The Source of Human Morality [3/9] (debate)

[MivH124]

So the priest is saying "everything I just said, I didn't mean"

[baldurus1]

If morality is objective as Mr.Jacobse contests, then shouldn't morality be Universal?

Our moral standards are not the same as the moral standards of people in other countries, they're not even consistent in our own society(pro abortion vs. anti abortion).

Clearly there is no Universal morality, ergo there can't be a Universal moral giver.

[naughteedesign]

why does ze bald one have a glowing stand

[TheStarvingSamurai]

@naughteedesign He's Jesus.

[kloveless82]

That priest got smoked,

[TheFoulest]

While he seems like a decent guy, the priest got butt fucked here.

[vibratinjoyful]

priest: "I agree with everything matt says, but he just has to add "god" to the end of what he is saying"

[FIGHTFANNERD3]

@vibratinjoyful indeed

[gulbirk]

the priest is right, apart from the fact that these moral "truths" do not come from the bible.

[TheLuckySaGe]

All the priest does for his arguments can be re-worded as "I beileve this.... I believe that....I believe this". Is this guy a poe or is he really that stupid?

[legacy917]

ok .... a few things I noticed here.. The preacher said a dozen times " I'm not saying that."

Well what are you saying?

In any debate when you realize you are wrong one of the dead giveaways is humbling yourself to the opponent.. and he humbled himself, tucked his tail between his legs when he said "I could go out and have a beer with Matt"..

Does anyone else see this?

He did not address anything. All he did was say " I agree with Matt, I'm not saying this and I'm not saying that"

Pwned...

[A1z1u1L]

there you go with science you have a structure for communication..and religion..well...not so much maybe the priest needs to learn how to convey his ideas a little better and he'll have a real argument

[dutchbb1979]

@LetJimiT8keOver Yeah it's pathetic, they make no sense whatsoever.

[IJUSTLOVETURTLES]

"Truth exists in the universe, but it needs to be uncovered."

You just contradicted your entire theistic belief system. You don't know that your god even exists, so therefore he isn't true, because you haven't uncovered him.

[Paetaor]

Communism is wrong because it tries to treat everyone equal but some more equal.

Would it not be better if you left them alone to think and act on their own within a set of laws.

[gulbirk]

@Paetaor Comunism isnt nesseseraly wrong, the ways comunism has been done (stalinism, maoism espesially) are wrong. Thats why those systems collaps. They realise that its wrong.

[AtheisticRevelation]

I can't begin to understand what he said because of all the disclaimers...

[MinisterKGB]

you know I could hear what the priest was saying but it was so inane that I think i went into a short coma

[crackthecorn]

wtf did he just say it was OK to kill people because god said so ...are you fucking kidding me thats righteousnesses

[Xather15]

I wanna see some Mortal Kombat action in this debate lol

[zacmondejar]

damn that priest got owned ...

[wretcherwretch]

Ugh, I really resent these faux-accomodationalist priests.

[QueOraSi]

I still can't believe that these holy types don't realize how bat shit crazy they sound.

[FlipFlopViking]

"it doesnt follow that if someone says he has the truth, that he actually has the truth! ill go "oh yeah? lets see, ill listen, ill think" OH THE IRONY!!! XD

[whatisnot1]

lol at the beer comment. truth has to be revealed..sounds like how science works to me.

[whatisnot1]

it comes down to the just world theory. even reading biblical texts reveal both god and man create and destroy. 'people must get what they deserve'-morals are based off of the threat of losing something or through personal failure through ones own stupidity..and thats how we learn how not to be idiots.

[whatisnot1]

of course they could comprehend there actions back then, it was eye for an eye. that was their morals.. "this guy pisses me off, I kill him off. therefore he won't be intruding upon my life anymore" there was no law to punish murder in or pain in hanourabi's society, excuse my spelling..you get what i'm saying anyways. I think the gravity of guilt over killing another human being, that is to take them out of existence of the here and now, is just more valued now. generally speaking.

[russmckinley]

<~~~this doesn't work with youtue's new ever changing format

i am below

[russmckinley]

<~~~skipped over the bullshit orthodox moron's time

just to hear dillahunty

not because i am close-minded, but because I have heard all of this religious brainwashing bullshit before

would just like to hear an intelligent person speak

[royalsteven]

People before Mozes did not comprehend the consequences for doing evil. Remember Sodom & Gomorra? God did throw out Adam & Eve out the garden not for nothing. Then sin cast down on mankind. People were living a hedonistic lifestyle before the commandments, were primitive, were practicing human sacrifices, killing babies etc. So yes Mozes changed all this and God's laws were needed and are still practiced in society today.

[fivestr1]

@royalsteven you can't use the bible as a historical record since most of it as history disagrees with the story in the bible so your point is only valid within the story.

[russmckinley]

@royalsteven wasn't jesus a "human sacrifice" ?

fucking moron

[kadosiable]

What the fuck is this fella talking about... his points are so sloppy and tangled it's difficult to understand what he's ultimately trying to say... or maybe that's the idea? I've enjoyed Matt's speeches so far though, just wish the opposition was more challenging.

[gspendlove]

So the Christer's whole argument here is: "I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'."

[HebaruSan]

Why is he talking about atheists and the details of his own belief system instead of the debate topic of the source of human morality?

[TheLunarmonkey]

that christian is such a crap debater.lol

[sasnsatx]

He seems to be saying "yeah, what Matt said, but God said it first". This is a very weak stance, since it falls so easy to Occam's Razor

[JuanchoMan]

god what a douchebag

matt utterly destroyed his ass

logic fail

[nak807]

I don't think Mr Dilahuntay should count this as his first public debate since he was debating alone on this one.

[StopSpamming1]

I am disappointed. I had hoped for a more substantial debate. But now Hans is just using special pleading and blind faith as basis for his position. Pity. I suppose next he will invoke the holy spirit.

[hossrex]

5:50 He fully admits to coming into this debate with an irrational presupposition... that his beliefs require the idea that a divine creator exists.

Since he can't demonstrate that god exists, he can't use that existence as evidence for ANYTHING.

He lost the entire debate right there.

[Nibielari]

atheist can go beyond just are self interest, its called laws that society set up.  i can agree to live under a law even if i don't agree with the law.

[Existentialisht]

Matt...don't answer his questions...stay on topic. Destroy him.

lol

[jjmm112]

Weak debate- check Hitchin`s and Dawkin`s for the "real Deal".................

[VideoMenu]

@jjmm112

Where's your debate? I'm backing up through the videos to check my own comments and I see you've been progressively getting more vitriolic towards Americans as the vids go by. So, if you're so superior, darling Brit, where's your debate? Please post the link. Thanks.

ps. Why are you even watching all the videos if they're so substandard?

[jjmm112]

@VideoMenu .

My "debate" is "the man of cloth" is stupid!. I`m "vitriolic" toward`s American`s because many of your ppl believe in creationism!!.

"Darling Brit"-lol!!. .................

From what country did the "industrial revolution" take place?.......

What language do you speak?........................­- LOL!!!.

I subbed this channel because it is usually truthfull................

[VideoMenu]

@jjmm112

Our people came from your people. In fact, a handful of your people died at Waco in '93 following that crackpot cult leader, David Koresh. And all one must do is search YouTube to easily find English religions morons makeing rebuttal videos to atheist videos.

You have no debate. You're just a moron. But no worries for the people of England--I won't hold them all accountable for your ignorance.

[jjmm112]

@VideoMenu . Yes, I`m aware of that even though I`m not as old as you (103- lol!).

I stated my debate previously. "Moron"- a bit strong coming from a guy who feature`s a muppet vid, don`t you think?.

[leavesof3]

This priest is talking, but he's not saying anything.

[shaneisawesome11]

@leavesof3 A-fucking-men! He didn't say a damn thing!

[jancar2012]

If we didn't know that murder was wrong until Moses received the ten commandments, then why was God so angry with Cain? And why did the hebrews kill so many more people en masse AFTER receiving the commandments.

[marowak1337]

Truth is something... first you hear...

FFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUU-

[Ecite]

"Truth is something...first you hear"....lolwut?

[mar8les]

@Ecite i was thinking the same thing.

[theguruofreason]

This priest is a total clown. Does anyone take him seriously?

[jancar2012]

@theguruofreason Unfortunately I think it's safe to assume that his entire congregation agrees with him.

[MacabreManifesto]

The Atheist rejects all authority he doesn't perceive? Duh! Hey preacher! If I told you that there was a super speedy invisible monkey death squad that had come to town to kill everyone: With a beard, and/or who had eaten a bagel, and/or within the last twenty four hours, and got into a car within the next two hours, would you fallow that authorities rules?

[Macrochenia]

I'm not saying that all Christians are idiots, but I am saying that this guy is.

[MacabreManifesto]

Moments after Moses returned and broke the commandments he orders the slaughter of many of his people! Looks like those commandments really stuck...

[philosophyman76]

at 7:32 "they are written in the fabric of the universe..." really where? what science book does killing is wrong come up. What star can I see that? really. Why do so many things kill each other then. The universe could give a damn about about what happens on this tiny little planet going around a star. If killing is wrong fundamentally by the universe then why does the universe kill just about everything. Our own damn planet we get killed all the time by weather alone!

[Sciborg09]

@philosophyman76 the priest is a troll! :/

[216trixie]

"I could....Just put the god question aside"........Good first step.

[Kergillian]

The stupid... it burns! It BURNS! Jacobse hides the internal inconsistencies of his argument with rambling strawmen and gran proclamations. Notice how he never backs up any of his assertions. His arguments have been debunked many times. Shermer's Science of Good an Evil or Harris' The Moral Landscape do this quite nicely.

[I85PIES]

'God spoke the world into existance'

And the non existing world, upon hearing the command duly jumped into existance.

He said that with a straight face too. What an idiot.

[z0z0bra]

the longer i listen to this priest, the more i get the impression that he doesnt know what his own point is. he basically argees about everything with matt, and then tries to explain the most basic assumptions with his own wishy-washy arguments that neither does he know how to explain (or at least fails trying to do so), nor even seems to be sure about, himself.

[Macrochenia]

@z0z0bra He agreed to face an atheist in a battle of wits, but has chosen to come unarmed.

[Macabre215]

"Truth is not something you see, truth is something first you hear."

That's illogical at best. This priest is an idiot.

[MetalCatharsis]

What the fuck matt, the retard got the definition of atheism wrong and you don't call him on it?

[wretcherwretch]

"I'm not saying you're a terrible person, but you're responsible for eugenics and the Holocaust."

[bodeezy]

This priest is ridiculous. Sidestepping & strawmanning around double talk & false assertions. Condescending ass is claiming moral high ground because he FEARS an invisible, undetectable, tyrannical, insecure, murdering prick in the sky which he has absolutely ZERO evidence of it's existence. He has NO CREDIBILITY.

Matt's logic destroys him......this is more of a debacle than a debate IMO.

[TitenSxull]

This guy is floundering miserably for one thing and for another thing he keeps kissing Matt's ass (saying they can get a beer) and then strawmanning so called "atheist" positions, despite the fact that ATHEIST refers to only ONE position, the position on belief in god(s).

[MangaFanGuy]

Wow, didn't take long for Father Hans to break out the old "Atheism is Communism" nonsense. (And Eugenics is an "atheist experiment" - WTF!!!)

[NUGNESS123]

wow hes an ass.

[DonQuixotedeKaw]

Lingual problem again; "truth" is NOT synonymous with fact. His continuous implication that it is synonymous, is the foundation of his fallacy. Truth as he believes it, is in the absolutes of dogma. Truth as it really is, is ephemeral, and subject entirely to the paradigms of the perceiver. Truth can have, nothing to do with fact, though honestly that occurs most often in theocracies and other delusional states, where the dogma demands that the senses be ignored, in any contradiction.

[Brandt761]

"Even the atheist can perceive some of these fundamental precepts"

...

is he not merciful?

[DonQuixotedeKaw]

There were 13 tribes, each with their own deities. So of course they each were going to have separate commentary sets on "the golden rule". But all primates comprehend a variation of consequentialism.

[maikit333]

its hard to debate people like this priest guy. so much rambly. lots of words but very little being said.

[FrizzKid05]

@maikit333

Not only that..but he backpedals on everything he says. "I'm not saying that....but I'm saying that."

Can you even count how many times he did that? There were no logical building blocks in this debate? Just assertions and answers. Matt tried, but he couldn't make this debate any more intelligible, because both parties need to have solid points...preacher-man got none.

[perkeleman]

I really wanted to hear Matt debate, but his opponent was so short-sighted and plain biased in his assessments , overly religious and everything he called "philosophical" should just be interpreted as what he was "indoctrinated" in his cult.

Takes away all the challenge of a proper debate.

But kudos to Matt for what hes doing out there, lessening the hatred people have towards atheism

[rafaravioli]

His presupposition is that God spoke the world into existence? Hold on. Go back to that last point. That's a pretty hefty assumption to base absolute morals on.

[somebodysdad]

That's a lectern not a podium.

[KarinMikazuki]

"I have the truth"

Wtf does that even mean, you cant apply truth that way

[Boepyne]

I just hate this mystification of the word 'truth' (into 'Truth'). It just doesn't seem to mean anything. There are only 'statements that are true'; there's no 'Truth'.

[proudfootz]

Christians can't seem to wrap their heads around the idea that other points of view really exist and that everyone is a closet christian who's just 'in denial'.

Of course the facts just get in the way of the christian's tunnel vision, so they must also be denied or ignored.

[wackyweed57]

why doesn't he stop telling us which points he's NOT making because he not and start telling us which points he does want to make

[mornmeril]

When he said "atheist experiment" I could only go "no no no no no no no not that again..." how desperate does he have to be to grab that argument?

[shampoofresser]

no wonder the original uploader deactivated comments on this part where matt owns him

[Hopeful71]

Matt is hitting all the right notes. I would have tossed in the morality of social animals (eg primates) as the last nail in that coffin of god ordained morality.

Morality is the child of social interaction; by logic & reason OR by evolution, the equation remains the same.

[mfjeff]

Matt reminds me of Sam Harris when he speaks (hand gestures/ eye brow raise)

..speaking of Sam Harris...the other guy should read his new stuff

[rafaravioli]

"I'm not saying atheism caused horrible world leaders, but that's EXACTLY what I'm saying." Just because you say that you aren't saying something, doesn't mean you aren't saying that thing.

[AnnRKey]

Oy vey! Father Hans is meshuga.

[Muljinn]

07:55 to 08:15 in the immortal words of Monty Python "GET ON WITH IT!"

[muzvh1]

The priest drowns in his own philosophical and religious ineptitude.

[Jonstern1983]

Did this guy just say that religion caused an end to eugenics? Most of the people who believed in eugenics were religious, and it was science that ended eugenics by showing that there isn't enough genetic difference between races to make eugenics a viable practice.

[216trixie]

@Jonstern1983 Margaret Sanger, the modern proponent of eugenics was an active atheist. That doesn't mean that eugenics is somehow an "atheist" characteristic.

[Jonstern1983]

@216trixie I have to ask what your point is.

My statement was that 1. MOST proponents of eugenics have been religious (especially when genocide was being performed by first world nations), and 2. the scientific evidence shows that the genetic difference between ethnic groups is so tiny and that the more diversity that you add to a genetic code the stronger the code becomes, so eugenics is no longer viewed as a viable practice by mainstream scientists.

[OpiatedBliss]

8:00

pathetic

[FlightIsLife]

It honestly feels like Matt is wasting his time and intellectual effort... this moron doesn't deserve a debate like this... He can't get through 20 minutes without contradicting himself, and he offers no reasonable response to the first and most basic points.. Boring.

[pacogoatboy]

This guy appears to have gotten his tired arguments from listening to callers from The Atheist Experience show. Do they ever come up with anything new? This is just embarrassing.

[Sabohaque]

By "communism" he must mean "Marxism"

Not all communists are materialists.

[firefly4f4]

6:29 of the previous video, "... is given to us through the mouth of Moses"

5:16 - roughly, "I never said we know killing is wrong because Moses came down from the mountain."

Then tries to pass it off as saying he knows it's narrative.

Um... what?

No, sorry, not buying it. Your position is that god told us at some point what was moral, maybe even that god built it in from the beginning. If that's try, why the heck doesn't everyone think the same things are moral?

[BabySatch1]

ummm, you need to show that god exists before useing genesis as proof...

Fucking ignoramus.

[freeflow14]

Communism is an "atheist experiment"? I cannot comprehend how mind meltingly retarded that is. Especially when you look at the teachings of jesus and his views on how we should share all that we have with everyone.

[TekLok]

@freeflow14 FUCK! hahahaha its seriously does melt my brain. I never thought of that one before thanks.

[Maxdwolf]

What he seems to be arguing (in a kind of waffling, indirect fashion) is that we "know" morality through our inner, sky-faeiry supplied spiritual compass. And he offers no evidence for this position. This makes ceiling cat sad.

[kadosiable]

9:00 Exactly what does he think 'Emerge' means?

[fokGoogol]

The materialist atheist has two mics  ^_^

[stukajunker88]

More than half of this guy's stuff is backpedalling. "I'm totally not saying all atheists are scumbags... But atheism causes scumbaggy behavious."

Facedesk.

[Axias85]

@stukajunker88 Are you saying that Matt is backpedaling or that Father Hans is backpedaling?

[93alvbjo]

@stukajunker88 i think you can make that assesment though.

[N0tsaved]

@stukajunker88

epic fail, sir...... epic fail.

[serioush]

He's right it is his pre-supposition, thats not a good thing.

[Archael2]

what the fuck is this child molester talking about

"atheist experiment"?

lol!

[DigitizedSelf]

I would have told Hans Jacobsen to go look up atheism in the dictionary - just ridiculous that Christian debaters don't even grasp the basics of atheism when atheist debaters are displaying not just insight into Christianity but also other religions and philosophy in general.

I feel sad for all believers whenever I see this kind of thing... how can they be this misguided?

[RoadRunnerLaser]

@DigitizedSelf - They have to be. If they weren't, they'd have to admit their errors and reject their dogma. By being so misguided and deliberately ignorant, they can construct one strawman after another in order to convince the unthinking masses with flimsy sophistry in order to propagate their religion.

[qwestwardly]

he's not arrogant because he's condescending... he's condescending because he's arrogant! so subtle too!

[mardastheEitheist]

The communist argument... As always. But where were the moral goods of religion, as hitler chose to be the religious messiah and freeer of christian germany? They also didn't help...

Sorry, but Mr Jacobse is doing a rearguard action, he cannot win and he seems to know it. And the only things he comes with are the usual accusations...

[xd1rtx]

5:22,,, bullshit, you specifically said that we derived our moral of 'killing is wrong' from moses who got it from god,,,,, asshat,,, am i the only guy here who thinks this guy talks in circles???

[RoadRunnerLaser]

@xd1rtx - No, you're not. I spotted his contradictory bullshit, too.

I shouted at my screen when he spouted his crap.

[xd1rtx]

@RoadRunnerLaser

i often wander how many monitors, keyboards and such get brokin when someone with a half a brain loses his mind listening to this nonsense

[RoadRunnerLaser]

@xd1rtx - They say that religion causes good people to do bad things... I think Father Goatse might just inspire me to give him a healthy kicking.

"Pray to your god to make me stop.... Did it work??? NO !!!"

"Pray to your god to make me stop... Did it work this time? NO !!!"

"Pray to your god to make me stop... Did it work this time?? NO..? What can we conclude from that? You don't know??? Let me see if kicking you some more helps you to work it out, moron !"

[Tolrias]

It's like one FAIL after another by Jacobse's

[Scarletpooky]

If I was in that audience it would be hard for me to stop myself standing up and telling this guy he is plain wrong and telling him exactly why he is talking rubbish

[Scarletpooky]

"truth exists independant of our knowledge of it"

yep, just think of 'ignorance of the law is no defence'. but that doesn't mean that rules concerning human behaviour could not be invented by humans

[dalinean]

Transcendant reality!!

sounds like madness to me.

Dream away.

Truth is truth. even if we don't want it that way.

GOD IS TRUTH.

even the greatest lie is a subset of truth; it's a lie.

relativism is madness

[sapunec7854]

@dalinean Penis?

[aadoza]

@sapunec7854 Double penis

[Pilaf1984]

@dalinean Which "God"?

[Muljinn]

@dalinean Which god and how do you know you've got the right one?

[dalinean]

@Muljinn

If it aint true it aint god.

How we know something is true is a different question, science is one way

[Muljinn]

@dalinean Uh huh. Considering the, literally, thousands of gods that are purported to exist, just HOW exactly do you determine which, if any, is the "true" god? Particularly given the fact that not ONE of them has EVER provided ANYTHING remotely resembling verifiable evidence of their divinity, or indeed their very EXISTENCE? All of them seem to expect people to accept their claims exclusively on faith, which is, frankly, insane.

[Muljinn]

@dalinean Then why bother calling it god? The words "truth" and "actuality" are sufficient. Calling reality "god" is needlessly & deliberately clouding the issue, causing unnecessary confusion & allows the ignorant & the dishonest to proclaim that their anthropomorphic fantasy exists.

[dalinean]

@Muljinn

indeed!

except that the confusion exists (part of human nature perhaps) Replacing a false concept with a falsifiable search involving self inquiry may be laudable.

And if there is a god, it must be true, a form of truth.

Most current gods are a subset of truth called delusion

[wwwATHEISTATOMcom]

No, concepts like "truth" are phenomena, and all phenomena are created by matter/energy interacting with other matter/energy. Which is the brain in the case of concepts. Matt seems to agree for the most part, but the keeps conceding this on TAG. He is agreeing that "truth" can exist without the matter (brain) to conceive it. No, it can't. There are no truths or untruths without brains to classify one or the other.

[MrSaturn1]

Can anyone understand what this guy is saying? Because I honestly have no fucking idea.

"Truth as a separate category of being actually sits in judgment of what we do."

What in the holy mother of fuck does that even mean? As far as I can tell, he's just babbling. Am I just a complete idiot?

[martiangrundy]

@MrSaturn1

NO M8. At least I hope not. Because if you are you have me to keep you company.

I think it's a case of a blithering babbling idiot, who doesn't even know what he's talking about, due to the fact he's been used to for however many years viewing everything through big thick faith coloured blinkers.

I often find it next to impossible to fathom exactly what these types are even talking about.

And I think they just make shit up too. The "atheist experiment". What the fuck does that mean.

[RoadRunnerLaser]

@MrSaturn1 - No. You're just listening to one and expecting him to talk sense.

[AllRightRotten]

@RoadRunnerLaser - You just have to 'have faith' and believe that what he says makes sense. If you don't you'll be tortured forever. That's love.

[RoadRunnerLaser]

@AllRightRotten - Thanks for clearing that up. It makes perfect sense to me now... But... last time I tried to have Faith, she told me "no". ;)

[MaJoRMJR]

FFS, this guy is such a retard. Why does he keep referring to atheism as something more than what it actually is, it's a non sequitur, it makes no logical sense to use the term atheism in this way. When will these retards learn this?

[AllRightRotten]

@MaJoRMJR - I think he just wants to convince the audience that all atheists (except Matt) are fascist communists (It's all part of the atheist programme).

[blurglide]

Wow- he just throws a lot of unsupported assertions out there and expects us to swallow it.

[MultigamerLygre]

Priest: "God spoke the world into existance". What the hell? Dead he speak for six days or something? The world was formed in millions of years because of star dust coming together forming plantets.

[VCSandARM]

WHOA did he just throw communism in there? WTF... this guy is nuts

[waksibra]

first