIVOROUS apes". Which part did you not understand? Of course they eat meat (of insects). I agree. We are more herbivorous then the gorilla. Cockroaches anyone? C'mon... " books about Evolution" Which ones? "every single professor" I'm not sure about that. Most herbivores can digest meat quite well.
you know what "predominantly" is? its " for the most part" it doesn't mean ALL THE TIME.
They have been observed to eat meat in captivity and in the wild(but rarely in the wild), and NO I don't mean insect meat.Chimpanzees even hunt smaller monkeys and eat them. We are actually more carnivorous than gorillas, since we actively hunt for meat and it is and was a BIG part of our diet.
I read mostly Richard Dawkins like "selfish gene" and "greatest show on earth".
@spetznas101 "since we actively hunt for meat" No we don't. We do it for fun, with guns, not claws nor teeth, and more then half of the people who do eat meat from wild animals get gout. As I said, "Most herbivores can digest meat quite well" but that doesn't mean eating this food for a long amount of time won't have the corresponding consequences. Richard is a great writer and professor, but he's occupied with lots of other things and doesn't really take this direction seriously.
Our "intelligence" is our weapon, just like Lions and Wolfs use their intelligence to plan an attack.
Also we don't do it for fun, we do it for survival!
Neither me nor anybody else in my family has gout, so I guess your stats are wrong!?
Also NO most herbivores cannot digest meat, most cant even chew it and they wont be able to survive on it. Also my High school biology teacher, My two College professors also agree on the fact that humans are Omnivores.
@spetznas101 Our intelligence could be whatever... "Neither me nor anybody else in my family has gout, so I guess your stats are wrong!?" That's not a scientifically correct statement. U don't go off with a gun, kill and eat wild animals, right?"we do it for survival!" It's cheaper resource-wise to take care of a plant.
"College professors also agree on the fact that humans are Omnivores."All people feel compelled to justify perceptions of their established personalities.
@spetznas101 Dr. William Clifford Robers, editor @ The American Journal of Cardiology, medical director of the Baylor Heart and Vascular Institute at Baylor University Medical Center in Dallas
Prof. Walter Willett @ Harvard Medical School of Public Health in Boston
Prof. Robert W. Sussman @ Washington University
People should be able to use their own brains & not rely on others to do it for them. Small monkey bit the top of a finger of a child and it died out of the infection. We're too fragile
Actually you haven't given me any facts whatsoever , just your opinion and false science.
And like i said before I am not against vegetarianism, If I knew how to be one I might actually be one( I just really like steaks though). I just don't like how vegetarians are really douchy and in your face about it, especially when they use fake science to justify their douchiness .
because they aren't facts. real science says we are omnivores, we have canines are intestinal track is right in between carnivore and herbivore, and we can digest raw meat(but less efficient nowadays).
Sorry I didn't even get a notice of your reply to my comment.
The human intestine track is around 9m(30feet) the average human lets say is 1.7m(around 5.6feet)
doing the math that gives as around 5-6 times our body length. definitely not 10-12.
About the stomach acid look at my comment before to xjih78, our stomach acid is also right between carnivore and herbivore. We are not herbivore which is what you are trying to say.
Organs affected by meat-eating are kidneys, pancreas and the heart. The kidneys of even moderate meat-eaters must work three times harder than the kidneys of vegetarians to eliminate the toxins produced.
True carnivores eat their meat raw. Cooking destroys the natural enzymes present in meat that aid a carnivore's digestion. The pancreas must therefore produce more digestive enzymes, stressing the organ, weakening it, and inviting disease.
I never said we are carnivores. I said we are Omnivores, we can eat either but through evolution and technological advances our bodies have changed to suit this lifestyle better. Like Chimpanzee our closest relatives who can still eat raw meat.
The acidity levels in our bodies are quite important part of our metabolism, health etc. and it's essential for the bacteria in our stomachs. If there is a dis-balance, the body tries everything it can to reestablish the balance. Alkaline food is important. We can eat meat, though it's NOT the best health choice.
Well Actually the Ph of the Human stomach is 1.35 to 3.5 or 2-3, So more in the omnivore range(for gods sake at least try googling your facts before spouting them).
So I guess you probably got your info from some Veggie Douchebag site.
@spetznas101 if wikipedia fits the description. You see, Gastric acid isn't what you should be looking for. ;) Read more about digestion and get your story straight. lol
Not just wikipedia , biology textbooks and science journals too.
well why don't you tell me what other digestive juices I should be looking for? or maybe you are just trying to seem like a smart as because you know that you were wrong?
@spetznas101 logical fallacies are a convenient way in trying to abolish true facts. I did not tell you to look into gastric acid. Every mammal has it, including herbivores. I was talking about the part of the gut where digestion takes place, where the crucial bacteria thrives. I already explained why it's crucial to eat alkaline food. Meat isn't alkaline. If the bacteria dies out, the patient is dead. That's the relevant argument. Get me?
You were talking about stomach pH, Gastric acid is in the stomach and its Ph is 1.35-3.5 right between herbivore and carnivore.
How about this, show me the site where you read your info or where your info is cited.
Also the "Alkaline Diet" is by most real scientists refereed to as Pseudo-science and there has been to factual evidence supporting your theory, of eating "alkaline" foods.
@spetznas101 Point taken, we can eat whatever we want. My only argument is that eating vegetarian food is better for our health, the planet and the animals that we kill to eat (10 billion annually).
The reason we can be vegetarian now is because we can get vegetable that grow around the world and not in just our backyard , we didn't have the technology do to that in the past. So yes its healthier to be a vegetarian nowadays.
Also realize that if everybody changed to vegetarian we would need to create a whole lot of farm land which can seriously screw with the earths ecology.
About half of the harvested acreage in America, and in a number of European, African and Asian countries is used to feed animals. If the earth's arable land were used primarily for the production of vegetarian foods, the planet could easily support a population of 20 billion and more.
The meat industry is a powerful economic and political force, and besides spending millions of its own dollars to promote meat-eating, it also manages to grab an unfair share of tax dollars. National governments support the meat industry because it needs to be heavily subsidised to survive.
The US National School Lunch Program gave schools more than 6 billion dollars to offer low-cost meals to students. That sounds like charity, but the National School Lunch Program was originally designed to serve two purposes: to provide "healthy" meals to children regardless of income, and to subsidise agribusiness by "shoring up demand for beef".
That has more to do with Politics and that most politicians are corrupt in the States(which is hilarious because that is what everybody said about communists).
American politicians are just as bad if not worse then Communists, communists just couldn't and didn't need to hide it their shady activities.
I would still think a farmer if he can make more money and live better farming veggies then why wouldn't he?
I think it has to do with the cost of running one vs the other.
In light of all the health hazards of a meat-based diet, what is this doing to our children, and to families who have little choice but to accept the subsidies lunches.
Well lets not make eating meat seem dangerous, I agree with you that its healthier to be a vegetarian to a point(lets not forget the crap we spray on veggies is just as bad as the crap they inject into cattle).
This has more to do with mass production then eating meat.
also actually parents don't have to accept the lunches, they can just pack their own.
Ofcourse thats still bad since you are paying allot of taxes for something you dont and should not use.
The Journal of the American Medical Association stated that 97% of heart disease cases, the cause of more than one half of the deaths in the United States could be prevented with a vegetarian diet. These findings are supported by the American Heart Association in their report on high-saturated fats causing heart disease.
That has more to do with excess eating and the way they produce the meat.
I dont live in the States but where I come from we eat Meat and we live a healthy life, that probably comes from the fact that we get our own meat(fishing,farming, hunting), you can actually taste the difference in quality of the meat.
Again everything has to be in modesty , I wouldn't mind beeing a vegetarian but I would not want to give up all Steak, fish, or chicken for it.
The government just has to start with the School children and try to wean them off of excess meat consumption and maybe introduce healthier meats like fish(but we really need to clean the waters before that).
We just have to meet in the middle not on one extreme and also not on the other, people get defensive when you extremely oppose their views but if you slowly very slowly introduce them to change then you can get your way.
I am actually for this idea, the only reason I commented on this video is because I saw most comments saying stupid things like " we are herbivores, we aren't meant to eat meat" or the ones who just put up BS facts that they get from some vegan douche site,even though science facts states otherwise. so yeah I actually agree with weekday vegetarian just not when people make up facts to suite their cause.
This is exactly my point as well. Like I said earlier people can eat whatever they want. People in a few countries eat lizards and snakes and for them, that's the most normal thing ever. Cannibals eat humans and for them too that's part of life. No amount of facts are going to sway them. And yes, facts can be used to suit the cause both by meat-eaters and vegetarians.
Well the reason I like vegetarianism is because its healthier and better in the long run, it has nothing to do with morals. Evolutionary/Naturally speaking there is no right and wrong, you not gonna go up to a lion and tell him to stop eating meat. The only difference is that a lot of vegetarians make up facts, which is the reason I choose to comment on this video.
Vegetarians make up facts is just a gross generalisation. There is tons of research from national medical associations and top universities on the link between meat-eating and disease. However, meat-eaters actively choose to ignore this to satisfy their own beliefs.
Does it matter what meat they used for testing? If meat-eaters find out that meat from homegrown animals is detrimental to health, do you really think they would care?
They used vegetarians vs. meat-eaters.
The health benefits are much better. Smoking, drinking and meat-eating are just different ways of harming your body.
To obtain meat you just need to kill a few animals, but that's all right all right because it's the animals that are getting slaughtered.
Well I'm not hear to win any debate. I just here to list facts. And if people want to ignore facts and stick to what they want to believe in that's their choice.
If you want to conveniently sidestep the ethical issue you can do so as most meat-eaters do. Just push it to to background and claim that it never existed.
My ethical reasons are based on facts. And one can choose to ignore the underlying facts to form a completely baseless ethical system suited to their own beliefs. The facts say that vegetarian food is healthier than meat and that you can't have compassion for animals if you believe in killing them. And if those facts point you to a meat-eating diet, then that is a fallacy.
Well it you don't care about animals that's your problem not mine. Ethics is important for me and don't see any logical reason to leave it out. Just because you don't believe in the morality of the issue does not make it a good enough reason for me to let it go.
You cannot use your beliefs to put guilt on someone, because morality is decided by the majority.
You can try to make people see your side, but as far as they are concerned, you are in the wrong.
I car about animals just like a Lion cares about a Gazelle, I wont eat it if I am not hungry but when I am hungry I will eat it. If I find a better more viable resource(vegetables) then I will switch.
Also you cant call me basically heartless and then say "agree to disagree".
If you don't feel guilty after killing an animal for food or recreation like hunting, good for you. Just because a lot of people are doing something doesn't make it right. It is just because that is what they have been conditioned to do. I wouldn't call you heartless. I only think that many meat-eaters just don't realise that for them to eat meat a living, breathing animal had to die. You should continue to do whatever you are doing as long as you feel that it is correct.
You use your believe to judge others, you are no better then religious fanatics.
Baseless ethical system? don't forget to add that its Just like Yours!!
facts don't say shit about ethics, facts are facts. And people who bases their ethics on facts are idiots who want to justify to themselves their beliefs and to be able to judge others.
just come out and say " I dont like killing animals, because it doesnt feel right to me" don't be a judgemental Douchebag!
And I am saying that eating homegrown vegetables are better than eating homegrown meat. Exactly we have the right to take care of our bodies or abuse them in any way that we like, that's our choice. Well humans are part of the food chain but they have a superior brain that helps them make decisions that are good for them, for animals and the environment.
The health benefits are much better. Smoking, drinking and meat-eating are just different ways of harming your body.
To obtain meat you just need to kill a few animals, but that's all right because its the animals that are getting slaughtered.
It amuses me that some people love their pets as much or even more than their children but don't give a second thought to the number of animals that need to be killed for their sake.
making facts up actually cheapens the cause and makes it a bigger target, thats why most people get soo defensive against vegans, because allot of the fake facts are easy to shoot down.
I am for vegans(well as long as they dont take away All of my meat, I still like the taste of some especially fish).
No vegan or vegetarian can take anything away from someone that wants to eat meat. As long as meat-eaters are comfortable with the ethical, ecological and physiological impact of their actions, they should be allowed to do as they please.
A lot of people get defensive because vegetarians challenge centuries of culture and traditions that glorify meat-eating. Old habits die hard. We like to see a view of the world that agrees with what we are doing whether it is right or wrong.
Exactly this "We like to see a view of the world that agrees with what we are doing"
you are pushing your beliefs onto someone, just because its your belief.
you trying to guilt people into your viewpoint, which is not gonna work because people get defensive when someone accuses them.
The best way to make people change is to tell them the health benefits, people love to live healthy(at least most do), and to introduce it slowly in schools.
Most meat-eaters know that eating vegetarian food is more healthy. However, a lot of people lack the backbone to make healthy eating decisions. They choose to ignore facts about the link between saturated fats and heart disease and cancer. They cannot think beyond their taste buds. For others it is a matter of conditioning. We tend to do things that we are brought up to do without questioning them.
A study at the Oregon State University states that rates of colorectal cancer in various countries are strongly correlated with per capita consumption of red meat and animal fat, and inversely associated with fibre consumption. Humans take between 12 to 18 hours to digest flesh. In the process free radicals are released, which can cause cancer premature ageing, and other degenerative conditions.
In the United States, livestock produces 130 times as much waste as people do. These mega-farms are proliferating, and in populous areas their waste is tainting drinking water (Time Magazine).
The overconsumption of meat by the rich means hunger for the poor. This wasteful agriculture must be changed - by the suppression of feedlots where beef are fattened on grains, and even a massive reduction in beef cattle.
Lets take Africa for example, lots of starving people, why wouldn't they just create farms?
I think its because the vegetable that you would need to live healthy don't grow in most lands, otherwise their is no logical point in raising cattle if veggies is cheaper and faster with the same benefits.
Businesses would have taken advantage of that start investing more in veggie farms.
Logic isn't always readily accepted by people the world around. People and businesses get defensive when age old traditions and practices are challenged by new thinking. Forty thousand children around the world die each day from malnutrition. US livestock eats enough grain and soybeans each year to feed more than five times the entire US population.
If Americans reduced their meat consumption by only 10%, 12 million tons of grain would be freed up annually for human consumption - enough to feed each of the 60 million children and adults who starve to death each year.
Carnivores eat meat that they themselves kill. If we are predisposed to eating meat, we should be killing animals ourselves, if we want to eat them. And if we don't feel the slightest bit of remorse while slaughtering animals we would know that it is what we were meant to do.
@SuperHardYakka We never have been carnivores. It might take a little while out of eternity to evolve into this kind of species and sorry to burst your bubble, but conclusively we're not there yet.
We can pretty much be anything we like. The big question at this day & age is: would we destroy everything around us, including ourselves, by making the wrong decisions? We have been making them 4 quite a while now. At this point, It's really irrelevant if we're herbivores or omnivores. The choices people make need to be relevant & they aren't at this point. There are no vegans, vegetarians, nor meat eaters. We're called human beings & we need to change our habits & practices.
Like I said before its only been recently that being a vegetarian is becoming a viable choice.
Don't try to guilt people to your viewpoint, its not gonna work, and make you look like a big douche.
Tell people the health benefits and maybe the benefits it would have on the economy, it might be late since allot of people have a negative views of vegans(mainly because of people that make up shit and scream "murderer") but if you stick to it then people might change.
@spetznas101 When did I say anything about murdering? When did I inflict guilt on you or another person here? We mostly agree with each other on this, but please don't be harsh. Economy is fucked anyway and we're so fucked up with it. Who knows what people will do in the recent future. Everybody should embrace ideas about the future of out chidren right now, because it's getting scarier and scarier.
I didn't say that you said anything, read my comments more thoroughly.
I said that allot of Vegans do that, I have met them in person and on the web.
This is actually the perfect time to change, if you think about it, People are desperate and are open for any new ideas, the economy is in shambles which means that new products can take over market share and people aren't afraid of "change". If everything is going good that people don't want to mess with it.
I consider this great advice. That's what I did at first and now I'm down to meat just a couple times a month. To me it was just a matter of realizing how non-essential meat is in a good tasty meal... And just like anything else, it is not all or nothing, e.g. by carpooling or taking the bus you are cutting down your emissions even if you still own a car
You know, I'll agree with a lot of the comments I've been seeing and say that it wasn't a very good or in-depth or even sourced/cited talk, BUT I'm so so very glad this was posted.
I'm no simpleton, but the mere concept that I could still do my part and just cut back on meat and still enjoy it some once a week had never crossed my mind.
Its because straight up vegetarians are so self righteous, and meat eaters are so very defensive, I never considered a middle ground possible.
I converted to weekday vegetarianism a few months ago after reading about it on Treehugger, and I couldn't be happier with the choice. Most of the time, I don't even eat meat in the weekends, but if I feel the craving, I have that to look forward to.
It's unrealistic to think that we will be able to convert even NEARLY everyone to vegetarians within our lifetime, but not far-fetched to think we could be able to convince people to REDUCE their intake of meat.
Patrick Bateman: I'm on a diet.
Jean: What, you're kidding, right? You look great... so fit... and thin.
Patrick Bateman: Well, you can always be thinner... look better.
TheAxis456 1 week ago
Probably did more to reduce meat intake than all the pure veggie presentation. I was a vegetarian for 3 months and now I started eating meat again. Wish me luck folks...the next time will hopefully be for much longer
crudhousefull 1 month ago in playlist More videos from TEDtalksDirector
lame & TED unworthy
masusomasuso 1 month ago
Vegan!!!!!!
IWantSoundKnowledge 2 months ago 3
@nerdymom2 yes I am aware anything can be purchased. I love to cook nonetheless. Thanks anyway
acousticatmosphere 2 months ago
wow the ad at the end is as long as the presentation..!
Mark1Mach2 3 months ago
It's only a matter of time before the meat industry has this guy terminated.
spacekangaroo 3 months ago
I agree with this guy.
I think eating some meat can be justified because animals that we eat are much more successful. Because they are useful to us they survive well. If we didn't eat meat these animals would not be mass produced and I think they would rather live to be eaten than to not live at all.
humpfry24 3 months ago
@humpfry24 I'd rather never be born than live a life of pure agony.
CaptainSuspenders 3 months ago
@humpfry24:
I disagree with your idea thag animals would rather live to be eaten than not live at all. In the case of traditionally hunted animals or animals that are raised in humane settings for slaughter, what you're saying may be true. But the way the animals are raised and slaughtered in the modern meat industry negates any notion that at least being alive is better than not existing at all.
spacekangaroo 3 months ago
@spacekangaroo I do agree that animals should be treated better.
humpfry24 3 months ago
@humpfry24 Have you seen inside a factory farm? It's hell.
brianv00 3 months ago
@humpfry24
If we did not eat meat these species of animal would not exist. The cows, and other domesticated animals you see today are created by humans through selective breeding, and other methods into other creatures. Forced evolution I guess you could call it, we turned them into far more productive beings, but at what moral cost?
We are also most certainly not making them healthier in many cases, just making them produce more meat, which is a pretty silly idea in retrospect.
NeutralExistence 3 months ago
Also known as "Ethical Laziness!"
606Athena 4 months ago
Also known as "Ethical Laziness!"
606Athena 4 months ago
but meat tastes sooooo good, i could never go vegetarian
jesssiicaah 4 months ago
The best and the worst thing about the human-being: the ability to think. You will NEVER see an ANIMAL be like "ew, I wont eat this because some other animal died"
Thebielnasser 4 months ago
@Thebielnasser
"The best and the worst thing about the human-being: the ability to think. You will NEVER see an ANIMAL be like "ew, I wont eat this because some other animal died"
I've never met a vegetarian who doesn't eat meat because they're disgusted by the thought of eating a dead animal. I'm a vegetarian because the modern meat industry - unlike the traditional practice of hunting animals in the wild - is ethically and environmentally detrimental.
spacekangaroo 3 months ago
A more accurate way to put this would be to say that human beings have the ability to think "I won't eat this because it causes immense suffering to animals and because it is an unsustainable source of damage to our planet". Yes, humans alone possess this capacity, in the same way that we are the only animals to be able to write a declaration of universal human rights. Thank god we have this capacity because, unlike other animals, only we are capable of using our intellect to destroy our planet.
spacekangaroo 3 months ago
@spacekangaroo
Actually Chimpanzees have the ability to think such conscious thoughts, and for all we know other animals might be able to as well, we simply haven't studied that enough. Jane Goodall exposed the fact that Chimpanzees display almost every human emotion, and characteristic. All living things have the ability to become what we are intellectually, but the chances are unfortunately against them. Evolution didn't just pick us because we were nice, it was pure chance.
NeutralExistence 3 months ago
Latest research shows that the meat-diet of an average westerner is responsible for roughly 50% of his ecological footprint.
Consider this very carefully, without meat, the human race would use up HALF of the natural resources of what we use right now.
TremblingWillows 5 months ago
I think it its a good thing that he is cutting meat out of his diet, if only slowly. I get that if more people tried this then it would help the environment drastically- but this should be considered as a jumping off point.
trust me, its not that hard to give up meat once you become educated about the processes it took to get it on your plate. If more people knew things like THAT, then change would come.
jellysandwichwhore 6 months ago
Seriously? Give this guy some credit. I've only been a vegan since the beginning if the year but I've been vegetarian for 7 years. Getting other people to follow a veg way of life (for health, environmental and ethical reasons) is difficult. It's difficult to be a "perfect" vegan-- everything you eat harms some animal in some way. If he can inspire people to change, even slightly, then I have nothing but respect and love for him.
acousticatmosphere 7 months ago 10
@acousticatmosphere
Inherently the problem is not our decision to eat meat, but how we treat the animals, ultimately in nature they would be eaten anyways. So we as conscious beings would be doing no wrong by providing them with a better life then they could naturally poses, in exchange for food. However as we have seen some among us choose to not respect the animals, and don't give back. Then it gets even worse when you bring in the fact that most meat we eat is not natural.
NeutralExistence 3 months ago
@NeutralExistence My decision to become a vegan stems, inherently, from my belief in using my human nature to reduce suffering instead of cause it. I couldn’t agree with you more--the treatment of animals raised for commodity is not justifiable moral. For me, the decision to reduce suffering is one extended far beyond my own species, but that is not to say that it does not incorporate my own. I idealize those who use their potential to benefit the world, even if their action is of the
acousticatmosphere 2 months ago
@NeutralExistence smallest measurement. I think it needs reminding that we are giants of chaos with steps of destruction, and we cant afford to be clumsy. Yes, our bodies have the ability to digest meat. Yes, animals would be naturally eaten in nature (although I don’t think it’s possible to provide a better environment for them then what is natural). The point is that growing animals to use as commodities is essential destroying
acousticatmosphere 2 months ago
@NeutralExistence everything; our personal and national health (along side our financial pocket), our environment (as I believe was this guys point), and yes, I am a believer that it is also destroying our individual morality--for those aware of the suffering it causes
acousticatmosphere 2 months ago
@NeutralExistence and do nothing to defend against it. We as a species should not and cannot afford to cause such destruction, especially with the exponential population expansion and loss of the worlds natural ecosystems. Any steps towards the reducing of suffering to me seems like a good thing. Sometimes logically things need to be taken in steps, despite how frustratingly obvious the answers seem to be. Thanks for being like minded.
acousticatmosphere 2 months ago
@acousticatmosphere
I guess the hardest part is to change within, and if people are truly able to give up a meat eating lifestyle then no doubt we will see things change fast. Personally however I think that organic methods of farming etc.. are a better method then stopping eating meat altogether, since that would also eliminate our need for the animals. We must change our methods of farming, instead of our diets, or at least that seems the most efficient.
NeutralExistence 2 months ago
@NeutralExistence Cows kept in terrible environments, being fed food their stomachs weren't ever supposed to process, polluting the environment and using a significant amount of water vs no cows being born, raised and slaughtered within the system? I choose no cows. Organic, grass fed cattle will never be able to feed the same number of people that intensively farmed cows do, so clearly a change must occur in the choices of consumers. We must change our methods of farming, as well as our diets.
jessiebrickley 1 month ago
@jessiebrickley
How do you think they would be kept if we didn't eat them? Look how we treat things we don't eat, I am sure a lab monkey would love to trade places with the cow. I think the cows have it pretty good compared to the monkeys who are tested on, and put through all sorts of cruel bullshit. At least when its food we have that little bit of guilt to keep us from making it go extinct. Stopping eating them would make entire cow species disappear, or worse.
NeutralExistence 1 month ago
@NeutralExistence If we didn't eat cows there would be less of them bred. Less of them to suffer needlessly and die largely for human desires, not needs.
Extinction means nothing to extinct species since non-existent beings can't suffer or be deprived of anything.
It's down to human vanity why we arbitrarily keep species going, not animal welfare.
I could torture you for the rest of your life but it's okay because I'd be keeping you alive, right? That's your logic.
void110 1 month ago
@void110
In no way was that an argument supporting the treatment of domesticated bovine, but one must consider how to best go about changing the mentality of man gradually, as to reduce the risk of destroying entire species. Like I said look how we treat the things we don't eat, simply turning into vegetarians isn't going to stop the suffering of these animals, nor will it change the mentality that made us think these actions are okay.
NeutralExistence 1 month ago
@NeutralExistence What value is there in keeping species going from the point of view of the members of a species? Do you think the last two pandas on earth will know or care that they are the last of their kind?
99% of the species which have ever existed are now extinct.
The welfare of conscious beings (human and otherwise) is all that matters. Conservation is a massive waste of time and resources.
void110 1 month ago
@void110
Well existence is a good one, living... On a biological level, the only thing that matters is creating more successful copies of one's cell's. To take it above that can hinder a species existence, we have proven this many a time...
I suppose you assume we wont find some other purpose for the millions of cows we have if we just all of a sudden stopped eating them? I don't even want to imagine what all the "cow factories" would figure out as a good solution...
NeutralExistence 1 month ago
@NeutralExistence Survival and reproduction is all that matters to a piece of chemistry which can accurately be described as a virus (DNA).
Unlike DNA we have intelligence and the ability to empathise. Surely the greatest thing ever to be produced by blind natural forces.
Killing (or preferably neutering) the last remaining factory cows would be worse than continuing to breed and kill them in far greater numbers and keeping the factory farms going? I think not.
void110 1 month ago
@void110
That "piece of chemistry" is the building blocks for all life as we know it, one cant really even try to contrast our newly formed consciousness to DNA, which has taken many a millennium to reach its state of perfection. You think its better to moralize, then rationalize? I think the definition of intelligence is quite subjective frankly, for I know cellular life can problem solve, and personally consider the pro-creation of life in itself to be intelligence.
NeutralExistence 1 month ago
@void110
Who said we have to keep breeding/killing them, you seem to be missing my point.... I am all for us searching for less harmful solutions to our food problems, but I am stating that it needs to be a gradual process, otherwise everything is going to be effected. One cant change 100+ thousand years of diet in a couple years time, we need to think of alternatives, and maybe instead of risking loosing these species, we could help them back into nature slowly.
NeutralExistence 1 month ago
@acousticatmosphere vegan cheese is diliicous
nerdymom2 2 months ago
@nerdymom2
I have yet to try it or make it for that matter! Got a got recipe? ;0)
acousticatmosphere 2 months ago
@acousticatmosphere no you can just buy vegan cheese. go to your local health food store and ask the worker their. its basically dairy free cheese.
nerdymom2 2 months ago
''Imagine your last hamburger'' as if there is no alternative for vegetarians... come on that's just riducule I ate a vegan burger few days ago and it was even better than one made with dead cows. He make it sound like being vegetarian is hard, it's not it's easy once you're used to it!
VeganPua 8 months ago
THIS IS FUCKING LAME!!! HE IS SLAVE TO HIS TASTE BUDS!!! VEGANISM IS THE ANSWER!!!
avaizhashmi 8 months ago
'a hamburger a day' - who eats that many hamburgers
MitchL17 8 months ago
@MitchL17
there might be some people that do, but I think he was getting at is that some people eat the equivalent of a hamburger a day in some type of meat
hogo1 7 months ago
Man this video is horse shit. I mean I get what the dude is saying but he's basing his theory on the same principles as being addicted to cigarettes, or crack. He came to terms with everything that is wrong with meat eating, but then decided it's too hard to give it all up. "Can you imagine your last burger" That sounds all too similar with smokers. Have your last cigarette. Never take drugs again. Wake up, you're conditionally addicted to this food and it's made you too weak to drop it.
Neutral666 9 months ago
@Neutral666 its exactly like smoking. Every craving produced by your brain is longing for chemical gratification. Meat, cigarettes, sports, all produce a chemical reward. Its hardly horse shit, in fact the mechanisms are pretty well established.
anananwar 9 months ago
La 4 unuaj minutoj estas bonegaj kaj aŭskultindaj ! Se vi ne komprenas ilin, vi povas trovi Esperanto-tradukon tie : "Kial mi estas labortaga vegetarano" : ted.com/talks/lang/epo/graham_hill_weekday_vegetarian.html
Laurent
laurentvign 10 months ago
I'm vegan. 1) Vegan food is the most delicious food- vegweb.com... also, it will get easier as more people demand vegetarian food 2) my conscience is unburdened knowing my habits reduce suffering of my fellow animals - meat.org 3) I may not be able to stop war, but i can save 130 lives per year 4) I have tons of energy and do not fear obesity, cancer, diabetes and autoimmune disorders 5) I'm slim without really trying 6) reduce violence to the environment/people/animals
thatbitchonskates 11 months ago
there is a reason humans eat meat, we are Omnivores.
its because of our Hunter brain that we don't still live in treetops.
herbivores aren't as smart as carnivores since
Herbivore: OMG LION!! RUNN!!!
Carnivore: observe herd,pick out weakest link,talk to pack, formulate strategy,sneak up on herd, execute plan, WIN!
I understand that Vegetarian is probably healthier, but what you guys do not understand is that either way Animals are gonna die because for veggies you need farm land
spetznas101 11 months ago
@spetznas101 actually, humans aren't designed to be meat eaters…but if you want to be an omnivore, I'm okay with that. everyone deserves a choice.
nosammich 10 months ago
@nosammich
Yes we are designed to be Omnivores, and Not a herbivore, but ig you want to be an herbivore, Im okay with that. everyone deserves a choice.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 but if ur okay with rotting meat in ur intestines, im all up for that. im not telling you should be a non meat eater, im telling you the truth.
black00dice 10 months ago
@black00dice
Not all omnivores( and even carnivores) can eat rotting meat the animals that can are called Scavengers like Hyenas and certain birds.
Also like said before since for thousands of years, we haven't actually have to eat raw meat, our stomach acid got weaker. The reason those animals can eat rotting meat is because their stomach acid is strong enough to kill of bacteria and parasites.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 last i checked we don't have natural predators, and besides Leonardo Da Vinci was a vegetarian, and Aristotle, and Isaac Newton, infact pretty much every ancient philosophor did not eat meat, go figure, and don't prove to me you're stupid by inflicting a flame war...hope i didn't touch a nerve
black00dice 10 months ago
@black00dice
Yes we have allot of natural predators bears,giant cats, hyenas,wolfs,etc.. they are all natural predators, even still now people are eaten by them.
Are you sure? I cant find any sources stating Aristotle was vegetarian, and saying "pretty much much every ancient philosopher" better have some proof of that. cause I only see 2 that you gave.
They weren't smart because they were vegetarian, they were vegetarian cause they were smart.
I hope I didn't touch a nerve there.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 my mistake he was a vegan, and you didn't really touch a nerve by proving me right. please don't tell me you actually used the internet to find out if these people were vegetarian
black00dice 10 months ago
@black00dice
How did I prove you right? you were wrong about the natural predators,about Aristotle, and you said "almost every one" but you only gave me 3 examples ,1 of which was wrong.
Well I didn't know them personally, and since the Internet is a collection of most of human knowledge
its probably the fastest and most accurate way to find any info, you just have to check the sources.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 back to my last entry please don't prove to me you're stupid by ranting, but unfortunately you just did. ciao.
black00dice 10 months ago
@black00dice
Ranting? Thats not ranting thats proving you wrong, but maybe someone that douchy cant see the difference.
Haha dude you cant just debate with someone and then say " if you reply you are stupid" now maybe you thought i was ranting but I know you are an idiot.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 i didn't say that that, and obviously i did hit a nerve, you are the idiot. good day sir.
black00dice 10 months ago
@spetznas101 And i end this conversation now.
black00dice 10 months ago
@black00dice
sure Im fine with that.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 and i eat meat btw lol, but if being a vegetarian will make me live a couple months longer, it's not really worth it is it
black00dice 10 months ago
@spetznas101 And no we are not omnivores. omnivores when hungry,have the killer instinct to rip an animal to shreds and eat it raw, for humans a dead animal smells disgusting, but it attracts animals and not to mention bugs. we also can't eat it raw, we would get sick and it would taste horrible, true omnivores can. it also takes a very long time to digest meat, even when u shit it out, some is still left over to rot in your lower intestines.
black00dice 10 months ago
@black00dice
Yes we do have a killer instinct, if you don't eat anything for a week and someone gives you a gun/spear/knife and a squirrel, you are gonna eat it. Maybe not raw( Eskimos still eat raw Whale and Seal meat,Sushi,Medium Rare Steaks), But since human have knowledge of fire we have arent as good at eating raw meat anymore.
Yet the Chimpanzee our closest cousin regularly kills other mammals and primates, and it eats them raw.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 no, i mean to feel hungry then see an animal, then chase it down it down bite into it with ur teeth and rip it open and eat the bones n all then eat it raw, but our teeth aren't designed to cut into flesh
black00dice 10 months ago
@black00dice
Yes they are we have canines for ripping Flesh
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 Yes we do. Also, all mammals have canine teeth, including herbivores. The thing is, herbivores have SMALLER canines, almost as small as the ones we have. Well, not all. Gorillas, for example have big canine teeth, but are also mostly herbivores. You've read biology, right? What about the textbooks and the science journals?
xjih78 10 months ago
@xjih78
also No not all Mammals have canine teeth, I say BS, since generally herbivore don't have canines.
Chimpanzees eat meat, Gorillas have been observed to eat meat but rarely.
Yes I read Biology and books about Evolution and every single book i read says that humans are Omnivores, not only that but every single professor says so too.
you should try to be more like SHYakka, don't try to make up science since real scientist will debunk you and it will make you look bad.
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101 "Gorillas are the largest species of primates. They are ground-dwelling, predominantly HERBIVOROUS apes". Which part did you not understand? Of course they eat meat (of insects). I agree. We are more herbivorous then the gorilla. Cockroaches anyone? C'mon... " books about Evolution" Which ones? "every single professor" I'm not sure about that. Most herbivores can digest meat quite well.
xjih78 9 months ago
@xjih78
you know what "predominantly" is? its " for the most part" it doesn't mean ALL THE TIME.
They have been observed to eat meat in captivity and in the wild(but rarely in the wild), and NO I don't mean insect meat.Chimpanzees even hunt smaller monkeys and eat them. We are actually more carnivorous than gorillas, since we actively hunt for meat and it is and was a BIG part of our diet.
I read mostly Richard Dawkins like "selfish gene" and "greatest show on earth".
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101 "since we actively hunt for meat" No we don't. We do it for fun, with guns, not claws nor teeth, and more then half of the people who do eat meat from wild animals get gout. As I said, "Most herbivores can digest meat quite well" but that doesn't mean eating this food for a long amount of time won't have the corresponding consequences. Richard is a great writer and professor, but he's occupied with lots of other things and doesn't really take this direction seriously.
xjih78 9 months ago
@xjih78
Our "intelligence" is our weapon, just like Lions and Wolfs use their intelligence to plan an attack.
Also we don't do it for fun, we do it for survival!
Neither me nor anybody else in my family has gout, so I guess your stats are wrong!?
Also NO most herbivores cannot digest meat, most cant even chew it and they wont be able to survive on it. Also my High school biology teacher, My two College professors also agree on the fact that humans are Omnivores.
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101 Our intelligence could be whatever... "Neither me nor anybody else in my family has gout, so I guess your stats are wrong!?" That's not a scientifically correct statement. U don't go off with a gun, kill and eat wild animals, right?"we do it for survival!" It's cheaper resource-wise to take care of a plant.
"College professors also agree on the fact that humans are Omnivores."All people feel compelled to justify perceptions of their established personalities.
xjih78 9 months ago
@xjih78
Well I doubt " half of all meat eaters get gout" is a scientific correct statement, since Its false.
Seriously look up some of the science you are quoting.
yes we do, we are hunters and Farmers. yes its cheaper to take care of a plants then farm animals, thats why we let nature do it.
Really? you are saying that professors(who are neutral) in Biology are biased.
Wow but you believe douche bag vegan sites, who don't state any sources?
no help for you.
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101 Dr. William Clifford Robers, editor @ The American Journal of Cardiology, medical director of the Baylor Heart and Vascular Institute at Baylor University Medical Center in Dallas
Prof. Walter Willett @ Harvard Medical School of Public Health in Boston
Prof. Robert W. Sussman @ Washington University
People should be able to use their own brains & not rely on others to do it for them. Small monkey bit the top of a finger of a child and it died out of the infection. We're too fragile
xjih78 9 months ago
@spetznas101 eskimos still live in igloos too
black00dice 10 months ago
@black00dice
So what you are saying they can eat meat without hazards because they don't live the same lifestyle as you?
you really are a douche.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 no i am not saying that at all
black00dice 10 months ago
@spetznas101 personally i don't really care if these farm animals die anyway, im just telling you the facts
black00dice 10 months ago
@black00dice
Actually you haven't given me any facts whatsoever , just your opinion and false science.
And like i said before I am not against vegetarianism, If I knew how to be one I might actually be one( I just really like steaks though). I just don't like how vegetarians are really douchy and in your face about it, especially when they use fake science to justify their douchiness .
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 im not using fake science, why do you find this so hard to understand these are facts
black00dice 10 months ago
@black00dice
because they aren't facts. real science says we are omnivores, we have canines are intestinal track is right in between carnivore and herbivore, and we can digest raw meat(but less efficient nowadays).
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 (The following are things that can be found in any high school biology textbook.)
Meat Eater: Intestinal tract 3 times body length so rapidly decaying meat can pass out quicky
Herbivore: Intestinal tract 10-12 times body length
Human: Intestinal tract 10-12 times body length
Meat Eater: Strong hydrocholric acid in stomach to digest meat
Herbivore: Stomach acid 20 times weaker than meat-eater's
Human: Stomach acid 20 times weaker than meat-eater's
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
Sorry I didn't even get a notice of your reply to my comment.
The human intestine track is around 9m(30feet) the average human lets say is 1.7m(around 5.6feet)
doing the math that gives as around 5-6 times our body length. definitely not 10-12.
About the stomach acid look at my comment before to xjih78, our stomach acid is also right between carnivore and herbivore. We are not herbivore which is what you are trying to say.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101
Organs affected by meat-eating are kidneys, pancreas and the heart. The kidneys of even moderate meat-eaters must work three times harder than the kidneys of vegetarians to eliminate the toxins produced.
True carnivores eat their meat raw. Cooking destroys the natural enzymes present in meat that aid a carnivore's digestion. The pancreas must therefore produce more digestive enzymes, stressing the organ, weakening it, and inviting disease.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
I never said we are carnivores. I said we are Omnivores, we can eat either but through evolution and technological advances our bodies have changed to suit this lifestyle better. Like Chimpanzee our closest relatives who can still eat raw meat.
spetznas101 10 months ago
Comment removed
xjih78 10 months ago
@spetznas101 Not quite sure about that.
Stomach pH of carnivores is 1-2
Stomach pH of omnivores is 1-2
Stomach pH of herbivores is 4-5
Stomach pH of members of the human species is 4-5
The acidity levels in our bodies are quite important part of our metabolism, health etc. and it's essential for the bacteria in our stomachs. If there is a dis-balance, the body tries everything it can to reestablish the balance. Alkaline food is important. We can eat meat, though it's NOT the best health choice.
xjih78 10 months ago
@xjih78
Well Actually the Ph of the Human stomach is 1.35 to 3.5 or 2-3, So more in the omnivore range(for gods sake at least try googling your facts before spouting them).
So I guess you probably got your info from some Veggie Douchebag site.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 if wikipedia fits the description. You see, Gastric acid isn't what you should be looking for. ;) Read more about digestion and get your story straight. lol
xjih78 10 months ago
@xjih78
Not just wikipedia , biology textbooks and science journals too.
well why don't you tell me what other digestive juices I should be looking for? or maybe you are just trying to seem like a smart as because you know that you were wrong?
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 logical fallacies are a convenient way in trying to abolish true facts. I did not tell you to look into gastric acid. Every mammal has it, including herbivores. I was talking about the part of the gut where digestion takes place, where the crucial bacteria thrives. I already explained why it's crucial to eat alkaline food. Meat isn't alkaline. If the bacteria dies out, the patient is dead. That's the relevant argument. Get me?
xjih78 10 months ago
@xjih78
You were talking about stomach pH, Gastric acid is in the stomach and its Ph is 1.35-3.5 right between herbivore and carnivore.
How about this, show me the site where you read your info or where your info is cited.
Also the "Alkaline Diet" is by most real scientists refereed to as Pseudo-science and there has been to factual evidence supporting your theory, of eating "alkaline" foods.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101 Point taken, we can eat whatever we want. My only argument is that eating vegetarian food is better for our health, the planet and the animals that we kill to eat (10 billion annually).
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
The reason we can be vegetarian now is because we can get vegetable that grow around the world and not in just our backyard , we didn't have the technology do to that in the past. So yes its healthier to be a vegetarian nowadays.
Also realize that if everybody changed to vegetarian we would need to create a whole lot of farm land which can seriously screw with the earths ecology.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101
USDA's Economic Research Service:
Over 90% of all the grain produced in America is used to feed livestock. We get back only one pound of beef for every 16 pounds of grain.
University of California's Agricultural Extension:
Water required to produce a pound of beef: 5214 gallons
Water required to produce a pound of pork: 1,630 gallons
Water required to produce a pound of wheat: 25 gallons
Water required to produce a pound of lettuce: 23 gallons
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101
About half of the harvested acreage in America, and in a number of European, African and Asian countries is used to feed animals. If the earth's arable land were used primarily for the production of vegetarian foods, the planet could easily support a population of 20 billion and more.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
If that is true then why don't the governments step in?
If those stats are right I would think producing vegetable would be cheaper then Meat.
not to mention the land saved.
How about the energy intake of a veggie farm vs a cattle farm?
or maybe its the environment( different vegetable grow in different environments, therefore maybe most land is only suited for growing wheat)?
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101
The meat industry is a powerful economic and political force, and besides spending millions of its own dollars to promote meat-eating, it also manages to grab an unfair share of tax dollars. National governments support the meat industry because it needs to be heavily subsidised to survive.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@spetznas101
The US National School Lunch Program gave schools more than 6 billion dollars to offer low-cost meals to students. That sounds like charity, but the National School Lunch Program was originally designed to serve two purposes: to provide "healthy" meals to children regardless of income, and to subsidise agribusiness by "shoring up demand for beef".
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
That has more to do with Politics and that most politicians are corrupt in the States(which is hilarious because that is what everybody said about communists).
American politicians are just as bad if not worse then Communists, communists just couldn't and didn't need to hide it their shady activities.
I would still think a farmer if he can make more money and live better farming veggies then why wouldn't he?
I think it has to do with the cost of running one vs the other.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101
In light of all the health hazards of a meat-based diet, what is this doing to our children, and to families who have little choice but to accept the subsidies lunches.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
Well lets not make eating meat seem dangerous, I agree with you that its healthier to be a vegetarian to a point(lets not forget the crap we spray on veggies is just as bad as the crap they inject into cattle).
This has more to do with mass production then eating meat.
also actually parents don't have to accept the lunches, they can just pack their own.
Ofcourse thats still bad since you are paying allot of taxes for something you dont and should not use.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101
The Journal of the American Medical Association stated that 97% of heart disease cases, the cause of more than one half of the deaths in the United States could be prevented with a vegetarian diet. These findings are supported by the American Heart Association in their report on high-saturated fats causing heart disease.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
That has more to do with excess eating and the way they produce the meat.
I dont live in the States but where I come from we eat Meat and we live a healthy life, that probably comes from the fact that we get our own meat(fishing,farming, hunting), you can actually taste the difference in quality of the meat.
Again everything has to be in modesty , I wouldn't mind beeing a vegetarian but I would not want to give up all Steak, fish, or chicken for it.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
The government just has to start with the School children and try to wean them off of excess meat consumption and maybe introduce healthier meats like fish(but we really need to clean the waters before that).
We just have to meet in the middle not on one extreme and also not on the other, people get defensive when you extremely oppose their views but if you slowly very slowly introduce them to change then you can get your way.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101
Which is why the weekday vegetarian concept seems to be a good idea.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
I am actually for this idea, the only reason I commented on this video is because I saw most comments saying stupid things like " we are herbivores, we aren't meant to eat meat" or the ones who just put up BS facts that they get from some vegan douche site,even though science facts states otherwise. so yeah I actually agree with weekday vegetarian just not when people make up facts to suite their cause.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101
This is exactly my point as well. Like I said earlier people can eat whatever they want. People in a few countries eat lizards and snakes and for them, that's the most normal thing ever. Cannibals eat humans and for them too that's part of life. No amount of facts are going to sway them. And yes, facts can be used to suit the cause both by meat-eaters and vegetarians.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
Well the reason I like vegetarianism is because its healthier and better in the long run, it has nothing to do with morals. Evolutionary/Naturally speaking there is no right and wrong, you not gonna go up to a lion and tell him to stop eating meat. The only difference is that a lot of vegetarians make up facts, which is the reason I choose to comment on this video.
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101
Vegetarians make up facts is just a gross generalisation. There is tons of research from national medical associations and top universities on the link between meat-eating and disease. However, meat-eaters actively choose to ignore this to satisfy their own beliefs.
SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
those test what meat did they use? did they use homegrown or Mcdonalds?
did they use vegans vs meat eaters? because their is class difference to consider.
are the health benefits that much better? is it comparable to stopping to drink or smoke?
what If I stop driving my car, and recycle? will that be better for the environment than if I stop eating meat?
Why don't we just move to huts to conserve the environment?
its all about BALANCE!
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101
Does it matter what meat they used for testing? If meat-eaters find out that meat from homegrown animals is detrimental to health, do you really think they would care?
They used vegetarians vs. meat-eaters.
The health benefits are much better. Smoking, drinking and meat-eating are just different ways of harming your body.
To obtain meat you just need to kill a few animals, but that's all right all right because it's the animals that are getting slaughtered.
SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
Actually it matters allot, its the same with vegetable(monsanto veggies). Where your food comes from is a HUGE part of how healthy it is.
I am saying maybe eating homegrown meat is better than genetically modified,pesticide fed vegetables.
Its all about balance, we have the right to do with our bodies what we want(smoking,drinking, etc).
also don't come at me with morality, we are part of the food chain there is no morality in the food chain.
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101
You not gonna tell a bear to stop eating meat.
the only thing you can do is tell us and try to get the benefits of being a vegan out there.
If you are coming from a moral point of view, you cannot win any argument/debate about vegans vs Carnis.
when you debate or talk about vegetarianism, loose that "holier than thou" attitude it makes your arguments weaker and your message less important.
just list the health benefits and benefits to the economy, No "I am the saving squirrels".
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101
Well I'm not hear to win any debate. I just here to list facts. And if people want to ignore facts and stick to what they want to believe in that's their choice.
If you want to conveniently sidestep the ethical issue you can do so as most meat-eaters do. Just push it to to background and claim that it never existed.
SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
You constantly come with Ethics, but Ethics are not facts and are opinionated.
Its pushing your "believes" on others.
IF people are ignoring your beliefs that is not the same as ignoring facts.
It doesn't exist naturally, We invented it.
Ethics are like unspoken rules that you can but don't have to follow, and just like any other rules they can and have to be changed regularly.
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101
My ethical reasons are based on facts. And one can choose to ignore the underlying facts to form a completely baseless ethical system suited to their own beliefs. The facts say that vegetarian food is healthier than meat and that you can't have compassion for animals if you believe in killing them. And if those facts point you to a meat-eating diet, then that is a fallacy.
SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
Thats impossible, ethics are opinions. You can base your ethics on facts but someone else can use the same facts for an opposite opinion.
really, you cant have compassion for animals if you kill them? you really seem douchy right now.
what about veterinarian who have to put down animals who are in pain? I guess in your view they are evil.
Also its NATURE, nature has no compassion!
You are a fucking moron.
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101 You are mixing morality and ethics up.
hippydude89 9 months ago
@spetznas101
Well it you don't care about animals that's your problem not mine. Ethics is important for me and don't see any logical reason to leave it out. Just because you don't believe in the morality of the issue does not make it a good enough reason for me to let it go.
Let us agree to disagree and leave it at that.
SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
You cannot use your beliefs to put guilt on someone, because morality is decided by the majority.
You can try to make people see your side, but as far as they are concerned, you are in the wrong.
I car about animals just like a Lion cares about a Gazelle, I wont eat it if I am not hungry but when I am hungry I will eat it. If I find a better more viable resource(vegetables) then I will switch.
Also you cant call me basically heartless and then say "agree to disagree".
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101
If you don't feel guilty after killing an animal for food or recreation like hunting, good for you. Just because a lot of people are doing something doesn't make it right. It is just because that is what they have been conditioned to do. I wouldn't call you heartless. I only think that many meat-eaters just don't realise that for them to eat meat a living, breathing animal had to die. You should continue to do whatever you are doing as long as you feel that it is correct.
SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
You use your believe to judge others, you are no better then religious fanatics.
Baseless ethical system? don't forget to add that its Just like Yours!!
facts don't say shit about ethics, facts are facts. And people who bases their ethics on facts are idiots who want to justify to themselves their beliefs and to be able to judge others.
just come out and say " I dont like killing animals, because it doesnt feel right to me" don't be a judgemental Douchebag!
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101
And I am saying that eating homegrown vegetables are better than eating homegrown meat. Exactly we have the right to take care of our bodies or abuse them in any way that we like, that's our choice. Well humans are part of the food chain but they have a superior brain that helps them make decisions that are good for them, for animals and the environment.
SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
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SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@spetznas101
The health benefits are much better. Smoking, drinking and meat-eating are just different ways of harming your body.
To obtain meat you just need to kill a few animals, but that's all right because its the animals that are getting slaughtered.
It amuses me that some people love their pets as much or even more than their children but don't give a second thought to the number of animals that need to be killed for their sake.
SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
making facts up actually cheapens the cause and makes it a bigger target, thats why most people get soo defensive against vegans, because allot of the fake facts are easy to shoot down.
I am for vegans(well as long as they dont take away All of my meat, I still like the taste of some especially fish).
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101
No vegan or vegetarian can take anything away from someone that wants to eat meat. As long as meat-eaters are comfortable with the ethical, ecological and physiological impact of their actions, they should be allowed to do as they please.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@spetznas101
A lot of people get defensive because vegetarians challenge centuries of culture and traditions that glorify meat-eating. Old habits die hard. We like to see a view of the world that agrees with what we are doing whether it is right or wrong.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
Exactly this "We like to see a view of the world that agrees with what we are doing"
you are pushing your beliefs onto someone, just because its your belief.
you trying to guilt people into your viewpoint, which is not gonna work because people get defensive when someone accuses them.
The best way to make people change is to tell them the health benefits, people love to live healthy(at least most do), and to introduce it slowly in schools.
Don't push your beliefs onto others.
spetznas101 9 months ago
Comment removed
SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
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@spetznas101
Most meat-eaters know that eating vegetarian food is more healthy. However, a lot of people lack the backbone to make healthy eating decisions. They choose to ignore facts about the link between saturated fats and heart disease and cancer. They cannot think beyond their taste buds. For others it is a matter of conditioning. We tend to do things that we are brought up to do without questioning them.
SuperHardYakka 9 months ago
@spetznas101
A study at the Oregon State University states that rates of colorectal cancer in various countries are strongly correlated with per capita consumption of red meat and animal fat, and inversely associated with fibre consumption. Humans take between 12 to 18 hours to digest flesh. In the process free radicals are released, which can cause cancer premature ageing, and other degenerative conditions.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@spetznas101
In the United States, livestock produces 130 times as much waste as people do. These mega-farms are proliferating, and in populous areas their waste is tainting drinking water (Time Magazine).
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@spetznas101
United Nations World Food Conference:
The overconsumption of meat by the rich means hunger for the poor. This wasteful agriculture must be changed - by the suppression of feedlots where beef are fattened on grains, and even a massive reduction in beef cattle.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka
Lets take Africa for example, lots of starving people, why wouldn't they just create farms?
I think its because the vegetable that you would need to live healthy don't grow in most lands, otherwise their is no logical point in raising cattle if veggies is cheaper and faster with the same benefits.
Businesses would have taken advantage of that start investing more in veggie farms.
spetznas101 10 months ago
@spetznas101
Logic isn't always readily accepted by people the world around. People and businesses get defensive when age old traditions and practices are challenged by new thinking. Forty thousand children around the world die each day from malnutrition. US livestock eats enough grain and soybeans each year to feed more than five times the entire US population.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@spetznas101
If Americans reduced their meat consumption by only 10%, 12 million tons of grain would be freed up annually for human consumption - enough to feed each of the 60 million children and adults who starve to death each year.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@black00dice
Carnivores eat meat that they themselves kill. If we are predisposed to eating meat, we should be killing animals ourselves, if we want to eat them. And if we don't feel the slightest bit of remorse while slaughtering animals we would know that it is what we were meant to do.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka We never have been carnivores. It might take a little while out of eternity to evolve into this kind of species and sorry to burst your bubble, but conclusively we're not there yet.
xjih78 10 months ago
@xjih78 Don't think my message was clear enough, I am arguing that we are more similar to herbivores than carnivores.
SuperHardYakka 10 months ago
@SuperHardYakka sorry about that :)
xjih78 10 months ago
We can pretty much be anything we like. The big question at this day & age is: would we destroy everything around us, including ourselves, by making the wrong decisions? We have been making them 4 quite a while now. At this point, It's really irrelevant if we're herbivores or omnivores. The choices people make need to be relevant & they aren't at this point. There are no vegans, vegetarians, nor meat eaters. We're called human beings & we need to change our habits & practices.
xjih78 10 months ago
@xjih78
Like I said before its only been recently that being a vegetarian is becoming a viable choice.
Don't try to guilt people to your viewpoint, its not gonna work, and make you look like a big douche.
Tell people the health benefits and maybe the benefits it would have on the economy, it might be late since allot of people have a negative views of vegans(mainly because of people that make up shit and scream "murderer") but if you stick to it then people might change.
spetznas101 9 months ago
@spetznas101 When did I say anything about murdering? When did I inflict guilt on you or another person here? We mostly agree with each other on this, but please don't be harsh. Economy is fucked anyway and we're so fucked up with it. Who knows what people will do in the recent future. Everybody should embrace ideas about the future of out chidren right now, because it's getting scarier and scarier.
xjih78 9 months ago
@xjih78
I didn't say that you said anything, read my comments more thoroughly.
I said that allot of Vegans do that, I have met them in person and on the web.
This is actually the perfect time to change, if you think about it, People are desperate and are open for any new ideas, the economy is in shambles which means that new products can take over market share and people aren't afraid of "change". If everything is going good that people don't want to mess with it.
spetznas101 9 months ago
Such a pansy.
CounterfeitSoda 11 months ago
I consider this great advice. That's what I did at first and now I'm down to meat just a couple times a month. To me it was just a matter of realizing how non-essential meat is in a good tasty meal... And just like anything else, it is not all or nothing, e.g. by carpooling or taking the bus you are cutting down your emissions even if you still own a car
simonchis 1 year ago
weaklings i was able to become a vegetarian at 12
pdlsuper7 1 year ago 3
oh god this is stupid
Viewtiful22 1 year ago
i'm having ribs tonight :-)
Ramsez 1 year ago
@gallop2victory Ha Ha you figure that HOW?
1madaboutguitar 1 year ago
what's with the animation behind?
Juggernaughty824 1 year ago
I agree that being a vegetarian would be better, I disagree that we are a carnivorous culture....because humans are omnivorous O.O
warmpancaxe 1 year ago
"eating a hamburger a day increases risk of dying by a third". I, as a mortal, am already at 100% chance of dying. Bad statistic bub.
theqball80 1 year ago 6
You know, I'll agree with a lot of the comments I've been seeing and say that it wasn't a very good or in-depth or even sourced/cited talk, BUT I'm so so very glad this was posted.
I'm no simpleton, but the mere concept that I could still do my part and just cut back on meat and still enjoy it some once a week had never crossed my mind.
Its because straight up vegetarians are so self righteous, and meat eaters are so very defensive, I never considered a middle ground possible.
SakuraElyse 1 year ago
I converted to weekday vegetarianism a few months ago after reading about it on Treehugger, and I couldn't be happier with the choice. Most of the time, I don't even eat meat in the weekends, but if I feel the craving, I have that to look forward to.
It's unrealistic to think that we will be able to convert even NEARLY everyone to vegetarians within our lifetime, but not far-fetched to think we could be able to convince people to REDUCE their intake of meat.
Magnulus 1 year ago