no offense to you, but government spending is one of their great evils that they need to correct, all that money goes to the corrupt politicians, so tax breaks are good, more spending is BAD, the idea for circulation is the right one, but it doesn't work what with all the people ready to drain all that money out before it serves its purpose.
You failed to mention how the federal reserve prints the money with nothing backing it causing more debt and a larger interest fee that will never be paid off, all our taxes go to pay off the interest on our gigantious trillions of debt. Nothing we do will work, the central banks cant keep printing money with nothing to back it, we're all screwed.
It is interesting nearly 3 years later i heard an npr story looking back if it worked... and of course being as complex as an economy is... we really don't know... but more than likely things would have been worse... for me, it came to late to save my job in houston, and despite being moved to indiana for work, an unsold house in houston means near financial ruin. Hm. But.. i have a job... and am living... so that works.
and here we are in 2012 and with the euro dieing before our eyes the British government are attempting to improve the economy by cutting spending. Do I listen to John Green or David Cameron, or does what John said no longer aply? I honestly don't know what to think
I sure hope it was an honest attempt. I get nervous when people talk about elected officials trying to--as some people put it--"destroy America". That would be scary.
keynes also said the tax rate should never exceed 10% and that the standard gov't expenditures should not exceed 5% during good times the difference was to be saved by gov't for use when needed. so they are not following his advice they are using his name to lie about what the intention is
The problem is the debt based monetary system. Money is created AS debt and the interest is not created at the same time. What we need to do is get rid of debt on a national level. Governments can simply spend money into existence and as long as mutually agreed to practical limits are in place and the spending is backed by real labor projects. Debt is unnecessary and exists as a means to allow a few to gain advantage over many. The "free market" doesn't exist. Markets are controlled and guarded.
no one knows exactly what's going on in the economy, due to the almost infinite complexity of it's system. i do know that infinite growth is not possible without paradigm shifts happening at smaller and smaller intervals. we can't grow forever. it's like trying to arrange a room where every object is on top; a game that everyone wins. we all know only one person wins monopoly in the end, and that guy is usually a douche-bag.
@Salvysahagun You missed the entire point, you are supposed to keep taxes low and spending high in the time of a reccession. Bush's years were mostly years of growth and somewhat prosperity- yet he spent like crazy (in all of the wrong areas) and cut taxes when they shouldn't have been cut (and for the wrong people).
@Salvysahagun Exactly- spending, as a form of bidding, will create demand in an economy lacking it. Reccessions are caused by slowdowns in demand, not supply. But the spending will also create job, move forward major construction projects, releive local government's of their debt, and ultimatley put more $ into the pockets of Americans.
Hmm, where did "the bubble" come from to begin with? Maybe you should try to use your brain? And by the way, how's stimulus working out. BTW, Bernanke has a Nobel prize while being a retard, so...where does that put you and your medal?
@johammbass Obama has a Nobel prize.... He did nothing Therefore that prize hold no credibility.
Also the bubble is caused when money isn't backed up properly like how a bubble isn't strong on the inside and can collapse in on its self.
Because people were selling crap mortgages saying they were good and so the people who bought them thought they had assets but in reality had crap and when they found out it went to hell.
The problem with the stimulus is that with increased spending comes increased regulation. The government is changing the playing field so much that companies are afraid partake in already risky expansions for fear that the government shall regulate and tax their successes. Thus they are cutting jobs, and shrinking back into a safe mode of operation. We all know that expansion is the way out of a recession, and thus the effects of the stimulus are hurting us by discouraging it.
My Keynes Hayek: The Clash That Defined Modern Economics is published in October by W.W.Norton. Read an extract at: sites.google.com/site/wapshottkeyneshayek/
Lol, didn't the bubble come about explicitly due to Keynesian economics, ie when money is simply printed? Maybe the consumer isn't spending because he is out of money and has a massive debt and not because he is scared? Just a thought.
@alc99 So according to the broken window fallacy, the shopkeeper would have spent his money on some other industry if he hadn't had to fix his window. But what if he was not planning on spending at all, but rather on saving? This would have stimulated no industry at all, and he would have just been absorbing money through his store. When this boy broke his window, he was forced to spend money to fix his window, which gave money to the glazier who could have spent it on another industry
@Caolaidhe13 Our country's average savings rate is only ~10%. And saving the money in the bank allows other people to use it until he needs it. But even so do you think he shouldn't save the money for a college fund or retirement? Is charity for the glazier somehow more noble than saving for his family? And by spending his money only to fix the window back to its previous state does not invest for the future. Keynesianism overlooks the lost opportunity cost.
@alc99 I am not saying that saving is bad. I just felt like the broken window fallacy was saying that it was less noble, if you will, to pay the glazier because your window broke instead of buying something else, which I think begs the question what would be worth spending money on? Say you need new shoes. Is it a fallacy to buy new shoes instead of a new book for your library? Also, I would not call it charity; charity is giving something without expecting anything in return.
@LIGHTRONIX I see no evidence that he has read Frédéric Bastiat's essay from 1850 "That Which Is Seen and That Which Is Unseen". Reading books is good but living in the real world is better. Stimulus plans ignore the unseen reactions.
the maintenance of the american dollar is key. As a canadian i worry about what will happen should the dollar collapse and the debt be called in. eeeep.
I do see some flaws in his theory, but the biggest one I see is the govt spending part. If the funds the govt spent 1. Actually focused on being free of waste 2. Were spent in ways that offered bigger benfits to the economy and the people as opposed to pay backs and the Ideologies of the the politicians... it might stand half a chance. I'm sorry, but $580,000 for peanut research can't be the best way for half a million bucks to stimulate the economy. Tha'st just one of many silly things!
It wasn't World War 2 itself that ended the great depression. It was the destruction of Europe's industrial centers, and the rebuilding efforts. America had a virtual monopoly on manufacturing for nearly 20 years. During this time, America was prosperous despite some real freaking pieces of work running this country both in Congress AND the whitehouse. You ignore the reason Keynes was discredited was because of the recessions during the 70s and the fact spending did nothing to help.
@Slipknotyk06 um actually it was ww2 i dont know u understand the fact then when the us went to war everyone even woman went into the mans workplace to help benefit the war thats wat revived the economy and thats how the depression really ended come on they teach u this in every history class
@hugitohdz - This just shows the economic illiteracy of this theory. If taking 10 million out of the workforce aids the economy, then putting them back in would cause a secondary depression because there aren't jobs for all the men coming home. In addition, it wouldn't account for the fact that wages went up nearly 50% from 1945 to 48, and the unemployment rate actually dropped over the same years.
Your understanding of Keynesianism is very limited. Your argument that a crash causes a prolonged downward trend without intervention is one debunked by the Depression of 1920 No intervention was made, and 25% unemployment became 10% in less than a year. Then Coolidge takes over, cutting Government spending by 2/3, and taxes by 2/3. If your theory was correct, the economy should have fell on its face. But what happened? Roaring 20s! Come on, man. Get with the times.
Then you go on to say "if we had a major public works project" like we didn't have a HUGE number of public works projects under FDR. World War 2 did NOT get us out of the great depression, as people were still suffering. All World War 2 did was take 5 million men out of our work force at home, which does wonders for the appearance of unemployment and ship them overseas. Back home things were still bad due to goods rationing. This is a joke.
@Slipknotyk06 Being a soldier is a job, though, and the amount of industry required to produce wartime material combined with the relative lack of utter destruction of the United States allowed industries to grow, and then convert to consumer applications, and continue to grow as soldiers came home. That wouldn't have happened if it wasn't for WW2.
Usually I can spot an idiot real quick. So, spend more money on entitlement programs that discourage people from working, and government programs that NEVER work to reign in out of control debt from spending too much on entitlements based on said programs. That's like calling out a larger marker for a longshot to win in order to pay the original marker. Take that medal back. Apologize for squandering your education, and never balance a financial statement more intricate than a checkbook
I really like your videos, they are some of my favorite on youtube. Thank you for doing what you do.
With those things said, this video is very upsetting because I consider you very intelligent and this video is not just wrong, but completely wrong. Please read: The Politically Incorrect Guide to the Great Depression and the New Deal by Robert Murphy; The Forgotten Man by Amity Shlaes; Depression, War, and Cold War by Robert Higgs; Also check out the Econtalk podcasts on the crisis. Thanks
Joe Biden claimed that the $862 Billion failed stimulus ($400 remains unspent) “created or saved” 750,000 jobs. Economists don’t recognize jobs created, and the jobs saved may have been keep local agencies afloat. When the money ran out, the people lost their jobs. Currently States are considering filing bankruptcy for spending. watch?v=IqmeT5ykKf0
The Govt owns 61% of GM, GOOGLE, “GM's electric-car fantasy running out of gas” and read links. The Green Movement should be free market driven
Everything in a nutshell (I think). Recession is when there is a negative GDP growth. GDP is measured by-
Consumption of Goods+Investments+Government Spending+(Export-Imports)
Since the citizens are not consuming as much goods, there are not lots of investments, and the obvious fact that we are importing more than we are exporting, the government will increase spending so that the overall GDP growth for the year is positive.
Two years later...how's that stimulus package working for ya? Hoover tried Keynesian policies, it didn't work. Roosevelt tried Keynesian policies, it didn't work. In response to the Great Depression of 1920 Coolidge cut taxes and spending, and the depression was over in a year. The reason why Keynes fell out of favor was because it predicted that stagflation couldn't exist and that was proved wrong in the 70's.
Kk so when I was 8 And my parents explained what a recession was, I said, "why doesn't the govt just print more money and give it to everyone?" So either I was a child prodigy or a stimulus is really stupid.
so why is a bank allowed to lend out 95% of the money in it? it doesn't make sense to me. Also, money is fiction, the money that was lost in the mortgage crisis never existed, it was just lines of code and data on computers: virtual money.
Hmm... Hopefully the fact the the various stimulous bills over the past few years, including this one, have made the situation worse has led you to, at least, reexamine your economic views.
787 BILLION DOLLARS isn't enough??? i have a question then: how much is enough to test out this theory? and a better question: how much further would the United States have to sink into debt for it TO be enough?? this is ridiculous.
and P.S. WW2 helped the economy because it supplied jobs and generated income, which, based on statistics taken after the first stimulus package, proved to do neither.
why the hell you need more spending, if woy can raise tax and make more income without wasting 80% of natural resouses on nothing.
maibe people shoud reduce their life standards intsead? is it so nesescary to drive gigantic car? chinese somehow manage to live using 10 times less resources than USA.
@deltaxcd who are you to say what is necessary (p.s. that's how you spell it) to live on? if you asked a hundred people (hell, even 10) what a sustainable income is, i guarantee that 99.9% of the people would have different answers. this boils down to the concept of "fair" in which there is no definite definition of the word, because it is based on perspective, not proof or fact.
also, as a side-note, who are you to judge what is right for other people to have?
Of course everyone has different greed level, but in any case sustainable income is about same for everyone, these who get more than that are just wasting it.
Living in that way is suicidal. nobody even noticed real reason of this crisis, it was resource problem cost of energy and materials skyrocketed and it will continue to rise further.
With this amount of consumption we wont be sustain our lives for long, and so expect new crisis soon.
What do you think about Nationalisation of the Federal Reserve and the Banking System itself, bringing it under control of Congress and the US Treasury?.
OPEC want accept monopoly money just putting that out there and your neither Commi or tyrant and you are dangerous because you think you know what your talking about and your spreading your nonsense. You simply want see the truth because you just can't believe the reality of how far gone we are, Sorry like your commentary though
Hyper Inflation the total amount money in circulation has skyrocketed from about 1 trillion to almost 10 trillion. So the simple fact is the distortion is already present in the market were just starting to see it now. Just look at the secret Walmart Study that show that prices are rising at an astounding pace. Wake Up do some RESEARCH FOR YOURSELVES... SHIT STORM
Economies ought not need to be reset. Economies, IF allowed to operate as free markets, where supply and demand balance each other out, would be self regulating and never go through boom and bust cycles. The booms and busts would occur millions of times a day on a micro level.
It's when governments and regulators and legislators believe in Keynesian bullshit is where it all goes wrong.
Your right your not an economist and the school that gave you that award must be Keynesian in it's thinking or put another way... completely off their rocker.
@HowHighRYa@HowHighRYa I think you mean "you're" and "its" in place of "your" and "it's." Also, by modifying school with "off their rocker," I think you mean to say "off its rocker" as school in this case is singular.
I guess when you got your degree in economics they didn't explain these things.
How about an economic stimulus plan that will pay off the national/world deficit and employ millions of people? Would you want to know what it is? Well the government doesn’t care so why should we. Lets all take our money out of the bank and let the banks CRASH!!! But as soon as we do lets put in in gold because that’s what will sky rocket. Then we’ll all be rich. :)
Nothing happen, taxes not only is not lowered they raising TREMENDOUSLY!
Cutting gov't spending? Oh, shit didn't they just sent 140 million to the Palestine? didn't they just spend $800,000 on Africa Genital Washing program(this is real)?...etc
Increase spending? LOL if you're want to go live under a bridge go ahead and start spending for the rest of the country
If you were a small/medium or large business owner would you want to borrow funds from a bank to expand your operations in this shaky economy? Because a majority of businesses will not borrow, no new money will be created via fractional reserve banking therefore there will be a shortage in the money supply (the prime reason why the great depression lasted so long). A shortage in the money supply leads to spiraling deflation. The stimulus package will not work- the damage is too severe.
Thank you for giving the other side of this argument. All I hear anymore is that getting the gov't to spend more will drive us into debt with no way out. But what I hear you saying is that we should pay off the debt when our economy is back on track, which makes perfect sense!
It's not like I'd try and pay off my massive student loans before I graduate and get a good job. Ya know, one where I make enough money to satisfy my needs and pay off debt.
Debt is the problem. You cannot borrow and spend your way out of debt when the spending is used for consumption. Taking money from businesses and individuals in the form of taxes and using a portion of it (after much waste) to hire people to do tasks until the taken and/or borrowed money is exhausted is not job creation. This is asinine.
@darrinbrand What is asinine, is sending good paying manufacturing jobs to low wage countrys so a few rich people can make a killing. That's what caused this mess, the rest is all bullshit. Tax, no tax, spend, baorrow, tax, save, tax........all bullshit. Limit imports now, put the people back to work in high paying jobs. Fuck the rich and Wall Street. Save a Nation, limit imports, manufacture in America.
It feel reassuring to see the giant squids of anger and the decaptcons on the board.
I don't know if it's just me, but I ENJOY being apart of an awesome community with haters as well.
Every group I see, millions of people are already apart of it, and nobody is against it. I don't want that. I want to feel like I'm doing something nobody else is doing. So really... thanks haters.
Hey dude, you seem like a smart enough guy, so I feel compelled to type out a long, well-thought out rebuttal. So here we go.
First off-world war two. Why did the American economy rebound after this? Simply because America was the only untouched economic superpower. All of Europe except Scandinavia (and they matter none) was bombed to SHIT! Same with Japan. They had no industry to speak of. But the U.S except Hawaii and Alaska (and they matter none) was un-freaking-touched.
@rickroflcopter That's not accurate. First of all, Finland (which I consider part of Scandinavia), was bombed by the USSR. Second, Norway and Alaska are HUGE exporters of oil. If they had been taken over or "bombed to shit" the oil market would be different, so of course they matter. Even though those two countries are exceptionally important, it's ridiculously ignorant of you to state that the others you mentioned do not matter in world economy.
@dylanbryson Have you heard of a little thing called Franklin Roosevelt and the New Deal? Essentially it was World War 2 that brought America out of the Depression, so it didn't just recover magically, a huge event happened.
so i have been watching all vlogbrothers videos from the beginning and last night i watched this and today i was taking my US history final and i had a question on Keynes... and the only reason i knew it was because of this video so thank you for helping me pass my final:)
I have traded stocks in 15 year. Buy ranger stocks buy low sell high. AIG is a ranger stock now, the most volatile tho, much better than walmart, burger king or microsoft which are other examples. why buy walmart for a 4 dollar gain a share, when u can buy AIG and get 100 % gain in the same timespan? Do this over and over and over and over again.
I'm going to put this in small enough words that you can understand. Keynsian economics relies on government intervention to produce inflation which increases the money supply by creating debt. The whole reason we have recessions is due to deflation caused by banks slowing down money creation because they lost reserves from bad loans or a bank run. You have a nice shiny medal, but I doubt you understand how inflation and deflation work.
Less tax, Less government, remove spending of our tax money on social programs and NO stimulus plans...would be a wonderful first step to free markets
I dont think this guy would keep using his credit card more and more when he wasn't able to make minimum payment before the recession in the first place, what makes him think he'll be able to pay it off by exceeding his limit beyond the max?
@Compact3 I agree. He should watch the videos entitled, "The Money Masters," "I.O.U.S.A." and "The Dollar Bubble." It was the Bush tax cuts that erased all of Clinton's surpluses. And the Stimulus plan causes inflation.
The war, the housing bubble, and derivative markets caused this. Regulate derivative markets, end the FED, and Bring all troops home from anywhere in the world.
That will fix it.
Keynsian economics doesn't really do anything. It does not grow the economy, it just moves money from a to b. Besides, the smartest person in the world wouldn't know what to do to get the economy started faster than the free market would. And stop saying "unregulated" companies abide by laws the same as you or I.
thanks....I am a 30+ year wall street econ guy and never cease to be amazed by how few people understand how the FED's fiat money power can and does corrupt nearly everything.
Right! It is even deeper than that. The House of Rothschilds through JP Morgan, et. al. pushed the Federal Reserve Act in 1913 under the Wilson Administration so that they could control the country's monetary policy. You might want to check out "The Creature from Jekyll Island" by G. Edward Griffin. It is an eye-opener.
"The Creature from Jekyll Island" back in 1995 and have written national mag articles about the evil history of central banking back to Jesus going postal on the temple money changers.
During the Great Depression we DID have government spending in the form of the alphabet soup program which didn't help. Unfortunately we didn't learn from our mistakes and the billions of dollars in the stimulus bill (which Obama said would stop unemployment from going above 8% (it went over 10% btw)) was wasted money.
Most of the 6% of the people in the USA that actually believe that the stimulus package created jobs are either working in the mainstream media, a union, or for the Obama administration...
Every dime government spends is merely redistributed or printed/borrowed. In neither case is any REAL WEALTH created. Regardless how the government spending is financed, it is by nature a THEFT of real wealth.
The government "tick" on this "dog" economy is now about the same size as the "dog," if that's a clear enough picture for you.
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epiccupcakethime 1 day ago in playlist The News with John
I hate it when people think we've had anything close to an "unregulated" financial system.
TheTubbtubb 3 days ago
no offense to you, but government spending is one of their great evils that they need to correct, all that money goes to the corrupt politicians, so tax breaks are good, more spending is BAD, the idea for circulation is the right one, but it doesn't work what with all the people ready to drain all that money out before it serves its purpose.
ameteuraspirant 1 week ago
You failed to mention how the federal reserve prints the money with nothing backing it causing more debt and a larger interest fee that will never be paid off, all our taxes go to pay off the interest on our gigantious trillions of debt. Nothing we do will work, the central banks cant keep printing money with nothing to back it, we're all screwed.
RP4REVO 3 weeks ago
@RP4REVO
but you havent even got a degree. what do you think you can ever do? sweep the streets?
RichardPapen1 3 weeks ago
It is interesting nearly 3 years later i heard an npr story looking back if it worked... and of course being as complex as an economy is... we really don't know... but more than likely things would have been worse... for me, it came to late to save my job in houston, and despite being moved to indiana for work, an unsold house in houston means near financial ruin. Hm. But.. i have a job... and am living... so that works.
todkapuz 1 month ago
and here we are in 2012 and with the euro dieing before our eyes the British government are attempting to improve the economy by cutting spending. Do I listen to John Green or David Cameron, or does what John said no longer aply? I honestly don't know what to think
SomeoneBeginingWithI 2 months ago in playlist Vlogbrothers 2009 part 1
Stealing tomatoes to survive is better than stealing turnips ... i hate tobacco road
flashjack15 2 months ago in playlist avlog2
YOU WERE IN AC DEC??? ZOMG ME TOO! *ahem* Sorry about that...
flubaxx 2 months ago in playlist More videos from vlogbrothers
thanks for the answers to my history test tomorrow!!
siruroxs 2 months ago in playlist The News with John
I sure hope it was an honest attempt. I get nervous when people talk about elected officials trying to--as some people put it--"destroy America". That would be scary.
lordmahan11 4 months ago
it is possible to walk uphill both ways to school! A hill midway...so many says "Naw naw tha' ain't possible maaaan!"
chrantheman 4 months ago
While this is an important topic, I'm more interested in the idea that you were a Varsity Academic Decathlon Student.
JacquilineMist 5 months ago
youre a tyrant, and a communist, and dont know what youre talking about
DoNtMeSsWiThMyJeSuS 5 months ago in playlist The News with John
How is giving money to the people communist... -.-
mcfleppa 5 months ago
keynes also said the tax rate should never exceed 10% and that the standard gov't expenditures should not exceed 5% during good times the difference was to be saved by gov't for use when needed. so they are not following his advice they are using his name to lie about what the intention is
wiseorwiseazz 5 months ago
John's puff reminds me of the Netherlands from Hetalia....
cuitonwap 5 months ago
The problem is the debt based monetary system. Money is created AS debt and the interest is not created at the same time. What we need to do is get rid of debt on a national level. Governments can simply spend money into existence and as long as mutually agreed to practical limits are in place and the spending is backed by real labor projects. Debt is unnecessary and exists as a means to allow a few to gain advantage over many. The "free market" doesn't exist. Markets are controlled and guarded.
TDK4play 6 months ago
no one knows exactly what's going on in the economy, due to the almost infinite complexity of it's system. i do know that infinite growth is not possible without paradigm shifts happening at smaller and smaller intervals. we can't grow forever. it's like trying to arrange a room where every object is on top; a game that everyone wins. we all know only one person wins monopoly in the end, and that guy is usually a douche-bag.
paintingshade 6 months ago
Johns story of what it would be like to live in the great depression is eerily similar to my mothers story of living in the soviet union.
4j8ack 6 months ago
Raise spending and lower taxes.
Pretty sure thats ALL Bush did!
Do you even understand how the Crash happened?
Salvysahagun 6 months ago
@Salvysahagun You missed the entire point, you are supposed to keep taxes low and spending high in the time of a reccession. Bush's years were mostly years of growth and somewhat prosperity- yet he spent like crazy (in all of the wrong areas) and cut taxes when they shouldn't have been cut (and for the wrong people).
AWesome61696 4 months ago
@AWesome61696
Taxes low Spending high... Gee don't forget demand is a function of bidding.
That means doing these things will only raise prices.
Salvysahagun 4 months ago
@Salvysahagun How?
AWesome61696 4 months ago
@AWesome61696
Spending is a function of bidding... don't forget that.
Salvysahagun 4 months ago
@Salvysahagun Exactly- spending, as a form of bidding, will create demand in an economy lacking it. Reccessions are caused by slowdowns in demand, not supply. But the spending will also create job, move forward major construction projects, releive local government's of their debt, and ultimatley put more $ into the pockets of Americans.
AWesome61696 4 months ago
@AWesome61696
Spending is a function of bidding... don't forget that.
In auctions the more money people have the higher prices go, because people have more money to spend hence have more money to bid each other out.
Right now we need lower prices to allow grassroots businesses men to buy resources at cheap prices.
We need to tightin up on credit, raise taxes, add heavier deductions for production, cut government spending.
70% of the US Economy is consumption.
Salvysahagun 4 months ago
I hate how relevant this still is
besttheeverhappy 7 months ago
I didn't know american high schools are that bad.
86nguyenviet 7 months ago
Comment removed
86nguyenviet 7 months ago
Hmm, where did "the bubble" come from to begin with? Maybe you should try to use your brain? And by the way, how's stimulus working out. BTW, Bernanke has a Nobel prize while being a retard, so...where does that put you and your medal?
johammbass 7 months ago
@johammbass Obama has a Nobel prize.... He did nothing Therefore that prize hold no credibility.
Also the bubble is caused when money isn't backed up properly like how a bubble isn't strong on the inside and can collapse in on its self.
Because people were selling crap mortgages saying they were good and so the people who bought them thought they had assets but in reality had crap and when they found out it went to hell.
Almost the same story with derivatives.
BTW: were you kidding or not?
caseyvill 7 months ago in playlist The News with John
I just failed economy.. this is depressing to hear, cause this is like everything I had to say in order to pass..
andrineslife 8 months ago 30
The problem with the stimulus is that with increased spending comes increased regulation. The government is changing the playing field so much that companies are afraid partake in already risky expansions for fear that the government shall regulate and tax their successes. Thus they are cutting jobs, and shrinking back into a safe mode of operation. We all know that expansion is the way out of a recession, and thus the effects of the stimulus are hurting us by discouraging it.
Valdrag 8 months ago in playlist The News with John
This has been flagged as spam show
My Keynes Hayek: The Clash That Defined Modern Economics is published in October by W.W.Norton. Read an extract at: sites.google.com/site/wapshottkeyneshayek/
Nicholas Wapshott
nhwapshott 8 months ago
i'm doing the great depression in history class now !
imamadmad1 8 months ago
Lol, didn't the bubble come about explicitly due to Keynesian economics, ie when money is simply printed? Maybe the consumer isn't spending because he is out of money and has a massive debt and not because he is scared? Just a thought.
johammbass 8 months ago
"...respectfully, those people are crazy." :D
anniexan 9 months ago
John - Please educate yourself about Keynesian economics and google the Broken Window fallacy
alc99 9 months ago 14
@alc99 So according to the broken window fallacy, the shopkeeper would have spent his money on some other industry if he hadn't had to fix his window. But what if he was not planning on spending at all, but rather on saving? This would have stimulated no industry at all, and he would have just been absorbing money through his store. When this boy broke his window, he was forced to spend money to fix his window, which gave money to the glazier who could have spent it on another industry
Caolaidhe13 1 month ago in playlist More videos from vlogbrothers
@Caolaidhe13 Our country's average savings rate is only ~10%. And saving the money in the bank allows other people to use it until he needs it. But even so do you think he shouldn't save the money for a college fund or retirement? Is charity for the glazier somehow more noble than saving for his family? And by spending his money only to fix the window back to its previous state does not invest for the future. Keynesianism overlooks the lost opportunity cost.
alc99 1 month ago
@alc99 I am not saying that saving is bad. I just felt like the broken window fallacy was saying that it was less noble, if you will, to pay the glazier because your window broke instead of buying something else, which I think begs the question what would be worth spending money on? Say you need new shoes. Is it a fallacy to buy new shoes instead of a new book for your library? Also, I would not call it charity; charity is giving something without expecting anything in return.
Caolaidhe13 1 month ago
@alc99 I think he's spent more time researching the subject than you.
LIGHTRONIX 2 days ago in playlist The News with John
@LIGHTRONIX I see no evidence that he has read Frédéric Bastiat's essay from 1850 "That Which Is Seen and That Which Is Unseen". Reading books is good but living in the real world is better. Stimulus plans ignore the unseen reactions.
alc99 1 day ago
@alc99 also, he reads lots and lots of books, instead of watching youtube videos about economics.
LIGHTRONIX 2 days ago in playlist The News with John
Once again John proves he need to run for president.
chefmirmir177 9 months ago
the maintenance of the american dollar is key. As a canadian i worry about what will happen should the dollar collapse and the debt be called in. eeeep.
canadian00793 9 months ago
you don't know what you're talking abou you communist tyrant. :)
Mercyb123 10 months ago
Smith or Marx? Keynes!
jazlyn777 10 months ago
How could you walk up hill to school both ways..
RPHSNerdyfun311 10 months ago
@RPHSNerdyfun311 massive...massive earthquakes.
adulby 9 months ago
@vlogbrothers
this is one of the poorest videos i've ever watched. pure dis-info.
for the vblogger himself. how about reading 'ECONOMICS IN ONE LESSON'
read the amazon reviews. it's short and concise - 180pages
100CommonCents 11 months ago
I do see some flaws in his theory, but the biggest one I see is the govt spending part. If the funds the govt spent 1. Actually focused on being free of waste 2. Were spent in ways that offered bigger benfits to the economy and the people as opposed to pay backs and the Ideologies of the the politicians... it might stand half a chance. I'm sorry, but $580,000 for peanut research can't be the best way for half a million bucks to stimulate the economy. Tha'st just one of many silly things!
mrhoffame 11 months ago
It's funny how you look so much like a Dutch fan in this video. Orange for our royal family and Red/White/Blue for our flag!
HlenaH 11 months ago
(Part3)
It wasn't World War 2 itself that ended the great depression. It was the destruction of Europe's industrial centers, and the rebuilding efforts. America had a virtual monopoly on manufacturing for nearly 20 years. During this time, America was prosperous despite some real freaking pieces of work running this country both in Congress AND the whitehouse. You ignore the reason Keynes was discredited was because of the recessions during the 70s and the fact spending did nothing to help.
Slipknotyk06 11 months ago
@Slipknotyk06 um actually it was ww2 i dont know u understand the fact then when the us went to war everyone even woman went into the mans workplace to help benefit the war thats wat revived the economy and thats how the depression really ended come on they teach u this in every history class
hugitohdz 11 months ago
@hugitohdz - This just shows the economic illiteracy of this theory. If taking 10 million out of the workforce aids the economy, then putting them back in would cause a secondary depression because there aren't jobs for all the men coming home. In addition, it wouldn't account for the fact that wages went up nearly 50% from 1945 to 48, and the unemployment rate actually dropped over the same years.
Slipknotyk06 11 months ago
John,
Your understanding of Keynesianism is very limited. Your argument that a crash causes a prolonged downward trend without intervention is one debunked by the Depression of 1920 No intervention was made, and 25% unemployment became 10% in less than a year. Then Coolidge takes over, cutting Government spending by 2/3, and taxes by 2/3. If your theory was correct, the economy should have fell on its face. But what happened? Roaring 20s! Come on, man. Get with the times.
Slipknotyk06 11 months ago
(Part2)
Then you go on to say "if we had a major public works project" like we didn't have a HUGE number of public works projects under FDR. World War 2 did NOT get us out of the great depression, as people were still suffering. All World War 2 did was take 5 million men out of our work force at home, which does wonders for the appearance of unemployment and ship them overseas. Back home things were still bad due to goods rationing. This is a joke.
Slipknotyk06 11 months ago
@Slipknotyk06 Being a soldier is a job, though, and the amount of industry required to produce wartime material combined with the relative lack of utter destruction of the United States allowed industries to grow, and then convert to consumer applications, and continue to grow as soldiers came home. That wouldn't have happened if it wasn't for WW2.
thisismy7thusername 9 months ago
i learn a lot more from you and hank than from a year of private school education. could you explain the great depression too? :) :)
benzenetoluene1 11 months ago
Usually I can spot an idiot real quick. So, spend more money on entitlement programs that discourage people from working, and government programs that NEVER work to reign in out of control debt from spending too much on entitlements based on said programs. That's like calling out a larger marker for a longshot to win in order to pay the original marker. Take that medal back. Apologize for squandering your education, and never balance a financial statement more intricate than a checkbook
Brajabu74 1 year ago
this is a great video, because it illustrates that people who support the "stimulus" are intellectually, at best 3.0GPA high-school students.
you're not a tyrant, but you def. don't know what you're talking about.
but you talk very well...well, at least you talk very fast.
nevertheless, you should look into quality vs. quantity.
ZamolxisReborn 1 year ago
I really like your videos, they are some of my favorite on youtube. Thank you for doing what you do.
With those things said, this video is very upsetting because I consider you very intelligent and this video is not just wrong, but completely wrong. Please read: The Politically Incorrect Guide to the Great Depression and the New Deal by Robert Murphy; The Forgotten Man by Amity Shlaes; Depression, War, and Cold War by Robert Higgs; Also check out the Econtalk podcasts on the crisis. Thanks
chunga777 1 year ago
Joe Biden claimed that the $862 Billion failed stimulus ($400 remains unspent) “created or saved” 750,000 jobs. Economists don’t recognize jobs created, and the jobs saved may have been keep local agencies afloat. When the money ran out, the people lost their jobs. Currently States are considering filing bankruptcy for spending. watch?v=IqmeT5ykKf0
The Govt owns 61% of GM, GOOGLE, “GM's electric-car fantasy running out of gas” and read links. The Green Movement should be free market driven
TheModelification 1 year ago
watch?v=d0nERTFo-Sk
Keynes was an idiot.
Your medal was awarded by state employees which explains why they are in favor of keynesianism. If I was a state employee I would be a keynesian too.
TheSupremeSkeptic 1 year ago
Everything in a nutshell (I think). Recession is when there is a negative GDP growth. GDP is measured by-
Consumption of Goods+Investments+Government Spending+(Export-Imports)
Since the citizens are not consuming as much goods, there are not lots of investments, and the obvious fact that we are importing more than we are exporting, the government will increase spending so that the overall GDP growth for the year is positive.
xyoshimamax 1 year ago
Why has "communist" become a derogatory term?
TheMontypythonfan 1 year ago
@TheMontypythonfan What does any of this have to do with communism! (I mean, really...)
musikstar81 1 year ago
@musikstar81 Communism is an economic system which is dismissed in this video without explanation. So yeah.
TheMontypythonfan 1 year ago
@TheMontypythonfan - I would hope more people would dismiss Communism.
Slipknotyk06 11 months ago
Two years later...how's that stimulus package working for ya? Hoover tried Keynesian policies, it didn't work. Roosevelt tried Keynesian policies, it didn't work. In response to the Great Depression of 1920 Coolidge cut taxes and spending, and the depression was over in a year. The reason why Keynes fell out of favor was because it predicted that stagflation couldn't exist and that was proved wrong in the 70's.
PissedFechtmeister 1 year ago
Kk so when I was 8 And my parents explained what a recession was, I said, "why doesn't the govt just print more money and give it to everyone?" So either I was a child prodigy or a stimulus is really stupid.
FangsUpCobraFans 1 year ago
Can you do this again.... only slower
TheMEK3 1 year ago
so why is a bank allowed to lend out 95% of the money in it? it doesn't make sense to me. Also, money is fiction, the money that was lost in the mortgage crisis never existed, it was just lines of code and data on computers: virtual money.
jack16895 1 year ago
God man, blink!
BrittanysMusicVideos 1 year ago
Hmm... Hopefully the fact the the various stimulous bills over the past few years, including this one, have made the situation worse has led you to, at least, reexamine your economic views.
akpiano27 1 year ago
It is really sad that keynesian economists don't know that what individuals consume has to be produced.
MiklosTh3Gr3at 1 year ago
In order to have capital (food, clothes,Ipod, etc.) to consume, it first must be produced.
If you can buy (capital) a machine (capital) you can make something to sell (guess).
Debt is a lack of capital.
A is A .
356pla 1 year ago
"Keynes has been out of favor..."
That statement alone disqualifies this entire video fantasy.
lbrlove 1 year ago
*sigh* I really wish I understood this video John :/
jellybeangravy 1 year ago
787 BILLION DOLLARS isn't enough??? i have a question then: how much is enough to test out this theory? and a better question: how much further would the United States have to sink into debt for it TO be enough?? this is ridiculous.
and P.S. WW2 helped the economy because it supplied jobs and generated income, which, based on statistics taken after the first stimulus package, proved to do neither.
silverturtle14 1 year ago
Another fine example of our government run education system
allinlen 1 year ago
why the hell you need more spending, if woy can raise tax and make more income without wasting 80% of natural resouses on nothing.
maibe people shoud reduce their life standards intsead? is it so nesescary to drive gigantic car? chinese somehow manage to live using 10 times less resources than USA.
deltaxcd 1 year ago
@deltaxcd who are you to say what is necessary (p.s. that's how you spell it) to live on? if you asked a hundred people (hell, even 10) what a sustainable income is, i guarantee that 99.9% of the people would have different answers. this boils down to the concept of "fair" in which there is no definite definition of the word, because it is based on perspective, not proof or fact.
also, as a side-note, who are you to judge what is right for other people to have?
silverturtle14 1 year ago
@silverturtle14
Of course everyone has different greed level, but in any case sustainable income is about same for everyone, these who get more than that are just wasting it.
Living in that way is suicidal. nobody even noticed real reason of this crisis, it was resource problem cost of energy and materials skyrocketed and it will continue to rise further.
With this amount of consumption we wont be sustain our lives for long, and so expect new crisis soon.
deltaxcd 1 year ago
What do you think about Nationalisation of the Federal Reserve and the Banking System itself, bringing it under control of Congress and the US Treasury?.
AwakenFromTheSlumber 1 year ago
he does not blink
computerpuke 1 year ago
How is the government meant to raise spending when they have little money in the first place?
Hadezul2 1 year ago
so did it work ? are we out of the recession yet ? after all the stimulus went into effect almost 2 years ago.
remotehog1 1 year ago 2
@remotehog1 Nah man it's worse than before. The stimulus package was made by the federal reserve which is the root of tha problem
xDarkside101x 1 year ago 2
This guy is a communist terrorist. He has no idea what he is talking about.
ancient122 1 year ago
@ancient122 I think you're what you just said
xDarkside101x 1 year ago
OPEC want accept monopoly money just putting that out there and your neither Commi or tyrant and you are dangerous because you think you know what your talking about and your spreading your nonsense. You simply want see the truth because you just can't believe the reality of how far gone we are, Sorry like your commentary though
MrHabs1993 1 year ago
Hyper Inflation the total amount money in circulation has skyrocketed from about 1 trillion to almost 10 trillion. So the simple fact is the distortion is already present in the market were just starting to see it now. Just look at the secret Walmart Study that show that prices are rising at an astounding pace. Wake Up do some RESEARCH FOR YOURSELVES... SHIT STORM
MrHabs1993 1 year ago
Economies ought not need to be reset. Economies, IF allowed to operate as free markets, where supply and demand balance each other out, would be self regulating and never go through boom and bust cycles. The booms and busts would occur millions of times a day on a micro level.
It's when governments and regulators and legislators believe in Keynesian bullshit is where it all goes wrong.
Look into the Mises School of economics.
Also look into Zeitgeist Addendum
beneehall 1 year ago
Comment removed
beneehall 1 year ago
Your right your not an economist and the school that gave you that award must be Keynesian in it's thinking or put another way... completely off their rocker.
HowHighRYa 1 year ago
@HowHighRYa @HowHighRYa I think you mean "you're" and "its" in place of "your" and "it's." Also, by modifying school with "off their rocker," I think you mean to say "off its rocker" as school in this case is singular.
I guess when you got your degree in economics they didn't explain these things.
jonathanshastings 1 year ago
you are a bit crazy, but I liked you though
alonelychild 1 year ago
that depression story is going to haunt my oddly themed dreams!
SSdetectiveagency 1 year ago
How about an economic stimulus plan that will pay off the national/world deficit and employ millions of people? Would you want to know what it is? Well the government doesn’t care so why should we. Lets all take our money out of the bank and let the banks CRASH!!! But as soon as we do lets put in in gold because that’s what will sky rocket. Then we’ll all be rich. :)
SeeEverythingisEasy 1 year ago
Comment removed
MrHabs1993 1 year ago
2589 people either missed the dislike button or they thought this was a satire.
Xasew 1 year ago
Ya, the stimulus worked really well. 9.6% unemployment and 1.6% Growth, fantastic!!!
aaasssfffdddiii 1 year ago
when have we seen a free market bubble form (during the last 40 years)... not even the.com bubble was free of government malpractice.
gotlogg 1 year ago
Yup, Mr. Obama signed the stimulus bill....
question is....so now what?
Nothing happen, taxes not only is not lowered they raising TREMENDOUSLY!
Cutting gov't spending? Oh, shit didn't they just sent 140 million to the Palestine? didn't they just spend $800,000 on Africa Genital Washing program(this is real)?...etc
Increase spending? LOL if you're want to go live under a bridge go ahead and start spending for the rest of the country
Wake up you MORONS, OBAMA IS FUCKING LIAR!!!
akira357 1 year ago
If you were a small/medium or large business owner would you want to borrow funds from a bank to expand your operations in this shaky economy? Because a majority of businesses will not borrow, no new money will be created via fractional reserve banking therefore there will be a shortage in the money supply (the prime reason why the great depression lasted so long). A shortage in the money supply leads to spiraling deflation. The stimulus package will not work- the damage is too severe.
jjwmonsta 1 year ago
Thank you!
Thank you for giving the other side of this argument. All I hear anymore is that getting the gov't to spend more will drive us into debt with no way out. But what I hear you saying is that we should pay off the debt when our economy is back on track, which makes perfect sense!
It's not like I'd try and pay off my massive student loans before I graduate and get a good job. Ya know, one where I make enough money to satisfy my needs and pay off debt.
SMFortissimo 1 year ago
you just about summed up a month of my economics class.
potential job as a teacher?
Belula4 1 year ago
So you're telling me that the economy grows because people spend money?
That's completely backwards. People can spend money BECAUSE the economy grows. That's where spending comes from. Money comes from production.
You're basically telling me that food comes from people eating it, and not from the actual process of growing it instead.
cheesebone82 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"We're in for a crap storm no matter what!" yes and keynism is going to make it worse in the long run!
Musketor 1 year ago
Debt is the problem. You cannot borrow and spend your way out of debt when the spending is used for consumption. Taking money from businesses and individuals in the form of taxes and using a portion of it (after much waste) to hire people to do tasks until the taken and/or borrowed money is exhausted is not job creation. This is asinine.
darrinbrand 1 year ago 50
@darrinbrand What is asinine, is sending good paying manufacturing jobs to low wage countrys so a few rich people can make a killing. That's what caused this mess, the rest is all bullshit. Tax, no tax, spend, baorrow, tax, save, tax........all bullshit. Limit imports now, put the people back to work in high paying jobs. Fuck the rich and Wall Street. Save a Nation, limit imports, manufacture in America.
rickbar123 1 year ago
It feel reassuring to see the giant squids of anger and the decaptcons on the board.
I don't know if it's just me, but I ENJOY being apart of an awesome community with haters as well.
Every group I see, millions of people are already apart of it, and nobody is against it. I don't want that. I want to feel like I'm doing something nobody else is doing. So really... thanks haters.
Is that just me?
TrollinTheInterwebz 1 year ago
"We're in for a crap storm no matter what!" <---- YES!!!
TheRealLife333 1 year ago
Sigh. So many people rejecting such a tested theory without any education. How arrogant.
nafaidni 1 year ago 39
The one thing we all forget is the source of all wealth..which is natural resources. Try going back on finding out where the money is generated
akrskb 1 year ago
some pills ... maybe .... :)
jepeto79 1 year ago
I got a bronze metal in Academic Decathlon economics too! :) Yes, that makes me a little too happy.
karaluvsketchup 1 year ago
Ron PAUL!
movingtodie 1 year ago
Only video of yours i will actually thumbs down.. sorry
themantrevor 1 year ago
Problem:
I was stimulated too much that I got into trouble. BAD TROUBLE.
The Fix:
Stimulate me more!
The outcome
I am an over stimulated whore- but I feel good about it. Can I have another loan please?
rowanshole 1 year ago 5
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Shadow29125 1 year ago
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Shadow29125 1 year ago
Hey dude, you seem like a smart enough guy, so I feel compelled to type out a long, well-thought out rebuttal. So here we go.
First off-world war two. Why did the American economy rebound after this? Simply because America was the only untouched economic superpower. All of Europe except Scandinavia (and they matter none) was bombed to SHIT! Same with Japan. They had no industry to speak of. But the U.S except Hawaii and Alaska (and they matter none) was un-freaking-touched.
rickroflcopter 1 year ago
@rickroflcopter That's not accurate. First of all, Finland (which I consider part of Scandinavia), was bombed by the USSR. Second, Norway and Alaska are HUGE exporters of oil. If they had been taken over or "bombed to shit" the oil market would be different, so of course they matter. Even though those two countries are exceptionally important, it's ridiculously ignorant of you to state that the others you mentioned do not matter in world economy.
Tattas999 1 year ago
The depression of 1920: they did nothing. It recovered.
dylanbryson 1 year ago 2
@dylanbryson Have you heard of a little thing called Franklin Roosevelt and the New Deal? Essentially it was World War 2 that brought America out of the Depression, so it didn't just recover magically, a huge event happened.
ArenGtv 1 year ago
@ArenGtv I wasnt talking about the great depression? are you just telling me things?
dylanbryson 1 year ago
so i have been watching all vlogbrothers videos from the beginning and last night i watched this and today i was taking my US history final and i had a question on Keynes... and the only reason i knew it was because of this video so thank you for helping me pass my final:)
bookworm1395 1 year ago
"Which is my favorite kind of exuberence. :D"
Lol...my favorite part. Asides from the massively informational part.
Also, thank you for helping me with me Economics final!
moskitomagnet 1 year ago
wow he is so right (sarcasm) look how well that worked out
TheRunner94 1 year ago
ACADEMIC DECATHLON!!!
Azureluna 1 year ago
One day, I will have an office with an organized library.
Hellmyerstwin 1 year ago
I have traded stocks in 15 year. Buy ranger stocks buy low sell high. AIG is a ranger stock now, the most volatile tho, much better than walmart, burger king or microsoft which are other examples. why buy walmart for a 4 dollar gain a share, when u can buy AIG and get 100 % gain in the same timespan? Do this over and over and over and over again.
SteelboneNakedlunch 1 year ago
that was pretty good.... lay off the coffee dude.
ridgid300 1 year ago
I'm going to put this in small enough words that you can understand. Keynsian economics relies on government intervention to produce inflation which increases the money supply by creating debt. The whole reason we have recessions is due to deflation caused by banks slowing down money creation because they lost reserves from bad loans or a bank run. You have a nice shiny medal, but I doubt you understand how inflation and deflation work.
thebestsumoeva 1 year ago
you look like a dutchman =P
orange colored shirt and a red-white-blue colored necklace nedal thingie xD
M44hk 1 year ago
Less tax, Less government, remove spending of our tax money on social programs and NO stimulus plans...would be a wonderful first step to free markets
chezz97541 1 year ago
hehi really need to find somebody who clicks with me
Spineyw 1 year ago
I dont think this guy would keep using his credit card more and more when he wasn't able to make minimum payment before the recession in the first place, what makes him think he'll be able to pay it off by exceeding his limit beyond the max?
fudgedogbannana 1 year ago
commie tyrant
ggggrrranyname 1 year ago
Keynesian EConomics vs Austrian Economics
hmmm listen to this guy for the Keynesian...listen to Ron Paul for the Austrian. Ron Paul studied Austrian economics
RyeGuyfx 1 year ago
It you want to believe that the Washington/Wall Street guys are really trying to help Americans, then go ahead.
Go watch Mr. Smith Goes to Washington.
StaticTricity 1 year ago
/// this jerk off never blinks// he blinked 3 times in 4 min
tonmagicwon 2 years ago
u sux
adonis1936 2 years ago
That was actually helpful!!!!
Hanan12Kamel 2 years ago
I say start all over again, this time without the FED...
Compact3 2 years ago
@Compact3 I agree. He should watch the videos entitled, "The Money Masters," "I.O.U.S.A." and "The Dollar Bubble." It was the Bush tax cuts that erased all of Clinton's surpluses. And the Stimulus plan causes inflation.
Jossher700 2 years ago
The war, the housing bubble, and derivative markets caused this. Regulate derivative markets, end the FED, and Bring all troops home from anywhere in the world.
That will fix it.
Keynsian economics doesn't really do anything. It does not grow the economy, it just moves money from a to b. Besides, the smartest person in the world wouldn't know what to do to get the economy started faster than the free market would. And stop saying "unregulated" companies abide by laws the same as you or I.
enomarekim 2 years ago
why did you not mention that the bill WASN"T READ ALL THE WAY THROUGH BY ANY ONE PERSON!!!!!!!!!
bibliophile232 2 years ago
erm...I think you have something in your teeth...
bibliophile232 2 years ago
congrats bud, your clueless!!!
The boom and bust cycles are CREATED by design to make TRILLIONS for the bankster families that own the federal reserve bank.
THERE CAN BE NO RECOVERY TO NONINFLATIONARY GROWTH WITHOUT A NEW SYSTEM OF SOUND MONEY
unameitltd 2 years ago
@unameitltd You hit it right on the head. Apparently, you are aware.
Jossher700 2 years ago
thanks....I am a 30+ year wall street econ guy and never cease to be amazed by how few people understand how the FED's fiat money power can and does corrupt nearly everything.
unameitltd 2 years ago
Right! It is even deeper than that. The House of Rothschilds through JP Morgan, et. al. pushed the Federal Reserve Act in 1913 under the Wilson Administration so that they could control the country's monetary policy. You might want to check out "The Creature from Jekyll Island" by G. Edward Griffin. It is an eye-opener.
Jossher700 2 years ago
I got my Griffin autographed copy of
"The Creature from Jekyll Island" back in 1995 and have written national mag articles about the evil history of central banking back to Jesus going postal on the temple money changers.
unameitltd 2 years ago
Awesome! Prett cool! Yes, it was the only time Jesus got physical. I'm sure you saw "The Money Masters." Great docu.
Jossher700 2 years ago
Great job explaining it, John, but here is my question, who gets all the money if we are losing it?
keyofawesomefan 2 years ago
holy shmit i was fucking right all along !
LANCExTHEGREAT 2 years ago
Keynes never met the mafia.
OmarThePug 2 years ago
So I'll jsut not work and then get my free money...Thank obama. I can get thoes microsoft points I wanted.
halowarrior1000 2 years ago
During the Great Depression we DID have government spending in the form of the alphabet soup program which didn't help. Unfortunately we didn't learn from our mistakes and the billions of dollars in the stimulus bill (which Obama said would stop unemployment from going above 8% (it went over 10% btw)) was wasted money.
Numbskiller 2 years ago 5
Most of the 6% of the people in the USA that actually believe that the stimulus package created jobs are either working in the mainstream media, a union, or for the Obama administration...
STPdemon 2 years ago 5
Every dime government spends is merely redistributed or printed/borrowed. In neither case is any REAL WEALTH created. Regardless how the government spending is financed, it is by nature a THEFT of real wealth.
The government "tick" on this "dog" economy is now about the same size as the "dog," if that's a clear enough picture for you.
sinless1 2 years ago 5
I just wasted 4 minutes of my life.
g00se99 2 years ago