Consider the train to contain water at rest with respect to the train and the embankment to contain water at rest with respect to the embankment. If water is at rest with respect to both the train and the embankment and the train and the embankment occupy different regions of three dimensional space then the video correctly represents the propagation of the light on the train and on the embankment. The light waves reach M' and the light waves will reach M simultaneously.
I was one of the ones here correcting you, nut case.
Your dipiction is just plain wrong. In physical reality wether you like reality or not the waves leaving A and A' expand together, neither one going to the right. The vacuum speed of light is independent of the source. Same for the waves leaving B and B'. If you wanted the A' and B' waves to reach M' together then you would have to set them off at different times. Thats relative simultaneity.
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics If the train and embankment occupy different regions of three dimensional space and the train is full of water at rest with respect to the train and the embankment is full of water at rest with respect to the embankment and the lightning strikes occur as depicted then the light from A and B reaches M and the light from A' and B' reaches M' simultaneously. Einstein is incorrect assuming the frames of reference are equal in his train gedanken.
Water has nothing to do with it. Physical reality supports Einstein, not you. You are the one who was wrong. It is crazy to dissagree with reality. Get over it.
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics Water is used as an analogy for aether. If the train and the embankment occupy the same region of three dimensional space then the aether can not be in the same state with respect to both. Einstein does not correctly factor in the state of the aether in his train gedanken. See the 'Aether Displacement' thread at sci.physics.relativity to understand what occurs physically in nature in Einstein's train gedanken and why the Observers conclude as they do.
The wave fronts from A' and B' shouldn't have a net propogation to the right and If they are supposed to be simultaneous for S' then they should also start at different times for the S frame.
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics Consider the train to contain water at rest with respect to the train and the embankment to contain water at rest with respect to the embankment. If water is at rest with respect to both the train and the embankment and the train and the embankment occupy different regions of three dimensional space then the video correctly represents the propagation of the light on the train and on the embankment. The light waves reach M' and the light waves will reach M simultaneously.
Thats irrelevant. Relative simultaneity is infered by the existance of an invariant speed which just happens to be the speed of light "in vacuum". You're dipiction of that topic is just wrong.
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics It is relevant. It shows how light propagates if the frames of reference are equal. In Einstein's train gedanken if the frames of reference are equal then the light must reach M' and M simultaneously. Since that is not the case then the frames of reference are not equal. If the train and the embankment occupy the same region of three dimensional space the light reaches M simultaneously and does not reach M' simultaneously because light propagates with respect to the aether.
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics In order to correctly determine the simultaneity of the lightning strikes the Observer on the train and the Observer on the embankment must know their state with respect to the aether.
If the Observer on the embankment concludes the lightning strikes were simultaneous and the Observer on the train concludes the lightning strikes were not simultaneous, it is simply due to light propagating at 'c' with respect to the aether. It is too much to go into here, but the atomic clocks on the train and the embankment 'tick' based upon the aether pressure in which they exist. The clocks on the train tick slower then the clocks on the embankment. Einstein's train gedanken is not relative.
The point of the video is to show the train and embankment frames of reference are not equal, if the train and embankment occupy the same three dimensional space the light waves propagate through, in Einstein's Train Gedanken. The state of the aether must be known in order to determine the simultaneity of the lightning strikes in nature. Einstein said the state of the aether is determined by its connections with the matter. The state of the aether is most determined by its connections with Earth
The train and the embankment occupy different regions in three dimensional space. Consider the train to contain water at rest with respect to the train and the embankment to consist of water at rest with respect to the embankment. In this scenario, the light from A and B reaches M and the light from A' and B' reaches M' simultaneously. This is what is meant by the reference frames must be equal in all respects.
But that video doesn't tell you anything about relativity or simultaneity.
The "wave fronts" are consistent with the Newtonian corpuscular theory of light, in which velocities add v = v_1 + v_2. This is not the case in our universe.
It tells you simultaneous lightning strikes equi-distant from the mid-point in different frames of reference will reach the mid-point simultaneously. To conclude otherwise, is to have a preferred frame.
Consider the train to contain water at rest with respect to the train and the embankment to contain water at rest with respect to the embankment. If water is at rest with respect to both the train and the embankment and the train and the embankment occupy different regions of three dimensional space then the video correctly represents the propagation of the light on the train and on the embankment. The light waves reach M' and the light waves will reach M simultaneously.
mpc755 1 year ago
I was one of the ones here correcting you, nut case.
Your dipiction is just plain wrong. In physical reality wether you like reality or not the waves leaving A and A' expand together, neither one going to the right. The vacuum speed of light is independent of the source. Same for the waves leaving B and B'. If you wanted the A' and B' waves to reach M' together then you would have to set them off at different times. Thats relative simultaneity.
WaiteDavidMSPhysics 1 year ago
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics If the train and embankment occupy different regions of three dimensional space and the train is full of water at rest with respect to the train and the embankment is full of water at rest with respect to the embankment and the lightning strikes occur as depicted then the light from A and B reaches M and the light from A' and B' reaches M' simultaneously. Einstein is incorrect assuming the frames of reference are equal in his train gedanken.
mpc755 1 year ago
@mpc755
Water has nothing to do with it. Physical reality supports Einstein, not you. You are the one who was wrong. It is crazy to dissagree with reality. Get over it.
WaiteDavidMSPhysics 1 year ago
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics Water is used as an analogy for aether. If the train and the embankment occupy the same region of three dimensional space then the aether can not be in the same state with respect to both. Einstein does not correctly factor in the state of the aether in his train gedanken. See the 'Aether Displacement' thread at sci.physics.relativity to understand what occurs physically in nature in Einstein's train gedanken and why the Observers conclude as they do.
mpc755 1 year ago
The wave fronts from A' and B' shouldn't have a net propogation to the right and If they are supposed to be simultaneous for S' then they should also start at different times for the S frame.
WaiteDavidMSPhysics 1 year ago
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics Consider the train to contain water at rest with respect to the train and the embankment to contain water at rest with respect to the embankment. If water is at rest with respect to both the train and the embankment and the train and the embankment occupy different regions of three dimensional space then the video correctly represents the propagation of the light on the train and on the embankment. The light waves reach M' and the light waves will reach M simultaneously.
mpc755 1 year ago
@mpc755
Thats irrelevant. Relative simultaneity is infered by the existance of an invariant speed which just happens to be the speed of light "in vacuum". You're dipiction of that topic is just wrong.
WaiteDavidMSPhysics 1 year ago
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics It is relevant. It shows how light propagates if the frames of reference are equal. In Einstein's train gedanken if the frames of reference are equal then the light must reach M' and M simultaneously. Since that is not the case then the frames of reference are not equal. If the train and the embankment occupy the same region of three dimensional space the light reaches M simultaneously and does not reach M' simultaneously because light propagates with respect to the aether.
mpc755 1 year ago
@mpc755
I wasn't asking if it was relevent. I was telling you that it was not. You are insane.
WaiteDavidMSPhysics 1 year ago
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics In order to correctly determine the simultaneity of the lightning strikes the Observer on the train and the Observer on the embankment must know their state with respect to the aether.
mpc755 1 year ago
@mpc755
bs prove it.
WaiteDavidMSPhysics 1 year ago
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics See 'Aether Displacement' thread at sci.physics.relativity
mpc755 1 year ago
@mpc755
No.
WaiteDavidMSPhysics 1 year ago
@WaiteDavidMSPhysics Then remain incorrect.
mpc755 1 year ago
If the Observer on the embankment concludes the lightning strikes were simultaneous and the Observer on the train concludes the lightning strikes were not simultaneous, it is simply due to light propagating at 'c' with respect to the aether. It is too much to go into here, but the atomic clocks on the train and the embankment 'tick' based upon the aether pressure in which they exist. The clocks on the train tick slower then the clocks on the embankment. Einstein's train gedanken is not relative.
mpc755 1 year ago
The point of the video is to show the train and embankment frames of reference are not equal, if the train and embankment occupy the same three dimensional space the light waves propagate through, in Einstein's Train Gedanken. The state of the aether must be known in order to determine the simultaneity of the lightning strikes in nature. Einstein said the state of the aether is determined by its connections with the matter. The state of the aether is most determined by its connections with Earth
mpc755 1 year ago
The train and the embankment occupy different regions in three dimensional space. Consider the train to contain water at rest with respect to the train and the embankment to consist of water at rest with respect to the embankment. In this scenario, the light from A and B reaches M and the light from A' and B' reaches M' simultaneously. This is what is meant by the reference frames must be equal in all respects.
mpc755 2 years ago
But that video doesn't tell you anything about relativity or simultaneity.
The "wave fronts" are consistent with the Newtonian corpuscular theory of light, in which velocities add v = v_1 + v_2. This is not the case in our universe.
RichardPenner 3 years ago
It tells you simultaneous lightning strikes equi-distant from the mid-point in different frames of reference will reach the mid-point simultaneously. To conclude otherwise, is to have a preferred frame.
mpc755 2 years ago