Paper Problems: Retirement, Unemployment and Longevity

[VolcanicPenguin]

Great vid!

Although moving the retirement age down would just make it so that retirement would cost more while having less people paying for it, so I don't see how that would work.

The whole retirement problem is a symptom of rising unemployment, which is a symptom of automation. The solution in my mind, as often, is shortening the work week.

[zthustra]

@VolcanicPenguin

Someone who is 60 years old might not find working 30 hours a week quite so live draining! A person who is 24 years old would probably find something to do with the extra 10 hours a week in off time, like growing a garden or just having fun with friends.

[cnxtrans]

In Asia, in most countries, they have no retirement plans per se, what happens is that people save and later on they also get taken care of by their children and/or close family members.

Even though this system is not perfect (e.g. person without family), this makes people responsible for their own lives and does not make them rely on governments schemes that do not work in the long term.

People also do not feel obliged to work until the legal age of retirement in order to get full benefits.

[zthustra]

@cnxtrans

I keep telling my family that there needs to be a HUGE social change in attitudes about retirement. Aging people need to turn over their assets and affairs to the younger generations. Old farts can't afford to live in big, nice homes, drive big, new, cars, make trips all over the place and live ultra independent lifestyles. They need to transition from breadwinners to dependents and may been to live with their kids or other family or friends as their lives wind down.

[zthustra]

@cnxtrans

We need to stop thinking of government retirement or other benefit shemes as something THEY porvide US and think of them as some WE provide for OURSELVES. Humans are social animals and there is nothing wrong with social schemes to ensure humane and dignified existence. A capitalists system (one were the top 1-3% own damn near everything) virtually guarentees a dininished standard of living for the botton 80%, especially the bottom 40% so that they can enjoy the good life.

[Lionlielone]

I doubt that unemployment would rise due to the French austerity measure (a euro saved is a euro earned), but I think you put your finger on a big, BIG underlying problem with the monetary system.

[zthustra]

@Lionlielone

A penny saved by NOT paying it to someone in the bottom 80% (retirement) and instead paying it to someone in the top 1-3% (interest).

[Lionlielone]

@zthustra But why assume that the saved money will go to the top 20%? It might just as well go to keeping some other worker employed, or be left untaxed in the economy. Either way it stands a fair chance of boosting employment. Of course, the overall effect is to pressure people to work harder and longer. But I also see your point: if the saved money goes just to paying loan interest, the money will tend to pool at the top.

[zthustra]

@Lionlielone

I didn't say the top 20%, I said the top 1-3%.

The purpose of the austerity measures is to make it possible to repay loans (interest) and loans are issued by the top 1-3% and the interest is always paid by the bottom 80%.

I'l try to find the link for a video that explains this.

[Lionlielone]

@zthustra (Yes 1-3%, sorry) The interest is an obligation, the alternative to the austerity act would be a higher tax burden. It's a tight spot either way.

[zthustra]

@Lionlielone

ALL interest is ALWAYS paid by those at the bottom of the economic spectrum. Loans to government are repaid by taxpayors, loans to business are repaid by consumers, and loans to individuals are paid by individuals. The wealthiest and most politically influencial individuals are always looking for ways to shift their own obligations to the poorest. It isn't always obvious how they do this. I need to make another video.

Watch my playlist "Monetary Growth (German)".

[a012345]

Partially, some people can't retire at a reasonable age is because they want the toys. Look at all the stuff people are buying. Crap they don't need and paying interest off it for their entire lives. They choose to pay it forward. Why should I feel bad for people who choose to enjoy life now and work it off as a slave later? If anything, it's only fair that they work to repay in full those who saved to lend them the money.

[zthustra]

@a012345

Q: Can the human monkey thingy resist low hanging fruit?

Q: Who makes all that money available on loan but NOT available in wages?

Q: What would happen if the human monkey thingy could only borrow money that actually existed prior to them borrowing it?

Q: What would happen if all the human monkey thingies were paid fair wages instead of some very high wages and othes almost nothing?

[a012345]

@zthustra I think humans can resist urges and splurges although many can not. Many tend to live in the moment. I don't know if a particular someone makes all the money on loan but not in wages. You could say banks do that and pay in out in wages back to the bankers themselves. I don't see much wrong in those being paid higher wages who took the time to get educated, skilled or took numerous business risk being compensated. Of course scammers are a different case.

[zthustra]

If you had a work horse and fed it less food than it need to live, it would die. But if you have a human employee and you pay them less money than they need to pay the basic bills, you expect them to keep working? No problem, they can apply for food stamps and Medicaid. The taxpayers have no problem offsetting the cost of employment for you. And if taxes are insufficent, all the better, the goverment can borrow more money from you and pay you interest in the cost of subsidizing low labor costs.

[a012345]

@zthustra A limiting pool of money of course would limit economic expansion as well. You would just be shuffling the same money around and no capital formation would take place while services or products would increase. I can't see that being a positive thing either. You would have that top 3% hoarding all the money as well. Fair wages is too hard to really define. What would you consider fair? People's rate of compensation should be based on risks taken, mastery of skill and difficulty of labor

[zthustra]

@a012345

Wha said anything abou "limiting the pool of money"?

And of what value would hoarded money be to a capitalist? If it could not be loaned at interest, it would have to be invested in real and actual business that employed people and provided goods and services to consumers. The so-called financial services market would dry up fast for those who shuffle pretend money (credit) about in an endless shell game or confidence trick.

[zthustra]

@a012345

Just noticing this, "it's only fair that they work to repay in full those who saved to lend them the money."

Lenders do NOT lend money that was saved. There is NEVER money in a box. The so-called money, is really "credit" to an account that is created out of cyberspace. The money is virtually printed for the borrower. If you and I loaned money we did not have, it would be fraud. If we printed money for others it would be forgery. It would be unlawful for us to profit from this.

[SeruQuik]

The tinkling of teabags. I chortled at that. You really don't like that movement, do you? I'm no fan of it myself, but your treatment of them is rather amusing all the same.

[zthustra]

@SeruQuik

I like the Ron Paul Revolution crowd and they are a big part of the Tea Party. I even liked the idea of a Tea Party to let government know that it was overreaching and overgrown. But I find that most of the outspoken Tea Party members are ignorant, entrenched in their ignorance and ... well, that's a good place to stop. I know that will offend a few people but I don't care that much.

[SeruQuik]

@zthustra

I have my own criticisms of the Ron Paul crowd, but I respect them still. The Tea Party as it is now is just a conglomerate of wild, ignorant rage.

[a012345]

@zthustra I think a lot of tea party people are a bunch of hypocrites. They keep bitching about reducing government and yet many willingly take handouts from them ie, medicaid & social security. They got the "fuck everyone else as long as I get my piece attitude". If they want to make a point, refuse any form of "socialistic" handout from the government. Having Sarah Palin as a spokesperson doesn't help their image either.

[zthustra]

@a012345

For some months now I have assigned a mantra to a large group of people, I call them the "Fuck you, I've got mine!" crowd. It was way cool to see that you use almost the same words. LoL

[Rathrider]

I like your videos, I will continue to watch them but I dont like this video. Poor people usualy have bad habiits(heavy drinking and others) wealthy people usualy dont, so it is to be expected that poor people will die young and poor(due to bad spending and living habits). you do have some valid points but just saying I think you have made better vids

[zthustra]

@Rathrider

This video has nothing to do with "poor" people. If you are in the bottom 80%, you will work until you die! The people who worked at Boeing were not "poor". They choose to delay retirement because they were not wealthy enough to retire earlier.

[Rathrider]

@zthustra okay rewatched the vid, didn't realize it was the same study, I was thinking it covered everyone. still doesn't bother me that much, just encourages me to make more money, be healthier in general, btw thanks for the quick reply

[TheAtheistPaladin]

The value of an F-22 Raptor, $143 million dollars.

The value of the national debt, $14 trillion dollars.

The value of a human life..... Priceless.