Motor update. Making use of extracted energy.

[mixcev]

good job!!

....but.. i think for the best extraction of extra energy, the coils should be energized with nsnsns alternating poles, not nnnnn....

try it with alternating poles, its how generators should work... i tried measuring the output of the extra coil on my ssg, but it cant produce anything with all north poles out...

all the best

[Drevtoobe]

Hey Blackie! lol

Check out this clip: watch?v=d58RHwFc6oI

It's from the user truthmovementuk. He might be close enough to become a mate of yours.

Just keep your hands in your pockets and watch the blinking lights.

He is missing the current programming resistors for the LEDs and he has a trick up his sleeve... an opto-isolator. Heavy stuff man! lol

[Drevtoobe]

Nice setup. You may have noticed that your audio is about eight seconds ahead of your video.

You could try different resistive loads at the output of the 7812 (?) regulator. I would assume that as you draw more and more current as you lower the value of the load resistor, you will start to see the voltage on the cap bank start to lower. You could measure the watts of output power into the resistive load.

Most likely it will get to the point where the cap bank stabilizes at about 12.2 vols.

[Drevtoobe]

At this point your coils are just pumping in enough juice to keep the cap bank just above the voltage of the regulator output. Note that the regulator will be running very "cool" here as it does not have to sustain a significant voltage drop to pass current from the input side to the output side.

I assume that if you draw more current than that, the cap bank will fall below 12.1 volts and the regulator's output voltage will start to "flicker". I'm just guessing.

[Drevtoobe]

Note that the higher the voltage in the cap bank, the smaller conduction angle that you get from the sine waves from the coils. With a very small load the tips of the sine waves will be keeping the cap bank "topped out".

As the cap bank lowers in voltage, the greater conduction angle you get from the sine waves, and the more available power there is to drive a load.

The user Lidmotor purchased something fancier than the 7812 regulator, he is using an "adjustable switching regulator".

[Drevtoobe]

The adjustable switching regulator sounds like it is a self-contained "switching" power supply, just like the switching power supply used in all PC computer boxes.

The advantage with the switching regulator is that it loses much less power through heat as compared to a 7812 regulator. The 7812 regulator acts like a "smart variable resistor" to maintain the 12-volt output, whereas the switching regulator pulses a capacitor with a 20 kHz variable pulse train to maintain the output voltage.

[Drevtoobe]

So I have a big idea for you to get more output power. Are you familiar with three-phase power for big electric motors and other industrial loads? There are three 240 VAC lines, each one 120 degrees out of phase with the adjacent line. If you could overlap the three 240 VAC lines on an oscilloscope, you can see how the peaks for each sine wave are evenly spaced apart. I just realized that may have already played with this with one of your generator setups.

[Drevtoobe]

With three-phase power, you can get a pretty decent DC output with some ripple by using big industrial power diodes. It's neat in the sense that you can use three 240 VAC lines and get high-power high-voltage DC using just a few diodes, no power supply! Anyway, like I said, you guys are already doing this with your motors.

So my idea is to put a FWBR on each of the power coils and connect all of the FWBRs together. Connect that to your cap bank. So what, you say?

[Drevtoobe]

Right now with your setup you have four coils 90 degrees apart and four magnets on the rotor 90 degrees apart. Therefore when the rotor turns all of the coil outputs are in the same phase.

To get more power, you could try to emulate a three-phase power system just by physically moving two of the generator coils.

Just to be clear, I am talking about changing your setup so you have one power coil, and three generator coils; A, B, and C each with their own FWBR.

[Drevtoobe]

So you simply move coils B and C on your mounting board so that the magnets fly by the coils not at the same time, but out of phase with each other so that the generators coils produce an "A-B-C-A-B-C-..." firing sequence.

I think that with that arrangement, you may be able to get the most power out of the coils.

If you changed the 7812 regulator with the adjustable switching regulator, you should be able to squeeze out the max power into a matching load resistor.

[Drevtoobe]

I use the term "matching load resistor" because whenever you have a power source driving a load, there is always a certain value of a load resistor that draws the maximum power from the power source.

Here is a simple made-up example: Batteries are modeled by an ideal voltage source in series with an output impedance resistor. If the load resistance is the same as the output impedance you get maximum power transfer.

[Drevtoobe]

Assume a 1.5 volt Alkaline battery has an output impedance of 3 ohms. If you put a three ohm resistor across the battery, you will measure 0.75 volts across the battery and have 250 milliamps of current, for a power output of 0.1875 watts. For any other resistor value, you can do the calculations and you will find that you always get less that 0.1875 watts. The three ohm resistor is the "matching" load resistor for the battery. That concept applies to your generator setup also.

[Drevtoobe]

You can simplify this if you assume that you want to get the most possible current at 12 volts DC output from the regulator. In this case, you simply lower the value of the load resistor, and the regulator starts to demand more and more power from your generator coils to maintain the output voltage. So you do this until the output from the regulator starts to croak, which really means that the coil power generation is croaking. The rotor may even croak as the coils offer ever more resistance!

[Drevtoobe]

Anyway if you are tempted to try this three-phase setup, I have a challenge for you:

The challenge is to make power output measurements for the current setup and then do the same thing for your next setup and compare the results. It's all so easy to do, just put a resistor across the regulator output, measure the voltage, and the measure the resistor value out of the circuit.

It would be nice to see some real data, and see this related back to the real current consumption of the motor itself.

[Pwordchernoir]

so far im reading ur comments thinking yep, nice, phasing, got it. i can tell you about finding the ideal load though, that as u mentioned above, the rotor croaks as the coils demand too much from it at an already decelerated speed.

[Drevtoobe]

Yeah that's a tough one with a Bedini motor, you put a load on the rotor and it slows down, and then you are getting less pulses per second from the driving coil to power the rotor.

I am not sure that the three-phase arrangement will produce significantly more power than your current arrangement. Certainly it gives each coil its separate time to pump current into the cap bank.

[Drevtoobe]

But even in your current configuration when the cap bank voltage is lowered, all of the coils start to pump current into the cap bank. The coils that may be "weaker" and generate less EMF will still discharge into the cap bank but with a slightly smaller conduction angle. Ultimately both setups draw from all of the generator coils when the cap bank voltage is lower.

Stand-alone generator coils also generate less EMF than your current setup with the coils in series.

[Drevtoobe]

Lower EMF from any stand-alone coil could be boosted by putting a 2:1 or 3:1 transformer between the coil and the FWBR. That would "squeeze out" more power from the coils to pump current into the cap bank by increasing the conduction angle.

Heck, even a coil that only generates 2 VAC when the rotor is at full speed could generate 20 VAC just by using a 10:1 transformer.

Of course adding transformers would give you more voltage to work with, but not any more power!