1a: Technology, Evolution, and God (Kevin Kelly and Ken Wilber - Exploring the Technium)

[CoachAlvar]

Wow, just found this. Ken Wilber (big fan!) and Kevin Kelly (Awesome!) talking a few hours with each other!? That's like the Wilber/Robbins interview. Thanks for sharing.

[nemirn]

Does Ken Wilber ever talk about his ideas in a way that doesn't just sound like "woo"?

[nemirn]

Watch the series "God Quality Control" by GreatBigBore for excellent use of images with a voiceover track.

[alliant]

science is a naturalphilosophy. philosophizing is analyzing this world and life critically, using this strange reason nature has provided us with, to make sense of things. you make a distinction as if science was some kind of new activity. it's just a particular method of philosophy - which is an ongoing activity.

[gui2004evil]

does anyone have the transcription? I would like to translate to portuguese!

[LooksAeterna]

11:00 - 11:15 - 11:35 Did I hear Kelly mentioning ET and Wilber agreeing there (twice each) ?

It's dangerous to claim with Kelly "the more the better" even if one grants the inherent goodness of technology. Because like "natural" powers, it is going to cause harm if rapid advances in power exceeds the moral, cognitive and affective development to control destructive effects of such advance.

[gasmbay]

Nothing is "not God" .. everything we do IS god, so technology is not "evil".. it CAN be used for evil but it is up to us to decide what to use it for. I, however, believe that humanity has great potential to strive forward together collectively , I don't think we will use technology for much evil in the future.

[AnonymousQuarks]

Kevin is another rented possesed body of a being of light, a deceitful lier who wants to condemned people just like he already is, he is a tool of the ascended masters or negative beings in a disguise of pure light beings, its your decition to fall or not fall on his trap.

[rook1123]

foolishness and presumptuousness in its' highest form

[bangNL94]

Let me put it this way:

Both Religion and science were started by men. Religions were there to explain the unexplainable, but sciences were there to try to understand the unexplainable.

Get it? We don't need religion! Pretty much everything can be learned through science!

[adsensus]

The god of the gaps.

[AlvaroAndfriends]

@ bangNL94:

Awesome choice of words i like your way of thinking.

[bangNL94]

Thank you :) It's hard to say things the right way in English when you're from Holland.

[Democracyplz]

@bangNL94

thats what a person who is 100% sure of life will say... but you are not 100% sure..

NO SCIENTIST IS SURE.. every top scientist points out the one and last fact.. and that is.. these are all theories..

to say that GOD DONT EXCIST.. is something NO SCIENTIST will claim 100%...

a good scientist.. will never decline 100%..because in science theres things thats not explained just accepted..dont forget this..

AN example: the universe theorie..its all bullshit.. now its multiverses..

[bangNL94]

Yes I get your point too.

We cannot know things outside of the physical and observable world. So yes, you're right, we can't know if any supernatural being exists, but why would you accept the concept, if it is not supported by any evidence or observation? Like you said, we cannot know if God or whatever exists.

[Democracyplz]

@bangNL94

why accept the concept of evolution ? there is no evidence of it either.. missing link was never found you know...

WE cannot know anything about this life either.. maybe its all an illusion since me and you are both same participants of the same energi field..

its all the way you wanna see it.. some people find peace in god.. some people dont.

And both are equally correct.

[bangNL94]

you've GOT to be kidding me, there is tons of evidence for evolution! and thousands of transitional fossils, too.

BTW there are some things in your (and my) body that would not be there if there wasnt evolution. for example your tailbone!

So whatever you may think, evolution is supported by tons of evidence. CDK007 has some nice videos for people like you.

You should check him out.

[nemirn]

@Democracyplz

Is this satire?

You demonstrate a very typical (willful?) ignorance of evolution.

I recommend you check out talkorigins dot  o r g

[Democracyplz]

@bangNL94 My point is.. no one knows.. so completely putting out the idea.. is stupidity.. like all top scientists say..

NO ONE KNOWS for sure.. only theories that are accepted.. not even proven..

[mcSnoski]

@bangNL94

You know, it often turns out the other way around as well: Scientists merely want to explain the unexplainable in order to legitimize oppression of the Other, while spirituality, theosophy and philosophy might give one a sense of understanding of the cosmos, nature of being, logic etc.

Your rhetoric works the both ways.

[bangNL94]

@mcSnoski Scientists want to oppress?

And you are wrong anyway, because spirituality, theosophy and philosophy can only explain the understanding of the universe in a subjective way. Science tries to explain everything as objective as possible, but philosophers don't use the scientific method, you know, they only philosophize.

That's why I would not even remotely compare science with philosophy, because science is way more objective and accurate and true, in every possible way.

[alliant]

@bangNL94

err sorry, you chose an immature and unintelligent definition of philosophy

[bangNL94]

@alliant What do you mean, exactly? Can't philosophers only explain the universe in a subjective way?

[jondulars]

Read "Science Speaks" by Peter Stoner. It is a free on-line book. If you are looking for the truth and not stupid you will find it! Most will go into their black hole. A very few will really try to understand and look with an open type of thinking. Like the three blind men each feeling a different part of the elephant. Do we not need to hear the whole story to enjoy the meaning? This book was created in a classroom of study and should be approached with respect. Fools walk by knowledge for......

[nickoleum]

I would find that distracting from the actual dialogue taking place in this interview. Maybe you should check your ego, deflate your head a bit, and actually just listen to the content that is being produced by these people.Youtube is a platform for not just video only, it is a great tool to bring amazing, interesting, thought provoking, comedic, etc. to many more people than if it were left in the constrained delivery modes of audio only platforms. There r countless examples of such audio vids!

[nickoleum]

mennedy1- you apparently dont understand the point of this "video", its not about watching two fat old guys sitting in easychairs talking to eachother on the phone, is it?

[Glass2007]

Two fat old guys? Have you ever seen a picture of Ken Wilber? Hes like a body builder.

[dylanmiles1]

Ken is BUILT!!!!!

[ricksays]

It's funny people complain about content and sit idly by consuming it. Be thankful for what you have or do it yourself! Peace!

[spiveyhowitzer]

extropy is novelty. Terrence Mckenna developed this idea a long time ago.

[Mennedy1]

Ha Ha on us!

A video from Kevin Kelly and Ken Wilbur on,

TA DA: TECHNOLOGY

with a STILL PICTURE for the entire posting?

Come on guys.

[IntegralNaked]

Well, it was a telephone interview, so i am not sure how else i could translated it for YouTube. Unfortunately we couldn't quite afford CGI approximations of Ken and Kevin, so we just went with the still images.

[Mennedy1]

As Kelly said in his TED talk, there is a drift towards complexity in technology. You can now record video via a Skype call.

[IntegralNaked]

Understood, and good suggestion. Unfortunately, it's not what we did for this interviews--or any of our audio interviews, for that matter. I think there is still an advantage to producing audio-only interviews (as we do every week), especially since its a medium that does not require that you sit in front of your computer the entire time--you can put them on your ipod, burn to CD, etc. These were put on YouTube just to try to get them out to audiences that might not discover them otherwise.

[Mennedy1]

Some of us are already putting You Tube videos on our iPods. There's no need to sit in front of the computer.

It's just really ironic that a talk about the frontiers of communication techology is not using the medium to its fullest. According to Kelly' in one of his earlier talks, "attention is the currency".

Seems like iTunes might be a better venue for an audio only podcast. Good Luck.

[bspill1]

Thanks for the new vids! always appreciated