why again SW fans siding with the Empire? SW heroes are'nt from the Empire's side... The Empire failed, so why siding with the loosers? It would be more fair to compare the Alliance with the Fed, or to compare the Borg (and all ST ennemies) to the Empire...
It takes one photon torpedo to destroy a whole 3m x 3m asteroid meanwhile Jango Fett's slave ship destroys a quarter of a asteroid field and these asteroids in episode II attack of the clones
@Joshman345 It takesone torpedo to kill a whole 5km by 5km asteroid. And the asteroids you refer to were like small shuttlecraft, no to mention hollow.
Phasers are more powerful than lasers. PERIOD. If you are using tech manuals from Star Wars and Star Trek, fine. I can use that to disprove what you're saying. Let's say Lasers are a Pentium IV processor at it's highest clock speed, 3.8ghz. Let's say Phasers, which are MUCH more advanced than lasers, are then next processor up, Dual Core running at it's highest clockspeed, 2.6ghz. You're saying a P4 3.8ghz is more powerful than a Dual Core 2.6ghz. P4= more powerful b/c of clockspeed.WRONG.
Hey I just realized something that many people who know you probably already know. After about 30 seconds or so I was able to completely tune you the fuck out. I really have no idea what you said after the x wing could shoot through the Enterprise, I just started talking shit and didn't hear another word that you said. Sorry. Or better yet. What was that?
Another thing, take a breath ,Jesus. You talk like a Democrat; so fast and loud that no rational person has a chance to get a word in edgewise to counter your flury of bullshit. We cannot consider this argument is not worth the effort. Why? THE SHIT DOESN'T EXIST, ANYWHERE! ITS FICTION. Its like arguing about who would win a wrestling match Santa Claus or The Tooth Fairy. Meaningless. Go jerk off or something.
Ok, I am not going to argue about this because its all fiction. But, Lucas pulled the numbers he got out of his ass. Star Trek was more realistic on their energy outputs due to the number of nerds involved in the project. Star Wars would win not because of their energy, but because the Federation are pussies and the Empire are bloodthirsty killers. The X wing vs. Enterprise is bullshit. Yes I can argue that point because like I said Lucas pulled it out of his ass, and its not realistic.
what I dont understand is neither star wars or star trek ships can fly on the surface of a star like our sun. if nuclear bombs are as hot as the surface of the sun wouldnt nuclear weapons be VERY powerful in both these universes. also you can put nukes on pretty much anything becuase you can build whatever side you need. star trek phazer can vaporize cities and hand held can wipe out battalions in one shot but ive never seen it done in any movie or episode why is that
there are so many errors in this video, mainly the fact that star wars would kick star trek's ass. i've personally had the pleasure of asking George Lucas what he thought of this subject, and he said that star trek would win. he has stated numerous times that star wars was inspired by star trek. star wars threw out the science and essentially made what the fans come up with their own science, while star trek is based on science improbabiliities, not impossibilities like star wars.
@crowsan12 That is exactly correct,Star Trek is science based,Star Wars is just the opposite--fans babbling numbers they created for themselves whether they make any sense or not-AND THIS VIDEO PROVES IT WELL!!!!!!
star trek ppl just see thet you hew lost dis ona. and if you like star trek it is ok. i give a shit. i like star wars. but if you ST ppl talke shit of star wars. then i talke shit of star trek. K
Gotta love the Star Wars science. Star Wars has lasers, "but they're not really lasers." Star Wars has LIGHTSPEED, but they can travel from one end of the galaxy to the next in days or weeks. Must be a very SMALL galaxy. :S
Star Trek used science to define how things are done. Roddenberry actually got help from NASA. We actually see some Star Trek style items today (cell phones, ipads, etc.) Star Wars gave us Jar-Jar.
Lucas said himself Star Wars is Sci-FANTASY, Trek is Sci-FICTION.
BTW, Star Trek will always defeat Star Wars. Here are two possibilities of how it happens:
1.) Q snaps his fingers. The Star Wars Universe disappears. And Q does it without disrupting the timeline throughout the rest of the universe.
2.) The Empire fell at the hands of TEDDY BEARS named Ewoks. I'd argue Kirk, Picard, Janeway, Sisco, and Archer are smarter and have more tactical experience than the Ewoks.
@GalacticNonsense Star Wars fans calculate speed by using the absence of footage showing accurate travel time from point A to point B in ANH, which at the moment they get to the Death Star, they say 'Increase to attack speed' and from that point on, we see them doing surface attack runs at mere MPH speeds.
Dudes, you have to be absolute morons to think you're going to submit such wankery and expect someone to accept it. That's the biggest load of horse shit 'Canon' I've ever seem.
Define a measurement of a Gigawat. In each universe. See, this is the problem. How do you know if they are using the same scale for defining a gigawat? Just like when you mentioned Warp 13 from "All Good Things..." This is a redrawing of the warp scale. Warp 10 is basically equal to the speed of infinity, which no ship can go (except for one episode of Voyager where Tom Paris actually achieved the infinity speed.) Unless BOTH manuals say they are using the same SCALE to define a GW, NO.
I must start by saying i am a fan of both series, but i am just a little curious as to what drugs are being smoked here when these ULTRA BIASED so called technical remarks are being made.A Galaxy class starship is 4,500,000 tonnes,640 feet from top to bottom,1540 feet across and almost a half mile long.Phased energy weapons,antimatter torpedoes,hull armour and mega shielding!AND WHAT.....one little fighter will blow it to bits in one shot....with what.... lasers???......NOT LIKELY!!!!!!!!!!!
@87camaro100 I know, right? To the average Star Wars fan, a loose collection of jet engine parts piloted by one guy can kill a precisely manufactured battleship from the future, as long as the battleship is from Star Trek.
@Idazmi7 Yah, no kidding,the average Star Wars fan is interested in a good story,and it is a good story,i like it alot.But on the tech side of things it's a little far fetched. Star Wars tech is R2D2 and C3P0.Star Trek is Commander Data.Comparing the ships of both sides would be the same exact story.A Dominion Wars Galaxy Class battleship would yawn if it seen any amount of Tie Fighters coming it's way.
@87camaro100 A Constitution class would laugh outright. My second favourite sci-fi film is Star Wars: the Empire strikes Back. But I recognise the immense utility of the Star Trek space vessel:
Star Trek's phaser is a city vapourising weapon, and a PRECISE CUTTING TOOL in one package, not to mention rapid fire, and it's the least impressive gun in Star Trek.
Star Wars' Turbolaser is an exploding tracer bullet.
@klamki1 well we will never no who's better until the the people responsible for the shows tell us who's better p.s federation time ships can go all over the damn universe and go back in time and obliterate the star wars planets and people before they went to space.
That's completely impossible the federation starships have so much more firepower how can a x-wing destroy the enterprise-d the enterprise-d is a galaxy class the most powerful of its time an x-wing is the size of a shuttle craft star wars tech is primitive compared to star trek tech lasers or blasters can't go though federation shields and phasers can burn through the most solid metal the federation can clearly take over the empire if they wanted to
@bluebrick0701 All I hear is crap coming from your mouth, no evidence to support your claim. The Enterprise-D would get destroyed if it battled Slave-1! Its main turrets can fire 64000 GW and Enterprise main phasers can fire 3.6GW. HyperSpace can take you to a different galaxy and Warp takes 75 years to get to a different quadrant! And actually Turbos would rip through the hull of Feds. If they went against a Destroyer they would last 5secs. There only chance would be speed and team up with Rebs
@KLamki1 all of the star wars weapon stats are wrong. Example Slave 1 can break apart asteroids with it's blasters. The same blasters barely damage obi wans ship. Obi wans ship is made of Durasteel. At-St is also made of the same durasteel.
The At-St is crushed by 2 logs the logs suffer no damage.
Therefore the asteroids that Slave 1 was shooting where weak and not strong at all so the numbers for the star wars weapons are wrong
@KLamki1 Also. R2D2 is shot with a direct hit by a Tiefighters blasters. R2D2 is also hit with a blaster rifle in RotJ and suffers similar damage.
Therefore a Tiefighters weapons are about the same strenght as a blaster rifle.
We have also seen a tiefighters weapons are a threat to capital ships so therefore a tiefigthers weapons and a capital ships armor are not as strong as people think.
@bluebrick0701 I don't agree with the X-wing though. I'm sure they would be assed kicked, but this guy has researched so I can't argue. At least the Tie fighters would get destroyed though, they have no shields!
@KLamki1 lol Star Wars fires hundreds of shots and most of them miss against targets slow enough that they can keep up with. What are they supposed to do against ships that can elude them indefinitely? Star Wars ships have no way of chasing Star Trek ships so whether their weapons can do damage means very little. In a real strategic conflict, it comes down to whether Star Destroyers would sit there while Trek ships find a weakness to exploit, and then its all over.
@DigitalAlpine They have some ships in their fleet to slow down ships, can't remember what they call them. They would use tractor beams like the Borg and I'm pretty sure not every ship in their fleet is slow ass capital ships. The rebels would team up with the Feds so its fine. You don't really think the rebels/republic would team with the Empire, do you? And i'm pretty sure theres a site explaining star wars ships are about the same speed as Feds, I think the bigger ones are slower though.
@KLamki1 They're called Acclamators. They have to generate a gravity well that would perhaps cause problems with Warp Drive like it does Hyperdrive but Trek can evade SW ships at Impulse. The enterprise has been shown capable of going from like all stop, do a 180 and jump to warp in like 3 seconds. That's reasonably comparable maneuverability to any ship, large or small, only I never see Star Destroyers show maneuvers like that, ever. They're like Aircraft Carriers until they jump to hyperspace
@DigitalAlpine Anyway I don't care about too much tech crap, as long as its cool and things blowup its all the same to me. Can't wait to play STO, bought the golden edition on Amazon, I'm going to use the disk to install it on my mac with that new program called wine wrap (Star Trek Online on Mac).
@Idazmi7 This guy so called "research" is videos. Research: Its on the internet, if you you weren't so goddam biased you could try looking it up. Ever heard of looking things up for yourself? Or do you want me to do your homework for you and then call me a moron again? Learn to wipe your own ass jerk and stop spamming my inbox, I repeat I don't want to read your bullshit that you make up, at least I gave facts you just say "OH Look At Vid!" When was that comparable proof on both ships?
@Idazmi7 Now I have work to do, unlike some people that just sit their ass glued to a chair all day typing crap and trolling every Star Wars vs Star Trek vid, loser. Seriously go and do some work or just take a walk outside and have a conversation with people, if you can walk that is.... Might help your small mind be more open to others opinions for once, cough never going to happen...
@thepounderful That's what I would consider most likely - Enterprise can always stand off until they find a weakness, and in theory, never be caught. Impulse drives are fast enough to 'speed off in an instant' the moment they get the slightest hint of danger, IF it was even caught standing still when an Imperial fleet comes out of hyperspace.
star trek wins.. hands down.. IE the NCC-1701D travels 10 times the speed of an X-wing fighter at max speed,.. so fighters have no effect and capital ships are super slow and could probably not hit the enterprise while the enterprise sets up an attack run,
Dont even attempt to insult someone's intelligence with your bullshit. You can read all about the downside of hyperspace travel, and when you're done losing your hardon, maybe u can debate some actual facts.
@onlypeaceindeath the bioship would be able to outmanuver the star destroyer, also where does it even show its 3000G star destroyers are slow lumbering unmanuverable ships that are sitting ducks for bioships to come and destroy.
@xXDARKNESS9Xx The Millennium Falcon had to stuggle to outmaneuver a Star Destroyer. A bioship would be the perferct target. And the +3000 G's comes from the battle of Endor. The Imperial fleet moves around Endor in roughly one minute to block the Rebel fleet from escaping. Depending on the distance the fleet was from Endor, and when it actuallly started to move (it could have been less than a minute), it would have needed an acceleration between 2200 G's to something as high as +5000 G's.
"Warp speed combat beats ANYTHING below 500,000 G manuvers."
There IS no +5000 G maneuvers. Because the clearest logic you will ever need is: IF THE SHIPS ARE BADASS AND CAPABLE OF DOING IT, THEY'D HAVE SHOWED IT IN THE MOVIES. SW has ALWAYS shown off the capabilities of a ship in space battles - its absolutely frickin RETARDED to think he'd just not include their best normal space capabilities and leave you to figure shit out with speculative math.
@Idazmi7 Since their weapons will be useless such an advantage is not going to save them anyway. Besides, the Empire have tricks that could probably remove much of that advantage anyway.
@onlypeaceindeath I suggest you educate yourself. Star Wars is the one with disadvantages in FTL, because they're in hyperspace.
Star Trek abides by 'nothing travels faster than light' and cheats it by warping space, using subspace corridors, underspace, transwarp conduits, Slipstream, etc. Um.. they use their weapons in these places, and in normal space at warp speed.
Note: The warped space that effects ship speed, will also effect weapons speed.
@DigitalAlpine Since Hyperspace is normally faster, how is that a disadvantage? Tactically maybe, but its not like Star Destroyers will spend their entire time trying to play cat and mouse games. If they can't catch a ship they will head for another target, such as planets or refuel stations etc. Warp is also affected by gravity if I remember correctly. Technologies such as tractor beams, distortion field generators and interdiction fields will play an important roll for SW then.
@onlypeaceindeath "If they can't catch a ship they will head for another target, such as planets or refuel stations"
Of course they will, having magically acquired more star charts than even the Borg have so they can plot safe routes through hyperspace, and they suddenly have knowledge of all the strategic targets? All this speculative 'what if' crap is the arguments of a desperate fan. You can ALWAYS say 'if, then' but both sides have that option. We can always deploy ships to those areas.
@DigitalAlpine I assume the Empire wouldn't start a war without the proper scouting first. All they need to do is to scout out some larger routs for the main invasion and then simply spread from there using long-range sensors and such to safely navigate when they are travelling "off-road".
@onlypeaceindeath starting a scouting war? Dude u are way into the 'what if' now. Before you start worrying about 'what if', just try to stay focused on the matter at hand.
@onlypeaceindeath " All they need to do is to scout out some larger routs"
what if, what if. So the Empire goes searching for stuff to blow up, find out Borg and 8472 is waiting for them when they get there. So its back to ship vs ship. (about 2000 years later since the Empire has no knowledge and would take decades to try mapping hyperspace routes.)
Because we're talking about engaging ships, and Hyperspace is not good for that, only fleeing the scene as shown in so many SW movies. You can't chase someone who jumps to hyperspace, but SW cant chase someone who goes to warp. Disadvantages: You have to wait for Nav comp to plot courses, you are flying blind, you can't track ships, can't make course adjustments, can't communicate, can't use weapons, etc etc.
@DigitalAlpine The nav computer only takes a few seconds as I recall, at least for military ships. And you can track ships, make slight course adjustments and communicate. The Star Destroyers chasing the Falcon in ANH appeared to have tracked it, based on Solo's statement that he had finally lost them. As for communication, i'm pretty sure the Clone Wars has shown it. And for maneuvering, i have to look that up, but i'm pretty sure i've heard that its possible, which would be necessary anyway.
I suggest you google something about hyperspace and read about the hazards. Traveling at hyperspace speeds, your sensors and comm will not work because no signals you would use for them would travel to and from your target at the same speeds. Falcon came out of hyperspace near their intended destination to find it was blown up... remember that? Why didnt they know? Cuzz they cant detect real space stuff while in hyperspace.
@DigitalAlpine Or he didn't use the sensors at all. Boba Fett could track the Falcon in hyperspace, the Star Destroyers could track the Falcon in hyperspace, the Empire could track the Rebel fleet in hyperspace as I recall it. The idea that one is loses both communication and sensors in hyperspace makes no sense.
@onlypeaceindeath h t t p : / / st a r w a r s . w i k i a . c o m / w i k i / H y p e r s p a c e read something once and stop trying to bullshit your way thru debates.
@onlypeaceindeath "In addition to navigational hazards, there was also the difficulty inherent in communicating with a starship while traveling at hyperspeed. Since ships in hyperspace did not exist, in a conventional sense, they were largely cut off from conventional radio or subspace communication...wavelengths of any signal would be massively distorted..The same difficulties presented to communication also applied to sensors"
I dont make it up... you should read it for yourself.
@DigitalAlpine Funny how the Essential Atlas says that sensor data is gathered from starships which has travelled in hyperspace to be analyzed by the Space Ministry. "As a part of the same process, route and sensor data from starships' navicomputers is routinely uploaded and collected for analysis by the ministry's astrogation bureau, after which it becomes part of new updates". Page 14.
@onlypeaceindeath First of all, I didnt write the information available at Wookipedia. Surely there must be problems or why mention it? I also don't claim there is no work-around for making successful transmissions. However, since Han came out of hyperspace only to find there was a whole fricking PLANET missing, it stands to reason, they have trouble with sensors detecting such things. HOWEVER... Here's some stuff that should be noted... [cont...]
The sensor trouble I was talking about was not astrogation data; I was talking about trying to track a ship in normal space while in hyperspace.
So why dont you go to wookipedia and read up on all the hyperspace stuff there, and maybe come back then and try to argue your statement of sensors for astrogation data has anything to do with the discussion. LOL
@DigitalAlpine Why are you guys making a argument about hyperspace? Everybody knows that hyperspace can take you to a different galaxy in days and if you went on warp it would take decades to get to a galaxy. Theres a website on all this shit, waiting to be read, but all you guys just want to debate further until your agrument is trolling the comment page.
Need I remind you they show the Enterprise go from practically standing still to a 180 U-turn and jump to warp? Soon as you come up with these Interdictors and begin creating a gravity field which takes some time, Enterprise can easily get away on Impulse. You must remember that Trek battles are shown slow enough on screen, but so long as the scenes of Enterprise maneuverability exists, we must accept these ARE NOT SLOW TARGETS.
@DigitalAlpine Which means that they have pretty much left the battlefield. If they won't engage the imperial ships in combat, the Federation ships might loose the Imperials when they enter hyperspace for a more important target, depending how much information they have on the Federation.
@onlypeaceindeath Oh, and BTW, I find it quite lame to use this 'anything in ST that can go wrong WILL go wrong'. I can accept they cant use 100% of their technology 100% of the time but SW fans try to say 'if at some point it didn't work, it will never work' and that's BS. If you have ANY integrity, you'll at least keep things realistic.
Also, the unexplained being used as canon is BS too. The calculation of 3000G is over-wank based on poor writing. Everything about it smells of discrepancy.
@DigitalAlpine I can agree on the first point. But that the acceleration calculations are over-wank and poor writing doesn't change the fact that it appears that the Imperial navy, and also Rebel navy covered many tens of thousands of kilometers in the minute (or something like 72 seconds if I remember correctly). When the Rebels exits hyperspace they are closing in on the Death Star pretty fast as it is visibly growing on screen. And Endor is not the only sceen with >1000 G's in Star wars.
@onlypeaceindeath The wank about covering so much distance "offscreen" is about moving the action forward in the movie. Nothing more. I refuse to accept it because if it was a vital point of how fast the ships are, they would have shown that in the movie. The only reasoon they got those ships from point A to point B so fast was to keep the action of the movie going.
No, its part of a movie that doesnt even exist and you're wanking off to it. just like someone who said if Han Solo wasnt in the scene just after a jump to hyperspace, he must have been making course adjustments the whole time. Dude, seriously?? I do NOT believe in 'part of a movie missing equals time that can be used to explain ship acceleration' so u can pretty much just fuck off with that whole BS concept.
@onlypeaceindeath "The Millennium Falcon had to stuggle to outmaneuver a Star Destroyer."
DUMBEST STATEMENT EVER!! The falcon was able to pull a 180 and go right back towards the ship, so it did NOT struggle to outmaneuver, it was just HELLA SLOW.
You have truly shown just how GD ignorant you are. And your wank-off 'math based on time' logic fails cuz if they HAD that kind of speed, Lucas would have shown it all thru the frickin movie! They CHUCK the time to keep the movie action going! DUH
I'm not about to look through nearly 600 comments, but has anybody pointed out that Incredible Cross Sections didn't give firepower numbers for the X-Wing?
@Jesse1066 No, but Slave 1 could be used as a benchmark for heavy fighters. Two kiloton laser cannons, multi-megaton missils, multi-gigaton bombs. Or maybe he used another source?
@onlypeaceindeath If X-Wings had four laser cannons, each twice as powerful as a W79 tactical nuke, the Empire must have been huuuge idiots to use unshielded TIE Fighters.
@onlypeaceindeath Star destroyers are very slow and not very manuverable also it would take borg nanoprobs to destroy species 8472 which the empire does not have.
@xXDARKNESS9Xx They're not slow. +3000 G acceleration is pretty damn good, and they might have even more. And bioships can obviously be destroyed by other stuff since a slow impact was enough to cause it do explode.
@onlypeaceindeath "a slow impact was enough to cause it do explode." That's drawing conclusions, and not even a good one since the Borg Cube also exploded, which as I said, running a ship over as the cube did would likely trigger the explosive potential of the vessel. It's like saying, you can blow up a truck by shooting it with tracer rounds from a rifle, just because you hit a cargo container full of TNT. If the truck HAD no TNT you wouldnt get the same results.
@onlypeaceindeath Here's an example of slow: When they got to the 2nd Death Star and realized it's a trap, they took evasive action... like earths big battle ships, they take a long slow sweeping turn, and then they're just sitting there getting wasted on. Maybe u have some clip u can show me where they maneuver faster than the rebels did when they noticed the 'trap' ? And I'd like to see that +3000 G accel in action...
@onlypeaceindeath "The movies supports such levels of destruction by the very fact that the reactor can supply the engines with enough power to accelerate a Star Destroyer to 3000G (which is observed in RotJ).
This comment turned up in my search. Falcon is rated at 3000g also right? When chased by an SD, why not turn left and pull 3000G? Simple escape unless those numbers are BS. An SD would literally NEVER be able to chase a small ship with the Falcon's maneuverability. Period. No Fing way.
You guys are idiots star wars has more ships beter superweapon and honestly the tech manuals are produced by Lucas so sorry if the numbers hurt Trekies. Wait im not sorry I am laughing at the fact that if it comes down to numbers SW wins. Besides ST was afraid of a gigawatts star wars use gigawats weapons as normal fire power
Well, I seem to have disproven this whole video as mindless fanwank. Star Trek has: Better guns, Better accuracy, Better range, Better shields, And better anti-starfigher defense. My reasons why are below this post, and can be referenced: Star Trek TNG/DS9battles:
/watch?v=d734afLFPds
/watch?v=QN2ZrTpvIss
Star Wars ep3/ep6 battles:
/watch?v=BIAHHGnpQ3c
/watch?v=weDrSphcVEg
Star Trek wins, easily. As I've said before: watch Star Trek and Star Wars before arguing, it saves time
Well, I seem to have disproven this whole video as mindless fanwank. Star Trek has: Better guns Better accuracy Better range Better shields Better anti-starfigher defense even (mostly) BIGGER SHIPS My reasons why are below this post, and can be referenced: Star Trek TNG/DS9battles /watch?v=d734afLFPds /watch?v=QN2ZrTpvIss Star Wars ep3/ep6 battles /watch?v=BIAHHGnpQ3c /watch?v=weDrSphcVEg Star Trek wins. Starfleet never misses a shot in war, and has better guns.
@onlypeaceindeath dont forget that a borg cube is huge so of course it destroyed the bioship but fighters are smaller than the bioship so if they did collide than the fighter would be destroyed while the other ship maybe a little damaged but not destroyed. Also it would take a star destroyer ramming into one of their bioships to destroy it, and since star destroyers are slower i doubt they will be able to ram even one.
@xXDARKNESS9Xx It doesn't matter if the Borg Cube was huge. It's the impact that counts. The bioship rammed the borg cube at a speed of a few hundred meters at most, which destroyed both. That says much about both vessels fragility. Starfighters armed with shaped-charged nuclear warheads with a 100+ megaton yield would be devastating against both. And how fast can a bioship accelerate? Star Destroyers can accelerate something like 3000> G's as was seen in battle of Endor.
@onlypeaceindeath How do you suggest Star Wars would ever hit something they can't even keep up with? The turrets for the turbo cannons can't even rotate fast enough to track a ship at ST impulse speeds, nor can the fighters keep pace with that in normal space. SW is ALL SLOW in normal space. The maneuverability of the Star Destroyers is practically non-existent.
Borg and Voyager were trying to outrun 8472 and the Cube literally ran the bioship over. Regardless of whether they can withstand energy weapons or not, running something over will likely trigger an explosion of their own weapons, power reactors, warp core, antimatter containment, whatever is on the ship that has explosive potential.
Firepower doesn't have to be great enough to destroy, just enough to trigger the explosive potential of their target.
Finally, I didn't get any reference in your speech explaining wave frequencies and their interactions in shieldings and weaponry. Plazma was proven to choke warp engines in early days and I don't know any info about later designs. Plazma blast is particle stream and star fleet shielding was successfully blocking it within plazma clouds (at high speeds), much more dense than single or multiple weapon blasts.
@unendlicheWeisheit Star Wars is not "bad shit". It is just different (sub)genre, more dynamic and easier to understand if you are impatient or too lazy to think.
I used to like SW more when I was a kid. When I grew up I understood ST better.
There is no way any ship or station that starwars has can beat species 8472 the only way to kill them is with borg nanoprobes which the empire doesnt have. plus they can also destroy planets like the deathstar can. Their weapons while annihilate the stardestroyers and rip through the deathstar there is no way the empire can stop that.
@xXDARKNESS9Xx Actually, the Empire only needs to deploy fighters. Species 8472 ships are so soft that a slow impact with a Borg Cube casuses them to explode.
@onlypeaceindeath Cardassians don't understand point-defense weapon arrangement. (kind of like the Imperial Empire) Find one-man fighters attacking and destroying a Starfleet ship.
@Idazmi7 Cardassian ships have pretty much the same weapons as the Federation. There is no reason fighters shouldn't work on Federation warships. And Imperial starships do have pretty good point-defences (specially against civilian targets or targets with limited ECM). They managed to clear out huge voids in the Hoth asteroid belt with little trouble. Turbolasers have also pretty good accuracy against civilian targets, such as the astro-mechs trying to repair Amidala's Yacht in Episode 1.
@Idazmi7 They have two on the dorsal side too, and might have some on the ventral side.
And one question? What is considered a good point-defence? The Executor had roughly a 50% hit ratio against tiny fighters, in a fleet battle, and they where hit from the side when they made a close strafing maneuver in the Executor's cityscape. That's pretty good, considering the situation.
@Idazmi7 They have at least two phasers on the dorsal side, one at the top of the bridge and one in the middle. And they might have some on the ventral side too.
And what is considered a good point-defence? The Executor had roughly a 50% hit ratio against fighters who where flying in the cityscape, and it hit them from the side too, during a fleet battle. That's not that bad considering the circumstances. The Star Destroyers in the Hoth asteroid field blasted everything in their vicinity.
@Idazmi7 Yet they can't repeat such accuracy in a fleet battle. It's quite obviously that jamming plays part in this. I don't question that Star Trek ships can hit stuff with great accuracy, but their sensors are notorious for being easily disrupted by stuff ranging from simple EM radiation to heavy metals and even something as simple as Magnesite (magnesium carbonate). A few dozen fighters which are emitting large amounts of jamming signals should last some time.
@onlypeaceindeath Yes they can, and do replicate that accuracy in heavy combat, and no, they are not "notorious for being easily jammed"
Find a starfleet ship actually *missing* a target! Klingons miss all the time. Dominion miss. But Starfleet? I can't recall even one miss. There is a scene where two Galaxy Class ships precision-strike a Cardassian warship, in heavy combat. It's all over Youtube.
Don't even mention torpedoes: 10 shots at ten targets in simultaneum, over and over...
@Idazmi7 They manage to score hits on warships a few hundred meters away from them, in Deep Space 9 battles. That's hardly impressive. And yes, they are notorious for being jammed or blocked by all kinds of stuff. A wing of fighters screaming out their ECM would be a though target.
Besides, if Romulans, Cardassians and Klingon misses such small targets in larger fleet battles, there is no reason to believe that Federation starships should perform any better.
@Idazmi7 Yet they choose to fight at such short ranges in Deep Space 9, and also in Voyager from time to time. Sure, they can hit stuff at great ranges, and so can Star Destroyers, but in larger fleet battles, or where some form of interference is present, Starfleet and the other navies appears to always have to fight at close range.
Star Wars cannot claim anything now. Not power, range, accuracy, capability, armor, shields, firing rates, speed, or anything else.
So you instead poke fun at audience-pleasing visual effects. And no, never did a Starfleet ship miss- ever. Interference or not, long range or not. You have nothing, so you try to hypothesize hidden weaknesses. Those weaknesses do not exist. To destroy a Star Trek ship, you must be powerful.
@Idazmi7 Star Wars has claimed pretty much all of those points. You don't just want to admit it.
And Starfleet have missed. Remember a Borg battle in, was it Q Who? They had to fire four shots from a few hundred meters to hit the tractor beam. And they missed big time too. The ECM produced from SW vessels would most likely produce similar results, considering how useless Federation sensors are.
@onlypeaceindeath Star Wars claimed none of it: you did. Like most fanboys
"a few hundred meters to hit the tractor beam" That was way longer than that: borg cubes are city-sized!
And find a few more starfleet misses to really make a point. Every battle in Star Wars features hundereds of misses: episodes 1,2,3,4,5 and 6, without ECM mentioned anywhere.
@Idazmi7 Enterprise was right on top of it and had the accuracy of a blind, drunk redneck.
And episode 4 and 6 do mention jamming. During battle of Yavin the Rebel pilots complained about that they couldn't detect the Imperial fighters, and one pilot even said "There's to much interference". During battle of Endor the Imperials had even a dedicated ship to produce some form of undetectable jamming which prohibited the rebels from detecting the imperial fleet and even...continue>
@onlypeaceindeath Find more phasers missing. Blasters miss WITHOUT jamming, and only the Death Star has jamming. And what dedicated jamming ship? Which of the 40 dead Star Destroyers?
In Star Trek there was only one scene with any missed shots.Involving higher tech species. In Star Wars, EVERY EFFING SCENE features "soldiers" acting like rednecks with machine guns.
@Idazmi7 Deep Space 9 only grazed a Cardassian ship which was about to ram it, also from a few hundred meters away. It travelled very slowly and in a straight line too.
The ship I refered to was the Imperial Main Communications ship, which was mentioned in the novelization of Return of the Jedi. Curtis Saxton also believed he spotted it in a screenshot which had a view of the battle from the Emperors throne room. Wookiepedia has an article about it, if you're interested.
@Idazmi7 The Holocron mentions all canon, from G to S canon. And as stated by Chee, the stats in the Cross Sections are still canon. Trivia seems to matter very little.
And as I said, the Comm-ship was mentioned in the novelization, and it even took out a Mon Calamari cruiser by itself. Don't ignore canon.
@Idazmi7 And yet Lucas creates a branch of Lucasfilm that specifically works to keep the continuity. Face it, Chee knows more what Lucas wants than you do. If he says that something's canon then it is canon.
HAIL STAR WARS
siegeghost100 5 days ago
MUST KEEP THE LIKES AND DISLIKES IN BALANCE!
MSKproductions123456 5 days ago
I hate technical manual
drazar1358 1 week ago
why again SW fans siding with the Empire? SW heroes are'nt from the Empire's side... The Empire failed, so why siding with the loosers? It would be more fair to compare the Alliance with the Fed, or to compare the Borg (and all ST ennemies) to the Empire...
SuperCoraxo 1 week ago
@SuperCoraxo Because they have the largest military in star wars history, but not the most powerful actually
siegeghost100 5 days ago
@SuperCoraxo Ok lets do Empire vs Borg...
Empire attacks Borg.
Borg Adapts.
Empire gets destroyed.
The End.
inphasesith 5 days ago
@inphasesith =D
SuperCoraxo 4 days ago
It takes one photon torpedo to destroy a whole 3m x 3m asteroid meanwhile Jango Fett's slave ship destroys a quarter of a asteroid field and these asteroids in episode II attack of the clones
were the size of the enterprise's saucer.
Joshman345 1 week ago
@Joshman345 It takesone torpedo to kill a whole 5km by 5km asteroid. And the asteroids you refer to were like small shuttlecraft, no to mention hollow.
Idazmi7 1 week ago
Phasers are more powerful than lasers. PERIOD. If you are using tech manuals from Star Wars and Star Trek, fine. I can use that to disprove what you're saying. Let's say Lasers are a Pentium IV processor at it's highest clock speed, 3.8ghz. Let's say Phasers, which are MUCH more advanced than lasers, are then next processor up, Dual Core running at it's highest clockspeed, 2.6ghz. You're saying a P4 3.8ghz is more powerful than a Dual Core 2.6ghz. P4= more powerful b/c of clockspeed.WRONG.
GalacticNonsense 1 week ago
At the first picture. WHO LETS THE NX-01 IN A FULL OUT WAR!?!?
LegoWeirds 1 week ago
I like both but sorry this is bull - Sorry
TMulvale 2 weeks ago
Hey I just realized something that many people who know you probably already know. After about 30 seconds or so I was able to completely tune you the fuck out. I really have no idea what you said after the x wing could shoot through the Enterprise, I just started talking shit and didn't hear another word that you said. Sorry. Or better yet. What was that?
78starbuck 2 weeks ago
Another thing, take a breath ,Jesus. You talk like a Democrat; so fast and loud that no rational person has a chance to get a word in edgewise to counter your flury of bullshit. We cannot consider this argument is not worth the effort. Why? THE SHIT DOESN'T EXIST, ANYWHERE! ITS FICTION. Its like arguing about who would win a wrestling match Santa Claus or The Tooth Fairy. Meaningless. Go jerk off or something.
78starbuck 2 weeks ago
@78starbuck
Yes the tech to build a death star does exist!
legogeek94 1 week ago
@legogeek94 Where is it, then? Too big.
Idazmi7 1 week ago
@Idazmi7
We do have laser tech, now all we need is a giant metal ball to be built in space
legogeek94 1 week ago
@legogeek94 You are an idiot. No laser we could make would damage a small mountain, let alone a planet.
Idazmi7 1 week ago
@Idazmi7
A nuclear reactor would be enough to power the laser...
legogeek94 1 week ago
@legogeek94 Still not enough to blow up the world.
Idazmi7 1 week ago
@Idazmi7
Who said it had to blow up the world?
It could be made to hit targets from the size of a person, up to a chunk of land the size of china
legogeek94 1 week ago
@legogeek94 -_- I thought you were talking about an actual Death Star.
Idazmi7 1 week ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@legogeek94 -_- I thought you were talking about an actual Death Star.
Idazmi7 1 week ago
@Idazmi7
Is doesn't need to be the size off the real DS, it could be the size of a Darksaber
legogeek94 1 week ago
Ok, I am not going to argue about this because its all fiction. But, Lucas pulled the numbers he got out of his ass. Star Trek was more realistic on their energy outputs due to the number of nerds involved in the project. Star Wars would win not because of their energy, but because the Federation are pussies and the Empire are bloodthirsty killers. The X wing vs. Enterprise is bullshit. Yes I can argue that point because like I said Lucas pulled it out of his ass, and its not realistic.
78starbuck 2 weeks ago
what I dont understand is neither star wars or star trek ships can fly on the surface of a star like our sun. if nuclear bombs are as hot as the surface of the sun wouldnt nuclear weapons be VERY powerful in both these universes. also you can put nukes on pretty much anything becuase you can build whatever side you need. star trek phazer can vaporize cities and hand held can wipe out battalions in one shot but ive never seen it done in any movie or episode why is that
canadachop 2 weeks ago
@canadachop Star Trek ships can, and do. Just not often.
Idazmi7 1 week ago
@canadachop And the phaser does that in the Original Series.
Idazmi7 1 week ago
Anyone with a brain knows this is bull.
Idazmi7 2 weeks ago
there are so many errors in this video, mainly the fact that star wars would kick star trek's ass. i've personally had the pleasure of asking George Lucas what he thought of this subject, and he said that star trek would win. he has stated numerous times that star wars was inspired by star trek. star wars threw out the science and essentially made what the fans come up with their own science, while star trek is based on science improbabiliities, not impossibilities like star wars.
crowsan12 2 weeks ago
@crowsan12 That is exactly correct,Star Trek is science based,Star Wars is just the opposite--fans babbling numbers they created for themselves whether they make any sense or not-AND THIS VIDEO PROVES IT WELL!!!!!!
87camaro100 2 weeks ago
star trek ppl just see thet you hew lost dis ona. and if you like star trek it is ok. i give a shit. i like star wars. but if you ST ppl talke shit of star wars. then i talke shit of star trek. K
natonorway 2 weeks ago
@natonorway The guy in the video talked shit first.
Idazmi7 2 weeks ago
Gotta love the Star Wars science. Star Wars has lasers, "but they're not really lasers." Star Wars has LIGHTSPEED, but they can travel from one end of the galaxy to the next in days or weeks. Must be a very SMALL galaxy. :S
Star Trek used science to define how things are done. Roddenberry actually got help from NASA. We actually see some Star Trek style items today (cell phones, ipads, etc.) Star Wars gave us Jar-Jar.
Lucas said himself Star Wars is Sci-FANTASY, Trek is Sci-FICTION.
GalacticNonsense 3 weeks ago
BTW, Star Trek will always defeat Star Wars. Here are two possibilities of how it happens:
1.) Q snaps his fingers. The Star Wars Universe disappears. And Q does it without disrupting the timeline throughout the rest of the universe.
2.) The Empire fell at the hands of TEDDY BEARS named Ewoks. I'd argue Kirk, Picard, Janeway, Sisco, and Archer are smarter and have more tactical experience than the Ewoks.
GalacticNonsense 3 weeks ago
@GalacticNonsense Star Wars fans calculate speed by using the absence of footage showing accurate travel time from point A to point B in ANH, which at the moment they get to the Death Star, they say 'Increase to attack speed' and from that point on, we see them doing surface attack runs at mere MPH speeds.
Dudes, you have to be absolute morons to think you're going to submit such wankery and expect someone to accept it. That's the biggest load of horse shit 'Canon' I've ever seem.
DigitalAlpine 3 weeks ago
Define a measurement of a Gigawat. In each universe. See, this is the problem. How do you know if they are using the same scale for defining a gigawat? Just like when you mentioned Warp 13 from "All Good Things..." This is a redrawing of the warp scale. Warp 10 is basically equal to the speed of infinity, which no ship can go (except for one episode of Voyager where Tom Paris actually achieved the infinity speed.) Unless BOTH manuals say they are using the same SCALE to define a GW, NO.
GalacticNonsense 3 weeks ago
I must start by saying i am a fan of both series, but i am just a little curious as to what drugs are being smoked here when these ULTRA BIASED so called technical remarks are being made.A Galaxy class starship is 4,500,000 tonnes,640 feet from top to bottom,1540 feet across and almost a half mile long.Phased energy weapons,antimatter torpedoes,hull armour and mega shielding!AND WHAT.....one little fighter will blow it to bits in one shot....with what.... lasers???......NOT LIKELY!!!!!!!!!!!
87camaro100 3 weeks ago
@87camaro100 I know, right? To the average Star Wars fan, a loose collection of jet engine parts piloted by one guy can kill a precisely manufactured battleship from the future, as long as the battleship is from Star Trek.
Idazmi7 2 weeks ago
@Idazmi7 Yah, no kidding,the average Star Wars fan is interested in a good story,and it is a good story,i like it alot.But on the tech side of things it's a little far fetched. Star Wars tech is R2D2 and C3P0.Star Trek is Commander Data.Comparing the ships of both sides would be the same exact story.A Dominion Wars Galaxy Class battleship would yawn if it seen any amount of Tie Fighters coming it's way.
87camaro100 2 weeks ago
@87camaro100 A Constitution class would laugh outright. My second favourite sci-fi film is Star Wars: the Empire strikes Back. But I recognise the immense utility of the Star Trek space vessel:
Star Trek's phaser is a city vapourising weapon, and a PRECISE CUTTING TOOL in one package, not to mention rapid fire, and it's the least impressive gun in Star Trek.
Star Wars' Turbolaser is an exploding tracer bullet.
No comparison.
Idazmi7 2 weeks ago
@klamki1 well we will never no who's better until the the people responsible for the shows tell us who's better p.s federation time ships can go all over the damn universe and go back in time and obliterate the star wars planets and people before they went to space.
bluebrick0701 3 weeks ago
Thanks for the chuckle:
"even the slightest electrical-magnetic interference such as a POWERFUL STORM can stop transporters from functioning"
Metagg 3 weeks ago
@Metagg Since when was it a REGULAR storm, I wonder.
They seemed fine when they did that in "Silicon Avatar".
Idazmi7 3 weeks ago
That's completely impossible the federation starships have so much more firepower how can a x-wing destroy the enterprise-d the enterprise-d is a galaxy class the most powerful of its time an x-wing is the size of a shuttle craft star wars tech is primitive compared to star trek tech lasers or blasters can't go though federation shields and phasers can burn through the most solid metal the federation can clearly take over the empire if they wanted to
bluebrick0701 1 month ago
@bluebrick0701 i wouldnt place any bets on startrek just because the Federation's ships look so god damn stupid
CommonSenceMafia 3 weeks ago
@bluebrick0701 All I hear is crap coming from your mouth, no evidence to support your claim. The Enterprise-D would get destroyed if it battled Slave-1! Its main turrets can fire 64000 GW and Enterprise main phasers can fire 3.6GW. HyperSpace can take you to a different galaxy and Warp takes 75 years to get to a different quadrant! And actually Turbos would rip through the hull of Feds. If they went against a Destroyer they would last 5secs. There only chance would be speed and team up with Rebs
KLamki1 3 weeks ago
@KLamki1 all of the star wars weapon stats are wrong. Example Slave 1 can break apart asteroids with it's blasters. The same blasters barely damage obi wans ship. Obi wans ship is made of Durasteel. At-St is also made of the same durasteel.
The At-St is crushed by 2 logs the logs suffer no damage.
Therefore the asteroids that Slave 1 was shooting where weak and not strong at all so the numbers for the star wars weapons are wrong
slicktyler 3 weeks ago
@KLamki1 Also. R2D2 is shot with a direct hit by a Tiefighters blasters. R2D2 is also hit with a blaster rifle in RotJ and suffers similar damage.
Therefore a Tiefighters weapons are about the same strenght as a blaster rifle.
We have also seen a tiefighters weapons are a threat to capital ships so therefore a tiefigthers weapons and a capital ships armor are not as strong as people think.
slicktyler 3 weeks ago
@slicktyler LOL agreed.
Idazmi7 3 weeks ago
@bluebrick0701 I don't agree with the X-wing though. I'm sure they would be assed kicked, but this guy has researched so I can't argue. At least the Tie fighters would get destroyed though, they have no shields!
KLamki1 3 weeks ago
@KLamki1 lol Star Wars fires hundreds of shots and most of them miss against targets slow enough that they can keep up with. What are they supposed to do against ships that can elude them indefinitely? Star Wars ships have no way of chasing Star Trek ships so whether their weapons can do damage means very little. In a real strategic conflict, it comes down to whether Star Destroyers would sit there while Trek ships find a weakness to exploit, and then its all over.
DigitalAlpine 3 weeks ago
@DigitalAlpine They have some ships in their fleet to slow down ships, can't remember what they call them. They would use tractor beams like the Borg and I'm pretty sure not every ship in their fleet is slow ass capital ships. The rebels would team up with the Feds so its fine. You don't really think the rebels/republic would team with the Empire, do you? And i'm pretty sure theres a site explaining star wars ships are about the same speed as Feds, I think the bigger ones are slower though.
KLamki1 3 weeks ago
@KLamki1 They're called Acclamators. They have to generate a gravity well that would perhaps cause problems with Warp Drive like it does Hyperdrive but Trek can evade SW ships at Impulse. The enterprise has been shown capable of going from like all stop, do a 180 and jump to warp in like 3 seconds. That's reasonably comparable maneuverability to any ship, large or small, only I never see Star Destroyers show maneuvers like that, ever. They're like Aircraft Carriers until they jump to hyperspace
DigitalAlpine 3 weeks ago
@DigitalAlpine Anyway I don't care about too much tech crap, as long as its cool and things blowup its all the same to me. Can't wait to play STO, bought the golden edition on Amazon, I'm going to use the disk to install it on my mac with that new program called wine wrap (Star Trek Online on Mac).
KLamki1 3 weeks ago
@KLamki1 This guy predictably fails to mention the source of his "research".
Idazmi7 3 weeks ago
@Idazmi7 This guy so called "research" is videos. Research: Its on the internet, if you you weren't so goddam biased you could try looking it up. Ever heard of looking things up for yourself? Or do you want me to do your homework for you and then call me a moron again? Learn to wipe your own ass jerk and stop spamming my inbox, I repeat I don't want to read your bullshit that you make up, at least I gave facts you just say "OH Look At Vid!" When was that comparable proof on both ships?
KLamki1 3 weeks ago
@KLamki1 Your entire resource is a biased website. BTW, this is just a hobby.
LOL
Idazmi7 3 weeks ago
@Idazmi7 Now I have work to do, unlike some people that just sit their ass glued to a chair all day typing crap and trolling every Star Wars vs Star Trek vid, loser. Seriously go and do some work or just take a walk outside and have a conversation with people, if you can walk that is.... Might help your small mind be more open to others opinions for once, cough never going to happen...
KLamki1 3 weeks ago
3:15 an xwing could never catch up to the enterprise so it would be in theory a draw
thepounderful 1 month ago
Comment removed
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@thepounderful That's what I would consider most likely - Enterprise can always stand off until they find a weakness, and in theory, never be caught. Impulse drives are fast enough to 'speed off in an instant' the moment they get the slightest hint of danger, IF it was even caught standing still when an Imperial fleet comes out of hyperspace.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
star trek wins.. hands down.. IE the NCC-1701D travels 10 times the speed of an X-wing fighter at max speed,.. so fighters have no effect and capital ships are super slow and could probably not hit the enterprise while the enterprise sets up an attack run,
thepounderful 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath
Dont even attempt to insult someone's intelligence with your bullshit. You can read all about the downside of hyperspace travel, and when you're done losing your hardon, maybe u can debate some actual facts.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
What would happen if the Death Star took on a Bor Cube? Which would win? Would the Death Star be assimilated?
lightfoot007 1 month ago
Here's an ending argument, Wave-Motion Gun will beat both sides. End of argument!!!!
Sabrewolf23 1 month ago
@Sabrewolf23 Starfleet has a Wave Motion Gun.
/watch?v=wEcO4-bJM58
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath the bioship would be able to outmanuver the star destroyer, also where does it even show its 3000G star destroyers are slow lumbering unmanuverable ships that are sitting ducks for bioships to come and destroy.
xXDARKNESS9Xx 1 month ago
@xXDARKNESS9Xx The Millennium Falcon had to stuggle to outmaneuver a Star Destroyer. A bioship would be the perferct target. And the +3000 G's comes from the battle of Endor. The Imperial fleet moves around Endor in roughly one minute to block the Rebel fleet from escaping. Depending on the distance the fleet was from Endor, and when it actuallly started to move (it could have been less than a minute), it would have needed an acceleration between 2200 G's to something as high as +5000 G's.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath So? Warp speed combat beats ANYTHING below 500,000 G manuvers.
Star Trek ships fight at 1-24 times lightspeed regularly. Admit it: you have nothing but your own words to save you.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"Warp speed combat beats ANYTHING below 500,000 G manuvers."
There IS no +5000 G maneuvers. Because the clearest logic you will ever need is: IF THE SHIPS ARE BADASS AND CAPABLE OF DOING IT, THEY'D HAVE SHOWED IT IN THE MOVIES. SW has ALWAYS shown off the capabilities of a ship in space battles - its absolutely frickin RETARDED to think he'd just not include their best normal space capabilities and leave you to figure shit out with speculative math.
PLEASE, peaceindeath, save us your BULLCRAP
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Since their weapons will be useless such an advantage is not going to save them anyway. Besides, the Empire have tricks that could probably remove much of that advantage anyway.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath I suggest you educate yourself. Star Wars is the one with disadvantages in FTL, because they're in hyperspace.
Star Trek abides by 'nothing travels faster than light' and cheats it by warping space, using subspace corridors, underspace, transwarp conduits, Slipstream, etc. Um.. they use their weapons in these places, and in normal space at warp speed.
Note: The warped space that effects ship speed, will also effect weapons speed.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@DigitalAlpine Since Hyperspace is normally faster, how is that a disadvantage? Tactically maybe, but its not like Star Destroyers will spend their entire time trying to play cat and mouse games. If they can't catch a ship they will head for another target, such as planets or refuel stations etc. Warp is also affected by gravity if I remember correctly. Technologies such as tractor beams, distortion field generators and interdiction fields will play an important roll for SW then.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath "If they can't catch a ship they will head for another target, such as planets or refuel stations"
Of course they will, having magically acquired more star charts than even the Borg have so they can plot safe routes through hyperspace, and they suddenly have knowledge of all the strategic targets? All this speculative 'what if' crap is the arguments of a desperate fan. You can ALWAYS say 'if, then' but both sides have that option. We can always deploy ships to those areas.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@DigitalAlpine I assume the Empire wouldn't start a war without the proper scouting first. All they need to do is to scout out some larger routs for the main invasion and then simply spread from there using long-range sensors and such to safely navigate when they are travelling "off-road".
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath starting a scouting war? Dude u are way into the 'what if' now. Before you start worrying about 'what if', just try to stay focused on the matter at hand.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
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@onlypeaceindeath " All they need to do is to scout out some larger routs"
what if, what if. So the Empire goes searching for stuff to blow up, find out Borg and 8472 is waiting for them when they get there. So its back to ship vs ship. (about 2000 years later since the Empire has no knowledge and would take decades to try mapping hyperspace routes.)
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath "how is that a disadvantage?"
Because we're talking about engaging ships, and Hyperspace is not good for that, only fleeing the scene as shown in so many SW movies. You can't chase someone who jumps to hyperspace, but SW cant chase someone who goes to warp. Disadvantages: You have to wait for Nav comp to plot courses, you are flying blind, you can't track ships, can't make course adjustments, can't communicate, can't use weapons, etc etc.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@DigitalAlpine The nav computer only takes a few seconds as I recall, at least for military ships. And you can track ships, make slight course adjustments and communicate. The Star Destroyers chasing the Falcon in ANH appeared to have tracked it, based on Solo's statement that he had finally lost them. As for communication, i'm pretty sure the Clone Wars has shown it. And for maneuvering, i have to look that up, but i'm pretty sure i've heard that its possible, which would be necessary anyway.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath "The nav computer only takes a few seconds"
I suggest you google something about hyperspace and read about the hazards. Traveling at hyperspace speeds, your sensors and comm will not work because no signals you would use for them would travel to and from your target at the same speeds. Falcon came out of hyperspace near their intended destination to find it was blown up... remember that? Why didnt they know? Cuzz they cant detect real space stuff while in hyperspace.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@DigitalAlpine Or he didn't use the sensors at all. Boba Fett could track the Falcon in hyperspace, the Star Destroyers could track the Falcon in hyperspace, the Empire could track the Rebel fleet in hyperspace as I recall it. The idea that one is loses both communication and sensors in hyperspace makes no sense.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath h t t p : / / st a r w a r s . w i k i a . c o m / w i k i / H y p e r s p a c e read something once and stop trying to bullshit your way thru debates.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath "In addition to navigational hazards, there was also the difficulty inherent in communicating with a starship while traveling at hyperspeed. Since ships in hyperspace did not exist, in a conventional sense, they were largely cut off from conventional radio or subspace communication...wavelengths of any signal would be massively distorted..The same difficulties presented to communication also applied to sensors"
I dont make it up... you should read it for yourself.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@DigitalAlpine Funny how the Essential Atlas says that sensor data is gathered from starships which has travelled in hyperspace to be analyzed by the Space Ministry. "As a part of the same process, route and sensor data from starships' navicomputers is routinely uploaded and collected for analysis by the ministry's astrogation bureau, after which it becomes part of new updates". Page 14.
So who's bullshitting here?
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath First of all, I didnt write the information available at Wookipedia. Surely there must be problems or why mention it? I also don't claim there is no work-around for making successful transmissions. However, since Han came out of hyperspace only to find there was a whole fricking PLANET missing, it stands to reason, they have trouble with sensors detecting such things. HOWEVER... Here's some stuff that should be noted... [cont...]
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
The sensor trouble I was talking about was not astrogation data; I was talking about trying to track a ship in normal space while in hyperspace.
So why dont you go to wookipedia and read up on all the hyperspace stuff there, and maybe come back then and try to argue your statement of sensors for astrogation data has anything to do with the discussion. LOL
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@DigitalAlpine Why are you guys making a argument about hyperspace? Everybody knows that hyperspace can take you to a different galaxy in days and if you went on warp it would take decades to get to a galaxy. Theres a website on all this shit, waiting to be read, but all you guys just want to debate further until your agrument is trolling the comment page.
KLamki1 3 weeks ago
@KLamki1 Um.. nobody is debating whether hyperspace is faster for traveling.
DigitalAlpine 3 weeks ago
@DigitalAlpine Opps my mistake... Sorry
KLamki1 3 weeks ago
@onlypeaceindeath "Warp is also affected by gravity"
Need I remind you they show the Enterprise go from practically standing still to a 180 U-turn and jump to warp? Soon as you come up with these Interdictors and begin creating a gravity field which takes some time, Enterprise can easily get away on Impulse. You must remember that Trek battles are shown slow enough on screen, but so long as the scenes of Enterprise maneuverability exists, we must accept these ARE NOT SLOW TARGETS.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@DigitalAlpine Which means that they have pretty much left the battlefield. If they won't engage the imperial ships in combat, the Federation ships might loose the Imperials when they enter hyperspace for a more important target, depending how much information they have on the Federation.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Oh, and BTW, I find it quite lame to use this 'anything in ST that can go wrong WILL go wrong'. I can accept they cant use 100% of their technology 100% of the time but SW fans try to say 'if at some point it didn't work, it will never work' and that's BS. If you have ANY integrity, you'll at least keep things realistic.
Also, the unexplained being used as canon is BS too. The calculation of 3000G is over-wank based on poor writing. Everything about it smells of discrepancy.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@DigitalAlpine I can agree on the first point. But that the acceleration calculations are over-wank and poor writing doesn't change the fact that it appears that the Imperial navy, and also Rebel navy covered many tens of thousands of kilometers in the minute (or something like 72 seconds if I remember correctly). When the Rebels exits hyperspace they are closing in on the Death Star pretty fast as it is visibly growing on screen. And Endor is not the only sceen with >1000 G's in Star wars.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath The wank about covering so much distance "offscreen" is about moving the action forward in the movie. Nothing more. I refuse to accept it because if it was a vital point of how fast the ships are, they would have shown that in the movie. The only reasoon they got those ships from point A to point B so fast was to keep the action of the movie going.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@DigitalAlpine Then don't accept it. But it's still there to base acceleration on.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
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@onlypeaceindeath "it's still there to base acceleration on."
No, its part of a movie that doesnt even exist and you're wanking off to it. just like someone who said if Han Solo wasnt in the scene just after a jump to hyperspace, he must have been making course adjustments the whole time. Dude, seriously?? I do NOT believe in 'part of a movie missing equals time that can be used to explain ship acceleration' so u can pretty much just fuck off with that whole BS concept.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath
@DigitalAlpine Said it for me.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath "The Millennium Falcon had to stuggle to outmaneuver a Star Destroyer."
DUMBEST STATEMENT EVER!! The falcon was able to pull a 180 and go right back towards the ship, so it did NOT struggle to outmaneuver, it was just HELLA SLOW.
You have truly shown just how GD ignorant you are. And your wank-off 'math based on time' logic fails cuz if they HAD that kind of speed, Lucas would have shown it all thru the frickin movie! They CHUCK the time to keep the movie action going! DUH
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
I'm not about to look through nearly 600 comments, but has anybody pointed out that Incredible Cross Sections didn't give firepower numbers for the X-Wing?
Jesse1066 1 month ago
@Jesse1066 No, but Slave 1 could be used as a benchmark for heavy fighters. Two kiloton laser cannons, multi-megaton missils, multi-gigaton bombs. Or maybe he used another source?
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath If X-Wings had four laser cannons, each twice as powerful as a W79 tactical nuke, the Empire must have been huuuge idiots to use unshielded TIE Fighters.
Jesse1066 1 month ago
@Jesse1066 It doesn't really matter if they have shields or not. Fighter shields don't last long anyway.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@Jesse1066 Yes, I did. My brother owns one.
/watch?v=lcMgcJuQqvg - The reason for the argument.
Idazmi7 3 weeks ago
@Starkiller22475 a superweapon that only takes a couple of shots to destroy it you call that better
xXDARKNESS9Xx 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Star destroyers are very slow and not very manuverable also it would take borg nanoprobs to destroy species 8472 which the empire does not have.
xXDARKNESS9Xx 1 month ago
@xXDARKNESS9Xx They're not slow. +3000 G acceleration is pretty damn good, and they might have even more. And bioships can obviously be destroyed by other stuff since a slow impact was enough to cause it do explode.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath "a slow impact was enough to cause it do explode." That's drawing conclusions, and not even a good one since the Borg Cube also exploded, which as I said, running a ship over as the cube did would likely trigger the explosive potential of the vessel. It's like saying, you can blow up a truck by shooting it with tracer rounds from a rifle, just because you hit a cargo container full of TNT. If the truck HAD no TNT you wouldnt get the same results.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Here's an example of slow: When they got to the 2nd Death Star and realized it's a trap, they took evasive action... like earths big battle ships, they take a long slow sweeping turn, and then they're just sitting there getting wasted on. Maybe u have some clip u can show me where they maneuver faster than the rebels did when they noticed the 'trap' ? And I'd like to see that +3000 G accel in action...
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
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@onlypeaceindeath "The movies supports such levels of destruction by the very fact that the reactor can supply the engines with enough power to accelerate a Star Destroyer to 3000G (which is observed in RotJ).
This comment turned up in my search. Falcon is rated at 3000g also right? When chased by an SD, why not turn left and pull 3000G? Simple escape unless those numbers are BS. An SD would literally NEVER be able to chase a small ship with the Falcon's maneuverability. Period. No Fing way.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
Here is a ROTJ Documentary. Maybe u can find the time index where this 3000 takes place? watch?v=yWHWm7ZPnK0
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
You guys are idiots star wars has more ships beter superweapon and honestly the tech manuals are produced by Lucas so sorry if the numbers hurt Trekies. Wait im not sorry I am laughing at the fact that if it comes down to numbers SW wins. Besides ST was afraid of a gigawatts star wars use gigawats weapons as normal fire power
Starkiller22475 1 month ago
Well, I seem to have disproven this whole video as mindless fanwank. Star Trek has: Better guns, Better accuracy, Better range, Better shields, And better anti-starfigher defense. My reasons why are below this post, and can be referenced: Star Trek TNG/DS9battles:
/watch?v=d734afLFPds
/watch?v=QN2ZrTpvIss
Star Wars ep3/ep6 battles:
/watch?v=BIAHHGnpQ3c
/watch?v=weDrSphcVEg
Star Trek wins, easily. As I've said before: watch Star Trek and Star Wars before arguing, it saves time
Idazmi7 1 month ago
Idazmi7 1 month ago
my i point out that that the wepoans on star strek ships our oint defsnes system
FlyingDiabloGuy 1 month ago
@FlyingDiabloGuy Photon Torpedoes are tactical assault weapons.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath dont forget that a borg cube is huge so of course it destroyed the bioship but fighters are smaller than the bioship so if they did collide than the fighter would be destroyed while the other ship maybe a little damaged but not destroyed. Also it would take a star destroyer ramming into one of their bioships to destroy it, and since star destroyers are slower i doubt they will be able to ram even one.
xXDARKNESS9Xx 1 month ago
@xXDARKNESS9Xx It doesn't matter if the Borg Cube was huge. It's the impact that counts. The bioship rammed the borg cube at a speed of a few hundred meters at most, which destroyed both. That says much about both vessels fragility. Starfighters armed with shaped-charged nuclear warheads with a 100+ megaton yield would be devastating against both. And how fast can a bioship accelerate? Star Destroyers can accelerate something like 3000> G's as was seen in battle of Endor.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath How do you suggest Star Wars would ever hit something they can't even keep up with? The turrets for the turbo cannons can't even rotate fast enough to track a ship at ST impulse speeds, nor can the fighters keep pace with that in normal space. SW is ALL SLOW in normal space. The maneuverability of the Star Destroyers is practically non-existent.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
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DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
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Borg and Voyager were trying to outrun 8472 and the Cube literally ran the bioship over. Regardless of whether they can withstand energy weapons or not, running something over will likely trigger an explosion of their own weapons, power reactors, warp core, antimatter containment, whatever is on the ship that has explosive potential.
Firepower doesn't have to be great enough to destroy, just enough to trigger the explosive potential of their target.
DigitalAlpine 1 month ago
ohh burn star trek
cheethahunt1 1 month ago
Hmm, then why couldn't an X-Wing shoot through the command deck of a Star Destroyer?
mdurwin 1 month ago
@mdurwin Because the command tower on a Star Destroyer can survive such firepower.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
and all this in the assumption that the figures are the same in both universes...witch they are likely not.
in Star wars one can WALK through shields, Star trek wins :P
henkman00 1 month ago
Keith Jenkins is a British Historiographer. I found no NASA affiliates or ex-employees with that name.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
The "Galaxy far, far away" is much smaller.
It is, also, too far to allow any encounter.
Finally, I didn't get any reference in your speech explaining wave frequencies and their interactions in shieldings and weaponry. Plazma was proven to choke warp engines in early days and I don't know any info about later designs. Plazma blast is particle stream and star fleet shielding was successfully blocking it within plazma clouds (at high speeds), much more dense than single or multiple weapon blasts.
bradivoy 1 month ago
star wars is bad shit and star trek is the one and only
that is the fact
every person who say the opposite is wrong becaus I always to be right
unendlicheWeisheit 1 month ago
@unendlicheWeisheit LOL nice!
Idazmi7 1 month ago
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@unendlicheWeisheit Star Wars is not "bad shit". It is just different (sub)genre, more dynamic and easier to understand if you are impatient or too lazy to think.
I used to like SW more when I was a kid. When I grew up I understood ST better.
bradivoy 1 month ago
so the star wars ships are rediculously powerful and fast...what does this mean? GL has no scientific background.
dizzleblackizzle 2 months ago
i believe you but you didn't talk about the tractor beam in star trek
ncc1701dfreddyvulcan 2 months ago
@ncc1701dfreddyvulcan He didn't prove any of his statements, either.
Idazmi7 2 months ago
im sorry this is really sad...im a fan of star trek, star wars and sci fi generally but this is sad in the extreme. its not real for god sake
wakeylad81 2 months ago
kater video je to
rocekful 2 months ago
There is no way any ship or station that starwars has can beat species 8472 the only way to kill them is with borg nanoprobes which the empire doesnt have. plus they can also destroy planets like the deathstar can. Their weapons while annihilate the stardestroyers and rip through the deathstar there is no way the empire can stop that.
xXDARKNESS9Xx 2 months ago
@xXDARKNESS9Xx Actually, the Empire only needs to deploy fighters. Species 8472 ships are so soft that a slow impact with a Borg Cube casuses them to explode.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Fighters mean nothing in Star Trek. OR in Star Wars.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 They were quite effective in Deep Space 9. They managed to knock out several Cardassian warships if I remember correctly.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Cardassians don't understand point-defense weapon arrangement. (kind of like the Imperial Empire) Find one-man fighters attacking and destroying a Starfleet ship.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Cardassian ships have pretty much the same weapons as the Federation. There is no reason fighters shouldn't work on Federation warships. And Imperial starships do have pretty good point-defences (specially against civilian targets or targets with limited ECM). They managed to clear out huge voids in the Hoth asteroid belt with little trouble. Turbolasers have also pretty good accuracy against civilian targets, such as the astro-mechs trying to repair Amidala's Yacht in Episode 1.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Cardassians have a single, front-mounted phaser.
Ergo, no point defense.
"And Imperial starships do have pretty good point-defences "
Except in film.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 They have two on the dorsal side too, and might have some on the ventral side.
And one question? What is considered a good point-defence? The Executor had roughly a 50% hit ratio against tiny fighters, in a fleet battle, and they where hit from the side when they made a close strafing maneuver in the Executor's cityscape. That's pretty good, considering the situation.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 They have at least two phasers on the dorsal side, one at the top of the bridge and one in the middle. And they might have some on the ventral side too.
And what is considered a good point-defence? The Executor had roughly a 50% hit ratio against fighters who where flying in the cityscape, and it hit them from the side too, during a fleet battle. That's not that bad considering the circumstances. The Star Destroyers in the Hoth asteroid field blasted everything in their vicinity.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath The Enterprise-D destroyed 20 starfighters in 2 seconds onscreen in "Conundrum" with one phaser array.
The Voyager does similarly.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Yet they can't repeat such accuracy in a fleet battle. It's quite obviously that jamming plays part in this. I don't question that Star Trek ships can hit stuff with great accuracy, but their sensors are notorious for being easily disrupted by stuff ranging from simple EM radiation to heavy metals and even something as simple as Magnesite (magnesium carbonate). A few dozen fighters which are emitting large amounts of jamming signals should last some time.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Yes they can, and do replicate that accuracy in heavy combat, and no, they are not "notorious for being easily jammed"
Find a starfleet ship actually *missing* a target! Klingons miss all the time. Dominion miss. But Starfleet? I can't recall even one miss. There is a scene where two Galaxy Class ships precision-strike a Cardassian warship, in heavy combat. It's all over Youtube.
Don't even mention torpedoes: 10 shots at ten targets in simultaneum, over and over...
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 They manage to score hits on warships a few hundred meters away from them, in Deep Space 9 battles. That's hardly impressive. And yes, they are notorious for being jammed or blocked by all kinds of stuff. A wing of fighters screaming out their ECM would be a though target.
Besides, if Romulans, Cardassians and Klingon misses such small targets in larger fleet battles, there is no reason to believe that Federation starships should perform any better.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath They also consistently hit cardassian ships at 300.000 kilometers with torpedoes.
Your just being a pussy now.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Yet they choose to fight at such short ranges in Deep Space 9, and also in Voyager from time to time. Sure, they can hit stuff at great ranges, and so can Star Destroyers, but in larger fleet battles, or where some form of interference is present, Starfleet and the other navies appears to always have to fight at close range.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath They can fight at both short and long range.
Star Wars cannot claim anything now. Not power, range, accuracy, capability, armor, shields, firing rates, speed, or anything else.
So you instead poke fun at audience-pleasing visual effects. And no, never did a Starfleet ship miss- ever. Interference or not, long range or not. You have nothing, so you try to hypothesize hidden weaknesses. Those weaknesses do not exist. To destroy a Star Trek ship, you must be powerful.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Star Wars has claimed pretty much all of those points. You don't just want to admit it.
And Starfleet have missed. Remember a Borg battle in, was it Q Who? They had to fire four shots from a few hundred meters to hit the tractor beam. And they missed big time too. The ECM produced from SW vessels would most likely produce similar results, considering how useless Federation sensors are.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Star Wars claimed none of it: you did. Like most fanboys
"a few hundred meters to hit the tractor beam" That was way longer than that: borg cubes are city-sized!
And find a few more starfleet misses to really make a point. Every battle in Star Wars features hundereds of misses: episodes 1,2,3,4,5 and 6, without ECM mentioned anywhere.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Enterprise was right on top of it and had the accuracy of a blind, drunk redneck.
And episode 4 and 6 do mention jamming. During battle of Yavin the Rebel pilots complained about that they couldn't detect the Imperial fighters, and one pilot even said "There's to much interference". During battle of Endor the Imperials had even a dedicated ship to produce some form of undetectable jamming which prohibited the rebels from detecting the imperial fleet and even...continue>
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Find more phasers missing. Blasters miss WITHOUT jamming, and only the Death Star has jamming. And what dedicated jamming ship? Which of the 40 dead Star Destroyers?
In Star Trek there was only one scene with any missed shots.Involving higher tech species. In Star Wars, EVERY EFFING SCENE features "soldiers" acting like rednecks with machine guns.
You lost a LONG time ago.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Deep Space 9 only grazed a Cardassian ship which was about to ram it, also from a few hundred meters away. It travelled very slowly and in a straight line too.
The ship I refered to was the Imperial Main Communications ship, which was mentioned in the novelization of Return of the Jedi. Curtis Saxton also believed he spotted it in a screenshot which had a view of the battle from the Emperors throne room. Wookiepedia has an article about it, if you're interested.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Deep Space 9 is cardassian. And no "Main Communications ship" ever appeared, only Star Destroyers.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Wrong. It was mentioned in the novelization, so it was there.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath The Holocron mentiones "lesser canon". In simple talk: Contradiction = non canon.
There was no comms ship in the Imperial fleet.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 The Holocron mentions all canon, from G to S canon. And as stated by Chee, the stats in the Cross Sections are still canon. Trivia seems to matter very little.
And as I said, the Comm-ship was mentioned in the novelization, and it even took out a Mon Calamari cruiser by itself. Don't ignore canon.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath It didn't happen. There is nothing to ignore. George Lucas said the EU (all but G-canon) is an alternate universe.
Plus, if everything is canon, where is the Wookie Christmas Special on that list?
/watch?v=Mz550T3QeAo
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 It would be G-canon.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 And yet Lucas creates a branch of Lucasfilm that specifically works to keep the continuity. Face it, Chee knows more what Lucas wants than you do. If he says that something's canon then it is canon.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago